Universal Credit and Personal Independence Payment Bill

Chris Vince Excerpts

2nd reading
Tuesday 1st July 2025 Commons Chamber

[Mrs Badenoch]

I am not surprised that the hon. Gentleman is baffled, because he is clearly not listening to what I am saying. We had three conditions. We have been very, very clear that we want to see the welfare budget come down. I will make some progress.

Even with the changes in this Bill, welfare spending will still be higher by billions at the end of this Parliament. Slowing down an increase is not a cut: we need to get this under control.

[Chris Vince (Harlow) (Lab/Co-op)]

Will the right hon. Lady give way?

[Mrs Badenoch]

I will make some progress.

Despite the obvious flaws in the Bill, we offered to support benefit changes in the national interest. The hon. Member for Gateshead Central and Whickham (Mark Ferguson) asked a question, and I will answer it very clearly for those who have not been paying attention. We agreed to support the Government if they could make three simple commitments; they were not unachievable or unreasonable commitments. First, they had to cut the overall welfare bill, because we are spending far too much already. Secondly, they had to get more people into work. Thirdly, they had to stand by the Chancellor’s own commitment that, with taxes at a record level because of her choices, she would not come back for more tax rises.

What did we get from the Government? A sneery response indicating that they could manage on their own. How’s that going? What happened instead was that the number of MPs opposed to the Bill grew ever larger, until the inevitable U-turn finally came, announced by a press release dispatched after midnight and a panicked letter setting out that the reforms had been gutted. The Bill is now more incoherent than it was at the beginning.

Draft Financial Services and Markets Act 2000 (Regulated Activities etc.) (Amendment) Order 2025

Chris Vince Excerpts

Wednesday 25th June 2025 General Committees

[The Parliamentary Secretary to the Treasury (Torsten Bell)]

I beg to move,

That the Committee has considered the draft Financial Services and Markets Act 2000 (Regulated Activities etc.) (Amendment) Order 2025.

It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mr Stuart.

Consumers have waited too long for the change before us. More than 10 million people now use buy now, pay later products. When used responsibly, such products can help people manage their finances. Many especially value the fact that the products are interest-free, often making them an affordable alternative to credit cards and personal loans. Yet, unlike those traditional forms of credit, buy now, pay later products sit outside the UK’s consumer credit regulatory framework. That is because buy now, pay later products fall under an exemption originally designed to help small businesses offer instalment plans to their customers. In recent years, however, innovative fintechs have used the exemption to roll out buy now, pay later products offering to customers, usually at an online checkout, new ways to pay via the likes of Klarna, PayPal and Clearpay.

Small firms do not need authorisation from the Financial Conduct Authority, nor are buy now, pay later agreements required to adhere to the Consumer Credit Act. That approach makes sense for small businesses offering simple instalment plans for goods and services, but it is not right for the large-scale consumer credit lenders now in this market.

Back in February 2021, under the previous Government, the Woolard review set out the risks of that unregulated market. First, there are no rules on what information buy now, pay later firms must give their customers. Too many people are left unclear about what they owe, and some do not even realise that they have taken out credit. Secondly, the firms are not required to check whether people can afford these products. Finally, that lack of checks brings real danger.

[Chris Vince (Harlow) (Lab/Co-op)]

Does the Minister agree that this draft legislation is particularly important to protect those facing hardship? Potentially, people—certainly residents in my constituency—may feel the need to turn to buy now, pay later products, but given that they are not regulated, that could lead them into further debt.

[Torsten Bell]

My hon. Friend makes an important point that is generally relevant to financial services regulation: we want the availability of credit for people, but we want it done safely. That is exactly what the changes are about. As I was saying, debt can quickly mount up when people take out several buy now, pay later products at once, with no one checking what they already owe.

The previous Government rightly pledged to bring the products into regulation, although sadly did not get to the point of delivering on that promise. I am proud that, in May, this Government laid this draft order to bring unregulated buy now, pay later products offered by third-party lenders into regulation under the Financial Conduct Authority. That will bring proper oversight of such firms and strong protection for consumers.

