The Secretary of State for Defence (John Healey)
I beg to move,
That this House has considered remembrance and the contribution of veterans.
This is the first time in four years that the House has held a general debate on remembrance. Back then, I responded for the Opposition. It is a huge honour for me to open this debate as Secretary of State for Defence and, in that role, to be the voice of veterans in the Cabinet. I am proud to have my ministerial team here with me, particularly the Minister for Veterans and People, my hon. Friend the Member for Birmingham Selly Oak (Al Carns), who will wind up this debate.
Given the number of colleagues from all parts of the House who have put in to speak in this debate, I wish to keep my remarks brief, so that we can hear from others. It is striking how many colleagues on the call list, of all parties, have served in our UK armed forces; many were elected for the first time in July, and I welcome them all to this debate. That underlines the deep affinity between the House and our nation’s armed forces. Whether or not we have served, we in this House have the interests of our armed forces at heart; but we may debate, forcefully at times, the state of our armed forces and how best to use them. That matters to those who put on the uniform and accept a duty to give unlimited service to our nation, ready to do anything, at any time, anywhere, if this House and His Majesty’s Government will it.
Mr Mark Francois (Rayleigh and Wickford) (Con)
During the troubles in Northern Ireland, hundreds of thousands of British servicemen served on Operation Banner. Hundreds were killed and thousands were maimed by both republican and loyalist bombs. I respect the right hon. Gentleman, but how can his Government repeal the Northern Ireland Troubles (Legacy and Reconciliation) Act 2023 and throw many of those veterans to the wolves in order to pander to Sinn Féin? What is noble about that?
John Healey
The legacy Act is without supporters in the communities in Northern Ireland, on any side. That is one of the reasons why it should be repealed. In the process of repeal, we will take fully into account the concerns and position of veterans, who have given such service, as the right hon. Gentleman rightly says, and their families.
Sir Julian Lewis (New Forest East) (Con)
I am grateful to the Defence Secretary for giving way; he is always very courteous. When I was on a previous iteration of the Defence Committee, we produced an in-depth report on the best way forward after the troubles, called “Drawing a line: Protecting veterans by a Statute of Limitations”. It recommended ending prosecutions and substituting a truth recovery process. People from, shall we say, some of the Northern Irish parties felt compelled to condemn it on the Floor of the House, but quietly came up to me afterwards and admitted that it was the only way forward. Just because there is this performative condemnation by different communities, he should not be diverted from the fact that what was good enough for Nelson Mandela in South Africa should be good enough for us.
John Healey
For me, one of the great strengths of the House and Parliament is the work of the all-party Select Committees. The right hon. Gentleman’s Committee, during that time, did the House and the wider cause of peace and reconciliation in Northern Ireland a service. We will take those points into account. I do not think that anybody could point their finger at the current Northern Ireland Secretary and say that he is not a serious figure, or that he could remotely be accused of performative politics. He will take very seriously his duty to lead the repeal of the legacy Act and find a way forward that takes everybody with us.
Remembrance Sunday is a moment when the nation comes together to honour those who have served, those who have fought and, above all, those who have made the ultimate sacrifice of their life to defend our country, preserve our freedoms and protect our way of life. To all those who serve and have served, on behalf of the country, I offer a profound thank you.
This will be the first time many new Members have the privilege of representing their constituency at remembrance parades, ceremonies and services. I encourage all to play their fullest part, and to go into their schools to join in the lessons and projects that will take place in the run-up to Remembrance Day, because remembrance is not just an opportunity to show our gratitude and pride; it is an opportunity to learn, and to teach the next generation about the service and sacrifice of those who came before. Given that the number of veterans in this country will fall by a third in this decade, it is clear that we need to do more at all levels to reinforce the country’s understanding of and commitment to our armed forces. That has never been more important than in the year in which we mark the 80th anniversary of D-day and many of the major battles that led to the end of the second world war. At the weekend, we marked a decade since the conclusion of UK combat operations in Afghanistan, and during this Remembrance we honour the 457 British service personnel who lost their life, the thousands who were wounded, and their families, who bore such a burden.
Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)
I thank the Minister for his contribution. He is an honest and honourable person. This is on the subject of justice for those who served in uniform. I declare an interest, having served in the Ulster Defence Regiment for three years and in the Royal Artillery for 11 and a half years; that is 14 and a half years in total. My cousin was murdered on 10 December 1971. No one was ever made accountable for his murder. The IRA men who killed him ran across the border to the Republic of Ireland, to sanctuary and safety. No one was made accountable for the murder of four UDR men at Ballydugan on 9 April 1990. It grieves me greatly on their behalf to know that there are people still walking about who have never been made accountable in this world for what they have done. I want to see justice. Does the Minister want to see justice for those people as well?
