Mesothelioma Bill [Lords]

Baroness Primarolo Excerpts

Monday 2nd December 2013 Commons Chamber

[Chris Bryant (Rhondda) (Lab)]

On a point of order, Madam Deputy Speaker. The Minister is expecting to speak for a second time in this debate, but he is not prepared to give way during his speech now. Can you confirm that it is a matter of discretion for the whole House as to whether somebody is allowed to speak for a second time in a debate?

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo)]

If a Minister seeks to speak for a second time, it is with the leave of the House. As the hon. Gentleman knows, whether any Members, including Ministers, decide to give way to an intervention is entirely a matter for them and not for the Chair.

[Mike Penning]

I am conscious that lots of colleagues want to speak in this debate, which has been shortened because of the two very important statements that took place earlier. I have given way three times and there will be plenty of opportunities for Members to speak. The hon. Member for Rhondda (Chris Bryant) has probably got his press release, yet again, but that is unnecessary in this sort of debate.

I hope that the House will see the urgent need to push this Bill through and get it through its Committee and Report stages so that it goes on to the statute book and I am able to move the regulations that are under consultation as soon as possible. It can then provide compensation for our constituents who have been suffering from this terrible disease or, if they have died, for their dependants who need assistance from the scheme.

Housing Benefit

Baroness Primarolo Excerpts

Tuesday 12th November 2013 Commons Chamber

[Mike Freer]

You can bob up and down as much as you like. I have given way once.

The capital cost of adaptions for disabled people moving into smaller accommodation is also likely to be offset by the savings in rehousing those who are in temporary accommodation. In my authority, the average cost of adaption for a disabled property is £7,000, yet my council spends on average on emergency accommodation £14,000 for one placement. So one placement would pay for two houses to be adapted. Again, the fiscally incoherent Labour party argues that the cost of downsizing is offset by the housing benefit, but what about the larger families already in the private sector who may then be rehoused in those properties that become vacant? Little is said of that saving.

This is a completely one-sided debate. What about the private rented sector? People in such accommodation do not get spare rooms. What about the people in my office? They work, yet they do not even get a flat of their own. They have to share. You are quiet on the private sector. Let us make it fair. This was your policy. You were quite happy to tax the private sector spare rooms, but now you say no.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo)]

Order. The hon. Gentleman should calm down and stop accusing the Chair of everything. He repeatedly uses “you” when he should be directing his accusations to Opposition Members, not the Chair.

[Mike Freer]

I would never be rude to you, Madam Deputy Speaker, as you well know, but I feel passionately about this. I was raised in a two-up, two-down, with no outside toilet—[Interruption]—with an outside toilet and no inside bathroom. Opposition Members might laugh, but I know what it is like to live in poor accommodation and I do not need lectures from them about what it is like to live in poor accommodation. The Conservative party is the party of aspiration; it is the party that is solving the mess; and I will vote for the amendment.

Jobs and Business

Baroness Primarolo Excerpts

Friday 10th May 2013 Commons Chamber

[Rushanara Ali]

With a Cabinet full of millionaires, I think the empathy will be limited, but I hope that those Cabinet millionaires speak to Government Members who come from the kind of background that means they might have some understanding. If they even talked to some of their own colleagues—such as the former shadow Home Secretary, the right hon. Member for Haltemprice and Howden (Mr Davis), who, I understand, grew up on a council estate, and raised the issue of the Government and the Prime Minister being out of touch—they might learn a thing or two about how people have to live their lives. If they paid attention to ordinary, poorer constituents, they might learn a thing or two about what it is like to live below the poverty line or to struggle on a modest income. The changes the Government have made in people’s incomes—a reduction of £1,700 a year—have had a devastating effect on families and children. [Interruption.] The Minister is heckling, but I cannot hear what he is saying. He is welcome to make an intervention. Does he wish to make an intervention? No. He does not have much to say.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo)]

Order. Minister, either intervene or stop heckling. It does not help the recording of the debate to throw comments across the Chamber that not everyone can hear—the Hansard Reporters in particular.

[Rushanara Ali]

I am interested in hearing the Minister, if he would like to say anything.

[Mark Hendrick]

On a point of order, Madam Deputy Speaker. Given that we are debating the coalition Government’s Queen’s Speech, is it in order that only a Minister, a Parliamentary Private Secretary and a Whip are present? Not one Government Back Bencher is present for this very important debate.

