Oral Answers to Questions

Mike Penning Excerpts

Tuesday 9th September 2014 Commons Chamber

[Debbie Abrahams (Oldham East and Saddleworth) (Lab)]

4. What steps he plans to take to enforce the code of practice for victims of crime.

[The Minister for Policing, Criminal Justice and Victims (Mike Penning)]

May I, with your permission, Mr Speaker, pay my own personal tribute to Jim Dobbin, as it is my first opportunity at the Dispatch Box to do so? Jim was a personal friend and a colleague of all of us in the House. He would, I am sure, have been here at Justice questions because they are the sort of questions he would have been here for. He was a great man.

I would have asked you, Mr Speaker, if I could group Questions 4 and 8, but I do not need to do so now, so I will just answer Question 4. The victims code is a statutory document that places clear duties on criminal justice agencies. We will monitor criminal justice agencies’ compliance with the victims code and my Department will report back in March 2015.

[Debbie Abrahams]

I thank the Minister for his very kind remarks and support him in what he said. Jim Dobbin was a neighbour and a long-standing friend of mine, and a thoroughly decent man who will be sorely missed.

The murdered police constable Nicola Hughes was a constituent of mine. Her father Bryn has set up a charity in her name, particularly to support the families of murder victims. Will the Justice Secretary meet me and Bryn not only to hear about his experience but to discuss how families of murder victims can be better supported, particularly during the court process?

[Mike Penning]

I will be more than happy to meet the hon. Lady and her constituent. I have been very closely involved with this area for many years, not least because my constituent Billy Dove was murdered right outside my constituency office, and the family set up a charity straight after that. I have had the honour of chairing the victims panel. I will be more than happy to meet the hon. Lady and see the work that is being done brilliantly, I am sure, in her constituency.

[Mr Elfyn Llwyd (Dwyfor Meirionnydd) (PC)]

May I add my condolences to the family of the late Mr Jim Dobbin? He will be sorely missed.

As the Minister will be aware, victims are often secondarily victimised by poor treatment within the justice system. It seems that whereas perpetrators have rights, victims have only codes and charters. What plans does he have to improve the treatment of victims of domestic violence, including those who suffer from coercive control, which I hope—I am still campaigning—will become subject to a law in the coming months?

[Mike Penning]

I pay tribute to the campaigning that the right hon. Gentleman has done over many years. I look forward to him knocking on my door in the next couple of weeks, I am sure, to come in and see me as the new Minister. We are doing everything we possibly can to reverse the way victims are treated, or perceived to be treated, within the criminal justice system. In the past couple of weeks I have used the analogy that we should look at the other end of the telescope and put victims first. That is why the victims panel was set up by the Secretary of State. I look forward to working with many of the victims groups so that we can reverse the feeling that they are being treated unjustly.

[Mr Barry Sheerman (Huddersfield) (Lab/Co-op)]

May I press the Minister on the countless victims in towns and cities up and down our country who were forced into illegal sex—underage sex—and who were raped and pushed into child prostitution? Up and down the country, they have got no justice. Will this code help them? Will he join my appeal for an early, major debate in the House on that issue as soon as possible?

[Mike Penning]

I will be more than happy to respond to a debate on that very important subject, but it is above my pay grade to decide what the business in the House will be—that decision is for the business managers. The Backbench Business Committee has been enormously successful in this Parliament. I will be more than happy to respond to any debate proposed by the business managers.

[Dan Jarvis (Barnsley Central) (Lab)]

I welcome the victims Minister to his post. I know he will share the House’s concern about the number of young people coming forward who have been victims of horrendous abuse. It is very important that they get the support they need to ensure that justice is done. That includes victims being able to give evidence away from a court setting via a video link. There are only a handful of remote sites across the country, and the vast majority are located within court buildings. The National Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Children has highlighted the traumatic impact that this can have on young victims. One mother described her daughter Iris’s court experience as being “like a second abuse”. Will the Government bring forward plans for more of these remote sites, and will the Minister do more to ensure that victims’ rights are protected, as we have proposed, with a victims law?

