Train Operators’ Revenue Protection Practices Review

Lord Brennan of Canton Excerpts

Thursday 17th July 2025 Lords Chamber

[Lord Hendy of Richmond Hill (Lab)]

Ticketless travel is a real problem. Operators have to be on their toes, because leaving gates open at times when people travel means that they will just walk through them. It is not necessarily the case that those passengers do not have tickets, but it is certainly no deterrent to people who do not have tickets. “See It. Say It. Sorted”—oh dear, I have said that now—is actually a good deterrent. We have to be mindful of the safety of people, including women and girls, on the railway. We are going to refresh it, but I am sorry to tell the noble Baroness that we are going to carry on with it, because it is the right thing to do to make everybody travelling by train feel safe.

[Lord Brennan of Canton (Lab)]

My Lords, Trainline tells me that, if I get the 15.16 pm train home to Cardiff from London Paddington this afternoon, I could save 5p by splitting my ticket. Will my noble friend the Minister’s reforms get rid of this sort of nonsense? Can he sort that?

[Lord Hendy of Richmond Hill (Lab)]

It needs to be sorted and it will have to be sorted, over time. I refer to my experience at Transport for London, where we radically changed the fare system and introduced pay-as-you-go and Oyster, which took several years of incremental change. Fundamentally, the noble Lord is right: if you have enough time and effort, finding a cheaper way to travel through buying multiple tickets is not the way to market an effective railway or public transport service. We need to get to a stage when that nonsense is no longer prevalent.

E-scooters: Insurance

Lord Brennan of Canton Excerpts

Wednesday 14th May 2025 Lords Chamber

[Lord Hendy of Richmond Hill (Lab)]

The use of e-scooters needs legislation to regulate it. This is a question which I have answered in the House before and which no doubt will continue to come up until we produce draft legislation. The issues are complex. Noble Lords will know that I have replied to the noble Baroness, Lady Pidgeon, putting in the Library a résumé of the legislation applying in all European countries, where there are vast differences in where you can use them, whether you should have a helmet, whether there is an age limit, whether they should be registered and whether they should be insured. We are working hard through those issues. They are not easy to solve, but the noble Baroness is right that determining what can be used on pavements and what is safe in a world where people with disabilities are, rightly, very worried about this, is very important.

[Lord Brennan of Canton (Lab)]

My Lords, even when things are made legal, they can be abused. There must be enforcement. E-bikes are supposed to travel at a maximum of 15.5 miles per hour and not be throttled up to that speed. Yet around us all the time we see employees, in effect, of multinational companies delivering our groceries and our takeaways being exploited on illegal and uninsured vehicles. Will the Government take that into account when considering any regime for e-scooters?

[Lord Hendy of Richmond Hill (Lab)]

My noble friend is absolutely right. The speed limit of 15.5 miles per hour determines the point at which an electric bicycle, capable of more speed than that, is a vehicle that needs to be licensed. The enforcement of the law is a matter for chief police officers, but we are considering what we can do in this area. I recognise as much as everybody else in this House that these alleged bicycles travelling at 25 or 30 miles per hour silently, and with the logos of quite major companies on the back of their riders’ rucksacks, represent a significant challenge to the legal use of the roads system.

E-scooters: Trials

Lord Brennan of Canton Excerpts

Tuesday 1st April 2025 Lords Chamber

[Lord Hendy of Richmond Hill (Lab)]

If the noble Lord is accurate, I must have been correct in what he reports I said, so I am sure that I did. I cannot immediately answer him on whether and to what extent there has been consultation in Northern Ireland, but I take his point. I will take it away and write to him about it.

[Lord Brennan of Canton (Lab)]

My Lords, they glide among us on illegal, uninsurable vehicles, delivering our groceries and our takeaways. What are the Government going to do to help the workforce who use these types of vehicles and go after the faceless bosses who employ them, rather than the low-paid workers themselves?

[Lord Hendy of Richmond Hill (Lab)]

My noble friend makes a really good point. That is one of the subjects which the Employment Rights Bill seeks to remedy. I do not think that we cannot do it directly through road traffic regulation, although when there are rules for these things, it will be incumbent on the employers of the people who ride them to comply with the rules as well as the people who ride them.

