Crime and Courts Act 2013 (Consequential Amendments) (No. 2) Order 2015

Baroness Kramer Excerpts

Tuesday 24th February 2015 Grand Committee

Moved by

[Baroness Kramer]

That the Grand Committee do consider the Crime and Courts Act 2013 (Consequential Amendments) (No. 2) Order 2015.

Relevant document: 21st Report from the Joint Committee on Statutory Instruments

[The Minister of State, Department for Transport (Baroness Kramer) (LD)]

My Lords, this order is makes four amendments to the Road Traffic Offenders Act 1988 in consequence of the introduction of the Crime and Courts Act 2013, which inserted a new Section 5A into the Road Traffic Act 1988.

Section 5A creates new drug-driving offences of driving or being in charge of a motor vehicle with a specified drug in the body above specified limits. The Drug Driving (Specified Limits) (England and Wales) Regulations 2014 were made on 24 October 2014. They specified the drugs and their limits, and will come into force in England and Wales on 2 March 2015. Although the new Section 5A applies to Scotland as well, it is for the Scottish Government to make regulations to specify the drugs and their limits. I understand that the Scottish Government are in the process of considering responses to a consultation and hope to publish an analysis report shortly. The views offered in the consultation will inform their decision on the drugs and their limits for the new drug-driving offence in Scotland. This order therefore applies to Great Britain where the amendments extend the penalties already available in relation to similar driving offences connected with drink-driving and drug-driving to the new drug-driving offences. It also provides for the endorsement of an offender’s driving licence counterpart and the driver’s record in relation to the new offences.

As noble Lords are aware, the review of drink and drug-driving law by Sir Peter North concluded that there is,

“a significant drug driving problem”,

and recommended the new offence. Drivers impaired by drugs kill large numbers of people, and there could be as many as 200 drug-driving-related deaths a year in Great Britain. Statistics show that a drug-driver has 1/50th of the chance of being prosecuted compared to a drink-driver. European evidence from the driving under the influence of drugs, alcohol and medicines project—DRUID—suggests that drug-driving is about half as prevalent as drink-driving. We estimate it to be around a third as prevalent in Great Britain, so enforcement related to drugs is disproportionately low. Ensuring we have the full range of penalties and the ability to record offenders fully to support the new offence will thus enable more effective law enforcement and act as a deterrent to those who recklessly risk killing and injuring on the road as a result of taking drugs and driving.

I turn to the detail of the order we are proposing. Section 45 of the Road Traffic Offenders Act 1988 provides for the period during which an endorsement remains effective on the counterpart of a driving licence following a conviction where endorsement of the offence has been ordered. This order amends the Act so an endorsement ordered upon a person’s conviction for the new offence remains effective until 11 years have elapsed since the conviction, in line with other drink-driving and drug-driving offences, rather than just four years as it currently stands.

When the relevant part of the Road Safety Act 2006 is brought into force, Section 45, which relates to the endorsement of counterparts, will be repealed and Section 45A, which relates to the endorsement of driving records, will be in force. The amendments made by the Road Safety Act 2006 are part of the legislative changes which abolish the paper driving licence counterpart so that all endorsements will need to be recorded electronically on a person’s driving record only. This order has therefore been drafted so that when these Road Safety Act changes commence, the amendments made by this order to Section 45A will enable the endorsement of a person’s driving record for the Section 5A offences of driving or attempting to drive with a specified drug in the body above specified limits to remain effective until 11 years have elapsed since the conviction.

The order also amends the Road Traffic Offenders Act to provide for the penalties applicable to the offences of failing to provide a specimen for analysis under Section 7 and failing to permit a specimen to be subjected to a laboratory test under Section 7A without reasonable excuse in the course of an investigation into whether a person has committed an offence under Section 5A.

Noble Lords may be wondering why the Government have tabled this order so close to the commencement of the new Section 5A offences on 2 March. It was originally hoped that the abolition of the paper driving licence counterpart would have been completed by the end of October 2014. Our intention was to wait for that legislation to be made and make the amendment to Section 45A—“Effect of endorsement of driving records”—which would come into force instead of amending a revoked Section 45. However, industry asked for more time to get ready for the abolition of the counterpart. To accommodate the needs of industry, and so that Parliament does not have to revisit this piece of legislation in the future, this order has been drafted to refer to Section 45 but also to Section 45A of the Road Traffic Offenders Act, to cover the situation where Section 45 is revoked and Section 45A is commenced.

The Government believe that it is important that those drivers who continue to commit drug-driving offences and put lives at risk have their counterparts or driving records endorsed for a considerable period of time and so are able to feel the full force of the law when prosecuted. With the power of social media, it is also important that potential drug-driving offenders are not incentivised to refuse to provide a specimen or to refuse to allow that specimen to be analysed, in order to get a lesser penalty. I urge Members to agree that we must send a strong message that this House, Parliament and wider society will not tolerate those who persist in drug-driving and the threat they pose to other road users. I therefore recommend that the Committee approves this order. I beg to move.

[Lord Teverson (LD)]

My Lords, I have come very recently to this debate, but I was interested to come along and listen to it. I am interested in two areas, which are probably old territory—I hope that the Minister will forgive me. This is an important bit of legislation; drug-driving is equally as dangerous and as much of a hazard to fellow citizens as drink-driving. However, I am still unclear how the enforcement of this testing is to be done in a practical way. We always think of drug-driving as being about illegal drugs, but presumably some legal highs or even medicinal pharmaceuticals, particularly tranquilisers, can be equally dangerous. Is that covered in this legislation? I would be interested to hear and understand that context.

[Lord Rosser (Lab)]

I thank the Minister for explaining the purpose and content of this order. As she said, and as the Explanatory Memorandum sets out, the order amends the 1988 Act in consequence of the introduction to the Act, through the Crime and Courts Act 2013, of new drug-related road traffic offences, which make it a criminal offence to drive, attempt to drive or be in charge of a motor vehicle with a concentration of a specified controlled drug above a laid-down limit. The amendments in the order extend the penalties connected with drink and drugs, including failure to provide a specimen, to the new drug-related road traffic offences and provide for the endorsement of an offender’s counterpart and driving record in relation to the new offences. As the Minister said, the new offence comes into force shortly—at the beginning of next week—in England and Wales. Regulations determined by Parliament last October, I think, specified the controlled drugs and their limits.

I appreciate that the key debate on this issue has already taken place and the decisions have been made, but can the Minister give an up-to-date indication of the number of proceedings per year expected to be brought under the new offence of driving having taken a relevant controlled drug above the specified limit and whether the ability to test for and prove that drugs above the specified limit have been taken is sufficiently robust to expect a proportion of guilty findings similar to that applicable to drink-driving proceedings, namely 96%? Perhaps she could also say something about whether the necessary equipment to undertake these tests on those who it is felt may have been driving with a concentration of a specified controlled drug above a specified limit is now available, so that we are ready to go as far the bringing into force of these new offences is concerned. What is the cost of that equipment? How many police forces already have it? Who has to pay for it? Does it have to be used back at the police station or do we have equipment that can be used at the road side? It would be helpful if the Minister was able to comment on those points.

As I understand the penalties and levels, a zero-tolerance approach is being adopted towards anyone who is found to have a concentration of a specified controlled drug unless they are able to show that it resulted from having taken a drug for medical reasons.

The Explanatory Memorandum states:

“No formal consultation for these amendments has been undertaken as these are consequential amendments upon the creation of new drug driving offences”.

Has consultation taken place previously on what the penalties should be and whether they should be on a par with, lower than or higher than those related to drink-driving, or has it just been assumed that they should be on a similar level? Was a view taken on whether driving having taken drugs is likely to have a lesser or greater impact on driving ability than having consumed alcohol? One assumes, in the light of the comment in the Explanatory Memorandum that the penalties are on a par with those for similar driving offences connected with drink and drugs, that the impact is deemed to be the same. Perhaps the Minister could confirm that point because, if the impact is deemed likely to be greater, one would have thought that that would have been reflected in the penalty; if it was deemed likely to be lower, likewise it might have been thought that that would have been reflected in the penalty the other way.

Finally, the Explanatory Memorandum states in paragraph 12 that a supplier has been selected to evaluate the effect of the new drug-driving offences. Could the Minister say who that supplier is?

[Baroness Kramer]

I thank noble Lords. I should make it clear to my noble friend Lord Teverson that there is an existing Section 4 offence that is used to deal with driving under the influence of drugs not specified for the purpose of the new offence. That remains in place. The existing drug-impaired driving offence remains, and therefore all drug-impaired drivers can be prosecuted, whatever and how many drugs they have taken. I give him that assurance. There is a process to add drugs to the list of specified drugs. I will write to my noble friend with the details of how drugs can be added in that process. There is both the broad brush and the ability to add new drugs to the list. For a new drug to be covered by the new offence, the following are necessary: the drug has to be recognised and classified by the Home Office under the Misuse of Drugs Act 1971; a consultation would then need to follow on whether to add it to those specified under the offence of drug-driving and at what level to set the specified limit; and regulations would need to be approved under the affirmative procedure. So there is a procedure in place to add to the list.

I am sure the noble Lord, Lord Rosser, will correct me if I have misunderstood this, but one of his questions was essentially about whether or not there should be a difference between the sentencing for impairment caused by alcohol and that for impairment caused through drug use. The rationale to me is that identifying the specified drug is step one, and then defining the level above which having that drug in one’s system is the standard of impairment for the offence is step two. That, essentially, is the way in which this legislation works. In other words, first, the drug is identified—I have read out the process that is gone through to get a drug on the list, which obviously involves consultation—and, secondly, the limit above which that drug in the system would be considered an offence is determined. The noble Lord will understand that that is, in many ways, the same as the approach used with alcohol. It is illegal to drive with above a certain limit of alcohol in the system.

The noble Lord also asked about testing equipment. We understand that 12 forces at present have station-based screening devices. Manufacturers are talking widely to various forces, who are obviously considering whether to purchase devices to enhance their capacity to enforce. Mobile screeners are also available. The new mobile screener tests only for cannabis and cocaine, but those are two of the most prevalent types of drugs detected among drug drivers. Again, police forces manage their budgets and so they must decide how to use their budget to acquire equipment for enforcement.

[Lord Rosser]

I am sure the noble Baroness will correct me if I am wrong but 12 forces have station-based equipment and the new offence comes in at the beginning of next week. Does that mean that there is a significant number of forces that cannot enforce this offence because they do not have the equipment?

[Baroness Kramer]

At this point in time, 12 forces have station-based screening devices. We are encouraging forces to talk with manufacturers about the kind of products available. I am sure the noble Lord would not want the introduction of the offence to be delayed until all forces had decided on the kind of equipment they wished to purchase for enforcement.

[Lord Rosser]

I hope the noble Baroness will not take this as an attempt at withering criticism but police forces have known for some time that this new offence was likely to come into force. If I understand correctly, it does not look as though many of them have been taking active steps to make sure they have got the equipment to be able to enforce. Is it a question of cost? Does this equipment cost a large sum of money?

--- Later in debate ---

[Baroness Kramer]

I do apologise. I am not being clear. Driving under the influence of drugs, even though it has not been specified, has long been an offence, as the noble Lord is aware, and the method for enforcement has been a blood test. That has been used by all forces over many years and remains in place, so they have that capacity. However, with the new list of specified drugs, many of them are now interested in alternative screening devices, particularly mobile devices, because that puts them in a position, as it were, to issue a fixed penalty on the spot. I think we will see that take-up, given the new opportunities for enforcement that are provided by forces up and down the country. But of course they always have the fallback of using the blood test, which has always been available to them and continues to be.

I hope that I have covered the range of issues. If I have not, I will gladly read through Hansard and provide a letter with more detail. I hope, on that basis, that your Lordships will feel that they can support this order.

Motion agreed.

Renewable Transport Fuel Obligations (Amendment) Order 2015

Baroness Kramer Excerpts

Tuesday 24th February 2015 Grand Committee

Moved by

[Baroness Kramer]

That the Grand Committee do consider the Renewable Transport Fuel Obligations (Amendment) Order 2015.

Relevant documents: 20th Report from the Joint Committee on Statutory Instruments, 25th Report from the Secondary Legislation Scrutiny Committee

[The Minister of State, Department for Transport (Baroness Kramer) (LD)]

My Lords, the order follows a good deal of consultation and makes some relatively small but important changes to the renewable transport fuel obligation scheme—the RTFO. The changes would improve consistency in the way the RTFO treats two different types of biodiesel, and would encourage investment in renewable gaseous fuels. The RTFO is a certificate trading scheme that places an obligation on suppliers of fossil fuels in the UK to ensure that certain amounts of sustainable biofuel are supplied. The obligation can be met by redeeming renewable transport fuel certificates known as RTFCs. Their value is determined by the market, and trading them provides a financial reward for those supplying renewable transport fuel.

The RTFO order was amended in 2011 to ensure that only biofuels meeting mandatory sustainability criteria were rewarded with RTFCs. The 2011 amendment also introduced new requirements on suppliers to report on the sustainability of the biofuel being supplied and for this to be assured through independent verification. In April last year we published our response to a call for evidence on additional support mechanisms for advanced and more sustainable fuels. At the same time, we concluded a post-implementation review of the RTFO scheme. The review considered the extent to which the RTFO had achieved its objectives to support the supply of sustainable biofuels in the UK. The review also noted the significant achievements made by the UK biofuel industry to date.

Since the RTFO was introduced in 2008, savings in greenhouse gas emissions, excluding impacts from indirect land use change, have increased from 46% to reach 69% in 2013-14. The most recent statistics also showed that 46% of biofuels supplied in the UK were made from a waste or residue such as used cooking oil, which does not compete for land with food crops. A further public consultation on the proposed changes to the RTFO order we are considering today ran in the summer of 2014.

This small group of amendments aims to build on the RTFO scheme’s success and deliver two important commitments. The amendments will, first, provide consistency in respect of how we treat renewable fuels under the RTFO by aligning the treatment of two particular types of biodiesel; and, secondly, encourage investment in the development of emerging renewable transport technologies such as sustainable renewable gaseous fuels, by adjusting the reward provided to reflect their higher energy content relative to liquid biofuels.

Hydotreated vegetable oil, or HVO, and fatty acid methyl ester, or FAME, are both renewable fuels that can be blended with diesel. The biological feedstocks used in the HVO process are similar to those used for FAME: for example, vegetable or plant oils and waste animal fats. In both the FAME and HVO processes, a secondary, non-biological feedstock is used and incorporated into the final fuel. For FAME, this is methanol derived from natural gas, while for HVO it is hydrogen produced from natural gas. However, although FAME is deemed to be 100% renewable in calculating the reward of RTFCs, HVO is currently not. The effect of the order would be to provide for HVO to be treated in the same way as FAME. This is in line with our emerging understanding of how HVO should be treated under the renewable energy directive and is consistent with the approach in other EU member states to these two types of biodiesel.

Our policy aim for gaseous fuels is to level the playing field for renewable gaseous and liquid fuels. Doing so provides a clear signal that the UK Government will provide a positive investment climate for those looking to supply renewable gaseous fuels in the HGV and other sectors. Renewable gaseous fuels are currently rewarded at one RTFC per kilogram of fuel supplied, and liquid renewable fuels at one RTFC per litre. However, the energy contained in a kilogram of gaseous fuel is generally higher than the energy found in a litre of liquid fuel. The draft order would provide that 1.9 RTFCs per kilogram would be rewarded for biomethane and 1.75 RTFCs per kilogram for both biopropane and biobutane. As is the case now, double the amount of RTFCs would be awarded where the fuel is produced from wastes or residues.

I am aware that the Secondary Legislation Scrutiny Committee has reasonably advised the House that the order may imperfectly deliver the policy, due to uncertainties highlighted by the department in our cost-benefit analysis. I will address the concern that has been raised. The range of costs and benefits is essentially determined by which sort of biodiesel will be displaced by extra RTFCs going to renewable gaseous fuel. We are estimating discounted carbon-reduction benefits of £2.65 million, assuming a 50:50 spilt in the displacement of biodiesel from waste versus biodiesel from crop.

Waste-derived biodiesel is incentivised by being awarded twice the number of certificates per litre compared to crop-based biodiesel. As a consequence, it is a more cost-effective option in meeting the obligation. There would only be a carbon cost should a significant volume of waste-derived biodiesel be displaced—and then only if approaching 60% of the displacement was of waste-derived biodiesel.