[Madam Deputy Speaker]

Mr Hendrick, that is not a matter for the Chair. Who is in the Chamber or who answers for the Government is a matter for the Government and Government Members. You have got your point on the record, but perhaps we can now return to the debate on the Gracious Speech.

[Rushanara Ali]

I was about to come on to that. Clearly the legislative programme in the Queen’s Speech is riveting, given the extraordinary presence on the Government Benches—just four Government Members, including Front Benchers. That says it all. The Government cannot even pull together more than a handful of Members to defend their legislative programme. [Interruption.] There are five of them now. The Secretary of State for Work and Pensions is here. Perhaps he can defend it singlehandedly on behalf of the two parties in government. It says it all that so few people are in the Chamber to speak up for the Government’s legislative programme—or, rather, the lack of it.

I want to focus on unemployment, which, yet again, the Government’s programme—or lack of it—fails to address. In constituencies such as mine, long-term and youth unemployment continue to soar. The lack of opportunities remains significant; the lack of sufficient numbers of apprenticeship programmes to meet the demand is a real problem and a real challenge. If young and other unemployed people were given the opportunity to get a foot on the employment ladder, we could reduce not only the level of deprivation in constituencies such as mine, but the burden on the taxpayer of welfare costs. The way to reduce the deficit is to ensure that we get people back into work and economic activity.

The Government’s Work programme has managed to find work for only 2% of participants in my constituency. It is a scandalous waste of public money that only 2% of people are in jobs through that programme. Will the Business Secretary and the Work and Pensions Secretary look again at why their programme has had such little impact? Why not consider improving the system for getting people into work so that we can give people, in particular young people, hope and a chance to make a contribution to our economy? That kind of wasted talent cannot be good for our society or communities, and is certainly not how to recover from the economic troubles that we continue to face.

One suggestion that my party has made, but which the Government have failed to take on board, is the compulsory jobs guarantee. We know that having training programmes with a genuine guarantee of a job works. We demonstrated that it worked when we were in power, through the future jobs fund and apprenticeship programmes. I believe that the Business Secretary and the Work and Pensions Secretary want to get people into work. What I do not understand is why, if a programme does not work properly and manages to get only 2% of people into jobs, the Government will not reform it. When the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions went on his journey in opposition to discover poverty in constituencies such as mine, I thought he might have learned a thing or two about how to get people out of poverty and into work, but he clearly has not. He is too busy focusing on punishing people, rather than giving them hope and the opportunity to get a job.

Welfare Benefits Up-rating Bill

Baroness Primarolo Excerpts

Tuesday 8th January 2013 Commons Chamber

[Several hon. Members]

rose—

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo)]

Order. Interventions, even when invited, need to be relatively brief.

--- Later in debate ---

[Andrew George]

Of course we welcome the Labour party’s last-minute pre-election conversion to increasing tax for wealthy people. The right hon. Gentleman will have heard in my intervention on my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State my sincere misgivings and my wish to encourage him to review this rather arbitrary 1% cap and perhaps to find ways of relating it to average wages. Bearing in mind that the welfare budget is—

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo)]

Order. It was only a few moments ago, I remind the hon. Gentleman, when I said interventions on a speech needed to be brief and should not become a speech in their own right.

[Mr Byrne]

I am grateful for the intervention because I think the hon. Gentleman, like us, is concerned that in our country today a food bank is opening every three days, and that 5 million people may resort to payday loans this year in order to balance the books for the end of the month. The Sun on Sunday this weekend, in an article carried next to the one by the Secretary of State, said that a quarter of mums are now turning off heating so that they have enough money to feed the kids. Is that the kind of country that we are becoming, because the Saint of Easterhouse has now become the punch bag of the Treasury? Once he talked about broken Britain; now he is presiding over breadline Britain because he keeps losing his battles with the Treasury.

--- Later in debate ---

[Several hon. Members]

rose—

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo)]

Order. I remind all Members that there is a five-minute time limit on Back-Bench speeches.

--- Later in debate ---

[Sajid Javid]

As a Treasury Minister, I know only too well how crucial those savings are—[Interruption.]

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo)]

Order. The Minister has said he is not giving way, so we do not need people shouting from the side of the Chamber that he should do so. It is up to him.

[Sajid Javid]

I have five minutes left to sum up the whole debate and I need to take that time.

