House of Lords Reform Bill

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Pete Wishart

Tuesday 10th July 2012 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

I say gently to the right hon. Gentleman: what happened to the Lisbon referendum? I do not know whether the right hon. Gentleman was in the Chamber yesterday, but my right hon. Friend the Deputy Prime Minister dealt with the question of a referendum on several occasions. He dealt with it again in Deputy Prime Minister’s questions today and it is dealt with in our response to the Joint Committee’s report. In the 1990s, under the leadership of my right hon. Friend the Foreign Secretary, the Conservative party opposed Labour’s changes to the composition of the upper House, not because we wanted to retain the hereditary peers, but because we took a principled stand to argue—with very little dissent—for “no stage 1 without stage 2”. Our fear, disputed forcefully by Labour at the time, was that if we did not move immediately to an elected House after the abolition of the hereditaries, progress would inevitably stall. That was my party’s view at the time, and how right we were.

Let us remember that, in their response to Lord Wakeham’s report in 1999, the previous Government said that they would

“make every effort to ensure that the second stage has been approved by Parliament before the next general election.”

That was the 2001 election, when they told us we were going to elect the first tranche. Yet with three large majorities, three White Papers, two Green Papers, one royal commission, one Joint Committee, two Acts of Parliament and two sets of free votes, Labour missed a golden opportunity to move on to the second stage, despite support from many Conservatives and Liberal Democrats.

[Pete Wishart (Perth and North Perthshire) (SNP)]

Will the right hon. Gentleman give way?

[Sir George Young]

I propose to make a little more progress, and then I may give way again.

No political party ever voted for the halfway House that we now have, and no one wanted that to be the lasting settlement, or imagined that it would be. Although their Lordships do a diligent job, I believe their work is undermined by their lack of democratic legitimacy. It is simply unacceptable that just five people have appointed over 75% of the Members of our second legislative assembly. Tony Blair appointed 316 peers during his time in office. I find that difficult to defend.

[Pete Wishart]

Should we not just go home? The Leader of the House knows it is all over; Government Members know it is all over. We have more important things to debate and decisions to make today. Let us just say, “Enough is enough,” and call the whole shooting match off.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Pete Wishart

Thursday 14th June 2012 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

I understand the concern the right hon. Gentleman expresses, and it is a concern that he also expressed when we set up the Backbench Business Committee. When the relevant proposals come forward, there will be an opportunity to take on board the representation he has just made.

[Pete Wishart (Perth and North Perthshire) (SNP)]

So far, the Wright Committee proposals have been a disaster for the smaller parties—fewer places for us on Select Committees; exclusion from the Backbench Business Committee. We need an absolute guarantee that, this time around, there will be representatives of the smaller parties on the House business committee.

[Sir George Young]

The harsh reality is that the hon. Gentleman represents a minority party. He will know that the way in which Select Committees are composed represents the balance in the House, and a Select Committee would have to be very big indeed for him to have a place as of right. We have recently changed the rules for the Backbench Business Committee to give access to him which he did not have before. As I said in reply to an earlier question, we will look in the round at the proposals for a House business committee when the opportunity presents itself.

Business of the House

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Pete Wishart

Thursday 19th April 2012 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

That would be an interesting debate. The Government believe in local democracy, in devolving decisions about parking charges to local authorities and in local electors holding people to account if they take unpopular decisions on parking. My hon. Friend will have seen the Mary Portas review and some of the proposals in that to make it easier for people to park in towns or cities such as his, and I can only suggest that he pursue his campaign in Brighton, because I think the key to a change in policy is held there rather than here.

[Pete Wishart (Perth and North Perthshire) (SNP)]

May we have a debate on employment rights at the Olympics? The Musicians Union has learned that the London Organising Committee of the Olympic Games and Paralympic Games is expecting musicians to play for nothing at the summer events. Those who put on the events will be paid, as will those who provide the equipment and the security. I am sure that the Olympic bureaucrats will be handsomely paid, but uniquely musicians will be expected to play for nothing. Does the Leader of the House believe this is totally unacceptable and that musicians should always be offered a fee for their services?