In future, buy now, pay later firms will have to carry out robust affordability checks, ensuring that consumers are protected from taking on debt that they cannot afford. Firms will also be required to give consumers clear information. That will help people to decide whether buy now, pay later is right for them, and to know that support is available if they face financial difficulty. Buy now, pay later users will gain strong rights under the Consumer Credit Act, including section 75 protection. That will make it easier for consumers to get a refund if something goes wrong with a purchase. Crucially, consumers will have the right to take their complaint to the Financial Ombudsman Service. That will guarantee them access to a fair, independent resolution if problems arise. Those are the rights and protections that users of other regulated credit products already enjoy. It is only right that users of buy now, pay later products receive them, too.

There is also something new: the Financial Conduct Authority will be able to develop a modernised information disclosure regime for buy now, pay later products, set by FCA rules, not by the Consumer Credit Act. We have recognised, in line with feedback, including from consumer groups, that the existing provisions of the Consumer Credit Act on information requirements do not suit interest-free, short-term buy now, pay later products. However, this is not special treatment for these products. On the same day as we laid the draft order that we are debating today, we launched a consultation to reform the Consumer Credit Act more widely.

Lastly, let me stress that a new regulatory regime is not just a win for consumers. Buy now, pay later firms will benefit as well. For years, they have faced regulatory uncertainty. This order ends that uncertainty, and we have ensured that the order delivers a smooth transition to regulation for them. They will be able to continue lending under a temporary permissions regime while the FCA authorisation is under review. That guarantees business as usual, for them and for customers, throughout the transition.

Twelve months after this order is made, the new regulatory regime for these products will come into force. In that time, the FCA will consult on and finalise the rules that will govern buy now, pay later lending. We must not delay giving millions of consumers the vital protection that they deserve.

I thank the Committee for its attention to this issue and would welcome any questions from the shadow Economic Secretary to the Treasury or any other Members.

Oral Answers to Questions

Chris Vince Excerpts

Monday 23rd June 2025 Commons Chamber

[Liz Kendall]

I do not recognise the attitude that the hon. Member describes—quite frankly, we feel precisely the opposite. This vital benefit makes a crucial contribution towards the extra costs of living with a disability. That is why we want to reform it to protect it for generations to come, because we do not think that it is sustainable to have a doubling of the number of people on PIP over this decade from 2 million to more than 4.3 million. It is also why we are putting in extra employment support, why we want to support employers to do more to recruit and retain disabled people, and why we want to reform Access to Work—a vital scheme that helps people—because disabled people should have equal rights, chances and choices to work, and that is what we seek to deliver.

[Chris Vince (Harlow) (Lab/Co-op)]

This morning, I had the pleasure of visiting PACT for Autism, a brilliant local charity in Harlow. It raised concerns about the accessibility of the PIP application process for those with autism. As the Department looks to reform the process, could that be considered?

[Liz Kendall]

I absolutely will consider that. In fact, I ask my hon. Friend and his constituents to feed into the work that my right hon. Friend the Minister for Social Security and Disability is doing. We have to ensure that it is as easy and effective as possible to access that vital benefit. It is crucial for people with autism, and we want to make it work properly.

Winter Fuel Payment

Chris Vince Excerpts

Monday 9th June 2025 Commons Chamber

[Chris Vince (Harlow) (Lab/Co-op)]

I thank the Minister for his statement, which pensioners in Harlow will welcome. The fastest growth in the G7, three trade deals and four interest rate cuts—is that the context in which the Minister feels we are able to provide more pensioners in Harlow with the winter fuel allowance?

[Torsten Bell]

My hon. Friend always does a good job of not only representing Harlow, but remembering the economic progress that is being made. If anyone did not hear what he just said, he talked about rising growth, rising wages, interest rates falling and a country back on the path to success.

PIP Changes: Impact on Carer’s Allowance

Chris Vince Excerpts

Thursday 27th March 2025 Commons Chamber

[Sir Stephen Timms]

The key proposal in the Green Paper is the default recording of assessments, so that when something goes wrong, we can check back and see what happened. I have had the experience, as my hon. Friend probably has, of talking to people who have been through the assessment and then seen it and said, “Well, that wasn’t me. It is unrecognisable.” That should not be happening, and we want to change that.

[Chris Vince (Harlow) (Lab/Co-op)]

I thank the Minister for his statement. I declare an interest as the chair of the all-party parliamentary group for young carers and young adult carers. Does the Minister agree that the role of young carers is critical not only to those who are cared for, but to the economy? Although young carers under 16 do not receive carer’s allowance, will he consider the impact of any plans on young carers and how we might better support them?

[Madam Deputy Speaker]

Order. Before the Minister responds, I remind the hon. Member that this is an urgent question, not a statement.

