Child Sex Abuse (Rotherham)

Tim Loughton Excerpts

Tuesday 2nd September 2014 Commons Chamber

[Mrs May]

Yes. I commend the hon. Lady for the careful and thoughtful way in which she has responded to this appalling report and these appalling revelations. We will certainly work with her. As I have said, I have already spoken to the chief constable of South Yorkshire police about the ongoing investigations there. Sadly, we must recognise that similar investigations are also taking place in other parts of the country. We are beginning to unveil the extent of the problem across the country, and in so doing we can now start to get to grips with it.

[Tim Loughton (East Worthing and Shoreham) (Con)]

The scale of the revelations in Rotherham was truly shocking but, alas, came as little surprise to those of us who have been railing against institutionalised political correctness, as the Home Secretary put it, for so long. More Rotherhams will come to light, which is why the Government put in place the child sexual exploitation action plan in November 2011 to co-ordinate activities to intervene and prevent. Will she update the House on the progress of that co-ordinated action plan? In particular, will she tell us whether anyone is monitoring the plan to ensure that every local safeguarding children board in the country—well beyond Rotherham—has a fit-for-purpose action plan to intervene, prevent and prosecute in every part of the country?

[Mrs May]

The Secretary of State for Education has been looking into the local safeguarding board plans across the country, and it is true to say that they are of variable quality. One of the pieces of work that we will be discussing in the ministerial team—I know that my right hon. Friend is already considering it—is how we can raise the quality of those plans. This is not just about the quality of the plans, however; we need to ensure that something happens behind them. It is all very well putting words on a piece of paper, but it is essential that work is then done to put them into practice.

Child Abuse

Tim Loughton Excerpts

Thursday 17th July 2014 Commons Chamber

[Mrs May]

First, may I say that the right hon. Lady is absolutely right to commend the work of police forces, the National Crime Agency and CEOP command? This work is not easy for police officers to undertake. It is very difficult for those who have to look at the evidence of child abuse images. We should recognise the valuable and important work they do, and the work that goes on around them to ensure that perpetrators and others involved in this horrendous crime are brought to justice.

I have made it clear that the work of NCA investigations is ongoing. I am therefore not in a position to indicate anything in relation to how many suspects they might be looking at or the action I might take against those suspects. Those are operational matters and decisions for the NCA to take in consideration with the various police forces involved, but I can assure Members that this is an ongoing investigation.

The right hon. Lady referred to a number of matters, for example the increase in the number of sex offences being reported. That is indeed the case, but what I think we are seeing in the figures is a number of people coming forward with historic cases of sex offences. While that does have an impact on the figures, I think we would all welcome the fact that there are more people now who feel comfortable in being able to come forward with allegations of these sorts of offences. For too long, people have felt that they would not be believed, and have been hiding their own experiences and keeping them to themselves, rather than surfacing them. It is important that they are coming forward. In some of the historic cases that have gone to trial, some perpetrators have been brought to justice. They have been charged and prosecuted as a result of people coming forward.

We are, of course, making sure that resources are available. In my response to the right hon. Lady’s question, I indicated that CEOP resources, which are specialist and expertise resources, are being made available to other police forces. The child abuse inquiry is being set up to ensure that we can learn the lessons from the various reviews that have taken place into historic cases. As part of that, I expect it will want to look at what is happening today: whether the lessons from the past are already being dealt with, or whether there are still gaps in what we need to do. Obviously, one of the areas that has increased in recent times is online abuse.

At the Prime Minister’s summit in November last year, we made it absolutely clear that we are determined to stamp out online child sexual abuse. That is why we have worked with industry to ensure that search engines block images, videos and pathways to child abuse from blacklist search terms used by paedophiles. We are developing a child abuse image database, which will help officers to work more effectively together to close the net on paedophiles and ensure that internet companies can better identify, block and remove illegal images. We have also established the UK-US taskforce to counter online child exploitation. Through that, we are drawing on the brightest and best minds in the industry, law enforcement and academia to stop the internet being used to abuse children. We saw from the National Crime Agency’s operations yesterday the value of setting it up as a strong crime-fighting organisation that has already shown its ability to root out perpetrators of this sort of crime, to deal with them and ultimately to bring them to justice.

[Tim Loughton (East Worthing and Shoreham) (Con)]

May I add my congratulations to the NCA for yesterday’s successful operation? It is worth noting that of the 660 arrested, very few were people already on the sex offenders register. This is very difficult work and a reminder that we are talking about current abuse going on, in addition to the historic child abuse that we must now investigate. May I suggest to my right hon. Friend that rather than coming forward with a new action plan, as has been suggested, she gives this House a progress report on the child sexual exploitation action plan, which I launched in November 2011, which was multi-agency and multi-departmental? It has been exceedingly successful and no doubt played a major part in bringing a lot of people to justice in yesterday’s operation.

[Mrs May]

May I commend my hon. Friend for the work he has done in this area over the years? He and I joined this House at the same time, and I know that he has consistently led on child protection issues and has put a lot of work into this area, both when he was children’s Minister and outside that time, and he continues to do so. I will certainly be happy to ask the Minister for Crime Prevention to report to the House on the child exploitation action plan that my hon. Friend developed as the children’s Minister and also on how the group that was set up subsequently is taking that work forward, looking at how it can build on it in a number of other ways, so that we are always looking to ensure that we have the best possible response.

Oral Answers to Questions

Tim Loughton Excerpts

Monday 7th July 2014 Commons Chamber

[Norman Baker]

We published a new victims code in December 2013, which sets out the entitlements of victims of the most serious crimes. Other steps are being taken, such as the videoed pre-trial cross-examination pilot, to ensure that we make it as easy as possible for children to give evidence and to ensure that they are not re-traumatised by the process.

[Tim Loughton (East Worthing and Shoreham) (Con)]

This question would more normally be heard at Education questions because tackling child abuse is about not just detecting crime but prevention, education and safeguarding children. Will the Minister say what arrangements exist for the Department for Education to co-ordinate that action?

[Norman Baker]

As the former Minister for children knows, there are existing and strong links between various Departments, including the Department for Education and the Department of Health, to ensure that such matters are dealt with on a cross-departmental basis. We intend to continue and strengthen those links between Departments.

--- Later in debate ---

[Norman Baker]

That is a matter I take very seriously, not least because of my previous role in the Department for Transport. We are engaged with mobile phone companies on a whole range of issues to ensure that their products are responsibly used, but the hon. Lady makes a valid point, which I will happily take forward. If she has any particular suggestions, I would be happy to hear them

[Tim Loughton (East Worthing and Shoreham) (Con)]

Will the Home Secretary undertake to review the workings of police information notices, or PINs? Thousands have been issued by constabularies, including to myself, but in too many cases they do not even follow the Association of Chief Police Officers guidance, to the extent that people are not even aware that they are under investigation and therefore cannot defend themselves.

