Post Office Closures

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Tuesday 19th October 2021 Westminster Hall

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

It is a pleasure to speak in this debate. There has not been a debate on post office closures that I have not attended or spoken in on behalf of my constituents.

[Mr Gregory Campbell (East Londonderry) (DUP)]

And many other topics.

[Jim Shannon]

There are many things that interest me.

I thank the hon. Member for Motherwell and Wishaw (Marion Fellows) for securing the debate. She has been a real champion of this issue, and we thank her for giving us all the opportunity to participate. It is a real pleasure to see the Minister in his place, because he understands the importance of post offices. I am sure that he will encapsulate our feelings about post offices, so I look forward to his reply.

Historically, post offices have been central hubs of both rural and urban communities, but. like others, I want to draw attention to their importance to rural communities. I am fortunate that, over a period of time, I have had the opportunity to engage with post offices directly and may be able to chart a way forward. The hon. Lady referred to the closure of Spar shops; I am going to speak about the Spar shops that have given opportunities to the post offices across Northern Ireland. My hon. Friend the Member for East Londonderry (Mr Campbell) will also be able to contribute to the discussion. I am absolutely sure that post offices in rural communities and in housing estates have been a vital point for social interaction and accessibility. I will give some examples of just how important this is for people.

There is always a little feeling of dread when I get an email detailing amendments to post office services. I dread the news that services are going to be cut, although, thankfully, such news has not been prevalent recently, probably because of the engagement between post offices and major supermarkets in Northern Ireland to ensure that that we can defer potential closures and cuts. The co-operation with the Spar Henderson group in Northern Ireland has meant that there are many more basic post office functions available in our petrol stations and stores. I am incredibly thankful for that, but they do not provide the full range of services or the same expertise as dedicated post offices. It is clear that demands for the service require the retention of stand-alone post offices, as well as these smaller, satellite offices.

[Mr Campbell]

On the issue of not providing a full range of services, does my hon. Friend agree with me that we need to look to the future? In the past, the Post Office did innovate to some degree with the support of previous Governments, but just as we see credit unions evolving in terms of financial services, we now need to look ahead to the bigger picture over the next 10 to 15 years, and to allow post offices to innovate and evolve to serve the community better in financial services.

[Jim Shannon]

I thank my hon. Friend for his intervention, which encapsulates what we all feel about how post offices have an integral part to play in the future. We look to the Minister for indication of his vision for the future of post offices, and the importance of having them as an integral part of local communities.

[Ronnie Cowan (Inverclyde) (SNP)]

One of the issues in my constituency is that when one post office closes, rumours start about all the other post offices; I am sure we all feel that. Because of the uncertainty and the precarious environment that post offices are operating in right now, it is very hard to get anybody to invest in them and keep them going. Talking about the long-term future, the Government either have to accept and admit that there is no future for post offices, or they have to legislate to protect the long-term future of the post offices in all our constituencies.

[Jim Shannon]

The hon. Gentleman is absolutely right. When the Minister sets out his vision for post offices, as I hope he will, he has to retore confidence in the post offices so that they can see a future for themselves financially and viably.

Yesterday morning I had a lady in my office thanking my staff for persevering with her attendance allowance form. She had been notified that her appeal had been upheld. I listened as my staff members reminded her that this additional money was hers, and that she should use it to make her life easier—to get a cleaner or to help pay for a taxi rather than walking everywhere. She said something that struck me and was very important: “I will get a taxi to get my post office money.” It was very clear what she was saying. “I can’t use this card stuff, and they help me to get my cash where I can get all my bills sorted. I don’t know what I will do when they don’t do cash anymore.”

This is replicated dozens of times across my constituency, and I know it is replicated across all of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. The availability of the help and support that post office staff provide to vulnerable people in our communities cannot be overstated. That lady also said that her life would be turned upside down if she could not get her pension and her money sorted. She said, “The girl in the post office put some money on my gas and electric, and my TV licence bill. She does it all.” This lady is in close contact with the people in the post office. I am so thankful for all those staff who take the time to do what those in a busy petrol filling station simply cannot; I mean no disrespect to them, but it does underline the importance of post offices.

With more and more bank branches closing down, the role of the post office for vulnerable people and for businesses that cannot lodge cash easily without it is more vital than ever, so I urge the Government to ensure that we play our part in the retention of post office services. We should remember that although a large number of people operate online for the majority of things, there is also a large vulnerable section of society who do not operate online and who are frightened to do so because of security concerns. Again, I seek the Minister’s reassurance in relation to this security issue. I will give him another example, which concerns one of my constituents, because I do not believe that the vulnerability of some elderly people to scams can be underlined enough.

Only last month, a man in my constituency lost a substantial amount of his savings because he was scammed through an online system. Many of our older people and other vulnerable people are increasingly refusing to try any online payments, just because they are not sure whether they have the security that they need so much. My parliamentary aide’s mother had a discussion with her private pension provider regarding the transfer of a bulk payment. Coincidentally, that afternoon she received a message on her phone, apparently from HMRC, regarding an outstanding tax bill. Let us be quite clear—HMRC does not make telephone calls to tell people about tax bills. If someone receives such a call or message, it is a scam, and that is a fact. Indeed, I received a phone call here at Parliament just before the recess, telling me to contact a particular number immediately in relation to something similar. I contacted my accountant and asked him about it, and he said, “Jim, HMRC do not contact you about any HMRC business by phone. They will contact you by letter. If you get a phone call supposedly from them, it’s a scam.” He was quite clear about that.

The mother of my parliamentary aide, Naomi, rang her, and Naomi told her mother to do nothing about the message until she had looked at it. It was a scam, but one timed in such a way as to be believable. Not everyone has a child who understands the tax system so well that they can spot a scam, which perhaps underlines the importance of this issue.

Fears about these issues make people’s ability to head to their local post office and have a local, friendly staff member help them to pay their bills safely and to get things sorted out vital. How important it is to have the accessibility to that service from someone an individual knows and who has a face they recall and trust—trust that has been built up over many years. I believe that every speaker today will endorse that.

The post office is vital. It is okay to have all the other shops and petrol stations where people have access to a post office service, but people also need to have someone they know. Post offices give that reassurance, so they are vital, and we must do our part to protect them. In doing so, we must protect our service provision, which is even more important for our elderly community, who rely on it and cannot do without it.

[Mr Clive Betts (in the Chair)]

Finally, I call Kirsten Oswald to speak.