[Sir George Young]

I understand the strong feelings and I commend the hon. Gentleman on his own performance as a musician. I will raise the issue with my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport. I do not know whether there will be an opportunity to raise the matter in the rather narrow debate on Monday week on the Olympics and Sunday trading. Depending on the ingenuity of the hon. Gentleman and the breadth of tolerance of whoever happens to be in the Chair, there might be an opportunity to raise it then, but I shall certainly forewarn my right hon. Friend of the concern the hon. Gentleman has just expressed.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Pete Wishart

Thursday 22nd March 2012 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

The commission will be meeting in public and it has asked for evidence. My hon. Friend is too kind about the work of the democracy taskforce to which I contributed when I was on the Back Benches, but I am sure this exchange will have drawn the commission’s attention to the existence of that important work.

[Pete Wishart (Perth and North Perthshire) (SNP)]

Is not the easiest and most elegant solution to the West Lothian question for Scotland to become a normal, independent, self-governing nation?

[Sir George Young]

“Bring it on” is what we on the Government Benches would say. That particular issue is beyond the remit of the commission, but I hope the hon. Gentleman will do what he can to bring forward the date when we can resolve it once and for all.

Business of the House

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Pete Wishart

Thursday 26th January 2012 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

I am sorry that there was an apparent lack of interest in self-employment among Opposition Members. I am sure that their constituents are as interested as ours in the opportunities available for self-employment, particularly under the new enterprise allowance scheme, which I hope will give many people an opportunity to commence their own business and in due course begin to employ other people.

[Pete Wishart (Perth and North Perthshire) (SNP)]

What are the Government going to do about the Scotland Bill? It is back in the Lords today, like a sad, eccentric old aunt that nobody wants to visit. After the momentous events in Scotland of the past couple of weeks, as we move towards independence, are not the Government starting to think about pulling the plug on the sad old dear?

[Sir George Young]

Absolutely not. The Scotland Bill will implement commitments that I believe all three parties made. The reason progress is not being made at the moment is that one of the options in the consultation document, as I am sure the hon. Gentleman is aware, was to amend the Bill. We need the consultation process to end before we decide whether it needs to be amended as was suggested in that document.

Business of the House

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Pete Wishart

Thursday 15th December 2011 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

As a former Housing Minister, I am aware of the problems facing many leaseholders, who find themselves confronted with service charges that they believe to be unreasonable. There are a number of protections in legislation, but my hon. Friend may know that there is also the Leasehold Advisory Service—which I set up when I was Housing Minister—a specialist body sponsored by the Department for Communities and Local Government that can perhaps advise his constituents in dealing with the challenges that face them.

[Pete Wishart (Perth and North Perthshire) (SNP)]

May we have a debate about the impact of the disastrous consequences of the Prime Minister’s decision to isolate the UK from the rest of Europe on the ambitions of the devolved nations? The Leader of the House and other hon. Members refer to “separatists”, but are not the only real separatists in this House the little Englander separatists on the Conservative Back Benches?

[Sir George Young]

I think that that charge might be made against the hon. Gentleman. One might think that his was a separatist party, if I might say so. However, we had such a debate on Tuesday, on an Opposition motion, when he would have had the opportunity to raise the matter, although as I said a moment ago, it is by no means clear that we are isolated in Europe.

Business of the House

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Pete Wishart

Thursday 24th November 2011 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

The practice has been abandoned because of paragraph 145 of the Wright Committee report, which specifically mentioned the two pre-European Council debates that formerly took place in Government time. The Wright Committee recommended that that debate and the other set piece debates should be transferred to the Backbench Business Committee along with the time in which those debates took place. That has now happened. My hon. Friend should go to the Backbench Business Committee with his request for a debate on this particular matter. I have to say to him that it is not as though we have not debated Europe in this Chamber: we had a debate on the petition on the referendum; we had a motion to approve the budget on 8 November; we had a motion on Croatia on Tuesday; and we had a general debate on the UK chairmanship of the Council of Europe. It is not the case that these important issues have gone by default in the Chamber.