Airport Expansion

Lord Brennan of Canton Excerpts

Tuesday 25th February 2025 Lords Chamber

[Lord Hendy of Richmond Hill (Lab)]

The noble Lord is right that sustainable aviation fuel is important in reducing the carbon footprint of air traffic. This Government have taken forward the SAF mandate, which came into force in January, which progressively increases the percentage of sustainable jet fuel used from this year onwards. It is also important, as the noble Lord says, that the UK is a supplier, and the actions of the Government are to make sure that there are jobs in Britain and that Britain is a leading supplier of this. On 29 January, the Government announced £63 million of funding for the advanced fuels fund in the next financial year to support SAF producers based across the United Kingdom. I do not have a jobs figure to hand for SAF, but I will willingly write to the noble Lord and tell him what we know about it.

[Lord Brennan of Canton (Lab)]

My Lords, on the subject of airport expansion, there are airports around the country that are under capacity currently, including Cardiff Airport. What consideration have the Government given to working with the Welsh Government on driving more business in the direction of airports such as Cardiff Airport?

[Lord Hendy of Richmond Hill (Lab)]

The Government recognise the importance of regional airports. I do not have in front of me what the Government are doing about the expansion of Cardiff Airport, but I will willingly write to my noble friend and tell him exactly what we know about Cardiff’s expansion and the Government’s role in helping it.

Rail Ticket Offices

Lord Brennan of Canton Excerpts

Thursday 6th July 2023 Commons Chamber

[Huw Merriman]

Yes; the way in which the ticketing and settlement agreement process works means that anyone can access it online, but they can also write. Details will be available at stations, and indeed online, explaining how people can write through to make their points about their stations.

I am grateful to my hon. Friend for meeting me and for doing so in a constructive manner whereby he was able to give me examples of his concerns, including tickets not being available within 15 minutes of travel. I have taken that point away because it forms part of the catalogue of changes that I want to see—the remaining 1% of tickets that cannot be purchased for that reason should be reduced towards 0%. I invite all right hon. and hon. Members who can give other examples to get in contact with me as well, because I will take those problems away and look at getting them fixed.

[Kevin Brennan (Cardiff West) (Lab)]

The hon. Member for East Worthing and Shoreham (Tim Loughton) was right: sometimes it is just too complicated to purchase a ticket without using a ticket office. I recently had that experience, and buying my ticket from the ticket office was £50 cheaper than if I had purchased it from the machine. I am afraid that the Beatles analogy he started is right: he’s got a ticket to ride, and he don’t care.

[Huw Merriman]

I was not even aware that I had started a Beatles analogy. Actually, this is more important than joking about music; this is about reassuring passengers that we can deliver a better experience but also an experience that they are very familiar with, in terms of the other transactions they make across the retail space. More and more people are doing that online, and they start doing it online by being taught how to do it. The idea is that ticketing staff who are currently behind glass, not seeing those passengers, will help to deliver that and ensure that those passengers have a better experience and do not need to queue up next time, because they can do it in a seamless manner. Where that operation does not exist because of the machine, we are looking to upgrade. I will take any examples he has, to ensure that passengers get the best price but can do it online or via a machine.

Draft Merchant Shipping (Fire Protection) Regulations 2023

Lord Brennan of Canton Excerpts

Monday 27th March 2023 General Committees

[Mr Holden]

My understanding is that the regulations are for all cargo ships, but I will write to the right hon. Lady on the specifics if that is not the case for all fishing vessels.

Amendments in 20 resolutions have been agreed at the IMO since 2003 to further improve the safety standards of fire protection, but they have not yet been implemented into UK law. The UK supported those amendments during the IMO discussions, and as a party to SOLAS, the UK now has an obligation to implement those further updates.

The Department held an eight-week public consultation on the draft regulations. None of the five responses received were contentious, and no changes to the regulations were made as a result. Responses were issued, as well as a post-consultation report, which was published on gov.uk. We have 440 ships on the UK flag, 324 of which are partially owned in the UK. They are expected to be already compliant with the requirements of the draft regulations. Making the regulations will enable the UK to enforce the same fire protection requirements as other states.

[Kevin Brennan (Cardiff West) (Lab)]

Further to the question from my right hon. Friend the Member for Walsall South, there is reference in the draft regulations to smaller ships, which make up about 3% of the fleet and have fewer than 50 people employed on them. How does that relate to what my right hon. Friend was asking about small fishing vessels and whether the regulations apply to them?

