Arms Export Licences: Israel

Brendan Clarke-Smith Excerpts

Tuesday 12th December 2023 Westminster Hall

[Brendan Clarke-Smith (Bassetlaw) (Con)]

It is, as always, a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Sir Christopher. I thank the hon. Member for Coventry South (Zarah Sultana) for bringing the debate to this Chamber.

Hamas’s barbaric 7 October attack on Israel featured unspeakable acts of brutality and sexual violence. The attacks left 1,200 dead and thousands injured and the bodies of many victims remain unidentifiable due to the severity of the violence. Hamas chose to break an existing ceasefire the day it launched the heinous genocidal attack. Acts of terrorism have not ceased since and more than 12,000 rockets have been launched indiscriminately at Israel since 7 October.

[Scott Benton (Blackpool South) (Ind)]

Israel is fighting a war that it did not want or start against an enemy that shows complete and utter disdain for its own civilian population by embedding its terrorist infrastructure in schools, hospitals and mosques. Does my hon. Friend agree that Israel has a legal right to defend itself and to remove the grave threat posed by a terrorist organisation whose stated aim is to wipe it completely from the world map?

[Brendan Clarke-Smith]

I thank my hon. Friend for his intervention. He is, of course, absolutely right: Israel does have the right to defend itself. I would argue that the biggest threat to the Palestinian people is not Israel, but Hamas. We must bear that in mind.

[Angus Brendan MacNeil]

Is the death toll of 17,000 in Gaza defence?

[Brendan Clarke-Smith]

It is very important when anybody takes any sort of action that civilians are protected. As with all wars, there are casualties. I wish Hamas had borne that in mind when they started this and broke the ceasefire in the first place. However, with any action that is taken, I would protect civilians and ensure that there are safe routes and humanitarian pauses so that we can ensure that we save as many lives as possible and prevent this from happening. I take the hon. Gentleman’s point, and it is important that we minimise casualties on both sides. We encourage that and we encourage a long-standing peace.

Of course, there will be casualties on both sides, and that is something that we want to avoid, but the intention to repeat the attack again and again has been boasted of very publicly. Some 137 hostages remain cruelly within Hamas control, and the group is using them as a sickening bargaining chip. No democratic state can be expected not to act in self-defence when faced with such an existential terror threat. I applaud the UK Government for resolutely supporting Israel’s duty to its citizens to remove the threat posed by Hamas but, like everyone in this place, I hope for a just and lasting peace in the region. That is why I believe that the Foreign Secretary, Lord Cameron, was right last week when he said:

“If we leave Hamas in charge of even a part of Gaza, there will never be a two-state solution because you can’t expect Israel to live next to a group of people that want to do October 7 all over again.”

[Carol Monaghan]

rose—

--- Later in debate ---

[Brendan Clarke-Smith]

I will give way to the hon. Lady first and then to the hon. Gentleman.

[Carol Monaghan]

The hon. Gentleman mentioned Israel’s right to defend itself against Hamas. My hon. Friend the Member for Na h-Eileanan an Iar (Angus Brendan MacNeil) asked whether those 18,000 civilians were defence. I would add, are 6,000 children defence? We now have a situation where 800 experts say that this could possibly be a genocide against the Palestinian people. How can we continue to support it, because, if we do continue to support Israel in their bombardment of Gaza, we are complicit in this genocide?

[Brendan Clarke-Smith]

I thank the hon. Lady for her intervention, but I think it is wrong to imply, as the debate appears to, that Israel alone is responsible for the current situation in Gaza. Hamas have ruthlessly controlled Gaza now for almost two decades, and have inflicted a great amount of suffering on the civilian population. They have also deliberately prioritised this genocidal terrorism with direct support from the Iranian regime. Israel did not seek this war. It hoped, wrongly, that Hamas was moderating itself and more interested in governing the Gaza strip, but that does not appear to be the case.

[Colum Eastwood]

Israel’s stated aim in this conflict is the destruction of Hamas, and the UK and US Governments have given it a blank cheque to achieve that aim. I have not met one serious expert who believes the destruction of Hamas is possible, so how many deaths will it take before the UK Government closes their cheque book to Israel?

[Brendan Clarke-Smith]

I disagree with the hon. Gentleman that a blank cheque has been provided. If we look at the comments of the Foreign Secretary and the former Foreign Secretary, we know we have spoken with our international partners and are very keen to see that two-state solution, and that means working with Palestinians as well. As I said, the biggest enemy of the Palestinian people is Hamas; we want to work together to finish this conflict as soon as possible and move on.

[Richard Foord (Tiverton and Honiton) (LD)]

The hon. Gentleman says that Hamas is the biggest threat to Israel, but will he not acknowledge that Hezbollah, located to the north of Israel with up to 130,000 rockets, is probably more of a threat? Will he also acknowledge that we have to look at the bigger geopolitics? This is a proxy war being fought with Hamas as one combatant, and many civilians as the poor, unfortunate victims of this war.

[Brendan Clarke-Smith]

The hon. Gentleman makes an excellent point; he is absolutely correct on the Hezbollah situation. This conflict involves several different sides—I mentioned Iranian involvement—and there are a number of people who simply do not want peace in the region as it is not in their interests, whether that involves funding groups such as Hezbollah or such as Hamas. Israel was looking at a deal on relations with Saudi Arabia, so the hon. Gentleman is absolutely right that the geopolitics are also important; we must not look at Israel and Gaza purely in isolation. I thank him for making that excellent point. I agree with him and we need to continue to focus on that.

The approach to Hamas has proved misguided and so far it has shown the world the true brutal face of the organisation. I believe that calls for an arms embargo against our democratic ally are deeply wrong, and all the more so in the absence of clear calls for Hamas—the instigator and belligerent in this situation—to surrender unconditionally.

The Minister will be aware that the UK has long benefited from the Israeli military’s technology. Every day it protects the lives of many British soldiers. For example, we have Israeli-made battlefield medical technology, techniques for dealing with suicide bombers, and technology to counter remotely detonated terrorist bombs. Those assets have all been used by the British Army to save lives.

Israeli drone technology such as the Watchkeeper WK45 has also been used by British forces in Afghanistan for intelligence collection, and the Sky Sabre missile defence system now protects the Falkland Islands—this uses the technology behind Israel’s Iron Dome system. It is worth noting that the Iron Dome has saved the lives of countless Israelis in recent weeks and has also played a major role in preventing the conflict from spiralling further, which of course we also want to do.

The 2030 road map signed by the UK and Israel is very welcome. It highlights further bilateral defence co-operation that will save the lives of British servicepeople for many years to come. Put simply, an arms embargo would jeopardise that invaluable co-operation. It is also worth noting at the outset that the UK already operates—as has been mentioned—the world’s most robust export licence controls. That is underpinned through strategic export license criteria that uphold the UK’s obligations under international law. It is worth bearing in mind that the UK’s defence exports to Israel are relatively small—just £42 million last year I believe—and many of its component parts are not used by Israeli forces in Gaza.

Calls for an arms embargo on Israel are part of the wider boycott campaign that the UK Government have resolutely rejected. It is harmful and divisive, and must be given no truck. I call on the Minister to restate that commitment today.