Illegal Migration Bill

Debate between Lord Marlesford and Baroness Williams of Trafford

Thursday 29th June 2023 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

I thank the noble Lord for his kind words, which I reciprocate. I hear him, and my noble friend the Minister, Lord Murray of Blidworth, certainly heard the House last night. In the hours since the debate, he has been back to the Home Office to seek what the House requested. I can confirm that the child rights impact assessment will be forthcoming early next week and well before Report concludes, as the noble Lord requested.

[Lord Marlesford (Con)]

My Lords, where does this morning’s decision of the Appeal Court that people cannot lawfully be transferred to Rwanda leave this legislation?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

I know that my noble friend the Minister will discuss that later. It is not quite a matter for debate now.

Manufacturing Post Brexit

Debate between Lord Marlesford and Baroness Williams of Trafford

Thursday 26th January 2023 Lords Chamber

[Lord Bassam of Brighton (Lab)]

My Lords—

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

My Lords, quick questions and quick answers will mean that both noble Lords will be able to get in.

[Lord Marlesford (Con)]

My Lords, Britain has over the decades sadly lost its pre-eminent position in nuclear power. Has my noble friend noticed that Rolls-Royce has today announced a new nuclear academy of excellence in Derby? Will he recognise that this is a real opportunity to move forward with the experience Rolls-Royce has in small modular reactors?

Nationality and Borders Bill

Debate between Lord Marlesford and Baroness Williams of Trafford

Lords Hansard - Part 1 & Committee stage
Thursday 3rd February 2022 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

The noble Lord is absolutely right, and this goes right back to the beginning of this discussion. We need to process claims quickly, grant asylum if the claims are valid, and ask people to leave if they are not. He is absolutely right and we agree with each other on this point: people’s claims need to be done expeditiously. Without making excuses, I say that the pandemic really held back the smooth running of our asylum system, as I am sure it did in other countries. I hope the noble Lord is satisfied. For the reasons I have outlined—so that we can both support asylum seekers appropriately and encourage that throughput that he was just talking about, by freeing up spaces in the asylum spaces— I hope noble Lords do not press their amendments.

[Lord Marlesford (Con)]

Does my noble friend agree that there must be a limit to the resources available to deal with the increasing potential scale of this problem?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

There is a limit to both the resources and the geography of this country. That is why the system needs to run in a way that accommodates the most vulnerable people. People whose claims are not upheld need to leave.

Immigration Rules: Supported Accommodation

Debate between Lord Marlesford and Baroness Williams of Trafford

Thursday 17th December 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

The noble Baroness described the changes as “major and fundamental”. They are neither major nor fundamental; they are technical changes. I made a commitment to the noble Lord, Lord Dubs, during the passage of the immigration Bill, that published guidance would necessarily be updated to ensure that it was clear and transparent by 31 December. The guidance will be published by the end of the year but, given the timescales involved, it has not been possible to consult on this ahead of publication.

[Lord Marlesford (Con) [V]]

Does the Minister recognise the challenging fact that the flow of economic migrants will continue until the standard of living of the country they are trying to reach is no longer sufficiently above that of the country they have left to make the risks and costs of the journey worthwhile? Does she further agree that the prospects of such a potential dilution of quality of life in the UK would not be tolerated by the electorate, whatever Government was in office?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

My noble friend’s question is a global one: why would people make these dangerous journeys, facilitated by criminals and risking their own lives, if they were not fleeing such substandard, and in many cases frightening, conditions back home? It is a terribly sad state that so many migrants are willing to make that journey. It is only in helping people, both upstream and in the reception that we give to genuine asylum seekers, that we can hope to address in some way the terrible things that people are facing.

Covert Human Intelligence Sources (Criminal Conduct) Bill

Debate between Lord Marlesford and Baroness Williams of Trafford

Committee stage & Committee: 2nd sitting (Hansard) & Committee: 2nd sitting (Hansard): House of Lords
Tuesday 1st December 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

Try as I might, that was very difficult to hear. I think that the noble Baroness—I know that she will intervene on me again—made the following three points. In fact, I meant to pull out from the speech of the noble Lord, Lord Paddick, her first point: that authorising is done not by the handler but by a senior authorising officer. The second point was that training for CHIS handlers is extensive. She may have said “expensive” but I think she said “extensive,” because it would have to be extensive for this serious an operation.

I think the noble Baroness’s third point was that details of numbers have to be top secret to maintain and protect the welfare of the CHIS. I referred to the IPC report because I think that the noble Lord, either last year or the year before, gave numbers on juvenile CHIS, which gave a flavour of the numbers that we were talking about.

