Renters' Rights Bill (First sitting)

Sam Carling Excerpts

Committee stage
Tuesday 22nd October 2024 Public Bill Committees

[Lola McEvoy]

Q It is really interesting to hear your evidence. Thank you for raising Ayesha’s story, because it makes a real difference to us as Committee members. Good landlords and good tenants are welcome in this. What do you see as an opportunity for the people you represent to support the work of the landlord database? What is the best way that we can ensure it affects people such as Ayesha?

Ben Twomey: Relating the database to rent repayment orders would be useful. If there is a way in which tenants or tenant groups can access the database to make sure that landlords are compliant with the database, it would be helpful. Adding the actual rents to that database would be useful, because we would finally get an honest and clear picture of what people are paying in rent. That would start to change the inflated idea that a landlord can stick their finger in the air and charge whatever they like just because it is a new tenancy. We would start to see the patterns appear for when people are in tenancies.

We should also have certain restrictions for evictions. We think eviction notices should be logged on the database. That would give a clearer picture of why people are being evicted, so that measures later down the line can be taken to reduce the number of evictions. It is helpful that in the Bill they will now have to have a reason for eviction, because currently we do not know why landlords are evicting. We know that it coincides far too often with complaints made by a tenant, but we could continue to track that through the database. We think that landlords should be restricted from making evictions or even rent hikes if they have not registered with the database and the redress scheme.

Tom Darling: I would agree with all that. I know that the Government intend to set out what will be on the database in secondary legislation, but I think it would be helpful to have a steer from Ministers throughout this process on what they intend to be on the database.

[Sam Carling (North West Cambridgeshire) (Lab)]

Q I have a couple of things to ask. First, I would like to hear your views on the arguments that the first panel of witnesses made that assured shorthold tenancy abolitions would remove some security from tenants, particularly students but also people who have longer tenancies.

On your point about the idea of limiting rent increases to wage growth or inflation, how would you respond to the counter-argument that it might lead to landlords setting a much higher baseline rent between tenancies, knowing that they would not necessarily be able to increase the rent as much within a tenancy?

Tom Darling: To take the first point about the lessening of security, similar reforms in Scotland led to an increase in average tenancy length. The idea that abolishing fixed-term tenancies will lead to Airbnb-lite, as we heard earlier, is ridiculous. Clearly, the people proposing that have not been through joining a tenancy recently, because it is an incredibly stressful experience. That is the last thing people would think of to do to go on holiday or to stay for only two months. There has been no evidence of that in Scotland, despite similar reforms in place there, so I would dismiss the idea.

The ability to leave the tenancy to be used in very rare circumstances—for example, where you realise there is some black mould that you did not see, which was being hidden from you when you viewed the property, or you have a serious change in personal circumstances—is an essential protection. It is to be used by tenants in very rare circumstances. Actually, the arguments about that are more about landlords: they would prefer to have the certainty of six months’ rent up front—I am sure they would. We think the Government have the balance right on that particular point at the moment.

Ben Twomey: To add to that quickly, the point made by the letting agents about someone on a two-year fixed-term contract who might find themselves at risk of a form of no-fault eviction by the end of one year is a valid concern. We would welcome support in calling for a longer protective period from no-fault evictions in that case. At the moment, one year is in the Bill, which we welcome as security for renters, but doubling that to two years would be very welcome to make sure that people on such contracts do not find themselves disadvantaged.

To address the point about rent-stabilisation measures, it is important that the vast benefit to potentially millions of private renters is weighed against any potential disadvantages. Millions of renters finding themselves better protected from arbitrary evictions through a rent hike, and from being driven into debt, poverty or homelessness, is an enormous success.

In Scotland, which introduced such measures recently, there has not been an enormous increase in market rents disproportionate to what has happened in England, Wales or indeed Northern Ireland. It was similar tracking of rent inflation with new tenancies. While doing that, we have protected all those people, yet what is happening in the market is similar. One of the ways to solve part of that market problem and to begin to drive down rents is, as has already been said, to build lots of homes at the same time. Some of the most successful rent-cap regimes across Europe are in places with lots of social housing, which takes some of the pressure off the private rented sector.

[Claire Hazelgrove]

Q Thank you both for joining us today. It is so important to hear renters’ voices here in Parliament as we discuss this crucial Bill. A simple question from me: do you believe that, as drafted, the Bill will improve the lives of, and make things fairer for, the millions of renters across our country?

Tom Darling: Simply put, yes. We will be pushing in a number of places where we think the Bill should go further and where we do not think the Government have quite got the balance right, but the groups in our coalition have been campaigning for this change since the promise was first made nearly six years ago. We think it will be an important change to our housing system.

