Northern Ireland City Deals

Karen Bradley Excerpts

Wednesday 9th October 2024 Commons Chamber

[Hilary Benn]

As I am sure my hon. Friend understands, anyone holding my office, including me, will argue the corner of Northern Ireland. I will continue to do so.

[Dame Karen Bradley (Staffordshire Moorlands) (Con)]

As the Secretary of State who secured funding from the Treasury for the first two deals—the Belfast city deal and the Derry/Londonderry and Strabane deal—I am very pleased that they are going ahead, but I have concerns, because I remember the impact that that announcement had on business confidence across Northern Ireland. What discussions has the Secretary of State had with businesses involved in the private sector element of these deals, to make sure they know that there is a commitment to them?

[Hilary Benn]

The right hon. Member is very generous and kind to me, but I cannot claim credit for the Belfast city deal—it was unaffected by the announcement that the Treasury made—and the signing of the full financial deal for the Derry and Strabane city deal was scheduled anyway. After clarification, that deal is going ahead, but when I meet the chief executives shortly, I hope to learn more about the point she raised about the practical impact. It is important that we understand the impact; that will inform the representations that are made.

St Patrick’s Day: Irish Diaspora in the UK

Karen Bradley Excerpts

Thursday 14th March 2024 Westminster Hall

[Dame Karen Bradley (Staffordshire Moorlands) (Con)]

I think that this is probably the first time that I have served under your chairmanship, Dame Siobhain; it is an absolute honour to do so. I pay tribute to my co-sponsor, the hon. Member for Salford and Eccles (Rebecca Long Bailey), for her excellent opening speech and for setting out so eloquently the contribution of the Irish community in her community and in the wider United Kingdom. She is such an advocate for the Irish community in the UK.

I thank the Backbench Business Committee for allocating time for this debate on 14 March, the closest we could get to St Patrick’s day. When we applied to the Backbench Business Committee, we said that we were keen to have the debate as close to St Patrick’s day as possible. That has meant that we could not be in the Chamber, for obvious reasons—it is estimates day—but we have a full three-hour debate, and we have the chance to talk, as close to St Patrick’s day as possible, about our views and our love for the Irish diaspora and all things Irish in our communities.

I confess that I fail the family test, because I am a Mancunian Howarth. The Howarths do not seem to have a great deal of Irish heritage in us; we tend to just be from Manchester. I can pick out lots of bits of Manchester that I have heritage from, but I cannot pick out anywhere in Ireland. I can claim a marriage link, however, because the Bradleys, who I married into, were originally the Bradleys of County Tyrone. I am proud that my children have that Irish link, even though I do not, and that they can proudly say they have Irish heritage. Irish heritage matters: people value being able to identify with Ireland and the Irish community. My mother told me that when she was growing up in Manchester, the Irish community played an important role in Gorton, where she lived. Her father worked in construction, and he knew many Irish colleagues.

The hon. Member for Salford and Eccles mentioned the football clubs. I confess that I support the team that has had fewer Irish players in its history, City, but United has always had a significant number of Irish players and a very big Irish support contingent. Getting a plane from Dublin or Belfast to Manchester on the day of a United match is nigh-on impossible.

My links to Ireland were really cemented when I was appointed Secretary of State for Northern Ireland—SoSNI, as they say in the Northern Ireland Office. I will not pretend that it was not a shock. The late, great James Brokenshire had been doing the role, and he had done a really excellent job. I do not think it is possible to find anyone who would ever say that James Brokenshire ever did anything that was not utterly brilliant, and he was brilliant at that job, but he had just been diagnosed with lung cancer, and for his health and his family’s sake he needed to step away from the role.

At that point, I was Secretary of State for Digital, Culture, Media and Sport. I walked into the Department in the morning planning what we were going to do for the rest of the year. It was the first day back—it was actually James’s 50th birthday, so I had been wishing him a happy birthday, and then the news came through that he was resigning and we did not know why. It suddenly dawned on me that someone was going to have to go to Northern Ireland. It never occurred to me that I would be given that role, but the then Prime Minister, my right hon. Friend the Member for Maidenhead (Mrs May), invited me into the Cabinet room and—because I had been a Whip and, more importantly, had served with her in the Home Office and understood the sensitivities around the security issues—asked me if I would take on the role. It was a shock to the system, but I have to say that it was the greatest honour.

