Overseas Operations (Service Personnel and Veterans) Bill

Lord McCrea of Magherafelt and Cookstown Excerpts

2nd reading & 2nd reading (Hansard) & 2nd reading (Hansard): House of Lords
Wednesday 20th January 2021 Lords Chamber

[Lord McCrea of Magherafelt and Cookstown (DUP) [V]]

My Lords, in general I welcome this Bill, insofar as it seeks to provide fair protection to our armed personnel who served overseas from vexatious and repeated investigations long after they have served. Whether it actually does this is open to question, and many believe that it promises more than it can deliver—but we shall surely examine that in our debate.

In this Bill, the threshold for prosecution of current and former personnel is raised for alleged offences committed on operations outside the British Isles more than five years ago. I join with the Minister in paying tribute to the bravery of our serving personnel and the burden their families carry when they are on duty.

For those of us from Northern Ireland, our genuine concern is not so much what is in the Bill but what is not in it. Missing from this Bill is equal protection for those brave service men and women who served in Northern Ireland, facing a vicious and evil onslaught from the IRA. Government Ministers in the other place have pledged to progress the principle of equal treatment, but their actions to date have certainly not matched the spirit of their promises.

In March 2020, the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland, Brandon Lewis, made this Statement to coincide with the introduction of the overseas operations Bill:

“Today the Government announced the introduction of legislation to provide greater certainty for service personnel and veterans who serve in armed conflicts overseas. Alongside this, we are setting out how we propose to address the legacy of the past in Northern Ireland in a way that focuses on reconciliation, delivers for victims, and ends the cycle of reinvestigations into the Troubles in Northern Ireland that has failed victims and veterans alike—ensuring equal treatment of Northern Ireland veterans and those who served overseas.”—[Official Report, Commons, 18/3/20; col. 168WS.]


During debate on this Bill in the other place, Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State Johnny Mercer said:

“We are very clear that we will not leave Northern Ireland veterans behind. The commitment of equal treatment in any Northern Ireland Bill that comes forward will be absolutely adhered to. This Government will not resile from their commitments to those individuals. We recognise, value and cherish the service and sacrifice of everyone who served in those operations.”—[Official Report, Commons, 23/9/20; col. 1022.]


We are told that Northern Ireland’s absence from the Bill is largely down to differences in the legal framework in which soldiers in Northern Ireland operated compared to those operating outside UK jurisdiction. However, this can often be misconstrued. It is vital that noble Lords recognise the valiant service and sacrifice of those who fought to keep peace for so many years in Northern Ireland, bring stability and protect democracy in our Province. I suggest that this is no different from those who defend our interests abroad. Our nation entered into a covenant with members of our Armed Forces; it ought to apply equally in scope and content to all personnel, regardless of where they serve. The progression of this Bill without legislation granting the same protection to our Northern Ireland veterans is wholly unacceptable.

My colleagues and I have often stressed that we do not support an amnesty or any equivalence of our soldiers with paramilitaries. That is why we cannot support the Government’s insistence on the need to separate Northern Ireland legacy issues from the overseas operations Bill. This serves only to differentiate or set apart the service of men and women in Northern Ireland from the sacrifice of our Armed Forces elsewhere, which could be considered discrediting to their contribution.

Let me be clear: I do not support an amnesty for soldiers who have committed criminal acts, but I am deeply concerned about the practice of veterans in their senior years being arrested and brought to Northern Ireland to respond to allegations which have already been investigated, often on multiple occasions, and for which no new compelling evidence is provided. In my humble opinion, that is persecution of our veterans. It is an intolerable burden to place on those veterans who ought to be enjoying, in their later years, the appreciation we give to their sterling service.

I have listened and will listen carefully to other noble Lords as they point out weaknesses and flaws in this Bill. I will certainly give them genuine consideration. I hope that, together, we can take forward legislation that is worthy of our support.

Military Covenant

Lord McCrea of Magherafelt and Cookstown Excerpts

Wednesday 22nd October 2014 Commons Chamber

[Dr William McCrea (South Antrim) (DUP)]

I want to begin by thanking the Secretary of State for Defence for attending the opening part of the debate; that was deeply appreciated. I am also delighted that the shadow Minister is here, and I thank the Minister of State for her speech, the manner in which she delivered it and her willingness to learn more about the workings of the military covenant in Northern Ireland. She and the shadow Minister both made a very generous offer to come to Northern Ireland and see what is happening for themselves. That is deeply appreciated and I want to put that on the record, because often, Ministers and shadow Ministers can be taken for granted. They will both be very welcome in our Northern Ireland constituencies. My right hon. Friend the Member for Lagan Valley (Mr Donaldson) has a base in his constituency, as do I, so they are very welcome to visit.

I want to pay tribute to the men and women of our regular armed forces across the United Kingdom, who daily place themselves in the line of fire, not only for this nation but for others across the world who need their protection. I also want to pay tribute to the Reserve forces and their families. As with others who put themselves on the front line, especially in Northern Ireland, many of their families are forgotten about, yet many have also made a tremendous sacrifice and paid a tremendous price for their involvement in the armed forces. In Northern Ireland we are very proud of the contribution our Reserve forces make to all elements of the armed forces in the United Kingdom. We are proud that, despite Northern Ireland’s making up approximately 3% of the UK population, we regularly provide more than 20% of the Reserve forces on operational deployment. That is a great testimony to the long and proud tradition of Northern Ireland’s servicemen and women, and the reason why we must speak up today in Parliament for those from our part of the United Kingdom whom we genuinely believe have been denied the full implementation of the armed forces covenant.

