Health and Social Care Bill

Lord Ramsbotham Excerpts

Thursday 8th March 2012 Lords Chamber

Moved by

[Lord Ramsbotham]

238A: Clause 191, page 191, line 32, leave out “may consult any” and insert “must consult relevant health professionals and any other”

[Lord Ramsbotham]

My Lords, I shall be brief. First, I pay tribute to the noble Earl, Lord Howe, and thank him very much for his letter on this subject. I declare an interest as chairman of the All-Party Group on Speech and Language Difficulties. We have been campaigning in many Bills—education, welfare and justice—to make certain that every child is properly assessed not just for learning disabilities but for learning difficulties and particularly to enable every child to engage with the education system. The Minister has assured me that health visitors are being trained by speech and language therapists to enable that to be done. I hope very much that this will soon be the norm throughout the United Kingdom. Therefore, Amendments 238A, 238B, 238C, 238D and 238E add a little more to the debate that we had at earlier stages of the Bill.

In particular, I am anxious to make certain, if we possibly can, that the variability in commissioning between local areas is reviewed. In her recent report, the communications commissioner, Jean Gross, stated that there was considerable variety and that she expected to find such commissioning in only 70 per cent of local areas. This is unfortunate. I do not think it is right that there should be a postcode lottery in assessing our children’s ability to engage with education.

I introduce the words “allied health professional” in Amendment 238B because the allied health professionals have responsibility for liaising between the primary and secondary sectors and therefore cover a wide number of disciplines. I include the words “education or children’s services” in Amendments 238C, 238D and 238E in order to make certain that those services, along with the NHS and local government, are properly represented in ensuring that this opportunity is available to every child throughout the United Kingdom.

I appreciate that it may not seem appropriate to make these amendments to the Bill. However, I hope that the Minister will be able to assure me that these points will be made in instructions that go out about the health and well-being boards, the joint strategic boards and so on, even if they are not included in the Bill. I beg to move.

[Baroness Whitaker]

My Lords, in supporting the noble Lord, Lord Ramsbotham, I have very little to add, which I imagine will be welcome to noble Lords at this hour. He has really said it all extremely comprehensively but I would just add that, if the Bill cannot provide the framework that these amendments would ensure, particularly in respect of integration of the education services, children in particular will suffer. I briefly remind noble Lords that speech and language deficits are among the most common disabilities in childhood. They affect significant numbers, who will lose out on education, employment and relationships as a result. I hope that the noble Earl will be able to provide the reassurances that we seek.

--- Later in debate ---

[Earl Howe]

That is a very gracious invitation on the part of the noble Lord. I will take him up on that if I may by responding to him in writing. That would be best.

[Lord Ramsbotham]

I thank the noble Earl for his habitually courteous and balanced reply and I am reassured on some of the points that I raised. I am grateful to the noble Baroness, Lady Whitaker, and my noble friend Lady Finlay in particular for supporting the amendments and to the noble Lord, Lord Beecham, for mentioning them. Like the noble Baroness, Lady Whitaker, I have this nagging fear that education, education, education is something that will need to engage the health and well-being boards. The link between education and health, particularly in the assessment, which was the subject of the amendments, is absolutely crucial. During the passage of the then Education Bill, noble Lords described what they wanted but of course they could not have it because they were health matters funded by health. Therefore, it is terribly important that joint working happens.

I was very glad that the noble Earl mentioned “effective joint working”, because I am sure that that is what we all seek. That was what was behind each and every one of the amendments. On the basis of that and knowing the noble Earl and that if he says something it is usually likely to happen, I beg leave to withdraw the amendment.

Amendment 238A withdrawn.