Apprenticeships

Christine Jardine Excerpts

Tuesday 4th February 2025 Westminster Hall

[Leigh Ingham (Stafford) (Lab)]

I thank my hon. Friend for securing the debate. The creative industries have been identified as a growth-driving sector, and I know the Government recognise the impact of the arts on the wider economy. We must build more talent pipelines and widen the accessibility of careers in the arts for the longevity of the sector. In my role as co-chair of the APPG for theatre, I have looked at the critical skill shortages that the sector faces in technical, backstage roles, from lighting to sound clinicians and wigs, hair and makeup. That is why it is crucial for Skills England to review the seasonality of theatre work and explore the development of shorter-term apprenticeships to widen access to those entry-level roles.

[Christine Jardine (in the Chair)]

Order. Was there a question?

[Leigh Ingham]

Sorry; does my hon. Friend agree?

[Sarah Dyke (Glastonbury and Somerton) (LD)]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for securing this important debate at the start of National Apprenticeships Week. Apprenticeships are particularly important in rural areas such as Glastonbury and Somerton, because they provide a valuable pathway for young people to gain practical skills and go on to secure employment in their local communities. That helps to combat rural depopulation and boost the local economy. There is a conflict, however, because although apprenticeships are good, the levy is not. Does the hon. Gentleman agree that the apprenticeship levy should be scrapped?

[Christine Jardine (in the Chair)]

Order. Before the hon. Member responds, I remind Members that a lot of people want to get in on this debate, and we need to keep questions much shorter in order to do that.

[Andrew Pakes]

I agree with the hon. Lady. That is why I welcome the announcement in September last year by my right hon. Friends the Prime Minister and Education Secretary of a new growth and skills levy to replace the existing apprenticeship levy, and include new foundation apprenticeships. That will give young people a route into careers where the nation has skills gaps.

It cannot be stated often or loudly enough that apprenticeships not only transform the lives of those who take them, but are vital to our economy and growth. Ministers’ single, unifying, animating purpose is to get the economy growing, and I wholeheartedly endorse that.

[Andrew Pakes]

I very much agree with my hon. Friend. Before I came to Parliament, I was a union official at Prospect, which represents many workers in the defence sector and in Barrow, so I know full well the great expertise of apprentices in the defence sector. We need more of those apprenticeships for our national security and for new jobs.

Growth will come because of a range of factors—we will secure inward investment and trade deals, shake up the planning system, boost infrastructure and back business—but a sure-fire way to stimulate growth is to invest in people’s skills, energy and talent. Just yesterday, I met level 3 to level 7 KPMG apprentices from all parts of the country who work together to bring new opportunities. It was brilliant to hear from Gaby from Peterborough, who told her own story and gave lessons for how to ensure that more young people in Peterborough get the same opportunities. That means nothing short of a revolution in our system of apprenticeships.

I am proud that the previous Labour Government revitalised apprenticeships—the largest expansion in our history—and I welcome the cross-party support for innovation since then, including all-age apprenticeships and all-qualification approaches to workplace learning, but I am not satisfied. We need to address head-on why 900,000 young people across our country are not in education, employment or training; why young people cannot access the opportunities they need; and why the opportunities are not there in the first place. That matters in Peterborough, where we have seen falling apprenticeship numbers and rising levels of youth unemployment.

Last Friday, I was pleased to co-host a NEETs summit with Peterborough college, Anglia Ruskin University Peterborough and local businesses and providers to look at how we can make apprenticeships work better in my constituency. We need to put rocket boosters under the number of firms that take on apprentices, not for altruistic reasons but because it makes smart business sense. We also need reform to ensure that apprenticeship standards work for businesses and learners. I ask the Minister to remove the artificial barriers to success of academic English and maths, and move quickly to business-ready, work-ready, functional skills where they matter.

We are coming up to National Apprenticeship Week, and I want to address one other issue before I finish: not apprenticeships policy, but the cultural barriers. In too many parts of the UK, there is a hang-up about apprenticeships, and so many parts of the system are obsessed with university. Of course, we should value our world-class universities and celebrate the hard work of our university students. As a former president of the National Union of Students, of course I recognise the vital role that British universities play in our national story. However, apprenticeships should be seen as an equally valid alternative route, a legitimate way to gain skills and experience, and a vital contributor to our economic prosperity, and yet in public policy sometimes they are not. Why is that? I fear that there is still a snobbery about apprenticeships in the UK that is not found in competitor countries such as Germany and Sweden, which are more competitive. There is too often a lazy and misguided assumption that apprenticeships are second best to degrees, and that apprentices are lesser in comparison with undergraduates.