[Damian Green]

I am always happy to continue to look at the PINs system and how it is operating. I am very aware that my hon. Friend has had his own issues with the Sussex police in this regard and I am happy to keep it under close review.

Child Abuse

Tim Loughton Excerpts

Monday 7th July 2014 Commons Chamber

[Mrs May]

There is, in a sense, a paradox here, in that a Member of Parliament can go into a school without a CRB check, but the inquiry panel will be considering how we can protect children, whether there are gaps anywhere, and whether we need to fill those gaps. I expect its report to identify areas in which the panel considers it necessary, potentially, to legislate further in order to protect children.

[Tim Loughton (East Worthing and Shoreham) (Con)]

I commend my right hon. Friend for—uniquely, it would seem—understanding the gravity of these never-ending revelations and the need for transparency and urgency in the investigation of them, and gently regretting the rather partisan approach taken by the shadow Home Secretary, which contrasts with the all-party spirit of the 141 Members who called for the inquiry.

Will the panel have the power to summon evidence and subpoena witnesses, will it be able to go where it needs to go, and, crucially, will it be able to trigger criminal investigations of anyone who is found to be responsible for covering up such acts, rather than just the perpetrators?

[Mrs May]

I thank my hon. Friend for his comments. I also commend him for the work that he has done for many years, and not just as Minister for Children: I remember how assiduous he was during our time in opposition in trying to ensure that children were properly protected, and that issues such as the abuse and exploitation of children. and their lack of safety, were taken into account and dealt with properly.

If the panel found allegations that it believed would be dealt with more appropriately by the police through a criminal investigation, I would expect the allegations to be passed to the police for that purpose. The panel will be able to call witnesses. Its initial structure will not enable it to require witnesses to come before it, and it will have to consider whether calling a witness would in any way jeopardise or prejudice a criminal investigation that was taking place if that individual was involved in the investigation. However, as I have said, if the chairman decides to recommend that the inquiry panel be turned into a full statutory inquiry under the Inquiries Act 2005—which would, of course, have the right to require witnesses to come forward—we will make it absolutely clear that we will go down that route.

Asylum Seekers (Support)

Tim Loughton Excerpts

Thursday 10th April 2014 Commons Chamber

[James Brokenshire]

This country has a proud tradition of providing humanitarian assistance in regions that are in need, and I have highlighted the support that has been given as part of the Syrian crisis. All Governments have a proud record on consistently upholding our asylum system and ensuring that protection is provided to those fleeing persecution who come to this country, and that those who are destitute are given appropriate assistance, which is what this Government are doing and will maintain.

[Tim Loughton (East Worthing and Shoreham) (Con)]

My hon. Friend is right not to be bounced into an early decision on yesterday’s complicated judgment, because we need to get the right balance between fulfilling our humanitarian responsibilities and ensuring that the system is not open to abuse. What representations has he had from respected children’s charities about their assessment of the impact these measures may be having on the welfare of children involved?

[James Brokenshire]

Representations are made on a range of different issues, and clearly we pay particular attention to the welfare of children. I understand and recognise my hon. Friend’s continuing interest in and focus on these matters. We keep these matters under consideration, but as I have already said, the level of asylum support provided to children properly recognises their additional needs and requirements, and we will keep our focus on that.

Public Administration Select Committee

Tim Loughton Excerpts

Thursday 10th April 2014 Commons Chamber

[Mr Deputy Speaker]

Last but certainly not least, I call Tim Loughton.

[Tim Loughton (East Worthing and Shoreham) (Con)]

I, too, commend my hon. Friend and the PASC for this forthright and uncomfortable report. Is he aware that the figures are being distorted further by the police’s increasingly arbitrary use of police information notices? When an individual perceives that harassment has taken place, often devoid of a common-sense test of whether a complaint has substance or is vexatious, according to Sussex police, at least, there is no need for them to follow their own guidance as it is only guidance. Even more worryingly, complaints about comments made in this House by hon. Members can be registered as a hate incident by police despite our parliamentary privilege.

[Mr Jenkin]

The case that ended up in court as a result of the incident concerning my hon. Friend—

[Tim Loughton]

Not in court.

[Mr Jenkin]

It did not finish up in court—that was the point, wasn’t it? It was privileged. I thought the incident was bizarre and showed an extraordinary lack of understanding of where the police sit in the constitutional framework of this country. It seemed to me to lack common sense and I agree with my hon. Friend.

I should say for the record that Cleveland, Surrey and Lincolnshire had a far higher no-crime rate than the national average when it comes to reported rapes. My hon. Friend the Member for Gainsborough should be asking his police why they record rape and then downgrade it so much more often than the vast majority of constabularies.

Domestic Violence (Police Response)

Tim Loughton Excerpts

Thursday 10th April 2014 Westminster Hall

[Tim Loughton (East Worthing and Shoreham) (Con)]

I congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Brentford and Isleworth (Mary Macleod) on securing this debate on a really important subject that is not given enough airtime in the House. It is encouraging the see the strong turnout on the Government Benches. I had not intended to speak, but my hon. Friend’s comments have spurred me on to add some of my own.

I want to look at the matter from the perspective of the effect on children. The simple fact is that in the United Kingdom the police receive a call every minute from the public for assistance because of domestic violence. That leads to the police receiving an estimated 1,300 calls every day, or more than 570,000 every year. We have heard that recognition of the problem is improving, but it is still a huge one and responsible for 14% of all violent crimes in this country.

I am particularly concerned about the estimate that at least 750,000 children every year witness domestic violence, and that has long-term implications, particularly on young children and how they will go through their childhood and adult life. It is important to protect women, and sometimes men, who may be victims of domestic violence; it is equally important to protect children from being influenced by it at an impressionable age.

Children who have witnessed violence and abuse are much more likely to become involved in a violent and abusive relationships as adults. Children tend to copy the behaviour of their parents. Boys learn from their fathers to be violent to women, and girls learn from their mothers that violence is to be expected and something that they just have to put up with. That is the most depressing response, and I saw it during the many hours and days I spent out on cases with social workers in my previous role.

When women and young girls who have been subjected to violence are asked why they did not just leave or do something about it, the response is along the lines of “I thought that’s what happens and is part of a relationship is about.” It is appallingly depressing that people can be conditioned to think that that is what they should expect, and that it is part of the deal of being in a relationship, whether married, cohabiting or whatever. That is why it is so important to get across to people from an early age that it is not the norm, and should not, must not and will not be tolerated. We must ensure that they are aware of how to access the power to do something about it because the long-term implications are frightening.

According to the Home Office, 200,000 children—1.8%—are living in households where there is a known risk of domestic violence, and that is probably an underestimate because of under-reporting of the problem. The definition of “harm” that is used in care proceedings under the Children Act 1989 includes

“impairment suffered from seeing or hearing the ill-treatment of another”.

That is not used enough, and we must ensure that our professionals are aware of how they should use it as a consideration for intervention.