Ben Twomey: Yes. Our homes are the foundations of our lives. The Bill will give us some much-needed security and should drive up standards and quality. As I say, we are worried about affordability within that, but the main reason why you as politicians have probably not heard from renters so much as is in the past year or two is that things have got so desperate. We are worried that if there are some improvements to renting, suddenly we will lose our ability to have spaces like this where we can begin to make change. If this is to be a once-in-a-generation opportunity to make that change, we think you should cover all bases and make sure that no one finds themselves homeless, in poverty or in debt because of the fact that they have been forced into private renting.

Renters' Rights Bill (Second sitting)

Sam Carling Excerpts

Committee stage
Tuesday 22nd October 2024 Public Bill Committees

[Mr Amos]

Q So that would be the control?

Victoria Tolmie-Loverseed: Yes.

[Sam Carling (North West Cambridgeshire) (Lab)]

Q I wanted to pick up on a couple of points from your written evidence on joint tenancies. Under the new Bill, if one student leaves, you have the problem where the whole tenancy might end up collapsing. Do you have any thoughts about what the Bill could do to address those concerns, save the arguments that you have already made about having a specialist student tenancy? Also, on that point about the student tenancy, would you agree that there is a bit of an issue at the moment wherein quite a lot of students drop out of university, which is an issue in and of itself, but are locked into tenancies? Would this Bill address that situation?

Victoria Tolmie-Loverseed: The joint tenancy issue is problematic, and there is no way to get around it. If you are in a joint tenancy, all the tenants are essentially treated as one. If one tenant gives notice, all the other tenants, in theory, could be asked to leave at the same time. I think landlords will be pragmatic about it and seek to manage that process actively. Unless it is in their interests to regain possession of the whole property, I think most landlords will try to smooth things out and find a resolution.

Typically, the remaining tenants are liable for the rent on the room that has been vacated, and I think it would be very difficult for landlords to backfill, so the remaining tenants may find that the rent increases. That is going to cause quite a lot of rupture and disruption in the student market. We think about half of tenancies are on a joint basis at the moment, and that is going to be really disruptive. I cannot think of a way around it. Unless there was some sort of ability to have a fixed term, I think it is going to be really difficult. Sorry; I have forgotten the second bit of the question.

[Sam Carling]

Q It was about the point that quite a lot of students drop out of university, so there is an issue, on the flipside of some of the points you made before, about those students being locked in. Would you agree that this Bill addresses that?

Victoria Tolmie-Loverseed: Yes. I think a lot of landlords release tenants, certainly in the PBSA sector. If somebody leaves university or their circumstances change, I think a lot of landlords release tenants. I think it is right that if somebody leaves university, a landlord should seriously consider releasing them, perhaps with two months’ notice, and letting them leave. I think that would be a very good element of a student tenancy. Unipol is a landlord, and we release tenants if their circumstances have changed. It is a relatively small number of students who require that, but it is difficult. That would undoubtedly be an advantage to the students who need it.

[Carla Denyer]

Q I have a specific question on the new grounds for possession that we were just talking about. I interpreted the wording of the new ground that specifically gives the power to recover possession between June and September as potentially an oversight. One of the written statements we received—RRB 04, for Committee members—highlights that as well. The ground seems to fail to consider other kinds of students, such as people on a one-year Masters that starts in January, or nursing students who are often studying over the summer. I know, as I am friends with some of those people, that they found it hard enough to get housing on a non-traditional term as it was, without giving landlords a particular power to kick them out halfway through the summer when they are halfway through their course. Do you share that concern, and do you have suggestions for whether that should be changed?

Victoria Tolmie-Loverseed: There are significant numbers of students—I do not know the exact numbers, but more and more are starting with January start dates. Some universities have five points in the year when you can start a degree or a Masters. It is problematic for Masters students whose course goes on until September or October, when they are having to write up, or PhD students. That can be difficult. I think there should be more flexibility in the current timetable of June to September, and perhaps in the ability to give notice at different points in the year for student properties.

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Amos]

Q I was interested to hear the rest of your points. One area that is not regulated in the Act is the regulation of letting agents. Is that something that Acorn would like to see happen? Feel free to expand on your points.

Anny Cullum: We would like to see letting agents regulated. Especially with the issues around bidding wars and discrimination when you enter a new home or the private sector for the first time, in the majority of cases that will be about your experience with your letting agency. We as Acorn suggest mystery shopping, like when Trading Standards sends kids into shops to mystery shop and sees whether they will sell them alcohol. Maybe we should be sending people into letting agencies and seeing whether they are being discriminated against on the basis of any protected characteristic, but particularly on the basis of being benefit claimants. That part could be strengthened in the Bill.