British Sign Language Week

Chris Vince Excerpts

Thursday 20th March 2025 Westminster Hall

[Jen Craft (Thurrock) (Lab)]

I beg to move,

That this House has considered British Sign Language Week.

[In British Sign Language: I beg to move, That this House has considered British Sign Language Week.]

It is a great pleasure to serve under your chairship, Sir Desmond. I thank those who have supported today’s debate: the hon. Members who sponsored my application to the Backbench Business Committee; the members of the newly formed all-party parliamentary group on British Sign Language, who had ideas for how to celebrate Sign Language Week; and the British Deaf Association, which campaigns tirelessly to promote the interests of the deaf community. I am delighted that we have live British Sign Language interpretation today, and I am grateful to the House authorities for supporting it. It means that we are able to have members of the deaf-signing community join us in the Public Gallery. [In British Sign Language: Welcome to Parliament, and I hope you enjoy the debate.]

As the theme of this year’s Sign Language Week captures well, BSL is more than a language. For the 87,000 first-language signers in the UK, it represents culture, community and belonging. It is symbolic of a unique way of life—one that empowers deaf people to overcome the barriers they face from birth. It provides connection, not only in the deaf-signing community, but to their loved ones. Sign language creates special moments that other families might take for granted. The first time a parent tells their deaf child, “I love you,” might be using sign.

My daughter has Down’s syndrome and experiences hearing loss, so my husband and I use sign-supported English, which is a form of BSL, as part of our toolkit to communicate at home. To any BSL first-language speakers who are watching, I am going to attempt some BSL throughout this speech, so my apologies. [In British Sign Language: I am trying.]

It is with a real sense of personal pride that I open this debate. It is an opportunity to celebrate Sign Language Week and the rich culture it commemorates, while discussing how we as MPs can go further to improve access and the inclusion of the BSL community. The progress that has been made to date is testament to the determination of deaf campaigners, but British Sign Language is not a new phenomenon; it has existed for hundreds of years. There are printed accounts of a national language of the hand dating back as far as the 17th century, but it was only in 2003 that BSL was officially recognised as a language, and it was not until the British Sign Language Act 2022 that this nominal recognition was translated on to the statute book, with legal recognition of BSL. I pay tribute to the former Member for West Lancashire, Rosie Cooper, for leading that private Member’s Bill through Parliament.

The Act was a watershed moment in galvanising public support, and Rosie Cooper’s exceptional campaigning has left an enduring legacy. The Act legislated for the promotion and inclusion of BSL in Government, and led to the creation of the BSL advisory board, which has done excellent work to put the experiences and voices of deaf signers at the heart of Government. It placed a duty on Departments to prepare and publish reports on the use of BSL in their communications. From May 2023 to April 2024, BSL activity in Government communications doubled, and the overall number of Government Departments that said they had not produced any BSL communications halved, from 11 to five. However, there is still much further to go. Five Government Departments is still five too many.

[Chris Vince (Harlow) (Lab/Co-op)]

[In British Sign Language: Will my hon. Friend give way?]

[Jen Craft]

I will.

[Chris Vince]

My hon. Friend is giving a passionate and knowledgeable speech. Does she agree that, in terms of Parliament, this is a question of accessibility? We want people with BSL as their first language to be able to not only access politics but be a part of it as well.

[Jen Craft]

[In British Sign Language: I thank my hon. Friend for his intervention.] As people will see, we have tried to learn some parliamentary signs ahead of this debate. My hon. Friend is absolutely right—it is a question of accessibility. If someone is a British Sign Language first-language speaker, there are barriers to taking part in this House. There absolutely should not be. This is the House of Commons of the United Kingdom. There are 87,000 BSL first-language speakers and they absolutely deserve their place here as much as hearing people do. Too frequently, Government consultations, including on the national health service 10-year plan and the welfare reform Green Paper, have BSL interpretation as an afterthought, if it exists at all.

In wider society, we need to see a renewed focus on the needs and interests of the deaf community. Some 90% of deaf children are born to hearing parents, but support to learn BSL is based on a postcode lottery. Across the country, there is a patchwork of sign language services, with a mix of local authority and third-sector provision. According to research by the National Deaf Children’s Society, almost half of local authorities neither provide, fund nor commission any courses in sign language for families.