[Lord Marlesford (Con) [V]]

My Lords, I want to make a point on Amendment 77 on journalistic sources, in the name of the noble Baroness, Lady Whitaker. As I mentioned to my noble friend last week, Parliament already has an effective equivalent to judicial review. I referred to the Economist case of 1975, when the House of Commons Committee of Privileges imposed a personal penalty on the editor and a journalist—who happened to be me—of the Economist due to the premature publication of the draft report of the Select Committee on a Wealth Tax and our refusal to reveal our sources. The House of Commons debated this on the Floor of the Chamber for more than two hours and voted not to impose the penalty.

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

I think the only response to that is to thank my noble friend for taking the time to explain it to noble Lords.

Covid-19: Support and Accommodation for Asylum Seekers

Debate between Lord Marlesford and Baroness Williams of Trafford

Tuesday 30th June 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

My Lords, the health service generally, whether in Scotland or here, has had to find new ways of working through the pandemic, so assessments probably happen remotely, as they do for the general population. He is right to ask whether they take into account the specific needs of people who perhaps have fled war-torn countries to seek asylum and refuge here. This pandemic has seen the very best of our NHS. I am fully confident that when assessments happen, NHS doctors and nurses are well trained to take into account the vulnerabilities and traumas that these people may have faced.

[Lord Marlesford (Con) [V]]

My Lords, in her reply last week to my Written Question on the asylum process, the Minister said:

“Individual applications are referred to Ministers where they are identified as potentially sensitive”.


Unfortunately, she was unable to give me any information on how often this happens. Does she agree that in determining an asylum application, the authorities must always consider potential risks to national security, which may require balancing the risk to the asylum seeker with that to the UK, and may mean that asylum seekers must be detained in custody? Of the 10 serious terrorist attacks since March 2017, some have been associated with an asylum seeker. Is she prepared to review the cases where asylum and permanent UK residence have been granted, and where the seeker has been convicted of terrorist offences in other jurisdictions?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

My noble friend makes some valid points. He is absolutely right that we need to balance the claim of the asylum seeker with any danger that they might pose and also the genuine nature of the claim. My honourable friend Chris Philp, a Minister in the House of Commons, said yesterday there how important it was to weed out the genuine from the—shall we say?—non-genuine asylum seeker. I am sure that the services do analysis like that all the time, examining the type of behaviour experienced after someone is granted asylum, their vulnerability and the things that might cause it.

Black Lives Matter: Protests

Debate between Lord Marlesford and Baroness Williams of Trafford

Monday 15th June 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord Marlesford (Con) [V]]

My Lords, can the Minister see that for both sides of the argument on the removal of statues, every day that the statue of Winston Churchill remains boxed up is a day when the banner of anarchy is raised over Parliament Square? Does this direct action on statues not echo horribly the fascist days of Islamic State, when it attacked the city of Palmyra and publicly decapitated the archaeologist in charge? Has the Minister read the compelling speech by the young American black activist Candace Owens, on the appalling murder of George Floyd?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

I confess that I have not read it, but my noble friend is right to point out that we can all think of attempts through the ages to erase culture and history for various reasons. The boxed-up Churchill is such a sorry sight. I understand that it was boxed up for its protection against some of the protests at the weekend. The sooner the Churchill statue is freed and he is commemorated once again as one of the greatest people who ever lived, the better.

Operation Midland

Debate between Lord Marlesford and Baroness Williams of Trafford

Monday 3rd February 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

I said at the beginning that HMICFRS was undertaking an inspection to see whether lessons had been learned from Operation Midland. That report is due out at the end of March.

[Lord Marlesford (Con)]

My Lords, do the Government not realise that it is not acceptable to this House or to the country that Sir Edward Heath’s reputation should be trashed and no attempt made to have a judicial review, which would be independent and respected, into the circumstances of Operation Conifer, bearing in mind that the chief constable who was responsible for it was subsequently retired in disgrace from another force?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

Where I think I can agree with my noble friend—with the whole House, in fact—is that if false allegations are made against someone, it not only damages their reputation but undermines public confidence. In an instance of false accusation, it may be appropriate to support a prosecution for attempting to pervert the course of justice.

Facial Recognition Surveillance

Debate between Lord Marlesford and Baroness Williams of Trafford

Monday 27th January 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

My Lords, I wish the noble Lord’s Private Member’s Bill all the very best when it comes to your Lordships’ House—without pre-empting, obviously, its outcome.

As for inaccuracy, LFR has been shown to be 80% accurate. It has thrown up one false result in 4,500 and there was no evidence of racial bias against BME people. I should point out that a human operative always makes the final decision; this is not decision by machine.

[Lord Marlesford (Con)]

My Lords, the lamentable decline in security on our streets and elsewhere makes it essential that every modern technique to increase security is used. Will the Minister agree to a seminar or something so that those noble Lords who are particularly interested in this subject may be given a briefing in some depth?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

That is a very constructive suggestion. I am happy to arrange a briefing on this technology for any noble Lords who wish to have one.