[Mr Holden]

My understanding is that some fishing vessels over 500 gross tons, especially those with mixed functions on board—for example, canning at sea—are treated like cargo ships. Other smaller vessels are in different categories, but the measures apply to those larger vessels.

Making the regulations will enable the UK to enforce the same requirements as other states—requirements to which UK ships are currently subject when entering foreign ports. That will provide greater equality between UK shipping companies and foreign operators. Members have highlighted the importance of the regulations: they improve safety standards, meet the UK’s international obligations and ensure a level playing field for UK shipping companies. I trust that we have cross-party support for this statutory instrument, which implements important updates to SOLAS regarding fire safety in UK domestic legislation. I therefore commend the instrument to the Committee.

Draft Road Vehicles and Non-Road Mobile Machinery (Type-Approval) (Amendment and Transitional Provisions) (EU Exit) Regulations 2022 Draft Road Vehicle Carbon Dioxide Emission Performance standards (Cars, Vans and Heavy Duty Vehicles) (Amendment) Regulations 2022

Lord Brennan of Canton Excerpts

Wednesday 23rd November 2022 General Committees

[Kevin Brennan (Cardiff West) (Lab)]

So far the Minister has referred only to GB approvals, but the explanatory memorandum refers to the whole of the UK. Can he clarify for the Committee why he is making that distinction when the explanatory memorandum refers to the whole of the UK?

[Mr Holden]

I certainly will. I should come to that issue further in my speech, but if the hon. Member is still unsure and wants to raise it again, I would ask him to please speak again.

Under the European Union (Withdrawal Agreement) Act 2020, the body of EU law on type approvals is retained in UK law. These are around 2,500 pages setting out approval processes and detailed technical standards for cars, buses and goods vehicles. This morning’s SI corrects deficiencies and creates GB type approval, although I would emphasise that at present the technical standards are essentially identical to those across the EU, so for manufacturers this is essentially, initially at least, an administrative exercise. This SI will require manufacturers of cars, buses and goods vehicles to transition into the GB type approval scheme no later than 1 February 2026, with approval being available from 1 January 2023, assuming the Committee’s agreement. With respect to the Northern Ireland protocol and unfettered access, this instrument will continue to exempt vehicles that meet EU rules that are made in or approved in Northern Ireland from the GB type approval regime. I hope that clarifies matters slightly for the hon. Member.

The SI gives Ministers powers to amend the retained direct minor EU law on road vehicles—in other words, the detailed technical specifications originally set by the European Commission. There will be a statutory requirement to consult representative bodies such as the Society of Motor Manufacturers and Traders, and similar groups, whenever Ministers are seeking to amend the technical standards. This will ensure that the vehicle industry and interested non-governmental organisations are able to have their say on any proposals that we make.

Machinery engines placed on the market from 1 January will be required to obtain GB approval under a new interim provisional approval scheme for machinery engines, which will recognise an EU approval with oversight from our VCA. These arrangements are already in place for agricultural tractors and motorcycles. The provisional schemes for all three groups of product will continue until the end of 2027, by which time we expect to have an independent GB type approval regime available for all those groups of vehicles.

The draft Road Vehicle Carbon Dioxide Emission Performance Standards (Cars, Vans and Heavy Duty Vehicles) (Amendment) Regulations 2022 amend various retained EU new car, van and heavy duty vehicle carbon dioxide emission regulations to ensure that they can continue to function appropriately.

The new car and van carbon dioxide emission regulations were retained following EU exit and establish mandatory average carbon dioxide emission targets for manufacturers of new cars and vans across the UK. The regulations set out how the carbon dioxide emission scheme is to be monitored, reported on and enforced. They also include provisions to help manufacturers to meet their carbon dioxide targets, including derogations for smaller volume manufacturers, the awarding of more credits for producing low emission vehicles, and allowing manufacturers to join together to be considered as one entity to meet carbon dioxide targets, inter alia.

The HDV carbon dioxide emission regulations were also retained following EU exit; however, they do not set mandatory carbon dioxide emission targets on HDV manufacturers until 2025. Until that time, manufacturers are legally required to report specific data points on their vehicles annually to the enforcement body, the VCA.

