Jim Murphy
Main Page: Jim Murphy (Labour - East Renfrewshire)Department Debates - View all Jim Murphy's debates with the Ministry of Defence
(10 years, 10 months ago)
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Mr Jim Murphy (East Renfrewshire) (Lab)
I beg to move,
That this House celebrates and commemorates the contribution of Her Majesty’s Armed Forces and their families, in particular those currently serving overseas; recognises the important introduction of Armed Forces Day in 2006 and urges the nation to come together and champion the Services’ achievements throughout the decades; pays tribute to the UK’s Forces, their families and the charities who do so much to support them; recognises the enormous contribution of the staff who support the UK’s Forces from within Government and the workforces in industry who supply them with world-class equipment; urges all those in public life to seek additional ways to support the Armed Forces Covenant; urges the Government, local authorities, business and charities to deliver the best possible post-service support; and considers the principles of the Armed Forces Covenant essential to uphold, through public policy, the provision of welfare and frontline support.
I am pleased to start what I think is an important debate in advance of Armed Forces day on issues that should transcend party politics. The care and support that we offer those prepared to make the ultimate sacrifice on behalf of others in our nation’s name across the globe is something that we rightly celebrate every day and in particular this weekend. The patriotism, courage and dedication of the men and women who serve are immeasurable. The first duty of any Government to protect our citizens would not be possible without our forces’ commitment, and they must at all times be properly valued and rewarded.
I want this House to know again that the Government will always have the support of those on the Opposition Benches when they seek to support our service personnel. This is more important as Armed Forces day approaches. That is an opportunity for people across the UK to come together locally to celebrate the contribution our forces and their families make, not just to our national security, but to local communities. So it is in that spirit that I offer my comments today. In doing so, however, I cannot guarantee the tone or the spirit in which my hon. Friend the Member for North Durham (Mr Jones) will wind up today’s debate.
Mr James Gray (North Wiltshire) (Con)
I strongly agree with everything the right hon. Gentleman said about Armed Forces day and about support for our armed forces. Having read his motion carefully, I strongly agree with every single word in it and I am most grateful to him for proposing it. However, I look forward to the response of his hon. Friend the Member for North Durham (Mr Jones). Is it not the job of Her Majesty’s loyal Opposition not simply to propose a motion on which we all agree, but to try to point out what is wrong with what the Government are doing? Why has he wasted the opportunity to do so?
Mr Murphy
There are 364 days of the year to point out where the Government are going wrong. We have chosen today in advance of Armed Forces day to celebrate the contribution our armed forces make and to offer, as the hon. Gentleman will realise as he listens to the rest of my comments, some of the ways in which we think the country and our politics could further improve the service and support for our armed forces. But I will take his advice and when I next return to the Dispatch Box I will do so in the spirit of my hon. Friend the Member for North Durham, rather than making my own comments.
Mr Jim Cunningham (Coventry South) (Lab)
May I answer the hon. Member for North Wiltshire (Mr Gray)? I will tell him what is wrong with the armed forces, if he really wants to know—the cuts to the Royal Regiment of Fusiliers.
Mr Murphy
There will be opportunities throughout the debate for right hon. and hon. Members to make their own assessments of the strength of the Government’s defence policy, but my intention today, as I said at the beginning of my remarks, is to make constructive suggestions about how together we can do more to honour our armed forces and support their families.
Sir Bob Russell (Colchester) (LD)
In a comradely spirit, does the right hon. Gentleman think that military bands have a role to play in the future of our armed forces?
Mr Murphy
I have visited the hon. Gentleman’s constituency a number of times and know how passionately he argues that case. Of course military bands play an important role, as we saw at trooping the colour a couple of weeks ago on Her Majesty’s official birthday. I think that the remarkable sights and sounds of military bands are celebrated by the entre nation.
Sir Bob Russell
The reason I intervened is that under the Labour Government the number of Army bands was reduced by almost a quarter.
