Prevention and Suppression of Terrorism

Debate between Robert Halfon and Louise Ellman

Tuesday 26th February 2019 Commons Chamber

[Dame Louise Ellman (Liverpool, Riverside) (Lab/Co-op)]

I congratulate the Home Secretary on bringing this much-needed measure before the House tonight. I am extremely concerned that my hon. Friend the Member for Torfaen (Nick Thomas-Symonds) was unable to give proper, full support to the banning of this terrorist organisation, Hezbollah, in its entirety. Hezbollah is not our friend, and today was a good opportunity to say so.

Terrorism affects our whole society. Hezbollah is a terrorist organisation acting throughout the world. We have heard examples of it causing death and destruction, with the death of 85 people in a community centre in Argentina, and hundreds of thousands of people, including children, killed or facing starvation in Syria because of its activities. I would like to concentrate on the activities of Hezbollah here in this country and ask Members to think about what happens every single year on the streets of London on al-Quds day—the day designated by the late Ayatollah Khomeini to call for the destruction of Israel.

The Hezbollah terrorist flag is flown on the streets of London, because of our current legislation. If the flag, with its upturned rifle, has a sticker on it saying, “We are supporting the political wing of Hezbollah,” it is able to be flown without challenge. I went to see the Metropolitan police last year after that happened, and they followed up with a letter to me, which said:

“As Parliament has chosen not to proscribe the whole of Hizballah, being a member or supporter of the wider non-proscribed organisation is lawful, and those supporters can rightfully protest”.

I was told clearly that if the whole organisation were proscribed, those flags could not be flown. Is the Home Secretary sure that this order does not contain any loopholes that will allow that terrorist flag to be flown on the streets of London? It would be appalling if it could be.

I very much welcome the step that the Home Secretary is taking, and I hope that it will have the full support of all Members. Terrorism is abhorrent. Hezbollah is a terrorist organisation. To suggest that it has two separate wings is a fallacy. It is wrong for Hezbollah to operate, kill and maim people and propagate terrorism throughout the world, and that includes what happens here in this country.

[Robert Halfon]

I thank the hon. Lady for standing up for an honourable Labour tradition of opposing terrorism. Is she aware of the opinion poll conducted by ComRes for the Jewish News that suggested that something like 80% of the public are in favour of banning Hezbollah?

[Dame Louise Ellman]

I thank the right hon. Gentleman for his comment. I am aware of that important opinion poll. It is a timely reminder that, while Hezbollah specifically targets Jewish people and Jewish organisations, it affects our whole society. When we consider this issue, we should look at how the terrorist organisation Hezbollah affects our whole society. That is why it is right for the Home Secretary to bring this order before us, and I hope that it is supported by everybody here.

Gaza

Debate between Robert Halfon and Louise Ellman

Wednesday 25th February 2015 Westminster Hall

[Mrs Louise Ellman (Liverpool, Riverside) (Lab/Co-op)]

I congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for East Kilbride, Strathaven and Lesmahagow (Mr McCann) on securing this important and timely debate. It is true that the rehabilitation and restoration of Gaza following Hamas’s attacks on Israeli civilians last year has been slow, and it is important that the barriers to that rehabilitation be removed; but what is happening now is far from that, and it is vital to be alert to Hamas’s current activities in preparing to launch a new war. It is doing that by reconstructing the terror tunnels; rebuilding its arsenal of rockets and mortars and, indeed, trying to beat Israel’s defence system, the Iron Dome; and recruiting an army which it describes as having been set up for the purpose of “liberating Palestine”.

[Robert Halfon]

The hon. Lady’s remark about Hamas rearming is important. Does she agree that despite that rearming, and contrary to what the hon. Member for Hammersmith (Mr Slaughter) said, hundreds of tonnes of aid are going from Israel into Gaza every week?

[Mrs Ellman]

I agree. Israel was right to defend its citizens from attack in 2014 and if necessary it will defend itself again, but a new round of violence started by Hamas aggression cannot bring a solution to a peace for Palestinians and Israelis any nearer. I call on all those who genuinely care about peace to take whatever action they can to stop a new war. That means recognising the threat posed by Iran, which is already saying how it supports a new war, and threatening, as the Ayatollah Khamenei did in a tweet in November:

“The West Bank will surely be armed just like Gaza”.

We should recognise the problems that Iran poses with respect to the lack of peace in Gaza, and the current nuclear talks with Iran should not stop pressure being applied for it to cease destabilising the region. The United Kingdom should urge the UN Security Council to pass a resolution preventing the rearmament of Hamas and starting a process of demilitarisation. Demilitarisation and the rehabilitation of Gaza are not alternatives to reaching a comprehensive agreement between Israelis and Palestinians, but they are an essential step towards that goal. Hamas aggression started a horrendous war last year with deplorable loss of life.