Serving in the Northern Ireland Office, as the Minister knows, is truly one of the greatest honours that one can have in this place, because of the warmth of welcome and the depth of hope and expectation that are put on the politician. There are very few roles that have that as much as Secretary of State or Minister of State for Northern Ireland. Northern Ireland is a place where politics genuinely changed lives. There are very few places where politics and politicians managed to do something as incredible as the Belfast/Good Friday agreement 26 years ago, which got the weapons laid down and ended the violence.

We all agree that there are still many problems, and some people who have never accepted the peaceful solution to the constitutional status of Northern Ireland, but the vast majority of people in Northern Ireland, Ireland and the United Kingdom accepted that that political settlement and the compromises involved in it were worth making because of the change that could happen. The two architects—the late Lord Trimble and John Hume—should be admired for their ability to put aside sectarian differences, come together and show true leadership to solve what had seemed an intractable problem. I wish there were more leaders like them around the world who could do the same thing and make that difference.

The other person I want to mention from my time in the Northern Ireland Office is Tony Lloyd, my shadow. He was a wonderful person to have shadowing me. We would occasionally have ding-dongs across the Dispatch Box; that is what politics is about, but I can assure everybody that when we got behind closed doors we got on like a house on fire. We supported different football teams—again, that Manchester difference—but we always had great conversations. If we were in Belfast at the same time and we could make it work, we would make a point of getting together with the hon. Member for Bristol South (Karin Smyth)—I will call her my hon. Friend —who was part of his team too.

We had great conversations. We wanted the same thing: we wanted the restoration of devolved government, and we wanted to work together to achieve it. We had different ways in, and different people we could influence, but we were all trying to get to the same thing. I am so relieved that we currently have devolved government in Northern Ireland, because it is vital for the people of Northern Ireland that they are properly represented by the people they elect to do so.

My constituency does not have a large Irish diaspora, but it has two great Irish employers. Advanced Proteins owns a plant that does animal rendering—it is not a terribly attractive thing to do, but it does it very well. The Irish dairy company Ornua, which brings Irish cheese and butter across the Irish sea to Leek in Staffordshire, also has a plant; Kerrygold is packaged in Leek, and all the cheese from Ireland is processed, grated, put into blocks and sold to consumers across Great Britain. I have a great need for the Irish to be successful, because they employ so many of my constituents. It is incredibly important that Ornua and Advanced Proteins know that we welcome them in the United Kingdom and we want them to continue to invest.

I have the great honour of being co-chair of the British-Irish Parliamentary Assembly, following on from my hon. Friend the Member for Romford (Andrew Rosindell), who did a fantastic job for so many years—he has been missed at our meetings. For those who do not know, the British-Irish Parliamentary Assembly began with the Inter-Parliamentary Union. Back in the early 1990s, there was a recognition that we had inter-parliamentary groups and there were conversations at Government level, but conversations at parliamentarian level are incredibly important in allowing people to recognise that we all face the same problems and all want the same solutions.

Before what was the British-Irish parliamentary group, there may have been a lack of trust and understanding and a lack of ability to empathise with parliamentarians on the other side of the Irish sea. The two Inter-Parliamentary Union groups—the British one, which I am honoured to chair in our Parliament, and the one from the Oireachtas—were therefore asked if they could form a grouping of parliamentarians to find a way to open up that dialogue. That was six years before the Belfast/Good Friday agreement; it was a very important part of the dialogue that created an atmosphere in which the agreement could happen.

I pay tribute to the late Lord Temple-Morris, who was one of the people who led the initiative from Westminster, and to Dick Spring from the Oireachtas. We were honoured that at a recent assembly Dick was able to address our dinner: it was lovely to hear from somebody who had not only been an architect of the agreement, but been there beforehand laying the groundwork for it.

I also pay tribute to the wonderful Amanda Healy, who has been the administrator of BIPA for 30 years. Without Amanda, the whole thing would collapse. She is utterly amazing. It would be wrong of me to say anything other than that she is absolutely fantastic—thank you, Amanda. I also thank the brilliant clerk, Martyn Atkins, who makes sure that I know what I am saying as co-chair, keeps me on track and ensures that I entirely deliver the message that needs to be delivered.

