Lord Sharpe of Epsom
Main Page: Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Conservative - Life peer)
Lord Paddick (LD)
My Lords, we all condemn Russia for its unjustified aggression in Ukraine and stand with the Ukrainians in their heroic defence of their homeland, but not everyone can stay and fight. There will be many vulnerable Ukrainians who need at least short- to medium-term sanctuary—in particular, women, children and older people need to be removed to safety.
My understanding is that this Statement is now out of date, following the intervention of the Prime Minister overnight. The Statement talks about a new route, but can the Minister confirm whether all these people will still need a visa to come to the United Kingdom? Can he also confirm that under the provisions of the Nationality and Borders Bill—were it to be in force—they would all be committing a criminal offence with a maximum sentence of 10 years imprisonment if they came to the UK without a visa, and that because there is no direct route from Ukraine to the UK, they would be treated as second-class refugees? Does not the Ukrainian humanitarian crisis highlight exactly why many noble Lords oppose the provisions of the Nationality and Borders Bill?
Can the Minister also confirm that the elderly parents of a Ukrainian national settled in the UK can now be brought to the UK, but only after the Prime Minister overruled the Home Secretary, who wanted to restrict the new arrangements to close family members only? In the Statement, the Home Secretary talked about 100,000 Ukrainians eligible under government schemes. Since then, the Prime Minister has said that the number is 200,000. What is the number now?
The Home Secretary gave the excuse for not allowing visa-free entry that security and biometrics were a fundamental part of our visa approval process. She went on to say that Russian troops are infiltrating Ukraine and merging into Ukrainian forces and that intelligence reports state the presence of extremist groups and organisations that threaten the region but also the UK. Can the Minister confirm that the Russian army includes octogenarians and child soldiers?
We are talking about women, children and the elderly—the vulnerable who need the safety and security we, and their families here in the UK, can provide. What is the security risk that women, children and the elderly could potentially be Russian soldiers or members of extremist groups that threaten the UK? As the noble Baroness, Lady Kennedy of The Shaws, said earlier this evening, why can people’s security status not be established on arrival in the UK?
The Statement says that the Government are extending the visas for Ukrainian temporary workers “in some sectors” who can now stay until at least December 2022, primarily because people cannot return to Ukraine. In what sectors are Ukrainian temporary workers employed in the UK where they can safely return to Ukraine?
The Statement says that Britain continues to lead—how can that be true when Poland and other EU countries are allowing visa-free entry and the UK is not?
In the Commons on Monday, the Home Secretary tried to link measures, such as the temporary ban on the issuing of visas to nationals of a country that threatens international peace and security, to the Nationality and Borders Bill. She said:
“Those powers will be available as soon as the Bill receives Royal Assent. The sooner that happens, the sooner this House and all Members can collectively act.”.—[Official Report, 28/2/2022; col. 701.]
Are the Government really saying that they cannot stop issuing visas to Russian nationals in a time of crisis such as we are facing now without new primary legislation? I thought Brexit was about taking back control of our borders. Is the Minister seriously suggesting that they cannot, today, stop issuing visas to the citizens of a hostile foreign state? I look forward to the Minister’s response.
Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)
My Lords, I thank the noble Lords, Lord Ponsonby and Lord Paddick, for their questions. I also thank the noble Lord, Lord Ponsonby, for reminding me of Monday. It was a little bit difficult, but as I am sure he is aware, I did not actually have the full information—or indeed any information. However, I will endeavour to do a little bit better now. However uncomfortable it was for me, we should certainly remember that it was a good deal more uncomfortable for those people in Ukraine fighting for their sovereignty, so that is worth bearing in mind at all times.
If I may, I would like to start by craving Noble Lords’ indulgence and making a couple of general points to address questions which I have not been asked but which are important and germane and came out of the House of Commons debate yesterday. I echo the comments of the noble Lord, Lord Ponsonby, about the response given to the Ukrainian ambassador as he arrived in the other place today. It was genuinely moving, and I think it is a sign that the Commons, and, indeed, your Lordships’ House, is united in support of the people of Ukraine and all those who are working tirelessly for it. I also echo the comments of my noble friend Lord Ahmad when he spoke about Ukraine the other day and thanked the Opposition Benches for their help and support through this process.