According to Lord Ashcroft’s review, there are a significant number of home service Royal Irish Regiment and Ulster Defence Regiment personnel living in Northern Ireland, and their needs are enduring. The aftercare service, which, along with the armed forces charity SSAFA, operates a number of veterans support committees, was set up to provide welfare assistance to this group. It is in the process of reorganising to accept responsibility for all veterans in Northern Ireland. That discreet charitable welfare support is essential to mitigate the difficulties associated with assessing statutory veteran-related assistance and with the much lower profile of veterans in Northern Ireland. The DUP fought hard to secure that service in the period leading up to the disbandment of the home service battalions of the Royal Irish Regiment. The work of the various armed forces charities and support organisations is to be commended. Their dedication to working with and for our servicemen and women is second to none.

I welcome the news from the Government that £50,000 of funding has been given to the Ulster Defence Regiment and Royal Irish Regiment Aftercare Service to enable it to set up a welfare support network and an advisory service for veterans and their dependants in Northern Ireland. However, further charitable support is needed, and I repeat the DUP’s call for the Government to co-operate with the military charities to establish and fund a treatment and respite centre in Northern Ireland for veterans and armed forces personnel.

There are limits to what organisations such as those can achieve without greater Government assistance. In England, Scotland and Wales, wounded, injured and sick veterans are entitled—subject to the clinical needs of others—to priority NHS treatment for conditions that can be attributed to their military service. However, that arrangement is still not being implemented in Northern Ireland because of the ongoing security threat from dissident republicans.

Lord Ashcroft’s review proposed a solution in which security-vetted armed forces champions would be appointed to work in the various agencies to assist service personnel and veterans. The Government Departments in Northern Ireland that might be able to offer support to veterans and service personnel say that they are unable to give them any form of professional treatment in line with the objectives of the military covenant because of the restrictions placed on them by legislation.

When the then Minister of State for Defence Personnel, Welfare and Veterans, the right hon. Member for Rayleigh and Wickford (Mr Francois), gave evidence to the Welsh Affairs Committee on 30 October 2012, during the Committee’s inquiry into support for armed forces veterans in Wales, he was asked whether he was aware of the different emphasis being put on different policy priorities in England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland. He replied:

“We have a particular challenge in Northern Ireland because some of the Sinn Fein-run authorities have a particular view of the covenant and what it represents. So in Northern Ireland this area is particularly sensitive and difficult”.

If the Government are unwilling to fulfil their duty to implement the military covenant in Northern Ireland owing to a fear of Sinn Fein and nationalist intolerance, it is time that they publicly admitted it.

The challenge for the Government and the Northern Ireland Office is to stand up to those restrictive elements and give military veterans residing in Northern Ireland their full rights. This Government should not be frightened or bullied into backing down by Sinn Fein’s demands, which discriminate against the very servicemen and women who have protected our nation. The motion before us today is about equal citizenship, equal treatment and equal gratitude for our armed forces personnel, be they from England, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland or the various regions of the British Commonwealth. They all deserve our support, and they should not be discriminated against just because they happen to reside in Northern Ireland.

[Mr Donaldson]

Will my hon. Friend add to that list the very brave men and women who reside in the Republic of Ireland and who serve in the armed forces of the United Kingdom?

[Dr McCrea]

I agree with my right hon. Friend; we must also be sensitive to their needs. When we ask for protection and services for those from Northern Ireland or any other region of the United Kingdom, we must not forget the many people from the Irish Republic who put their necks on the line by joining up and going to fight with Her Majesty’s forces for freedom across the world, even though it was unpopular to do so in their own neighbourhoods. The armed forces covenant sets out the relationship between the nation, the Government and the armed forces. It recognises that the whole nation has a moral obligation to members of the armed forces and their families, and it establishes how they should expect to be treated. The covenant states:

“In putting the needs of the Nation and the Army before their own, they forego some of the rights enjoyed by those outside the Armed Forces.

In return, British soldiers must always be able to expect fair treatment, to be valued and respected as individuals, and that they (and their families) will be sustained and rewarded by commensurate terms and conditions of service.”

Why should one region accept anything less than that which is enjoyed by the rest of the United Kingdom?

The Democratic Unionist party is proud to support our armed forces and will accept nothing less than full implementation of the covenant. At Westminster, at Stormont and in local government, the DUP has sought to give a voice to those who have served our country. The greatest service that can be given in terms of recognition is to remove the barriers to the implementation of the military covenant for ex-servicemen and women. Within the current legal limits, DUP Ministers have done their utmost to help ex-military personnel, and that has been acknowledged in this House today. The work that my colleague in another place, Edwin Poots, a former Minister, put in has been acknowledged, as has that of other of my colleagues. Our party has met officials from the Northern Ireland Office on numerous occasions about the issue and we will continue to seek all avenues available for supporting the armed forces. Today’s motion is part of a wider debate on defending Her Majesty’s armed services. The Government must ensure that our defence budget is protected as much as possible. The very least we should be doing is ensuring that our soldiers are fully equipped for battle, and that those who return from military service are supported and given the opportunities in life that they deserve.