John Healey
I had moved on to Afghanistan, but the hon. Gentleman, in his forceful way, makes his point, which is on the record.
I want to move on and use this remembrance period and this debate to pay tribute to the very special service charities that we have in the UK. They work, week in, week out, all year round, to raise funds, promote awareness and provide services to our armed forces and veterans.
John Healey
I will give way one more time, and then conclude my speech, so that the House can hear from the many Members who wish to speak.
Ian Roome
I am grateful to the Secretary of State for mentioning the good work of charities. My base in North Devon, Royal Marines Base Chivenor, and garrison commander Lieutenant Colonel Simpson are supportive of service charities, including the Royal Marines Association. Will the Secretary of State wish the Royal Marine Corps a happy birthday, as they celebrate their 360th birthday today?
John Healey
I am so glad that I gave way. I was going to leave that to my hon. Friend the Minister for Veterans and People, who I am sure will have something to say about that. To respond to the hon. Gentleman’s invitation, on behalf of the whole House, I say: what a remarkable service, and what a remarkable feat—360 years proud today. We honour those in that service, we wish them well in future, and say a big happy birthday.
At this time of year, we see the particular contribution of the Royal British Legion and the importance of its poppy appeal. Let us recognise the commitment of the hundreds of volunteers across the country who recruit the poppy sellers, organise the shifts, check the stock, account for the donations and encourage the public to give, and to wear poppies at this time of year with such pride. On behalf of us all, thank you.
These are serious times—war in Europe, conflict in the middle east, growing Russian aggression and increasing threats elsewhere. As the world becomes more dangerous, we will rely more heavily on the professionalism and courage of our armed forces. It is against that backdrop that the Government are committed to renewing the nation’s contract with those who serve. We have already been able to announce the largest pay increase for our forces for over 20 years, and I am the first Defence Secretary who can stand in the House and say that everyone in uniform in the UK armed forces will be paid at least the national living wage. That is why we announced, in our first King’s Speech, legislation to introduce an independent armed forces commissioner to improve service life for service personnel and their families.
John Healey
I will, because the hon. Gentleman is particularly persistent. Despite his youthful looks, he has been in the House for some time.
Tim Farron
True enough, and I am sure I should know better.
Recruiting and retaining good people who will serve our country is made a little easier if they know that they will be cared for in the years after they leave active service. Will the Secretary of State say something about the importance of investing in mental health support for veterans, and in particular congratulate One Vision, the charity in my constituency that provides counselling support for the armed forces and all those in uniform, and does work to make sure that we value those people in the years after they have actively served us?
John Healey
I will indeed. The hon. Gentleman is right, of course. On support services for veterans who need them, there is not just what the Government can help provide—including, on mental health, through Op Courage—but what is provided by a network of first-class local charities. If One Vision plays a part in that in his area of Cumbria, I certainly pay tribute to it.
There is a more profound reason for our concern to provide support for our veterans. We need to recognise that those on deployment in the armed forces must have the confidence to act decisively on behalf of the nation, and they can be motivated and have their confidence reinforced by how they see the nation supporting veterans back home. That is why we pledged in our manifesto in July to improve access to support for our veterans, including on mental health, employment and housing. It is why we have committed to putting the armed forces covenant fully into law. It is why, within three months of taking office, we have delivered on the commitment to make the veteran’s identity card an accepted form of voter ID, and why the Prime Minister, in his first conference speech, announced that veterans would be exempt from rules requiring a connection to the area from those seeking to access housing there.
At the heart of our national security will always be the men and women who serve this country. As we consider this debate, we have an opportunity to reflect on what we mean by remembrance and to recognise the immense contribution made to this country by our veterans, by serving members of the armed forces and by the families who support them.
Hundreds of thousands have answered the nation’s call and given their lives in doing so. We honour them, and we will remember them.
Madam Deputy Speaker (Judith Cummins)
I call the shadow Minister.
The Minister for Veterans and People (Al Carns)
It is indeed 360 years since the formation of the Royal Marines and they are still going strong. I will refuse to take advice from the hon. Member for West Aberdeenshire and Kincardine (Andrew Bowie) on face cream but it was a privilege to take the salute just the other day from both the Commandant General Royal Marines and the Commandant of the US Marine Corps, which demonstrates the strong ties across the pond with the US between those Marine units.