[Pete Wishart (Perth and North Perthshire) (SNP)]

Yesterday the Scottish Parliament discussed the Act of Settlement, and there was broad and overwhelming agreement that the discrimination against Catholics must come to an end. When the Government consider sexual equality and the succession, will the right hon. Gentleman ensure that the House gets the opportunity to debate this ongoing discrimination against Catholics?

[Sir George Young]

As the hon. Gentleman knows, there will be a Bill on the royal succession, and I hope it will be possible to debate the important issues he has just raised in that context.

Business of the House

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Pete Wishart

Thursday 27th October 2011 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

My hon. Friend is right that small and medium-sized enterprises are the drivers of economic growth, and he may have an opportunity to raise the topic when my right hon. Friend the Chancellor makes his autumn statement in November. In the meantime, my hon. Friend will know that we have extended the small business rate relief holiday for a year, we are working to abolish 43 tax reliefs in the system to come up with a better regime, and we are cutting corporation tax to the lowest rate in the G7. I hope that will help small businesses in Spelthorne.

[Pete Wishart (Perth and North Perthshire) (SNP)]

Does the Leader of the House think it is ever right or appropriate for a Chair of a Select Committee to threaten a female member of that Committee with getting “a doing”?

[Sir George Young]

My understanding is that, whatever happened in the Scottish Affairs Committee, the Chairman has apologised and I think that is the right action for him to take.

Business of the House

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Pete Wishart

Thursday 12th May 2011 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

I understand that my hon. Friend’s wish has been granted and that he has won an Adjournment debate on the subject next Wednesday.

[Pete Wishart (Perth and North Perthshire) (SNP)]

Can the Leader of the House—if he is paying attention—tell us when the Scotland Bill is likely to return for its remaining stages? When it comes back, will he also ensure enough time to debate and secure the extra economic powers that the Scottish people voted for with the overwhelming re-election of a Scottish National party majority Government last week?

[Sir George Young]

The hon. Gentleman will have heard that I have not announced further debate on the Scotland Bill between now and the Whitsun recess. I anticipate that we will be addressing it thereafter. It is the coalition Government’s intention that there should always be adequate time on Report to debate important issues. I hope to make enough time available for proper consideration of the Scotland Bill, including the issue that he has just touched on.

Business of the House

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Pete Wishart

Thursday 20th January 2011 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

As I understand it, the debate is on parliamentary reform—it does not come much broader than that. I share my hon. Friend’s concern about what is happening down the other end. When I came into this House some time ago, all the rough trade was down here, and down the other end there were non-partisan, short, focused debates in a revising Chamber. The rough trade now seems to have gone down the other end. The other place runs the risk of losing the moral high tone if its Members continue to proceed as they are.

[Pete Wishart (Perth and North Perthshire) (SNP)]

I follow the call of the right hon. Member for Bath (Mr Foster) for a debate on the minimum price of alcohol that was set by the Government this week. It was roundly condemned by health professionals as doing absolutely nothing. Meanwhile, the Liberals and Conservatives gang up with the Labour party in the Scottish Parliament to block the setting of meaningful minimum prices for Scotland. Why is there that discrepancy? Is it the case that Liberals and Conservatives are interested in minimum pricing only if it makes no difference to health and crime?

[Sir George Young]

I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for reinforcing the bid that has just been made. It is open to him to go to the Backbench Business Committee to ask for a specific debate on the minimum price of alcohol. He can then draw the comparisons between what happens in Scotland and the rest of the UK, and debate the proposals. In the light of the interest in this subject, the Backbench Business Committee might well find it a popular one.

Business of the House

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Pete Wishart

Thursday 16th December 2010 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

My hon. Friend makes a good point. He will know that we are introducing a new Work programme from early next year, and my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions is anxious to ensure that job seekers of all ages get the tailored and personalised support that they need to get back to work. I will draw my hon. Friend’s remarks to the attention of the Secretary of State.