--- Later in debate ---

[Chris Vince (Harlow) (Lab/Co-op)]

It is a pleasure to serve under your chairship, Sir Desmond. I thank my hon. Friend the Member for Thurrock (Jen Craft), my best friend, for securing this hugely important debate—sorry to everybody else! I pay tribute to my hon. Friend the Member for Lewisham North (Vicky Foxcroft), who in April 2021 was the first Member of Parliament to use British Sign Language during Prime Minister’s Question Time, bringing to the attention of the then Prime Minister the fact that there were no BSL interpreters at the then Prime Minister’s press briefings.

I came to this debate not speaking any BSL other than to say “thank you” and “Will my hon. Friend give way?”, which I learned yesterday. To be honest, having tried learning French in the past, I know that I am not very good at languages, so I appreciate the comments of my hon. Friend the Member for Thurrock about those who have difficulty learning languages—some would say my English is not great, either.

The contributions that I have heard so far from hon. Members from across the House have really moved me and made me think a lot about my own practice. When I go back to Harlow and my constituency team tomorrow, I will have conversations with them about how we ensure that any engagement that I have with members of the public in Harlow—including my MP surgeries—is compatible with BSL, because what I do not want, and I am sure no Member wants, is our constituents feeling that they cannot have access to their MP in their first language.

I want to talk about accessibility. I declare an interest because I am a member of the Modernisation Committee. It is really important that everyone, no matter their situation, has the opportunity to achieve. I have been impressed in many ways by how accessible the House is. Last week, members of Razed Roof—an inclusive theatre company that I am a trustee of—visited Parliament. Simon, who I have mentioned before, who often relies on physical communication and is wheelchair-bound, was able to get a tour of Parliament, which he enjoyed a great deal. The only slight problem came when we went to St Stephen’s Hall. But clearly there is more we can do. We do not just want to make Parliament accessible; we want to make politics accessible, and not just so that people who have BSL as a first language can access politics, but so they can participate in politics and perhaps even be an MP.

As my hon. Friend the Member for Thurrock said, there are 87,000 people who use BSL as a first language, so I ask the Minister how we can better ensure that they can participate in politics and play an active part in it. It would not be a Westminster Hall debate in which I was taking part if I did not mention young carers: I pay tribute to the number of young people who have to learn BSL to communicate with a parent or loved one. The points made about ensuring that BSL is part of the curriculum and that it is not a postcode lottery are really important, particularly to young carers. We have spoken about the difficulties parents have in being able to access BSL to communicate with their children, but it works both ways.

Of course, I recognise that life exists outside this place and I want to briefly touch on education—another of my favourite topics. The Department for Education has not yet made BSL part of the curriculum, but will give schools the option to offer a BSL GCSE. As my hon. Friend the Member for Chelsea and Fulham (Ben Coleman) mentioned, a GCSE for BSL was expected in September 2025. Can the Minister tell us how this is progressing? That would be really useful to know. There is also currently no national programme for early years BSL, as other Members have covered.

Let us as politicians work with organisations like the BDA and the Royal National Institute for Deaf People to make not only this place, but society, an inclusive place for everyone, including those people for whom British Sign Language is their first language. We should not have a postcode lottery.

Welfare Reform

Chris Vince Excerpts

Tuesday 18th March 2025 Commons Chamber

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Judith Cummins)]

The final question from the Back Benches will come from Chris Vince.

[Chris Vince (Harlow) (Lab/Co-op)]

Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker. I thank the Secretary of State for her statement. I think we all know that the current system is not only broken, but unsustainable. I welcome her focus on supporting the long-term unemployed, and I would point to some good examples of the work we are doing in my constituency. However, would she agree that we need to support those constituents in Harlow, many with severe disabilities, who cannot work, and end this merry-go-round of constant reassessment?

[Liz Kendall]

Madam Deputy Speaker, you were saving the best till last, as always, with my hon. Friend.

We absolutely will protect those with severe disabilities who can never work. I do not want to see them having to go through deeply worrying reassessments, and we want to put that right. For people in Harlow who can work but have been denied such opportunities, we will fix the broken system, tackle the perverse incentives left us by the Conservatives, and give people the hope and opportunity that there are better days ahead.

Oral Answers to Questions

Chris Vince Excerpts

Monday 17th March 2025 Commons Chamber

[Alison McGovern]

The hon. Gentleman will know that the Public Authorities (Fraud, Error and Recovery) Bill is going through the House at the moment. The issue that he has raised is at the forefront of the attention of the Minister for Transformation, my hon. Friend the Member for Stretford and Urmston (Andrew Western), who will take every step he can to deal with issues in that area.