[Sam Carling]

Q Picking up on the point you made about illegal evictions, is there anything we can do with the landlord database to help with that and some of the other issues you raise?

Anny Cullum: I think the landlord database will be excellent. It is important from our point of view that the landlord database includes information for tenants on previous enforcement action that has been taken against landlords, because you can then make an informed choice as a tenant about where you would like to rent. That will be another way to deter landlords from behaving illegally because they know they will have a mark against their name on the register. We hope the register will mean that, rather than tenants trying to compete for homes at the moment, landlords are competing for tenants by behaving in a good way and providing a good service. Having that sort of information on the database would be incredibly helpful.

[Carla Denyer]

Q I want to ask about one of the things in your submission, so this may help you to expand on it. I thought your proposal on the right to withhold rent for serious disrepair is interesting: it sounds quite radical on the surface, but in any other sector, if one party was breaching a contract and failing to deliver a service, it would be quite normal to withhold payments. Can you expand at all on how that would work in practice or how you envisage it working? What are Acorn’s views on the proposed regime for managing unaffordable rent hikes, and is it enough?

Anny Cullum: On withholding rent for serious disrepair, there are much-improved schemes and action within the Bill around the decent homes standard and improving standards for tenants, but a lot of the action set out to be taken if tenants are experiencing disrepair is retroactive or down the line. We know that councils can take a long time to act and that lots of tenants will not pursue things like rent repayment orders because they just do not have the time and energy. But if someone is living with serious disrepair—things like the damp and mould laid out in Awaab’s law, which we are pleased to see moving over to the private rented sector—we think there could be a mechanism whereby, if it is not fixed within the timescale set out by Awaab’s law, they could withhold their rent and pay it to a third party, which could then give the landlord another timescale within which to solve it. If they did not solve it, the tenant would get the rent paid back. If they did, the landlord would get the rent.

That would be an immediate incentive to do the work and stop leaving people in the dangerous conditions we see all the time. Landlords are not necessarily going to worry in the moment about a rent repayment order that a tenant may or may not put in for, which would take ages to go through a court—landlords sometimes do not even pay them anyway—whereas, if you can withhold the rent, that will speed along the process of sorting out mouldy and unsafe homes. So that is the mechanism we would think of. There are lots of considerations as to how it could work. If you consult on bringing Awaab’s law into the private rented sector, that will be a good place to think about the best mechanism to do it.

I think your second question was about rent hikes—rent rises.

Renters' Rights Bill (Fifth sitting)

Sam Carling Excerpts

Committee stage
Thursday 31st October 2024 Public Bill Committees

[Carla Denyer]

A number of the organisations that gave evidence suggested something along those lines, and they had looked into the viability of both mechanisms existing in parallel. I do not have the exact chapter and verse of what they said in my head; we can look at that in Hansard.

[Sam Carling (North West Cambridgeshire) (Lab)]

On the suggestion made by the hon. Member for Bristol Central, the civil penalty income is imposed by a public body as a punishment for breaking the law. There is a point of principle about whether it is right—whether there is a precedent—to give a contribution back to the tenant from that. It feels very unusual to me.

I have a brief question for the Minister; it may be that as a new Member of Parliament I am not used to this yet. Is it normal to specify the amount of the fine in primary legislation? Can that cause problems later in respect of needing to uprate it with inflation or anything like that?

[Matthew Pennycook]

On the point made by my hon. Friend the Member for North West Cambridgeshire, it is conventional to put the amount of the fine on the face of the Bill. There are provisions in the Bill that allow the Government to increase the fine to reflect the increase in inflation over time, so it is not a static, once-and-for-all £7,000 or £40,000 in the case of criminal offences.

On the point from the hon. Member for Bristol Central, I sympathise very much with the intent. We have to ensure that prospective tenants who face direct or more subtle forms of discrimination take a complaint to the local authority, but I have confidence that tenants will, and I have concerns about the approach she specifies. First, on a point of principle, the penalties are imposed by a public body for breaking the law. They are not a mechanism for compensation. It would be a departure from the norm, as she rightly appreciates.

My primary concern—I think the hon. Lady underestimates it even with the increased fee she proposes —is that there would be a significant impact on local authorities. They will take issue with losing 20% of the fine they can levy. I will check with her local authority after I leave the Committee as to whether they would be happy to lose that.