I thank the hon. Member for Tewkesbury (Mr Robertson) for the update to the Northern Ireland Affairs Committee dated 16 June, which stated that 93% of the covenant measures had been extended to Northern Ireland and that further work is being done to bring Northern Ireland into line with the rest of the UK. That work must be continued, as the issue has not yet been settled once and for all. I firmly believe that Her Majesty’s Government have a duty to support the armed forces and the veterans who have served their country so well, and my party is happy to work with Ministers in pursuing that vital work. No political obstacle or political party should get in the way of full implementation of the covenant in every region of the UK, including Northern Ireland. Soldiers who reside in Northern Ireland serve the whole of the UK. The military covenant is not a devolved matter, so whether they receive their entitlements should not be a postcode lottery. There should be equal support for all military personnel, wherever they live within this United Kingdom.

I am sorry that we do not have any nationalist Members or Social Democratic and Labour party Members taking part in this debate but I remind everyone in this House that whenever our soldiers defended us on the streets of Northern Ireland—[Interruption.] I said taking part in the debate; I did not say that they were not present. Whenever our soldiers went out on to the streets of Northern Ireland to protect us in those years of trouble, they did so for everyone. Everyone was equally protected, and many of our soldiers gave their lives and sacrificed their all to ensure the safety of the ordinary, decent people of Northern Ireland, wherever they came from, in very difficult circumstances. As I said, many of them made the supreme sacrifice and paid the supreme price for their labours.

We in Northern Ireland know all too well the role our armed forces play. During Operation Banner, the longest continuous military deployment in British history, more than 1,000 British security force personnel were murdered defending our Province from terrorist attack. Tonight, in this debate on the military covenant, we honour the memory of all those who have served their country. We demand that the rights of those military veterans from Northern Ireland are upheld, as they have fought in the same conflicts, suffered the same hardships and encountered the same cost in terms of loss of colleagues, family and friends. Therefore, they are due not only the respect that this House, this Government, Northern Ireland and the people of the United Kingdom have promised, but full implementation of the armed forces covenant.

--- Later in debate ---

[Dr McCrea]

Does my hon. Friend agree that when the soldiers walked the streets of Belfast they walked the streets of west Belfast as well as of east Belfast and protected the community of west Belfast the same as they did every other part of the Province?

[Jim Shannon]

I thank my hon. Friend for that point and that was exactly the case in Northern Ireland: they protected everyone, as we all know.

Of course, paragraph 12 of the inquiry mentioned that Northern Ireland was different politically and legally, making issues relating to the armed forces contentious, but it went on to say that the armed forces community in Northern Ireland should not be disadvantaged

“compared with other groups there, or when compared to that community elsewhere in the UK, beyond that variation which would be expected under normal devolution.”

Although I understand that we are delivering 93% of the Select Committee’s recommendations, my hon. Friend the Member for South Antrim (Dr McCrea) made the pertinent comment that we want to see 100% of those recommendations implemented in Northern Ireland. We have only 7% to go.

Lord Ashcroft also recently considered alternative options as part of his review of how former military personnel assimilate back into civilian life. He recommended that part of the Northern Ireland Act, which was introduced after the Good Friday agreement, should be changed at Westminster to allow the covenant to operate in Northern Ireland. A number of Members have spoken about section 75, which makes it an offence to discriminate against anyone based on factors such as religion, race, age or disability.

Ironically, the section has been used to discriminate against some former servicemen, who cannot apply for social housing when they are in the military for security reasons. A number of constituents have come to me who have had difficulties letting the housing people know all their circumstances because of their security service. They could gain some advantage from being in the services, but cannot because of the security implications. There are issues that need to be addressed when they leave the armed forces. Lord Ashcroft suggests that the section should be altered to allow ex-servicemen to receive the

“recognition and provision they deserve”.

It is not as if we are asking for mountains to be moved; we are not. Giving veterans priority access to NHS treatments if they have been injured in the line of duty seems just and fair, and it also seems just and fair that these men and women, and their families, should be given all the help possible to secure a house and a base from which to continue their life. These people were willing to lay down their lives so that we could have our today; we say that every Remembrance Sunday, and the words are pertinent to everyone who attends Remembrance Sunday services. They mean so much, and those people have done that so that we can have our todays, and continue to have them. They should not be punished or made to feel as though they have done something wrong in their duties. Quite the opposite: our communities should do everything they can to show these men and women how grateful we are, and our Executive should do all they can to ensure that veterans and their families receive the best possible care when they return home.

When Corporal Channing Day, a constituent of mine from Comber, died after being shot in Afghanistan, we asked for a meeting with the Prime Minister. It was attended by my right hon. Friends the Members for Belfast North (Mr Dodds) and for Lagan Valley, my hon. Friend the Member for South Antrim, Brenda Hale, who is a Member of the Northern Ireland Assembly, and me. We had a very good meeting with the Prime Minister. Although it was held as a result of tragedy, we initiated that day a call to ensure that all service personnel have an opportunity to participate and have the advantages that they clearly should have from the covenant.

I will summarise some of the contributions. We heard first from my right hon. Friend the Member for Lagan Valley, whose deep interest in defence matters we all acknowledge. We also recognise that he is greatly respected in this House and further afield, and not only for his knowledge of defence matters, but for his contribution in telling other parts of the world how our peace process has progressed. We cannot be the panacea that will change everything in the world—far from it—but perhaps we can offer some help, and clearly he does that.

My right hon. Friend referred to the sacrifice made by service personnel in Northern Ireland so that we can enjoy life. He referred to the almost 1,000 people who gave their lives in service between ’69 and 2002, and to those who died afterwards as a result of their service. He referred to the covenant being designed to ensure that veterans are not disadvantaged, which we all adhere to.