As biodiesel from waste is the cheaper option to meet the obligation, and is in limited supply, we fully expect that biodiesel from crop would be displaced by increased rewards for renewable gaseous fuels. This means that the carbon savings for 2015 to 2020 are likely to be towards the higher end of those estimated in our cost-benefit analysis central scenario—nearer the £16 million benefit end of the scale. Further, I stress that we have limited options to decarbonise the heavy goods sector, and I believe that, in the long term, renewable gaseous fuels will be an important element in meeting our carbon-reduction targets.

The draft order will also introduce two measures to support effective administration. The first would update and streamline the powers of the RTFO administrator to require information. The second measure would put it beyond doubt that the administrator can apply mathematical rounding as part of calculating the number of RTFCs it issues.

Biofuels have proved a complex and controversial topic over the years. However, we know that vehicles are going to continue to require liquid and gaseous fuels for decades to come. We therefore need to develop technologies and capacity to produce low-carbon fuels in the UK, to reduce emissions from road transport and to encourage sustainable growth and jobs.

The proposed changes in the draft order are supported by stakeholders and make a number of worthwhile improvements in that direction. I know that the industry and investors would like to see greater certainty on the pathway to meeting the 2020 transport renewable energy target. The Committee will be pleased to hear that, in anticipation of measures to address indirect land use change—ILUC—being agreed in Europe later this year, we have been working with a very broad group of interested parties through our Transport Energy Task Force on precisely how to improve the investment climate. The group will report to Ministers in the coming months. I commend the draft order to the Committee.

[Lord Rosser (Lab)]

The only issue that I wished to raise—and I am sure that the Minister will hardly be surprised—was the report of the Secondary Legislation Scrutiny Committee and the concerns it expressed. I had intended to mention them in order to give the Minister the opportunity to put the Government’s response on the record. She has, of course, already done that in her introductory comments.

In the light of the Minister’s speech, it rather begs the question why the three different scenarios of low, central and high were drawn up for the period 2015-20, given that, as I understand from her speech, she is almost dismissing at least one, if not two, of those scenarios as being based on unrealistic modelling assumptions. If she is so sure that the issue raised by the Secondary Legislation Scrutiny Committee—that this is about not just a range of carbon savings but a range covering both carbon savings and carbon costs—will not be the case, why did we end up with a cost-benefit analysis that contained those projections? What is the case for having projections that the Government apparently do not believe for one minute are likely to occur? I would be grateful if she will address that point.

One of the things that the Secondary Legislation Scrutiny Committee said, in paragraph 28, was:

“The central scenario assumes an increase in the size of the HGV fleet able to use gaseous fuel from the current 500 to 7,400 by 2020, that 12.5% of fuel used is renewable gaseous fuel and a 50/50 displacement split between the two types of biofuels. These are modelling assumptions. They do not as the CBA explains … ‘represent today’s mix of biofuels’”.

I am grateful to the Minister for having set out the Government’s response straight away, but I am still a little puzzled about why we have ended up with a document that has raised scenarios which, as I understand it from the Minister’s speech, the Government are now saying are extremely unlikely. Why include them in the first place if the Government do not believe that they are going to happen? What is the answer the point made by the Secondary Legislation Scrutiny Committee that the 50/50 displacement split between two types of biofuels does not actually represent today’s mix of biofuels?

[Baroness Kramer]

I thank the noble Lord, Lord Rosser, for his comments. It is standard practice to look at a range of impacts in developing forecasts. I came out of business, and the department very much follows the same pattern of talking to the industry and all the various relevant groups whose behaviour can impact on those forecasts and coming up with a forecast that seems reasonable and likely and in which it has a high level of confidence. In this case, from the perspective of the department, it was considered to be quite a conservative estimate. It was chosen as what could be called the central forecast in which the department has the greatest level of confidence, based on the work, research and analysis that it has done.

It is also standard practice to then say, “What if we were wrong?”, and to look at both a more pessimistic range and at what would happen if we could, reasonably, be more optimistic about the behaviour of certain factors. I would hate to see the department, in doing its analysis, simply going with the forecast in which it had the greatest confidence, without presenting, for other people to consider, what the impact would be of variations in the underlying factors, both downwards and upwards. That is fairly standard and a wise way to present issues. It is also a way to tease out concerns that then have to be answered.

The answer to the concerns raised by the noble Lord, Lord Rosser, is that the department is convinced that all the logic and the discussions with all the various players indicate that the form of fuel most likely to be displaced is crop-based biodiesel rather than waste-based biodiesel, and because of that, the department has a great deal of confidence in the carbon benefits. Again, we raised those issues to discuss the cost-benefit analysis, as I think was entirely appropriate.

[Lord Rosser]

I asked the Minister about the report of the Secondary Legislation Scrutiny Committee, which ends up saying:

“For this reason, we draw this Order to the special attention of the House on the ground that it may”—

may, not will—

“imperfectly achieve its policy objective”.

Is that a view with which the Government agree or disagree:

“it may imperfectly achieve its policy objective”?

[Baroness Kramer]

The Government have a high degree of confidence in their central forecast. I have never seen forecasts turn out exactly right, to the right-hand side of the decimal point. Forecasting is an attempt to look into and understand the future, so it is never a perfect science. It is right that that is always recognised. The noble Lord will also recognise that biodiesel and biofuel prices will always be volatile in this industry. That affects the trend, and there will be variance year on year in actual behaviour. It is right that there is always an element of uncertainty in forecasting, but it is also right to use the research, the analysis and the discussion with the industry to come up with the scenario in which one has the greatest confidence. That is what I think the department has, entirely appropriately, done. It has shaped and presented its policy on that basis. Given that understanding that it would be sheer arrogance to present only one scenario without considering both upside and downside, this is a considered policy that I think, generally, has been widely welcomed by all players and participants.

I also point out that the amendment makes only a small change to the current market for RTFCs. Although we are concerned to make sure that our modelling is as good as it can be and that it does not have the arrogance to ignore the fact that there are variances and volatilities, we also recognise that, were either the upside or the downside scenario to prove to be the one that actually played out, the impact would be relatively small because this is only a very small change in the current market for RTFCs.

I hope that, on that basis, the noble Lord will feel that the Government have taken a rational approach and that he will feel capable of supporting the order.

Motion agreed.

Motor Vehicles (Wearing of Seat Belts) (Amendment) (No. 2) Regulations 2015

Baroness Kramer Excerpts

Tuesday 24th February 2015 Grand Committee

Moved by

[Baroness Kramer]

That the Grand Committee do consider the Motor Vehicles (Wearing of Seat Belts) (Amendment) (No. 2) Regulations 2015.

Relevant document: 20th Report from the Joint Committee on Statutory Instruments

[The Minister of State, Department for Transport (Baroness Kramer) (LD)]

My Lords, this Motion will allow a new type of child seat to be used in motor vehicles in Great Britain. This has already been discussed in another place. It has long been an established fact that wearing seatbelts is an important safety mechanism. Seatbelts are a significant factor in saving lives in collisions. In a crash, individuals not wearing a seatbelt are twice as likely to die as those wearing a seatbelt. Therefore the Department for Transport takes this matter very seriously.

It is especially distressing when a crash involves young children. Safety for children in cars has improved in recent years but, unfortunately, car crashes are one of the leading causes of child fatalities. This is why the department has been involved in developing, under the auspices of the United Nations, the new standard which has been adopted by the European Union. Child seats currently come in an array of overlapping size groupings which confuse many parents and can encourage them to switch to a forward-facing seat too early. This new standard of child seat is known as i-size, and has many advantages over the existing designs currently allowed. As well as requiring a child to travel in a rearward position until the age of 15 months, it also provides side impact protection for better protection of the head and neck, with a more rigorous testing procedure for new designs, including an improved crash-test dummy. Furthermore, by doing away with the overlapping groupings and moving to a system based on the child’s height, it will be much easier for parents to choose the correct seat.

The new standard does not replace the current one. Both standards will run in parallel. Therefore, car seats complying with either standard may continue to be sold and used safely and will not require parents to purchase a new design of child seat if they are using one which meets the current standard. With the introduction of i-size, consumers will be given an extra option to choose a seat that conforms to the latest standard when purchasing a new car seat for their child. This also means that manufacturers will not have to stop making existing designs. However, many manufacturers have already designed and tested i-size products and are ready to bring them to the UK market. Indeed, they are pressing us to make this change. While it is anticipated that approvals for the old standard will eventually be phased out, it is not the intention to prevent existing products being used.

This issue is an important aspect of designing safer vehicles, which was a major challenge identified in this Government’s strategic framework for road safety. I therefore commend the regulations to the Committee. I beg to move.

[Viscount Simon (Lab)]

My Lords, the noble Baroness the Minister described this very well. It makes perfect sense. It will help maintain the health and safety of very young children. I have only two questions but I do not know whether she will know the answers. How has the new type of child crash-test dummies been changed? How has the new side-impact test been changed again?

--- Later in debate ---

[Baroness Kramer]

My Lords, perhaps I may respond first to the noble Viscount, Lord Simon. Currently, there is not a side impact test; that now comes in with the new regulations. The dummies will be designed so that they demonstrate the damage that comes with a side impact test. If there is further information on the dummies that I have not mentioned, I will gladly write to him and let him know.

On the point of the noble Lord, Lord Rosser, essentially about why the new seat is not mandatory or why we do not have a date for its becoming mandatory, it is possible that the documentation has not been clear. Part of the new standard does not fit in to the car by use of a seat-belt. It requires an Isofix point to be built in, which is deemed to be a safer way for a seat to be anchored. That standard became mandatory for new cars from 2012. It would have been seen in many new cars built from around 2006 and even in some from before then, but obviously many cars that parents own date from an earlier period and therefore do not have an Isofix anchor embedded in them. If we were to make this mandatory today, we would effectively be requiring parents to go out and purchase a new car when they simply want to purchase a car seat. That really is an unacceptable burden.

There will be demand from parents who have older cars or cars which do not have the Isofix fitting to purchase a seat for their child. We are satisfied that the current standard is very safe. That does not mean that we do not want to pursue opportunities to increase the measure of safety. I described earlier the side-impact benefit and the noble Viscount, Lord Simon, followed up on it. We recognise that existing car seats provide a great deal of safety for children, so we do not feel that it is necessary to tell parents that they have to buy a new car in order to buy a seat that meets the new standard.

We accept that over time, as they replace their cars and their car seats, parents will follow the new standards, but this means that there is a period of time when we need to have both standards operating in parallel. To put in a date would in fact be artificial. It is sensible to do all we can to encourage the take-up of the new car seats in vehicles which can take the fitting. It will be a matter of parent choice, but the majority of parents want the car seat that provides their child with the greatest protection. It is also true to say that as the volume of sales of the new car seats goes up—they are currently more expensive than the current car seats—the price will inevitably come down as economies of scale kick in.

I think that we will see a very good take-up of these new car seats, but to make it mandatory would place a burden on some families for whom the purchase of a new car would be exceedingly difficult. What we do not want is for anybody to be tempted not to use a car seat because the only one that they can legally purchase cannot be fitted into the car they already have. I think that the noble Lord will recognise that. Over time, we can see what is happening with the turnover of cars; that is not something that is ideally predictable. It will be possible at some point to remove the earlier standard and simply go with the new standard because there will have been sufficient turnover in the car fleet. I hope, with that understanding that this is a sensible way that does not place an extraordinary burden on families—

[Lord Rosser]

Am I to take it that the cost of changing an existing car and thus enabling it to take the new fitting or arrangement is either prohibitive or just not technically feasible?

[Baroness Kramer]

I am not an expert in whether one can easily retrofit an Isofix fitting—it has a top tether anchorage point. According to the information I have just been given, it is not possible to retrofit into a car, so it is a case of buying a car in which this fitting is part of the original design of the car, because it is so fundamental.

[Lord Rosser]

That is less a comment about not wanting to gold-plate an EU directive than it is actually saying that in relation to existing cars it is not possible to do it anyway. The Minister has said that it is not a question of cost, but that you actually cannot do it.

--- Later in debate ---

[Baroness Kramer]

I suppose that we could theoretically require parents to go out and buy a new car, which is why we have used phrases such as gold-plating. It is clearly not feasible to bring in the new standard and require parents to have a car that meets it. They may be in the second-hand market for cars, or they may have an older car which, because of family finances, they are not in a position to replace. But as I have said, existing car seats offer a great deal of safety to children, and parents have been very satisfied with them. The industry has demonstrated their quality, but that does not mean that we do not keep on improving, and it is the rationale for running the two standards in parallel.

Parents are very concerned about safety of their children. As the new car fleet turns over, take-up of the new standard will obviously overrule the old standard and we will reach a point—I cannot tell the noble Lord in which year—at which it will be possible to phase out the old standard.

[Viscount Simon]

I thank the Minister for her reply on side-impact testing. From a purely academic point of view, side-impact testing has been taking place privately for many years for research purposes by TRL, the universities and the manufacturers. It is an interesting point of view that it is now being used as a logistic point of view, and it is very good that it now forms part of the legislation.

[Baroness Kramer]

I thank the noble Viscount, Lord Simon, for those comments. We are all very focused on the issue of safety and we have to give credit to the industry and the consumer for constantly driving forward the technical progress that makes cars safer. That is something we all want and it is an important part of the work that the Government have done on a whole series of fronts. With that understanding, I hope that this is a sensible way in which to bring in a new standard for car seats which gives parents the opportunity to move to the new standard without making life impossible for those for whom it would be unaffordable for a whole variety of reasons. Having addressed the range of issues, I hope that noble Lords will be able to agree to the regulations and that they can be brought into force.

Motion agreed.

Road Safety Act 2006 (Consequential Amendments) Order 2015

Baroness Kramer Excerpts

Monday 23rd February 2015 Lords Chamber

Moved by

[Baroness Kramer]

That the draft Order and Regulations laid before the House on 8 and 16 January be approved.

Relevant document: 20th Report from the Joint Committee on Statutory Instruments, considered in Grand Committee on 10 February

Motions agreed.

Passenger and Goods Vehicles (Recording Equipment) (Downloading of Data) Regulations 2015

Baroness Kramer Excerpts

Tuesday 10th February 2015 Grand Committee

Moved by

[Baroness Kramer]

That the Grand Committee do consider the Passenger and Goods Vehicles (Recording Equipment) (Downloading of Data) Regulations 2015.

Relevant document: 20th Report from the Joint Committee on Statutory Instruments

[The Minister of State, Department for Transport (Baroness Kramer) (LD)]

My Lords, these draft regulations are being made to remove unnecessary gold-plating of EU rules by giving transport operators longer to download data of drivers’ hours from digital tachographs. The change was recommended in the Government’s Red Tape Challenge and Logistics Growth Review, and removes unnecessary restrictions on operators. It is estimated that it will save hauliers nearly £1 million a year, as well as giving some operators much-needed flexibility.

For the benefit of noble Lords who may not be aware, EU drivers’ hours rules apply to goods vehicles over 3.5 tonnes and passenger vehicles with 10 or more seats, unless covered by a range of specific EU-wide exemptions and national derogations. Drivers and operators of vehicles that are in scope of these rules are required to fit and use a tachograph—a mechanical device that records, in real time, each driver’s driving time.

Operators are required to download data from digital tachographs and from drivers’ tachograph cards at regular intervals to check their drivers’ compliance with the rules relating to drivers’ hours. The 28-day maximum interval between downloads of the driver card data will remain unchanged. These regulations lengthen from 56 days to 90 days the maximum interval transport operators are permitted between data downloads, bringing GB hauliers in line with the maximum permitted under the EU rules.

The Government’s consultation on this change was published on the department’s website between December 2012 and February 2013. The proposed 90-day limit was welcomed by operators, particularly those involved in long, international journeys and tours, as the additional flexibility would alleviate the problems that they currently encounter trying to download the data while abroad. Enforcement agencies can require operators to produce records at any time, and can access a driver’s or vehicle’s records at the roadside, so this added flexibility for operators will not have implications for the enforcement of the drivers’ hours rules. In addition, most operators download data from the tachograph much more frequently as part of their routine maintenance checks.