Mr Murphy
I knew that I would enjoy the hon. Gentleman’s second intervention. Someone shouted from a sedentary position “Good luck” in relation to his not seeking to intervene again. All I will say is that I will not give way to him later in my speech. I am pretty proud of the changes and reforms introduced by the Labour Government with regard to our armed forces. Members today will offer their observations and criticisms, but on balance I am pretty proud of our record.
Our armed forces stationed overseas are rightly at the front of all our minds, including those stationed in Afghanistan. They operate in the dust and danger of a far-away terrain to protect security on our streets at home. Of course, after the pain of the past few years, many people understandably ask why it is in our interests to engage in such causes and to confront unrest in Afghanistan and elsewhere. The answer, in my opinion, is pretty straightforward: we do so because we do not want it to visit our shores.
We have recently seen UK personnel operating in Libya and Mali, alongside the ongoing operations in Afghanistan, in a sign of the unpredictability of today’s security landscape. Today the men and women who put themselves in harm’s way do so in a rapidly evolving defence environment that will demand new skills, technologies and strategies alongside their timeless courage and ingenuity.
Mr David Ruffley (Bury St Edmunds) (Con)
I endorse the right hon. Gentleman’s preliminary remarks. Are not many armed servicemen and women worried about any future entanglement? Will he take this opportunity to share with the House the answer to this question: do Her Majesty’s loyal Opposition support or oppose arming the Syrian opposition forces?
Mr Murphy
As my right hon. Friends the Leader of the Opposition and the shadow Foreign Secretary have already made clear, there is a great degree of scepticism and worry about any decision to arm the Syrian opposition, not least because it is not possible to quarantine the arms provided or guarantee who will be the end user. We look forward to hearing the Government make their argument. I thought that the Prime Minister, at Prime Minister’s questions the week before last, had an argument, but he did not make it very well.
Our purpose in the world is to defend our interests and promote our values, but the means by which we achieve those ends and the threats that challenge both our interests and our ideas are increasingly diverse, complex and intense. The global population is growing rapidly, putting massive pressure on resources and space and forcing migration from poor to rich states. Climate change will reduce available land, food and water, exacerbating the drivers of state failure. Weak and unstable states already outnumber strong and stable ones by more than 2:1. A youth bulge is seeing rising aspiration and great emotional urgency in the desire for political change. The advance of information technologies and biotechnologies threatens international security infrastructure, while nuclear proliferation and cyber-attacks pose the potential for mass destruction.
Within this context, it is our duty collectively to ensure that our forces are designed to meet new threats, with a strategy defined by adaptability, prevention and partnering with our allies. Labour has argued that our recruitment plan must be advanced and affordable, defined by discipline in budgetary management as well as maximising modern technology and a new multilateralism, and that our armed forces must be higher-skilled, focused on stabilisation, cultural embedding and building other nations’ underdeveloped forces so that they can share the burden of future heavy lifting. We see a new role for our services based on earlier intervention, to prevent the need for the large-scale conflicts of our recent history. However, it is our duty to ensure that such capability is based on reform throughout the ranks.
Our duty to forces on the front line is matched, of course, by our duty of care to them when they return. The armed forces covenant, enshrined in 2010 following a campaign by the Royal British Legion, has at its heart the principle that no one should suffer disadvantage as a result of their service. That principle should infuse all our work in support of the covenant and those men, women and their families.
Andy Sawford (Corby) (Lab/Co-op)
I absolutely agree with my right hon. Friend about the armed forces covenant. I am sure he welcomes the news that all three local authorities in my area have signed up to the community covenant. Indeed, this Saturday morning we will name the town square in Corby after Lance Corporal James Ashworth, who, as my right hon. Friend will know, made the ultimate sacrifice fighting in Helmand, Afghanistan. He was awarded the Victoria Cross—only the 14th person to receive the honour since the second world war. I welcome my right hon. Friend’s commitment to encouraging local authorities to recognise the sacrifice of our troops.