My right hon. Friend also referred to post-traumatic stress disorder, which became a theme in all our contributions. Northern Ireland has the highest rate of PTSD anywhere in the United Kingdom, and indeed anywhere in the world. That shows the magnitude of the issues we face in Northern Ireland. He also referred to the Royal Irish Aftercare Service, which we are all aware of—those Members who were not aware are now. It is second to none. We thank the Royal Irish for all they do.

When it comes to health and housing, a distinct group is specified under section 75 of the Northern Ireland Act. My right hon. Friend talked about the issues Lord Ashcroft referred to in his report. He recommended that the armed forces in Northern Ireland had a champion. The Minister also referred to that recommendation. The hon. Member for Harrow West (Mr Thomas) intervened a couple of times and referred to the importance of credit unions.

The hon. Member for North Down (Lady Hermon) referred to the contribution made by those who police the Province, as did my right hon. Friend the Member for Lagan Valley when he responded to that intervention. He also referred to community covenants and the need for the armed forces to be directly involved with local community groups, for example where they are garrisoned, and some Members have garrisons in their constituencies.

I was particularly impressed by the clear commitment the Minister gave—it is on the record in Hansard—on mental health issues in the armed forces and the fact that communities should be involved so that no soldiers or service personnel ever face any disadvantage. The Government are clearly committed to helping the armed forces.

The Minister referred to the 11 councils coming together to nominate one representative to go to the reserve forces association. In a past life I was a representative from Ards borough council, but not every council sends somebody. We hope that the 11 councils will send someone and that they will become, as the Minister said, a champion for veterans. If we get that, I think that we will achieve a marvellous amount of movement for the future.

We heard that 93% of the recommendations will be implemented in Northern Ireland. Again, that commitment shows the impact of what has been initiated in this House by many Members, and it indicates its acceptance across Northern Ireland. The Minister also referred to the Royal Irish Aftercare Service and the cadets, which I was pleased about, because I have a particular interest in the cadet force. We need to show what they have done across Northern Ireland in bringing communities together.

It is always a pleasure when we are all in agreement and saying the same thing, and it was good to hear the commitment from the shadow Minister about a high level of reserves in the TA. In Northern Ireland we have a higher level of service personnel per head of population than in any other part of the United Kingdom. I am not sure if that is due to our warring attitude, or what it is, but we do like to serve in the uniforms of British Army, Royal Air Force and Navy personnel. That runs deep in all our blood in Northern Ireland. She said that the armed forces want a level playing field, and that is exactly what we are trying to achieve. At its heart, the armed forces covenant is about people, and we ought to make sure that their treatment is the same in all parts of the United Kingdom.

As always, the Royal Navy rode high in the speech by the hon. Member for Plymouth, Sutton and Devonport (Oliver Colvile), and we appreciate that very much. I think there must be no place in the world like Plymouth when it comes to the Royal Navy. I always listen to his speeches with some joy. He referred to the work he has done in Plymouth, and particularly to the work that is done with children. That was quite interesting. Other Members might not have mentioned it, but I am aware of the work that armed forces personnel and charities do with children across all communities, and that is good news.

Better Defence Acquisition

Lord McCrea of Magherafelt and Cookstown Excerpts

Monday 10th June 2013 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hammond]

I will be very frank with the hon. Gentleman: one of the things I have learnt over the past three years is that new inefficiencies creep in all the time if one is not continually vigilant. That, incidentally, is why, however much one thinks one has squeezed out all the inefficiencies, when one goes back around the loop and looks again one finds more that were not noticed the last time or that have crept in since. He is absolutely right to say that it is a complex enterprise, but within the overall portfolio of defence transformation—we are carrying out many hugely complex projects simultaneously —it is just one of many, and I am confident that we can manage it.

[Dr William McCrea (South Antrim) (DUP)]

Will the Secretary of State assure the House that the interests of national security and the safety of our armed forces, to whom we owe a great debt of gratitude, as well as value for taxpayers’ money, will be at the heart of the changes in defence procurement? Will he also assure us that all essential defence equipment will be made available to our front-line forces in the defence of the nation?

[Mr Hammond]

I can of course give the hon. Gentleman that assurance. We are trying to do two things: to ensure that the £160 billion defence equipment and support programme is delivered effectively to our armed forces and that it is delivered efficiently and in a value-for-money way to the taxpayer. In the end, this allows us better, more reliably and more sustainably to support our armed forces while ensuring that this is done in an appropriate way during a period of public financial austerity.

Reservists

Lord McCrea of Magherafelt and Cookstown Excerpts

Tuesday 23rd April 2013 Westminster Hall

[Several hon. Members]

rose—

[Dr William McCrea (in the Chair)]

Order. A considerable number of Members desire to speak. I do not want to impose a time limit, so I ask them to be considerate of their colleagues. Given the number of Members who have asked to speak, contributions should be six minutes.

--- Later in debate ---

[Several hon. Members]

rose—

[Dr William McCrea (in the Chair)]

Order. I impose a five-minute limit on speeches to get most of the Members who have requested to speak into the debate.

--- Later in debate ---

[Richard Drax]

I did not quite get the gist of the first part of the hon. Gentleman’s question, but I of course pay tribute to the reservists in his constituency. I hope that he will forgive me for not picking up quite what he said. I have not got long, so I will finish quickly.

