Procedure Committee Reports

Baroness Berger Excerpts

Thursday 13th October 2011 Commons Chamber

[Mr Knight]

I hear what the right hon. Gentleman says. If I may, I shall return to his point when I address the terms of the amendment.

[Luciana Berger (Liverpool, Wavertree) (Lab/Co-op)]

Does the right hon. Gentleman agree that it is wrong if Members decide to have a little snooze? The motion states that we should behave with decorum. Is that not the point? We should use electronic devices sparingly, but the option to use them should be available.

--- Later in debate ---

[Luciana Berger (Liverpool, Wavertree) (Lab/Co-op)]

I am grateful for the opportunity to speak in robust support of the main motion and strongly against the amendment. The main motion seeks to allow Members to use hand-held devices in a way that does not impair decorum. We are all adults, and we are all mindful of how we are viewed in the eyes of the public and of the importance of being respectful to each other. It is therefore right that we use our phones and our tablets with discretion. It is also correct that laptops should be banned—they conceal people’s faces and make a noise—and it is right that any smartphone or tablet should be in silent mode when used. It is always regrettable and often embarrassing when a colleague’s phone beeps or rings in the Chamber.

I cannot support an amendment that allows Members to receive and send only urgent messages. According to an e-mail that explained this amendment, the intention behind using the term “urgent messages” is to ban tweeting, among other things, from the Chamber. Twitter started five years ago and now has more than 100 million active users. More than 300 MPs use Twitter. It allows us, in a bite-sized 140-character nugget, to talk to people outside this place. While it is not a replacement for traditional forms of communication, it is a very useful way to connect with the communities we were elected to represent.

[Tracey Crouch (Chatham and Aylesford) (Con)]

I am a user of Twitter myself. One of its advantages is that messages have to be condensed into 140 characters to communicate with the outside world. Does the hon. Lady agree that we could learn from that, and try to condense more of our contributions to 140 characters?

[Luciana Berger]

I thank the hon. Lady for that intervention. That point has been made by many people engaged in the discussion about whether we should be able to continue using Twitter from the Chamber. I shall go on to refer to some of those contributions.

Many of us have a function whereby our tweets are listed on our websites for people to read, particularly for those who do not access the main Twitter website. Some MPs have been lambasted for using Twitter solely to publish press releases or to state what they are doing. Others use it to engage in debate. A conversation on a topic can unfold on Twitter via a hashtag. I started #keeptweeting to initiate an online discussion and identify what the public thought about tweeting in the Chamber. I was careful to ask what people thought about using Twitter in this place, not outside it.

The fact that the amendment has been tabled at all has provoked anger from some. For example, @RichSwitch said:

“No wonder people think Politicians are out of touch”.

There were many tweets offering reasons why Chamber tweeting should continue. I will not read them all, but I have picked a few relating to a number of themes. Some see it as a means of engagement. For example, @LeamingtonSBC said:

“Surely anything which widens public participation in the democratic process is a good thing!”

Similarly, @NHConsortium said:

“Parliament already seen as cut off & static, don’t amputate it further.”

Others shared why Twitter was important to them in understanding what is going on. Thus @maggieannehayes admitted that

“parliament can be such an alien place. MPs tweeting enables us, the voters, to get a sense of what’s happening”.

[Mr Gray]

Does the hon. Lady agree with me that she has taken a somewhat self-selecting sample? She has asked the twitterers whether or not they like twittering. I would have thought that they probably would do.

[Luciana Berger]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for his intervention. I shall come on to the responses of people who thought that we should not continue tweeting. I have a selection here. To continue, @PercyBlakeney63 said, “Citizens deserve transparency”, while @Daisydumble said, “Censorship of MPs now”.

[Claire Perry]

Does the hon. Lady agree that tweeting helps MPs to stay informed, in touch and accountable to their constituents, and that to ban it would be an inexplicable step back in time? That is 138 characters.

[Luciana Berger]

I thank the hon. Lady for her succinct, pithy and tweetable intervention of 138 characters, and I wholeheartedly agree with everything she said.

All too often we are accused of being inward-facing. The public say that we are out of touch and inaccessible. Twitter allows us to make politics relevant, and makes us as individuals accessible.