Many public inquiries into the death of children in recent years have shown that the men responsible for such deaths often have a history of violence towards their female partners. A study of 139 serious case reviews—official reports when a child is harmed fatally or seriously—in England between 2009 and 2011 showed that 63% were found to have domestic abuse as a risk factor.

Some years ago, I spent a week as a social worker in Stockport in a sort of undercover operation. I went out with social workers on real cases away from the glare of television cameras, dressing down for the occasion. I saw at first hand the nature of many of the problems that those of us who have been Ministers have to deal with in legislation to provide the professions with the powers to do something about it. I knew that domestic violence was a big factor in child protection cases, but that week really brought home to me how many child protection cases have domestic violence as a key element—probably more than three quarters of cases have domestic violence at the heart of child protection issues.

What I saw in Stockport, which has a first-class child protection team, was that the addition of a domestic violence specialist social worker in the team made a huge difference. When new social workers in particular suspected a domestic violence element, they could get wise advice, and there were proper procedures for becoming involved in such cases, and recognising the symptoms of domestic violence and the effect it was having on children. They were better placed to produce a plan of action for taking the woman and children to a place of safety.

Training to deal with domestic violence should be a key part of social work training, particularly when it involves children. The multi-agency approach of that child protection team included a domestic violence specialist social worker, a family nurse partnership specialist representing the local health facilities and a police officer. They came together every morning to assess cases and had a wealth of intelligence and approaches for how best to intervene on behalf of vulnerable children. There are some good examples—Stockport is not an isolated one—of how the practice can work to provide much better and earlier intervention on behalf of abused women and children.

Children who experience severe maltreatment by a parent or guardian are between 2.7 and 2.9 times more likely also to have witnessed family violence. According to a report from the NSPCC, under-11s who have experienced physical abuse by a parent or guardian were almost five times more likely to have witnessed family violence. Another NSPCC study showed that 12% of under-11s, 18% of 11 to 17-year-olds and 24% of 18 to 24-year-olds had been exposed to domestic abuse between adults in their home during childhood, and that adult males were the perpetrators in 94% of cases when one parent had physically abused another.

Violence in the home may result in children suffering long-term emotional and psychological damage. The very young may show physical signs of distress. They may become anxious or depressed, have difficulty sleeping, have nightmares or flashbacks, complain of physical symptoms such as tummy aches, and start to wet their bed. They may have temper tantrums, behave as though they were much younger than they are, have problems at school or start truanting, become aggressive, internalise their distress and withdraw from other people, and have a lowered sense of self-worth. Older children may start to use alcohol or drugs, begin to self-harm by taking overdoses or cutting themselves, and develop an eating disorder. All that may be down to being an unwitting participant in a home where domestic violence is being inflicted on them indirectly, and sometimes also directly. The physical and psychological implications for children are therefore deep-seated and not just a bit of a worry or a bit of a nuisance.

One could say that if parents are prepared to allow their children to be exposed to those sorts of experiences, they do not deserve to be parents and the state needs to step in—certainly against the abusive parent who is inflicting the violence on a woman and the children.

Although many parents report trying to shelter their children from marital violence, research suggests that children in violent homes commonly see, hear and intervene in episodes of marital violence—they try to step in—in some cases thinking, “Is that my fault?” Children may get a hang-up that they are, in some way, contributing to or responsible for the horrible things that are going in their homes.

As I said, domestic abuse accounts for 14% of all violent crime. On average, women contact 11 agencies before they receive the help they need. For black women, that figure rises, appallingly, to 17 agencies before they receive the help they need, according to a report from Barnardo’s.

We are talking specifically about the police, and interestingly, we have just discussed in the Chamber the Public Administration Committee’s report on the reliability—or not—of police crime statistics. The Minister made a brief response to that report. The Chairman of the Committee, my hon. Friend the Member for Harwich and North Essex (Mr Jenkin), mentioned the under-reporting of rape and downgrading, or attempted downgrading, of allegations of rape, to flatter the crime figures. The figures that we have on domestic violence and, in its extreme form, rape—particularly ongoing rape—may underestimate the real state of the problem. It is absolutely key that the police are completely honest about the extent of the problem that is reported to them, that it is properly investigated as the serious crime that it is, and that it is pursued and investigated, and that charges are brought wherever possible. We all know the appalling record we still have on the number of rape charge cases ending in successful convictions in court. We need to do a lot more on that.

According to Women’s Aid, 30% of domestic violence starts when a woman falls pregnant. Pregnancy can exacerbate the severity and frequency of the violence and the woman’s abdomen is often specifically targeted during attacks, according to the charity website, protectingchildren.org.uk. Domestic violence has been identified as a prime cause of miscarriage or stillbirth. I find that appalling, particularly because yesterday I spoke to one of my constituents who suffered a stillbirth and several miscarriages—she is campaigning with me for a change in the law to recognise the registration of stillbirths under 24 weeks—but for someone to have that imposed on them by the violence of the partner who is the potential father of that child is doubly appalling.

Domestic violence is also a major factor leading to death in or related to pregnancy and childbirth. During the three years 2006 to 2008, 34 of the 261 women who died around the time of giving birth showed signs of domestic abuse, 11 of those having been murdered by partners or family members. Previous reports indicated an even higher proportion of deaths in childbirth being related to domestic abuse. Between four and nine women in every 100 are abused during their pregnancies and/or after giving birth.

Given the influence of and contact with midwives, GPs, health workers, clinicians doing scans, health visitors—and the increasing number of health visitors that we are trying to recruit—those professionals must be the early-warning systems to see, identify and know how to identify signs of domestic violence before it is too late, and before some of those extreme outcomes come into play.

[Nicola Blackwood]

Will my hon. Friend give way?

[Tim Loughton]

I am delighted to give way, so I can have a breather.

[Nicola Blackwood]

Earlier, my hon. Friend mentioned the importance of multi-agency risk assessment conferences and multi-agency working. One problem that we experienced in Oxford with a similar but related issue of child sexual exploitation was the difficulty that different agencies had in sharing important information and intelligence that would have resulted in earlier identification of victims, and the ability to intervene and protect those victims at an earlier stage and bring prosecutions in those cases. I believe that exactly that kind of problem is preventing better work from happening with domestic violence. As my hon. Friend said, we should have better information sharing between GP services, health services, social workers and the police, so that victims can be identified at the earliest possible stage and action can be taken. There is often a feeling that sharing that information would break data protection law, which is not, in fact, the case. I wonder whether he would comment on that.

[Tim Loughton]

My hon. Friend, who has a great interest in the subject, is absolutely right in her final comment. It is an excuse. Data protection has for too long in child protection cases, just as in domestic violence cases, been used as a reason for not acting, and that just should not be the case. Nothing under data protection prevents people from sharing the data in a responsible manner with other proper professionals, be it through MARACs or other structures, when clearly it is in the interests of the potential victims or victims that they are looking after.