I am grateful to Members for their thoughtful reflections on remembrance and the contributions of veterans to this country. We have heard moving contributions from Members reflecting on their personal experience of service, and as I am sure they would testify there is an unspoken oath of allegiance between service personnel. Indeed, it knows no bounds; it is the glue that holds the forces together, and that oath has always extended to the fallen on the battlefield and beyond. For serving personnel and veterans, remembrance is an enduring reflection of that oath, and on the eleventh hour of the eleventh day I will remember the individuals who have gone before us but also those I have stood next to who have been killed or wounded—after five tours of Afghanistan, one of Northern Ireland, and multiple of the Arabian gulf, eastern Europe and Africa, there have been many.
Importantly, we must remember those who will never see that smile again or see them laugh or hold them close once more. It is a time for them, and those that did not come home to see their children, their partners, or indeed their loved ones or their friends. It is our duty to remember them all.
But remembrance is not only about fallen comrades and veterans; it is a rare moment when the nation comes together, from Northern Ireland, Scotland, Wales and England. And it is a reminder to everyone in every generation across the whole country that the freedoms we all enjoy—the freedoms of speech, of equality, of quality of life—were all hard fought for and hard-won. Freedom is not free, and it is something in the fractious world we live in today that individually or collectively we should not take for granted.
Those freedoms are forged from the sacrifice of the young men and women of the Army, Navy and our Air Force who stepped forward when the country needed them: the sacrifices of the few who are still owed so much by the many; the sacrifices on the high seas, in the air, on the beaches and the landing grounds and in the fields, and in the streets from world war one to Operation Overlord, where they secured a beachhead in Normandy that would free a continent from Nazi tyranny and usher in the rules-based international system; and the sacrifices of 80,000 British service personnel who fought in the forgotten war on the Korean peninsula to uphold the rights and freedoms enshrined in that rules-based international system. All are memorialised in stones outside the MOD, of which one says,
“A distant obligation honourably discharged.”
There were the sacrifices in the south Atlantic, on the open water, in the skies and on the windswept heaths, for the right of the Falkland Islanders to choose their own sovereign future. And the sacrifices of service personnel in desert fatigues who liberated Kuwait and fought in Iraq, and those in the operational areas whom I served alongside in the long troubles of Northern Ireland, the middle east, Africa, Afghanistan and eastern Europe who sacrificed so much to uphold the right to self-determination and give freedom and democracy a chance to take root. And the sacrifices we cannot talk about because we do not comment on certain issues.
It is thanks to all those who have served and sacrificed and whom we honour on Remembrance Day that we can sit here, as democratically elected MPs, and debate the future of this wonderful country. Few, if any, outside the armed forces sign a contract that puts their life on the line and those who have served or continue to serve often pay the price for that service, through the long-term mental or physical scars, the impact on families and on their children, or through the painful memories or indeed the longing for the camaraderie and service they left behind. It is my opinion that those who serve through one way or another serve until the day they die. That is why this Government of service are committed to standing with members of our armed forces and their families long after they leave the services.
Mr Calvin Bailey (Leyton and Wanstead) (Lab)
Syd Little was part of the team which delivered life-saving supplies to Mount Sinjar on 9 August 2014, in the operation now known as Operation Shader. Flight Sergeant Little lost his life this weekend to cancer. Does my hon. and gallant Friend agree that service people face some of their greatest challenges on their exit from service and that the veterans strategy is essential to ensuring that those challenges are not equal to those they faced while serving?
Al Carns
There are few fights as valiant as that against the barbaric regime of ISIS. My thoughts go to my hon. Friend’s constituent, and his family and loved ones who were left behind. This Government are committed to supporting the welfare of veterans and those who are serving, and there will be more details to follow. As a veteran, as the Minister responsible for veterans, people and personnel, I do not take these commitments lightly.
This Government have already ensured that those who defend democracy will have the right to exercise that democracy at the polling station. In just over 100 days, we have made the veterans ID card a form of voter ID. The Prime Minister has also confirmed that veterans will rightly be prioritised in accessing housing. Furthermore, we are determined to deliver on our manifesto commitments to fully incorporate the armed forces covenant in law, get rid of the postcode lottery, and give veterans the support that they need on mental health, employment and housing. We will also scrap visa fees for non-UK veterans who have served for four or more years, and for their families.