[Kerry McCarthy]

I am not sure whether my hon. Friend was in the Chamber when we discussed whether we should able to discuss whether the UK Youth Parliament should be allowed to sit here on a Friday for the second year running. It was a debate on whether to have a debate on that subject. Many MPs were here into the early hours of the morning. It was important that we could tweet and explain to people, particularly young people, what on earth this charade they were watching on the BBC Parliament channel was all about. Many young people wanted to know what we were talking about. I think that was the best use of Twitter in the Chamber that I have encountered so far. I think people valued the fact that their MPs were prepared to explain to them what was going on.

[Luciana Berger]

I thank my hon. Friend for her intervention and wholeheartedly agree with everything she said. That was a good example of something embarrassing—the prospect of not allowing the Youth Parliament to sit in this place. We debated it for many arduous hours and came to the right decision in the end. The fact that we were able to communicate with the public, particularly with those young people who wanted the opportunity to come here, was a fantastic use of Twitter. Twitter also enables us to offer an immediate reaction to a debate, to signal when we are going to speak—as I did just before I began my speech—and to inform our constituents how we are voting.

[Dr Huppert]

I have the great honour, I believe, of having been the first of all current MPs to join Twitter. It has been useful. [Interruption.] I was not an MP at the time I joined; I do not claim that. I, too, have received a number of comments about this debate. A number of people said that they had become interested in politics as a result of following Twitter and receiving tweets from myself, the hon. Lady and others. There are also people who actively tune into debates because they know what is happening; they can quickly understand what is being debated in this place. The TV and online audience for Parliament goes up because of Twitter. Another point is that deaf people have no better way of following a debate in this Chamber as it happens.

[Luciana Berger]

I thank the hon. Gentleman, who makes two points on which I shall elaborate in a few moments. As I said, I believe that Twitter, for the reasons I outlined, allows our constituents to hold us to account better.

A number of Members have said that if the public want to know what is going on, they should watch our proceedings on television. However, as @Scarletstand said, people “can’t all watch” it “on TV”. Not everyone has access to a television or a computer for internet TV, although they may have internet access to sites like Twitter on their mobile phones. It also less likely that the public would choose to watch the Parliament channel. The right hon. Member for Bermondsey and Old Southwark (Simon Hughes) expressed in an earlier intervention his worry about what people might think as they watched us on television, but according to BARB—the Broadcasters Audience Research Board—the average weekly viewing per person of BBC Parliament is just one minute.

[Kevin Brennan]

That much?

[Luciana Berger]

That much. I think it is when they flick through to get to another channel. As @Scarletstand went on to say, tweeting from the Chamber

“helps voters gauge mood & tone”.

[Simon Hart (Carmarthen West and South Pembrokeshire) (Con)]

Is the hon. Lady aware of any evidence relating to MPs like me who do not tweet to suggest that our constituents are less satisfied with us than other constituents are satisfied with their MPs who do tweet?

[Luciana Berger]

I am not aware of any evidence to suggest that constituents would be less happy with their MPs if they did not tweet. I am saying, as I have said before, only that Twitter enables us to reach out to a wider audience. It should not be a replacement for traditional forms of communication, but for younger constituents and people who go on to our websites and want to see some pithy little updates, Twitter provides that opportunity. As I said earlier, it also enables people to gauge the mood and tone of this place, which they might not be able to pick up by watching television.

One aspect that had not occurred to me until I opened up the debate on Twitter is the fact that, as the hon. Member for Cambridge (Dr Huppert) mentioned a moment ago, it has positive benefits for people with hearing impairments. The BBC parliamentary channel is not subject to the BBC’s 100% subtitle commitment, and pledges just 800 hours of subtitled content a year. As @TimRegency observed, Twitter is one really useful way for deaf people to get involved in political discussion and debate.

Some objections were expressed. @JimSpin said that we could not concentrate and tweet. However, I would argue that we can, and that tweeting is equivalent to sending a text message, which takes just seconds. I agree with the hon. Member for Devizes (Claire Perry) that both women and men are able to multi-task.

@Donna_Smiley asked:

“Can surgeons tweet from operating theatres, policemen in a raid, jurors from courtrooms, teachers from classrooms?”

I would argue that the audience for each of those individuals—the surgeon, the teacher and the juror—is immediately in front of him or her, whereas we are accountable to our constituents, who are a long way from this place.