We have a very good MARAC in West Sussex, where the agencies work well together. I also flag up MASHs—multi-agency safeguarding hubs. I visited many of them round the country and what matters there is getting all the professionals around the table eyeballing each other and talking to each other. It was interesting to visit the MASH in Haringey, an authority that has gone through a pretty traumatic time, with baby P, Victoria Climbié and others. I saw the way that its MASH works: when an incident comes in, around the same table very quickly will be social workers, police, people from the housing department and from education. They will all be sharing information quickly. They do not have to go through protocols about getting information; they will be on the phone and on the computer getting that information.

I also saw that in Stockport. People knew far more from talking to each other and they rarely had to go to the computer. If they did, it was usually to check something that they knew already. That is why it is so important that professionals talk to each other face to face, rather than through the internet and electronic communications. There is no substitute for the experience of professionals who have been on the front line—and often know a fact about a family going back many years—and can come up with the right information. They are more likely to make the right judgment and intervention.

I want to finish with three points about what should be done. We need to make this a high-profile taboo subject. Mariella Frostrup rightly wrote in an article some time ago:

“We need a Man Army”

that is able to stand up and say that domestic violence is “for cowards.” We know that an awful lot of people in this country—particularly young people—are unduly influenced by celebrities, and we need a few celebrities to come forward and say exactly that and use their influence for good, rather than appearing too often in our Sunday tabloid newspapers creating the wrong impressions for our young people to follow.

The United Nations’ “Real men don’t hit women” campaign is another thing that we need to make available to our young people. I absolutely echo the comments of my hon. Friend the Member for Brentford and Isleworth that we need better education. We need better hands-on education about respectful relationships, and we need to tailor it particularly to certain black and minority ethnic communities where we need to handle the issue very carefully.

Children are better able to cope and recover when they get the right help and support, for example, from other family members, peers and school. Some children find it helpful to speak to a professional—a trained counsellor or whoever—but it is not uncommon for victims of domestic violence and abuse to take a long time to recognise what is happening. For some families, domestic violence and abuse are a normal part of family life. Even when children realise that a situation is wrong, shame can make it difficult to speak out. As my hon. Friend also said, there is often a fear that children may be taken into care if a woman comes forward to say that there is a domestic violence problem.

We need to ensure that social workers can recognise who is to blame and are as open as possible, so that those women can open up to them without fearing that they will lose their children through no fault of their own. Having a trusting relationship outside the home can increase the chances that someone affected by domestic violence and abuse will manage to talk about their experience. Sharing the secret with someone outside the family is the first step in breaking out of the cycle of violence and abuse. We need to ensure that there are trusted confidants. In school, they will be teachers, school nurses and perhaps social workers working in schools, of which there are good examples. Children will be able to go to them, trust them and pour out their experience, so that someone can recognise that and do something about it.

Secondly, I have a concern about the legal aid changes. We had an event in the House on that issue last week. Necessary changes are being made in legal aid, and domestic violence cases should be exempted from them, but in some cases that is not happening. In some cases, women are not getting the professional support that they need to ensure that they are getting the full protection of the law. That is not acceptable. I hope that my right hon. Friend the Chancellor of the Exchequer will be able to look at the matter in more detail to see whether there are unintended consequences from some of the changes being made to the availability of legal aid.

My third point was also made by my hon. Friend the Member for Brentford and Isleworth in opening the debate. We need to ensure that there is better training of police and other professionals working with all the agencies. I am very glad to say that in my area and that of the Minister, largely due to the new police and crime commissioner, Katy Bourne, domestic violence has become one of the priorities. She has done a lot of work to ensure that Sussex police are sensitive to and able to cope with incidents of domestic violence. I pay tribute to the excellent women’s refuge services in Adur and Worthing in my constituency.

Housing is a particularly important element in all this. Too often, women are confined in accommodation where they are experiencing domestic violence because housing services are not liaising properly with the police, social workers and others to ensure that those women are appropriately relocated out of harm’s way, which often means across local authority boundaries. We need to have a better networking system between local authorities, so that safe accommodation can be made available, often at short notice.

[Mary Macleod]

I am very glad that my hon. Friend has raised the issue of children, because that is a critical part of the debate. He is considering housing. Part of the problem is often that a woman will go into a refuge for some time with her children, but then they end up getting put in temporary accommodation until something else is found. That is still unsettling for the children. I want to push councils to try to get families quickly into not temporary accommodation, but more stable housing, so that the lives of the children are not disrupted again and they can go on to live fulfilling lives.

[Tim Loughton]

Again, my hon. Friend is absolutely right, because we look at this issue as primarily about getting the victim out of harm’s way and into a place of safety—that is clearly the biggest priority—as well as the children. However, that situation may pertain for some time, and children need stability. They need continuity in their education and access to other people and friends around them. We therefore need to ensure that there is some long-term planning so that the children can still access all the services and facilities that they need as children growing up, but in safety. There are complications with that, but again, early intervention involving housing services, police, social workers and specialist domestic violence people and charities can make the process easier, rather than it just being a case of out of the frying pan into the fire.

I take the point made by my hon. Friend the Member for Braintree (Mr Newmark) about psychological violence, because the issue is not just bruises and broken bones, although they are easier to see. As important in many cases but much less easy to see are the effects of the psychological violence of a controlling person—coercive control, as my hon. Friend puts it. We need to be better at detecting that. That means better psychological training for some of our social workers and more specialist domestic violence social workers who are able to bring in all the different aspects of the issue, as I have said.

There is also, of course, the question of what we do about sexual violence. We have talked about physical violence. I have just mentioned psychological violence. There is a worrying and growing trend of sexual violence. In this Chamber earlier this week, we had a very interesting debate about the pornification of the young and the influence that violent pornography in particular is having on impressionable young children. I remember a particularly appalling case on “Woman’s Hour” in which a 15-year-old girl had been forced to watch violently pornographic films, videos, by her boyfriend and then to re-enact the sex that had been portrayed in them. That was seen as normal by the boy, but when the girl was asked, “Why didn’t you just tell him where to go?”, her response was, “Well, I didn’t think I had the right to say no.” Again, that was a very depressing response. We need to ensure that our girls in particular have the confidence and the know-how to be able to say no and mean no, and that our young boys do not normalise pornographic violence and unacceptable hard-core sex as what growing up is all about. That goes back to the education process as well.

[Mike Freer]

In terms of helping to stem domestic violence from a very early age, does my hon. Friend agree that our education system needs to be teaching the importance of express consent in our schools, rather than just this implicit “You have to say no”? Boys need to be taught that express consent is required.

[Tim Loughton]

My hon. Friend is right. I alluded to that in relation to respect for relationships and what that means. It needs to be learned by boys and it needs to be learned by girls. We are talking about another aspect of the cancer that is domestic violence that needs to be spotted early. We need to protect the victims, but we also need to ensure that we can protect the children against the long-term and highly damaging consequences of being in a home afflicted by domestic violence.

[Katy Clark (in the Chair)]

I remind hon. Members that interventions should be brief.

