HM Courts and Tribunals Service Trust Statement (2011-12)
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The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice (Mrs Helen Grant)
Her Majesty’s Courts and Tribunals Service (HMCTS) has prepared a trust statement providing an account of the collection of revenues which are due to be paid to HM Treasury. The statement includes the value of fines and confiscation orders imposed by the judiciary; fixed penalties imposed by the police; the value of collections; the balances paid over to third parties including victims of crime, the Home Office and HM Treasury; and the balance of outstanding impositions.
We welcome the Comptroller and Auditor-General’s (C&AG) report on the trust statement which recognises the improvements HMCTS has made in its accounts. The statement shows in 2011-12 HMCTS collected more than £484 million from offenders. A record £22.3 million in compensation has been paid to victims of crime—funded by criminals’ cash and assets recovered through confiscation orders. During 2011-12 the total value of outstanding impositions decreased from £1.9 billion to £1.8 billion. We recognise that more must be done to tackle this outstanding debt.
Seventy-five per cent of the orders imposed in 2011-12 have already been paid in full. Of the balance outstanding, £1.2 billion is made up of confiscation orders. Around one third of this is money that cannot be collected— £141 million (12%) relates to individuals who are deceased, deported or who cannot be located, £40 million (3%) relates to orders which are being appealed and cannot be enforced while under appeal; and £154 million (13%) relates to orders where following the conclusion of financial forensic investigations the assets have been assessed as hidden. Also, £278 million is interest which has accrued on confiscation orders which are outside the agreed payment terms.
Cracking down on those who do not pay is an absolute priority. The agencies involved in enforcement, including the Ministry of Justice, the Home Office, the Serious Fraud Office and the Crown Prosecution Service take every step to tackle outstanding debt including targeted fine blitzes, taking deductions from offenders’ benefits or their earnings and by seizing and selling their property and goods. Those who do not pay can go to prison.
Criminals go to extraordinary lengths to hide the proceeds of their crimes by transferring funds abroad and disguising it with friends and family, but we are succeeding in recovering more money every year. The agencies responsible for enforcement are building better relationships with overseas authorities and engage specialist forensic teams to track down hidden assets.
Crucially, an outstanding order stops the criminal benefiting from the proceeds of crime and from using it for further criminal activity. If they ever surface, the assets will be seized.
HMCTS is actively seeking a commercial partner to help increase fine collection, reduce enforcement costs and importantly, ensure more criminals pay. Also, a new system is being implemented to improve the collection of fixed penalty notices, making payment easier and further improving the financial information.
The continuing improvement the agencies are making, combined with our future plans will ensure that more criminals pay and that taxpayers get better value for money.
Oral Answers to Questions
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Alex Cunningham (Stockton North) (Lab)
6. What discussions she has had with the Chancellor of the Exchequer on the effect of the autumn statement on women, black and minority ethnic groups and older people.
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Women and Equalities (Mrs Helen Grant)
Colleagues have had discussions with the Chancellor and others on the impact of tax and benefits changes. The Government are committed to fairness and look very closely and carefully at the effects of their decisions on different groups, including women, black and minority ethnic groups and older people.
Alex Cunningham
Evidence from the House of Commons Library contradicts what the Minister has said, because it shows that women are shouldering almost three quarters of the cumulative impact of the net direct tax, benefit, pay and pension changes pursued by the coalition Government. Does she believe this blind spot on women reflects the fact that there are so few women in the Government?
Mr Edward Leigh (Gainsborough) (Con)
8. What steps she is taking to improve cost-effectiveness and value for money in the Government Equalities Office.
Law Commission (Triennial Review)
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The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice (Mrs Helen Grant)
In March 2011 the Government responded to the Public Administration Select Committee report “Smaller Government: Shrinking the Quango state” setting out the coalition’s plans for reforming the public bodies sector. It includes the requirement to undertake triennial reviews of Executive and advisory non-departmental public bodies (NDPBs).
The Law Commission is an independent statutory body with a mandate to keep the law under review and make recommendations for reform as appropriate. It was established as in 1965 by the Law Commissions Act 1965. Its remit covers the law of England and Wales; Scotland and Northern Ireland have their own similar, but separate, commissions.
