Official Secrets Act Case: Witness Statements

Tom Tugendhat Excerpts

Thursday 16th October 2025 Commons Chamber

[The Parliamentary Secretary, Cabinet Office (Chris Ward)]

I thank the hon. Member for the question and for the opportunity to respond to it today. I appreciate how serious and personal this is for the hon. Member, who, like other Members of this House, is sanctioned by China and/or named in the witness statements.

Following the Security Minister’s statement to the House on Monday, the Prime Minister updated Parliament yesterday, following the Crown Prosecution Service’s clarification that the Government were able to publish the witness statements of the deputy National Security Adviser. As the Prime Minister said in the House, he carefully considered this matter and, following legal advice, decided to disclose the witness statements unredacted and in full.

I reiterate that, as the Prime Minister said yesterday, under this Government no Minister or special adviser played any role in the provision of evidence. The Prime Minister cannot say whether that was the case under the previous Government, but I once again invite the Conservative party to clarify that.

[Tom Tugendhat (Tonbridge) (Con)]

Stop playing politics! This is about national security, you petty little man!

[Chris Ward]

Having now had the opportunity to read these statements, Members will have been able to confirm for themselves what the Prime Minister and other members of the Government—

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[Chris Ward]

I can understand how seriously my hon. Friend and her constituents will take this. If she will permit me, I will get back to her with a substantive answer on that from the team as soon as I can.

[Tom Tugendhat (Tonbridge) (Con)]

May I apologise for earlier outbursts, Mr Speaker? [Interruption.]

[Mr Speaker]

Order. I am not in the position of needing any advice or help. I have had enough from the Opposition Benches; I do not want it starting on the Government Benches, too. I think we will take it that there was, in fairness, an apology to those on the Front Bench.

[Tom Tugendhat]

May I start by saying briefly quite how this feels, Mr Speaker? My home has been broken into, my files have been ransacked, somebody was put into my office by a hostile state, and the two parties are playing politics with it. This is the national security of the United Kingdom. The people of Tonbridge elected me; they may have chosen wrong, but they did. The people of other parts of the United Kingdom chose everybody else in this House—it is up to them to choose who represents them. Yet here we have two individuals seeking to extract information from us, and the Government’s response is not as mine was: do everything you can to make sure the prosecution works. No, no, it was “process, process”. Well, who the hell’s side are you on? This is not about bureaucracy; this is about leadership. We are not sent here to be civil servants. We are sent here to lead the country and to make decisions.

I feel nothing but fondness for the Minister in his place, and I am very sorry that he has been sent out on what is not quite his first outing, but pretty close—[Interruption.] Oh, it is his first outing! He has been sent out on his first outing to defend the indefensible. He now has the position in which he effectively has to say that he is not a politician, but a bureaucrat, that there is nothing he can do, and that frankly he should not even be here in the first place, because that seems to be the Prime Minister’s line. Former Attorneys General have got up and prosecuted on the state’s behalf. This Attorney General and this Prime Minister have said, “Not on my watch—not worth the effort.”

[Chris Ward]

Just to say, I have huge respect for the right hon. Member, even if that evidently is not mutual at the moment—let us see if we can get to that place.

The Prime Minister answered this question yesterday. I fully appreciate how personally this affects the right hon. Member, his constituency and his office. I do understand that, and I am genuinely not trying to play politics. I see his eyebrows raised at that, but I am genuinely not. I am trying to tell the story of how this situation has progressed and to reiterate from the Dispatch Box the point that the Prime Minister made yesterday and the Security Minister made on Monday, which is that the Government’s position—as it has been under successive Governments, but particularly under this Prime Minister—is that there will be no interference with the CPS in the process of this, and that every effort was made to try to deliver evidence to support its case when it was asked for.

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[Mr Speaker]

I cannot prolong the UQ. I know the hon. Lady well, and I know she will not leave it at that point of order. She will go and use all the options that are open to her, and I am sure that she will be coming back in not too distant a time.