Child Sexual Exploitation

Tim Loughton Excerpts

Tuesday 13th November 2012 Commons Chamber

[Nicola Blackwood]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for his intervention. We should ask the Minister to respond to it, because clearly some of these people are victims of some of the most serious offences that can be imagined. It is not the automatic nature of the programme that we need to consider; rather, that these people are able to access the support when they need it.

The Government have not been idle on this issue. Tim Loughton, who led in creating the tackling child sexual exploitation strategy last November, and Ed Timpson, who now leads on it, deserve credit for the work they have done. However, we are coming from a very low base. The prevalence of child sexual exploitation and the very poor recognition of it by relevant agencies was highlighted in Barnardo’s “Puppet on a string” report as recently as January 2011. So although the Government deserve credit for the action they have taken—the strategy is an effective response—in many areas we still do not have effective plans in place.

Now, counter-intuitively, where areas are taking action the picture seems to look worse, rather than better, as more victims come forward and more perpetrators emerge. We are familiar with the pattern from other hidden crimes, such as domestic abuse; we should not be surprised that as public awareness increases, so reporting increases. We should not confuse that with increased risk. We should be aware that the high level of national media attention is artificially pushing up reporting levels, but if increased reporting does not lead to better prevention, detection and prosecution, the bravery of those victims who come forward will be for nothing. Simply identifying gaps in provision will not be enough to avoid that outcome; we also need to find practical solutions and make sure that they are actually driven through on the ground.

[Tim Loughton (East Worthing and Shoreham) (Con)]

I am grateful for my hon. Friend’s comments. She rightly makes the point that a sign of success is that more of these cases are coming to court. The fact that the Rochdale perpetrators were given 77 years in total—a tough sentence—sends out a strong message that the police and other agencies are now taking these crimes seriously, that the perpetrators are more likely to be brought to book than they were before and that they will be punished properly for the revolting crimes they have committed.

[Nicola Blackwood]

I thank my hon. Friend for his point. Although we must indentify where there have been failings in the system and root out systems that are not working, it is important that we do not vilify places that take action and bring perpetrators to justice. If we do that, we will put off local authorities and police from taking these cases to court.

Government can only do so much. It is generally accepted that local services, led by the local safeguarding children boards and police, have to lead on responding to child sexual exploitation. But before they can do that, they are going to have to accept that this issue affects them and is worthy of being prioritised in the current economic climate. There are still local authorities that do not think this affects their area. I do not cast any stones. I cannot express the shock I had when the news about the Oxford case emerged, and I do not think I was alone. Organised sexual exploitation on this scale was, to me, something that happened somewhere else—in inner cities with gangs or in cities with grinding poverty. What is more, to me, it did not happen to local girls; it happened to trafficked girls from Cambodia, eastern Europe or west Africa—or just any other place. What I have learned during this process is that it is not so much that it is everywhere, as that it could happen anywhere. The deputy Children’s Commissioner, who is halfway through a two-year inquiry into group and gang-associated child sexual exploitation, said in evidence to the Select Committee:

“what I am uncovering is that the sexual exploitation of children is happening all over the country. As one police officer who was a lead in a very big investigation in a very lovely, leafy, rural part of the country said to me, there is not a town, village or hamlet in which children are not being sexually exploited.”

Peter Davies, the chief executive of the Child Exploitation and Online Protection Centre confirmed her view, although I have to say that he thought that hamlets might be pushing it.

In that context, it is not enough to have plans, regulations and guidance pushed down from government—we had that in 2009 and it did not work. What we need to know is that effective multi-agency teams are on the ground, trained to recognise risk factors and able to pursue not only prevention and early intervention, but investigation and prosecution. This is what the Government have been trying to encourage since last year, but it turns out that it is quite hard to track local progress on the ground.

--- Later in debate ---

[Kevin Brennan (Cardiff West) (Lab)]

In agreeing with that point, may I ask the hon. Lady whether she thinks it was therefore a good idea not to proceed with ContactPoint, which was designed so that that data could be shared easily by professionals—[Interruption.]

[Tim Loughton]

That is absolutely wrong.

[Nicola Blackwood]

I hear two experts behind me, my hon. Friends the Members for Beverley and Holderness (Mr Stuart) and for East Worthing and Shoreham (Tim Loughton), commenting on the detail of that point, so I will allow them to comment further in their speeches. I have spoken at length to CEOP and other agencies since then and they have not given me any indication that ContactPoint would have improved their response.

--- Later in debate ---

[Tim Loughton (East Worthing and Shoreham) (Con)]

I will start by apologising for the fact that I have to be in my constituency later today and so, alas, will be unable to stay for the wind-ups. I have written to Mr Speaker about that and apologised to the Front Benchers and to my hon. Friend the Member for Oxford West and Abingdon (Nicola Blackwood), who moved the motion.

I congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Oxford West and Abingdon and the hon. Member for Stockport (Ann Coffey) on securing the debate and on the powerful and well-informed points they made. I know from bitter experience, over many years in opposition and then in government, that debates in this House on children’s issues or on safeguarding children are hard to come by. At last we are having a debate on child protection and child sexual exploitation. Perhaps that explains why the Press Gallery is deserted. This is not about celebrities, the structural overhaul of the BBC or senior politicians possibly being connected with paedophilia; it is about child sexual exploitation, a subject of huge concern to all our constituents and members of the public and something that the National Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Children says affects at least 64 children every day of every year, one in four of them aged under 11. ChildLine has had almost 16,000 contacts on just that subject. It is hugely important. Frankly, the recent media circus with sensationalist celebrity scalp hunting has really undermined the importance and severity of the issue we are at last discussing today. I think that the media should take note of that.

I must say that it is puzzling and disappointing that the Minister responsible for child protection will not respond to the debate and, indeed, that no Minister from the responsible Department, the Department for Education, is on the Front Bench. One of the responses to the “Puppet on a string” report produced by Barnardo’s was that one Minister should have overriding responsibility across Government for tackling child sexual exploitation. I took on that responsibility in my previous ministerial role and I think that my successor has also done so. Perhaps the Minister who is here today could explain whether that arrangement has changed. It is disappointing and puzzling, as I have said.

The media circus of recent days has concentrated on the BBC and political links, so it has gone almost unnoticed that there have been further arrests in the Rochdale case, an arrest in the Savile case and arrests regarding a further paedophile ring operating in Leeds. As my hon. Friend the Member for Oxford West and Abingdon said, the fact that more of these cases are hitting the news and coming to court is a sign of success in that they are being taken more seriously by the police and other agencies, who are pursuing them and making the charges stick. We need much more publicity about that.

This is an important issue now, but it was also important in the 1970s, 1980s and 1990s, when, as has become apparent in recent days, we failed to look at it properly. Even now, the NSPCC estimates that only one in 10 cases of child sexual abuse is reported. Back in the ’70s and ’80s we would have been lucky if one in 100 was reported, let alone prosecuted and the perpetrators brought to book.