Reservists take between 36 and 40 months to be considered fit for mobilisation. As I understand it, they may then be used for 12 months in any five-year period. Will the Minister confirm that? Yet I understand that the Government may spend £1.8 billion in enticements to the new lot of reservists over the next 10 years. Again, I would be grateful to the Minister if he could confirm whether that is true. In these tough times, £1.8 billion over 10 years to entice people into the reserves is an awful lot of money. Perhaps that money would be better spent on the regulars.

A possible solution that has been mooted is to cut the reserves by half, to 15,000. That would save money and retain the essential niche roles of, for example, lawyers and tanker drivers, whom we have already discussed in this debate. Of course that niche market must be maintained; such people do a fantastic job.

I want to draw to an end because there is, I think, one more speaker. If not, the Minister will sum up. Let me just go back to my first point and ask whether this is the direction that we in this country want to go. Many honourable and distinguished predecessors of ours in this place have issued warnings when our country has cut her armed services. We are now cutting down to a point where, whatever the calibre of the extra reserves, and they will of course be top notch, will they be enough to fulfil all the roles, commitments and responsibilities that this country has? Some Members have compared what we are doing here, or not doing here, with other countries. I always think that it is a great danger to compare the United Kingdom and what we are trying to do with our armed services with another country, such as America, which has a very different budget from our own. America has the ability to produce aircraft and all the equipment that it needs to train its reserves.

Back in the 1980s when I was a regular soldier, the TA was having huge difficulties getting on to the appropriate training ranges and all the things that it needs to do. I suggest today that with all the training disappearing in Germany and everyone coming back to this country, these facilities will be hard sought by the Regular Army let alone the TAs who desperately need it as their percentage increases.

[Dr William McCrea (in the Chair)]

I want to give a highly respected Member of the House some time to speak, so may I ask Julian Lewis to speak for three minutes only, as we have already been beaten by time?

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Robathan]

I am sorry but I really do not have time to give way.

We remain confident that our proposition, in addition to being the right thing to do, will deliver value to the taxpayer. The independent commissioner for reserves concluded that reserves are significantly cheaper to maintain than regulars, and that they are no more expensive than regulars even when we take into account the costs on operations. In response to my hon. Friend the Member for Basildon and Billericay (Mr Baron), who just tried to intervene, I will say that part-timers are inevitably cheaper than full-timers.

As I have said, we need a change in the mindset regarding reserves, and a change in the attitude towards them. I absolutely believe that this policy is the right thing to do. It is not that we are keen to reduce the regular Army, but it is ridiculous to have a trained reserve of 19,000 for a country of our size; that is a ridiculously small number. We can do better than that—using reserves has huge social benefits—and we shall do better than that. Rather than admire the problems that we faced on inheriting an overblown defence budget in 2010, this Government have taken the necessary decisions to deliver a credible future Army which is fit for the challenges of the 21st century.

Just before I sit down, may I also say that my hon. Friend the Member for South Dorset (Richard Drax) and I served in another English regiment, and not just in the Fusiliers? On St George’s day, we used to have a service, quite a good lunch as I recall and then the rest of the day off.

[Dr William McCrea (in the Chair)]

Order. I thank hon. Members for their contributions in what has been a very valuable debate, and I also thank you for the manner in which you have treated each other.

Army Basing Plan

Lord McCrea of Magherafelt and Cookstown Excerpts

Tuesday 5th March 2013 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hammond]

First, today’s announcement says nothing about the training estate. If announcements about the training estate need to be made, my right hon. Friend the Minister for the Armed Forces will make them. I recognise the tension my hon. Friend outlines between the need to have reserve accommodation in the areas where we recruit and the need to enable joint training for regulars and reserves, which is at the heart of our new model for the reserve forces. I can assure him that resolving that tension is at the core of the work going on and will inform the reserve basing review, which I will announce to the House before the summer recess.

[Dr William McCrea (South Antrim) (DUP)]

Northern Ireland has a long history of providing our Army with a lot of recruits. Will the Secretary of State reconsider the reduction of approximately 400 in the overall number of armed personnel in Northern Ireland proposed in the announcement, and recognise Northern Ireland as a part of the consolidation process? Army personnel and their families have found Northern Ireland a great place in which to live and educate their children. We have a lot of capacity, and at a time of financial restraint it is surely wise to use that.

[Mr Hammond]

I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for his comments. He will recognise that part of the reductions in the 2020 numbers for armed forces personnel in all four countries of the Union results from the civilianisation of the search and rescue service. When we talk about reductions of 400 personnel in Wales and Northern Ireland, we must recognise that a significant proportion of that number is represented by the transfer of search and rescue services to a civilian contractor.

Oral Answers to Questions

Lord McCrea of Magherafelt and Cookstown Excerpts

Monday 26th March 2012 Commons Chamber

[Mr Robathan]

My hon. Friend raises a very good point, and I should say that in general, service children have a rather better than average attainment record in schools. We have several schemes, one of which is the continuity of education allowance, which allows children to remain in one school while their parents move around the world or the country. Another is the pupil premium that we have introduced, run by the Department for Education, under which each child carries a passport of money for their school. Schools very much welcome that.

[Dr William McCrea (South Antrim) (DUP)]

I join the Secretary of State in expressing sincere sympathy at the tragic deaths of the soldiers in Afghanistan.

Can the Minister confirm that homes at military bases in Northern Ireland such as Aldergrove will be upgraded to improve living conditions for all our military families?