The question I would like to answer which I have not been asked, but which came up a lot in conversation in the other place, is what Members might like to be able to do if they get petitioned with individual cases, because I cannot talk about them for obvious reasons. Just to give an idea of some of the help that is available, individuals can refer to GOV.UK or contact our free helpline. I am going to give the number very carefully so that Members can refer to it in Hansard. The number is: 0808 1648810. Noble Lords can ask for advice on those cases. It is a free helpline and it works around the world. If, for any reason, noble Lords cannot get what they need from that helpline—and that should not be the case—we suggest referring via a constituency MP in the usual way. If, for any reason, that does not work, there is a Portcullis House referral system. Just in case any noble Lords have any individual cases that may need addressing, I thought it was worth pointing that out.
In order to answer the various questions that I have been asked, I am going to run through the scheme as announced. Before I do, I want to point out that this is a unique scheme that has not been done by this country before. We have established the Ukrainian family scheme, which will significantly expand the ability of British nationals and people settled in the UK to bring family members to the UK. As my noble friend Lady Williams has just said, that extends the eligibility to adult parents, grandparents, children over 18, siblings and all of their immediate family members. Under this scheme—which will be free—those joining family in the UK will be granted leave for an initial period of 12 months. They will be able to work and to access public funds. Given the range of family members who will be able to come through this route, we estimate—the numbers are inexact for obvious reasons, but this is the best estimate I have—that it might help around 140,000 people to come to the UK. I stress, however, that this is not a capped number, so, in a sense, it does not matter what number I give here, because it is not capped.
We will make emergency changes to Immigration Rules on 15 March to create this route, but we are introducing a concession to the existing rules to enable families to apply via a bespoke application process no later than Friday 4 March—this coming Friday. If people call the helpline before that, someone will get back in touch with them. We will also consider anyone who applied on the existing family route, or existing concessions, under the new scheme if they do not meet the rules. The noble Lord, Lord Ponsonby, asked me about fees: any fees that have already been paid will be refunded. There are no other barriers: all the usual requirements around language and salary, for example, have been removed.
That will mean that although we would encourage Ukrainians not to apply before Friday, we do have mechanisms for those in urgent need to apply now. Eligible family members who have already made applications under the existing family rules will be considered under the Ukrainian family scheme if they do not meet the family rules. As I have said, they will also have their application fee and any applicable immigration health surcharge payments refunded.
Secondly, we have committed to establishing a Ukrainian sponsorship humanitarian visa offer, which will open up a route to the UK for Ukrainians who do not have family ties with the UK, but who we will match with individuals, businesses, community organisations and local authorities who are willing and able to act as a sponsor. All those benefiting from this offer will also be granted leave for an initial period of 12 months and will be able to work and access public services.
The Home Office will be working closely with the UNHCR and others on the ground to ensure that displaced Ukrainians in need of a home who wish to come to the UK are aware of this offer and are able to apply. DLUHC will be leading on this offer. It will work with the devolved Administrations to ensure that individuals and organisations who want to sponsor an individual or family can volunteer to do so, and they will be matched with Ukrainians in need. Again, there is no arbitrary limit on this scheme: we will welcome as many Ukrainians as wish to come and for whom we have sponsors. I anticipate that DLUHC will be working with local authorities and charities, but the department would welcome thoughts and suggestions on that particular route. The noble Lord, Lord Ponsonby, asked me if only family members can sponsor. British nationals or settled persons can sponsor, not those with temporary leave; but, as I said, we would encourage people to apply anyway.
Turning to the subject of visa waivers, in essence, the noble Lord, Lord Paddick, asked me why we will not go further and announce a visa waiver. Visas are an important security tool and are entirely consistent with all our other Immigration Rules. There is a risk that hostile actors or other individuals with links to serious and organised crime or corruption could exploit the arrangements to travel to the UK undetected if security checks are not in place. The Government do not believe that they should unnecessarily put the UK’s security at risk.
I understand what the noble Lord was saying about women, children and octogenarians in the Russian army, but I do not wish to go further and speculate as to what sorts of things the Russians might get up to. We have seen what they are capable of doing in peacetime. It is not peacetime any more, and I would not like to speculate what they might be capable of doing now.