To deliver the coalition Government’s commitment to transparency and accountability the Law Commission will be subject to a triennial review. The Ministry of Justice, as the sponsoring Department, has today launched a consultation, which will last until 6 February 2013, inviting views. In line with Cabinet Office guidance, the review will consider the following:
the continuing need for the Law Commission—both its functions and its form; and
where it is agreed that it should remain, to review the control and governance arrangements in place to ensure that the public body is complying with recognised principles of good corporate governance.
In conducting the triennial review, officials will be engaging with a broad range of stakeholders and users of the Law Commission. The review will be aligned with guidance published by the Cabinet Office: “Guidance on Reviews of Non Departmental Public Bodies”. The House will be notified of the conclusion of the review.
Female Genital Mutilation
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Westminster Hall is an alternative Chamber for MPs to hold debates, named after the adjoining Westminster Hall.
Each debate is chaired by an MP from the Panel of Chairs, rather than the Speaker or Deputy Speaker. A Government Minister will give the final speech, and no votes may be called on the debate topic.
This information is provided by Parallel Parliament and does not comprise part of the offical record
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice (Mrs Helen Grant)
It is a pleasure, Mr Hollobone, to serve under your chairmanship. I earnestly congratulate the hon. Member for Kingston upon Hull East (Karl Turner) on securing this debate on victims of the abhorrent crime of female genital mutilation. I also congratulate the hon. Member for Bristol East (Kerry McCarthy), my hon. Friend the Member for South Derbyshire (Heather Wheeler), the hon. Member for Liverpool, Riverside (Mrs Ellman) and my hon. Friend the Member for Battersea (Jane Ellison) on their important interventions. I congratulate particularly my hon. Friend the Member for Battersea on her tireless work over many years, and as chair of the all-party group on female genital mutilation.
Female genital mutilation is an extremely painful and harmful practice that blights the lives of many young girls and women. The Government roundly condemn the practice and are determined to see it eradicated in this country and elsewhere. In my joint role as Minister with responsibility for victims and the courts and Minister for Women and Equalities, I am particularly pleased to have the opportunity of responding to this debate.
The practice of female genital mutilation is an age-old one that is deeply steeped in the culture and tradition of practising communities. Those who practise it no doubt genuinely believe that it is in their children’s best interests to conform to the prevailing custom of their community, but that does not excuse the gross violation of human rights. It is wholly unacceptable to allow a practice that can have such devastating consequences for the health of a young girl. The physical and psychological effects can last throughout her life. The mutilation and impairment of young girls and women have no place in a modern society where equality is prized.
My Department is responsible for the criminal law in this area. The Female Genital Mutilation Act 2003 extended significantly the protection that the law affords these vulnerable young victims. It created extraterritorial offences to deter people from taking girls abroad for mutilation. To reflect the serious harm caused, it increased the maximum penalty for female genital mutilation from five to 14 years. Sadly, like the Prohibition of Female Circumcision Act 1985 that it replaced, the 2003 Act has yet to result in a successful prosecution, which is a source of considerable frustration. That is not, as some have suggested, a reflection of the effectiveness of the law itself. The law is perfectly capable of dealing with perpetrators if offences are reported to the police, and evidential and public interest tests for prosecution are met. At the time of mutilation, however, victims may be too young, too vulnerable, or too afraid to report offences, and they may be reluctant to implicate family members. The simple fact is that no law can be effective in this area unless the barriers to prosecution are overcome.
Karl Turner
Before being elected to this place, I practised as a criminal lawyer, and I worked on behalf of defendants who were charged with serious sexual abuse of children. It is not often suggested that it is difficult to bring such cases to prosecution, and the same issues are involved. Will the Minister explain her point?
Mrs Grant
I am aware of the hon. Gentleman’s criminal law experience. The law is robust, extensive and adequate but, unfortunately, dealing with the issue often involves very young children who are frightened and reluctant to take action against family members. There is often pressure within their community not to give evidence and not to say anything.