Improving conditions for growth in the logistics sector is critical to the Government’s growth agenda, and this change forms part of a package of measures that the Government are bringing forward to help this vital industry, such as taking 76,000 mechanics and valets out of scope of burdensome EU rules on professional driver training and raising the speed limits for lorries on single and dual carriageway roads. This is a common-sense and industry-supported move to remove unnecessary restrictions on a key sector, helping it to make its contribution to Britain’s long-term economic plan. I beg to move.

[Lord Rosser (Lab)]

My Lords, I thank the Minister for explaining the thinking behind the order, which increases the maximum interval that transport operators are permitted between downloads of drivers’ hours data from tachographs from 56 days to 90 days, which as has been said, is the maximum permitted interval under EU Commission Regulation No. 581/2010.

Will the Minister confirm that one of the effects of this change will be to enable operators who already seek to undermine drivers’ hours legislation to have an additional 34 days to break that legislation without detection and, as a result, the DVSA will potentially have a month less to prepare a prosecution case against historical drivers’ hours offences? If that is the case, what is the Government’s assessment of the impact of that on road safety, since on a fairly quick look-through it does not seem to be covered in the impact assessment?

Indeed, the impact assessment, dated last July, states that the DVSA thought that adopting the 90-day maximum European timescales could hinder enforcement as it could make it more difficult to gather evidence from prosecutions within the six-month deadline imposed by the courts. If Ministers have now managed to persuade the DVSA of the error of their thinking, perhaps the Minister will confirm that that is the case, and indicate either why the DVSA has misunderstood the situation, or what changes have been made to address the concerns raised by the DVSA.

There are already concerns about the DVSA’s enforcement capabilities. According to government answers, the relevant agency made 43,000 fewer checks under drivers’ hours regulations for foreign-registered HGVs at the roadside last year than four years ago and less than half the number of foreign HGV drivers breaking the drivers’ hours rules received prohibitions or fixed-penalty notices last year than four years ago. For what reason have the Government presided over this considerable reduction in both checks and prohibitions and fixed-penalty notices?

Under the current requirement to download data at least every 56 days, what is the Government’s assessment of the current percentage of operators who already breach drivers’ hours legislation to a greater or lesser degree? Once again, on a relatively quick look through the impact assessment, that issue does not seem to be addressed in it, yet non-compliance not only risks the safety of drivers and other road users but undermines fair competition and adversely affects the majority of operators who adhere to the rules. Have the Government considered bringing forward tougher measures and sanctions to enforce weekly rest rules, as have apparently the French and Belgian Governments recently?

The Explanatory Memorandum indicates that a “targeted industry consultation” was undertaken. Can the Minister clarify what is meant by that? Is it a euphemism for saying, “We consulted rather fewer people and organisations than normal”? The Explanatory Memorandum refers to the 20 responses received, which seems a relatively small number unless it turns out that the targeted consultation only invited that number or not many more to respond. Where did the 20 responses come from and how many were in favour of the change in the limit and how many voiced opposition or expressed reservations? How many people or organisations were invited to respond? Why could this information not have been provided in the Explanatory Memorandum under paragraph 8, headed “Consultation Outcome”? There appears to be some separate document on the outcome of the consultation. I do not think—I am prepared to be corrected—that reference is even made in the Explanatory Memorandum to such a document. All that I have been able to find is a passing reference to it tucked away on page 5 of the impact assessment.

The Explanatory Memorandum states that,

“many operators already download data from the vehicle unit more regularly than the current 56 days required”,

as some 80% of HGVs need more frequent maintenance checks than that, but for those involved in long international journeys and tours of more than 56 days, the extended interval to 90 days would alleviate, as the Minister has said, a number of problems encountered when trying to download data while abroad.

Why, in order to address a problem faced by what I presume is a minority of operators involved in extended journeys and tours abroad, is it necessary to increase the limit to a maximum 90 days for all operators when it seems that many of them already download data more regularly than the current 56 days? How assiduously has the department tried to address the problems facing operators who are abroad for more than 56 days without changing the requirement for those operators who are not in that position?

We do not intend to oppose the order, but it would nevertheless help if the Minister could respond to the points that I have raised and provide some information on what the limit is in other comparable EU economies such as France and Germany, particularly as the impact assessment seeks to imply, but does not clearly state, that the change would bring us into line with our European counterparts.

[Baroness Kramer]

My Lords, I shall start by responding to the questions asked about the consultation—there may be some that I cannot cover because I do not have sufficient information at the moment, in which case we will be glad to write. The respondents were hauliers, Unite, traffic commissioners, ACPO, the police and tachograph analysis companies. That is quite a wide range across the industry.

The noble Lord asked about the DVSA. Obviously, we followed up its response to the consultation, and from those discussions our understanding is that it believes its enforcement powers, which enable it to access this information at any time, are the important measure which supports its enforcement activity. Therefore we are comfortable that we are not creating additional problems here for the DVSA. Indeed, the noble Lord will know—and this goes back to the whole question of safety which he discussed—that, increasingly, the whole approach to enforcement has been intelligence-led. That has always been true, but it has become even more so. He will be aware of the London task force, which I believe started its work in October 2013. That is a combined effort by the DVSA, Transport for London, the department and the Met to use a targeted approach, and it has been very successful in London by, again, using intelligence, so that the knowledge of the operators to helps drive the enforcement process, rather than simply using a random process which might have been more prevalent in the past.

[The Deputy Chairman of Committees (Lord Geddes) (Con)]

A Division has been called in the Chamber. The Grand Committee stands adjourned.

--- Later in debate ---

[Baroness Kramer]

I am sure that interruptions to the flow will only improve matters. I was talking about enforcement when we took a break for the Division. One of the questions that the noble Lord, Lord Rosser, raised was whether the DVSA was doing sufficient checks. He is right that the number of checks is down but, as a result of the enhanced targeting I described, there has been a quite dramatic increase in the effectiveness of those checks. On drivers’ hours the prohibition rate has risen from 15.7% in 2009-10 to 18.1% in 2013-14, and on roadworthiness from 31.8% in 2009-10 to 37.7% in 2013-14.

[Lord Rosser]

In the light of that, those figures still mean that the number of prohibitions and fixed penalty notices has gone down. The percentage may have gone up, but that should be compared with the large reduction in the number of checks, prohibitions and fixed penalty notices. What is a relatively small increase in the percentage surely still means that the number of checks, prohibitions and fixed penalty notices has gone down. Would the Minister confirm this?

[Baroness Kramer]

My Lords, surely what we are all looking for is effectiveness, which we need. Having a more effective way of tackling this problem strikes me as important, since the issue we are looking at is the recording of tachograph information.

[Lord Rosser]

I am sorry, is the Minister arguing that having a reduction in the number of checks, prohibitions and fixed penalty notices, which she has not denied, makes it more effective?

[Baroness Kramer]

My Lords, I am simply arguing that the important thing is catching those who are breaking the law and breaking the rules, and to do so effectively. The mode of working that has now been adopted is more effective. Surely effectiveness is something that we are all seeking to achieve.

Going back to the subject of this regulation, one of the key elements is the downloading of driver data. That interval for doing so remains 28 days. Operators remain responsible for their drivers being in compliance—that has not changed either. The noble Lord noted that, for most companies, the common way of downloading the vehicle data is simply to do it at the time of maintenance on the vehicle, which for most companies is more frequently even than 56 days. The outer time limit and the actuality are not in fact particularly closely linked. The way that operators work means that the data are downloaded far more regularly.

The noble Lord also asked about countries in continental Europe and what benchmarks they were using. I can tell him that France, Austria, Belgium, Germany and Italy all have 90-day limits. That may give him some comfort that we are working within the same kind of range as continental Europe.

[Lord Rosser]

The Minister quite rightly referred again to the problems being faced by operators that have vehicles abroad on extended journeys; the maximum of 90 days will certainly make life easier for them. However, they are a relatively small percentage of the number covered. I asked how assiduously the department has tried to address the problems facing operators abroad for more than 56 days without changing the requirement for operators that are not in that position, in light of what the Minister has repeated—that most of them do it more frequently than every 56 days. Why could it not have been a more targeted approach to address where the problem apparently lies?

[Baroness Kramer]

My Lords, one of the reasons for having a consultation, which the industry was widely aware of, was to provide an opportunity to come up with other mechanisms. This one appears to have an appropriate benefit in giving that greater and necessary flexibility to operators who have vehicles travelling overseas, but it does not create additional enforcement issues domestically. As the noble Lord said, most operators download the data more frequently anyway. We have moved towards a pattern of enforcement that is based far more on intelligence than on random checks. A random turn-up at an operator is not likely; it would be an intelligence-led arrival at an operator’s premises.

There is also the regular process of enforcement through approaches such as that of the London task force. There are now thoughts about whether this approach could be taken in places such as Manchester. Using that intelligence-led information and using the opportunity to enforce readings of both the driver and the vehicle unit tachometers at the roadside are among the primary tools of enforcement.

Therefore, making this change does not seem to us to undermine the enforcement process. It provides some additional flexibility for companies which have vehicles overseas and which have had problems trying to meet the 56-day benchmark simply because their vehicle is somewhere on the continent. Although it may be a relatively small change—as I admit it is—it is surely no bad thing to lift a burden of about £1 million off the industry, particularly in the highly competitive world in which companies must currently operate.

The case for making these changes is there is no weakening of the key enforcement mechanisms, which remain in place, and that enforcement mechanisms are more effective today than they have been historically—which surely has to be a good thing. The download of the drivers’ card, which is the primary method for measuring drivers’ hours, continues to be every 28 days; the download of data from the vehicle at 90 days, which in a sense is back-up or a cross-check, is not causing, as we understand it, any concerns to either the enforcement or the operators. The noble Lord said, “Well, surely this is unfair to good operators”, but operators have not come to us and said, “Don’t do this”, and there are many good operators based in the UK who surely would have raised that issue if they felt that it was a concern.

Therefore, with all those issues in mind—and as I say, if I have missed out on specific questions that the noble Lord, Lord Rosser, raised, I will try to get back to him in writing—I commend the regulations.

[Lord Rosser]

I think that the Minister said that she would write to me on the issue of the consultation and how many people or organisations were invited to respond, since I am still not sure what a “targeted industry consultation” is a euphemism for, and clearly it means something. On the face of it, 20 responses does not seem a particularly high number, but that begs the question of how many were invited. I asked how many had voiced opposition or reservations about the changes, and I appreciate that the Minister said right at the beginning that she would respond subsequently to me on the consultation. However, I would also be grateful, since I do not think that I have had a clear answer to the question, if, when the Minister comes to reply, she could confirm or deny that the number of checks, prohibitions and fixed penalty notices has gone down over the past four years. The answer to that question is either yes or no, because I am still not clear how a reduction—which is what I think it has been—actually improves the situation. Perhaps the Minister could address that in the letter she will send to me on the consultation.

[Baroness Kramer]

I will be very glad to do that, because our target, obviously, is safety, and that is the absolute standard we have to go by. With that understanding, I hope that the noble Lord, Lord Rosser, will be satisfied.

Motion agreed.

Road Safety Act 2006 (Consequential Amendments) Order 2015

Baroness Kramer Excerpts

Tuesday 10th February 2015 Grand Committee

Moved by

[Baroness Kramer]

That the Grand Committee do consider the Road Safety Act 2006 (Consequential Amendments) Order 2015.

Relevant document: 20th Report from the Joint Committee on Statutory Instruments

[The Minister of State, Department for Transport (Baroness Kramer) (LD)]

My Lords, I beg to move that the draft Road Safety Act (Consequential Amendments) Order, which was laid before the House on 16 January, be considered.

The driving licence paper counterpart is to be abolished from 8 June 2015. The primary legislative changes that provide for this were included in the Road Safety Act 2006, and will be brought into force on the same day as this order. This order amends several additional pieces of primary and secondary legislation, many of which were enacted since 2006, that include references to the paper counterpart.

Old-style paper licences are not being abolished and will remain valid documents. The driving licence paper counterpart has been issued since the photocard driving licence was introduced in 1998. The main function of the paper counterpart that is issued with the photocard licences has been to show provisional driving entitlement and penalty points or driving disqualifications. The counterpart was necessary because the EU driving licence directives, with which every member state must comply, do not allow provisional driving entitlement or endorsement details to be displayed on the photocard. This meant that introducing a counterpart was, at the time, the only way this information could be provided for individual drivers and for them to then share that information, if they needed to, with those who required it for driving entitlement validation or enforcement purposes.

The primary powers to abolish the paper counterpart were included in the Road Safety Act 2006. We intend to enact these provisions by commencement of Section 10 and Schedule 3 of the Act, which are to be brought into force on the same day as this order by commencement order.

The secure electronic inquiry services needed to share driver data to replace the counterpart were not available in 2006. Since then, there has been significant development of online services and this Government are committed to developing the wider use of digital services as a key element of providing improved customer services. The paper counterpart was identified as an area of unnecessary bureaucracy and burden. This Government have made a clear commitment to remove such unnecessary burden under the Red Tape Challenge initiative, and abolishing the counterpart will result in significant savings for motorists. The paper counterpart will be replaced with a digital service that will enable customers and stakeholders to access their driving licence details securely. This will be an online service, called Share Driving Licence, which will enable individual drivers to check their own information and share it, as they need to, with a third party who will be able to securely view the up-to-date driver record digitally and securely.

Protecting individual driver data is of paramount concern. The Share Driving Licence service enables customers to generate a one-time use authentication code which they can then share with a third party to enable them to access the relevant information held on the DVLA’s driver record. This online service ensures that control remains in the hands of customers, giving them the power to share or not share the information.

There will also be an assisted digital inquiry service for those who are unable or do not want to use the online service themselves. The assisted service will provide two options. A customer can telephone the DVLA’s contact centre, which will provide them with a one-time use access code that the customer can then share with a third party. Alternatively, businesses can call the DVLA’s driving licence checking service. This is a three-way conversation between the customer, the third party and the DVLA to verify information from the individual’s driver record. These services are in addition to the online inquiry service that the DVLA has already made available to motor insurance companies, called My Licence. This enables them to check the status of the driving licence, with the consent of the driver, when giving a quote and when a policy is renewed.

Pre-photocard paper driving licences are not being abolished and will remain valid documents showing the categories of vehicle an individual can drive. However, they will no longer be endorsed with new penalty point information. The digital driver record held by the DVLA will be the legal record of penalty point information. So drivers with old-style paper driving licences will also need to use the new inquiry services to access the most up-to-date information on penalty points and endorsements.

I recognise the need to minimise any confusion between the paper counterpart and the pre-photocard paper driving licence. This is one of the key messages that features prominently in the wide-ranging communications activities being carried out now and will continue to be developed as abolition draws nearer. The DVLA is working with customers and businesses to help individual drivers understand the change.

Around 90% of motorists do not have penalty points and rarely need their paper counterpart. If a driver loses it, they must obtain a replacement licence at a cost of £20. The requirement for drivers to hold a paper counterpart to their driving licence is no longer considered by motorists to be the most effective way of enabling people to demonstrate their up-to-date penalty point information. The current arrangements impose unnecessary costs on motorists and can perpetuate the use of inaccurate and out-of-date information.

Generally, abolishing the paper counterpart has been welcomed by businesses. However, there was some industry concern about the original planned date for abolition, which was 31 December 2014. Some organisations advised that they were not ready to operate without the counterpart. My department has listened to these concerns and has delayed abolishing the counterpart until 8 June 2015. This revised implementation date will allow businesses more time to work with the DVLA on introducing the changes and communicate the change to their customers.

This department has worked closely with enforcement partners, including the Ministry of Justice and the Scottish Court Service, to ensure that they are prepared for the change. The processing of road traffic offences will continue without any issues as fixed penalty offices and courts are prepared for when the paper counterpart is abolished. Abolishing the paper counterpart will save motorists around £17 million per year. The changes before your Lordships support the Government’s commitment to improving public services through increased digital delivery and will realise significant savings to motorists. I commend the order to the Committee.

[Lord Rosser (Lab)]

I thank the Minister for explaining the background to, and purpose of, this order. I hope that she feels on top of the detail of the order to a rather greater extent than I do.