This draft instrument primarily amends references to EU type approval in the regulations to EU, GB or UK (NI) type approval, where appropriate, to reflect the creation of the GB type approval scheme. As the car, van and HDV carbon dioxide emission regulations apply UK-wide, it is appropriate to reference all three type approval schemes; due to the protocol, vehicles registered in Northern Ireland will continue to receive EU type approval or, now, UK (NI) type approval.

[Kevin Brennan]

That interests me. Am I right in saying that the regulations will have no effect whatsoever in practice, because EU type approval will continue to be legal in GB due to the Northern Ireland protocol, and vehicles that are subject to UK (NI) type approval will continue to be legally available in GB? Is that a correct interpretation of what the Minister is saying?

[Mr Holden]

The changes in regulations are merely, at the moment, moving from one to the other. Obviously, there are broader discussions around the Northern Ireland protocol, what that will mean down the line and whether there is any derogation in the future, but at the moment the regulations are essentially the same for both GB and Northern Ireland under the protocol.

[Kevin Brennan]

It says in the Minister’s own explanatory memorandum, in paragraph 7.9:

“As a result of EU exit and the GB type-approval 2022 Regulations vehicles with either GB, UK(NI) or EU type-approval can be sold on the UK market.”

What I just said was right, was it not?

[Mr Holden]

That is correct, but what I said was right as well. Manufacturers have a choice in Northern Ireland to place products on—

[Kevin Brennan]

And GB.

[Mr Holden]

Yes, indeed—on markets using EU approvals issued by an EU approval authority, or to seek approval for EU rules from the VCA, known as a UK (NI) approval. GB-based manufacturers will have the same choice when selling in Northern Ireland. Whichever route manufacturers choose, they will be able to sell products—the hon. Gentleman is absolutely right—throughout the rest of Great Britain without additional approval. The point at the moment is that we want to get these regulations on the statute book in advance of anything further. Particularly with respect to bus manufacturing, which has a significant presence in Northern Ireland, we may wish at some further point to derogate.

References to type approval are fundamental to the regulations as they determine which vehicles are in scope of either scheme, as well as defining who will receive a carbon dioxide emissions target, including a fine for any non-compliance. A number of minor EU exit-related deficiencies, and a simple typo made in a previous statutory instrument, are also corrected by this instrument.

The type approval instrument creates an independent GB type approval scheme for cars, buses and goods vehicles, continues the interim regime for other categories of motor vehicle, and creates a similar interim regime for machinery engines.

Oral Answers to Questions

Lord Brennan of Canton Excerpts

Thursday 13th October 2022 Commons Chamber

[Lucy Frazer]

I am delighted to hear about my hon. Friend’s active travel. I remember that his constituency has a very impressive company that converts bicycles to electric bicycles. Announcements in relation to the fourth fund will be considered and made in due course.

[Kevin Brennan (Cardiff West) (Lab)]

The Minister has just outlined the fact that nearly £10 billion of investment will be required to meet the targets. One of the only good things to come out of covid has been the expansion of cycling networks and opportunities. Will she guarantee to the House today that that will not be one of the areas that has to be cut as a result of the Government’s economic plans?

[Lucy Frazer]

I am pleased to tell the hon. Gentleman that we have already spent significant funds on active travel. There are core funds available, but there are also funds from other Departments, such as the levelling-up fund, the highways maintenance fund and the future high streets fund. Much of that money is already committed. I remind the hon. Gentleman about the poor record of the Labour party, whose funding for active travel was significantly less than we have already put in to this important area.

Draft Airports Slot Allocation (Alleviation of Usage Requirements) Regulations 2022

Lord Brennan of Canton Excerpts

Tuesday 1st March 2022 General Committees

[Mike Kane (Wythenshawe and Sale East) (Lab)]

It is always a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mr Dowd.

I feel the hot breath of my hon. Friend the Member for Cardiff West on my neck, so happy St David’s day to you all. St. David was canonised by Pope Callixtus II in 1123. I doubt he had to get up at 9.30 to attend one of his synods to discuss airport slots, but genuinely happy St David’s day to everyone.