[Tom Tugendhat]

rose—

[Mr Speaker]

I call Tom Tugendhat, who will not keep this debate going.

[Tom Tugendhat]

On a point of order, Mr Speaker. I will not; I am going to raise a different argument, if I may. Given that the Government’s position is that the bureaucrats run the Government and are in charge of everything, may we dissolve this House and save the taxpayer the money, because clearly this is not a democracy any more?

[Mr Speaker]

I am sure the right hon. Member would not want to give up his seat quite so quickly.

Oral Answers to Questions

Tom Tugendhat Excerpts

Wednesday 15th October 2025 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

Let me be clear: the only process I want to go through is in relation to some of the individuals in the statements to make sure that they know that this is coming up. I can assure the House that there is no substantive delay here.

[Tom Tugendhat (Tonbridge) (Con)]

rose—

[The Prime Minister]

I know this is of acute concern to a number of people. I will have the statements out in full. There is a bit of proper process that I need to go through—the right hon. Member for Tonbridge (Tom Tugendhat) will understand why that is necessary—and then they will be published in full. The right hon. Lady asks about minutes etc. There are the usual rules and process for Government. I remind her that the substantive issues in this case were discussed at meetings under the previous Government, so the Opposition are asking me to disclose the discussions that they had in relation to the witness statements in the first place.

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[The Prime Minister]

Labour is introducing an elections Bill to protect our democracy from foreign interference. But look at Reform. The hon. Member for Clacton (Nigel Farage) and his deputy, the hon. Member for Boston and Skegness (Richard Tice), worked alongside someone who took money to spread Putin’s propaganda. Whatever their denials, they have serious questions to answer about what they knew, but that is the choice: Kremlin cronies sowing division or Labour patriots working for national renewal.

[Tom Tugendhat (Tonbridge) (Con)]

The lines that we have heard from the Government in recent days have been a conflation of fabricated stories trying to set up straw men and knock down things that have not been said. The real question in this whole debate is whether or not the Director of Public Prosecutions charged legally and properly. If they did, then the Official Secrets Act is valid, and all this talk about the National Security Act 2023, which I introduced, is completely irrelevant. If they did not, why is he not charging his successor with abuse of power? Well, we know the reality, Mr Speaker. Although the Prime Minister has answered the question about evidence, the real question is: what political direction did this Government give to their officials before they went to give evidence?

[The Prime Minister]

Absolutely none—absolutely none. I will also tell the right hon. Gentleman this: I was the chief prosecutor for five years, and I can say that in those five years, which included three years under the coalition Government, when we were taking difficult decisions on MPs’ expenses, not once—not once—was I subjected to political pressure of any sort from anyone. That is the tradition in this country. It is a proud tradition, and it is one I uphold as Prime Minister, just as I upheld it when I was Director of Public Prosecutions.

Security Update: Official Secrets Act Case

Tom Tugendhat Excerpts

Monday 13th October 2025 Commons Chamber

[Dan Jarvis]

I am grateful to my hon. Friend, not least for saying that facts matter—they really do. That is why I have come to the House today, to set out facts so that Members can make a judgment on how they wish to proceed.

My hon. Friend also makes an important point about cyber-security and the ongoing review of the Computer Misuse Act. I can assure him that we take these matters incredibly seriously. In fact, I will have more to say about it shortly.

[Tom Tugendhat (Tonbridge) (Con)]

The Minister and I have been friends for many years, so it gives me no pleasure to say this. The statement that he read out today, no doubt under instruction, has thrown out more chaff and set up more straw men than a Russian disinformation campaign. It is pure fabrication to claim that those are the relevant points and, sadly, he knows it.

The Minister knows it, because we discussed many of these issues when he was in opposition and I was in his place. He knows it, because the various security and defence reviews that have been updated in the past four years have set out the clear position of the threat. He knows it, because I stood at the Dispatch Box, as he now does, on 15 April 2024 and made clear the position of China being a threat.