Since their introduction in 1998, all drivers issued with a Great Britain photocard driving licence have also been issued with an A4 paper counterpart because under an EU directive provisional entitlement or endorsement details were not allowed to be displayed on the photocard, and there was a need to provide this information for those who might be required to give details of any current convictions, disqualifications and other penalties, or in the case of a driver with a substantive licence the need, if it arose, to verify an additional provisional driving entitlement.

In 2004, a public consultation indicated that more than 80% of those responding supported the paper counterpart being abolished, with the overall preference being that instead the information on the paper counterpart should be made obtainable by secure electronic links to the Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency database. However, as the Minister said, the Government at the time did not have the necessary electronic system in place to abolish the paper counterpart.

As I understand it, this order amends primary and secondary legislation in the light of the commencement of the parts of the Road Safety Act 2006 which provide for the abolition of the driving licence counterpart in Great Britain. These parts of the 2006 Act will be brought into force on the same day as this order by the Road Safety Act 2006 (Commencement No. 11 and Transitional Provisions) Order 2015.

Apart from the paper counterpart displaying details of a driver’s current convictions, disqualifications and penalties, it is also used by the freight industry to carry out safety checks of commercial vehicle drivers, by the rental and leasing industry to verify customer driving licence details for car hire, and for other employment and enforcement purposes.

We are not opposed to the order but I would like to raise a few points. If I raise points that are answered in the impact assessment, I offer my apologies in advance for not having read it as thoroughly as I should have done. Under the arrangements to be introduced in the light of the abolition of the driving counterpart, those entitled to will be able to check securely information held on the document via a new electronic inquiry database, including driving entitlements and endorsements. Drivers will also be able to print their information. Who or what will be held responsible for making sure that the information held on the inquiry database in respect of each individual is accurate? How will an individual know whether that information held about them is accurate, bearing in mind the potential consequences if it is wrong? Is it the case that an individual will be expected themselves to check the information on the database for accuracy, and will there be any redress if it is incorrect and the individual has been penalised in some way as a result? If an individual finds incorrect information about themselves on the database, will they have to use a premium rate telephone line to ring up and challenge the accuracy of the entry?

It is essential that the abolition of the paper counterpart is managed effectively—unlike the reorganisation and merger of agencies last year, which was not. Abolition will not be successful unless a replacement electronic service is effective, easy to use and up to date. How secure will the information on the database be? Are the Government satisfied that people’s personal information on the database cannot be hacked into by others who should not be able to see or have that information?

As the Minister has said, the move away from the paper counterpart was originally planned for the last day of last year, but will not now happen until June, with, as she has indicated, the British Vehicle Rental and Leasing Association and Freight Transport Association having called for an extension to ensure that the online alternative was fit for purpose. As I understand it, the BVRLA is still saying it is vital that the agencies are given an adequate budget to publicise and provide guidance around key events such as the recent abolition of the paper tax disc, which is another issue from the one that we are discussing, and the impending removal of the paper driving licence counterpart, which we are discussing. Have the Government responded to that call and, if so, in what way? I appreciate that in her introductory comments the Minister made reference to this, but if she could say a little more about what the Government are doing to respond to that call from the BVRLA, it would be helpful. Given the experience of the tax disc abolition, including the DVLA’s website crashing, what assurances can the Government give that the abolition of the driving licence paper counterpart will be properly managed, explained and communicated to the public and business?

On the potential costs and benefits, the impact assessment states that there could be additional costs for some businesses as checking driving details online could take longer and the cost of calls to the DVLA’s premium rate telephone lines to access the information will increase. If the information is in the impact assessment, I apologise for asking this but could the Minister indicate what these costs will amount to?

The documentation also indicates that a range of inquiry services will be established for accessing driving licence details online, including the use of a premium rate telephone number, which, once again, the Minister referred to in her introductory comments. The impact assessment refers on page 7 to the DVLA receiving 1,207,104 premium line calls last year. On page 12 that figure is repeated, but another figure is also given: namely, that 940,000 premium line telephone inquiries relate to the general public. Perhaps the Minister could say whether that figure of 940,000 is included in the higher 1,207,104 figure or is in addition to it.

I understand that as a response to serious concerns about the Government’s use of premium rate phone lines, the Cabinet Office issued guidance stating that the use of premium rate phone numbers is inappropriate. If that is the case and the Minister accepts that that is in the Cabinet Office guidelines, how does the use of a premium rate phone number in this instance fit in with those guidelines? What cheaper alternatives, such as the 03 range, were considered, and why were they rejected?

[Baroness Kramer]

My Lords, I thank the noble Lord for the issues raised. If I miss some of the questions, we will try to catch those up afterwards. I understand that for the ordinary motorist the number to call for the DVLA is a standard-rate number—an 0300 number—0300 790 6801. That may answer a number of the noble Lord’s concerns.

In terms of costs to businesses, we have acknowledged that this may add somewhat to the burden of the car rental industry. However, we can compare the advantages to the motorist. It seems that the benefit is significant. The noble Lord may know anecdotally from friends and family that trying to find the paper counterpart is one of the great annoyances as so many people manage to mislay or lose them, which creates problems in having to apply again, with all the costs and inconvenience involved. The benefits to the motorist are significant, which outweighs what I suspect will be rather minor additional burdens to the industry, outlined by the noble Lord. We appreciate that the industry will need to manage this process effectively.

The DVLA will use its many regular communications with the public through a whole variety of channels. It will send out information leaflets with all full drivers’ licences, which equates to 1 million drivers a month getting a leaflet to outline this. The DVLA is working with industry stakeholders, such as trade associations for the car hire companies and the motor industry, to make sure that they have up-to-date information that they can communicate to their members and the motoring public. A campaign page has been created on GOV.UK to provide the Government with general information and the DVLA will use all those forms of media, which I confess I do not look at much myself, but a large part of the world does, such as web chat, social media, information videos and blogs to maximise awareness. A substantial communications campaign sits behind this, but it is also true that when people call to make bookings with a car hire company, they are typically told what documents to bring with them. Therefore, that is an opportunity for the car hire company to make it clear that people need to come along with an access code.

Change is never without the occasional hiccup but there will certainly be a substantial communication process. Indeed, there probably will be additional calls. The DVLA is expecting calls from people who do not feel comfortable going online to obtain information. That, by the way, is a free service. The DVLA is staffing up to be able to respond appropriately to that additional level of demand.

The noble Lord, Lord Rosser, asked if the information was secure, as government is responsible for a great deal of data affecting the lives of many people. Therefore, the levels of security are always significant—no less so in this case than in any other. I can give the noble Lord the confidence that this will not be treated in a more casual way than important information that is held on individuals by government departments and agencies. In terms of the accuracy of the data, because an individual can go online and check for themselves, it gives them an opportunity to make sure that the data are accurate. They can also call the DVLA if they have some concern. In many ways this gives them an opportunity to be sure that they are up to date in the way that the paper counterpart, sitting in a back drawer and possibly long forgotten, does not.

[Lord Rosser]

We are not opposing the order, so I am not making this point on the basis that we are. I am not sure that I see a way around this, so in a sense I am asking the Minister to clarify that the onus is actually on the individual to check on a reasonably regular basis that the information held about them is accurate. For many individuals, the first indication they may have that something is wrong will be when they are denied something that they are seeking, or find out that something is on the record that should not be which has adverse consequences for them. It is only then that they will check on the database and find out that the information is wrong. I have no solution as to how you get around that, but that seems to be the situation.

[Baroness Kramer]

I point out to the noble Lord, Lord Rosser, that at present the DVLA accesses its information from the courts and fixed penalty services, so that will be exactly the same pathway, except that it will be available for an individual to check on a live basis—for example, if they have forgotten to send in their counterpart to get it endorsed. I think that there are probably potentially fewer potential trip-ups with the new system than under the old one.

I am trying to remember other questions that the noble Lord asked, but I think I have covered most of his concerns around this issue. As I say, we will look back through Hansard and if there are particular issues that I have not covered in full, we will be glad to follow them up in writing. If he is satisfied with that response, I hope that he will feel able to support this order.

Motion agreed.

Infrastructure Bill [HL]

Baroness Kramer Excerpts

Monday 9th February 2015 Lords Chamber

[The Minister of State, Department for Transport (Baroness Kramer) (LD)]

My Lords, I have it in command from Her Majesty the Queen to acquaint the House that Her Majesty, having been informed of the purport of the Infrastructure Bill, has consented to place her interests, so far as they are affected by the Bill, at the disposal of Parliament for the purposes of the Bill.

Motion on Amendments 1 to 5

Moved by

[Baroness Kramer]

That this House do agree with the Commons in their Amendments 1 to 5.

1: After Clause 3, insert the following new Clause—
“Route strategies
(1) The Secretary of State must from time to time direct a strategic highways company to prepare proposals for the management and development of particular highways in respect of which the company is appointed (“a route strategy”).
(2) A route strategy must relate to such period as the Secretary of State may direct.
(3) The strategic highways company must—
(a) comply with a direction given to it under subsection (1), and
(b) publish the route strategy in such manner as the company considers appropriate.
(4) A direction under subsection (1) must be published by the Secretary of State in such manner as he or she considers appropriate.”

--- Later in debate ---

5: After Clause 12, insert the following new Clause—
“Periodic reports by the Secretary of State
(1) The Secretary of State must from time to time prepare and publish reports on the manner in which a strategic highways company exercises its functions.
(2) The Secretary of State must lay a report prepared under subsection (1) before Parliament.”

[Baroness Kramer]

My Lords, in discussing Commons Amendments 1 to 5, I shall also speak to Commons Amendments 24 and 42 to 45. I am very pleased to put forward this group of amendments, which I believe demonstrate the progress made since the Bill was first introduced and that the Government have listened to the views made known in this House and in the other place.

It is clear that we intend the route strategies to be a key building block for the second road investment strategy, which covers the period after 2020-21. The individual route strategies will help ensure that Highways England and the Government of the day are able properly to consider local roads, local transport, our cities and other modes of transport as the RIS is developed. As Highways England carries out the work on the route strategies it will have to work closely with local highway authorities, local economic partnerships, Network Rail and other local and national bodies. Through the statutory direction and guidance set out in the licence, the updated version of which was published on 29 January and attached to my letter of 2 February, which has been placed in the Library—I am sure noble Lords have studied it in depth—we have made it clear how we expect the route strategies to be developed and what they should cover, ensuring that integration and working with others will be a key feature of the process.

To provide even more reassurance, my right honourable friend the Minister in the other place moved Amendment 1, which puts route strategies on the face of the Bill. To quote my right honourable friend:

“The Secretary of State will require a strategic highways company to prepare and publish one or more strategies on the management and development of the highways to which it has been appointed, which will be known as route strategies. The strategies must be published, as must the Secretary of State’s directions to the company, so we have provided that the process will be transparent”.—[Official Report, Commons, 26/1/15; col. 667.]

The arrangements that we have put in place give certainty that the route strategies will be prepared, and recognise the important part that they play in managing and planning for the future of the strategic road network.

Government Amendments 2, 3 and 5 deal with reporting to Parliament. I know that noble Lords have been keen to ensure that there is a transparent process for parliamentary accountability for the company, so I think it is best that I present Amendments 2, 3 and 5 together, as they reflect the full picture of the Government’s intention.

Amendment 5 places a responsibility on Government to report periodically to Parliament on the performance of Highways England. I have described before the combination of governance arrangements that provides choice in how it is applied while retaining levers for Ministers to intervene if the company fails to perform. If necessary, Ministers can intervene through the use of statutory direction and guidance, which must be published, to shape how the company must act or deliver requirements.

In addition, through Amendments 2 and 3 to the monitor provisions, we make it clear that the monitor may report on the effect of direction and guidance given to the company by the Secretary of State, and we insert a specific requirement on the Secretary of State to lay before Parliament any report published by the monitor. These further requirements on the Government to report to Parliament, and to furnish Parliament with the independent assessment of the Highways Monitor on the company’s performance, will make the process even more transparent and provides a very strong way of ensuring that the company delivers.

I turn to Amendment 4. On Report, we briefly discussed the issue of a change in the name of the Office of Rail Regulation name, when the noble Lord, Lord Berkeley, who I see is in his place today, proposed to rename it. On that occasion, I said that we had concerns about the prospect of renaming the ORR in the Bill. However, the principle of ensuring that the ORR has an accurate name remains a sound one. We accept that there is a risk of confusion if its name does not correspond to its functions, though, as I emphasised in previous debates, the ORR is at liberty to use different brand names for these different activities, and always planned to do so.

We have therefore decided to take steps to remedy such a situation. Amendment 4 gives the Government the power to rename the ORR once an appropriate name is agreed. The ORR is in the process of discussing options with stakeholders and staff. As I say, this amendment does not rename the ORR directly because of the complications involved in doing so. Instead, it inserts a new power in the Railways and Transport Safety Act 2003, allowing the Secretary of State to rename it and make the necessary consequential amendments through secondary legislation.

Government Amendments 44 and 45 deal with transferred staff. Noble Lords will recall that on Report I made clear that the transfer of staff from the Highways Agency to Highways England would follow guidance under the Cabinet Office statement of practice, COSOP, and that this follows TUPE principles. I confirm again that the employment terms and conditions of existing Highways Agency staff will not change when they transfer but, in recognition of the assurance that many want on this point, Amendment 44 reaffirms this and, I hope, makes the Government’s intentions clear. I highlight that the Bill already provides protection that a transferring employee can terminate their contract if there is a substantial detrimental change to it after they transfer. This would amount to a constructive dismissal and the employee could bring a claim for unfair dismissal. This reflects regulation 4(9) of the TUPE regulations.

Amendment 45 is brought forward to reflect fully the intention of the TUPE regulations on this point. The amendment means that, where an employee resigns in such circumstances and seeks compensation, the employer is not liable to pay any damages in respect of any unpaid wages that relate to a notice period that the employee has not worked. It does not in any way prevent employees from claiming damages for constructive dismissal in other circumstances. The amendment provides a limited protection for the employer, and reflects regulation 4(10) of the TUPE regulations themselves.

I shall also cover government Amendments 24, 42 and 43, a group of minor and technical amendments which I shall briefly describe. Amendment 24 deals with transitional provisions. I brought forward an amendment in Committee in recognition of concerns raised by the Delegated Powers and Regulatory Reform Committee that the power to modify primary legislation generally should be subject to the affirmative resolution procedure. Amendment 24 addresses a risk we have identified that might cause unremarkable transitional provisions and savings made under Clause 17 in Part 1 of the Bill to be subject to the affirmative resolution procedure on the basis that they modify the effects of primary legislation. This was not our intention. The power would be used to ensure that processes or procedures started by the Highways Agency which are incomplete at the time of transition can be taken forward by Highways England. Transitional provisions are routinely required where functions pass from one body to another and to require a debate under the affirmative procedure for such regulations would be disproportionate.

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[Lord Davies of Oldham (Lab)]

I do not need to add much because my noble friends have emphasised certain weaknesses in the Bill as we are considering it today. That is not for want of trying. Both my noble friends—and I, from the Front Bench—were concerned about the issues that they have just emphasised. My noble friend Lord Whitty was concerned that road safety will not get the prominence in the Bill it surely deserves while my noble friend Lord Berkeley emphasised the significance of the Office of Rail Regulation. We all welcome the fact that there will be the possibility of a change of name as we could not see how the Office of Rail Regulation could intelligently deal with the road sector and operate under its present name. It is going to do so for a while, but at least the Minister has now ensured that there is provision for change at a later stage.

We support the thrust of Amendments 1 to 5, which we were pressing on the Government not so very long ago. We are still concerned that the Bill does not improve significantly the overall British performance with regard to roads, which clearly are a very important part of the national infrastructure. We know that other countries are more successful in establishing infrastructure. Those of us who from time to time are privileged to drive on the continent often appreciate the difference that obtains there. Even the French have begun at last to approximate to British standards of road safety. There was certainly a deficiency in the past. We support the five-year roads investment strategy that is underpinned by the Bill. It sets a long-term transport planning strategy to give the road sector the same certainty that the railways have. However, we have no evidence that justifies the main thrust of the Bill, which is unamended by these amendments, and the Bill is still overwhelmingly concerned to move the roads authority to an arm’s-length position. We were not persuaded of that argument through all the days of Committee and Report and I am not sure that those in the other place were persuaded about that fundamental part.