[Pete Wishart (Perth and North Perthshire) (SNP)]

Last week, during the tuition fees debate, the Minister for Universities and Science, the right hon. Member for Havant (Mr Willetts) probably inadvertently misled the House when he said that there were more Scottish university students studying in England than there were English university students studying in Scotland. According to the latest figures, 11,805 Scottish students were studying in English universities, while in the same academic year, some 22,510 English students were studying in Scottish universities. I know that the Leader of the House takes these matters very seriously. Can we now expect a statement from the Minister to put that right?

[Sir George Young]

It is certainly the case that, if a Minister has inadvertently given inaccurate information to the House, the appropriate action should be taken and the record should be set straight. If one of my hon. Friends did indeed give the wrong information, that will happen, and I will draw the hon. Gentleman’s remarks to the attention of the appropriate Minister.

Business of the House (Thursday)

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Pete Wishart

Wednesday 8th December 2010 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

For the convenience of the House, the Divisions will be taken together at the end of the debate, as specified in the motion. As my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills has set out previously, it is right that we bring forward the motions now, to give prospective students and universities certainty before the 2012-13 application round starts.

[Pete Wishart (Perth and North Perthshire) (SNP)]

It has been reported in the press that Thursday was selected as the day for debating the motions because of the hope that Scottish and Northern Irish MPs might not be present. Is there any truth in that? The Leader of the House can take great comfort from the fact that we will be here, and we will be voting against the motions.

[Sir George Young]

I am delighted that the hon. Gentleman will be here. I announced last Thursday that the debate would take place tomorrow, and no one objected once during business questions to the day that we chose for the debate.

A slower process would have been not only unfair to prospective students and their families but irresponsible, because of the need to tackle the fiscal crisis that the previous Government left behind. My intention in bringing forward this evening’s motion was to allow adequate time for tomorrow’s important debate. I hope that hon. Members in all parts of the House will support that intention, and I commend the motion to the House.

Business of the House

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Pete Wishart

Thursday 24th June 2010 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

I understand that the arrangements on the civil list were dealt with by agreement, and I entirely agree with my hon. Friend that appropriate celebrations are necessary. We have a year or two in which to plan them, and I hope there will be an opportunity to share with the House exactly how that will be handled.

[Pete Wishart (Perth and North Perthshire) (SNP)]

May I offer my most sincere congratulations to the English football team on reaching the knockout stage of the World cup? Does the Leader of the House not agree that disqualification of the smaller parties in the House from the Backbench Business Committee is in danger of rendering the whole project undemocratic and illegitimate? What is he doing to ensure that all Back Benchers are equal and that all have an opportunity to participate in the business of the House?

[Sir George Young]

The Wright Committee recommended that there should be a business committee of between seven and nine members. The House agreed the establishment of a Backbench Business Committee of eight members a few days ago, and the allocation between the parties was done according to the formula with which the hon. Gentleman is familiar, and the minority parties did not get a place. However, that Committee will be re-elected every year, and I can only suggest that when members are elected for the current year, he opens a dialogue with as many of them as possible to ensure that the voice of minority parties is heard at the Backbench Business Committee, and I am sure that its Chairman has listened to his point.

Backbench Business Committee

Debate between Lord Young of Cookham and Pete Wishart

Tuesday 15th June 2010 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

I will come in a moment to the question of whether the committee should be established for one year or five years.

I turn now to Standing Order No. 14. It is just over 107 years—in fact it was on 1 December 1902—since the House first passed a Standing Order governing the precedence of business at different sittings. That was the predecessor of today’s Standing Order No. 14, which provides for Government business to have precedence at every sitting, with certain exceptions. The motions before the House today will change that proposition radically. For the first time in over a century, the House will be given control over significant parts of its own agenda.

The new committee will give Back Benchers the power and time to schedule debates on issues that matter to them and to their constituents, and allow the House to become more responsive to the world outside. Motions 2 to 5 establish the committee, make arrangements for its election by secret ballot of the whole House and set out its powers and role. Much of what we propose is self-explanatory and, in the interests of brevity, I will direct my remarks towards those points that I feel need some further explanation, and on which Members have tabled amendments.

[Pete Wishart (Perth and North Perthshire) (SNP)]

Does the Leader of the House agree that to be effective the Back-Bench committee must include Back Benchers from every part of this House, including the minority parties?