Mrs Grant
I would disagree, but obviously, the adequacy of the law is something that we will always keep under review. I know that the Director of Public Prosecutions has had conversations with the Home Office and Ministry of Justice officials—I think the hon. Gentleman is aware of those—on the effectiveness of the law, and whether new laws or other legislation, such as the Domestic Violence, Crime and Victims (Amendment) Act 2012, might help in those areas. I can assure the hon. Gentleman that the matter will be kept under review, but I will discuss a number of other things in my speech that can be done in the interim.
Jane Ellison
The Minister may well be moving on to this point, but I just want to agree with what the hon. Member for Kingston upon Hull East (Karl Turner) said. If the police wanted to go after the people who were organising this, they could. I hope that the Minister will address in her remaining comments the fact that, ultimately, there is a lack of will. We all know that children are not going to report it. They are too young. They are not going to report their parents, but people are setting up the travel and the medical care when the children get back, and they are meeting them at the other end. Where there is a will, there is a way. This has been held back by some misguided notion that it would be racist to pursue the issue. It is racist not to. If these girls were white middle-class children, we would be protecting them a lot better than we are now.
Mrs Grant
I hear everything that my hon. Friend has to say, and I am aware that she knows a considerable amount about the matter. I do not accept that there is a lack of will, but I hear what she has to say, and I will make sure that as much action as possible is taken to deal with the issues that she highlighted.
I very much welcome the action plan that the Director of Public Prosecutions published recently, with a view to bringing a successful prosecution for female genital mutilation. The willingness of victims and others to come forward and give evidence in court is crucial. We need to create a climate in which victims, and those close to them, feel able to report offences to the police and to receive the help and support that they need to give evidence, so that perpetrators of this unacceptable, dreadful practice can be brought to justice.
Of course, the law is only one part of tackling the problem of female genital mutilation in this country, and prosecution after the fact does not relieve the victim from a lifetime of pain and discomfort. Ideally, we want to prevent the mutilation from happening in the first place. We need to educate people and change their attitudes— sometimes long-established attitudes. A holistic approach and a multi-agency response are vital.
Heather Wheeler
The Minister talks about a multi-disciplinary approach. I wonder whether she could open up discussions with the health authorities, because I understand that, under the NHS, restorative medical treatment is not granted automatically.
Mrs Grant
I note what my hon. Friend says. I shall come on to health and cross-Government, inter-agency multi-practice in a moment, but if I do not cover her specific point, I will be happy to write to her.
A joined-up approach within Government is also important. The Government’s approach to tackling female genital mutilation is set out in our “Call to End Violence Against Women and Girls” action plan. Our key focus is prevention, and cross-Government work, co-ordinated by the Home Office, has seen significant progress in raising awareness of female genital mutilation and supporting professionals to intervene. Central to that work are the multi-agency practice guidelines on female genital mutilation, which were published in February 2011. They highlight the risk factors that teachers, nurses, GPs, police officers and social workers should be looking out for in their work, and they set out what action they should take. Above all, they stress the need for a collaborative effort to protect girls at risk. A review of the use and effectiveness of the guidelines was launched by the Home Office in August 2012, and a report on the findings of that review will be published later this year. Additionally, over 40,000 information leaflets and posters about female genital mutilation have been distributed to schools, health services, charities and community groups around the country.
We also continue to support front-line organisations that work with communities to challenge their long-held beliefs about the practice. The Home Office launched a £50,000 fund in November 2012, from which organisations may bid for grants of £2,000 to £5,000. That follows from the success of the 2011 fund, which supported 10 organisations working to tackle FGM across England and Wales. Another recent initiative is the declaration against FGM launched by the Home Office in November. Based on the Dutch document known as the “health passport”, it sets out the law and penalties for female genital mutilation. It is supported by and carries the signatures of relevant Ministers, including my own and those of the Minister of State, Home Department, my hon. Friend the Member for Taunton Deane (Mr Browne) and the Under-Secretary of State for Health, my hon. Friend the hon. Member for Broxtowe (Anna Soubry), as well as that of the Director of Public Prosecutions.