[Andrew Rosindell (Romford) (Con)]

I thank my right hon. Friend for her kind remarks. I was proud to be the co-chair of the British-Irish Parliamentary Assembly from 2016 to 2022. I commend her work, and the work of BIPA over so many years in promoting relations between not just Britain and Ireland, but the devolved legislatures of Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland, and the Crown dependencies of the Isle of Man, Jersey and Guernsey. Sunday is an important day for me because it is my birthday on St Patrick’s Day. My great- grandparents were Dempseys and O’Learys.

If my right. hon Friend will indulge me for a moment, I would like to pay tribute to the schools and churches in my constituency—St Mary’s Roman Catholic Church and St Mary’s Roman Catholic Primary School in Hornchurch, St Peter’s Catholic School and St Edward’s Roman Catholic Church in Romford, St Patrick’s Catholic Primary School in Collier Row and Corpus Christi. I also pay tribute to the Iona club, which is somewhere people of Irish ancestry can go to socialise and meet people in the local community. I am proud of my Irish links and the Irish connections within Romford. I look forward to continuing to work with my right hon. Friend and all Members of the House to ensure that we promote strong British-Irish relations going forward.

[Dame Karen Bradley]

My hon. Friend is absolutely right to pay tribute to all the schools and churches that help to promote the Irish identity in his constituency. I also thank him for his work on BIPA, which he was so devoted and dedicated to for so many years.

When the British-Irish Inter-Parliamentary Body was in place, it was just the Oireachtas and Westminster, and then the ’98 agreement happened. The agreement itself envisaged a body to shadow the new British-Irish Council, perhaps along the lines of the British-Irish Inter-Parliamentary Body. The body took the hint, and by 2005 it had become the British-Irish Parliamentary Assembly and, as my hon. Friend said, was not just the Oireachtas and Westminster. It was expanded to include all the legislatures in the British Isles—all the devolved Parliaments and the Parliaments in Jersey, Guernsey and the Isle of Man—exactly mirroring the British-Irish Council. I must say to the Minister that we would be delighted if BIPA could have more of a role in scrutinising the British-Irish Council, because we feel that we would be the perfect body, able to discuss what the BIC is debating and bring a parliamentary aspect to that work.

One thing that BIPA has been able to do, unlike any other body, is give a voice to the Members of the Legislative Assembly who have been members during the times we have not had a Government in Stormont. Because of the way it is constituted and the history, members of the British-Irish Parliamentary Assembly remain members even if their Parliament is not sitting. That has meant that MLAs have had a voice on BIPA throughout all the periods when the Stormont Assembly has been suspended. I pay tribute to Steve Aiken, who serves on the steering committee. He is now the Deputy Speaker in Stormont, but he has been able to attend every one of our assemblies and steering committees, despite the fact that Stormont was not sitting. He and other MLAs have been able to bring the voice of Northern Ireland to the debate, which is incredibly important.

I want to quickly touch on a plenary that we held in March 2023 to mark the 25th anniversary of the 1998 agreement. It was just before St Patrick’s day because, as everybody knows, if any event is going to happen around St Patrick’s day, we can forget anybody from Ireland being there because they will all be enjoying the celebrations in Washington, Dublin, London, Chicago, Boston or all the other places that put on the most magnificent St Patrick’s day events. We had a wonderful meeting, and with the kind permission of the then Speaker, Alex Maskey, we were able to use the Stormont Assembly Chamber. It was very special because it was using a building that had not been used for many months at that point.

We were grateful to be addressed by Bertie Ahern, who was the Taoiseach at the time of the Belfast/Good Friday agreement, Sir John Holmes, who had been principal private secretary to John Major and Tony Blair, and Kate Fearon, Bronagh Hinds, Dr Avila Kilmurray and Jane Morrice, who were all members of the Women’s Coalition. That was an incredible session, because the voice of the women who had been instrumental in bringing about the agreement was so powerful and resonated with everyone who was there. Finally, Jonny Byrne from Ulster University reflected on the achievements of policing under the agreement, and the work still left to do.