Do not get me wrong. I am not advocating constant tweeting, or tweeting while we are talking. As @TrojanFanl969 said,

“mp’s to use common sense. 50 tweets an hr bit silly, but selective use v good, engaging with electorate etc.”

Just two countries in Europe have banned tweeting, and I do not think that we should join them. @RichSwitch said:

“A ban on Tweeting in the chamber would be unconstitutional”.

I am not sure that I agree, but I do believe that—as he also says—it would be

“anti-democratic, regressive and bemusing to the public”.

Business of the House

Baroness Berger Excerpts

Thursday 8th September 2011 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

I am grateful to my hon. Friend. He will know that issues relating to taxation are matters for the Chancellor at the Budget, and are therefore usually matters for the Finance Bill. He may have heard at Treasury questions on Tuesday the exchange in which my right hon. Friend the Chancellor made it clear that the 50% rate was temporary and subject to a review by Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs to see how much revenue it raises. That review will not be completed until early next year. I know that my right hon. Friend will take the views of my hon. Friend the Member for Colchester (Bob Russell) into account, along with others, before he comes to his Budget judgment.

[Luciana Berger (Liverpool, Wavertree) (Lab/Co-op)]

Today is the launch of the It’s Liverpool, I’m Liverpool campaign, which shows why the city is such a vibrant and exciting place to live, work and study. It is also the friendliest city in the country, according to a recent travellers’ survey. Will the Leader of the House join me in backing the campaign, and can we have a debate on how the Government can support great British cities such as Liverpool?

[Sir George Young]

I endorse what the hon. Lady said about Liverpool. In a former Administration, along with my right hon. Friend Lord Heseltine, I was part of an initiative to assist Liverpool in the difficult time it went through after the riots. I applaud her campaign and will see what more can be done by my colleagues at the Department for Communities and Local Government and the Department for Business, Innovation and Skills to assist the regeneration that is under way.

Business of the House

Baroness Berger Excerpts

Thursday 14th July 2011 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

That, in a sense, follows on from the two earlier questions about the responsibilities of the Backbench Business Committee. Previous debates on issues such as fisheries, defence and the EU were provided for by the Government, in Government time. The recommendation of the Wright Committee was that all those days, which would include days for debates such as the one to which my hon. Friend refers, should be put in a pot and allocated to the Backbench Business Committee. That is exactly what we have done, so responsibility for finding time for the debate to which he refers falls to the Backbench Business Committee, using, in the rest of the Session, one of its 35 days plus.

[Luciana Berger (Liverpool, Wavertree) (Lab/Co-op)]

I was in the unfortunate situation, on Tuesday in my housing market renewal Westminster Hall debate, of having before me a Minister who was not able adequately to answer the debate. He was clearly out of his depth and referred to very serious issues experienced by my constituents as sob stories. My hon. Friend the Member for Birmingham, Erdington (Jack Dromey) asked the Minister to withdraw his comments, and he did not. Realising that he had made a mistake, the Minister got his civil servants to doctor the record, which, two days later, has still not been corrected—all while the Minister for Housing and Local Government, who should have been answering the debate, was tweeting about a round-table discussion in his Department just five minutes down the road. To ensure that those mistakes do not happen again, will the Leader of the House ensure that the relevant Minister answers the very real concerns of our constituents that we articulate and debate?

[Sir George Young]

I understand that the debate was replied to by a Minister from that Department who has responsibilities for housing, and I am sure that he discharged his responsibilities adequately. The hon. Lady mentioned doctoring the record; it is not, so far as I am aware, possible to doctor the record. The Hansard Reporters report faithfully that which is said.

Business of the House

Baroness Berger Excerpts

Thursday 7th July 2011 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

My hon. Friend is right: we allocated money to PCTs with the specific objective of transferring it through to local authorities to be used to fund social care. That was the precise objective. We asked PCTs to work with local authorities to agree jointly on appropriate areas for social care investment. I will raise what my hon. Friend has said with a Health Minister.

[Luciana Berger (Liverpool, Wavertree) (Lab/Co-op)]

The Charity Commission has recently completed a strategic review to determine how Government spending cuts will affect staff in its organisation. Draft proposals show up to 42% of staff at the Liverpool office being made redundant, with a large amount of those staff on lower pay grades. In view of the urgency of the situation and the threat of job losses in Liverpool, may we please have an urgent debate on how Government cuts to the charitable sector are affecting the lowest paid?