[Mr Robathan]

The hon. Gentleman raises a very important issue. It is rather like painting the Forth road bridge—or is it the rail bridge? I can never remember. [Interruption.] The rail bridge—I am grateful. It is ongoing—[Hon. Members: “Not any more.”] Apparently, they have found a new paint in Scotland. Nevertheless, we will continue to work on all Army quarters. The last Government took great steps to improve service family accommodation, and we are continuing that work.

Afghanistan

Lord McCrea of Magherafelt and Cookstown Excerpts

Tuesday 18th October 2011 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hammond]

I will certainly look at those provinces and draw the attention of my right hon. Friend the Foreign Secretary to what my hon. Friend has said. Of course, my focus will be on the area of central Helmand, for which the British forces have direct responsibility.

[Dr William McCrea (South Antrim) (DUP)]

On behalf of my right hon. and hon. Friends, I welcome the Secretary of State to his new position and pay tribute to the professionalism of his colleague who served before him. Will the Secretary of State assure me, and the House, that soldiers who have returned home from Afghanistan with serious physical and mental injuries will continue to receive the best possible medical attention for as long as they need it?

[Mr Hammond]

The Government have put a huge investment of time, management effort and money into that exercise, and I can assure the hon. Gentleman that those who need medical help as a result of injuries that they received while fighting on behalf of their country will receive it.

Armed Forces Bill

Lord McCrea of Magherafelt and Cookstown Excerpts

Tuesday 14th June 2011 Commons Chamber

New clause 4 also focuses on support in the prison and probation systems. I note that the right hon. Gentleman feels deeply about this issue and has raised it on many occasions. I must tell him that his proposal for—[Interruption.]

[The Temporary Chair (Dr William McCrea)]

Order. I ask right hon. and hon. Members to keep the noise down. We want to hear the response from the Minister. A lot of people intervened and asked questions. It is only appropriate, proper and courteous to hear the answers.

[Mr Robathan]

If Members have come in at the behest of the Whips because they expect a Division, they might as well go out for a bit longer, because I have a lot more to say that will delay the Division. They are very wise to do so.

New clause 4, which I was addressing, proposes a legal obligation to appoint a former armed forces personnel support officer to every prison and probation service in England and Wales. That would impose an unnecessarily legislative framework. The veterans in custody support programme focuses on the early identification of ex-service individuals who would benefit from extra support. It offers advice on a range of issues from housing and mental health to medals and war pensions. The voluntary sector provides excellent additional support.

New clause 5 would require financial support to be provided for a range of welfare groups. I pay tribute to the invaluable role played by numerous service and ex-service organisations in promoting the welfare of the armed forces community. Some have been doing so for a very long time. Only this month, we celebrated the 90th anniversary of the Royal British Legion. Indeed, there was a garden party—indoors because it was raining—at No. 10 on Friday, at which the Prime Minister spoke. Members of the Royal British Legion and its supporters, such as Vera Lynn, all appreciated it enormously. Similarly, last week I went to the service at the Guards chapel on the 40th anniversary of the War Widows Association of Great Britain, with which we are in touch a great deal. Many such bodies have an expert understanding of the needs of service and ex-service personnel. Their support sits alongside the provision of facilities from public funds and we have close working relationships with many of them.

However, it would not be appropriate for the Government to give general financial support to such groups. Registered charities are and should remain independent. It is right that they raise their own funding, whether they are concerned with the armed forces or not. It is a long-standing practice that central Government do not provide funds raised through taxation to assist the core activities of individual charities. In any event, given the number of charities, the Government would not be able to do that in a fair manner. I pay tribute to the many charities that are raising a great deal of money at the moment, such as Help for Heroes, the Royal British Legion and Combat Stress—we have been discussing mental health. They are working to raise funds to support our armed forces and I pay tribute to them.

New clause 6 proposes the creation of a policy forum for former service personnel. Is there a need for another policy forum and, if so, do we need to legislate to create it? There are already a number of groups that help to shape the delivery of veterans’ welfare. The external reference group on the covenant brings together armed forces advocates from across Government and external members from ex-service organisations. It provides co-ordination for the effort across Government and oversight of the Government’s performance in rebuilding the armed forces covenant, and it allows ex-service organisations and other experts to influence the development of Government policy. The right hon. Gentleman mentioned the Confederation of British Service and Ex-Service Organisations. There are regular meetings between COBSEO and senior MOD staff and Ministers, including myself. The annual welfare conference organised by the MOD allows many smaller organisations to debate these issues. There are 13 veterans advisory and pensions committees throughout the United Kingdom that provide assistance to the service and ex-service community and local public service providers. They raise awareness in public bodies and the local community about the needs of veterans. I trust that I have made my point that establishing another former armed services personnel policy forum would not offer any tangible benefit.

I now turn to the second half of amendment 3. [Interruption.] For the benefit of people such as the shadow Secretary of State for Defence who have just walked in, perhaps I should repeat what I have said.

[The Temporary Chair (Dr William McCrea)]

Order. I ask right hon. and hon. Members once again to be courteous and to listen to the responses. If they want to have conversations outside this business, they can do so outside the Chamber.

[Mr Robathan]

For those who have arrived recently, it would be discourteous of me to not respond to those who have raised points, such as the right hon. Member for Dwyfor Meirionnydd. I have yet to achieve the same length of speech as the right hon. Gentleman or the hon. Member for West Dunbartonshire. [Interruption.] Indeed, the night is yet young.

