Oral Answers to Questions

Andrew Selous Excerpts

Thursday 15th June 2023 Commons Chamber

[Sir John Whittingdale]

Again, that is a matter for the BBC. I would say that the decision to freeze the licence fee was to reflect the significant pressures on the cost of living for many people—it would have been wrong to expect them to pay a significant increase at that time. That period is, of course, coming to an end shortly, but nevertheless the licence fee delivers a very large amount of money to the BBC. How it spends it is a matter for the BBC, but in my view, local radio remains an important part of the BBC’s output.

[Andrew Selous (South West Bedfordshire) (Con)]

Would the Minister be kind enough to ask the BBC to actually consult local people on what they think about the BBC’s proposed changes to radio services? “BBC Three Counties” is a very popular programme, and my constituents tell me they want it to carry on as before, so perhaps the BBC could ask the people it is broadcasting to, rather than just taking its own decisions.

[Sir John Whittingdale]

I recall the debate that has already taken place in this House on this matter, which was very widely attended. We heard from across the Chamber how much local radio is supported in each of the various areas represented by Members who spoke. The BBC does do a lot of consultation, but I agree that it is very important that local people should be able to make their views known on that proposal.

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[Sir Desmond Swayne (New Forest West) (Con)]

1. What steps the Church of England is taking to encourage church choirs to engage with local schools.

[The Second Church Estates Commissioner (Andrew Selous)]

The Church of England has enthusiastically supported the Government’s Sing Up programme, encouraging local music hubs to partner with churches, and enabling the use of skills and knowledge that schools would otherwise have to buy in. I am sure that my right hon. Friend, as a strong supporter of singing in church, will very much approve.

[Sir Desmond Swayne]

When will they be singing up in the New Forest?

[Andrew Selous]

I am very pleased to be able to tell my right hon. Friend that the new co-director of music at St Mary’s church in Fordingbridge, Hazel Ricketts, is running a singing club, working with 53 children in local schools every week. Her expertise in church music will enable that work to expand next term to include all four local schools, both primary and secondary. I am sure that my right hon. Friend will want to go to enjoy this wonderful singing for himself.

[Mr Speaker]

Talking of singers, I call Jim Shannon.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I am afraid that, as it says in the Bible, I make a joyful noise—it is never melodious, but it is always joyful and always noisy. I am very keen to encourage school choirs and church choirs to sing together. We have a tradition of that in my constituency. What can the hon. Gentleman do to ensure that Strangford can be a part of the project he is talking about?

[Andrew Selous]

As the hon. Gentleman knows, sadly the Church of England does not have any jurisdiction in Northern Ireland, but we are a generous-hearted church and we will share everything we are doing across England with churches in Northern Ireland. I am sure the scheme could easily be copied there.

[Kevin Foster (Torbay) (Con)]

2. What recent assessment the Church of England has made of the potential merits of recruiting additional ordained ministers into parish ministry in the diocese of Exeter.

[Andrew Selous]

I am delighted to tell my hon. Friend that, with financial assistance from the Church Commissioners, the Diocese of Exeter has increased the number of new curates to tell more people the good news about Jesus. On 1 July it will ordain 18 new ministers, 11 of whom are stipendiary and seven are self-supporting.

[Kevin Foster]

My hon. Friend will be aware that some of the diocese of Exeter’s most challenged parishes are in the Torbay deanery, where an ordained minister can not only bring people into Christ’s flock but be a lynchpin for wider community work. Has the Church of England looked at the situation of deprived communities in Torquay and Paignton to see where an additional ordained minister may be able to bring real value to those communities?

[Andrew Selous]

I am very pleased to be able to tell my hon. Friend that Ordinand Kenny Wickens is soon to be the curate at Our Lady and All Saints, Torquay. I would also like to pass on my thanks to two inspirational priests in my hon. Friend’s constituency, the Reverend Sam Leach from Saint Mags church in Torquay and the Reverend Matt Bray from the Bay Church in Paignton, for the work they do in running the Living Room café, and groups for children and young people across the Torbay constituency.