Let us take stock of recent history. An almost beatified celebrity in the form of Jimmy Savile has now been connected with some horrendous crimes involving young children. Other celebrities might be involved, and it might involve practices within the BBC. Yet when it was going on it was apparently an era of “nudge, nudge” and people saying, “Well, it’s just Jimmy—that sort of thing happens.” In fact, “nudge, nudge” and “That’s just Jimmy” was about serious sexual crimes against children, as we now recognise them to be. That is how it appears from the information that is emerging, although there is still much investigating to be done.

We then had the rumours about links with high-level politicians, which so far have not been based on any properly researched evidence. I have to say that certain allegations that were made without that evidence, both in this Chamber and in poorly researched “Newsnight” programmes, have not helped this case. However, as I said some weeks ago, why should we be surprised if there are people in political life connected with child abuse? It has affected the Church and it has affected children’s homes; it has involved people in positions of trust supposedly caring for vulnerable children. It is affecting the entertainment industry. Why should we be surprised if politicians are also involved? This is a cancer that has gone on for many years, under the radar, across a whole range of institutions that we did not previously consider.

The Waterhouse inquiry, as my hon. Friend the Member for Oxford West and Abingdon said, was very thorough. It was supposed to take a year and took over three years, and it uncovered 12,000 documents and hundreds of witnesses. It is right that we should make sure that all the evidence from that inquiry has been properly looked at. However, since last week we have had an inquiry into an inquiry. That is why I take the view, as I did some weeks ago when the Savile allegations started to come to light, that we need an overarching inquiry that goes back to the ’70s, ’80s and ’90s to look at what happened, why it happened, what stopped it happening, and what has changed to make sure that the perpetrators, who may still be at large, are at last brought to book. Importantly, it would ensure that the victims come forward and this time have their stories taken seriously and believed and, where appropriate, acted on, so that, we hope, they get some sort of closure. Even more importantly, it would help us to ensure that in 2012 every institution that has significant contact with children and young people has a robust child protection policy in place that can make these horrendous crimes much less likely.

Only today in my own area, in the diocese of Chichester, as a result of the report by Lady Butler-Sloss into allegations of child abuse, there have been two further arrests involving a former bishop. This goes everywhere, and we must not be blind to looking into every nook and cranny and under every carpet where it has been swept in the past.

[Sir Paul Beresford (Mole Valley) (Con)]

Does my hon. Friend agree, from his experience, that the age group of victims goes from 16 to birth, so a considerable proportion of the victims cannot speak out? In the baby P case, we used legislation against witnesses that has since been expanded. We might want to look at that aspect so that those who stand by and watch, and do not speak out, could be brought to book as well.

[Tim Loughton]

My hon. Friend makes a good point. As my hon. Friend the Member for Oxford West and Abingdon said, the Government cannot solve this on their own. The stories we have heard over recent weeks and months have made it clear to all of us that everybody has a responsibility of vigilance, while those in positions of care and trust have a greater responsibility than the rest of us. There is now no excuse for not realising that child abuse goes on and no excuse for someone not doing anything about it when they see it happening, or suspect that it might be happening, in their street, community, school, church, business, or whatever it might be.

[Pauline Latham (Mid Derbyshire) (Con)]

Very often the children who have been abused have gone to people who are in a position to help them, but, no matter what age they are, they have not been believed. Even if they have been believed, they have been told, “It’s not something that we need to worry about because it is about somebody famous”, or if it is not somebody famous they have not been believed and nobody has taken notice of their cry for help. We must help children who are being abused to be believed, because they know what is going on.

[Tim Loughton]

My hon. Friend is absolutely right. One of the scandals was the fact that in some cases children were not only told to shut up or not believed but threatened physically with violence if they kept on coming forward with their stories. People said, “They’re children—what do they know about it? It’s Jimmy”, or whoever it might be, “so just go away and forget about it.” That must not happen now. We have organisations such as Childline and some excellent children’s charities that have people working in the community to whom, we hope, children can go. We have better procedures in schools, with teachers trained to look out for this sort of thing—to listen and to be able to know what to do when these stories come to light. The biggest scandal is the fact that these children were completely rebuffed in the past and not taken seriously; that must not happen in 2012.

[Nicola Blackwood]

One of the issues that has particularly shocked me is the attitude of some of those in the agencies that are supposed to be protecting these children in saying that they are making bad choices, as though there is a choice and a question of consent when children as young as 11 and 12 enter into sexual relationships with adult men. We must address that within all these agencies, because it cannot be allowed to continue.

[Tim Loughton]

My hon. Friend rightly made that point, as I have done on numerous occasions, including, I think, before the Home Affairs Committee on which she serves. It came out of the Rochdale inquiry, among others. The possibility that a 13 or 14-year-old girl who was being sexually abused by a 48 or 50-year-old man she did not know, plied with cigarettes and alcohol, and taken to strange places and passed around various different men could have been doing that as a result of a lifestyle choice is absolutely incredible. It also says something about how our society looks at the way in which our children grow up in this century and when they stop being children and start to become adults. As far as I am concerned, until people are 18 they are still children and young people; we have responsibilities and duties towards them, and they need looking out for. Any institution or professional who thinks that such a child could have made that decision of their own volition and in their own interests should be sacked and has no place whatsoever in any safeguarding role with children.

I will quickly make progress, Madam Deputy Speaker, because I remember your warning, and many others want to speak who are much better equipped than I am. The reason I suggest we need an overarching inquiry is that we now have a double-figure amount of inquiries—within the BBC, the health service, the police, and children’s homes, including in the Channel Islands. For the next three to six months—a year or so—we will incrementally have reports from these reviews and inquiries, and I am sure that we will have more of them. I know that various other investigations—responsible investigations—are going on within the media and other areas that will uncover a whole load of other aspects that we had not previously considered. Nothing should stand in the way of the police doing their work now—the most important thing is that these perpetrators are brought to book and past crimes are looked at—but we need to have an overarching inquiry by a group of well-respected, heavyweight professionals who can look at the whole history of this and give their recommendations, quite aside from the individual reviews that are being conducted. Indeed, the Australian Government have announced just that—in the past few days, the Prime Minister of Australia has announced a royal commission. She said:

“The allegations that have come to light recently about child sexual abuse”

in Australia

“have been heartbreaking. These are insidious, evil acts to which no child should be subject. The individuals concerned deserve the most thorough of investigations into the wrongs that have been committed against them. They deserve to have their voices heard and their claims investigated. I believe a Royal Commission is the best way to do this.”

That mirrors the situation in this country, which is why I think we should go ahead with an overarching inquiry.

Are the perpetrators still at large? As I have said, the police must be able to do their work. Are victims being deterred from coming forward? We must not put any barriers in their way and we must make sure that the damaging allegations of shoddy journalism over the past few days do not do that.