The noble Lord, Lord Paddick, also asked me about visa penalties. The Nationality and Borders Bill contains provisions which allow the UK to apply visa penalties to a country which is being unco-operative in relation to the return of its nationals. Those powers include slowing down the processing of applications, requiring applicants to pay more or, critically, suspending the granting of entry clearance completely. I am told that an amendment will be tabled tomorrow, along with a letter outlining and explaining exactly what is going on with this feature. It would probably be better to wait until tomorrow and see the letter; I have not seen it, so I do not know what is in it.
There were also questions about the variety of existing visas and what is available to Ukrainian nationals already here on existing points-based system routes. They can extend their leave in the UK. Ukrainian nationals on an existing visitor visa can, exceptionally, switch into a points-based system immigration route without having to leave the UK. Ukrainian nationals on an existing visa can apply under the family route for further leave without meeting the immigration status requirement, provided they meet the requirements for leave based on exceptional circumstances. Ukrainian nationals on an existing seasonal worker visa will have their leave in the UK extended to 31 December 2022.
Finally, Ukrainian nationals in temporary work, such as HGV drivers and so on, will have their leave in the UK extended to 31 December 2022 as well. I think the point the noble Lord made was about temporary visas generally; I think that is covered by that particular point. However, all visa routes remain under constant review. As the noble Lord, Lord Ponsonby, said, this situation is incredibly fluid, so I expect there to be further changes as and when circumstances dictate.
The noble Lord, Lord Ponsonby, referenced Yvette Cooper’s comments yesterday in the House of Commons when she talked about which family members and how many. I think I have answered that. I want to stress that it is not capped. However, she also made the point—and made it very well—that a lot of people do not wish to be too far away from their loved ones, who are probably fighting in Ukraine as we speak.
That leads on to the humanitarian support we are offering. It is quite considerable. The FCDO has a humanitarian support team in place. We are providing an additional £40 million of humanitarian support, which I think my noble friend Lady Williams referred to earlier. That will provide access to basic necessities and vital medical supplies both in Ukraine and the wider region. That is on top of the $100 million of ODA already pledged for energy security and reform.
I mentioned the humanitarian team from FCDO, but military logistics experts are also operating in the countries neighbouring Ukraine. Obviously, we call on Russia to enable humanitarian access and safe passage for civilians to flee the violence, and we have 1,000 troops on standby to support the humanitarian response in the region should they be needed. We also stand ready to further support Ukraine’s economy through £500 million in multilateral development bank guarantees.
I think I have dealt with most of the questions I have been asked. If I have not, I apologise and will hope to come back to them when I have had a chance to skim through my notes in a little more detail. For now, I hope that answers most of noble Lords’ questions.
Lord Hannay of Chiswick (CB)
My Lords, I personally very much welcome the work the Government have done in putting together a really strong sanctions package and persuading other countries to come in the direction we wish to go. But I asked two questions in the debate on Friday that were not replied to. I would be grateful if either I could be given a reply now or the noble Lord could provide it in writing.
My first question was: what are we doing to muster a broad international scheme to ensure that exports to—not from—Russia, particularly of dual-use items, are prevented? During the Cold War there was a scheme called CoCom, which the vast majority of the West subscribed to. Are the Government considering resuscitating that? Secondly, what are the Government doing about countering the tidal waves of disinformation that are coming out? That means not just telling RT that it cannot broadcast but being able to get facts across to the Russian people ourselves while undermining the regime’s extremely misleading presentations and narrative.
Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)
I thank the noble Lord for that question. I cannot answer the question of whether we are planning a new version of CoCom, which I am not familiar with, but we have seen plenty of information delivered at the Dispatch Box in both Houses as to the sanctions applied to Russia, which I am very sure include dual-use items.
On the question of broadcast misinformation, disinformation and so on, the point was made in a meeting I was in earlier that the BBC World Service is one of the finest tools for delivering honest news. I know that message was received and it will be acted on.
Baroness Verma (Con)
My Lords, alongside the Ukrainian people, people who are not of Ukrainian descent will also be stranded. Could my noble friend tell me what is being done to help those people, so that they are not left in danger and isolated?
Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)
I can give two answers. First, if they qualify under the British citizen or the settled status visa programme, they are more than entitled to use that scheme in order to apply for their visas. If they are currently stranded in or near Ukraine, they can go to one of the visa application centres. Obviously, we have also announced the humanitarian visa, which I think will encompass them. As I say, and will keep saying, that scheme is uncapped.
Baroness Ludford (LD)
My Lords, can the Minister assure us that the helpline advisers will be fully trained? A journalist on the Independent had a tweet a few hours ago saying they are getting lots of calls but they have no information to give out. As I understand it, he said that was true, in a sense—they will have the information by Friday and they will call people back. Perhaps some planning could have taken place for this situation, which we have known was going to happen for weeks, if not months.
What is the situation of EEA citizens who have settled status? Can they sponsor Ukrainian family members in the same way that UK citizens and Ukrainian nationals can?
Lastly, I really do not see the need for these new amendments to the Nationality and Borders Bill. I do not understand why the Government cannot just refuse visas without some complicated new scheme under the Bill. Finally, I congratulate Eurostar on giving free tickets to London for Ukrainian refugees.
Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)
On the first question, part of the problem with the helpline is that one of the things it is having to deliver is access to a new application form that had to be developed in four days. That is not quite ready. The noble Baroness shrugs her shoulders on that point, but I think it is important to bear in mind that we are doing everything we are doing in liaison with the people of Ukraine and the Ukrainian Government. My noble friend Lady Williams just made this point.
The Home Secretary is regularly in contact with the Ukrainian authorities and the ambassador, and we are very much following their lines. I refer noble Lords, if they are interested, to an article in the Times this morning, talking about the diplomatic difficulties in making excessive plans early. I accept the point that this is a fluid situation and that it needs to be done, but it is important to bear in mind that this is happening at record speed. I am told that forms of this sort that have to be developed digitally normally take months, not days. This is being done very quickly.
I answered that question at such length that I have completely forgotten your second question—and I just said “your”, so I apologise for that as well. It was to do with EEA citizens. I cannot answer that specifically, but I cannot imagine, given what I have said about Ukrainians with settled status and about British citizens, that that would not be the case. As I have said already, this is meant to be a generous scheme, not a bureaucratic scheme.
On the last point, I have referred to the letter that is coming with the amendment today. I hope I am not piling too much pressure on the letter, but I have not seen it and I am not going to pre-empt what is in it.
Baroness Andrews (Lab)
My Lords, we are very grateful for the Minister’s Statement. He was not able to answer all the questions from my noble friend on the Front Bench. He was asked about the assistance we are giving to countries that border Ukraine, particularly Poland, which is taking the brunt of refugees. What can we do to build capacity on the ground to support those refugees? Speed is obviously of the essence. I know the Statement says we have one pop-up assessment centre: clearly, that is not going to be enough, even for the numbers we are thinking of taking. Everything is being done for the first time—we appreciate that—but what else can we do to support the Poles to develop their own humanitarian response and also to make sure we are doing everything we can as early as we can for those desperate people?
Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)
I thank the noble Baroness for that question. I think I have answered about some of the humanitarian actions that the Government have already taken and enacted very swiftly. Obviously, as the noble Lord, Lord Ponsonby, said, the situation is incredibly fluid, and I have no doubt that the Government will react to circumstances on the ground as and when required, at the request of the countries involved. I think I am right in saying—if I am not, I will correct myself later—that very recently, some Royal Marines were redeployed to that part of the world. It is happening, and happening fast.
The visa application centres, to which I think the noble Baroness was referring, are in the following locations. We have them in Poland, in Warsaw. There is the new one in Rzeszów, which I think I referenced on Monday—possibly the only thing I referenced on Monday. We have ones in Moldova, Romania and Hungary. and one is still open in Ukraine, in Lviv. We had to close the one in Kyiv, for obvious reasons. Demand across them is actually not as high as we would have expected at the moment, but we are none the less increasing capacity. More biometric kits are being redeployed and capacity is increasing on an ongoing basis.