In BIPA we discuss policy issues. We discuss those areas that are relevant to all of us, such as housing, tourism, sovereign matters, defence and energy provision. Reports are issued by our committees on a regular basis, which are in-depth and technical policy discussions. They are well worth reading because they touch on many aspects of our shared policy concerns, and make suggestions and recommendations for how things can be different.

I commend the work of the British-Irish Parliamentary Assembly. It is a fantastic body. I have been honoured to co-chair it for the last 18 months or so. I am looking forward to our next plenary in Wicklow, which is coming up in a few weeks’ time, just after Easter. I finish by wishing everybody a happy St Patrick’s day. It is always a great opportunity to enjoy oneself; the Irish give us a real chance to have such fun with our friends.

--- Later in debate ---

[Martin Docherty-Hughes (West Dunbartonshire) (SNP)]

Tapadh leat, a Cathaoirleach. I am delighted to participate in this debate, which was secured by the hon. Member for Salford and Eccles (Rebecca Long Bailey), and I thank them for doing so. We were talking earlier about how we are seemingly in the pull-out of The Irish Post today. That will not do me any harm, I am sure the hon. Member for Bolton North East (Mark Logan) will think.

I am reminded of a story we heard the last time we had this debate, in the Chamber, which was secured by our friend, the late Member for Rochdale, whom we miss from this debate today. I was telling the hon. Member for Salford and Eccles and the Minister that we had the debate and that by the time I got home to tell my dad in Clydebank that we were in the Donegal News, because that debate made headlines in Donegal, my dad was sitting there with his wee dog Sandy—no longer of this world, may she rest in peace—and he folded out his newspaper and went, “Yeah, I know.” He was reading the Donegal News. Needless to say, that had arrived the day previous by the bus from Donegal town to Clydebank, so I was beat by that. I am delighted to participate in today’s debate.

I am mindful of when the Uachtarán na hÉireann addressed the Parliament of Scotland back in in 2016. The relationship between Ireland and Scotland is familial; it is ancient. He stated:

“The bonds of kinship and history between our peoples are woven thick, finding expression today in a deep affection and empathy between Irish and Scots wherever our paths cross. Ours is a friendship which I deeply value as I know you do. You might even say that, given our shared and complex history, it has often been difficult to say where ends and where begins, or the other way around.”

I totally agree.

Given that my name—Máirtín Seán Ó Dochartaigh-Aodha—is probably one of the longest in Parliament, it would be remiss of me not to stand up here and speak on behalf not only of my party but of my constituents who are part of the Irish diaspora. At the all-party parliamentary group annual general meeting the other day—I think the hon. Member for Bolton North East mentioned this—we were all arguing about our connections to St Patrick. If I can use the Westminster process to trump everybody, my early-day motion in 2018 was clear that St Patrick came from the village of Old Kilpatrick in West Dunbartonshire, which was an ancient Roman fort at the western fringes of the Antonine Wall. It had clear consensus from every party in the Chamber, even the hon. Member for Strangford (Jim Shannon), who sadly is not with us today.

As I say to the hon. Member often, I am a proud Ulsterman. My family’s deep roots are in County Donegal. Donegal, along with Cavan in the Republic, is part of the ancient province of Ulster. I have no shame in that. It is important for those of us of not only the traditional Ulster notion but the Scots Irish and the Ulster Scots to be very proud of that mixed, complex and, yes, sometimes difficult history. It can still be difficult to have a St Patrick’s day in parts of the United Kingdom. Being vocal about your Irish heritage is sometimes looked down on, and we have to challenge that, for a range of reasons, so that we can see beyond what has happened in the past. I think the hon. Member for Belfast South (Claire Hanna) talked about how these islands were looked at as somewhere more progressive, with social democracy. As I am openly a member of the LGBT community, I know what that is all about.

It was therefore great for many of us to see the Irish Republic specifically push forward with constitutional debates and referenda on the right to equal marriage—not same-sex but equal marriage. To see that was extraordinary. People like myself, from a very openly Irish Catholic background, thought that would never happen.

I will say a wee bit more about my historical links, which I mentioned previously, but I want to concentrate a wee bit on Donegal and Ulster specifically.