[Mike Penning]

I am obviously very aware of the NSPCC’s campaign, not least because, quite rightly, I am signing an awful lot of letters for colleagues at the moment. I have also, in these early days, already met the chief executive and chairman of the NSPCC. We are coming to the end of a pilot of remote video evidence and I am waiting for the evidence of how it has worked. I would like to roll it out as fast as possible, if the evidence shows—as I think it will—that it should be.

[Mr Nicholas Brown (Newcastle upon Tyne East) (Lab)]

5. What assessment he has made of the effectiveness of governance and security at HMP Northumberland.

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[The Minister for Policing, Criminal Justice and Victims (Mike Penning)]

With permission, Mr Speaker, I will not read out the answer I read out earlier when, as is understandable, the hon. Lady was not in her place. I just reiterate that the victims code is a statutory document that places clear duties on criminal justice agencies. The Department will report to the Criminal Justice Board in March 2015. As I said to the shadow Minister, the hon. Member for Barnsley Central (Dan Jarvis), I will keep an enormously close eye on how this is being done, and if we need more powers we will take them. We intend to spend £100 million, which includes a lot of money coming from the perpetrators of such crimes, across all Departments to help victims.

[Stella Creasy]

On 14 January, the Minister’s colleagues in the Foreign Office wrote to me extolling the virtues of having signed the EU directive that means the families of victims of crimes that happen in Europe should expect to be able to enjoy the same rights as they would in their home countries, and on 7 April they wrote to tell me that it is the Minister’s responsibility to make that happen. Will he therefore meet me, my hon. Friend the Member for Leyton and Wanstead (John Cryer) and the families involved in the Tyrell Matthews-Burton case? The victim’s family and the witnesses have all been told that they have to raise the funds themselves to be able to go over to Malia to give evidence in this terrible murder trial. I am sure that he would agree that the victim’s voice not being heard is not what we would expect to see at home.

[Mike Penning]

Of course, whether the new Minister or not, I will be more than happy to meet the hon. Lady and her constituents, and the other hon. Lady’s constituents—I think that is the sort of role I should be playing—and look at the case closely, which I have not yet had an opportunity to do.

[Mr Speaker]

I think that the hon. Lady was referring to an hon. Gentleman, if memory serves me correctly. I would not want the Minister to suffer from gender confusion.

[David Mowat (Warrington South) (Con)]

Previous grooming trials have been characterised by intimidatory and vicious cross-examination by defence barristers, and often by multiple defence barristers. Will the Minister assure us that steps are being taken to stop that happening?

[Mike Penning]

Although I cannot interfere in the role of barristers in the courts, we are looking at the matter very closely and have piloted the use of video conferencing so that evidence can be given remotely or from behind a screen. It is vital that victims have the confidence to become witnesses, and I will do everything in my power to ensure that they have the support they need to do so.

[Bill Esterson (Sefton Central) (Lab)]

Colin McGinty was murdered almost 14 years ago. His parents recently gave a victim statement remotely, but the chair of the parole panel forgot to turn off his microphone and they overheard him say that their views would be disregarded. No doubt the Justice Secretary is explaining what happened. They have received an apology for what happened, which was incredibly distressing, as Members will understand. Can the Minister confirm that the Justice Secretary’s written advice is that victim statements are an important part of rehabilitation because of their role in the demonstration of empathy and remorse by offenders, and will he ensure that that is put clearly to the Parole Board and to parole panels?

[Mike Penning]

I have not yet had an opportunity to look at the full details of the case the hon. Gentleman refers to, but I know that there is an ongoing investigation to find out how it happened and to ensure that it does not happen again. I can only emphasise, as a human being, that it must have been horrible to hear that being said in the background. We must ensure that it does not happen again. The Secretary of State met the group only last week to discuss the matter.