Mr Murphy
My hon. Friend speaks again with great passion about Lance Corporal James Ashworth. This is not a partisan point: my hon. Friend has been in the House for only a short time, but no Member on either side of the House could fail to be impressed by the diligence with which he has taken an interest in armed forces and defence issues. The whole House is improved by his contributions. I am sure that, like my hon. Friend, Members across the House will be doing their bit in their own town and city centres this Saturday. I will be in Nottingham at the national celebration of Armed Forces day.
Only recently did we graphically witness both the danger that our forces face and the unity that they can inspire. The atrocious murder of Drummer Lee Rigby sickened us all—a feeling whose intensity was matched only by the resolve to defeat the extremist sentiments that shaped the minds of the murderers. The result was not division, apart from that in respect of an exploitative minority; instead, it was a simple act of Britain standing together to defy that violence, hatred and intolerance.
Richard Drax (South Dorset) (Con)
When that dreadful murder occurred, it was suggested that the uniform be removed and people should go out in civilian clothes. Does the right hon. Gentleman agree that that was a bad idea? Like other Members, I am glad that that did not happen. We should stand up to such acts and be proud that the uniform of the Army, Navy or Air Force is worn in this country.
Mr Murphy
I fully endorse everything that the hon. Gentleman says. I recently enjoyed visiting his constituency in an unusual bout of sunshine; coming from Glasgow, I was not used to that.
The hon. Gentleman makes an important point. For understandable reasons, our armed forces were, for a number of decades, to some degree invisible to the public eye because of the republican extremist violence emanating from Northern Ireland. Although there were questions during the first few hours after the attack the hon. Gentleman mentioned, it is right that we have settled on the position that our armed forces should continue to travel and be visible to the public mind and public affection. Although such a position is always taken under the best available advice, the hon. Gentleman makes an important point.
Mr Jim Cunningham
On the cuts to the armed forces and their replacement with reservists, the Federation of Small Businesses said that a lot of their members would think twice before employing a reservist. Will my right hon. Friend comment on that?
Mr Murphy
I will comment on that a little later. It is an important point. The Regular Army is being cut to about 82,000 and the reservist force is being doubled to about 30,000. It is crucial for our country that that is done in the right way. The issue is partly about how the Government interact and explain the benefit of having reservists in the workplace. I shall come back to that a little later.
I hope that Armed Forces day, in recognition of all those who have fallen, will be a reflection of the emotions that we feel—a commemoration of loved ones lost and a celebration of all they achieved and their comrades can continue to achieve; I am thinking not just of their deeds in the armed forces, but the love they gave, the friendships they built and the memories in which they are held.
The covenant is a statement of collective purpose, as my hon. Friend the Member for Corby (Andy Sawford) said. Its principles cut across classes, sectors, regions and nations of the UK. Businesses, local communities, central Government and local authorities all have a responsibility to deliver the highest possible levels of care and support to the service community. Of course we operate within financial constraints, but a pooling of our commitment and imagination can lead to better policy and meaningful results. That is why we have urged local authorities to have veterans champions—a dedicated person at each council to develop support for service leavers to help them to resettle into civilian life. On return from the front line or in departing the forces, many service leavers struggle with the transition from military to civilian life.
Angus Robertson (Moray) (SNP)
I am sure that the right hon. Gentleman will join me in praising all of Scotland’s local authorities for signing the covenant. On pooling, does he think that there is a useful model in understanding the work of Veterans Scotland, which brings together 53 veterans’ organisations to work with the Scottish Government and the UK Government to ensure that veterans have the appropriate policy delivered at a Scottish and a UK level?
Mr Murphy
It is a rare occasion when the hon. Gentleman and I are in full agreement on defence matters, because we have an entirely different vision for the future of UK defence. He makes a very important point. It is a cause for some celebration that all 32 of Scotland’s local authorities have community covenants. Of course, there is an issue of scale in England, but achieving 100% in Scotland is a remarkable achievement. I would like to put on record the whole House’s congratulations to all those local authorities.