[Dame Karen Bradley]

The hon. Gentleman is making such important points about how progressive these islands have been. Of course, one of our shared histories is the fighting in world war one, particularly at the battle of the Somme. Does the hon. Member agree that the moment in 2016 when the Irish ambassador, joining other ambassadors and high commissioners, laid a wreath at the Cenotaph for the first time was a significant step forward in relations between the two countries?

--- Later in debate ---

[Fleur Anderson (Putney) (Lab)]

How pleasurable it is to serve under your chairmanship, Dame Siobhain, and how apposite it is that you are the Chair for this wonderful celebration of the Irish diaspora in the UK. Happy St Patrick’s day to everyone contributing and listening to the debate.

St Patrick was himself a traveller between these isles, like the people we are celebrating today. I thank my hon. Friend the Member for Salford and Eccles (Rebecca Long Bailey) and the right hon. Member for Staffordshire Moorlands (Dame Karen Bradley) for bringing forward this debate and giving us this opportunity. I thank the many Members who have turned out today and spoken so eloquently. They have demonstrated so much understanding of the vital Irish contribution to life in our constituencies and across the UK.

I echo the many tributes to Tony Lloyd. I sat with him in December for the last speech that he gave in this very Chamber. He sat in the chair just behind me. I think of him every time I am here, as I am sure everybody does.

I thank my hon. Friend the Member for Salford and Eccles for celebrating the many achievements of the Irish diaspora in business, cultural, political, trade union and scientific life. She gave us a great list of Irish champions. She spoke about life in the second generation and about checking her identity all the time, which I absolutely understand, and she praised The Irish Post.

The right hon. Member for Staffordshire Moorlands spoke of the honour of being Secretary of State for Northern Ireland. I am also honoured to be a shadow Minister for Northern Ireland, and I receive a fantastically warm welcome every time I visit. She told us so much, and she championed the work of the British-Irish Parliamentary Assembly.

[Dame Karen Bradley]

I apologise for intervening on the hon. Lady and am grateful to her for giving way. I have just realised that I failed to mention in my speech my co-chair of the British-Irish Parliamentary Assembly, Brendan Smith TD, or Teachta Dála, who is an absolute champion for the British-Irish relationship. It would be remiss of me to allow this debate to finish without putting his name on the record.

[Fleur Anderson]

I am glad that the right hon. Lady has been able to set the record straight. A lot of work by British parliamentarians with Irish politicians goes unnoticed by many people, so I am really glad to have had this opportunity to hear so much about the work of the assembly.

I thank the hon. Member for Belfast South (Claire Hanna) for speaking in Irish and acknowledging the painful parts of our shared past, as well as the strength of the shared lives that we have built together. I thank my hon. Friend the Member for Luton South (Rachel Hopkins) for her celebration of the contribution of the Irish diaspora in Luton. She demonstrated an encyclopaedic knowledge of Luton clubs, making a special mention of the Irish dancers and the Luton Irish Forum.

[Mr Virendra Sharma in the Chair]

Similarly, my hon. Friend the Member for Hammersmith (Andy Slaughter) praised the Irish Cultural Centre in Hammersmith, and highlighted all that the Irish embassy has done to contribute to the role of the Irish diaspora here, and to strengthen our communities living alongside each other.

The rugby last weekend really stretched good relations between England and Ireland to their limit, but I am glad that the Irish contribution to British life is being fully demonstrated at Cheltenham, even as we speak.

In the 2021 census, 362,000 people in England and Wales identified as Irish, either solely or in combination with a UK national identity; 299,500 people identified solely as Irish; and 324,000 people were born in the Republic of Ireland. However, those figures actually diminish the real numbers; as has been said, probably about 5 million people across the country have Irish family connections.

Our two countries share so much history, culture, ideas, politics and people. This story runs like a thread through these isles and the lives of so many families, including my own. My grandmother came from Templemoyle in Northern Ireland and I am married to a proud London Irishman. My father-in-law came to London from Sligo in 1962. He is a carpenter and a builder and has worked hard, as so many Irish people did; that has been alluded to already. My mother-in-law, Nora, came to Doncaster from Donegal, before moving to Glasgow, then London, as a nurse. She came over in 1959. They met at a dance in London and married in a double wedding, with Nora’s sister and her husband, at St Mary’s Church in Clapham.