Middle East and North Africa

Debate between Robert Halfon and Louise Ellman

Thursday 17th July 2014 Westminster Hall

[Mrs Ellman]

The hon. Gentleman is absolutely correct. Those rockets are aimed at and landing on places such as Jerusalem, Tel Aviv and Haifa. Munir al-Masri, a senior Hamas spokesperson, stated only two days ago, on 15 July:

“Hamas will continue hitting Israel until the last Zionist leaves the whole of Palestine, from the sea to the river.”

It is pretty clear what this is all about.

The situation is intolerable. Neither the Israeli Government nor any other Government could countenance this targeted attack on their citizens, the aim of which is to kill and to destroy. It is interesting to note the comment made by Gershon Baskin, who is renowned for his efforts working with Palestinians and Israelis to seek peace. Indeed, he was a pivotal figure in the release of Gilad Shalit. He spoke only last week of his absolute despair. He said that he called on the Hamas leadership not to intensify its actions. He knows that his message went right to the top, to Khaled Meshaal, the Hamas leader. With absolute despair, he said that the Hamas leader simply said, “Bring it on.” The situation is extremely grave.

A large number of Palestinian civilians have been killed or injured, which is a matter of deep regret. It is a tragedy for them as much as it would be for Israelis to be injured or killed. The responsibility for the deaths and injuries has to lie with those who decided to put their rocket bases, launchers and headquarters in civilian populations—Hamas. Indeed, a senior Hamas spokesman, Sami Abu Zuhri, said only two days ago, on 15 July:

“The fact that people are willing to sacrifice themselves against Israeli weapons in order to protect their homes is a strategy that is proving itself.”

The Israelis feel that they have to stop those deadly rockets being launched, deliberately targeted at Israeli citizens. The Israelis know that they have to go to civilian areas, and they are consciously and as a matter of policy informing the civilians in those areas about what is about to happen and asking them to leave, because they do not wish to have civilian casualties. It is clear from that statement—there are many others—that the Hamas leadership is gloating over the situation and the death of its own citizens. That is absolutely deplorable and should not be countenanced.

[Robert Halfon]

I thank the hon. Lady for her thoughtful speech. Are we not in a crazy situation where Israel is being criticised for defending itself too well, because the Iron Dome is stopping many of the missiles and preventing many thousands of Israeli citizens from being killed?

[Mrs Ellman]

The hon. Gentleman makes a good point. Hamas has been threatening this type of action for a long time. It has clearly stated that it does not accept the existence of the Israeli state and that it will attack it. It has been building up its weaponry; Hamas now holds Iranian weapons. Indeed, recently, in March, Israel intercepted an Iranian ship with a cargo of weapons, including advanced weapons, heading for Gaza and for Hamas. Hamas has been organising itself to attack, so, naturally, a responsible Israeli Government have been preparing for that through defensive means. The Iron Dome was constructed so that the weapons—the shells, the rockets—coming over from Gaza, targeted on Israeli civilians, could be stopped without any Palestinian civilian loss of life. That is what the Israeli Government have deliberately done.

Anti-Semitism

Debate between Robert Halfon and Louise Ellman

Thursday 20th January 2011 Westminster Hall

[Robert Halfon (Harlow) (Con)]

I congratulate the hon. Member for Bassetlaw (John Mann) on securing the debate. Although I would not want to go into a dark alley with him to discuss party funding, I would be on the barricades with him on this issue. Often, when I look at people, I wonder who would be first to lead the resistance if there ever was, God forbid, a dictatorship, and I am sure that the hon. Gentleman would be right there. The work he has done over a number of years, which I watched before I was elected to the House, will be remembered by the Jewish community.

I also congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Finchley and Golders Green (Mike Freer). I know his constituency well because I grew up there. His community is very lucky that he is its representative and specialises in these issues.

As I have always seen it, there are three kinds of anti-Semitism. First, there is the low-level, under-the-carpet discrimination. It is the kind of anti-Semitism that happens at a dinner party. A person walks outside the room, and someone says, “Let’s give him a ham sandwich.” Everyone titters, but when he goes back into the room he does not know that anything has happened. That dinner-party anti-Semitism also manifests itself in harsh criticism of Israel, which is out of all proportion to the criticism of any other country. Given that it is out of proportion, I would argue that it is sometimes used as a fig leaf by people who just do not like Jews.

Secondly, there is skinhead anti-Semitism: thugs smashing up graveyards, violence and intimidation, and the criminal damage done to synagogues around the world. Dare I say it, that is the easiest kind of anti-Semitism to deal with because we at least know what we are dealing with.