We are broadly in favour of Amendments 1 to 5. The Minister took a very serious and empathetic approach to explaining how TUPE was to be fulfilled with regard to the Bill. I understand Amendment 44 and could not endorse it more whole-heartedly. However, I am not quite sure what Amendment 45 is doing there and I therefore ask the Minister to spell that out in greater detail.

We are pleased at the progress that has been made. We think it was a long time coming, because we were debating this Bill several months ago and there is not much in these amendments that we had not articulated or advanced in argument at that time without winning too much support. We are pleased with the amendments that are before us and will be supporting them.

[Baroness Kramer]

My Lords, to clarify, both Amendments 44 and 45 mirror TUPE arrangements. I confess that I am no specialist on TUPE, but I understand from those who are that for the purposes of the transfer of staff from the Highways Agency to Highways England, these amendments simply make it clear that staff will in effect enjoy the same level of protection that is available in the circumstances where TUPE arrangements would normally be in place. This is a reassurance that was asked for and one which has been very gladly given.

In terms of safety, the noble Lord, Lord Whitty, will be aware that there are very few duties on the new strategic highways company, Highways England. One of those duties is to have regard to the safety of users of the highways. That is a strong statement in the Bill. He will be conscious that there is great emphasis on safety in the directions and guidance, and that the road investment strategy has a great focus on safety. Highways England has been set a target of reducing the number of people killed or seriously injured on the network by 40% by 2020. Many of the RIS schemes are specifically focused on safety improvements—for example, improvements to Junction 10 of the M25 to create a freer flowing interchange with the A3 because that junction currently has the highest casualty rates on the network.

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Moved by

[Baroness Kramer]

That this House do agree with the Commons in their Amendment 6.

6: After Clause 18, insert the following new Clause—
“Cycling and Walking Investment Strategies
(1) The Secretary of State may at any time—
(a) set a Cycling and Walking Investment Strategy for England, or
(b) vary a Strategy which has already been set.
(2) A Cycling and Walking Investment Strategy is to relate to such period as the Secretary of State considers appropriate; but a Strategy for a period of more than five years must be reviewed at least once every five years.
(3) A Cycling and Walking Investment Strategy must specify—
(a) objectives to be achieved during the period to which it relates, and
(b) the financial resources to be made available by the Secretary of State for the purpose of achieving those objectives.
(4) The objectives to be achieved may include—
(a) activities to be performed;
(b) results to be achieved;
(c) standards to be met.
(5) Before setting or varying a Cycling and Walking Investment Strategy the Secretary of State must consult such persons as he or she considers appropriate.
(6) In considering whether to vary a Cycling and Walking Investment Strategy the Secretary of State must have regard to the desirability of maintaining certainty and stability in respect of Cycling and Walking Investment Strategies.
(7) A Cycling and Walking Investment Strategy must be published in such manner as the Secretary of State considers appropriate.
(8) Where a Cycling and Walking Investment Strategy has been published the Secretary of State must from time to time lay before Parliament a report on progress towards meeting its objectives.
(9) If a Cycling and Walking Investment Strategy is not currently in place, the Secretary of State must—
(a) lay before Parliament a report explaining why a Strategy has not been set, and
(b) set a Strategy as soon as may be reasonably practicable.”

[Baroness Kramer]

My Lords, in moving Amendment 6, I will speak also to Amendments 26 and 35. The Government are committed to cycling and walking, and making these the natural choice for shorter journeys. Government spending on cycling overall since 2010 has more than doubled compared with the last four years of the previous Administration: £374 million has been committed between 2011 and 2015. Spend on cycling is currently around £6 per person each year across England, and more than £10 per person in London and our eight cycling ambition cities. Furthermore, in November, the Deputy Prime Minister announced a further £114 million for the cycling ambition cities and, through the roads investment strategy, a further £100 million between 2015 and 2021 for additional cycle provision on the strategic road network.

As I am sure the House is aware, in October we published our draft Cycling Delivery Plan. This is a 10-year strategy on how we plan to increase cycling and walking across England. This plan illustrates this Government’s long-term commitment to cycling and walking and it is in that spirit that the Government have laid this amendment which provides a duty on the Secretary of State to have a cycling and walking investment strategy for England.

Each such strategy will be set for a given period, and must specify objectives to be achieved and the financial resources which will be made available for that purpose. Furthermore, the Secretary of State will be required to report to Parliament on progress on achieving those objectives, and—where a strategy applies for a period longer than five years—ensure that it is reviewed at least once every five years.

We have also provided that the Secretary of State must consult when setting or varying a strategy, and must bear in mind the desirability for certainty and stability when considering whether to make a variation to a strategy which has been set. This amendment provides a legislative framework for an investment strategy. We also intend shortly to respond to the consultation on the draft Cycling Delivery Plan, published by this Government last year.

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[Lord Davies of Oldham]

My Lords, I join the two noble Lords who have just spoken in very much welcoming these amendments. Throughout the passage of this Bill there has been very consistent pressure from the cycling organisations. They have established their case against a background, which we are all too aware of, where cycling is still too dangerous a pursuit in certain parts of the country, particularly in our great cities.

I always think of Lord Dormand, who was in this House for a number of years. When he was in the Commons, he used to cycle from Westminster to the National Executive Committee meetings at Walworth Road. That meant a journey around Parliament Square, the roundabout at the far end of Westminster Bridge, and Elephant and Castle. I thought that it was the most dangerous journey in the world as a cyclist, which is why, every week he threatened to do the journey, I sought to dissuade him. He always made the journey and always lived to tell the tale.

However, subsequently there has been an increasing number of cycling accidents, if not on trunk roads, often on large roundabouts, which are difficult to negotiate with a very slow vehicle such as a bicycle as you go past a number of exits from which other vehicles will make definitive and often rapid moves. We have a lot to do to make cycling safer, but I am pleased that the Government have been persuaded of the case that the cycling organisations, the general public and we on these Benches have pushed as hard as we could. We are delighted with the outcome that the Minister has described.

[Baroness Kramer]

My Lords, I join others in this House in saying that I am personally delighted with these amendments. As your Lordships’ House will be aware, when the Bill started here, there was slight frustration because the Cycling Delivery Plan was out to public consultation and we were somewhat limited in what we could do in those circumstances. That consultation has been completed, the Government will shortly give their response to it and the strategy itself will follow in due course. The plan is for all of England, not just the trunk roads, and it is anticipated that there will be a great deal of work with local authorities, local enterprise partnerships and all the other stakeholders as this progresses. This is another good example of co-operative working, across Benches and across both Houses.

Motion agreed.

Motion on Amendments 7 to 11

Moved by

[Baroness Kramer]

That this House do agree with the Commons in their Amendments 7 to 11.

7: Clause 20, page 13, line 8, at end insert “or
(c) a person who for the time being exercises powers of management or control over the land.”

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11: Clause 21, page 23, line 9, at end insert—
“NOTE. The common name or names given in the first column of this Schedule are included by way of guidance only; in the event of any dispute or proceedings, the common name or names shall not be taken into account.”

[Baroness Kramer]

My Lords, I shall begin with Amendment 7. As originally drafted, the definition of an “owner” of land in the Bill referred to a person who is entitled to dispose of the fee simple of the land or a person in possession under a lease. However, it was brought to our attention that this definition does not include owners of “inalienable land”, which is land that cannot be disposed of due to legal restrictions. This would mean that owners of certain land, which may include trustees, would be unable to enter into species control agreements or be made subject to species control orders, even though they may be the only or most appropriate persons with an interest in the land concerned. Amendment 7 resolves this anomaly by extending the definition of an “owner” beyond freeholders and leaseholders to persons who may exercise powers of management or control over the land.

Amendment 8 ensures that the environmental authority provides a clear statement to an owner that it considers that they have complied with all the requirements of a species control agreement. This “Notice of compliance” will provide certainty to an owner that an agreement is no longer in effect. We made a similar amendment on Report in respect of species control orders. On reflection, we now consider that this requirement should also extend to agreements.

Amendments 9 and 11 clarify that should doubt ever arise in a dispute or legal proceedings, the scientific name of a species listed in Parts 1A or 1B of Schedule 9 to the Wildlife and Countryside Act 1981 is determinative rather than its common name. The wording introduced by these amendments is consistent with that which already appears in the existing Schedule 9 and other schedules to the 1981 Act.

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[Lord Deben (Con)]

Before my noble friend leaves that point, I ask what arrangements are going to be made in relation to Wales and why it is done in this way.

[Baroness Kramer]

I will address my noble friend’s point in a moment if I may. We intend to commence Clauses 21 and 22 shortly after Royal Assent to provide legal certainty that licences are still required for the release of beavers into the wild. Now, these matters are devolved and I understand that Welsh Ministers are currently considering whether to make a similar amendment in relation to beavers in Wales.

[The Earl of Caithness (Con)]

Could my noble friend confirm that “a person” in new paragraph 5, which she is amending, is also a trust and a limited company?

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[Lord Davies of Oldham]

I apologise to the House because I am going to make a very technical and limited statement. We very much approve of this group of amendments but we have one concern, which has been articulated by those who know a great deal more about beavers than I know about anything. Consequently, we listened to their advice with the greatest care. It has come from a number of well intentioned sources—by “well intentioned” I mean those who want to ensure that our environment and natural life flourish. We are concerned about the welfare of species.

Our concern is that the European beaver—a native species that has established populations in the UK—has been excluded from the species control order. The classification of the beaver under Part 1B of Schedule 9,

“Animals no longer normally present”,

is regarded as bizarre. It lists them alongside the wild boar, hence our anxiety. It seems strange that, despite European beavers being recognised as a native species to the UK and a natural component of British river systems, they will need a licence from Natural England to continue to exist in the wild.

The Minister will know that we proposed an amendment in Committee, which was supported by a number of NGOs including Friends of the Earth, that the Government’s definition of invasive, non-native species should correspond to the European Union habitats directive, which was adopted in 1992. That will clarify exactly the status of the European beaver. I hope that the Minister can reassure me that that representation is a worthy one and is taken account of by these amendments.

[Baroness Kramer]

My Lords, I have a number of clarifications, which I hope will satisfy your Lordships. Yes, the definition of owners includes trusts and limited companies. We found that places including, I think, Epping Forest and some National Trust properties would not have been covered. It was important to make that amendment and give that clarification.

On Wales, Welsh Ministers are considering this issue and will make their decision shortly, but your Lordships will know that it will be necessary in that process for the Welsh Government to debate an amended legislative consent Motion, which we await. In the mean time, it is still an offence under Section 14 of the 1981 Act to release a beaver into the wild in Wales, so I do not think there should be concerns about release as a result of the changes that we have made here.

It is important to recognise that where we have species that are formally resident—I know people do not like the phrase, but it describes the situation quite well—it is important that we consider releasing them only under licence. The beaver is perhaps a very good example. First, we do not know for certain that they are Eurasian beavers, although vets will be able to answer that question. More importantly, in continental Europe the species is afflicted with a really very terrible disease—a parasite known as EM. I do not wish to trouble your Lordships, but essentially the beaver is a carrier, and many mammals, including human beings, can be devastated by this parasite, which effectively eats your organs from the inside out. It really is important that this country remains EM free and that the parasite does not get out into the general population of foxes and other creatures, because the consequences would be very undesirable.

There is therefore very widespread agreement that the licensing process is the right approach, and where we reintroduce animals we want them brought in in the right way and to the right place with all the consequences considered. The reason for the delay in testing the beavers is fairly straightforward: they have had young kits which have been nursing, and now that the kits are weaned it is much safer to find the animals and bring them in for testing. We expect that to happen shortly.

I hope with that range of reassurances, your Lordships will be very comfortable supporting the Motion.

Motion agreed.

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[Lord McKenzie of Luton (Lab)]

My Lords, we can support the creation of a regime for mayoral development orders, which we see as being uncontroversial. We are certainly supportive of proposals that can improve the delivery of new housing in London, and we note that London Councils and the GLA have expressed support for MDOs.

From discussion in Committee in the Commons, it has been confirmed today that such orders have to be initiated by the London boroughs themselves, and a particular benefit will be supporting the development of complex cross-boundary situations. Can the Minister say a little more about the extent to which they might be used within a particular boundary and not on a cross-border basis? It is presumed that we will not get the underpinning regulations by the end of this Parliament, unless the Minister can tell us otherwise. We note that the negative procedure is to be adopted. Perhaps the Minister might say when they are expected to be ready.

On housing numbers for London, what the Minister said in the other place has been confirmed today: there is an annual shortfall in capacity of between 7,000 and 20,000 homes. It was less than clear from the exchanges at the other end the contribution that MDOs might make in addressing that shortfall. I think the proposition was that they might speed things up, but whether they will have broader impact will be interesting to hear.

A further point, for which there was no satisfactory answer, was how MDOs can contribute to more affordable housing. Can the Minister confirm that Section 106 agreements will not operate for MDOs? If that is not the case, how will MDOs impact on the obligation to provide affordable housing? If this is the case, how will it be assured that the provision of affordable housing will be forthcoming, and what is the mechanism? It would be helpful to have clarity on that point. Nothwithstanding that, as I have said, we do not oppose the new clauses and will support them.

[Baroness Kramer]

My Lords, there is indeed a broad consensus across this range of issues. The noble Lord, Lord McKenzie, asked whether these orders could be used within a local authority rather than just across boundaries. Indeed they can, and of course local development orders are already available to local authorities, but they may wish to tap into the additional capacity and capability that is available in the mayor’s office for particularly complex projects. There may be occasions when that happens, and our expectation is that it will be primarily for the kind of sites that are complex enough to cross boundaries. Obviously, that happens quite often in London. Secondary legislation will appear in due course—a phrase with which I am afraid the House is probably very familiar—but at this point I think we can say with some confidence that that will be in the next Parliament.

I share the noble Lord’s understanding of Section 106, and he will be aware that the voice of local authorities is very powerful on this issue in shaping the kinds of development that they see as appropriate for their communities. It is not the mayor imposing a vision on local authorities, but rather local authorities looking to use the capacity that is on offer from the mayor in order to move developments forward proactively. Its primary purpose in all the discussions with London Councils and others has been to emphasise the importance of accelerating new housing development across the city.

Motion agreed.

Moved by

[Baroness Kramer]

That this House do agree with the Commons in their Amendments 13 and 14.

13: Clause 28, page 33, line 21, leave out “which is” and insert “the freehold interest in which was”

14: After Clause 28, insert the following new Clause—
“Expenditure of Greater London Authority on housing or regeneration
(1) In section 31 of the Greater London Authority Act 1999 (limits of the general power) after subsection (5A) insert—
“(5B) Nothing in subsection (1)(a) above shall be taken to prevent the Authority incurring expenditure in doing anything for the purposes of, or relating to, housing or regeneration.”
(2) The amendment made by subsection (1) applies in relation to expenditure incurred before as well as after the coming into force of this section.”

[Baroness Kramer]

My Lords, in discussing these amendments I shall include Amendments 28 and 36. These amendments deal with the Government’s public sector land programme, which has successfully released land for almost 98,000 new homes to date. We fully expect to meet our 100,000 homes target by March this year. Looking ahead to the next Parliament, we have an even more ambitious target, which aims to deliver land for a further 150,000 homes. This programme will be led by the Homes and Communities Agency and the Greater London Authority, and will mean transferring a significant amount of government land into their ownership.

Clause 28 will ensure that future purchasers of land owned by the Homes and Communities Agency, the Greater London Authority and the mayoral development corporations will be able to develop and use land without being affected by easements and other rights and restrictions. Clause 28 will bring the position of purchasers of land from the HCA, the GLA and the MDCs into line with those presently enjoyed by purchasers from local authorities and other public bodies involved in regeneration and development. This in turn will enable us to increase the attractiveness of surplus public sector land to developers, thus ensuring that we can facilitate the development of much needed new homes and support economic growth by removing obstacles to development while achieving best value for the taxpayer.

I want to be clear, however, that where the HCA or the GLA currently retains the freehold in the land and leases that land to developers, the powers to override third-party rights and restrictions are already exercisable on that land under existing legislation. There has to date been a degree of uncertainty on this point, which I understand has resulted in delays to certain developments in London. Amendment 13 seeks to provide an assurance that where the HCA or the GLA retains the freehold of land, the powers to override third-party rights and restrictions in land already apply under existing legislation, and we are happy to provide that clarity.