The second half of amendment 3 sets out nine headings that must be covered in the annual report. I do not deny the importance of any of those topics. Some are broad and some are fairly narrow, such as “debt management” and “domestic violence”. However, it is not a comprehensive list and I am sure that other hon. Members could add many suggestions. We would rather not legislate for such a list because it may change over the next few years. The question is whether we should cram all possible issues into the legislation and turn the annual covenant report into a box-ticking exercise, or whether we want to give the Secretary of State the opportunity to identify and investigate the problems that are actually faced by service people. Amendment 3 would deny the Secretary of State the flexibility to deal with the effects of service that are considered to be the most important or relevant at the time of each report.

Finally on this group of amendments I come to amendment 4, which we do not believe would add a great deal to the Bill. The Secretary of State has made it clear that he will seek views and evidence in preparing each annual covenant report. If there are issues, he will respond to them and give a time frame for implementing any recommendations. The amendment would simply get us into questions about who is and who is not an expert in this field. This country is fortunate to have an active community of well informed, constructive and articulate groups that are committed to improving the welfare of service people and want to work with the Government to achieve that. Many are brought together in the external reference group, and I can assure the right hon. Member for Dwyfor Meirionnydd that they are not slow in coming forward. We have stated that we will publish their observations alongside the annual report.

--- Later in debate ---

[Thomas Docherty (Dunfermline and West Fife) (Lab)]

I beg to move, That the clause be read a Second time.

[The Temporary Chair (Dr William McCrea)]

With this it will be convenient to discuss the following: new clause 16—UK Defence Base Closure and Realignment Commission

‘(1) An independent UK Defence Base Closure and Realignment Commission shall be established.

(2) The Commission shall be comprised of 12 members reflecting the nations and regions of the United Kingdom.

(3) The Select Committee on Defence of the House of Commons shall, within a fortnight of the conclusion of a Strategic Defence and Security Review, propose the membership of the Commission, giving due weight to—

(a) the nations and regions of the United Kingdom;

(b) military and strategic expertise; and

(c) experience in assessment of economic impacts.

(4) The proposed membership shall be subject to approval by resolution of both Houses of Parliament.

(5) The Commission shall convene following the conclusion of a Strategic Defence and Security Review to consider a draft force structure plan submitted by the Secretary of State for Defence, and shall arrange for its reports to be laid before Parliament within six months of the conclusion of such a Review.

(6) The Commission will make recommendations for base closures and realignments following consideration of the force structure plan, the economic effects of a closure or realignment of a military installation and the strategic military presence across the nations and regions of the United Kingdom.

(7) The Secretary of State shall lay a draft Order in Council to give effect to the recommendations of the Commission which shall be brought into effect only if approved by resolution of both Houses.

(8) The Secretary of State shall not give effect to the draft structure plan referred to in subsection (5) until parliamentary proceedings under subsection (7) are concluded.’.

Amendment 1, title, line 2, after ‘Police’, insert

‘to provide for parliamentary control of proposals to close or realign bases for the armed forces.’.

[Thomas Docherty]

New clause 1 stands in my name and those of several colleagues. It is a pleasure, once again, Dr McCrea, to serve under your chairmanship. I very much enjoyed serving on the Finance Bill under your leadership, and I hope that you will keep me in order as we go through this evening’s proceedings.

New clause 1 should be relatively non-contentious. We have seen, in the last strategic defence and security review, an unprecedented attack on our defence of the realm capabilities: we have seen, as the Secretary of State himself admits, a Treasury and financially driven round of armed forces restructuring; we are seeing the British Army reduced significantly; we have already seen the closure of RAF Kinloss, as well as the loss of our Nimrod capability, which, as the First Sea Lord admitted to the Defence Committee, has placed our maritime surveillance capabilities at a severe disadvantage; and we are also bringing home the British Army from the Rhine.

Each Government, over the past 40 or 50 years, have reconfigured our armed forces structure to best suit the challenges as they have seen them, but never before have we seen one so radical and based not on the nation’s defence needs, but on the Chancellor of the Exchequer’s needs. For that reason, there is great concern in communities up and down the country that decisions are being made not by the Ministry of Defence, but by the Treasury, and that therefore those decisions are not being made because they are the correct defence decisions but because they are the most expedient or financially convenient for the Treasury and in order to save money.

I have great respect for the Under-Secretary of State for Defence, the right hon. Member for South Leicestershire (Mr Robathan) and his ministerial colleagues, and I know that they are fighting valiantly to persuade the Chancellor that he is plain wrong, but we cannot assume—because we have not seen any letters yet from the Secretary of State to his counterparts—that he will be successful in persuading the Treasury to provide additional money. If the MOD team are unsuccessful, next month there will be some extremely bad news for a number of communities throughout the United Kingdom.

--- Later in debate ---

[Dr Julian Huppert (Cambridge) (LD)]

I beg to move, That the clause be read a Second time.

[The Temporary Chair (Dr William McCrea)]

With this it will be convenient to discuss new clause 11 —Enlistment of minors

‘(1) The Armed Forces Act 2006 is amended as follows.

(2) In section 328(2)(c) (Enlistment) the words “without the consent of prescribed persons” are omitted.’.

[Dr Huppert]

It is a great pleasure to move this amendment in my name and that of my hon. Friend the Member for Wells (Tessa Munt), who is present. It would allow under-18s to leave the armed forces as of right, if they so wished. There have already been some discussions on this with the Minister, so I shall not detain the Committee for too long. It is an important issue, however, and a number of groups have worked hard, along with my hon. Friend, myself and others, to press for this change. I wish to note in particular the efforts of the Quakers in Britain, especially Michael Bartlet, who has spearheaded much of the awareness-raising that has led to our reaching this point.

