British Indian Ocean Territory

Caroline Nokes Excerpts

Wednesday 26th February 2025 Commons Chamber

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Caroline Nokes)]

I advise the House that Mr Speaker has not selected the amendment in the name of the Liberal Democrats.

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[Priti Patel]

My hon. Friend is absolutely right. This is a critical time for our two countries when it comes to both our place and our standing in the world. All we have seen from this Government is an epic failure in diplomacy, and concession after concession. The Labour Government have shown themselves to be weak. Not only have they undermined our strategic defence interests and our very close relationship with our dear ally, but they are putting our territories at risk and wasting taxpayers’ money. We need a Government who stand tall in the world and who fly the Union flag with pride rather than the white flag of surrender.

The deal is an epic failure in diplomacy and it is causing our standing in the world to fall. The House must vote for our motion to defend our national interests and Britain’s standing in the world.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Caroline Nokes)]

Order. Before I call the Minister, I must inform the House there will have to be an immediate five-minute time limit on Back-Bench contributions, which obviously excludes those from the Front Benches.

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[Anneliese Dodds]

No, I said that I would make progress.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Caroline Nokes)]

Order. As the shadow Minister will know, the Minister is not obliged to take interventions from the Dispatch Box.

[Anneliese Dodds]

Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker. Let me explain to Conservative Members, because I feel they are perhaps unaware of the fact that the ICJ advisory opinion is simply the most eye-catching of a huge number of legal concerns around the present situation. Those who had the genuine security of that base at the front of their minds would be determined to secure its future. Without a deal, it is inevitable that Mauritius would pursue a legally binding judgment against UK sovereignty.

Since 2015, 28 international judges and arbitrators have expressed views on the sovereignty of the Chagos archipelago. [Interruption.] Conservative Members are keen to shout. I wonder if they can tell me how many have agreed with the UK’s position. They are very quiet. That is because not a single one of those arbitrators and judges have expressed support for the UK claim about sovereignty. That lack of legal certainty would have real-world impacts on base operations and create space for our enemies. Some of those impacts would be on simple but crucial things, such as securing contractors and getting overflight clearances. I regret that the Opposition said not a single word about the issue of securing contractors and getting overflight clearances. There were other matters that they did not talk about.

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[Anneliese Dodds]

No, I will keep speaking, as is my right. Without a negotiated solution with Mauritius, it would pursue its legal campaign; it has made that very clear, as the shadow Minister knows. That would lead to an inevitable, legally binding judgment, which would be—[Interruption.]

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Caroline Nokes)]

Order. I will not have this level of shouting at the Minister. I will hear her, and of course, it is within her right not to take interventions. Please can Members approach this debate in an orderly fashion?

[Anneliese Dodds]

Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker.

As I was saying, in that kind of situation, we would unfortunately see international organisations following that determination, such as the International Telecommunication Union. [Interruption.] I heard from the Opposition Front Bench, “Let them have a go.” The consequences of letting them have a go could be that critical spectrum for telecommunications that is essential for our security is compromised, another issue about which I sadly heard nothing from the right hon. Member for Witham.

The legal necessity of this deal has rightly been recognised by successive Governments.

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[Mr Francois]

On a point of order, Madam Deputy Speaker. I apologise, but to prevent the Minister from inadvertently misleading the House, in answer to a parliamentary question, we have it from Sir Chris Bryant, ironically—

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Caroline Nokes)]

Order. Mr Francois, you know that you must not refer to Members by their name.

[Mr Francois]

We have it from the telecoms Minister that the International Telecommunication Union has no power to veto the use of military spectrum, so it could not interfere with satellites. That is the Government’s official position; does the Minister now wish to correct her remarks?

[Anneliese Dodds]

rose—

[Madam Deputy Speaker]

Order. I think I will respond to the point of order first. The shadow Minister will know that that was not a point of order, but a point of debate.

[Anneliese Dodds]

I do not want to embarrass the right hon. Gentleman, but he surely understands the difference with access to spectrum, which is the key issue here. It is critical. I find it strange that he allots that issue so little consideration, when it could be of such strategic importance to our country.