I turn now to Amendments 14, 28 and 36. Perhaps I may move on to the related matter of the Greater London Authority’s powers to incur expenditure on the transport elements of housing and regeneration projects. This important issue was raised in the other place during Committee and the Government promised to look urgently at the legislative options available to address it. We concluded that it was necessary to make a minor change to the GLA Act 1999 and have therefore made the proposed amendment.

Amendment 14 removes a prohibition in Section 31 of the GLA Act 1999 that prevents the GLA incurring expenditure on anything that may be done by its functional body, Transport for London. We are making this change to the GLA Act because the GLA has said that TfL’s powers are wide-ranging and therefore preclude the GLA from incurring expenditure on anything transport-related when undertaking housing or regeneration projects.

The prohibition excludes the GLA from incurring expenditure on projects that the GLA has been responsible for since 1 April 2012 when it took on the roles, land and contracts of the former London Development Agency and the Homes and Communities Agency in London. Without this amendment, around 50 projects worth over £200 million would have to stop. This includes work which the GLA has been funding with the London borough councils to revitalise high streets, including in Deptford, Bromley and Cricklewood. It also affects new initiatives to deliver new homes such as housing zones and at Barking Riverside.

Amendment 36 allows for the clause to come into effect on the day the Bill receives Royal Assent and that it will apply in relation to expenditure incurred by the GLA before as well as after the coming into force of the new clause. This is because it was clearly the intention of Parliament that the GLA should have equivalent powers to the former London Development Agency and the Homes and Communities Agency, following the Localism Act 2011. Amendment 28 limits the geographical extent to England and Wales.

Making these changes to the GLA Act 1999 is therefore essential to ensure that the GLA can deliver new homes and jobs for London. I beg to move that this House accepts these Commons amendments.

[Lord McKenzie of Luton]

My Lords, we consider these amendments uncontroversial and are happy to support them. We particularly see the thrust of Amendment 14 and the need to change what is clearly an unintended provision in the 1999 Act. It is indeed perverse if because of the existing powers the GLA is precluded from incurring expenditure on anything transport-related, such as transport-related projects to deliver housing, jobs and growth in London. That cannot be right, which is why we support the amendments.

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Moved by

[Baroness Verma]

That this House do agree with the Commons in their Amendment 20, do propose Amendment 20B as an amendment thereto, and do propose Amendment 20C as a consequential amendment to the Bill.

20: After Clause 43, insert the following new Clause—
“Advice on likely impact of onshore petroleum on the carbon budget
(1) The Secretary of State must from time to time request the Committee on Climate Change to provide advice (in accordance with section 38 of the CCA 2008) on the impact which combustion of, and fugitive emissions from, petroleum got through onshore activity is likely to have on the Secretary of State’s ability to meet the duties imposed by—
(a) section 1 of the CCA 2008 (net UK carbon account target for 2050), and
(b) section 4(1)(b) of the CCA 2008 (UK carbon account not to exceed carbon budget).
(2) As soon as practicable after each reporting period, the Secretary of State must produce a report setting out the conclusions that the Secretary of State has reached after considering the advice provided by the Committee on Climate Change during that reporting period in response to any request made under subsection (1).
(3) The Secretary of State must lay a copy of any such report before Parliament.
(4) In this section—
“CCA 2008” means the Climate Change Act 2008;
“petroleum got through onshore activity” means petroleum got from the strata in which it exists in its natural condition by activity carried out on land in England and Wales (excluding land covered by the sea or any tidal waters);
“petroleum” has the same meaning as in Part 1 of the Petroleum Act 1998 (see section 1 of that Act);
“reporting period” means—
(a) the period ending with 1 April 2016, and
(b) each subsequent period of 5 years.”

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Moved by

[Baroness Verma]

That this House do disagree with the Commons in their Amendment 21 but do propose Amendments 21B, 21C and 21D in lieu.

21: Insert the following new Clause—
“Hydraulic fracturing: necessary conditions
Any hydraulic fracturing activity can not take place:
(a) unless an environmental impact assessment has been carried out;
(b) unless independent inspections are carried out of the integrity of wells used;
(c) unless monitoring has been undertaken on the site over the previous 12 month period;
(d) unless site-by-site measurement, monitoring and public disclosure of existing and future fugitive emissions is carried out;
(e) in land which is located within the boundary of a groundwater source protection zone;
(f) within or under protected areas;
(g) in deep-level land at depths of less than 1,000 metres;
(h) unless planning authorities have considered the cumulative impact of hydraulic fracturing activities in the local area;
(i) unless a provision is made for community benefit schemes to be provided by companies engaged in the extraction of gas and oil rock;
(j) unless residents in the affected area are notified on an individual basis;
(k) unless substances used are subject to approval by the Environment Agency;
(l) unless land is left in a condition required by the planning authority;
and
(m) unless water companies are consulted by the planning authority.”

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Moved by

[Baroness Kramer]

22: After Clause 44, insert the following new Clause—
“Reimbursement of persons who have met expenses of making electrical connections
(1) The Electricity Act 1989 is amended in accordance with this section.
(2) In section 19 (power to recover expenditure)—
(a) omit subsections (2) and (3);
(b) after subsection (3) insert—
“(3A) Schedule 5B (reimbursement of persons who have met expenses) has effect.”;
(c) in subsection (4), after “this section” insert “and Schedule 5B”.
(3) After Schedule 5A insert—
“SCHEDULE 5B
REIMBURSEMENT OF PERSONS WHO HAVE MET EXPENSES
Power to make regulations
1 (1) The Secretary of State may, by regulations, make provision entitling the relevant electricity distributor to exercise the reimbursement powers in cases where conditions A, B, C and D are met.
(2) Condition A is met if any electric line or electrical plant is provided for the purpose of making a connection (the “first connection”)—
(a) between premises and a distribution system, or
(b) between two distribution systems.
(3) Condition B is met if a payment in respect of first connection expenses is made by one or more of the following persons—
(a) a person requiring the first connection in pursuance of section 16(1);
(b) a person who otherwise causes the first connection to be made (including by means of contractual arrangements).
(4) Condition C is met if any electric line or electric plant provided for the purpose of making the first connection is used for the purpose of making another connection (the “second connection”)—
(a) between premises and a distribution system, or
(b) between two distribution systems.
(5) Condition D is met if the second connection is made within the prescribed period after the first connection was made.
(6) “First connection expenses” are any expenses reasonably incurred by a person in providing any electric line or electric plant for the purpose of making the first connection.
(7) It does not matter whether the first connection, or the second connection, is made by an electricity distributor or a person of another description.
The reimbursement powers
2 (1) The “reimbursement powers” are—
(a) the power to demand a reimbursement payment from—
(i) a person requiring the second connection in pursuance of section 16(1), or
(ii) a person who otherwise causes the second connection to be made (including by means of contractual arrangements); and
(b) the power to apply the reimbursement payment in making such payments as may be appropriate towards reimbursing any persons for any payments they were expenses (whether that requirement arose by virtue of paragraph (a) or otherwise).
(2) A “reimbursement payment” is a payment, of such amount as may be reasonable in all the circumstances, in respect of first connection expenses.
Other provision about regulations under this Schedule
3 (1) The Secretary of State must consult the Authority before making regulations under this Schedule.
(2) Regulations under this Schedule may make provision requiring relevant electricity distributors to exercise a reimbursement power (whether in all cases or in cases provided for in the regulations).
(3) Regulations under this Schedule may make provision for the relevant electricity distributor to establish or estimate the amount of first connection expenses—or an amount of any aspect of those expenses—in cases where that distributor is not the person who made the first connection.
(4) Regulations under sub-paragraph (3) may not require any person to supply the relevant electricity distributor with information about any expenses incurred.
(5) Regulations under sub-paragraph (3) may provide for an estimate of an amount of first connection expenses to be calculated by a relevant electricity distributor by reference only to a combination of—
(a) expenses which that distributor would incur if that distributor were making the connection at the time of the estimate, and
(b) changes in prices since the time when the connection was actually made.
Interpretation
4 (1) In this Schedule—
“first connection” has the meaning given in paragraph 1; “first connection expenses” has the meaning given in paragraph 1;
“reimbursement payment” has the meaning given in paragraph 2;
“reimbursement powers” has the meaning given in paragraph 2;
“relevant electricity distributor”, in relation to the exercise of a reimbursement power, means—
(a) in a case where the first connection was made between premises and a distribution system, the electricity distributor that (at the time of the exercise of the power) operates that distribution system;
(b) in a case where the first connection was made between two distribution systems, the electricity distributor that (at the time of the exercise of the power) operates the distribution system into which the first connection has been, or is expected to be, incorporated.
(2) A reference in this Schedule to a payment in respect of first connection expenses includes a reference to such a payment made in pursuance of section 19(1).”
(4) In section 16 (duty to connect on request), in subsection (4), after “23” insert “and Schedule 5B”.
(5) In section 16A (procedure for requiring a connection), in subsection (5)(b)—
(a) omit “or regulations under section 19(2)”;
(b) after “19(2)” insert “or regulations under Schedule 5B”.
(6) In section 23 (determination of disputes)—
(a) after subsection (1) insert—
“(1ZA) This section also applies to any dispute arising under regulations under Schedule 5B between—
(a) an electricity distributor, and
(b) a person in respect of whom the electricity distributor exercises the reimbursement powers conferred by the regulations.”;
(b) after subsection (1C) insert—
“(1D) No dispute arising under regulations under Schedule 5B may be referred to the Authority after the end of the period of 12 months beginning with the time when the second connection (within the meaning of Schedule 5B) is made.”;
(c) after subsection (2) insert—
“(2A) Where a dispute arising under regulations under Schedule 5B falls to be determined under this section, the Authority may give directions as to the circumstances in which, and the terms on which, an electricity distributor is to make or (as the case may be) to maintain the second connection (within the meaning of Schedule 5B) pending the determination of the dispute.”;
(d) in subsection (4), after “(2)” insert “, (2A)”.”

[Baroness Kramer]

My Lords, I beg to move that this House agrees with the Commons in their Amendment 22, and will also speak to other amendments in the group, Amendments 30, 39 and 47.

Obtaining a timely and affordable connection to the electricity distribution network is essential for our growth and energy ambitions. It means that customers, including private citizens, renewables generators, house builders and commercial property developers get access to the network either to supply to or to take electricity from the grid when they need to. When seeking a connection, a customer can either use the local monopoly distribution network operator or an independent connection provider. There are around 194 independent connection providers. Over the years, they have gained a growing share of the connections market.

The Government support competition in network connections, as it gives customers greater choice and drives up standards across the board. The Government want to ensure a level playing field for independent connection providers. However, currently the legislation that makes up the second-comer regime potentially places independent connection providers and their customers at a disadvantage. The second-comer regime is based on a power and regulations under the Electricity Act 1989, which allows the recovery of expenses for electricity connections. It is designed to ensure the cost of connecting to the electricity distribution network is shared between different parties.

Specifically, the regime provides that where a customer—the second comer—connects to and benefits from infrastructure paid for by an earlier customer, the second comer can be required to reimburse the earlier party for a proportionate share of the costs. However, independent connection providers are not currently covered by this regime. This reflects the fact that they did not exist in any meaningful number at the time the original legislation was drafted. This means that customers who have their original connection provided by independent connection providers may not be able to recover any costs from the subsequent connecting customers. This in turn can make using an independent connection provider less attractive. This is an anomaly and the proposed amendment will update the power in the Electricity Act to ensure that it reflects the current market in connections by allowing a wider range of connection providers to be included in the second-comer regime. This change will support competition in the energy market and a fairer sharing of costs. To implement the change, subsequent secondary legislation will be required to amend or replace the Electricity (Connection Charges) Regulations 2002.

The new clause after Clause 44, Amendment 22, replaces the existing enabling power in Section 19 of the Electricity Act 1989 to confer on the Secretary of State a power to make regulations that will enable customers of independent connection providers to recover a proportion of the cost of a new connection from customers who subsequently connect to the same infrastructure. The power is included in a new Schedule 5B to the Act, which sets out in some detail the matters to be specified in the regulations. In particular, the regulations will allow for electricity distributors to administer reimbursements and, in some cases, to estimate the cost of connections for that purpose. This new clause also amends the power of the Gas and Electricity Markets Authority to determine disputes relating to connections to bring it into line with the updated second-comer provisions. As before, the Secretary of State is required to consult the Gas and Electricity Markets Authority to make regulations under the power.

--- Later in debate ---

Moved by

[Baroness Kramer]

That this House do agree with the Commons in their Amendment 23.

23: After Clause 45, insert the following new Clause—
“Power to abolish Public Works Loan Commissioners
In the Public Bodies Act 2011, in Schedule 1 (power to abolish: bodies and offices), after “Plant Varieties and Seeds Tribunal.” insert—
“Public Works Loan Commissioners.””

[Baroness Kramer]

My Lords, I beg to move that this House do agree with the Commons in their Amendment 23. In discussing Amendment 23, I will also include Amendments 34, 40 and 48. The Board of Public Works Loan Commissioners, commonly known as the Public Works Loan Board or PWLB, is a statutory body that dates back to the Public Works Loan Act 1875. It comprises 12 loan commissioners appointed by the Crown to administer making loans to local authorities. The commissioners are independent of government and unpaid by law. Under Section 4 of the National Loans Act 1968, the PWLB currently has a statutory lending limit of £70 billion. The current level of debt amounts to £64 billion. The original role of the loan commissioners was to approve and issue central government loans to certain categories of permitted borrowers. Under the 1875 Act and subsequent legislation, the commissioners have the power to refuse a loan on the basis of lack of security, and to appoint a secretary who can hold security and to whom the powers of the commissioners can be delegated. The commissioners are also required to issue an annual report to Parliament setting out details of loans advanced by the PWLB.

However, since 2004 decisions on borrowing have been fully devolved to local authorities under the prudential regime. As part of the local authorities’ self-regulated regime, local authorities are free to finance capital projects by borrowing without requiring government consent, provided they can afford to service their debts out of their revenues. This means that the decision-making functions of the PWLB commissioners are essentially obsolete. Local authorities are responsible for their own decisions on whether to borrow and how much. Further, the day-to-day operations of providing loans are now carried out by the Debt Management Office—the DMO—which is an executive agency of HM Treasury.

The commissioners’ functions and powers are delegated to the secretary of the PWLB, who is a civil servant at the DMO. The highly regarded prudential regime means there is no scope nowadays for the commissioners to exercise influence or discretion over lending to local authorities. The Government are therefore considering whether to abolish the Public Works Loan Board while ensuring that permitted borrowers, mainly local authorities, will continue to be able to access central government loans in the same way as now.

The purpose of including the PWLB in Schedule 1 to the Public Bodies Act 2011, which is what these amendments achieve, is to confer on the Government the power to make an order under the Public Bodies Act that would abolish the PWLB and transfer its functions to an eligible person, as defined in the Public Bodies Act. Let me assure noble Lords that the abolition of the PWLB, and the succession arrangements, will be subject to proper parliamentary scrutiny under the Public Bodies Act process. This proposal is purely about governance reform. The PWLB abolition will not impact on the prudential regime or local authorities’ existing loans with the PWLB, and local authorities will be able to undertake new borrowing from the successor body, as now, at rates that offer good value for money. Interest rates will continue to be a policy matter for HM Treasury.

Following the commencement of the provisions in this clause, the Government plan to publish a consultation document providing details of their proposals for abolition and succession, as required under the Public Bodies Act. After taking into account responses from the consultation, both Houses will have the opportunity to scrutinise the draft legislation, which will of course be accompanied by the explanatory document, as required by Section 11 of the PBA. Abolition of the PWLB would remove bureaucracy and align the accountability for lending to local authorities with DMO’s existing responsibilities for day-to-day operational management. This is in line with the Government’s wider efficiency and modernisation agenda.

I am conscious that these amendments are so uncontroversial that this may be the last moment that I am on my feet in a discussion on the Infrastructure Bill. I would like to take this opportunity to thank my noble friends Lady Verma and Lord Ahmad, who have been stalwart in leading significant parts of the Bill. I thank your Lordships all across the House. The Bill has involved many different departments; individuals with different specialisation and Peers who have followed different issues have had to co-ordinate and manage across the complexities. They have done so brilliantly. I think we have collectively improved the Bill. It has also involved working closely with the other place. This is also an opportunity for me to say particular thanks to the Bill team, which has had to deal with some of the most extraordinary complexity in managing this whole process. Frankly, I think it has done it brilliantly.