Around two years ago, the country was paralysed by the coronavirus pandemic, and after a considerable effort to repatriate Brits abroad, the business and leisure market and the aviation industry were effectively grounded. For two years the industry has struggled without a sector-specific deal. The Minister and I have had that discussion previously and we disagree about what the package should have looked like, but we move on today.

I believe that the Government’s approach of tinkering around the edges has led to many jobs being lost and many businesses in the sector burning through cash reserves daily. But we digress. The skies are reopening, although more slowly in the UK than in the rest of the world, and we now need to ensure that the sector is able to recover and support itself again. It is absolutely crucial that we protect what we have.

Slot rules are important in ensuring competition for routes, and in turn give passengers more choice and can lead to better fares for them. Smaller regional airports that do not have incumbent carriers are often able to make slots available for airlines, particularly new entrants to the market, offering good deals for travellers and allowing the regions to open themselves to new visitors and opening the rest of the world to those living in our regions. It should be a win-win situation, but that is currently not the case for all airports and operators.

The advisory note to the SI talks about a consultation that took place over a four-week period between November and December last year. However, three weeks into that consultation the rules changed again and the industry once again plunged into confusion with travellers and industry not knowing where the goalposts had moved to and when or if they would move again. That uncertainty led to bookings dropping off a cliff for the Christmas period. It is not acceptable for that to keep happening to the third biggest aviation sector in the world. We need more certainty in the future.

At the time when passengers were unable to fly without expensive testing and potentially expensive quarantine to follow it was nonsensical for almost empty flights to take off to satisfy grandfather rights to slots. We have seen recent news reports stating that airlines have operated thousands of ghost flights from UK airports during the pandemic—32 airports around the UK had flights of less than 10% capacity. An average of 25 such flights operated every single day throughout lockdown, totalling just under 14,500 over an 18 month period. I am aware some of those flights were carrying cargo and some were repatriation flights, but not all, and it would be disingenuous to imply that they were.

We all agree the industry must improve its green credentials, and I have grave concerns that the insistence of using any fixed percentage of slots makes a mockery of that aim, particularly if the process is being used by incumbents to hoard slots and to monopolise routes. When demand was low due to Covid, slot exemptions were the right thing, but now as demand grows again, that prompts the question ‘Should airlines be subject to competition through slots rules?’ Obviously it remains important to provide some consideration for markets that have yet to reopen or are still severely restricted such as east Asia or other long-haul routes.

I undertook some research of my own with the industry and operators, and the findings suggest that slots are still very contentious. Their allocation must be resolved in an equitable way that enables operators to recover while remaining committed to a green recovery. The environmental impact of those ghost flights is something which concerns me gravely and will continue to do so. By reducing the 80:20 rule by just 10% to 70:30, the Government could still be complicit in multiple flights taking off with many empty seats, seats that could have been sold at a reduced price at least to ensure that UK residents get some benefit from those tens of thousands of empty seats.

The last time we debated this matter I asked the Minister whether the Government would be dynamic and responsive enough to reassess the situation as the skies reopen and received assurances that there would be flexibility. I trust that is still the case. Another ask we have is that Government commit fully to funding the airspace modernisation scheme. A one-year commitment cannot really be classed as a commitment when it comes to doing something so vital that would reduce the need for stacking, enable point to point operations and increase capacity in our system. Indeed, that lack of ongoing commitment could be classed as further tinkering around the edges. What the industry needs is commitment to it, to show it that despite being left for almost two years without a sector-specific deal it is not treated as an afterthought by the Government.

The Opposition have been broadly supportive of a slot ratio and will continue to be so, but we have slots because of our lack of runway capacity and airports. That has not been addressed. The Prime Minister has tinkered around the edges, both in his current role and as Mayor of London, without addressing that fundamental problem, and it is one that our competitors are addressing. It would be great to resolve the issue of slots permanently and equitably, and move forward to a greener, cleaner strategy, but that is not for us today.

[Kevin Brennan (Cardiff West) (Lab)]

My hon. Friend is absolutely right that the terms of the instrument only apply temporarily until 29 October 2022. That is why the Government say that they have not prepared a full impact assessment of the SI. May I ask the Minister through my hon. Friend to clarify what will happen after 29 October 2022? Will we simply revert to the previous position? If a new permanent regime is proposed, will the Minister commit to providing the House with a full impact assessment?

[Mike Kane]

I note my hon. Friend’s points and I will leave the Minister to respond to them.