And the Minister knows it, I am afraid, because the right hon. Member for Islington South and Finsbury (Emily Thornberry), the Chair of the Foreign Affairs Committee, set out how the DPP has asked a very clear question: why have we not had the information in time for these cases to proceed? That is exactly the right question. The DPP did not say that the evidential threshold was not met. If it had not been met, the arrests should never have happened and the Minister should rightly be hauling the head of MI5, the head of counter-terror policing and the Treasury solicitor before him for abuse of power. He is not doing that because he knows the threshold was met.

Instead, the Minister should read the words of the DPP—the threshold is “no longer met”. That means there has been a change, and there has been a change because something has changed. That change could either be a commission or an omission, and from what we have heard today—from the way in which the Government have very carefully used language—it sounds much more likely that something has not been done than that it has.

As my friend the Minister knows, simply ignoring an order is not the same thing as not receiving one. I am afraid that what this has done, and what this statement does, is advertise that the UK is not willing to defend itself against threats from hostile states. I know that that is not a position he wishes to advocate.

[Dan Jarvis]

As the House knows well, the right hon. Gentleman is personally invested in this issue. Members will understand the history and the reasons for the concerns he has expressed, and I understand why he has taken the opportunity to express them today and on other occasions. The Government fundamentally agree with some of his concerns, though clearly not with his subsequent analysis. He will have noted the point I have made today about the issuing of guidance from the NPSA. We have published that guidance today, and I hope he will acknowledge the determination that exists—from myself as the Minister and from colleagues right across Government—to provide assurances and satisfy his concerns.

One of the ways in which we will do that is through the defending democracy taskforce, of which the right hon. Gentleman was a founding member. I can say to him and to the House that that taskforce provides the fulcrum point for dealing with many of these matters right across Government. It has had its mandate refreshed by the Prime Minister, and we invest a lot in that mechanism. It will seek to provide us with some of the answers we need in order to give the right hon. Gentleman the assurance he seeks. I hope he will understand that I stand ready to meet him and the hon. Member for Rutland and Stamford (Alicia Kearns) to further discuss any concerns they might have. The right hon. Gentleman may not be satisfied today, but I will do what I can to provide that satisfaction and assurance as we go forward.

National Security Strategy

Tom Tugendhat Excerpts

Tuesday 24th June 2025 Commons Chamber

[Pat McFadden]

There is a £1 billion investment in biosecurity. My right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for DEFRA has been able to announce only today new investment in critical resources at Weybridge as part of that.

[Tom Tugendhat (Tonbridge) (Con)]

I welcome today’s national security strategy, which bears a remarkable resemblance to every single one I have seen over the past 15 years. There have been only very slight adjustments over that period; I wonder whether there is any connection between the authors, or whether it is just that the officials have not changed, so the politics has not changed. However, one thing that really has changed over that period is technology, and the document I have seen this morning has very little connection to the democratisation of technology that we have seen in Ukraine’s warfare in Russia or between Israel and Iran—or, indeed, in warfare we might see waged against us by the switching off of electronic items, including solar panels and cars by the Chinese state.

[Pat McFadden]

I have great respect for the right hon. Gentleman, and I thank him for his question. He is absolutely right to draw attention to the importance of technology, which I mentioned in my opening remarks. It is why we have put such stress on having an AI action plan to make this country as strong as possible in this field, and why we have made the investment in the supercomputer at Edinburgh and this time put the money behind it. Such technology is a critical part of our strength as a country and we have significant advantage and expertise in it. One aspect of the document is about ensuring that, where we have an advantage, we invest in it and we make sure that it deepens our capability in those crucial ways.

Ukraine

Tom Tugendhat Excerpts

Monday 3rd March 2025 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

I agree on both propositions. Ukraine needs to be at the table. There have to be security guarantees, because we know from history that Putin does not honour agreements that do not have security guarantees. That is precisely why we need one.

[Tom Tugendhat (Tonbridge) (Con)]

I echo the thanks to the Prime Minister for his leadership over recent days. He has definitely spoken for Britain when he has spoken on the world stage. May I ask him to join me in thanking the parliamentary staffers who, while he was doing that, were driving aid to Ukraine?