These savings are crucial. They show that the Government are dealing with the record budget deficit they inherited. They will help to build confidence that the UK is a country in which it is safe to invest in the long term. Meanwhile, in the short term, these are savings that we can reinvest to make a real difference for a stronger economy.

Several of my hon. Friends raised the issue of fairness, including my hon. Friends the Members for York Outer (Julian Sturdy) and for Cannock Chase (Mr Burley). We need to continue to get Britain back to work, but we also need to ensure that being at work pays. Since the beginning of the financial crisis, those in work have seen their average earnings increase by 10%, while those out of work have seen their benefits rise by 20%. This is not fair on taxpayers. It is not fair for my working constituents to pay out more to sustain welfare benefits at the exact time they are facing pressures to stretch their wages further. Nor is it fair to benefit claimants if we ensnare them in a position where it pays to claim benefits rather than to get out and find work.

It is worth reminding the Opposition that those people who work in the public sector, whom this Government employ to carry out their work—such as the people whom the right hon. Member for Birmingham, Hodge Hill used to send out to buy his soup when he was a Cabinet Minister—have seen their pay frozen for two years and will see it increase by 1% for a further two years. The Opposition supported that course of action, but they do not think it is right to have the same restraint—a rise of 1%--applied to benefits and tax credits.

Several hon. Members also rightly raised the issue of protecting the most vulnerable. Welfare spending is all about protecting the most vulnerable members of society. My hon. Friends the Members for Erewash (Jessica Lee), for Keighley (Kris Hopkins) and for Elmet and Rothwell (Alec Shelbrooke) made that point very well, and that is why the disability carer and pension elements of working age benefits and tax credits will be protected. It is why the basic state pension will continue to increase by the triple guarantee—the higher of earnings, prices or 2.5%. Even in the most difficult times, we need to protect those most in need and the changes in this Bill will achieve just that.

We have heard some sensible opinions this afternoon, although it has to be said that they have come almost exclusively from this side of the House. We have also heard some vehement and misguided opposition from the other side of the House. The Labour party opposed the Welfare Reform Bill. The Labour party opposed the benefit cap. Now the Labour party opposes this Bill. The Opposition want to spend billions increasing benefits while people up and down the country face pay freezes. They want to spend billions increasing benefits when they have supported our decision to freeze public sector pay at 1%. Given Labour’s opposition to this Bill, they really need to tell the British people where they would find that £2.5 billion for 2015-16. Would they cut the jobs of 70,000 teachers, or perhaps 40,000 doctors? Perhaps they would raise income tax by nearly 1%. If they do not want to do any of those things, perhaps they need to be honest and admit that the Labour party is for something for nothing, and is the same old Labour party that would borrow billions more to pay for higher benefits. We are taking sensible, measured steps to put right the economic mess that the Labour party left behind, and I commend the Bill to the House.

Question put, That the amendment be made.

Fund for European Aid to the Most Deprived

Baroness Primarolo Excerpts

Tuesday 18th December 2012 Commons Chamber

[Luciana Berger]

My right hon. Friend will know that if someone goes to a food bank, they must tick a box giving the reason they have to access emergency food aid, and more than 40% say it is because of delays to their benefit payments. Does my right hon. Friend share my concern that in an article in The Guardian, Ministers said they aim to ensure that 80% of recipients get benefits within 16 days? Sixteen days is long enough to wait for people who have no cushion or money at all, but what about the 20% of people who have to wait for more than 16 days? Does my right hon. Friend share my concern that—

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo)]

Order. Interventions should be brief and one at a time. The hon. Lady has made her point.

[Stephen Timms]

My hon. Friend makes an excellent point. As well as delays there is the problem of mistakes and people being wrongly sanctioned. Friday before last I met a young man in my constituency who has been sanctioned and told that he will lose benefits for 14 months because he is attending a residential course delivered by the Prince’s Trust. An agreement between Jobcentre Plus and the Prince’s Trust means that people on Prince’s Trust activities are not sanctioned if they are unable to sign on while on a residential activity, but in that case—and, I fear, in others—the agreement is not being properly implemented by the jobcentre.

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Cash]

Does it not smack rather of the words attributed to Marie Antoinette at the time of the French revolution, when she allegedly said of the starving people of Paris, “Give them cake”?

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo)]

Order. I should like both hon. Members to return to the specific points that we discussing this evening. The scope of the debate is the subsidiarity issue as outlined in the proposed reasoned opinion, and that is what we should be discussing.