My parents-in-law brought up their six children in south-west London and their contribution to my life, the life of their church, the life of their whole community and the life of our whole family is immeasurable. They have 20 grandchildren and one great-grandchild. It is their lives, and the lives of so many people like them, that we are celebrating today. They built a bright future, with a truly shared heritage; they are an immigration success story and I am very proud to be part of their London-Irish family.

I pay particular tribute to the Irish Centres across the country, which have been family, welfare support, a place to meet and make friends, to stay, to dance, to celebrate, to organise and just to feel at home. Many of them have closed, as was mentioned earlier. I give a special mention to the Plunkett club in Clapham South, but I also thank and celebrate several London Irish Centres: those in Wimbledon, Camden, Bexleyheath, Haringey, Lewisham and, as has been mentioned, Hammersmith. I thank and celebrate all those who run them and go to them, ensuring their success in our communities.

The Mayor of London has taken that process to the next level with his annual St Patrick’s day festival and parade, which deserves a special mention. It will be enjoyed by hundreds of thousands of people this weekend—people proudly going out to be a little bit Irish for one day only, joining in the celebrations and watching or taking part in the parade. We are all happy and thankful to do that, which says a lot about how well the Irish diaspora is integrated within our country.

On her historic visit to Ireland in 2011, Queen Elizabeth II spoke powerfully about

“the ties of family, friendship and affection”,

which were

“the lifeblood of the partnership across these islands.”

How right she was! This tapestry contributes to our civic, cultural, political and social lives, and we would be immeasurably poorer without the strong influence of everything Irish.

However, our history has not always been a benign one. Our relationship over the centuries has seen terrible wrongs, which should be acknowledged, great violence and revolution. Nevertheless, that thread has remained in place and found new expression in recent years in ways that would have seemed unimaginable to us in the past. We have to pay tribute to everyone who has consciously built that peace over time.

Sadly, in recent years UK-Ireland relations have become strained, including over the Northern Ireland Protocol Bill, which the Government thankfully halted after the Windsor framework was signed; and now over the Northern Ireland Troubles (Legacy and Reconciliation) Act 2023. In Government, Labour will reset our relationship with our closest and most important neighbour. Ireland and the United Kingdom must get on for the sake of both its peoples and we in Labour will work hard toward that end.

I want to take this opportunity to reaffirm Labour’s support for the British Citizenship (Northern Ireland) Bill, tabled by the hon. Member for Belfast East (Gavin Robinson), which would establish a separate stand-alone route to British citizenship for Irish nationals born after 1948 who have been resident in Northern Ireland, and hence the UK, for significant periods of time. Across our two countries we share a unique bond, and I believe the Bill honours that.

Lastly, I again want to thank everyone who has taken part in the debate and I wish everyone a very happy St Patrick’s day. I hope all hon. Members celebrate appropriately.

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Baker]

I am so sorry; I do beg the hon. Gentleman’s pardon. I have a temporary Parliamentary Private Secretary, but he has become temporary in more than one way. I apologise to the hon. Gentleman unreservedly, but he made a very good and important speech, and I was grateful to hear it. I have often stood in Northern Ireland looking across to Donegal, and he reminds me that I should visit.

The hon. Member for West Dunbartonshire (Martin Docherty-Hughes) made a point about familial and ancient ties, and of course he is absolutely right. If English MPs have a fault, although they may be few, it is that too rarely we consider the importance of all parts of this United Kingdom. These past few months and years have been a reminder that every MP in this House and this United Kingdom should pay close attention to all parts of the United Kingdom, and indeed should remember the history that we have together. The hon. Gentleman mentioned poverty, and I remember with great sadness, sorrow and regret the impact of the famine on Ireland. He reminded me that “what we do in life, echoes in eternity”, as someone once said in a movie. We may not be able to set right the injustices of the past, but his speech reminded me that we can certainly avoid perpetuating injustices today and into the future. I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for the manner in which he set that out in his speech.

Economic ties between us have been elaborated on in the course of this debate. I just add that, in the four quarters to 2023, Ireland was the UK’s third largest export partner and the 10th largest source of imports. Beyond those statistics, those close economic ties are demonstrated by the contribution of Irish businesses to our economy, as pointed out by my right hon. Friend the Member for Staffordshire Moorlands. She may not have mentioned Kerrygold, but I was expecting her to mention it—

[Dame Karen Bradley]

I did.