Quite rightly, the Prime Minister has brought together a coalition of European and NATO partners. Is he working on those further afield? As he knows very well, Australia has already donated Bushmasters, and many are concerned about Iran’s support for the Russians through its Shahed drone programme. Is he reaching out to our middle eastern allies as well?

[The Prime Minister]

I thank the parliamentary staffers who have done such significant and important work. On the right hon. Gentleman’s important question about reaching out beyond Europe, I agree with him and we are doing that. This needs to be as broad a coalition as we can put together, with different capabilities. Each country should make whichever contribution is the most significant from its point of view, and I thank him for his support over the weekend.

G20 and COP29 Summits

Tom Tugendhat Excerpts

Thursday 21st November 2024 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

I am grateful to my hon. Friend for raising the important issue of the west bank and settlements. It is a major and escalating cause of concern and has been for some time. Certainly, sanctions have been imposed in the past and will continue to be imposed.

[Tom Tugendhat (Tonbridge) (Con)]

I welcome the Prime Minister’s statement condemning China’s actions, but can he make a commitment here, now and completely clearly that, before any Minister meets any Chinese official, they will meet with the family of Jimmy Lai, or indeed any of the other many Hongkongers who are here and whose families have now been detained. We know—we can brief the Prime Minister on this—that there are Hongkongers who are threatened by the Chinese state here in the UK today, and it is his job to defend the people of this country, not to bow to the people in Beijing.

[The Prime Minister]

Defending the people of this country is what we do every day. Raising these important issues is the right way to do it. I was very clear about what I raised, and that is a matter of public record, as the right hon. Member will well know.

Ukraine

Tom Tugendhat Excerpts

Thursday 24th February 2022 Commons Chamber

[Mr Speaker]

Order. The Prime Minister has some very important meetings, and I will be running the statement to 6.30 pm. For those colleagues who do not get in, we are keeping a list, as we did from the other day, to try to ensure that all Members have a voice on this very important matter.

[Tom Tugendhat (Tonbridge and Malling) (Con)]

I pay huge tribute to my right hon. Friend the Prime Minister and his Government for introducing what sound like the toughest sanctions we have seen in years. May I ask him to look wider than simply the Russian people, and at all those who are enabling Putin’s economy—those who sit on boards of the businesses that finance him, whether they are former Chancellors of Germany, or former Prime Ministers of France? Will he look here, close to home, at those who enable and propagate the propaganda that is used by Putin to undermine his own people and free people everywhere? Will he update the Treason Act 1351, so that we can identify those people and call them what they are: traitors? When the Prime Minister speaks to people around the world, will he speak with the truth that he can in Russian through the BBC Russian service, and start to broadcast in languages other than Russian into Russia, so that all Russian peoples can know that their oppression does not need to exist and they do not need to side with the tyrant?

[The Prime Minister]

I thank my hon. Friend very much. He is absolutely right to say that we have to look at those who abet the Putin regime. There are many, many of them, and that is why we are looking at all sorts of ways in which we can address threats to this state. We are, of course, ensuring that the messages from this House, which are so impressive in their unity, should be registered by the people of Russia, because we mean no ill towards them. They are, in many ways, as much the victims of this appalling regime as the people of Ukraine, and they need to know what is really going on.

Ukraine

Tom Tugendhat Excerpts

Tuesday 22nd February 2022 Commons Chamber

[Mr Speaker]

Order. I am expecting to run this statement until around 2 o’clock, so short questions and pithy answers would certainly be helpful.

[Tom Tugendhat (Tonbridge and Malling) (Con)]

I welcome my right hon. Friend’s statement today and the actions of him and his Government over recent weeks. I pay particular tribute to the Defence Secretary, whose unfailing efforts in preparing not just the people of Ukraine but our allies in NATO for this aggression has been exemplary.