I congratulate those who gave their maiden speech today. There were some fantastic speeches, particularly from my hon. Friends the Members for Nuneaton (Jodie Gosling), and for Stafford (Leigh Ingham). They outlined so many veterans’ issues, but also talked about the comprehensive military presence in their constituencies. I also pay tribute to the multiple individuals with military experience in the House. The hon. Member for Huntingdon (Ben Obese-Jecty) served in 2010. I probably dropped into the area he was in. I was very well hosted by his regiment or brigade. I was often met on the ground with a fiery reception, but also some good banter. It is a great tribute to the House that we have so many people with military experience, and like all Members, I look forward to their contributions in this great place.
Several issues were raised today. The hon. Member for Reigate (Rebecca Paul), the right hon. Member for Dwyfor Meirionnydd (Liz Saville Roberts), my hon. Friend the Member for Dunfermline and Dollar (Graeme Downie) and the hon. Member for Sutton and Cheam (Luke Taylor) paid tribute to the brave pilots of the Photographic Reconnaissance Unit, who did so much intelligence gathering during the second world war. Without their work on operations, none of those operations would have taken place. Given that the unit had one of the highest casualties rates of all those in the skies—I think it was 40% plus—it is right to pay tribute to it by moving forward with a memorial; I fully support that.
I say in response to the right hon. Member for Dwyfor Meirionnydd that I met the Welsh Veterans’ Commissioner, Colonel Phillips, last Thursday. I spoke to him about his role, responsibilities and potential changes for a good hour and a half. Several Members have brought up the issues of Northern Ireland. Our Government recognise the important service of veterans and the sacrifices they made to keep people safe in Northern Ireland during the troubles. I am a Northern Ireland veteran. I give the House my word that any veteran will get the legal and welfare support that they need to ensure that the stresses of any action that we move forward with are minimised.
Members brought up various charities. Across the veterans sector and the armed forces community, there are more than 1,000 charities. They are primarily led by individuals who give up their spare time to support the armed forces and veterans. As we move towards Remembrance Day, it is worth remembering not just those who have served or are serving, but those who support those in the armed forces, primarily in the UK’s amazing charitable sector, which has such an important role.
My hon. Friend the Member for Glenrothes and Mid Fife (Richard Baker) brought up mental health. Op Courage has had 30,000 referrals. It is doing a fantastic job. I have visited multiple NHS trusts that are delivering fantastic partnership working to ensure that veterans get the mental health support that they require.
The treatment of the LGBT community from 1967 to 2000 was completely and utterly abhorrent. Some of the stories that I have heard have been absolutely harrowing. I had the pleasure of attending the LGBT awards last week. We have delivered 32 of the 49 recommendations from the Lord Etherton review, and we are working hard to deliver an appropriate financial redress scheme, so that we can close out that review in a timely and effective manner.
I had the great pleasure of meeting the nuclear test veterans; that has been absolutely superb. We have built up a relationship through a cadence of meetings to ensure that there is communication and education, and to look into some of their issues relating to files. We are working collaboratively on that.
It would be unfitting of me to finish without saying that I have heard some harrowing stories today of the sacrifices paid by so many, including so many stories of the loss of loved ones. I think especially of the hon. Member for Strangford (Jim Shannon), who lost some of his loved ones in the troubles. I have also heard amazing stories about some of our longest-serving veterans, including Flight Lieutenant Harry Richardson, who is now over 100 years old, which is truly remarkable. The hon. Member for Mid Sussex (Alison Bennett) also outlined the amazing world war two story of George.
As I conclude, it is worth noting the broader message that is wrapped into remembrance. Yes, this is a time to remember—to remember that freedom is not free, and that every decision we make in this House, or in this Government, has an impact. That does not mean that we should shy away from difficult decisions on whether to deploy our armed forces. We should, rather, acknowledge and champion the fact that our armed forces are there for a reason: to protect us at home and abroad, to protect our way of life, and to ensure that the freedom we enjoy today is passed down to our children, and their children.
Our armed forces are the guarantors of everything we hold dear. To risk life and limb for one’s nation is, I think, the noblest of all traditions, but if service is anything, it is above politics. That is why I stand ready to work with all hon. and right hon. Members so that veterans and those serving can live a life, in and outside the armed forces, worthy of the incredible contribution they made to this nation. Today, in advance of Remembrance Day, we come together, united, to say thank you to those who have served, and to honour all those who have made the ultimate sacrifice.
Question put and agreed to.
Resolved,
That this House has considered Remembrance and the contribution of veterans.