Sir Menzies Campbell (North East Fife) (LD)
Mention of Scotland raises in my mind a prospect that many of us regard as unfortunate: that the contribution made by Scotland over many years—hundreds of years—to the British Army might in some way be prejudiced were Scotland to become independent and create its own armed forces. Does the right hon. Gentleman agree that that tradition is worthy of protection and is as powerful an argument as any against the idea that Scotland should hive off from the United Kingdom?
Mr Murphy
The right hon. and learned Gentleman is exactly right; he makes an important point. One of the remarkable things about the patchwork nature of the United Kingdom is the way in which our four nations come together in some of our most important institutions, none more so than our armed forces. For very many people in Scotland, but also across the UK, the idea of tearing that apart demonstrates that independence is a powerful idea of the 19th century that is ill suited to the complexity of the 21st century.
All this work and all this support from veterans’ champions are crucial to ensure that the armed forces covenant becomes a reality on the ground. For some time, I have reflected that although an Opposition party is formally out of office, it is not out of power. That is why we, as the Opposition, have worked with business to develop and deliver the veterans interview programme, which encourages employers to offer veterans a guaranteed interview or other form of enhanced employment support. It is a voluntary scheme that gives veterans a chance to show employers how their skills and experience could benefit their businesses. The Department for Work and Pensions has agreed to roll it out nationally.
Patrick Mercer (Newark) (Ind)
Does the right hon. Gentleman agree that with the several hundred charities that now exist all facing in the right direction, there is perhaps a lack of co-ordination in bringing their efforts together for the best benefit of the veterans concerned?
Mr Murphy
The hon. Gentleman, who served with such gallantry, makes an important point. The work that COBSEO—the Confederation of Service Charities—is doing could be important in this regard. Understandably, a plethora of new organisations has been created, born out of the remarkable emotion in the country whereby people wish to do something—anything—to support our armed forces. In a little while I will announce one more organisation that will be doing important work in future. I hope that the hon. Gentleman shares my sense of satisfaction about that.
Through the veterans interview programme, about which I have just spoken, we are working in partnership with some of the nation’s largest employers. This morning, in another partnership with business, I updated the Opposition’s Fighting Fitter campaign, through which health and leisure centres provide discounts for members of the forces and their families. Five national health companies are taking part: Nuffield Health, Pure Gym, David Lloyd, Virgin Active and ukactive. Between them, they have more than 450 sites that will offer discounts for the armed forces. We hope that others will do the same this weekend and beyond.
I was joined at the launch this morning by an Olympic athlete. When I tweeted that fact earlier this morning, people got in touch to find out which Olympic athlete would be joining me on the publicity trail. The top suggestions were Jessica Ennis and Sir Chris Hoy. However, if you will forgive me on this one occasion, Madam Deputy Speaker, for the misuse of parliamentary terminology, it was not Sir Chris Hoy, but another knight: our very own Sir Ming Campbell. As the House will know, he competed a blink of an eye ago in the 1964 Olympic games in Tokyo. His other claim to fame, as he has said before, is that he defeated O. J. Simpson on the running track. We were joined, I am pleased to say, by the Chairman of the Defence Committee, the right hon. Member for North East Hampshire (Mr Arbuthnot), in the House of Commons gym in an all-party show of support for the Fighting Fitter campaign.
Bob Stewart
There is no chance of me ever being an Olympic athlete. I would like to inform the House what happened when the shadow Secretary of State visited the Marines. Apparently, they sent him on a run and he beat the lot of them. Since then, they have never recovered.
Mr Murphy
Defeating the Marines in a run is one thing; defeating the shadow Chancellor in the marathon is another. I know which one I will pay for the longest. I think that he was only two hours behind me —[Interruption.] However, I do not keep records of these things and, I am sure, neither does he.
