National Insurance Contributions (Secondary Class 1 Contributions) Bill

Joe Morris Excerpts

Committee of the whole House & 3rd reading
Tuesday 17th December 2024 Commons Chamber

[Pippa Heylings]

I thank the right hon. Member. As I mentioned, Arthur Rank hospice in my constituency is one such hospice that should definitely have that compromise. Not only that; we have to look at the whole primary care sector—both GPs and independent care homes—because that is what will winter-proof our NHS. We cannot fix the NHS without fixing social care.

The national insurance increases are not just unwise; they are unthinkable. We are in a time of healthcare crisis when people are already struggling to secure appointments. Despite the Government’s assurances, these tax rises will inevitably affect ordinary people. They will particularly hurt those desperately trying to access their local GP and crucial appointments.

We cannot and will not fix the NHS by driving its primary care providers into the ground. I urge the Government to engage with our GPs, reconsider and provide immediate reassurance to GP practices, hospices and care homes that they will be protected them from these changes. Without those frontline services, the NHS stands no chance of coming off life support.

[Joe Morris (Hexham) (Lab)]

I rise to speak about the need for the Bill and the continued assault by the Conservative party on public trust and the public finances. When I go out in my constituency, I speak to people who are appreciative of the “bin fire”—that is the term that one of my constituents used—facing Treasury colleagues when we assumed office. Money for projects and half-baked plans was used more to launder the Conservative party’s reputation than to improve our public services.

When someone comes into office and finds out that the job is not as had been advertised and that the previous person in post set fire to the office, they have to do things differently. They have to begin to rebuild trust with the people they serve and to have honest conversations with the public. That is what the Government are determined to doing. [Interruption.] Opposition Members can chunter as much as they like, but they know that they gambled with public trust and undermined every aspect of themselves and the institutions of the British state. That is not just a failure on their part but a failure on the part of everyone in their party and everyone who knocked on doors. Ultimately, they were judged harshly by the British public for that.

The Bill is necessary to repair the public finances and rebuild public trust. We did not want to do this. We had to maintain our manifesto promise not to see tax rises for working people, but we must ensure that the country that we hand on is in a significantly better state than the country we inherited. That is the Government’s task.

[Dr Luke Evans]

I am enjoying the hon. Member’s exposition of his thinking on this matter. Will he set out how this works for national insurance contributions, which is what we are talking about? Those on the frontline—the likes of GPs and care homes—are private, but they are commissioned only by the NHS. Is he aware of where the funding will come from? Will it come from the £22.6 billion? That would make sense, but if so, the Government need to clarify where that money is going. Part of the problem is that it does not add up for the Government to say that they want to support the NHS yet tax those very people—the doctors, the hospices and the care homes—to fund it. Will he elaborate on how that will work?

[Joe Morris]

I was not sure if the hon. Member would take interventions during that. Ultimately, we need to support the NHS, our care homes and our GPs. It is very rich of the Conservative party to lecture us on supporting GPs and care homes. I have been out speaking to GPs in rural communities, who have been consistently undermined by the Conservatives’ failure to appreciate the challenges facing the modern countryside. I have been out speaking to care homes; I spoke to the Charlotte Straker care home, which looked after my grandmother, to hear its concerns. I have had those meetings, as is my duty as a constituency MP. Ultimately, perhaps if more of the hon. Gentleman’s Conservative colleagues had done the diligent thing as constituency MPs, there would be more of them on the Opposition Benches.

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[The Second Deputy Chairman]

Mr Doogan, I will not be in a quagmire.

[Joe Morris]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for his guidance on the correct form of words to use. The reason that I used the term “ultimately” is that it is the fundamental goal of Government to improve the lives of our constituents. That is why I choose to use the form of words that I am using, and why I am focused on the eventual outcome for my constituents. As I said, we did not want to inherit the country in the circumstances that we did. That is fault of the Conservative party, its record and the inheritance it left. We need to bear in mind the context, because that shapes everything and how we go about this.