The Department of Health continues to ensure that health professionals are able to respond appropriately to girls and women who may be at risk of genital mutilation and to those who have already been subjected to it. In May 2012, the then Health Minister, my hon. Friend the Member for Guildford (Anne Milton), wrote to the royal colleges and NHS agencies encouraging them to raise awareness of the problem among professionals, and the Department’s chief medical officer and the director of nursing, with the support of the royal colleges, wrote to health professionals drawing their attention to the multi-agency practice guidelines. It is clear from the responses received that all are committed to playing their part in eradicating this dreadful practice.
Work is continuing across Government to look at all possible ways of tackling this complex issue. To that end, in two days’ time, the Minister with responsibility for crime prevention, my honourable Friend the Member for Taunton Deane, will be co-hosting, with the National Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Children, a round-table meeting with key professionals. The meeting’s purpose is to explore how those working with children can work together to detect potential victims of FGM and deter those from considering carrying out the act. The public health Minister, my hon. Friend the Member for Broxtowe, and the Minister with responsibility for children, my hon. Friend the Member for Crewe and Nantwich (Mr Timpson), will also be attending.
Ultimately, the eradication of female genital mutilation in this country will require the practising communities themselves to abandon this awful practice. It is a sad fact that older women, who are themselves victims of genital mutilation, are often the strongest advocates for the continuance of the practice. Such attitudes are deeply ingrained.
The hon. Member for Kingston upon Hull East asked what the victims commissioner’s role might be in relation to the issue. The victims commissioner has a statutory duty to promote the interests of victims of crime, including victims of female genital mutilation. I hope that she will be taking up her position later this month, and I look forward to working closely with her on those matters. He also asked about my role as victims Minister, with particular reference to female genital mutilation, and I can tell him that I will be working closely with the Home Office in a cross-Government capacity on an issue that, as I think he knows, is also very close to my heart.
In a wider context, I am responsible for looking after victims and doing everything that I can to care for, support and help them, including, of course, victims of female genital mutilation. I will be working with the police and crime commissioners to make sure that they do everything that they possibly can to eradicate the practice, and working with the police in their new capacities. We will be reforming the victims code, which will hopefully make it easier for victims—including victims of female genital mutilation—to navigate their way through the criminal justice system, which can often be very confusing and intimidating, as I am sure the hon. Gentleman is aware, having worked in it for many years.
In conclusion, the Government remain committed to protecting young girls and women from the abuse, and to ensuring that those living with its consequences get the care and support that they need and deserve. I thank all hon. Members who have contributed to the debate, and I hope that it will serve to keep this important issue firmly on the agenda.
Trusts (Capital and Income) Bill [Lords]
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The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice (Mrs Helen Grant)
I beg to move, That the Bill be now read the Third time.
This is a short technical Bill that implements, with minor modifications, the recommendations of the Law Commission. The Government are grateful to the Law Commission, the Charity Commission and the leading experts and stakeholders who have worked with them and the Ministry of Justice to prepare the reforms. The provisions of the Bill are to be brought into force on a date or dates to be specified by order made by the Secretary of State and I will make a statement on the timing of commencement following Royal Assent.
The Bill will simplify and modernise the law and I commend it to the House.
Administrative Justice and Tribunals
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The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice (Mrs Helen Grant)
I am today publishing a strategic work programme for administrative justice and tribunals.
This document sets out the Government’s ambitions for administrative justice and tribunals under six headings:
1. Governance of the administrative justice and tribunals system;
2. Non-HMCTS tribunals and new appeal rights;
3. Funding of tribunals administered by HMCTS;
4. Improving initial decision making;
5. Enhancing proportionality; and
6. Maintaining a user focus.
The Government recognise that administrative justice plays a vital role in holding the Executive to account and upholding the rights and entitlements of people subject to the decisions of public bodies. It deals with issues that affect the lives of more people than any other part of the justice system, providing a means of redress across a range of issues as diverse as immigration, social security, mental health and taxation. It is delivered by many different bodies, including tribunals, ombudsmen and regulators.