The hon. Member for Lancaster and Fleetwood, representing the Speaker’s Committee on the Electoral Commission, was asked—

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[Sir Edward Leigh (Gainsborough) (Con)]

5. What steps the Church of England is taking to support parish life in small, rural communities.

[The Second Church Estates Commissioner (Andrew Selous)]

Parish ministry is at the heart of the mission of the Church and, per head of population, there is a higher proportion of ministers in rural areas than in urban ones, although I fully recognise how great the loss is to rural areas when they lose their minister. Between 2023 and 2025, the Church Commissioners will distribute £1.2 billion to support the Church’s mission and ministry, which is a 30% increase on the current three-year period, and a significant share of that funding will go towards revitalising parish ministry.

[Sir Edward Leigh]

Rural Lincolnshire has arguably the finest collection of medieval churches in the country and it is a joy to visit them. Many are open through the open churches event organised as part of the West Lindsey Churches Festival. Does my hon. Friend agree that the glory of the Church of England is the parish structure? Does he agree with many of the points made by the Save the Parish campaign, which prioritises keeping our parish churches open and functioning through worship, despite increasing diocesan bureaucracy?

[Andrew Selous]

I completely understand where my right hon. Friend is coming from. His concerns are shared by many colleagues across the House, because they care so much about the great work done in local parishes. If any of the communities in his constituency have candidates for non-stipendiary ministry—or self-supporting ministry, as we call it these days—that might be a way to provide a focal minister at slightly less cost; the Caleb stream might be one way to provide that. The Church of England’s lead bishop for rural affairs, the Bishop of Exeter, has also recently published “How Village Churches Thrive: a practical guide”, which might be helpful to my right hon. Friend’s local churches.

[Tim Loughton (East Worthing and Shoreham) (Con)]

7. What steps the Church of England is taking to support family relationships, parenting and marriage following the report of the Archbishops’ commission on families and households.

[Andrew Selous]

The commissioners made 36 recommendations to the Church of England and 29 to the Government, and now the focus must turn to implementation. Recommendations include supporting a consistent and universal roll-out of family hubs, requiring registrars to signpost high-quality marriage preparation, and a call to the Church to build relational capability at all life stages, not just for couples preparing for marriage.

[Tim Loughton]

I declare an interest as the son of a former Church of England rector.

In 2011, there were 51,000 weddings in Church of England churches; by 2019, pre-covid, that figure had dropped to 29,000; and since the current Archbishop of Canterbury came to office in 2013, as he readily admitted last week, the average congregational attendance has dropped by 15%. How can the Church of England influence the population on family relationships and marriage matters, when too many of the congregations are voting with their feet?

[Andrew Selous]

That is a good challenge from my hon. Friend, who I know cares about these things. The work the commissioners are doing to fund the Church to try new types of ministry is proving successful in different parts of the country. I know he will join me in supporting the objectives of the Church Commissioners to try to strengthen family life, which was the subject of his question. In particular, I think he will agree with me about the role that registrars have to play, but he makes a fair point that we need people in the churches. That is central to what the Church of England is doing.

[Mr Ben Bradshaw (Exeter) (Lab)]

There might be more weddings in church were the Church of England to allow same-sex couples to get married in church. In that context, does he welcome the commissioners’ conclusion, as I do, that

“‘family’ does not necessitate a certain type of relationship or a specific family form. What matters is the depth of the connections and the support which can always be relied upon”?

Is that not completely inconsistent with the Church’s continued rejection of families where the couple happens to be of the same sex, and its refusal to solemnise their committed relationships?

[Andrew Selous]

I know that the right hon. Gentleman follows these issues closely. This was an independent report to the archbishops, which has been welcomed by the Church. It is based on deep evidence collecting over a two-year period, which involved talking to, in particular, young people up and down the country. I agree with the right hon. Gentleman that it contains some sensible suggestions, and the matters to which he refers are on the agenda of the General Synod of the Church of England, which will take place in York early next month.

The hon. Member for Broxbourne, representing the House of Commons Commission, was asked—