We are considering this SI in a liberal democracy in which I can directly ask the Minister questions and hold him to account. Not all countries can do that today. I want the Minister and the House to know that the Opposition support the decision of the Secretary of State for Transport to ground Aeroflot and to ban the use of private Russian jets in this country. Will the Minister think of further ways in which we can do more? I note the article in today’s edition of The Times that speaks of banning Russian ships and cargo vessels from entering any UK ports. We will not have any truck with this dictator, Putin. Our quarrel is not with the Russian people, but with their current leader.

[Robert Courts]

I thank the hon. Members for Gordon and for Wythenshawe and Sale for their comments. I also wish the hon. Member for Cardiff West, and all hon. Members, a happy St. David’s day. I agree with the comments of the hon. Member for Wythenshawe and Sale about Putin and Ukraine. We have taken action quickly in the Department for Transport on aviation and maritime issues, and we will of course look to do more if that is possible. I could not agree more passionately with his comments that the most precious thing that we have is the ability to sit together in this House where a Minister proposes a law, hon. Members disagree or agree, as they wish, and they can ask any question without fear of any consequences or reprisals. We are very lucky to live in such a free country. I will continue to do anything I can from my perspective, as will my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State, to support the Ukrainian people in their hour of trial.

I am grateful to the hon. Members for Gordon and for Wythenshawe and Sale for their broad support of the SI. I particularly liked the phrase about clutch plates cited by the hon. Member for Gordon; that is quite a good way of phrasing the balancing act of moving back towards the normal slot alleviation position. We have moved the industry back to what is closer to normal times, which the hon. Member for Wythenshawe and Sale described as getting the skies reopening. How welcome it is that we are getting to that position.

The hon. Member for Wythenshawe and Sale asked about consultation, the rule change midway through that period and certainty. We have committed to introducing a playbook that will provide certainty for the industry, so that it will understand what we are likely to do were a variant or worse arise in the future. We are working on that in consultation with the industry. It aims to give precisely the certainty that he wishes to offer to the sector. There is no getting away from the fact that the action that we have had to take, often with very little notice, has been very difficult for the industry. We all understand the reasons, and I know that hon. Members understand and support the fact that we have to support public health, but none the less, there is no hiding from the fact that it has been very difficult for the industry. We are keen to alleviate those difficulties in whatever way possible. I believe that the playbook is the answer to that, and we will continue to look at that.

The hon. Gentleman also asked me about ongoing restrictions in other parts of the world. We are lucky that we are in many cases exceeding the progress of other countries, some are still restricted and quite locked down. That means that we can be quite forward looking and forward leaning in the measures we are taking. We have to remember, however, that in some cases carriers may be operating to markets that do not have those restrictions. That is why we have introduced in the SI the enhanced justified non-utilisation provisions, which address precisely the point that the hon. Gentleman quite rightly raised.

The hon. Gentleman also asked about the funding for airspace, and I entirely agree about the requirement for airspace modernisation. It is something about which the Government feel very strongly. We have airspace that has not changed since the 1950s and it is something that we discussed during the passage of ATMUA. For all the reasons he rightly cited, namely, improving navigation capability, reducing emissions and making the best use of airspace, it is something that we are determined to pursue. The usual principle is that the user pays for such work, but we have introduced two tranches of funding to assist the industry while it has been undertaking that work in the most difficult of conditions.

The hon. Member for Cardiff West asked me what happens after this period, and the short answer is that it depends on what happens with demand. The alleviation that we introducing depends on the Secretary of State being satisfied that there is a restricted demand due to covid-19 and that that is likely to persist. At present, I cannot give a definite answer because I simply do not know anymore than any else what the position in a few months’ time will be. We will have to continue to look at the circumstances. The alleviation positions are meant to be temporary, so it might be the case that we go back to the normal rule, and the provisions fall away and are not replaced, or we might introduce another package. That is the short answer.

The hon. Member for Cardiff West also asked me about longer-term reform. As the hon. Member for Wythenshawe and Sale also mentioned, slot reform is a major issue. As I have said before, we are working on our framework for the future of the sector—an aviation strategy for want of a better phrase—and that will consider the issue of longer-term slot reform. That is a major piece of work that will require significant consultation, and there will be a chance for us to discuss it with the industry and hon. Members in due course. I cannot go into too much detail about that now because it is a major piece of work, and I would probably be out of order in any event, but that is the approach we will take to longer-term slot issues, which may have been the answer to hon. Member for Cardiff West.