I will of course wish to respond if issues are raised by any other Members of the House, but I did not want to lose the opportunity to say thank you, since I am aware that the amendments I am moving are so technical and uncontroversial that this may be my last time to speak. I beg to move.

[Lord McKenzie of Luton]

My Lords, I am bound to say that when I saw references to the Public Works Loan Board being abolished a sense of nostalgia swept over me. It took me back to my first finance committee meeting of Luton Borough Council in 1976—noble Lords will remember that in those days if you turned up with a briefcase you were put on the finance committee straight away—and to the regular reports of the borough treasurer thereafter. Little did one realise that we were then in the comparative twilight of the commissioners’ existence.

The most recent Annual Report and Accounts, in describing the functions of the commissioners, says that they derive from legislation of 1875 and 1968, which has been referred to. However, the report also says that the PWLB’s existence can be traced back to 1793. It became established on a permanent basis in 1817. It is asserted that changes over time have made the PWLB less relevant, to the point where it is suggested that its purpose is redundant. As we have heard, its functions and powers have been delegated to the Debt Management Office. A significant development was the prudential borrowing regime introduced under the previous Labour Government, which obviated the need for local authorities to go through a credit approval process. In fact, the prudential borrowing regime has proved to be a major success and has demonstrated that local authorities act responsibly and prudently when it comes to exercising borrowing powers. The proposition is to include the PWLB in Schedule 1 to the Public Bodies Act 2011 so that the Government can use powers under that Act to abolish it and transfer its functions to an eligible person. It seems as though any necessary consultations are to take place under the PBA processes—presumably about “how” to abolish it, not “if”.

My colleagues in another place have already challenged the Government on why the consultation promised last July has not taken place. They have also reasonably sought to clarify what residual functions the PWLB undertakes. The foreword to the 2013-14 Annual Report and Accounts described the functions of the commissioners as being,

“to consider loan applications from local authorities and other prescribed bodies and, where loans are made, to collect the repayments”.

As a practical matter, as we know, these responsibilities have been delegated to the secretary—effectively the accounting officer. The PWLB borrows from the National Loans Fund to fund its loans. All interest and loan repayments are paid over to the National Loans Fund. Commissioners are prepared to lend to an authority up to the available capacity in its prudential borrowing limit.

It seems to us that although the functions have been delegated to others the PWLB’s nominal powers are surely not insignificant. At 31 March 2014 it held loans of approximately £63.7 billion, with corresponding liabilities of the same amount. Its powers to facilitate borrowing and manage loans must be significant, even though delegated. As my honourable friend Roberta Blackman-Woods MP stated in another place, we all,

“want assurance that there is good oversight”—

and transparency—

“of local government borrowing”.—[Official Report, Commons, Infrastructure Bill Committee, 13/1/15 col. 333.]

Perhaps the Minister would take the opportunity to say how she considers that this will be provided under any new arrangements. Having said all that, we certainly will not oppose these amendments.

[Baroness Kramer]

My Lords, the consultation that will come under the Public Bodies Act is obviously an important step in the process to allow for full discussion of the kinds of issues that the noble Lord, Lord McKenzie, has discussed today. At the moment the commissioners simply meet on an annual basis. They note the loans issued and review the annual report prepared by the officials. I think this House would agree that sometimes it is important to recognise reality and make sure that the formal arrangements match the actuality. We hope that this is a step in that direction.

[Lord Davies of Oldham]

Before the Minister sits down, perhaps I may just add my congratulations to the Bill team on dealing with a Bill that has been one of the more absurd creations of government in recent history. The Department for Transport has been responsible for invasive species and for fracking. Long after Christmas time—if ever there was a Christmas tree of a Bill, this is it—we got a suggestion that we would have clauses on the Electronic Communications Code. It was once said in the other place, “Take away this bauble”. If that part of the Bill had arrived here, I would have repeated that phrase in relation to the clause. I congratulate the Minister on having piloted the Bill through, but I hope it is not a precedent for how the Government in fixed-term parliaments produce a measure that has everything in it including the kitchen sink.

[Baroness Kramer]

My Lords, I shall just say in passing that I take comfort in the fact that the work we have done in the Bill is of genuine value. I know that particularly from the transport areas in which I have been engaged. I really appreciate the input that has come from this House but I also think that the Government have taken the leadership in, for example, underpinning future funding of our road strategy. Fracking has an important role to play, but the framework necessary for it has been forwarded by this Bill on a wide range of matters that might have been overlooked. Something as simple as the mayoral development orders will let local authorities use that mayoral capacity to achieve the kind of housing projects that they want very much for their areas and their residents. It may be a complex Bill with many different items in it but I do think that we will be better for it. I thank the House.

Motion agreed.

Moved by

[Baroness Kramer]

That this House do agree with the Commons in their Amendments 24 to 32.

24: Clause 46, page 52, line 32, after “17” insert “(1)(a)”

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Moved by

[Baroness Kramer]

That this House do agree with the Commons in their Amendment 33, and do propose Amendment 33A as an amendment to Amendment 33.

33: Clause 47, page 53, line 35, at end insert “, and
2 ( ) sections 38 to 43 extend to England and Wales only.”

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Moved by

[Baroness Kramer]

That this House do agree with the Commons in their Amendments 34 to 48.

34: Clause 47, page 53, line 35, at end insert—
“( ) Part 5A (Public Works Loan Commissioners) extends to England and Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland.”

National Networks: National Policy Statement

Baroness Kramer Excerpts

Tuesday 20th January 2015 Grand Committee

Moved by

[Baroness Kramer]

That the Grand Committee takes note of the National Policy Statement for National Networks.

[The Minister of State, Department for Transport (Baroness Kramer) (LD)]

My Lords, I welcome this second debate on the Government’s National Policy Statement for National Networks. I will use the abbreviation NPS, if I may, in the course of this debate. This House previously debated the draft NPS on 8 May 2014 and made a valuable contribution to shaping that final document. I can confirm that the final NPS has been voted on and approved in the other place—the procedure that allows for the document to be formally designated. That said, I welcome the opportunity to update this Committee on the positive changes that have been made in response to comments received through both the parliamentary scrutiny process and the public consultation. For far too long we have suffered stop-start in infrastructure investment, which is in no one’s interest. Investment, such as we are seeing in road and rail, not only improves the transport system but creates jobs. This NPS represents long-term planning that looks to the future.

It might be helpful if I begin by clarifying the role and purpose of the NPS. The NPS has a specific purpose: it will provide planning guidance for promoters of nationally significant infrastructure projects on our road and rail networks and for strategic rail freight interchanges. It sets out at a strategic level the need for development of our national networks and establishes clear, high-level policies by which any nationally significant infrastructure project on these networks will need to be decided.

Our national networks are already under considerable pressure, which is expected to increase further. Long-term drivers of demand to travel—GDP and, particularly, population—are forecast to increase substantially over the coming years and continue to influence the path of travel demand, even taking into account other important drivers such as changes to demographics. The development of our national networks and the improved connectivity it provides can also unlock regional economic growth and regeneration, particularly in the most disadvantaged areas. Broader environmental, air-quality, safety and accessibility goals will also generate requirements for development to address safety issues, improve the environment and enhance accessibility for pedestrians and cyclists. The final NPS has benefited from earlier discussions with noble Lords in these areas; I will highlight some of those in more detail later in my speech.

Of course, the NPS needs to be seen in the context of other, wider transport strategy documents, such as the rail investment strategy and the recently published road investment strategy. These documents show that the Government take the need to invest in transport infrastructure seriously. The first ever road investment strategy outlines how £15.2 billion will be invested in our strategic roads between 2015 and 2021 and is part of a radical transformation of how we run our major roads. Between 2014 and 2019, Network Rail will be delivering a £38 billion programme to help transform the busiest parts of Britain’s rail network, helping to deliver more and better journeys. The Government’s rail investment strategy, also known as the HLOS, will support more than £11 billion of infrastructure enhancement in that period to run and improve the rail network, supporting economic growth and jobs and delivering a greener, more cost-efficient railway that is better for freight and better for passengers. All that is in addition to the investment committed for HS2.

The national policy statement supports a significant and balanced package of improvements across the road and rail networks, including improvements in safety, resilience, maintenance, environmental performance and access for cyclists and pedestrians. Indeed, the development of the strategic road network is primarily about upgrading the existing network rather than building new roads. Almost 40% of the investment in this and the next Parliament is for maintenance, and more than 80% of the schemes in the current programme are smart motorways.

Following the previous debate on the draft NPS held on 8 May last year, I have kept noble Lords who expressed concern updated on progress. The final NPS has taken those concerns into consideration and addressed them as far as possible. Those concerns included road traffic forecasts and appraisal, as well as impacts on local roads and transport policies. Some of those issues were too complex and technical to address in a debate and so I wrote individually to those noble Lords.

Turning to the final NPS, I would like to set out how a number of issues which have been raised by noble Lords have been dealt with in the final document.

I begin with forecasts. Road traffic forecasts and their prominence in the draft NPS were challenged in the consultation and parliamentary scrutiny process. The updated forecasts in the NPS have made use of new scenarios that take into account changes in travel behaviour that have been observed over recent years. These indicate that even with conservative scenarios of overall traffic growth, we still expect significant growth on the strategic road network. We also expect greater divergence between traffic in different locations. We have highlighted in the final NPS that the Government’s aim is to tackle congestion rather than meet the level of growth forecast. This is why I can say confidently that we are not reverting back to a policy of “predict and provide”.

It is important to understand that the NPS does not mean that the national traffic forecasts will be used as the means to justify individual developments. Individual schemes will need to use local models to justify development and to understand local impacts. They will be subject to a full transport business case.

For rail, passenger demand is predicted to continue to grow significantly. Total average growth in passenger kilometres from 2011 to 2033 is predicted to rise by just over 50%, including phase 1 of HS2.

I turn to the environment. Following the consultation and earlier debates, we have further strengthened environmental protections. For example, we now have a presumption against road widening or new roads in national parks and areas of outstanding natural beauty. We have also made a number of other changes, including strengthening the text on biodiversity, landscape, land use and noise.

The NPS recognises that integration between modes is important, and the route strategies that feed into the rail and road investment strategies provide ample opportunity to integrate development where that is sensible. There is now an explicit expectation in the NPS that assessment of alternative transport solutions and modes takes place at the investment appraisal stage—that is, prior to the NPS—and evidence that that has taken place should be available.

The road investment strategy shows us that with improvements in design, the progressive decarbonisation of the vehicle fleet, and higher environmental and safety standards, there is no longer a forced trade-off between a well functioning road and rail network and a well protected environment. Some funds in the road investment strategy have been ring-fenced to ensure that interventions are sustainable and beneficial to society as a whole. They include a £250 million cycling, safety and integration fund to deliver, among other things, improved cycling facilities on 200 sections of the network, and a £150 million innovation fund to exploit novel and innovative technologies and techniques in road construction and management.

This Government take air quality seriously, and the NPS recognises the impact that new road and rail infrastructure can have on it. Over £2 billion has been invested in measures to increase the uptake of ultra-low-emission vehicles, sustainable travel and green transport initiatives. The Government have also committed £100 million to improve air quality on the strategic road network as part of the road investment strategy. This is on top of a commitment to have environmental measures built into all new road schemes as standard.

The policy in the NPS states that promoters of nationally significant infrastructure projects should identify air quality impacts and put suitable mitigation measures in place. These measures may affect the project design, layout and construction and may comprise measures to improve air quality in pollution hotspots outside the immediate locality of the scheme. The measures could include changes to the route of a new scheme, barriers to trap or disperse emissions or speed control. Where a scheme results in a zone that is currently compliant with the air quality directive becoming non-compliant, or if the proposed timescale in which a zone is expected to achieve compliance is affected, the NPS is clear that the scheme should not go ahead.

We have listened to concerns raised on the importance of reducing carbon. The Government have already set stretching legally binding carbon budgets, which the NPS supports, but a planning inquiry on an individual road development is not the place to have a debate on our national carbon reduction strategy. Carbon impacts will still continue to form a key part of the transport appraisal and decision-making process for road schemes. We make it clear that applicants for any new schemes should provide evidence of the carbon impact of the project and an assessment against the Government’s carbon budgets.

The final NPS is clear that applicants should include design as an integral consideration from the outset and that independent, professional advice on design is taken. Visual appearance should be a key factor in considering the design of new infrastructure, as well as functionality, fitness for purpose, sustainability and cost. Good design goes towards ensuring that a development is sustainable, as aesthetically sensitive as possible, durable, adaptable and resilient. It contributes to safety and accessibility so that all users, including disabled people, have their needs met. The new company, Highways England, if established under the Infrastructure Bill, which is progressing through the Commons at the moment, will be required to establish a design panel to provide advice on design issues, which will be invaluable in ensuring that development takes account of geographical, environmental and socioeconomic considerations. This is further evidence that we have listened and responded on the matter of design.

New developments provide an opportunity to make significant safety improvements; indeed, some developments may have safety as a key objective. Our roads and railways are among the safest in the world but there is always room for improvement. The rail industry is required by law to consider the impact on safety of any proposed changes. The frequency of train accidents with passenger or workforce fatalities is now at the lowest level ever, despite more passengers and miles travelled.

The Government’s vision, in which Britain remains a world leader in road safety, is set out in the national Strategic Framework for Road Safety. The NPS sets out clear guidelines on this. A scheme will not be granted development consent unless all reasonable steps have been taken and will be taken to minimise the risk of road casualties arising from the scheme, and the scheme contributes to an overall improvement in the safety of the strategic road network. The road investment strategy includes a key performance indicator of reducing fatalities and serious injuries by 40% by 2020. I take this opportunity to remind the Committee that the NPS is a high-level long-term planning document that does not name specific schemes, as that would not be appropriate in such a document.

I ask that noble Lords recognise that this final NPS is much improved, following their valuable contributions and public consultation. The NPS has been produced following the requirements of the Planning Act 2008. As I mentioned, it is a high-level planning document. Consideration of issues such as the mode and integration are dealt with much earlier in the phase than this planning stage—essentially, at the investment appraisal stage.

What we have is a document which provides greater certainty for those developing much-needed transport infrastructure, along with robust environmental and safety protections and design requirements, which should help speed up the process for nationally significant infrastructure projects.

I hope that the Committee will welcome this much improved document, and I beg to move that the Committee has considered this NPS.

--- Later in debate ---

[Baroness Kramer]

My Lords, as usual, this has been an excellent debate, with a significant number of issues raised. I very much appreciate the informed way in which this House approaches what to me are some of the most fascinating issues that a Government could look at, because transport is essential for both quality of life and the economy of the country.

I shall try to address some of those issues. First, this is a planning document and it may well be that some of the issues raised fall very far outside the scope of a planning document, so if I mention those only in passing or omit them, please forgive me. Your Lordships know that I am always happy to discuss those broader issues.

Let me first pick up the issue of forecasting. I am rather pleased with what I think has been a real consideration of methodologies for forecasting now reflected in this final NPS. It is probably true to say, if we look at some of the historical numbers that we have had, that the methodology that has typically been quite reliable for the road network outside the major cities, especially outside London, did not seem to reflect changing patterns within London. Your Lordships will find in the document that more factors have now been brought in. That has been thought through in a broader way to derive the current set of forecasts. Also, the forecasting part of this document looks across a range of scenarios. The reality is that even when you look across a range of scenarios and take a pretty conservative position, there is still a powerful drive in the direction of growing demand.

However, as I said in my opening speech, recognising all that, the Government’s programme has still focused very much on existing roads, hotspots and congestion, rather than a new roads strategy, so we are certainly not in “predict and provide” mode, but we must be conscious as we move through all this work that we are paying attention to growing demand. Frankly, if that was not part of the understanding process, we would find ourselves in real difficulty. A look at the description and discussion of forecasting in the document itself might be of real interest to those with concerns around these issues. A great deal of attention has been paid to this area and, in my eyes, the forecasting is certainly much more sophisticated and appropriate than some which we might have seen in the past. I am not saying that it was bad but that there are more complexities now, which are being introduced into that process.

