Oral Answers to Questions

Leo Docherty Excerpts

Monday 10th January 2022 Commons Chamber

[Carol Monaghan (Glasgow North West) (SNP)]

1. What recent assessment he has made of trends in the level of pay of armed forces personnel.

[The Minister for Defence People and Veterans (Leo Docherty)]

May I open by associating myself with your remarks, Mr Speaker, about the hon. Member for Birmingham, Erdington? We express our deepest sympathy to the right hon. and learned Member for Camberwell and Peckham (Ms Harman) and their entire family.

Armed forces pay remains competitive. Indeed, in 2021 approximately 35,000 service personnel earning less than £24,000 received a £250 consolidated pay uplift because, despite the public sector pay freeze, we are mindful of protecting the lowest earners in the armed forces during the public sector pay pause.

[Carol Monaghan]

May I start by offering my condolences to the family of our hon. Friend, Jack Dromey, and in particular to our colleague, the right hon. and learned Member for Camberwell and Peckham? Our thoughts are with her at this time.

Since 2010, many armed forces personnel have experienced a dramatic real-terms decrease in pay, some by as much as 6.5%. With the cost of living increasing dramatically and personnel struggling to stay afloat financially, will the Minister now lift the pay freeze and restore pay to at least the levels of a decade ago, when his party came to power?

[Leo Docherty]

When considering armed forces pay, it is very important to look at it in the round. Service personnel benefit from subsidised food and accommodation, a fantastic non-contributory pension, and allowances on top of basic pay. If I may say, it is a little bit rich getting lessons on armed forces pay from the SNP, given that it has hiked tax on service personnel in Scotland to the tune of £580 per person. It is just as well that the Ministry of Defence is making up the difference.

[Bob Stewart (Beckenham) (Con)]

I am very sad about the loss of Jack. I had known him since we both served together—him for the unions, me for the military—in Northern Ireland a long time ago.

Private soldiers, able seamen and aircraftsmen, after six months’ training and in accordance with the Armed Forces’ Pay Review Body, get roughly £3,000 to £4,000 less than a policeman who is also trained for about six months. That seems weird and I ask the Minister if he might slightly account for that.

[Leo Docherty]

As I said, we have to take note of the fact that service personnel benefit very significantly from subsidised food and accommodation, a non-contributory pension and allowances. Many young soldiers are also taking advantage of the opportunity to get on to the property ladder through the Forces Help to Buy scheme, which has been a great success.

[Mr Toby Perkins (Chesterfield) (Lab)]

I thank you, Mr Speaker, for what you said about Jack Dromey; his loss is felt by all of us across the House.

I take on board what the Minister said about pay below £24,000, but being as tough as it is for all those people, we think that that is inadequate. Moreover, is he aware that there are huge pressures in terms of the retention of more senior staff, particularly in the Royal Navy and the Royal Air Force? The gap between what they can earn in the private sector and what they currently earn in the Navy and Air Force, and how much their skills are in demand, are really affecting the ability to retain important members of staff.

[Leo Docherty]

The hon. Gentleman makes a good point, and that is why we offer some technical bonuses. We are also initiating a strategic review of terms and conditions and reward and incentivisation to ensure that we can compete with the private sector.

[Dr James Davies (Vale of Clwyd) (Con)]

2. What steps his Department is taking to support defence jobs throughout the UK.

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[Jonathan Gullis (Stoke-on-Trent North) (Con)]

11. What assessment his Department has made of the effectiveness of the veterans strategy.

[The Minister for Defence People and Veterans (Leo Docherty)]

Since the veterans strategy was published in 2018, we have been delivering for our veterans, including Op Courage in the NHS to support veterans with their mental health, the veterans’ railcard, and a national insurance holiday for those employing veterans. We continue to drive forward that agenda, with our publication soon of a veterans strategy update, which will recognise what a fantastic asset our veterans are.

[Jonathan Gullis]

In north Staffordshire we are very proud to house the Tri Services and Veterans Support Centre led by Geoff Harriman and supported by John Painter and Kathy Munslow, all of whom served themselves and do a range of work to support our local veterans—for example, the new veterans’ retreat set up in Kidsgrove parish, bringing veterans together to take part in archery, construction and even bee-keeping. I want to personally thank Ron Jeffries, a local businessman who kindly donated some of his land for this vision to become a reality. Will my hon. Friend therefore applaud the work of Geoff, John, Kathy and Ron in supporting our veterans and commit to visiting later this year to show us his skills in the field?

[Leo Docherty]

I would be delighted to learn about the work of those people in the parish of Kidsgrove—it sounds fantastic. I absolutely join my hon. Friend to thank Geoff Harriman, John Painter, Kathy Munslow and Ron Jeffries for their military service and all they continue to do for veterans in the community. I also thank my hon. Friend for the work he does to support our armed forces personnel. If possible, I would be delighted to visit.

[Stephen Kinnock (Aberavon) (Lab)]

Last month the President of the United States signed off the National Defense Authorization Act, which will ensure that US atomic veterans receive a medal and an official day of recognition for their service. Does the Minister agree that it is time to end the UK’s shameful position as the only country not to provide official recognition or compensation for nuclear veterans, and to mark the 70th anniversary of Britain’s first nuclear test by finally rewarding our courageous nuclear veterans with the medals they so highly deserve?

[Leo Docherty]

We will keep this under review but we regard it as a matter for the advisory military sub-committee on medallic recognition.

--- Later in debate ---

[Gavin Newlands (Paisley and Renfrewshire North) (SNP)]

T4. I am proud to have Erskine veterans home in my constituency. I am also proud of the Scottish Government’s veterans fund and their appointment of a Veterans Commissioner. Does the Minister not feel that that should be replicated elsewhere on these isles to ensure that the veterans community are properly represented in decisions taken affecting their welfare?

[The Minister for Defence People and Veterans (Leo Docherty)]

I am pleased to confirm that all the other nations of the United Kingdom do indeed have veterans commissioners.

[Mr Philip Hollobone (Kettering) (Con)]

T6. Strengthening our defence relationships in the Indo-Pacific will be essential to help maintain peace and stability in the region. In that regard, what are we doing to strengthen our defence relationship with Japan?