Let me get back to what I am meant to be reading out. The Opposition believe that it is vital to protect through anti-discrimination legislation those who protect our nation. As my hon. Friend the Member for Coventry South (Mr Cunningham) said, recent polling shows that one in 20 service personnel have suffered abuse in the street. My hon. Friend referred to the attitude of businesses in the survey. A private Member’s Bill presented yesterday by my hon. Friend the Member for Dunfermline and West Fife (Thomas Docherty) proposes that abuse of the forces should be treated as aggravated, thus guaranteeing specific punishment for those who attack our forces. The polling also demonstrates that 18% of service personnel have been refused service in a public place. The Bill also proposes to outlaw discrimination against members of the forces in the provision of goods and services. That is vital if we are to tackle disadvantage that arises from military service. Although I am certain that the Bill can be improved technically, I hope that it will gain cross-party support.
We hope that the whole House will support the initiatives that I have mentioned: the veterans interview programme, local armed forces champions, the Fighting Fitter campaign and the anti-discrimination legislation. I look forward to hearing from the Minister, whom we also did not invite to our session at the gym this morning. I hope that he will reflect on each of those initiatives which, although launched by the Opposition, are free from party politics.
Mr John Baron (Basildon and Billericay) (Con)
Before the right hon. Gentleman moves on from veterans, does he think that it is important that we recognise the role played by British nuclear test veterans? Those veterans played a unique service role at the dawn of our nuclear weapons programme, but the country has never recognised them properly. We rank pretty close to the bottom of the international table of decency on this issue compared with other nuclear countries. Does he think that it is time to put that right?
Mr Murphy
The hon. Gentleman raises an important and long-running issue. All I would say is that I have met, and will continue to meet, representatives of those veterans, as do hon. Members on all sides of the House. I am sure that the Government are grappling with this matter. Under the previous Government a settlement offer was made, but my recollection and understanding is that that was blocked, seemingly by legal process and by lawyers. If that had not been the case, compensation might already have been provided. It is disappointing and regrettable that that has not happened.
An essential element of duty of care is how we support those who have served to get back into work post-service. Being in the armed forces often provides personnel with friendship, if not near-familial support. It can be disorientating and disconcerting when bonds with compatriots are suddenly broken and the norms of military life are lost.
Charles Hendry
Does the right hon. Gentleman accept that there is a challenge for people who have tremendous skills and expertise from their time in the armed forces? When they move on, potential employers who have suitable vacancies often do not employ them because they do not have relevant industrial experience. Does he see a role for organisations such as ForceSelect and others to work with those leaving the armed forces and with potential employers to help ensure that they have the opportunity for a long-term career outside the forces too?
Mr Murphy
The hon. Gentleman makes an important point. He and his wife continue to do so much to support armed forces charity. I had the opportunity to attend one of his functions, which managed to raise thousands of pounds. His point about the relationship and interaction between potential employers and service leavers is crucial. The Government, as part of a national effort, should help to lead the way in breaking down some of those barriers and fostering a greater degree of understanding. The approach that we favour, as the hon. Gentleman hinted at, is to enhance post-service support and introduce much more rigorous in-service training. That would not only ensure that those who leave have the skills and structures to help them advance in new careers, but strengthen the operational effectiveness of the services by increasing the skill levels of personnel while they are still serving.
On post-service support, we want to see a permanent umbrella body, set above the brilliant but sometimes fragmented third sector, that will be a one-stop shop for leavers and that would vastly increase access to support and services.
Andrew Percy (Brigg and Goole) (Con)
I, with other members of the Northern Ireland Affairs Committee, recently met the US Department of Veterans Affairs, which produces a “bible” for veterans. Does the right hon. Gentleman agree that we need to have something similar in this country: a one-stop shop for all the services, support and benefits that are available for veterans?
Mr Murphy
The hon. Gentleman makes a serious point about how we can learn from international experience. A lot of information is available online, but not in print. If he wishes to suggest to the Government that they produce their own bible, I am sure that the Education Secretary would be happy to write the foreword. The hon. Gentleman raises an important point, and I am sure that those on the Government Front Bench are listening.