Are our children safer in 2012 than they were in the ’70s and ’80s, when many of the horrible things that we have been discussing in recent days happened? They are. We have much better child-protection policies now. They are still too bureaucratic and need streamlining, which is why the working together programme was seriously streamlined. That will allow the professionals to do their job much more effectively. We have better local safeguarding children boards, which were not taking the problem seriously. The study by the Child Exploitation and Online Protection Centre and the university of Bedfordshire showed that 73% of safeguarding children boards did not have an up-to-speed policy on child sexual exploitation. That is now changing very quickly.

Local safeguarding children boards did not used to speak to each other, but I was keen to ensure that they did. They held their first national conference a year or so ago. I spoke at it and we had some very good people there who had not met each other before. It is obvious that sharing best practice among those LSCBs was the way to go and I secured some funding to ensure that a network of LSCBs get good advice and good practice from each other for common problems throughout the country.

[Mr Graham Stuart]

rose—

[Sir Paul Beresford]

rose—

[Tim Loughton]

I first give way to the Chairman of the Education Committee.

[Mr Stuart]

I am grateful to my hon. Friend for giving way. Does he agree that a chair from one of the health and wellbeing boards should be appointed as a national lead on child protection, to ensure that their organisations have exactly the right focus and are linked to the safeguarding children boards?

[Tim Loughton]

There is merit in that idea. One of my concerns when I was in the Department was the weak link of safeguarding within the health service, and that has always been the case. LSCBs often say that health representatives are the weak link and the reluctant partners. I believe that is changing. I set up some cross-departmental protocols with my hon. Friend the Member for Guildford (Anne Milton), who was then a Parliamentary Under-Secretary in the Department of Health. It would be sensible to give a safeguarding role to the health and wellbeing boards. We have LSCBs, public health boards, safeguarding boards and overview and scrutiny committees in local authorities, but we desperately need to link them all up, because the problem of children being abused does not change. We need the right people to exchange the right information and for somebody to pick up the ball, run with it and act on it so that children are protected and safer.

[Sir Paul Beresford]

My hon. Friend has not mentioned—no one has so far—the fact that legal changes since the Sexual Offences Act 2003, which was crucial, have resulted in a new power, which received bipartisan support, that enables police, those who chase paedophiles on the sex offenders list, and judges to address the crime of grooming.

[Tim Loughton]

My hon. Friend was involved in bringing that about. It was difficult to define what amounted to child sexual exploitation. Although technology is a wonderful enabling tool, its emergence also enables people such as groomers to do evil things by it. We have to keep up with such people. On my visits to CEOP and Scotland Yard, I saw police officers trawling through all sorts of extraordinary, horrific imagery on their computers. It is often the case that paedophiles and traders in extreme pornography who take advantage of children are technologically one step ahead of law enforcers. We must never shirk from making sure that, technologically, our law-enforcement agencies are up to speed in doing their job, because paedophiles are really clever at using technology to peddle their vile trade.

Are we safer in 2012? I believe that we are, but we still have a long way to go. I believe that the modern equivalent of the abuse that took place in north Wales children’s homes in the ’70s and ’80s, and other similar events that are now being revisited, is child sexual exploitation gangs. Most of those that have come to light so far happen to involve British Pakistani men, but we will also see other gangs with different cultural backgrounds around the country. It is child sexual exploitation of a different sort from, but on a similarly serious scale to what happened in those children’s homes. It is not happening in children’s homes any more—we have well-regulated, well-inspected, better-equipped people—but it is happening outside children’s homes in too many cases. That is why we must be absolutely vigilant and make sure that we learn the lessons of Rochdale, Derby, Bradford and all the cases that have and are still to come to light. The knowledge that my hon. Friend the Member for Oxford West and Abingdon has of the cases that may come to light in her own part of the world will bring further gasps at the fact that such savagery can actually take place. This will continue to happen.

[Tessa Munt (Wells) (LD)]

I would caution against ever making an assumption that children are safe in any environment, even if we set up safeguards for them. We should never assume that sexual abuse cannot take place in a children’s home from now on. It is the power relationship that creates safety for perpetrators of sexual abuse. Would the hon. Gentleman like to comment on that?

[Tim Loughton]

I entirely agree. I used the word, “safer.” No child can be guaranteed to be absolutely safe and I would not be surprised if further stories come out of sexual exploitation of children in care homes. That is why the work that I commissioned in July to set up working parties to look at the quality of children’s residential homes, the safety of children who are increasingly being placed well away from their own homes, and better data-sharing between the police and the local children’s services department about homes, is vital. No child can be deemed to be absolutely safe—I hope that I have made that absolutely clear.

Is what happened in a north Wales children’s home less likely to happen in our children’s homes now? I believe it is, but we cannot guarantee that it will never happen. That is the comparison that I wanted to make.

[Mr Graham Stuart]

Will my hon. Friend give way?

[Tim Loughton]

I have spoken for quite a while and am almost coming to an end.

One of the most important pieces of work that was done in the Department for Education was the tackling child sexual exploitation action plan, which was launched a year ago. It brought together a whole range of different working groups. Sheila Taylor from the Safe and Sound charity was a pioneer in getting the police to realise the severity of the abuse that was going on in Derby and the midlands. The plan also brought together the National Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Children, CEOP and five Ministers from five different Departments, including the Attorney-General, to consider the problems involved in how to prosecute people without re-traumatising the victims who have to appear in court. Above all, Barnardo’s has done so much pioneering work in this area. I should also mention Andrew Norfolk of The Times, who over many years, when this was a very unfashionable, little understood issue that nobody really wanted to know about, ploughed away and uncovered some ghastly goings on, particularly in various northern cities, and he continues to do so. He must be given credit for bringing the issue to the attention of the wider public.

We brought together all those parties. The hon. Member for Stockport (Ann Coffey) was also part of our deliberations and made a fantastic contribution, as one would expect. It was not just a dusty document that then sat on a shelf. It needed to be acted on—it was an action plan and it needed to do what it said on the tin. When I published the action plan, I said:

“For too long now, the issue of child sexual exploitation has received too little attention. The system has not done enough to support victims and their families. The courts have not done enough to support traumatised young witnesses. And—perhaps most worryingly—too many local areas have failed to uncover the true extent of sexual exploitation in their communities.

This country has to now wake up to the fact that its children are being sexually abused in far greater numbers than was ever imagined.”

Those words are as true today as they were a year ago. Who would have believed, however, that the headlines across all the newspapers would be about child sexual exploitation or that it would dominate the media, albeit along the lines that it has gone down?

Why did we launch the action plan? It was the result of meeting many victims. I met many parents of victims as well. I met parents whose children were rescued from child abusers and whose houses were then firebombed by the abusers, who thought that it was a cheek that the daughter was not still at their disposal for abuse. The families go through horrendous experiences, not just the children.