[Sir George Young]

I hope that the hon. Lady will concede that we took a number of initiatives in the Budget to promote giving to the charitable sector. We also set up a transitional fund to help charities through what is a difficult time. There will be an opportunity on the final day before the recess for the hon. Lady to speak in one of the Adjournment debates that I announced at the beginning of business questions.

Business of the House

Baroness Berger Excerpts

Thursday 30th June 2011 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

My hon. Friend is absolutely right. Perhaps he was in the House on Tuesday, when the Minister for Universities and Science, my right hon. Friend the Member for Havant (Mr Willetts) made a statement—which was well received, certainly on this side of the House—offering a sustainable future for higher education, giving more power to students to choose their university and rewarding those universities that perform well. Also, looking ahead, we will strike a fairer balance between taxpayers and students.

[Luciana Berger (Liverpool, Wavertree) (Lab/Co-op)]

I recently met Frankie, a Whizz-Kidz ambassador in Liverpool, who told me about the situation that he is facing. He finishes school this year, but he still does not know whether the course that he has applied for at the local college will be made available. He will not find that out until August. His travel to the youth club has been cut, and his opportunities to socialise have been significantly scaled back. Frankie and his family face an uncertain future. May we please have an urgent debate on how the Government’s cuts are specifically affecting disabled older teens?

[Sir George Young]

In taking the difficult decisions that we had to take to get the deficit under control, we have sought to protect vulnerable members of the community—people who suffer from disabilities, the elderly and the sick; we protected the NHS budget—and in our reforms to welfare, we are also seeking to protect people such as Frankie. Inevitably, some reductions in public expenditure have had to be made and it would help if the hon. Lady’s party would at some point indicate how it would have responded to the fiscal challenge that we inherited.

Business of the House

Baroness Berger Excerpts

Thursday 19th May 2011 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

My hon. Friend is right to say that one has to drill down into the figures to get a truer picture. The rise in JSA payments, to which he referred, was due in part to new measures to move single parents whose children are attending school off employment and support allowance and on to JSA. The important figures are the continuing fall in unemployment and the continuing rise in employment.

[Luciana Berger (Liverpool, Wavertree) (Lab/Co-op)]

A 19-year-old constituent of mine, Paul Lawrence, has been on remand since February. He is autistic and has been diagnosed with Asperger’s. He has tried to hang himself and has taken an overdose while in prison, and yet he has been kept locked in his cell, until recently in isolation, and is only let out for meals. His mother is constantly worried about his safety. May we have a debate about how vulnerable people are treated while on remand?

[Sir George Young]

There will be a debate on sentencing on Monday, during which the hon. Lady may have an opportunity to debate that matter. Some of the decisions on whether somebody should be on remand are decisions for the courts, and it is important that they retain their independence.

Business of the House

Baroness Berger Excerpts

Thursday 12th May 2011 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

It might be expecting too much for the Opposition to allocate the next Opposition day for a whole-day debate on the successes of the coalition Government. We have cut the deficit, we have capped immigration and we have frozen the council tax, etc., etc. The Localism Bill will be debated next week, and its Report stage might provide an opportunity to talk about our successes in that field.

[Luciana Berger (Liverpool, Wavertree) (Lab/Co-op)]

During the local election campaign, an 18-year-old candidate in my constituency was subjected to relentless attacks about his age by his Liberal Democrat opponent. One letter sent to residents made negative references to his age no less than three times. As the minimum age for standing for election was reduced to 18 to encourage more young people to get involved in politics, does the Leader of the House agree that his coalition partners should not attack younger people for wanting to serve their community? May we have a debate on how we might further encourage young people to take part in our democracy?

[Sir George Young]

I am very much in favour of young people standing for local government. The Deputy Leader of the House tells me that a 19-year-old in his constituency was recently successful, as was a 21-year-old in my own constituency. The more young people who stand for local authorities and, indeed, for this place, the better.