I want to pick up quickly on the issue of resilience. Chapter 2 of the NPS does that rather well, frankly, so I stress it because resilience is crucial. However, if we are talking about the performance of Network Rail, that is really outside the scope of the planning document. There are lots of issues to discuss there which are not really part of the NPS, but keeping resilience within the frame for an NPS is important and does matter.

[Lord Berkeley]

But surely resilience, either on rail or road, includes having alternative modes when something goes wrong. Is that not part of planning?

[Baroness Kramer]

First, that is reasonably well covered but in terms of determining how you cope with resilience, the resilience study for the south-west—a study which the noble Lord, Lord Berkeley, will be very aware of—was also interesting because all modes were looked at in its production. However, it seems to me that it has to be apropos the event location that one is coping with, so we would need resilience on individual modes as well as for broader access. The NPS has that within its language. Part of the way in which the department and the Government are now working is also demonstrated by something like that resilience study, which addressed that wide range of issues. It is picked up again in the RIS where, for example, something such as the A303 is absolutely critical to resilience in access down into the south-west, even though the crisis was on a rail line at Dawlish. To tell the honest truth, I think we have that one sorted.

There are issues of integration and considering an overarching transport plan, which my noble friend Lord Shipley addressed and the noble Lord, Lord Berkeley, to some extent echoed. First, if one were to look at page 102 of the planning document—the very last page—it is quite instructive because it shows, as it were, the food chain. To me, the work on looking at alternative modes and setting out a broader transport plan happens much earlier up the food chain than in this planning document. It is too late by the time that progress has got as far as the NPS. There is a section called “strategy and policy”, which is a crucial area to bring in this thought around various modes and a much broader perspective on transport. Critically, and as I think I said in my speech, when it progresses to the investment planning and decision-making phase that would be where the RIS, the route utilisation strategies and the work required in the various control periods for Network Rail would appear. It is at those stages that those issues need to be addressed.

Once it gets to planning, it is not that one ignores integration and alternative modes but we would be just past that point when this document begins to apply. I think that is healthier. I say that for this reason: I look at what seems to have been real progression in this area over the last few years. If I had looked at transport planning even four or five years ago, I am not sure that when we looked at HS2 we would have been so incredibly focused as we are now on building that east-west connectivity across the Midlands and the north. It has become an implicit part of looking at HS2 to talk about not just HS3 but much more complex work. A significant part of the responsibility for that has now been devolved to Transport for the North—that is, having remembered its acronym, TfN—which will be producing its initial report in March. That devolved engagement is crucial to that step. That comes well before we would ever get to an NPS; it is a much earlier piece of thinking. Also, when we look on a project-by-project basis, Sir David Higgins of HS2—my noble friend Lord Shipley specifically raised HS2 and connectivity—has said that that is a key theme. He works closely with Network Rail around those issues, because as he builds rail infrastructure, building in the rail interconnection or ensuring that it is optimised will be key. Indeed, one reason that we have not finalised the route for phase 2 is that it is so important to bring connectivity into that picture. Much of that is relatively recent thinking, but it comes at a much earlier stage than the NPS. Very important issues have been highlighted, but I am not sure that they are something for this document. In fact, it would almost be a failure if we were suddenly to start considering that at the NPS stage. It has to have been dealt with much earlier in the process.

I completely agree with the noble Lords, Lord Davies and Lord Berkeley, that rail freight interchanges are crucial. I think that there is now general satisfaction with the provision for that as described in the NPS document. It takes what the industry and much—although not all—of the environmental community thinks is an appropriate approach. We are investing heavily in access to the ports. The noble Lord, Lord Berkeley, will know of the upgrade from Felixstowe to Northampton. Across the various controlled periods, we are looking at the necessary improvements for port capacity. An area that will need a lot of focus in future years is that HS2 releases west coast main line, east coast main line and Midland main line in ways that create capacity for freight that we have not been able to explore historically. Although freight always has to be near the centre of our thinking, there will be a great deal of change as we explore how we can maximise the benefits of that freed up capacity. That will be important.

On modal shift, we have our revenue fund—about £80 million—to try to encourage a modal shift from road to rail. I am now falling back entirely on memory, but I think that the road investment strategy highlighted some parts of that strategy as ensuring relevant port connectivity. If that is not right, I will write back to your Lordships, but I certainly remember that being a great subject of conversation and I am pretty sure that it ended up in the road investment strategy.

My noble friend Lord Shipley talked about continental gauge. My husband, who is now long dead, was one of the supporters of Central Railway, which proposed a dedicated freight line. I think that a Member of Parliament in the other place, Kelvin Hopkins, is a supporter of Eurorail. A number of such projects are coming forward; none is proposed at the moment. It will be complex to consider them until we have a sense of what HS2 releases.

[Lord Berkeley]

Just for the record, Kelvin Hopkins MP has a scheme which he has been promoting for several years. It is still on his table; whether it is on anyone else’s table, I cannot say.

[Baroness Kramer]

I do not think that it has come forward to Parliament. I am giving a personal view, but I believe that a major project on that scale is outside the NPS, just as HS2 is, and that the hybrid Bill process would be used because it affects so many communities and so many localised planning issues that require people to have a voice. I cannot believe that it would be appropriate to handle it in any way other than through the hybrid Bill process, but I could certainly be proved wrong in future. My sense is that it belongs there rather than within the NPS framework.

I think that I have covered most of the issues that were raised. As I have said, they are all crucial to transport thinking, so I appreciate the fact that they have been raised in the context of this opportunity to discuss transport. However, we have also to recognise that the NPS is a very specific document meeting a very specific purpose and it is with that in mind that I am narrowing down my comments. The NPS does not introduce new policy; it states current policy. It is a planning document and it is central to our long-term economic plan. We have responded seriously to discussion and debate in this House and the other place as well as in public consultation because we have wanted to get it right. I hope that, on that basis, your Lordships will feel able to support the document today.

Motion agreed.

Transport: London Bridge Station

Baroness Kramer Excerpts

Tuesday 13th January 2015 Lords Chamber

[Lord Kennedy of Southwark]

To ask Her Majesty’s Government what action they are taking to address the problems suffered by passengers at London Bridge station.

[The Minister of State, Department for Transport (Baroness Kramer) (LD)]

My Lords, this will be a difficult period as we spend over £1 billion improving London Bridge station. Steps have already been taken to address problems at London Bridge by increasing the number of staff, adding further passenger information displays and temporarily adjusting the timetable to improve reliability. The Secretary of State met senior Network Rail and train operator executives on 9 January to understand the problems and discuss preparations for the Southeastern service changes from 12 January. We thank passengers for their patience.

[Lord Kennedy of Southwark (Lab)]

First, I declare an interest as an elected member of Lewisham Council. The chaos and failure to manage the situation at London Bridge has just highlighted to a wider audience what we have been experiencing in south London for many years. At Brockley, Crofton Park, Honor Oak Park and other stations, trains are cancelled or, when they arrive, are already full up. Either the trains do not turn up or, if they do, there are not enough carriages and people cannot get on them to get to work. As a result, the platforms become overcrowded and dangerous. Will the noble Baroness agree to arrange and host a meeting between me, local campaigners, Network Rail and the train operators Southern, Southeastern and TfL rail to deal with this problem?

[Baroness Kramer]

As your Lordships know, I am always happy to meet on these issues, so that is something that I shall be glad to try to accommodate. Whether we need to do so in two phases or one is not entirely clear but I hope that we can discuss this matter. The underlying issue of congestion on the railways is obviously behind many of the problems that we face. This massive set of improvements around the London Bridge area, costing about £1.5 billion, will play an absolutely key role in removing one of the major bottlenecks in the system, even though it will take several years to achieve that.

[Lord Palmer (CB)]

My Lords, are not the fiasco at London Bridge, and indeed the chaos at Finsbury Park—I was caught up in it after Christmas—and Paddington, a very good cause to renationalise everything to do with our railways?

[Baroness Kramer]

I point out to your Lordships that quite a number of the problems that have occurred have been National Rail problems, which is the one part of the system that we directly own. One of the lessons that I have learnt from watching all the problems that have been taking place—they are inexcusable and must be dealt with—is that the rail network is complex and that there is a need to make sure that it is in manageable sections which, although they have to work together, are totally driven around their primary responsibility.

[Lord West of Spithead (Lab)]

My Lords, I declare an interest as a waterman and lighterman. Does the Minister believe that we should make greater use of the River Thames for commuters, which would take a lot of weight off the railway system and the roads?

[Baroness Kramer]

My Lords, I always think that it is exciting to look at opportunities to use the River Thames. However, one of the problems is that the Thames winds and bends around loops, which often means that journeys, rather than being quick, are fairly slow. However, Transport for London is always interested in looking at any proposed use of the Thames, and so are we.

[Lord Bradshaw (LD)]

Does the Minister agree that for decades there has been tremendous underinvestment in the railway, which is now busier than ever, and that the party opposite did not do much while it was in office to help the situation? Does this not pinpoint the imperative of getting HS2 working—where you can build a railway without having to inconvenience passengers—so that something new comes on stream to relieve the congestion?

[Baroness Kramer]

I agree with everything that my noble friend has just said.

[Lord Davies of Oldham (Lab)]

My Lords, I do not. The noble Lord and the House are aware that the developments at London Bridge were planned and started under the previous Administration. The Minister rightly says that Network Rail is the one part of the railway system that is directly under the control of Ministers who are directly answerable. How frequently do Ministers meet the planners of Network Rail when these crunch occasions can clearly be foreseen? It seems that not enough work is done when difficulties begin to arise and Ministers should realise that the buck stops with them.

[Baroness Kramer]

My Lords, meetings are very frequent at all levels. Obviously Network Rail is the entity with direct understanding of its own operations and interfering in the day-to-day operations would not be appropriate for a government department. The ORR plays a key role in all of this. However, the Secretary of State, for example, meets Network Rail every week. All through the system there are regular meetings. However, there are many lessons to be learnt from the experiences of the past couple of weeks, which, frankly, have been inexcusable. We need to make sure that they are not repeated.

[Lord Harris of Haringey (Lab)]

If the Secretary of State meets Network Rail on a weekly basis, what responsibility does the Secretary of State take for the failures at London Bridge?

[Baroness Kramer]

London Bridge is a massive and highly complex programme. We have to learn the lessons from what went wrong. The key management team at London Bridge has delivered magnificent improvements at Blackfriars and Farringdon, of which many noble Lords will be aware. However, it is crucial that we understand the extraordinary complexities at London Bridge. Improvements are already taking place. This service should bed down, but we will be watching it very closely at all levels.

Roads: Young Drivers

Baroness Kramer Excerpts

Monday 12th January 2015 Lords Chamber

[Lord Jordan]

To ask Her Majesty’s Government whether they have any plans to produce a Green Paper to address the incidence of vehicle accidents involving young drivers.

[The Minister of State, Department for Transport (Baroness Kramer) (LD)]

My Lords, Britain has some of the safest roads in the world. However, young drivers are disproportionately involved in collisions. There is a difficult balance to strike between promoting young drivers’ safety and their freedom to access work and education. We will not rule out further measures, but at present we are focusing our efforts on technological solutions. We recently commissioned research into how telematics can reduce accident rates among young drivers and the findings will help to shape future road safety policy.

[Lord Jordan (Lab)]

I thank the Minister for that reply. Young drivers account for about 20% of all road deaths, yet they represent only 7% of all fully licensed drivers and have less mileage than older drivers. Measures have been tried for many years, and all have failed. It is now time for this issue to be grasped. I believe the time has come for an all-party commitment, before the next election, to a Green Paper on young drivers that is prepared to see more radical solutions than we have seen so far. This will not only harness those who want to support this but will certainly give some relief to all the parents in Britain who are terrified of the statistics I have quoted. Is the Minister prepared to be part of an all-party commitment to a new Green Paper?

[Baroness Kramer]

My Lords, the Government are not ruling out any programme that safeguards young drivers, but at the moment we are focusing our efforts on technological solutions, such as the telematics I described. We think they offer great potential and will help to get the right balance between safety and the freedom to use a car, which is so important to many young people.

[Baroness Gardner of Parkes (Con)]

Will the Minister consider looking at the Australian system, which is very much tougher on young drivers? Until a certain period has passed, you have to have a nil alcohol level, but the real secret is enforcement. Will she look at that policy?

[Baroness Kramer]

Obviously it is important to look around the world, and we do. I agree that enforcement is important, and that is one of the very important areas for telematics, which provide a running judgment on the way in which a car is being driven at any moment.

[Lord Wills (Lab)]

My Lords, the Minister will be aware that of the serious accidents caused by young drivers, the great proportion of those accidents, and fatalities, are caused by young men drivers, not by young women drivers. This is as much a cultural problem as anything else. What are the Government doing specifically to tackle that aspect of the problem?

[Baroness Kramer]

We have extensive programmes on issues around drink driving, and I am sure your Lordships are aware of those campaigns. We have a very good safety record in this country, frankly, but we can never be complacent about that. As I say, the focus of the work is now on what we can do with telematics, which now enable us to tackle this problem in a much more targeted way. Research is under way so that we will be able to do that effectively.

[Lord Bradshaw (LD)]

My Lords, I concentrated on road safety for many years when I was a member of the Thames Valley Police Authority. The injuries which young men suffer—often at night, usually driving too fast, usually driving in wet conditions—are horrendous, and they are horrendously expensive. I wonder whether, instead of a Green Paper, the Minister would consider some legislation to make things like provisional licences a reality rather than something which people refer to every few years and then forget about.

[Baroness Kramer]

My Lords, it is crucial that we use research and research-based evidence to design effective programmes. As noble Lords will know, there are many different examples around the world, but under its current system, which we are obviously seeking to improve, the UK actually scores very well on international measures.

[Lord Howarth of Newport (Lab)]

My Lords, will the noble Baroness be kind enough to explain, for the benefit of elderly drivers who may not know, what telematics are?

[Baroness Kramer]

My Lords, that, I am sure, his Lordship does know. It is basically a gizmo—if I may use such language—that is in the car, which constantly communicates the driving performance to the insurance company, so erratic driving and speeding are picked up on a live basis.

[Earl Attlee (Con)]

My Lords, is it therefore correct that the Government have wimped out on introducing graduated licences, and why do we allow motor manufacturers to build motor cars that can far exceed the prevailing speed limit?

[Baroness Kramer]

My Lords, as I say, we have not ruled anything out, but we think telematics are a useful direction to pursue because they let us target problem driving, so that many other youngsters who are driving well still have the scope to reach various education and social events. As for the question of general speed limits in cars, I have never addressed that, but I will try to find the noble Lord an answer and write to him.

[Lord Davies of Oldham (Lab)]

My Lords, is this the only Government who perceive a Green Paper as green grass into which they can kick difficult areas? In March last year the Minister made a commitment to produce this Green Paper. Subsequently it was quite clear that we would not see it before Christmas. We know the nature of the grass leading up to the next general election. This Government have no intention at all of tackling this significant road safety issue, and they stand condemned on that fact.

[Baroness Kramer]

My Lords, the review of telematics will be a two-phase study, and we should see the first phase in April. That will lay out what further work needs to be done. At the moment we do not have the evidence base or the research that we need to make sure that we are coming up with the most appropriate solution.

[Baroness Walmsley (LD)]

My Lords, could I ask for a little more clarification about telematics? Does this mean that this gizmo has to be put in the car of every young driver for a period after they pass their test? Could my noble friend the Minister explain a little further?

[Baroness Kramer]

At the moment, Members of your Lordships' House may themselves have driving insurance that has telematics attached. Anyone going on to one of the websites and looking at various insurance premiums will see that discounts are available for most companies if there is an agreement to use the telematics system. It is still obviously fairly early on in its life. That is why we need to have research, because we want to understand whether there is a good relationship between this ongoing monitoring of what is happening in the car and the actual accidents about which we are all concerned.

[Lord Dubs (Lab)]

The Minister has not mentioned young motorcyclists. Are they not the group that is particularly in danger of accidents?

[Baroness Kramer]

The noble Lord is right that young motorcyclists are also disproportionately engaged in accidents. I am frankly not clear on the insurance and telematics potential for motorcycles, and I will have to write to him on that.