[Jacob Rees-Mogg]

Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker. I am very glad that you have returned me to this absolutely key point.

Amendment X to the United States constitution, which is part of the Bill of Rights, provides for all powers that are not specifically designated for the United States to be reserved to the states themselves. What do we have in Europe? We have the vague term “subsidiarity”, which means that if in an impossibly short time a sufficient number of member states lodge an objection with the European Commission, it may, out of its benevolent generosity and kindness, decide to reconsider its proposals. This is what we are doing: we are saying to the European Union, “We think that what you are doing is wrong. We think that what you are doing is so fundamentally wrong that it should be opposed, and that it is indeed a scandal. We think that what you have done to member states is ruin their economies and then give them back €2.5 billion of their own money.”

The document states:

“European financial support can demonstrate the direct solidarity of the Union with the poor people”—

my hon. Friend the Member for Stone (Mr Cash) quoted this as well—

“thus taking up on the broad request by European citizens.”

Well, I do not like being a European citizen anyway. I think that it is an affront to be called such a thing. I am a subject of Her Majesty, and long may I remain so. However, I cannot imagine that anyone in this country, whether he or she accepts the term “European citizen” or not, really wants the EU, having crushed nations, then to give them crumbs from the rich man’s table. I am therefore delighted that Members on both sides of the House support the reasoned opinion.

Question put and agreed to.

Resolved,

That this House considers that the draft Regulation of the European Parliament and of the Council on the Fund for European Aid to the Most Deprived (European Union Document No. 15865/12 and Addenda 1 and 2) does not comply with the principle of subsidiarity for the reasons set out in Chapter 3 of the Twenty-second Report of the European Scrutiny Committee (HC 86-xxii); and in accordance with Article 6 of Protocol (No. 2) of the Lisbon Treaty on the application of the principles of subsidiarity and proportionality, instructs the Clerk of the House to forward this reasoned opinion to the presidents of the European institutions.

Jobs and Social Security

Baroness Primarolo Excerpts

Wednesday 28th November 2012 Commons Chamber

[Several hon. Members]

rose—

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo)]

Order. To ensure that all Members can participate in this debate, I am reducing the time limit, with immediate effect, to six minutes.

--- Later in debate ---

[Several hon. Members]

rose—

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo)]

Order. The winding-up speeches will start at 20 minutes to 7. I will divide the remaining time equally between the two Members who are yet to speak, which means they have five minutes each.

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Alan Campbell (Tynemouth) (Lab)]

claimed to move the closure (Standing Order No. 36).

Question put forthwith, That the Question be now put.

Question agreed to.

Question put accordingly (Standing Order No. 31(2)), That the original words stand part of the Question.

The House proceeded to a Division.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo)]

I ask the Serjeant at Arms to investigate the delay in the No Lobby.

Universal Credit and Welfare Reform

Baroness Primarolo Excerpts

Tuesday 11th September 2012 Commons Chamber

[Several hon. Members]

rose—

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo)]

Order. To accommodate as many Members as possible still wishing to speak, I am reducing the time limit to five minutes. I call Mr Ian Lavery.

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr William Bain (Glasgow North East) (Lab)]

Let me begin with a statement on which there should be agreement throughout the House: a strong welfare state benefits all of us in society.

A growing body of evidence, extending from the International Monetary Fund to the Obama White House, shows that if we want to lift the current trend rate of growth, we need a fairer distribution of wealth across our society. We need more people to participate in the labour market, particularly the estimated 700,000 to 1.4 million women who are missing from employment in Britain in comparison with the rates in better-performing OECD countries. Our system of child care is less generous and more expensive than those of many of our trading partners in the European Union, and claims an ever larger share of take-home pay for many families. During the past 30 years the link between rising productivity and wages has gone and they have become decoupled, and that trend has accelerated over the last 10 years.

It is clear that there must be a wage-led recovery in living standards, with a living wage in the areas of the economy where it will work, and that companies must be made aware of the benefits to the whole economy of paying higher wages to their staff rather than increasing their short-term profit-taking. However, the role of the tax and benefits system will remain critical to a reduction in poverty, because from 2005 onwards the modest uplift in the living standards experienced by low to middle earners in Britain was exclusively due to the tax credit system. Other countries with better early-years education, which invested heavily in vocational education and skills, such as Denmark, and those with stronger collective bargaining systems in the workplace, such as the Netherlands, had even lower levels of pre-distribution poverty.