I pay tribute to the BBC and Barnardo’s for the Whitney Dean storyline that they ran in EastEnders a couple of years ago. It was a lifelike, in-your-face, shocking, but effective story of how an ordinary girl was befriended by an extraordinary abuser and made to feel that she was part of the abuse. It showed how insidious and clever such abusers can be in inveigling themselves into the trust of vulnerable girls and boys. It was a good storyline that shocked the public into waking up to this issue. We needed to raise the profile of the issue and I think that that has been done, albeit not in the ways that we anticipated.

Secondly, the action plan was about better inter-agency working between all the different professionals, who were not sharing information or acting on it well. That is getting better. Thirdly, it was about how we rehabilitate the victims when we rescue them. This is not something that goes away the minute somebody is rescued from the perpetrator; there are mental scars that last for years. Fourthly, it was about better court practices, so that more children could go to court without being scared of giving evidence because they would be re-traumatised by a barrage of barristers operating for the gang of perpetrators.

In July last year, we produced the progress report, which contained serious practical measures that have been taken, such as the teenage rape prevention campaign, the Safe and Sound project, the BLAST project, the violence against women and girls action plan, the NHS film and social worker training. A lot is happening and a lot is improving. It needs to, because recent events have shown that this problem is still with us.

The Government need rapidly to assure the public that they are on top of this situation, that the professionals at the sharp end, whose job it is to look out for this issue, are looking out for it, and that children’s voices are being heard, taken seriously and acted on. I hope that Ministers who are not here today will hear that message and reassure the public that child protection in this country is taken far more seriously in 2012 than it was in the ’70s and ’80s, and that we will do everything we can to make our children safer.

Child Abuse Allegations (North Wales)

Tim Loughton Excerpts

Tuesday 6th November 2012 Commons Chamber

[Mrs May]

I am grateful to the right hon. Lady for the approach that she has taken to these serious issues. It is right that we should work together across the House to find the best solution, not only to get to the bottom of anything that we have failed to uncover so far, but to support the victims—which, as she and I have said, is so important.

In looking at these issues, it is right that we should first look into the police investigations to see whether any avenues that should have been followed were not pursued, and whether any issues have been uncovered as a result of the allegations that are now coming forward that should be dealt with. We must also pursue any criminality that comes forward, so that the victims can see that justice is being done.

That is why I have put an emphasis on the police investigation, and on the NCA working with the North Wales police to look into the historic allegations and ensure that everything necessary was done. If there are any avenues to be pursued in any criminal investigations, I am absolutely clear that the police should take them wherever they go. It is important that the NCA’s director general should bring in various assets, including, crucially, the Serious Organised Crime Agency and CEOP. CEOP is renowned for dealing with these issues, and it is right that it should be the single point of contact for any fresh allegations that come forward.

If, at the end of the processes that we have set in train, it appears necessary to move forward to a wider investigation, of course we will look at that. At this stage, we need to get the police investigations into any criminality under way, and to ensure that the Waterhouse inquiry did as it was intended to do, and did it properly. As I have said, however, if there is a case to be made for a wider inquiry at some stage in the future, we will of course look at the issue.

I shall return to the point on which the right hon. Lady and I ended our statements today. She was right to say that other police investigations had taken place in which there were issues over whether the victims were believed. We need to be able to reassure victims that, when they come forward, they will be listened to and taken seriously. It is incumbent on all of us in the House, in the positions of authority and responsibility that we hold, to ensure that that is the case.

[Tim Loughton (East Worthing and Shoreham) (Con)]

The Prime Minister is to be congratulated on the urgency with which he has responded to this matter, and the Home Secretary is to be congratulated on the speed with which she has come to the House today. Many weeks ago, when the Savile affair first reared its ugly head, I said that it was just the tip of the iceberg. We should not be surprised that child abuse has now raised its head in the political spectrum as well.

As the shadow Home Secretary has said, we now have a multiplicity of inquiries, and the Home Secretary has just announced an inquiry about an inquiry. Rather than waking up to find a new institution involved in this mire every week, is it not now time to have an overarching and robust public inquiry into all the failings in child protection in various institutions—the BBC, the health service, the police, the Church and so on—during the latter part of the 20th century? All institutions involved with children and young people should be made to have a robust child protection policy that is fit for purpose in the 21st century. All perpetrators should be exposed and brought to book, and all victims should be given credence and closure at last.

[Mrs May]

I commend my hon. Friend, who has championed the interests of children and child protection throughout his time in this House. He has a worthy record of bringing these issues before the House and the public.

My hon. Friend talked about bringing perpetrators to book, but as I said in my response to the shadow Home Secretary, what matters at this stage is that we are able to let the police do the job of identifying the allegations brought forward, pursuing the investigations and bringing perpetrators to book where possible. He has rightly said that this is not just an issue that has hit the care homes in north Wales, as the allegations of child abuse and actions of child abuse go wider in respect of the number of institutions involved in various ways over the years. As I said to the shadow Home Secretary, let us see the criminal investigation routes pursued, and if there is a case to go wider, of course the Government will look at that.

Oral Answers to Questions

Tim Loughton Excerpts

Monday 15th October 2012 Commons Chamber

[Mrs May]

We have been absolutely clear about the 10-year cost in terms of the £1.8 billion figure. Yes, cost recovery will be available to the service providers, but that will be done on the basis set out during discussions about the usage made of this provision. The average annual investment that will take place over 10 years equates to about 1.3% of the annual cost of policing. Let me say to right hon. and hon. Members on the Opposition Benches that this Bill is important because without it we will see criminals and others potentially going free because of their use of internet communications. It is right that we have the Bill because it will help us to catch criminals, terrorists and others.

[Tim Loughton (East Worthing and Shoreham) (Con)]

11. What recent assessment she has made of the use by police of orders under section 61 of the Criminal Justice and Public Order Act 1994 to disperse illegal encampments.

[The Minister for Policing and Criminal Justice (Damian Green)]

A range of powers are available to the police to deal with illegal encampments, including the power under section 61 of the 1994 Act to remove people who are trespassing with intent to take up residence. The Government keep these powers under review.

[Tim Loughton]

During the summer, a number of public places in my constituency were, yet again, the destination of choice for many illegal Traveller encampments, leaving my constituents to pick up a hefty bill for damage, dumping and abuse, with no prosecutions made as a result. Yet Sussex police were very reluctant to invoke any section 61 orders, which they have had the power to do since 1994. Will the Minister look into the police’s reluctance and investigate whether the use of the word “discretionary” in the guidance is acting as a bar to their using these orders, which can result in instant dispersal, to the great relief of my constituents and those of many other hon. Members?

[Damian Green]

I have every sympathy with my hon. Friend and his constituents. Many Members on both sides of the House will have experienced similar problems. I understand that Sussex police responded in September to an encampment in Lancing by issuing a direction under section 61 that required the occupants to leave within 24 hours, which they subsequently did. I am also aware that my hon. Friend is engaged in continuous discussions with Sussex police about this matter. If there is an aspect that has anything to do with changes in the law, I will of course look into it, but I also urge him to talk to the PCC candidates in his part of the world, because within a month they will be responsible for writing the policing plan for his area.