[Kevin Brennan]

I know why Government do not want to go preparing impact assessments on every single thing they do, particularly when it is a temporary measure, but the Government could monitor the impact of the changes. If the Government are planning longer-term reform, they should commit to making sure that a proper impact assessment is then done so that the House has a real understanding of the likely impact.

[Robert Courts]

I am grateful to hon. Gentleman for clarifying that. He is quite right that because the SI relates to short-term, six-month provisions, a formal impact assessment has not been made. That does not mean, of course, that we do not look at that impact but just that a formal impact assessment notice is not prepared. We consult, however, and then a note on impact is prepared for Ministers. Anything that is longer term and permanent would be subject to the usual consultation and impact assessment provisions, as the hon. Gentleman would expect.

On the issue of ghost flights and the press reportage we have seen, the hon. Member for Wythenshawe and Sale is right that nobody wants to see such flights. They are an unnecessary expenditure of money and of carbon emissions. The press reports have perhaps given the wrong impression, and I should like to explain why briefly, if I may. That is on the back of a written question asked by the hon. Member for Leeds North West (Alex Sobel). In response we published some statistics—they are before the House because it was written answer— that show the rise and fall of departing airlines. The reason some reportage is misleading is that for the data period for which we have statistics available at the moment, the alleviation in place was a full waiver. That means there was not a requirement to fly any slots at all. We do not hold the data on why an airline flies a flight. It is not really possible for the Department for Transport to hold that, and it is a commercial decision for airlines in any event. However, the reasons for flights to which the hon. Member for Wythenshawe and Sale referred are absolutely right, because in many cases those flights would have been carrying back personal protective equipment, testing kits or essential freight. That would be taking place on passenger aircraft, even if there were a small number of passengers on board.

The second reason for such flights was repatriation. On looking at the data, there are two particular spikes in March and September, when people were brought back from abroad as rules changed. Clearly, in order for a person to be brought back, they have to have an aircraft to do that, and that aircraft has to go there. Although I do not have the full data and therefore I cannot say with cast-iron certainty why the flights were being flown, I point to the overriding principle, namely, there was no need for any operator to fly for the purpose of retaining a slot, because a full alleviation was in place at the time. I would observe that there are some understandable principles in place that will explain why those flights operated with low utilisation of passengers at the time. Essentially, they were carrying cargo. I hope that that answers the points quite rightly raised by the hon. Member for Wythenshawe and Sale.

We have a balanced set of measures before the Committee. Without them, we would have a return to the 80:20 rule and I do not think that would be right at the present time. We still need some relief available while the sector recovers, but we also need a balance to ensure that we support recovery at the same time. I hope very much that the Committee can support the regulations.

Question put and agreed to.

Oral Answers to Questions

Lord Brennan of Canton Excerpts

Thursday 3rd February 2022 Commons Chamber

[The Minister of State, Department for Transport (Andrew Stephenson)]

HS2 Ltd takes its responsibilities to secure and maintain land along the line of route extremely seriously. I thank my right hon. Friend for taking the time to show me some of the specific problem sites when I visited her constituency. Where fly-tipping or littering occurs, HS2 Ltd must act to address it as soon as possible.

[Kevin Brennan (Cardiff West) (Lab)]

T7. Further to the question from my hon. Friend the Member for Newport West (Ruth Jones), I am afraid the Secretary of State’s response just reflects the fact that his approach to this issue is laissez-faire and complacent. People on both sides of the House will tell him that there is a real problem with these scooters. The Government’s policy is encouraging a disrespect for the law, because people are riding them with impunity. As he will know, crashes in London alone went up by 3,000%. Will he really get a grip on this issue? Everybody knows it is a real problem, but he is denying it.

[Trudy Harrison]

I thank the hon. Member for his question, but I refer him to the 31 trials currently ongoing throughout the country to identify how we can legislate in the safest possible way. We regard micro-mobility as an essential part of the transition towards a much cleaner community, but I will endeavour to meet colleagues in the Home Office to discuss matters of policing with regard to illegal electric scooters.