While it is right that members of the armed forces—this relates to the point about an additional organisation—do not have a union and cannot join a union, I want to mention for a moment the role of trade unions in the important work of post-service workplace support. I know that some in the country, and perhaps even some in the Chamber today, bemoan the role of unions, but I am delighted to inform the House that earlier this afternoon I attended an event with the general secretary of the Community union, Michael Leahy. I hope that the whole House will welcome the news that the Community trade union has announced its intention to work with parliamentarians on all sides and other stakeholders to position themselves as the UK veterans’ union. It is well known that Community supports me in my work as shadow Defence Secretary, and from now on it will be able to offer specialist, bespoke provision to help veterans find gainful employment and continue to make a valuable difference.
Changes in post-service support should be just one side of the reform we need, which is why we are arguing for faster academic attainment within the services. In recent evidence, the Defence Select Committee said:
“The provision for meeting the literacy and numeracy needs of our service personnel would benefit from further improvement.”
A system where many of those who defend our country are left without additional basic skills is bad for our troops, the Army and our country. We believe that through close collaboration with the MOD, the Department for Education and the devolved Administrations across the country, there can be opportunities to reach level 2 within two years for those without qualifications. This should apply across the UK because while education may be devolved in Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland, our collective responsibility to our forces is not. I want to make it certain that members of the forces would benefit from such changes, no matter where in our islands they live. There should also be specialist training in literacy teaching, increased provision of Army apprenticeships within the infantry and easier conversion to civilian qualifications. Enhanced in-service education would be a genuine means of progression for military men and women.
Turning briefly to the issue of reservists, the House will be aware that in the light of the Government’s structural change in the Army—as my hon. Friend the Member for Coventry South has mentioned—realising defence planning assumptions rests largely on doubling the number of reserves to 30,000. Labour Members support a larger role for the Army reserve, as it will rightly be known, but we are concerned that plans are as yet insufficiently available in detail to give members enough information and senior military figures have raised public concerns about their confidence in the success of the current process.
In advance of the forthcoming White Paper, there are a number of policies that we believe the Government should consider, not least to ensure the compatibility between longer training and deployment time periods and the employment of a larger reserve force.
Ian Austin (Dudley North) (Lab)
Will my right hon. Friend join me in congratulating the people of Dudley on the contribution they make to the reservists through A squadron of the Royal Mercian and Lancastrian Yeomanry, which is based in Vicar street, Dudley? It is the best recruited squadron in the country; it recently took on 47 new trainees and is processing another 60 now, and has had two dozen volunteers on active service in Afghanistan.
Mr Murphy
My hon. Friend has been so strong in support of his Territorial regiment. When I was in Dudley, the campaign was so fierce that it was the one issue about which the local media wanted to talk. I congratulate him, and the Government will have to take into account the point he makes, not only about the high regard in which the unit is held in Dudley but the fact that it is recruited to full strength and is indeed over-subscribed. I look forward to the Minister responding to that specific point.
There must also be real protection for reservists. Current legislation says clearly that an employer has a duty to re-employ a returning reservist in the occupation they were employed in before their service and on the same terms and conditions. There is, however, no legislation to prevent an employer from discriminating against reservists in their hiring procedures on the grounds of their military affiliation. The Government should now consult employers specifically on new legislation to protect against discrimination in hiring reservists, which would need to be coupled with an obligation of transparency from reservists to declare their status.
Mr Baron
Is the shadow Secretary of State’s concern compounded by the fact that if we look at the present mobilisation rate of the existing TA, which stands at about 40%, we see that plugging the gap left by the loss of 20,000 regulars would require 50,000 reservists and not 30,000? Does the rundown of the TA forces in recent years, including the closure of TA centres and the fact that TA numbers are in decline, worry him?
Mr Murphy
The hon. Gentleman has raised these matters in Defence questions and other defence debates, and he will continue to do so. He sounds a clear warning to the Government and anyone who wishes to govern that in order to be successful, this policy—of boosting reservist numbers, engaging with employers and getting right the proportion of regulars to reservists and the relationship and integration of units and individuals—has to be done almost faultlessly. It is an enormous challenge to cut the Regular Army at this pace in the expectation that reservists will fill the gap, and I know that he will continue to raise that point.