The last decade has seen a period of major structural reform in the tribunal system which, with the creation of the Property Chamber, will be largely completed in 2013. The unified tribunal system that has emerged, administered by Her Majesty’s Courts and Tribunals Service (HMCTS), ensures that the members and administration of tribunals remain independent from the Departments and authorities that make the original decisions. It now provides rulings on hundreds of thousands of appeals on administrative matters every year. In addition to this, some tribunals also hear non-administrative claims such as disputes between employers and employees, which are heard by the employment tribunal.
With this period of structural reform almost at an end, the Government intend to shift their focus towards making practical improvements to administrative justice and tribunals processes. The programme of work planned under the headings above will allow us to make the system work better for users and be more cost effective for taxpayers.
This work programme will be taken forward by the Ministry of Justice in partnership with other central Government Departments, public authorities and other bodies.
Copies of the strategic work programme will be placed in the Libraries of both Houses and on the Department’s website at: www.justice.gov.uk.
Oral Answers to Questions
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Steve Rotheram (Liverpool, Walton) (Lab)
12. What recent assessment he has made of security arrangements in courtrooms.
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice (Mrs Helen Grant)
The security of our courtrooms and courts is a serious matter. Regular assessments take place at least once a year and they are monitored at cluster, regional and national level to aid in the continual review of security.
Steve Rotheram
A suspect who had been released on bail entered Liverpool Crown court with a knife he had smuggled through security checks and threatened to kill himself in the dock. Tragedy was averted on that occasion, but will the Minister outline what steps she is taking to instruct security staff to be extra vigilant during their searches of suspects on bail?
Mrs Grant
We are aware of that serious incident and I assure the hon. Gentleman that a full review of security has taken place at Liverpool Crown court. An action plan for improvement has been put together and good progress is being made. Training in search procedures for all G4S staff was provided last summer and its effectiveness is being monitored. Security arrangements are now operating to a required standard, but remain under careful review.
Robert Flello (Stoke-on-Trent South) (Lab)
Security in courtrooms is one of the issues of great concern to victims and witnesses. The announcement of the new part-time victims commissioner is imminent—they will do just 10 hours a month—but does the Minister think that the new part-time commissioner will have time to consider security in courtrooms as part of this Government’s approach to partly putting victims at part of the heart of the justice system?
Mrs Grant
Victims will certainly be part of the heart of the justice system. An announcement will be made imminently to confirm the name of the new victims commissioner and I look forward to working with her very closely indeed. [Hon. Members: “Her?”] A lot of work is being done to improve security and safety in courts in addition to what I and the victims commissioner will do. Work has been done to improve security, including improvements to buildings, improved ways of working and improved education and training. The provision for the presence of a court security officer and enhanced risk management have also been helpful additions. We will continue to make sure that security is a priority.
Mr Speaker
I look forward to hearing further details in due course, if we have not already heard all of them.
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice (Mrs Helen Grant)
The Government are committed to reducing offending and reoffending by women. We have a cross-government programme of work that seeks to address issues associated with offending, such as drugs, alcohol, mental health needs, domestic and sexual violence, accommodation and education.
Mr Wilson
I thank the Minister for her answer. Alana House in my constituency is a community centre supporting women experiencing problems whose behaviour has shown them to be at risk of offending. It has been particularly successful in providing the courts with a useful alternative to custodial sentences and helps vulnerable women to tackle their problems. The centre is in danger of closing. Will the Minister agree to visit Alana House to see the valuable work that the centre does, and to work with me to help ensure that this valuable community resource remains open?
Mrs Grant
I know that my hon. Friend cares deeply about Alana House and its future in his Reading constituency. He has already discussed the matter with me on a number of occasions. The National Offender Management Service has funded women’s community facilities successfully for a number of years and Alana House has been provided with funding of £111,000 for 2012-13. From 2013-14, probation trusts will commission these very important services for women. They are required to provide gender-specific services and if those services are not sufficiently robust they will be challenged. It is too early to say what that will mean for Alana House, but I can tell my hon. Friend that I would be happy to visit the facility.
