Armed Forces Commissioner Bill

Lord Craig of Radley Excerpts

Committee stage
Wednesday 19th March 2025 Grand Committee

[Lord Lancaster of Kimbolton (Con)]

It just came to my mind now, and my memory may be wrong, but I thought that was the case. If it was, it would be interesting to know why that provision has been taken out as the Bill has evolved, because it is probably quite a good thing. On the one hand, I can see the advantages of having a former member of the Armed Forces but, on the other, I would not want them to be in the Armed Forces on Friday and doing this role on Monday, which is why that time gap would be useful.

[Lord Craig of Radley (CB)]

I will say very briefly that I support Amendment 3, but I have some reservations about Amendment 4, mainly because of its length and its attempt to dot a lot of “i”s and cross a lot of “t”s. At the back of my mind all the time when we are discussing this Bill is that the Armed Forces Act is more than 500 pages long, and this will add to that. It becomes a nonsense to have an Act of Parliament of such complexity and such an attempt to deal with every conceivable possibility affecting the Armed Forces. It arises, of course, because the three single-service Acts were pulled together in 2006. It has produced a monstrosity, so where we can avoid adding detail to the Armed Forces Act by this Bill, we should jolly well try to do so.

[Lord Wrottesley (Con)]

My Lords, I will speak briefly in support of the amendments of and comments made by the noble Lord, Lord Beamish, the noble Baroness, Lady Smith of Newnham, and others. In doing so, I declare an interest in having previously served as a member of His Majesty’s Armed Forces.

Much has been made by His Majesty’s Government and other noble Lords of the attributes of the German model. A key feature of this model is its direct connection with and therefore accountability to Parliament. However, the Minister has previously stated that he feels that there is increased independence with the commissioner sitting outside Parliament—accountable to but independent of Parliament. There is a tension within these phrases that may be irreconcilable. We would all be keen to hear the Minister’s views on how to reconcile these tensions, which may even be contradictions.

I also support the comments made on term limits. We have heard from the noble Lord, Lord Beamish, about a limit of five years plus two for a total of seven years. In the corporate world, term limits often extend to two terms of four years, for a total of eight years, or three terms of three years, for a total of nine years. One of their key attributes is to allow for continuity and the retention of corporate memory, which still allows for a refresh and therefore introduces new experience into the mix within what is deemed an appropriate timeframe. I would like to hear from the Minister on why he feels seven years is an appropriate timeframe, as opposed to eight, nine or, as in this case, 10 years.

Armed Forces Commissioner Bill

Lord Craig of Radley Excerpts

Committee stage
Monday 24th March 2025 Grand Committee

[Lord Colgrain (Con)]

My Lords, I am in favour of Amendment 21A in the name of my noble friend Lord Harlech, to which I have added my name.

At Second Reading, I asked a question of the Minister regarding when reserves would come under the remit of the Bill. My question was supported by my noble friend Lord Lancaster of Kimbolton; sadly, he is not here today because he is with NATO in Moldova. The Minister was extremely generous with his time and subsequently gave me sight of a briefing note, which goes through in considerable detail the points that I wanted him to address; I am most grateful for that. However, the last paragraph of his briefing note brings me to the point of this particular question. It is entitled:

“How will the reserves find out about the commissioner?”


It goes on:

“During implementation, we are committed to ensuring the voices of reservists in scope of the commissioner are heard and their unique experiences and challenges are fully considered. We will actively engage with relevant reservists to ensure their welfare needs are effectively addressed, and that they are aware of the commissioner”.


Can the Minister reflect on that and see whether he cannot provide a form of words that would give us all comfort that, in fact, reservists will be made aware from day one of how they can access the commissioner? Can he also put that in the context of our debate earlier this afternoon, with particular reference to whistleblowing; and imagine what it would be like for someone who finds themselves, almost on day one, in a position where they need to access the commissioner? How would they do that? I look forward to hearing the Minister’s response.

[Lord Craig of Radley (CB)]

My Lords, I, too, support these amendments. Much of what I would have liked to say has already been said, but the importance that is attached both to reserves and to the contribution they make to the regular forces will, as we go forward, grow more and more. It may well appear in the defence review as one of those key steps that are being taken. If it is, and even if it is not, I still believe that the recognition of the work of the Reserve Forces, right in the middle of the regular forces, needs to be recognised in this particular way. It would be invidious to leave the Reserve Forces outside, as it were, the responsibility of the commissioner.

[Baroness Smith of Newnham (LD)]

My Lords, I support these amendments from these Benches. I am delighted that the noble Lord, Lord Harlech, felt inspired to stand up and speak on the first day in Committee and that he has now brought forward these two amendments.

On reading the Bill, my assumption was that it included regulars and reservists, but the very fact that these questions are being asked means that it would be very helpful if the Minister could clarify the intention of His Majesty’s Government and, perhaps, think about some minor amendments to the wording of the Bill for clarity.

Some of the amendments we brought forward last week, for example about funding, might look rather different depending on whether we are looking at a commissioner whose remit is, in essence, to deal with regulars or one who deals with reservists, because the sheer numbers are different and some of the concerns might be different. If we are looking at funding the commissioner, and his or her sub-commissioners or deputy commissioners as outlined in the Bill, it would be very useful to be absolutely clear that we are covering reservists as well as regulars, which I assume is the Government’s intention but which is not entirely clear.

Finally, the noble Lord, Lord Harlech, mentioned cadets, which also came up in discussions last week. I assume they do not fall within the Bill’s remit because they are not subject to service law, but are there ways in which they, too, would be in scope?