Finally, the evidence shows that some reservists can suffer worse post-service psychological issues than regulars, in part because of the speed of the transition from military to civilian settings, so we should consider how we can increase access for reservists to military medical services in order to tackle the potential mental health problems that a minority—I stress, a minority—experience.
The Opposition will regularly disagree on many aspects of domestic and on some aspects of defence policy, and the decision to leave certain key capability gaps following the defence review will remain controversial and continue to provoke enormous debate, but Armed Forces day should be defined not by a political contest between parties, but where possible by consensus and celebration. The groups comprising our national defence—the high-skilled industrial work forces that make world-class equipment, the civilian government work force who do so much to support our forces, the charities whose unrivalled support and commitment to our armed forces personnel provide a lifeline when often another does not exist, and the families, who are sometimes forgotten, but who make sacrifices to support the actions of their family members on the front line—will each participate in this Saturday’s celebrations, but uppermost in our thoughts will be the hundreds lost in recent conflicts and the thousands in service overseas this weekend and unable to be at home and to join in the commemorations and celebrations. We remember them, we thank them and, this weekend, we celebrate them.
The Minister for the Armed Forces (Mr Andrew Robathan)
I am pretty sure that I do not have to, but I will anyway, declare that I am in receipt of a service pension so I have an interest in this debate.
I will not be able to respond to all the points that have been raised today, but I will try. I know that hon. Members on both sides of the House will not be hesitant in sending me letters if they want a particular point answered to which I have not been able to respond.
Today’s debate has been remarkably consensual, which I welcome. It has demonstrated that Members of the House care passionately about supporting our service personnel. We are fortunate to be able to rely on the men and women of our armed forces, for whom as Minister for the Armed Forces I have some responsibility. It is a much over-used word, but it is a real privilege to have that responsibility and to work with members of our armed forces. I know that the hon. Member for North Durham (Mr Jones) has done that, as well as others in the House.
The dedication of our armed forces to maintaining our security and protecting our interests and values means that Britain is able to act as a force for good in the world, defending our national interests and our international obligations. We are all proud of what they do.
I was in Scotland this morning visiting one of our deterrent submarines and the submarine service on the Clyde, and it was extremely impressive and very professional. I know that other hon. Members will have seen that as well. The role of the armed forces both in the deterrent and elsewhere is difficult and sometimes dangerous. I pay tribute to their bravery and professionalism, which represent the very best qualities our nation has to offer. We owe them and the families who support them an enormous debt of gratitude. That is why the Government are committed to supporting the success of Armed Forces day, which was indeed introduced by the previous Government. It allows the public to express their appreciation of those who have served their country.
I was going to say that the right hon. Member for East Ranfrewshire, sorry Renfrewshire (Mr Murphy)—
Mr Robathan
Sorry, it is for me. I was going to say that he was better at running a marathon than—but then he was very consensual, so I won’t. I pay tribute to his time for the marathon. As he knows, I set him a target, which he beat very easily. Well done.
I am afraid that the hon. Member for Sheffield, Heeley (Meg Munn) will have to wait for the White Paper for a decision about moving 38 Signal Regiment from Sheffield. I would like to have heard more discussion from my hon. Friend the Member for Aldershot (Sir Gerald Howarth) about the Supreme Court judgment last week on extending human rights to the battlefield. It is a subject on which Members from both sides of the House may wish to comment. I know that we will be looking carefully at that judgment, and that we have some concerns.
I was sorry to hear about the constituent of the hon. Member for Middlesbrough South and East Cleveland (Tom Blenkinsop). I understand that my right hon. Friend the Minister of State, Ministry of Defence, the right hon. Member for Rayleigh and Wickford (Mr Francois), wrote to him only yesterday and we do not believe that this is a general problem. Leaving aside the armed forces and reservists, I thought that the Opposition had accepted that we need to make serious savings, as we have been doing over the past three years, for all the reasons that he understands. On this day the newspapers have published the letter from the right hon. Member for Birmingham, Hodge Hill (Mr Byrne) which says that there is no money.