Seema Malhotra (Feltham and Heston) (Lab/Co-op)
The Corston report highlighted the need for women’s centres to work with women offenders and those at risk of offending. What is the Government’s current policy on continuing to provide support to such services?
Mrs Grant
As I said, that funding will continue. The National Offender Management Service has funded women’s services very successfully for many years. The funding for women’s services will continue at the same level, but from 2013-14 probation trusts will commission these vital services.
Mr David Hanson (Delyn) (Lab)
Does the Minister agree that one of the best ways to ensure that women do not enter the criminal justice system is to use restorative justice more imaginatively for out-of-court disposals? Will she give a commitment to examine that in detail, particularly for women offenders?
Jonathan Reynolds (Stalybridge and Hyde) (Lab/Co-op)
14. What progress he is making on providing work for prisoners.
Paul Goggins (Wythenshawe and Sale East) (Lab)
16. What plans he has to extend the use of restorative justice.
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice (Mrs Helen Grant)
The Government published their restorative justice action plan for the criminal justice system on 19 November. It will improve the victim’s awareness of and access to restorative justice. We have also introduced legislation to put restorative justice on a statutory footing.
Paul Goggins
I am grateful to the Minister for that answer. I welcome the Government’s action plan, to which she referred, including the clear commitment to the needs of victims. However, if she and her colleagues are to embed restorative justice at the heart of the criminal justice system, she will need to find additional resources. Will she make a commitment now to allocate to restorative justice some of the extra money that has been raised from offenders through the extended victims surcharge?
Stephen Gilbert (St Austell and Newquay) (LD)
17. What steps he is taking to improve community sentences.
Lorely Burt (Solihull) (LD)
T2. Last week, the Public Accounts Committee published its report on the Ministry of Justice’s language services contract. It concluded, among other things, that Applied Language Solutions does not have enough interpreters available to meet demand, and that the interpreters who are provided do not all have the necessary qualifications. Does the Secretary of State intend to implement the Committee’s recommendations to address those pressing issues?
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice (Mrs Helen Grant)
Interpreting services in court are at a 95% success rate, and the National Audit Office has said that we should go on and implement the proposals fully. The contract is saving us £15 million a year of taxpayers’ money, and as long as we continue to work with interpreters—we have already had an important meeting with them—the new system will be more sustainable, effective and transparent than the old one.
Sadiq Khan (Tooting) (Lab)
The British Human Rights Act provides protection against cruel and inhumane treatment, including the right to a fair trial, the right to life, the right to family life and freedom of expression. It makes explicit the fact that Parliament is sovereign, and that even the Supreme Court cannot trump Parliament. Bearing that in mind, will the Justice Secretary make it clear that it is the British Human Rights Act that he so opposes, or is it the British courts that interpret the law? Which of the rights in the British Human Rights Act would not be included in his Bill of Rights?
Stephen Mosley (City of Chester) (Con)
T7. The Under-Secretary of State for Justice, my hon. Friend the Member for Maidstone and The Weald (Mrs Grant) mentioned the victims commissioner. Will she update the House on what progress has been made towards the appointment of a victims commissioner, and when that appointment is likely to take place?
Mesothelioma Claims (Reform)
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The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice (Mrs Helen Grant)
Today I am announcing the Government’s intention to consult publicly on proposals to reform the way that mesothelioma cases are dealt with, including; introducing fixed legal fees for mesothelioma claims, a dedicated pre-action protocol for those claims and an electronic portal on which the claims will be registered. The consultation will be issued in spring 2013. The aim is to ensure that these claims are processed and settled as quickly as possible given the nature of this disease.
As part of that consultation, we will carry out the review required under section 48 of the Legal Aid, Sentencing and Punishment of Offenders Act 2012 on the effect of the changes to the recoverability of conditional fee agreement success fees and after the event insurance premiums. We intend to publish the outcome of that review next autumn.
Mesothelioma is an aggressive and terminal occupational disease with an average life expectancy of less than two years from diagnosis. A claim for compensation can take up to two years to settle which means that sufferers often die before their claims are paid out.