[Chris Vince (Harlow) (Lab/Co-op)]

On Friday I visited Stansted airport, a huge employer for my constituency, and found out about the important work it is doing with the DWP and the jobcentre to get long-term unemployed people back into work. What work is the Department doing with organisations such as Stansted airport to promote good practice, such as that at Stansted and Working Minds in my constituency?

[Alison McGovern]

Through my hon. Friend, I give my thanks to everybody at Harlow jobcentre, because it sounds like they have their shoulders to the wheel in getting job opportunities for people who need them. When we arrived in the Department, we uncovered that there was not nearly a good enough relationship between the Department and employers. That is why we put a new strategy in place to do the basics well: there is a single point of contact and we are making sure that there is on-the-job training that is tailored to specific employers. We will be doing more to promote change in that area, but I thank everyone in Harlow for the efforts they are making.

Women’s State Pension Age Communication: PHSO Report

Chris Vince Excerpts

Tuesday 17th December 2024 Commons Chamber

[Liz Kendall]

I am sure the right hon. Gentleman could have encouraged his party to do a compensation scheme when he was in government. The reason the ombudsman actually referred the report to Parliament was because he did not believe the last Government when they were running the Department for Work and Pensions would deal with it properly. This Government take our responsibility seriously, and that is why we have come to Parliament today to make this difficult decision.

[Chris Vince (Harlow) (Lab/Co-op)]

A Conservative Member said to me this morning that being the Secretary of State for the DWP is probably the hardest job in Government, and I think today we can really see that. I pay tribute to the WASPI women in my constituency, and in particular Gina, who emails me regularly about this issue. What reassurances can the Secretary of State give WASPI women such as Gina that we will do everything we can to support them and to ensure that issues like this do not happen again?

[Liz Kendall]

As I said in my statement, I understand that many women born in the 1950s face a real struggle and, on this specific decision, they may well be disappointed, but our commitment to pensioners and to the pensions triple lock will deliver an extra £30 billion into the basic state pension over this Parliament. Our investment in the NHS, about which many 1950s-born women are desperately worried, of £22 billion this year and next, shows our commitment to the issues that matter to those women. As I say, they may be disappointed and, indeed, angry about the decision, but we believe that it is the fair and right decision. However, I would be more than happy to talk to my hon. Friend in further detail so that he can pass on comments from WASPI women in his constituency.

Oral Answers to Questions

Chris Vince Excerpts

Monday 16th December 2024 Commons Chamber

[Sir Stephen Timms]

The hon. Gentleman makes an interesting suggestion. That is not something I am considering at the moment, but as he will have heard me say earlier, we will be reviewing universal credit over the course of the next year or so. We certainly want to support young care leavers—he will know of the recent announcement that we made about changes to carer’s allowance—and we are keeping all those matters under review.

[Chris Vince (Harlow) (Lab/Co-op)]

12. What assessment she has made of the potential impact of the youth guarantee on young people in Harlow constituency.

[Catherine Atkinson (Derby North) (Lab)]

23. What assessment she has made of the potential impact of the youth guarantee on young people in Derby North constituency.

[The Secretary of State for Work and Pensions (Liz Kendall)]

Our new youth guarantee will ensure that every young person is earning or learning, tackling the scandal that we inherited of almost 1 million young people not in education, employment or training. Young people in Harlow, Derby North and across the country deserve the opportunity to work, get skills and build a better life, and that is what this Labour Government will deliver.

[Chris Vince]

In my constituency of Harlow, lots of fantastic organisations provide transferable skills for young people, and I thank the right hon. Member for Basildon and Billericay (Mr Holden) for reminding me of the name Jason Shaves, who is an incredible champion for that kind of work. Does the Secretary of State agree that giving local areas such as Harlow the flexibility, power and funding to engage with young people in the way that best works for them will get them back into employment quicker?

[Liz Kendall]

I absolutely agree with my hon. Friend. That is why we are going to give new powers, responsibilities and funding to local areas to deliver our youth guarantee. They know their communities best. They know the voluntary organisations, schools, training providers and businesses, and the mental health and other support that many young people need. In Harlow, I know that that approach will be key to giving young people the opportunities that my hon. Friend wants and that they deserve.