In principle, simplifying the tax and in-work benefits system by uniting them in a single integrated payment may have beneficial effects, but there is evidence that the Government are failing to address potential weaknesses in several key areas.

First, the system becomes more complicated for the growing number of self-employed people, and depends on access to the internet. In my constituency, where the poverty level is drastically above the national average, more than eight in 10 people do not have access to the internet at home.

Secondly, the current design of universal credit appears to penalise lone parents. Gingerbread understands that up to 4 million of them, including 1 million who are in work, will lose out under universal credit. Estimates suggest that 150,000 of the poorest single parents could lose up to £68 per week, which would push 250,000 children deeper into poverty. The situation appears worse when we consider the increasing competition for part-time work in a weak labour market. The rate of under-employment among women aged between 16 and 24 has risen by nearly 5% in the last four years, and for women aged between 35 and 49 the figure is nearly 4%.

Thirdly, universal credit does not put right the harm that the Government have already done in regard to support for child care costs. According to Save the Children, 56% of mums say that the main issue preventing them from working, or making them consider giving up work, is the increase in child care costs. However, parents on low incomes are already paying more than they used to because of the 10% reduction in the child care tax credit. The Resolution Foundation found that last year child care costs rose by 50% for some of those families.

Fourthly, the much-trumpeted rise in the personal tax allowance will be counteracted by universal credit, because people on low incomes who receive the credit will no longer receive a reduction in their tax bills. A £1,000 increase in the personal tax allowance will give £200 per year to every basic rate taxpayer except those on universal credit, who will gain only £70. They will receive only a third as much from any increase in the personal tax allowance as the rest of the population.

Fifthly, there is a risk that the withdrawal of “passported” benefits such as free school meals, and the lack of a second-earner disregard in the design of the credit, will create new cliff edges in the benefits system.

Finally, those who take jobs after being unemployed for more than six months will not receive an extra four weeks on benefits to smooth their transition.

The benefits bill is rising by £9 billion because of higher unemployment. I think it is clear that the Government should be focusing on that, rather than taking money away from—

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo)]

Order. The hon. Gentleman’s time is up.

--- Later in debate ---

[Steve Webb]

I have got only two minutes, so I had better not give way.

We were asked about the position on domestic violence, an important issue raised by my hon. Friend the Member for Oxford West and Abingdon (Nicola Blackwood). It is an important issue in respect of provision for splitting payments, for example. The Government are absolutely committed to protecting those who are subject to domestic violence. For example, under universal credit, victims of domestic violence will be exempt from things such as work search requirements for a three-month period. Although shared payments would normally be appropriate, because we know that most households budget together, clearly we will make alternative arrangements in exceptional cases. We have therefore retained powers to split payments between members of a couple, for example, in cases of domestic violence. Details of those exemptions will be included in guidance.

We heard a large number of contributions and I cannot do justice to them all, but the key theme from Government Members has been a unified view that we must make work pay and that we should not listen to the naysayers. Frankly, it is always possible to get a newspaper headline by saying “Big Government IT project bound not to work”, because if it does work nobody will ever remember. That is always the way in which the Opposition conduct themselves, but we are in the business of making things happen. When my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State explained how closely he monitors the programme, he was not exaggerating. This project has probably had more hours of testing, evolution and making things work than any other with which I have been associated.

The hon. Member for Makerfield (Yvonne Fovargue) mentioned the 1988 benefit changes, which were a “big bang” change. Income support, supplementary benefit, family credit, the family income supplement and housing benefit were reformed all on a single day. This is a roll out over four to five years and we will get it right by doing it gradually, testing it, having pathfinders and bringing in groups one step at a time. We all saw what happened under the previous Government to the tax credit system when the changes were done in a “big bang”, but we will make this change gradually, get it right and make work pay, so we should reject the naysayers and reject the motion.

Question put.

The House proceeded to a Division.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo)]

I ask the Serjeant at Arms to investigate the delay in the No Lobby.

Minister for Older People

Baroness Primarolo Excerpts

Thursday 28th June 2012 Commons Chamber

[Several hon. Members]

rose—

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo)]

Six Members wish to take part in the debate, so it is necessary to have a time limit of 10 minutes, but if there are lots of interventions, we may need to revisit that.