The Government consider that it is imperative that these claims are settled quickly and that early payment of compensation is made so as to ease the sufferings of victims of this dreadful disease and give some assurance that their dependants will be financially secure when they are no longer around. However, this cannot be achieved without a speedy pre-litigation process which is why the Government have decided to consult on how best to reduce delays in these cases.
Third Parties (Rights against Insurers) Act 2012
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The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice (Mrs Helen Grant)
In a written ministerial statement—12 July 2012, Official Report, column 145WS about the Third Parties (Rights against Insurers) Act 2010 the then Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, my hon. Friend the Member for Huntingdon (Mr Djanogly) undertook to make a further statement in the autumn.
The Ministry of Justice is continuing to prepare the way for the commencement of the 2010 Act at the earliest practicable date.
We are very grateful to the Association of British Insurers, the Association of Personal Injury Lawyers and the Law Commission for their assistance in connection with the preparation of the Act for commencement.
I will make a further statement before the end of the current session of Parliament.
Church of England (Women Bishops)
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The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice (Mrs Helen Grant)
This has been an important and poignant debate, with powerful contributions and speeches from every single Member across the House who has been able to speak today. I sincerely congratulate the right hon. Member for Exeter (Mr Bradshaw) on securing this debate and bringing it to us this afternoon and this evening.
It is clear from what has been said today and from views expressed over the last few weeks that the decision of the General Synod not to allow the appointment of women bishops has generated very strong feelings indeed, among those who wish to see women appointed as bishops in the future and those who want to retain the status quo. As our Prime Minister has made very clear indeed, the Government strongly believe that the time is right to enable the appointment of women bishops. Women already do a tremendous job within the Church of England, including in their role as members of the clergy, so it is very disappointing that a vote taken to address this issue has failed, despite a clear majority of Synod members voting in favour of the proposal.
The role of discrimination law in this matter has been raised. Let me make it very clear that there is nothing in discrimination law that would prevent the appointment of women bishops, should the Synod vote to do so. It is right and proper that the Church of England, just like any other religious organisation, is not exempt from having to comply with our equality law, namely the Equality Act 2010.
However, it is also right and proper that certain exceptions exist within the 2010 Act to recognise the specific nature of religious organisations and the unique role they have to play within our society. One such exception exempts religious organisations from certain parts of the Act’s employment provisions, where
“the employment is for the purposes of an organised religion”.
This exception is used by a number of religious bodies, allowing Roman Catholics and orthodox Jews, for example, to appoint only men as priests or rabbis. Amending the 2010 Act to remove this exception with the intention of forcing the appointment of women bishops would potentially have effects going far beyond the Church of England alone.
Diana Johnson
I am listening to what the Minister says. In the light of what was said yesterday about the special legislation being brought forward for the Church of England with regard to gay marriage, how does what the Minister has just said fit in with yesterday’s statement?
Mrs Grant
The two issues are completely different and unconnected, and should not be conflated.
Amending that exception would risk seriously affecting the work of various other religious bodies in some extremely sensitive areas. In any case, our law enables women bishops to be appointed; that is not a stumbling block here.
Some Members have pointed out today that changing discrimination law is not the only option. The doctrine of parliamentary sovereignty means that, in theory, it would be open to Parliament to legislate on Church of England matters without the involvement of the General Synod, for instance by amending canon law to require the appointment of women bishops. However, Parliament and Church work well together on so many matters. We would not want to disturb that balance by making impulsive changes, given the special relationship that exists between the state and the Church of England as the established Church of our nation.
The Government have made their views very clear on the matter of women bishops: we would warmly welcome their appointment. However, we respect the independence of religious organisations, and it is right that decisions of this sort about internal structure are ultimately matters for the Church of England itself to decide.
I particularly thank the Second Church Estates Commissioner, my hon. Friend the Member for Banbury (Sir Tony Baldry), for his earnest remarks about the position in which the Church finds itself today. I am heartened by his acknowledgement of the difficulties and emotions that the General Synod’s vote has generated and his determination to ensure that the Church resolves the issue as soon as possible, and I look forward to hearing from him again in a moment.