The right hon. Member for Witham talked about remarks from Mauritian Prime Minister Ramgoolam. It appears that she has been spending a lot of time looking him up at length on the internet. I therefore find it rather strange that she did not see what he stated on 5 February, where he set the record straight about the terms of the deal. Perhaps she does know about this, but chose not to refer to it in her remarks. He confirmed what this Government have been saying with clarity and consistency since the announcement of a political agreement in October, so let me spell out what we have said about the duration and terms of the treaty and what Prime Minister Ramgoolam confirmed, which appears to have been missed in previous comments.

The deal will be for 99 years and can be extended if both sides agree. The UK will additionally have a right of first refusal, meaning that the islands cannot be given to any other country at the end of the treaty without us first agreeing, and there are no changes to the rights and authorities that we will have to operate the base. Parliament will have the opportunity to scrutinise the details of the treaty after signature, when it is laid for scrutiny under the Constitutional Reform and Governance Act 2010 process before ratification. We would be delighted to have the right hon. Lady’s scrutiny, as would be usual.

To suggest that there was an acceleration of the negotiations before the Mauritian election flies in the face of the facts, as has been the case with many comments from the Opposition on this matter. When we took office, the negotiations had been ongoing for two years. We continued to engage with the Mauritian Government and to work in lockstep with the United States. While we recognise that it was in the interests of all sides to finalise the deal quickly, we did not put a completion date on the negotiations. We did not do so then and we do not intend to do so now. We are of course engaging with the new US Administration, including discussing the full details of the agreement, just as we engaged with the previous US Administration. I find it rather strange that the Opposition are confused about the nature of modern negotiations.

As we and Mauritius have said repeatedly, including in joint statements on 20 December and 13 January, both sides remain committed to concluding a deal on the future of the Chagos archipelago that protects the long-term effective operation of the joint UK-US base on Diego Garcia, continuing the practice of the previous Government. As is usual in these circumstances, negotiations have been led by officials with clear guidance and oversight from Ministers.

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[Dr Al Pinkerton (Surrey Heath) (LD)]

I am struck by the fact that it has taken nearly an hour of discussion and debate in this Chamber for Chagossians to be mentioned for the first time—not a single member of His Majesty’s loyal Opposition chose to mention Chagossians in their multiple interventions. I have spoken to Chagossians over many months and years, and they have told me they are genuinely fearful of being traded from the United Kingdom to Mauritius, a Government who have—

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Caroline Nokes)]

Order. I am sure the hon. Gentleman is getting to his point, but interventions really should be shorter. He could have put in to speak in the debate, had he wished. He has a few more moments—that is all.

[Dr Pinkerton]

I would simply ask the Minister: what role have Chagossians played in the negotiations thus far? She mentions a marine protected area—I know for a fact that Chagossians have not been consulted on that particular point.

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[Anneliese Dodds]

What I have said is that there is clear risk to critical functions of that base on Diego Garcia because of legal jeopardy. Conservative Members do not appear to be aware of those issues for contractors, insurers and communications and from the risk of hostile states when it comes to the outlying islands, while the Government are concerned about that risk. I detailed earlier the 28 different judges and arbitrators who have expressed an opinion on this. To suggest that there is no legal jeopardy is, I am afraid, for the birds.

To conclude, this deal has had support across the US national security apparatus. The previous US Administration supported the deal. The new US Administration is rightly ensuring that they are satisfied. The deal has been welcomed by India and the UN Secretary General. The shadow Foreign Secretary mentioned China in her remarks. Again, I know that Conservative Governments have been confused about China. They have oscillated all over the place in their relationship, but can she or anyone tell me whether China has welcomed this deal. No? A pin could drop, Madam Deputy Speaker. China has not welcomed it because it knows that it will strengthen our country’s position in the region for the foreseeable future. Security must be our priority, but we have also negotiated an agreement that protects the unique marine environment and reflects Chagossians’ demand. This deal will protect the base, solidify our relationship with our closest ally and reinforce the UK’s global leadership. Anyone who values UK national security and that of our allies should back this deal.

[Madam Deputy Speaker]

I call the Liberal Democrat spokesperson.