Today, however, the most worrying, pernicious, dogmatic and dangerous form of anti-Semitism comes from extreme Islamism. Yes, it is true that extreme Islamists do not just attack Jews—the massacre of 21 Christians in Egypt on new year’s day is a tragic reminder of that. As we know, the free world faces a major assault on its values. Whether we are talking about Baha’is in Iran, Christians in Egypt or Jews in Israel and elsewhere in the world, the extreme Islamists believe that theirs is the only view that deserves to survive. The terrorist attacks of 9/11 and 7/7 were not just attacks on Britain and America, but were explicitly designed as an assault on western civilisation itself.

Islamism, by the way, should never be confused with Islam. Islam is a religion, practised by millions of citizens. Islamism, however, is a revolutionary political doctrine, supported by a small minority, whose aim is to overthrow democratic Government and replace it with religious autocracy.

I raised the threat posed by Iranian President Ahmadinejad’s anti-Semitism in early-day motion 1145. Today, however, I want to focus on the problem of extreme Islamism in the UK. I want to make four key points. First, numerous factions and splinter groups, such as Hizb ut-Tahrir, operate in the UK. They call for the eradication of Israel, but they have not been banned. Moderate Muslims, Jews, Christians and members of all parties have called for the Government to proscribe Hizb ut-Tahrir because its website, leaders and literature frequently promote racism and anti-Semitism, call suicide bombers “martyrs” and urge all Muslims to kill Jewish people. Hizb ut-Tahrir is an extremely destructive group, which should no longer be appeased.

Secondly, there is extremism in universities. Late last year MI5 identified as many as 39 university campuses as vulnerable to violent extremism. The London School of Economics, as has been mentioned, has increasingly serious problems not just with students but with its professional staff. The involvement, for example, of Dr John Chalcraft and Professor Martha Mundy with its middle east centre is worrying. Those two senior LSE academics are extreme advocates of the movement to boycott Israel on the international stage. As the organisation Student Rights has shown, they have a track record of intense hostility to Israel and the Jewish people. As with many so-called study centres for the middle east, much of the funding flows from mysterious trusts and foundations in Islamic dictatorships, whose accounts are not transparent. A further example is the LSE’s Palestine society, which is soon to host a visit by Ahron Cohen, a leading anti-Zionist, whose conference expenses are usually paid for by the Iranian Foreign Ministry, and who stated in The Sunday Times that the Jews who died in the holocaust deserved it. Those people do not help the debate. They do not promote peace, and the LSE has a duty to explain why it allows those things to continue.

Thirdly, there is radicalisation in some mosques. I recently had the privilege of going to Kurdistan with the all-party group on the Kurdistan region in Iraq. The Prime Minister of Kurdistan told me that he had been to England and visited a mosque in the north; he said that if he had seen that kind of mosque in Kurdistan he would have shut it down overnight, because of its aggressive and intolerant teachings. Kurdistan is very progressive, and supportive of the Jewish community. We all know the reports that Richard Reid and Jermaine Lindsay who triggered the King’s Cross explosion on 7/7 spent considerable time together at Brixton mosque in south London.

Finally, and most alarmingly, there is a creeping culture of appeasement in Whitehall. Whether that is a push to create artificial Muslim organisations, such as the Muslim Council of Britain, or civil servants going out of their way to appease radical Islamists, it is a major worry.

[Mrs Ellman]

Does the hon. Gentleman share my concern that the anti-Semitism that he describes is rarely opposed by those who declare themselves anti-racist?

[Robert Halfon]

As always, the hon. Lady puts her finger on the button. She has a strong track record in dealing with those issues, and I agree with her completely.

Hon. Members may recall that last autumn the director general of the office for security and counter-terrorism, Mr Charles Farr, was reported as pledging his support for the extremist Mr Zakir Naik to enter the country. That was in complete opposition to the views of the Home Secretary, who barred Mr Naik from entering the UK. We also hear in the news today that Ken Livingstone is now an employee of the Iranian Government’s English propaganda channel, Press TV.

What are the effects of extremist culture in the UK? One consequence, which I raised with the Prime Minister, is that Britain has become an exporter of terrorism. From Afghanistan to Sweden to Israel, extreme Islamists from the UK have been travelling abroad with the intention of causing mayhem and murder. Closer to home, we all remember the attack on the right hon. Member for East Ham (Stephen Timms). In the Jewish community there is a constant climate of fear. There are growing reports, as has been mentioned, of Jewish students being spat at and beaten up, and having their rooms vandalised, and the incidence of recorded anti-Semitic events on university campuses has spiked in recent years. The CST recorded nearly 1,000 major anti-Semitic incidents in 2009—the highest annual total since it began records in 1984. Guards are now posted outside many synagogues and Jewish schools. Hate literature and terrorist propaganda are now sold openly in many book stalls or religious outlets.