As we are talking about sanctions today, and rightly so, will my right hon. Friend the Prime Minister also commit to a foreign agents registration Act? We have seen the insidious work of the United Front for China, and indeed of different outfits for Russia, to undermine our democracy and threaten our way of life. Will he please bring in that Act, and while he is doing it will he finance much more the Russian service of the BBC so the Russian people can hear the truth, not the lies being spread by their own Government?

[The Prime Minister]

I thank my hon. Friend very much. The Russian service of the BBC has done an invaluable job and it is important that it continues to be financed. I will look at the details of its package. On his proposal for a foreign agent registration law, we are indeed considering what more we can do to counter threats to this country from within.

Ukraine

Tom Tugendhat Excerpts

Tuesday 25th January 2022 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

Again, I thank the right hon. Gentleman and echo many of his sentiments. He is completely right to say that we should pursue every possible diplomatic avenue, in every appropriate forum; whether it is the NATO-Russia Council, the UN, the OSCE, the G7 or the Normandy Format, we must follow every avenue. He is right to press on what we are doing to track “dirty Russian money”, for want of a better expression. That is why we have the unexplained wealth orders and why we are bringing in measures to have a register of beneficial interests.

The right hon. Gentleman asks about SWIFT and financial transactions across the world, and there is no doubt that that would be a very potent weapon. I am afraid it can only really be deployed with the assistance of the United States—though we are in discussions about that.

The House needs to understand that one of the big issues we all face in dealing with Ukraine and with Russia is the heavy dependence, of our European friends in particular, on Russian gas. It was clear in the conversations last night that in this era of high gas prices we are bumping up against that reality. The job of our diplomacy now is to persuade and encourage our friends to go as far as they can to sort this out and to come up with a tough package of economic sanctions, because that is what the situation requires.

[Tom Tugendhat (Tonbridge and Malling) (Con)]

My right hon. Friend will recall that when he was Foreign Secretary the Foreign Affairs Committee published a report entitled “Moscow’s Gold”, which was about dirty Russian money flowing through our system and the call for us to have various registers not only of ownership but of foreign agents operating within our system. We have had a reminder only a week ago of why that is so important. Will he tell me what he is doing to work with partners across Europe to make sure that we stand together and do not just act as a voice outside the Kremlin, but make sure that Putin’s acolytes, who have profited from his kleptocratic regime, act as voices inside the Kremlin telling him what he is risking? The impressive work that the Defence Secretary has done in helping to support our Ukrainian friends could be undermined if the Kremlin does not listen to the very real danger it faces today.

[The Prime Minister]

It is absolutely right that the best way to get attention in the Kremlin and in Moscow generally is to have sanctions that are directed at the individual—like Magnitsky sanctions, for instance; that is what we will be coming forward with—as well as sanctions directed at companies that are of crucial strategic Russian interest.

Oral Answers to Questions

Tom Tugendhat Excerpts

Wednesday 15th December 2021 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

Yes, this is a massive national effort and, yes, it will be incredibly hard to achieve, but do I believe that our NHS, our GPs and our volunteers can do it? Yes, I do. That is the spirit in which the hon. Lady and the whole House should approach it. Rather than talking down our approach, I advise all Labour Members and all colleagues in this House to tell our constituents to get boosted now.

[Tom Tugendhat (Tonbridge and Malling) (Con)]

I very much welcome my right hon. Friend’s answer to my hon. Friend the Member for Harwich and North Essex (Sir Bernard Jenkin), with its emphasis on global Britain and partnership in standing up to autocracies. Does he therefore share my concern about reports that I have just got from the Foreign Office of a staff cut of 10% across the board? How is that compatible with global Britain?

[The Prime Minister]

We are investing massively in overseas aid—this country is spending £10 billion a year on overseas aid. I think that if you look at what we are doing on aid, on the Foreign Office and on Defence, we are, at £54 billion, the biggest spender on overseas activities of any country in Europe. My hon. Friend is an expert on foreign affairs, but I am assured by my right hon. Friend the Foreign Secretary that the information that has recently trickled into his ears is fake news.