We often use the phrase, “University is not for everyone,” as though university is the gold standard and apprenticeships are the also-ran for second-class kids. The English class system exerts itself and places people into boxes, limiting horizons, prejudicing futures and stifling ambitions. That must stop, not only for the good of the brilliant, energetic, ambitious young and not-so-young people who embark on apprenticeships, but for the economy and growth. We will not secure growth with one hand tied behind our back. Hardly any of the apprentices I have met say that their journey was made easier by careers support at school. That is why we need change in our careers service. We must make it easier for businesses to support learners and parents, and we need a step change in how we regard apprenticeships.

We are coming up to National Apprenticeship Week. Let us be loud and proud about apprenticeships. Let us challenge the stigma, call out the snobs, and put apprenticeships centre stage in our policy making, economic mission and national culture.

[Christine Jardine (in the Chair)]

I remind Members to bob if they wish to be called in a debate. To get in all the speakers we have, please try to limit yourselves to three minutes. I call Peter Bedford—he is not here. Jim Shannon, please.

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[Several hon. Members rose—]

[Christine Jardine (in the Chair)]

Order. Given the number of speakers, we will now have to move to two minutes per speech, unfortunately.

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[Lauren Edwards (Rochester and Strood) (Lab)]

Will my hon. Friend give way?

[Christine Jardine (in the Chair)]

Order. We are out of time. I call the Liberal Democrat spokesperson, Max Wilkinson.

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[Max Wilkinson]

Of course. An alignment of skills with the jobs need for the future is key in the apprenticeship sector. Flawed policy in the past means that there has been a clear drop-off in new apprentices in recent years. Just over 736,000 apprentices participated in an apprenticeship in the last academic year, which is a slight decrease of 2.1% on the previous reporting period. Apprenticeship starts overall have fallen by 170,000 since 2015-16, when the Conservatives started governing alone. The deal on offer is clearly not as attractive as it once was.

We need to recognise that apprentices have the same rights as other employees, but experience a large pay disparity compared with other workers. The national minimum wage will be £11.44 for those aged 21 and over, but for a first-year apprentice, the rate is much lower. Young people are not immune from the cost of living crisis and the disparity between those two wages might be a disincentive. Have Ministers considered whether it is and whether it might be putting young people off from taking up apprenticeships?

The Liberal Democrats would scrap the apprentice rate and instead pay apprentices more fairly. We must also reform the apprenticeship levy, which many Members have mentioned today. Employers tell us that it simply does not work and the House of Commons Library briefing shows that there are large underspends every single year. The amount of money being put aside to train young people is simply not being spent. The Association of Employment and Learning Providers says that the money is being raised for skills but not spent on skills, at a time when Governments—this one and the last—say they are keen to encourage businesses to invest in skills.

The Lib Dems would replace the broken apprenticeship levy with a broader and more flexible skills and training levy. We are pleased to hear that the Government want to abolish the apprenticeship levy and replace it with a new growth and skills levy under Skills England. That is a positive step. However, it is clear that there is still work to be done in establishing the new levy and Skills England to oversee it. I would appreciate an update from the Minister on where things are with that policy.

There is also a concern that careers advice systems are not being properly set up to advise people of the many opportunities in apprenticeships. If we are going to fill the skills gaps that we have discussed, alignment of careers advice with those gaps will be key.

We Liberal Democrats believe that apprenticeships have a much bigger role to play. We welcome the Government’s plan for changing the system. If we get the reform right, we will help young people and employers, too. Central to that will be finally getting rid of the failed apprenticeship levy, properly valuing apprenticeships and learning from best practice like that in my constituency and that of my neighbour in Gloucester.

[Christine Jardine (in the Chair)]

I call the Opposition spokesperson, Rebecca Paul.

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[Jim Shannon]

On a point of order, Ms Jardine. The hon. Member for Peterborough (Andrew Pakes) has not wound up the debate.

[Christine Jardine (in the Chair)]

We are out of time. The hon. Member indicated at the start that he did not mind.

Question put and agreed to.

Resolved,

That this House has considered the value of apprenticeships and National Apprenticeships Week.