Oral Answers to Questions

Baroness Berger Excerpts

Thursday 28th April 2011 Commons Chamber

[Tristram Hunt (Stoke-on-Trent Central) (Lab)]

13. What discussions he has had with the BBC Trust on the future of local radio.

[Luciana Berger (Liverpool, Wavertree) (Lab/Co-op)]

15. What discussions he has had with the BBC Trust on the future of local radio.

[Mr Jim Cunningham (Coventry South) (Lab)]

16. If he will discuss with representatives of the BBC Trust future provision of daytime local radio services; and if he will make a statement.

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Vaizey]

I hear what the hon. Gentleman says. Had that statement been made by a Conservative, it would have been seen as an unwarranted attack on the BBC. However, I am glad that there is cross-party agreement on concerns about the level of BBC salaries, even if he has ruled out further appearances on the Andrew Marr programme.

[Luciana Berger]

Of the 40 BBC local radio stations, BBC Radio Merseyside is the most listened to outside London. We know that the Secretary of State has shown his passion for local media in his promotion of local television. What are he and the Minister doing specifically to ensure that 24-hour BBC radio programming continues?

[Mr Vaizey]

This is the second time this month that the hon. Lady has praised BBC Radio Merseyside in the House. I hope that she is reaping the benefits as a result. As I have said, it is not for the Government to tell the BBC what to do. However, my understanding is that some of these reforms, which are only proposals—and I genuinely think that the BBC does listen to hon. Members’ views—are driven more by concerns about content than concerns about saving money.

Business of the House

Baroness Berger Excerpts

Thursday 31st March 2011 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

I am grateful for my hon. Friend’s earlier comments. I think that my career has peaked, so he need not be too worried about jeopardising my future. I am not sure that there is time in the congested programme for ministerial questions to squeeze in my right hon. Friend the Chief Whip, but his door is ever open, as my hon. Friend knows, and he is always particularly pleased to see him.

[Luciana Berger (Liverpool, Wavertree) (Lab/Co-op)]

Last week’s Budget did little to help hard-working people up and down the country. More than 55,000 families in Liverpool will pay on average an extra £450 in VAT this year. With inflation at 4.4%, food and energy bills rising rapidly, but wages staying flat, household budgets are really being squeezed. May we please have an urgent debate on falling standards of living and the Government’s lamentable response to the problem?

[Sir George Young]

The short answer is no. We have just had a four-day debate on the Budget, during which there was ample opportunity to make those points. Nonetheless, there will be the Second Reading of the Finance Bill when we return after Easter, during which the hon. Lady will have an opportunity to share her concerns and have them addressed by one of my hon. Friends.

Business of the House

Baroness Berger Excerpts

Thursday 24th March 2011 Commons Chamber

[Sir George Young]

I welcome that initiative in my hon. Friend’s constituency, which shows that parents want to use the freedoms given to them under this Government’s legislation. I will draw his concern to the attention of my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Education, so we can see whether further steps need to be taken to make sure that those who want to establish free schools or academies are not intimidated as a result of misinformation.

[Luciana Berger (Liverpool, Wavertree) (Lab/Co-op)]

Further to the request made by my hon. Friend the Member for Westminster North (Ms Buck), I draw the Leader of the House’s attention to early-day motion 1640, tabled yesterday, which seeks to save BBC Radio Merseyside.

[That this House believes BBC Radio Merseyside is a loved and valuable institution within Merseyside, providing local news and entertainment to over 300,000 listeners; notes that BBC local radio offers exceptional value for money at a cost of 3.2 pence per listener hour, in comparison with other stations such as BBC Parliament (14.1 pence) and Radio 3 (6.3 pence); further notes that BBC Radio Merseyside is the most listened to BBC local radio station outside London; further notes that for a third of its listeners, 100,000 people, it is the only BBC radio station that they choose to listen to; is highly concerned at proposals that would end daytime programming; and calls on the BBC to protect its proud history of broadcasting on Merseyside with a commitment to fund BBC Radio Merseyside.

There are no fewer than 40 BBC local radio stations throughout the UK, all of which are cherished by their communities and provide excellent value for money at 3.2p per listener hour, but the news that local programming may be scaled back to “drive time” and breakfast time is extremely worrying. Please may we have an urgent debate on the future of BBC local radio programming?

[Sir George Young]

I understand the hon. Lady’s concern. It strikes me that this would be an appropriate subject for a Backbench Business Committee debate or an intervention during the pre-Easter recess Adjournment debate, but she has just made her case very effectively.