The proposal to allow under-18s to leave as of right has also been supported by the Joint Committee on Human Rights. I should declare that I was a member of it at the time, which may or may not be coincidental. It gave a clear recommendation that—astonishingly—fits extremely well with the amendment I am now proposing:

“We recommend that a right to discharge for under-18s be established, and that all those recruited under the age of 18 be told of this right.”

Support for UK Armed Forces and Veterans

Lord McCrea of Magherafelt and Cookstown Excerpts

Thursday 3rd March 2011 Commons Chamber

[Mr Donaldson]

Indeed; I welcome the hon. Gentleman’s intervention. Our purpose in putting the motion before the House today even though there have already been debates on these issues, including one on the military covenant a few weeks ago, is to show that we think those debates should continue and that the House should not tire of discussing these issues until we get them right.

[Dr William McCrea (South Antrim) (DUP)]

Surely the point is that all we are asking the Government and the Prime Minister to do is to honour the promise that the Prime Minister made at the Dispatch Box.

[Mr Donaldson]

I thank my hon. Friend for that comment and I accept the hon. Member for South West Wiltshire’s point that what we want in the end is delivery. We want to ensure that armed forces personnel, veterans and their families are provided with the care and support they need, but as there is already debate out there about what is meant by enshrining the military covenant in law, or by referencing it in law, we would like some clarity so we can put the issue to bed and get on with the job of writing the covenant and delivering the commitments that have been given by the Government to those who require that help and support.

--- Later in debate ---

[Dr William McCrea (South Antrim) (DUP)]

It is an honour and privilege to join right hon. and hon. Members in paying tribute to the courage and bravery of our servicemen and women.

When the Democratic Unionist party was allotted this debate, I was delighted that we had the honour of being able to choose the motion on support for UK armed forces and veterans. The motion speaks for itself, and those right hon. and hon. Members who have spoken find that this matter touches the nerve of the community. I am delighted that there has been such support for the motion across the House.

Those who join our armed forces realise that they are not joining a boy scout club—they are joining the armed services. It is an occupation, and some join because they come from military families, some join for the excitement, and others join because they have no other means of employment. Whatever their reason for joining, however, it is right to point out that they have given valiant service and great sacrifice, and the House is proud of what they have done, and are doing at present, in the field of conflict. Let me mention the gallant service of the Royal Irish who are serving in Afghanistan.

I will never forget my visit to Camp Bastion in Afghanistan, and I salute every one of our soldiers, and the international team of soldiers—whether from the United States or other countries—who are working together to try to bring stability to that area and safety to the world. I was greatly taken by the bravery not only of the soldiers, as I pay tribute to the doctors and nurses serving there, especially in the brilliant hospital, which is an example of how to stabilise critically injured soldiers. I remember that the aircraft in which I had arrived was immediately turned into a hospital to transfer soldiers to Birmingham for additional treatment.

We think today of the families who have lost their loved ones because of the conflict in Afghanistan and the earlier conflict in Iraq, but we should also bear it in mind that many young men and women are returning from theatre with not only horrific bodily injuries, but horrific mental injuries. I remember the tragedy of Northern Ireland. I remember the night when a number of my then constituents—I represented a different constituency then—were murdered in Teebane. I remember walking among the dead, and having to lift up some of the living to get them to hospital as quickly as possible. I will never forget that scene. I remember, in a personal capacity, standing in a mortuary looking down at the face of a young woman and at a young lad. I did not see the young lad’s face, because there was not enough to view. Just a few bones were left. I will never forget that scene.

I am sure that many of these young men and women are returning from the field of conflict with horrific memories, and are trying to deal with the trauma of that. Let us never forget that the fact that they have come back and their bodies are intact does not mean that they have not been touched by the field of conflict. We must ensure that they are given the best possible treatment, and that their trauma and mental scars are properly treated.

I was very encouraged by what the Secretary of State said today. I genuinely believe that he has given a serious commitment, and continues to do so. I pay tribute to the Secretaries of State in the previous Government as well, because I believe that they did much for our armed forces. However, because this is a moving situation, we must continue to give them they best that we can. Let us also remember that when they return and, in many cases, have to move from the field of conflict to civilian life, great care must be taken with them. Many face unemployment, and in these times there is increasing unemployment. Let us therefore be sensitive. I am delighted that the Secretary of State is taking up the point made by my hon. Friend the Member for North Antrim (Ian Paisley), and will think carefully about the provision of housing for returning soldiers and their families.

It has been a privilege to take part in the debate. I trust that we will pass the motion unanimously, and ensure that our soldiers—servicemen and women—know that we are standing wholeheartedly behind them and that we thank them for what they are doing for us.

Oral Answers to Questions

Lord McCrea of Magherafelt and Cookstown Excerpts

Monday 13th September 2010 Commons Chamber

[Peter Luff]

I am delighted to be able to tell my hon. Friend that her constituency is playing a major part in ensuring that those contracts are delivering, as it were, more for less, with much greater capability compared to previous contracting arrangements, at lower cost. I congratulate her constituents in Falmouth for the part they are playing.

[Dr William McCrea (South Antrim) (DUP)]

In the light of the strategic defence and security review, can the Secretary of State assure the House that the coalition Government will maintain our forces’ capability to protect UK interests across the world?