[Kevin Brennan (Cardiff West) (Lab)]

On a point of order, Madam Deputy Speaker. I did not want to interrupt the hon. Member for Portsmouth North (Penny Mordaunt), but as of four minutes ago, the fifth written ministerial statement on the Order Paper, from the Secretary of State for Education, on educational reform, had not appeared in the Vote Office, despite its contacting the Department to remind it that it said that it would issue that statement today. Is it not a discourtesy to the House, Madam Deputy Speaker, that nearly six hours after the House began to sit, the statement has still not arrived? After all, the Department is quick to leak stories to the Daily Mail, but it is slow to provide written ministerial statements that it has promised to the House.

[Madam Deputy Speaker]

Mr Brennan, you will be aware of Mr Speaker’s ruling in this matter. He has indicated in this Session—and, indeed, it was indicated in the previous Session—that written ministerial statements should arrive promptly on the day for which notice has been given. That does not stretch on a Thursday to 4.30 in the afternoon, so I will make inquiries as to when we expect to receive the statement to which you refer. I am sure that Ministers will ensure that it flies here as quickly as possible, because you are clearly keen to read it immediately.

If there are no further points of order, perhaps we can move on. I call Julie Hilling.

Disability Benefits and Social Care

Baroness Primarolo Excerpts

Wednesday 20th June 2012 Commons Chamber

16:19

Division 20

Ayes: 236

---

Labour: 218
Democratic Unionist Party: 5
Scottish National Party: 5
Social Democratic & Labour Party: 3
Plaid Cymru: 3
Independent: 2
Alliance: 1
Green Party: 1

Noes: 298

---

Conservative: 258
Liberal Democrat: 38

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo)]

I now have to announce the result of a deferred Division on the motion relating to the draft regulations on community right to challenge. The Ayes were 282 and the Noes were 196, so the Question was agreed to.

[The Division list is published at the end of today’s debates.]

Employment Support

Baroness Primarolo Excerpts

Wednesday 7th March 2012 Commons Chamber

[Several hon. Members]

rose—

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo)]

Order. There are still a lot of Members wanting to get in. We therefore want short questions and short answers.

[Mr Frank Doran (Aberdeen North) (Lab)]

No one will be surprised to hear that the workers in my local factory were devastated by today’s news. They feel particularly angry because for the past two years, the management and the work force have been working together to try to develop a social enterprise that would include not only the Remploy workers but other voluntary organisations around the city. They have gone a long way down the road to achieving that, but there is now huge uncertainty. My reading of the literature that has been produced today is that the factories are to be closed, which means that—

[Madam Deputy Speaker]

Order. I will say it loudly this time: we want short questions, please, not speeches. Mr Doran, a question—now!

[Mr Doran]

I would love to make a speech, but I am trying to avoid one. The future of the factory is crucial. There is a possibility of saving jobs in Aberdeen, so will the Minister confirm what will happen to the factories?

--- Later in debate ---

[Maria Miller]

I am very happy to be able to give that assurance to my hon. Friend. I apologise if Members did not catch the answer to which he refers: under the previous Administration, 68 factories closed—[Interruption.] I apologise; 28 factories closed under the previous Administration. [Interruption.]

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo)]

Order. If the House were a little quieter, we would all be able to hear exactly what is being said. May I also ask the Minister to give briefer answers and, once again, ask Members to ask a single, brief question?

[Maria Miller]

Twenty-eight factories were closed under the previous Administration, and some 1,600 people were affected.

--- Later in debate ---

[Maria Miller]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for his question and hope that he received my letter, which clarified that I enjoyed my discussions with the Porth factory and very much understand his support for them. I gently remind him that the factory supports 74 disabled people. He needs to ensure that he is also thinking about the 12,400 disabled people in his constituency—[Interruption.] The Porth factory lost around £200,000 last year. We believe that we need to challenge ourselves on how we can use that money more effectively. Last year in Wales employment service—[Interruption.]

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo)]

Order. Mr Bryant, you asked a question. Please listen to the answer and stop shouting across the Chamber at the Minister.

[Maria Miller]

I was simply going to point out that 2,000 disabled people got very good jobs in Wales last year. The hon. Gentleman really needs to focus on the fact that there are employment opportunities there, but we need to ensure that his constituents and those of other hon. Members have the skills and support to be able to take those jobs up.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo)]

Order. I ask Members to leave the Chamber quietly and save their congratulations for outside, Mr Lloyd, so that we can proceed.