Commonwealth Parliamentary Association and International Committee of the Red Cross (Status) Bill [Lords]

Monica Harding Excerpts

Committee stage & Report stage
Wednesday 13th November 2024 Public Bill Committees

[Monica Harding (Esher and Walton) (LD)]

It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mr Vickers. I thank the Minister for his kind reassurances to those of us serving on a Bill Committee for the first time.

The Liberal Democrats are pleased to support the passage of this Bill, which recognises the Commonwealth Parliamentary Association and the International Committee of the Red Cross as international organisations. We believe that strengthening such international bodies will, in turn, strengthen international co-operation, which is sorely needed now more than ever in such an increasingly fragile geopolitical environment. It is also testament to the commitment that I am sure we all share across the House to the practice of international humanitarian law and good government.

The ICRC plays a crucial role in protecting civilian lives in the middle of conflict and war zones. The Bill will strengthen its ability to do that essential work without fear, using its unique mandate in maintaining neutrality. The privileges and immunities in the Bill will assure parties to conflict of the confidentiality of the ICRC’s information and its independence.

[The Chair]

Order. I draw the hon. Member’s attention to the fact that we are not on the part of the Bill dealing with the ICRC.

[Monica Harding]

Shall I turn to the CPA?

[The Chair]

Yes, stick to that.

[Monica Harding]

The Bill provides for international organisation status to be conferred on the CPA. It has promoted and strengthened parliamentary democracy since its establishment in 1911, and it facilitates mutual dialogue and learning. The diversity of experience across the 53 Commonwealth countries provides numerous opportunities for us to learn from one another in our shared aspiration of good parliamentary governance. Good governance is ever-moving and our aim should be that it is ever-improving. We support enhancing the status of the CPA by granting it the required protections and immunities, with new status as an international inter-parliamentary organisation.

The Liberal Democrats are pleased to welcome the Bill, which we hope will simplify the challenges that the CPA faces in its work across the world, and keep both institutions secure in the UK. We are proud of their work, and the Bill is testament to our shared commitment to them.

[Kevin Bonavia (Stevenage) (Lab)]

It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mr Vickers. I wish to declare a personal interest: I am a director and trustee of the Commonwealth Parliamentary Association UK branch. It is a non-pecuniary interest.

--- Later in debate ---

[Priti Patel]

I am very grateful to the Minister for the way in which he outlined the detail of clause 2. First, we recognise the benefits of conferring the legal capabilities of a body corporate on the ICRC, which includes contracts and the acquiring and disposing of property and legal proceedings. That is vital. Regarding legal disclosure requirements, it is right that sensitive information that the ICRC shares with the Government is protected. The Minister has succinctly outlined the reasons for that, and I completely endorse and support them.

We do not want the ICRC to be restricted in the level of information that it shares. We are contributors to the international aid budget and great supporters of the ICRC. Whether it is assessments or understanding the resources that are needed, all of this helps with the analytics, which helps the UK Government to step up in times of crisis and provide the resources that are needed. We should not do anything that would weaken our ability to work in a constructive way, particularly at times of crisis.

It would be very helpful if the Minister shared his thoughts on the use of these provisions in driving forward our relationship with the ICRC., because it is about results. The Minister will know from my previous incarnations my focus on delivery of results, which is even more important in times of humanitarian crisis. It would be helpful if he said where he has made assessments of areas in which we could do more together to drive outcomes. It might not be appropriate now to give the illustrations but, in due course, we should work together on this, because it should go beyond money.

The Minister made an important point about ensuring that the legal capabilities and proceedings work in the right way for the ICRC, but do not cross over into criminal proceedings. The Minister will recognise my point on this. I am afraid that there have been appalling situations within the development sector, where we have seen, fortunately, whistleblowers disclose harrowing information—sexual abuse, violence, people abusing their positions—but not enough done within the development community to deal with it. I am heartened by the Minister’s assurances and, in due course, I believe that the British Government can step up in this area and become the leaders that we should be, to show that we have no truck with the wrong kinds of behaviours. Not only that, we can work with organisations such as the ICRC to use criminal proceedings in the right way to show that we will not tolerate wrongdoing.

My final comment is on a Treasury matter. We recently had the Budget, and the ICRC and other organisations, including the CPA, will be subject to replenishments at some stage. This is not a subject for detailed discussion now, but would the Minister indicate, in light of this Bill, the provisions and the support we are giving to the ICRC, where he sees the future funding pathway giving the ICRC the resources it needs to carry on being the strong, successful force for good in the world that we all want it to be.

[Monica Harding]

The Liberal Democrats support the immunities and privileges given to the ICRC under the Bill, which support its unique mandate of neutrality. Its work is needed more than ever on the frontline of conflict—there are more than 120 ongoing armed conflicts in the world—not least in its understanding and witness to the exercise of humanitarian law, which is sometimes applied permissively. I pay tribute to its work, and the Liberal Democrats support the clause.

[Stephen Doughty]

I thank the shadow Foreign Secretary and the Liberal Democrat spokesperson for their support for the clause and the important protections it provides for the ICRC. I agree with their comments about the important work that the ICRC does. The Government are absolutely committed to supporting its work. It is indispensable in many of the harrowing situations we are engaged in. The shadow Foreign Secretary and I have engaged with the ICRC on a number of occasions and seen its work at first hand.

The shadow Foreign Secretary is right about the importance of continuing to support the ICRC’s work financially. I will not go into details of individual settlements in this debate for obvious reasons, but I am very happy to ask my right hon. Friend the Minister for Development to write to her to set out the details of our financial relationship with the ICRC going forward. It is an important organisation to support, because we all care about humanitarianism and treating prisoners of war, hostages and others properly. It does important, unique work that has been established for a very long time in relation to the Geneva conventions.

The shadow Foreign Secretary rightly raised the issue of balance between good governance and not allowing wrongdoing in the humanitarian sector to remain covered up. That is exactly why we have struck a balance in the Bill between necessary confidentiality for the ICRC, and that not applying to those criminal proceedings. Obviously, we would continue to work with the ICRC, as we would with any other international humanitarian organisation, to ensure that it upholds the highest standards of internal governance and procedures. We are very supportive of whistleblowing and other schemes that allow those who suspect any wrongdoing, whether in these organisations or any other, to raise a concern and have it dealt with appropriately, not only concerning our own relations with that organisation, but also within the international system as a whole.

I thought it might be worth briefly setting out why it is important that we get these confidentiality provisions right because, to date, the Foreign, Commonwealth and Development Office has been successful in applying to UK courts for public interest immunity—for example, to prevent disclosure of ICRC communications or to consider ICRC evidence in closed material procedures. However, the reality, and the right hon. Member for Witham understand this, is that those decisions are at the discretion of the court in each individual case and so cannot fully address the ICRC’s concerns. The release of material into closed material procedures still breaches the ICRC’s standard working methods of confidentiality, so even though we would expect confidentiality in those proceedings, that is not guaranteed. That is why it is important to put this important provision on the statute book and to give the ICRC and the CPA that assurance.

The Bill and, indeed, its predecessors have been developed in close co-operation with the ICRC and the CPA, so it very much reflects their needs and, crucially, the need for them to continue to work with us in the most productive and outcome-based way. The Bill and clause therefore strike the right balance between the confidentiality they need to work with us, but without a blanket exemption that allows anything to go because, clearly, when it comes to criminal or other matters, those need to be dealt with in the appropriate way.