[Stephen Mosley (City of Chester) (Con)]

9. What steps his Department has taken to prevent insurance fraud.

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[Jesse Norman (Hereford and South Herefordshire) (Con)]

15. What assessment he has made of the potential merits of joint working between probation trusts and police forces to reduce reoffending.

[The Minister for Policing, Criminal Justice and Victims (Mike Penning)]

I think we are all agreed that to tackle reoffending to protect the public, it is critical for the national probation service and community rehabilitation companies to work very closely with our local police forces.

[Jesse Norman]

Operation Castlemain is a police-led initiative to tackle street drinking in Hereford. Local probation officers and other agencies join police on the streets in areas where street drinkers are known to congregate. The result is a better environment for the public, closer working relations between the police and probation service and a higher profile for probation with people at risk of offending. Will the Minister join me in praising this excellent example of joint working?

[Mike Penning]

I will praise the work going on in my hon. Friend’s constituency and work that is going on around the country. Joint working and joint partnerships are important. I would also like to pay tribute to street pastors who do a fantastic job in constituencies, including my own.

[Andrew Griffiths (Burton) (Con)]

16. What assessment he has made of the effectiveness of open prisons.

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[Philip Davies (Shipley) (Con)]

T4. The Secretary of State has long argued that we should increase magistrates’ sentencing powers to 12 months for one offence. I hope that he can now clear up some confusion on the issue, because that provision was a manifesto commitment which was then abolished under the Secretary of State’s disastrous predecessor. My amendment proposing the introduction of the new sentencing power was rejected by the Government as recently as June, but the Prime Minister has now told the Magistrates Association at a reception that it will happen before the next election. Can we clear up the question of where we actually are, and can we crack on with doing something that would save money and would also be incredibly popular?

[The Minister for Policing, Criminal Justice and Victims (Mike Penning)]

I love doing things that are enormously popular and I also like doing things that are right. Magistrates’ sentencing powers are being reviewed and I will be able to come back to the House at its very early convenience, I hope, with some ideas.

[Sadiq Khan (Tooting) (Lab)]

The Secretary of State has previously said, and he said it again today, how proud he is of his prison reforms. The Ministry of Justice’s own figures show that suicides are up 69% in a year. More people died in prison last year than ever before. Self-harm is up 27% since 2010. Serious assaults are up 30%. The riot squad has been called out 72% more times than it was in 2010 and one in five prisons are now rated as “of concern”, double the figure 12 months earlier. We heard from my right hon. Friend the Member for Delyn (Mr Hanson) that four reports by the chief inspector of prisons have been pretty damning; the reports on Glen Parva, Doncaster, Isis and Wormwood Scrubs. What will it take for the Secretary of State to accept that we are in the midst of a prison crisis?

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[Mike Penning]

I think the hon. Lady might be pushing it a bit with our diary secretaries in trying to do that. If she wants a speedy meeting with me, I suggest that we have that meeting. I will get a full briefing from my colleagues and I will know exactly what is going on.

[Mr David Nuttall (Bury North) (Con)]

Further to the reply given to my hon. Friend the Member for Shipley (Philip Davies), will the Lord Chancellor join me on a visit to Bury and Rochdale magistrates court so that he can see for himself the excellent work that the magistrates are doing and see that the capacity exists for their sentencing powers to be increased from six months to 12 months?

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[Guy Opperman (Hexham) (Con)]

May I ask the victims Minister to meet me and to review the handling and sentencing of repeat antisocial behaviour offenders? In my constituency, there are two cases of people on year-long ASBOs, but the victims feel that the sentencing has been carried out solely on the basis of the most recent offence rather than the pattern of behaviour.

[Mike Penning]

As well as being the victims Minister, I am also the police and criminal justice Minister. I am sure, given that portfolio, that my hon. Friend and I will have a very good meeting.

[Mr Speaker]

Last but not least, Julie Hilling.