[Graham Stuart (Beverley and Holderness) (Con)]

Further to the question from my hon. Friend the Member for Hinckley and Bosworth (Dr Evans), we hear the hon. Gentleman’s critique of the previous Government, but we are trying to understand how imposing these costs on GPs at one end of the service and hospices at the other will remotely help the NHS and, more importantly, the people who rely on it. We would like him to explain that, not just slag us off, however much he might enjoy doing so.

[Joe Morris]

I have never turned down an opportunity to slag off the Opposition. I am always happy to do so.

The ultimate reason that the Budget was necessary was to raise the extra money to invest into the NHS. The extra infrastructure investment will support our rural communities, our rural GPs and our care homes. That is the fundamental point of the Budget. It is a reset moment to properly support our public sector once more, which the Conservative party failed to do, as the right hon. Gentleman well knows. We need to restore faith in our NHS and our small businesses that were so badly let down. I have spoken to many across my constituency who share my optimism about this Government and who are convinced of the need for that investment. [Interruption.] Opposition Members can chunter all they like, but it is true. Ultimately, those businesses know that we need to invest in the state in order to drive up standards and confidence and provide the stability that the country so desperately needs.

[Wera Hobhouse (Bath) (LD)]

The hon. Gentleman mentions public trust; we all understand how important it is to restore that, but how can that happen if the very things needed to support the public and restore trust—our hospices and the charitable sector—are being hit by this Government’s measures?

[Joe Morris]

As the hon. Lady well knows, when one inherits a difficult context, one has to take decisions that one did not want to take. The public understand that the NICs rise was important and was needed because of the circumstances that we inherited and to repair the black hole that we found in the public finances. Spending the national overdraft three times and not telling anyone about it is what has fundamentally undermined public trust.

[Rachel Blake (Cities of London and Westminster) (Lab/Co-op)]

Listening to Members speaking to the amendments has caused me to reflect on the challenges at the heart of this debate. Does my hon. Friend agree that the amendments that are trying to unpick a holistic approach to fixing the foundations of our public finances entirely miss the point, first of the challenge that this Government face in re-establishing confidence in public finances, and secondly of our approach to long-term investment in public services that are so desperately needed? I believe that all the amendments—

--- Later in debate ---

[Joe Morris]

My hon. Friend eloquently makes the point that I have been trying to make when I have tripped over my words.

I am extremely proud that the Government are committed to achieving economic stability, being frank with the public about the choices that we face and not simply taking the easy options. We need to implement these tough measures in order to resolve the previous Government’s disastrous economic mismanagement and to restore our foundations. I will finish by saying that traditionally, as far as I am aware, it is poor form for the arsonist to criticise the actions of the fire brigade.

[Gareth Davies (Grantham and Bourne) (Con)]

I rise to speak, on behalf of the official Opposition, to amendments 13 to 18 and new clause 1, which stand in my name.

First, it is important to remember the context of the situation we find ourselves in today. Throughout the election, the Chancellor and the Prime Minister promised the British people that they would not raise taxes on working people. They committed specifically to not raising national insurance, but here we are in Committee debating a national insurance tax on working people worth some £25 billion. Each and every Government Member made specific promises to their constituents on national insurance, which they have now broken. We have it here in black and white.

Clause 1 raises the rate of secondary class national insurance from 13.8% to 15%. To compound the impact, clause 2 drastically cuts the secondary threshold from £9,100 to £5,000. This two-pronged attack on business means that while clause 1 squeezes more from businesses, clause 2 simultaneously pushes more businesses into the taxman’s grasp. Taken together, based on data from His Majesty’s Revenue and Customs, a staggering 940,000 employers are set to lose out in net terms from the Bill. The Office for Budget Responsibility has made it clear that each one will be hit by an average of £26,000 in additional tax.

On Second Reading we heard the same old script from the Government and their Back Benchers. Time and again we hear that the Bill will hurt only the largest businesses, but that is not correct. Most high street hair salons would not say that they are a big business with mounds of profit to give away to the Exchequer, no matter how much hair mousse this Prime Minister buys from them. A village family butcher surely would not regard themselves as profiteering fat cats. Community pharmacies providing vital services to residents young and old surely cannot be put in the same category as a large multinational pharmaceuticals company. Yet they are.