Lord Cormack (Con)
My Lords, so much is falling on the Poles and the Hungarians, particularly on Poland, as the noble Lord, Lord Ponsonby, said. I make a suggestion for my noble friend to pass on to his ministerial colleagues: I do not expect an affirmative answer, but I do not want a dismissal. In the past, it has been found that it can sometimes be extremely helpful, in time of war, to have a resident Minister from this country stationed abroad. I put it to my noble friend that it would be symbolic, helpful and probably much appreciated by our former fellow members of the EU if we gave some thought to that now.
Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)
I thank my noble friend for that suggestion, which I will take back; it strikes me as a very good one. Perhaps I may also clarify something I just said: in answer to the noble Baroness, Lady Ludford, EEA settled citizens can.
Lord Campbell of Pittenweem (LD)
I imagine that the Minister, like me, has been in awe of the demonstrations of physical courage by so many of the citizens of Ukraine. I hope I can persuade him to accept that there have been some illustrations of political courage. I have particularly in mind the policy reverses of Germany: to supply defensive weapons to Ukraine, to increase defence expenditure by €100 billion and to suspend Nord Stream 2. Mr Putin can hardly be thought to have expected any of that.
Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)
I thank the noble Lord for that. I am not sure it was a question, but of course I agree with him: it was a courageous act on the part of the Germans, and well done them.
The Lord Bishop of Leeds
My Lords, I very much appreciate what the Government are doing and the Statement that was given. One of the elements that is lacking from it, however, is any reference to religion. One cannot understand the politics of Russia or Ukraine without understanding the history of the past 1,200 years, what is intended to be part of the reunification of the original Rus—I speak as a Russian linguist and former Soviet specialist at GCHQ. If we do not understand the role of religion, we are in danger of short-term, reactive, tactical activities in relation to the current conflict, whereas the Russians, certainly, have been running a long-term strategy under Putin, in which he has been extremely successful thus far. What role is religion playing in the Government’s assessment of how to care for refugees, which we have talked about, and in establishing back channels with the Moscow patriarchate and the Ukrainian patriarchate?
Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)
I thank the right reverend Prelate for that. He will not be particularly surprised to learn that I do not know the details on that subject. I will facilitate contact with the Foreign Office so that he can explain, using the depth of his expertise. I also point out that the setting up of the humanitarian visa scheme is being done by DLUHC, in consultation with a number of NGOs and other bodies. I strongly recommend that the right reverend Prelate gets in touch with DLUHC to pass on some of those suggestions, which strike me as incredibly sensible.
Lord Sterling of Plaistow (Con)
The right reverend Prelate has brought this subject up. There are about 15,000 to 20,000 troops stopped 30 miles away from Kyiv. They are conscripts and, as the right reverend Prelate has said, they have been highly religious and devoted to their beliefs for hundreds of years, except for the time when Stalin was in power. They are back and very devout.
I have concerns for these conscripts. As noble Lords know, Kyiv is the most sacred icon for Russia and for many others outside of Russia. That was the place where, nearly 1,900 years ago, the very first Orthodox church was built in Ukraine. That was the beginning, if you will, of the people being converted to Christianity. That is something so special in their mind. You could go all over the world and people talk about it. Today, when you go there, the cathedral is right on top of it. If these young men are asked to destroy it completely with artillery, I think that many of them will refuse or desert. In the history of war, if you desert, you got shot. If you were—
Lord Sterling of Plaistow (Con)
I will ask my noble friend, a military historian with huge knowledge on the subject, whether this aspect has been considered. Can we understand that thinking?
Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)
I thank my noble friend for his question, and indeed for the history lesson. I was not aware of some of the things that he has said, although I take note of them and think that they are very interesting. Lots of other historical moments are happening. The other day, we saw the missile strike on the Holocaust site, which was equally deplorable. Russians were cheerfully pulling the trigger on that, so I do not know where they will stop. I will take back the points he made.
Viscount Waverley (CB)
My Lords, I have listened carefully to provisions in relation to Ukrainians. They are appropriate. Being denied the right to live should be a wake-up call to the Government to be generous to the maximum. The Afghan citizens resettlement scheme took three months to establish as a working system. What measures are being taken to ensure that those moving through Europe have all the information about the new Ukrainian family scheme, including timeframes, eligibility for close family members and processing requirements for applications? Once the policy detail has been established, can the Government confirm how many Ukrainian applications can be processed in the immediate weeks of March, so that we do not leave hungry Ukrainian families out in the cold?
Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)
I thank the noble Viscount for his question. I hope he would agree that the Government have been very generous. The full communications will be available on the GOV.UK website. As we are not expecting people who are potentially living in difficult situations to be able to look this up on the internet, communications will be handed out at the visa application centres. Access to all this information will also be available via the helpline which I have already tried to describe.
I turn now to what will happen once the policy details are all in place. The visa application centres are currently processing under capacity, but capacity is being ramped up. Therefore, I am not in a position to say how many people might be processed in due course, because I suspect that the number will keep rising depending on circumstances.
Lord Austin of Dudley (Non-Afl)
My Lords, I welcome the tougher stance which the Government are taking on sanctions since last week. However, would it not make things swifter and more straightforward to make it a legal requirement for law firms, accountants, financial services firms, businesses and others to provide information they have on the finances, assets and business activities of people or companies which are sanctioned?
Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)
I thank the noble Lord for his question. As I am sure all noble Lords have seen, a letter was received yesterday from the Home Office and from the Business Secretary talking about the forthcoming Bill which will go through the House of Commons next week and will be in your Lordships’ House in a couple of weeks. The noble Lord makes some very sensible suggestions. I do not know what the legal niceties would be, but I will certainly take those suggestions back.
Baroness Smith of Newnham (LD)
My Lords, I will ask the Minister to try again with the question asked by his noble friend Lady Verma which was about people who are leaving Ukraine but are not Ukrainian nationals. In particular, the BBC was showing pictures of Afghan refugees who had been in Ukraine. As I understand it, they would not fall under the humanitarian sponsorship pathway because the statement says that this pathway is for Ukrainians. For those people who do not have Ukrainian citizenship but are fleeing, will the Government make any offer to them—and, particularly, to anyone who is from Afghanistan?
Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)
Afghans obviously have access to the Afghan resettlement scheme but—I reiterate the point—we have started work on the humanitarian visa scheme. There are lots of safe and legal routes open to Afghans who may find themselves in Ukraine.
Lord McCrea of Magherafelt and Cookstown (DUP)
My Lords, no one should deny that the United Kingdom Government have been leading many Governments across the world in response to the crisis in Ukraine with a strong package of sanctions, et cetera. However, as the situation develops, further measures will be necessary. Can the Minister clarify how long those choosing to come to the United Kingdom can stay under these regulations, and will that period be extended?
Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)
At the moment it is at least 12 months but we will not be sending anybody back, obviously, if that time expires and it would be unsafe to do so. I imagine that will be under review.
Lord Bellingham (Con)
My Lords, does the Minister agree that sporting sanctions are a vital ingredient in the overall package? Bearing this in mind, does he share my concern and dismay about the decision of the Paralympic committee to allow Russian and Belarusian athletes to compete next week, albeit as individuals and not flying their flag?
Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)
I did not know it had done that. The actions of the sporting authorities around the world have been admirable thus far. I do not think it would be appropriate for me to comment on particular instances where that has not been the case.
Lord Alton of Liverpool (CB)
My Lords, will the Minister draw to the attention of his noble friends in the Foreign Office the report this morning from the World Food Programme suggesting that 29% of all the grain and wheat sold to countries in the Maghreb and Middle East—the poorest of the poor—comes from either Russia or Ukraine, and that this is likely to be severely disrupted? There is also its figure that 400,000 people have already left and that it is now making preparations for some 3 million refugees in neighbouring countries. What more can we do to support the World Food Programme and the International Committee of the Red Cross?
Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)
That question obviously goes back to something that my noble friend Lord Benyon was discussing earlier on food security. Clearly, it is an issue not just for any particular part of the world but for us all. I have tried to go through some of the details on the humanitarian responses but there is another thing I should have mentioned earlier—I picked it up when I was googling before I came in here. I noticed that this morning, or during PMQs, the Prime Minister also announced that every pound donated to the Disasters Emergency Committee’s Ukraine appeal by the public will be matched by the Government, starting with £20 million. I also reference the fact that we have given an additional £40 million of humanitarian support. I appreciate that that does not fully answer the noble Lord’s question but it is a go at it.