[Mr Baker]

Did I miss it? She mentioned that Kerrygold is packaged in her constituency in Staffordshire, and another example is of course Guinness being packaged in Belfast and Runcorn. The impact of Irish people on UK public life has been profound, and I am very grateful that a number of Members set out how.

I was planning to mention two former British Prime Ministers, the Earl of Shelburne and the Duke of Wellington, but the hon. Member for Salford and Eccles beat me to it. I did have to check that those two Prime Ministers were not guilty of some crime against the Irish before I mentioned them, but I discovered that they were great champions of Catholic Emancipation—so for that I am very grateful. I also add the name of Edmund Burke, somebody from whom many of us have learned a great deal.

I also want to touch on the peace process. The anniversary of the Belfast Good Friday Agreement was a great thing to witness, and one of the things that it revealed was the immense good will for the island of Ireland, particularly Northern Ireland, from right across the world. People have invested a vast amount of their lives and careers into ensuring that Northern Ireland is peaceful and that the prospect of reconciliation can be held out.

I pay tribute to some individuals whom I have been privileged to meet in the course of the anniversary and some whom alas I could not. I want to refer to the relationship between Garrett FitzGerald and Margaret Thatcher leading to the Anglo-Irish agreement in 1985; the relationship between John Major and Albert Reynolds; and the robust collegiality between Bertie Ahern and Tony Blair, whose stalwart work secured the Belfast/Good Friday agreement. I want to mark the enormous contributions of the Irish Presidents Mary Robinson and Mary McAleese, who demonstrated valiant leadership during some of the darkest days when it seemed like the peace process might never come to pass. The UK Government are firmly committed to upholding and promoting the established structures created by the agreement to support the prosperity of the Irish people who want to strengthen their identity and culture as part of the wider family of nations that make up the UK.

Furthermore, the robust health of the strand 3 institutions reflects the depth of commitment from both Governments to our roles as co-guarantors of the Belfast/Good Friday agreement. Far from being mere talking shops, these fora allow us, have allowed us, and will continue to allow us to have honest and constructive discussions, not only on the subjects on which our two Governments agree, but on those areas where we have disagreed, one of which was identified by the hon. Member for Belfast South. I am extremely grateful to all of the other UK Government Ministers who have come along to the British-Irish Intergovernmental Conference; I know that that has been appreciated by the Government of Ireland.

For too long, of course, strand 3 stood alone as the only show in town, so I am delighted that, this time, as we approach St Patrick’s day, we can once again celebrate the full restoration of all three strands of the Belfast/Good Friday agreement through the North South Ministerial Council, through the upcoming meetings of the British-Irish Intergovernmental Conference and the British-Irish Council, and, of course, the fully-functioning Assembly and Executive. I particularly want to pay tribute to the First Minister and the Deputy First Minister of the Executive for the inspirational leadership that they are providing to everyone in how they are coming together in the best interests of the people of Northern Ireland.

Finally, I finish by reflecting that the familial relationship with Ireland is absolutely fundamental to the UK Government. It is so important to people across the UK. Many of us look forward to the annual St Patrick’s day celebrations, which showcase the contributions of Irish women and men. Some of those celebrations this year will include parades through the cities of Belfast, Cardiff, Glasgow, Liverpool and Leeds and, of course, at Trafalgar Square. I know that my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State is looking forward to a hundred thousand welcomes in the US this week for the St Patrick’s day celebrations. It only remains for me to thank, as others have done, all those generations of Irish people who have contributed so much to help make this great country as great as it is, and to wish everyone here, and all those people looking forward to celebrating, a very happy St Patrick’s day.

Northern Ireland

Karen Bradley Excerpts

Wednesday 22nd March 2023 Commons Chamber

[Peter Kyle]

I am grateful for that, because we will be getting to it. [Interruption.] It is interesting that Conservative Members want me to speed up but they keep intervening. I will get through the speech if they allow me to get to it. The hon. Gentleman makes the most blindingly obvious point here: my party will be voting in unanimity today, but his party is getting in the way of getting this across the line, because it is his party that is split over how to vote on the issue before us today. We are acting in the national interest; the Conservatives are riven with division.

People like me aspire to government because we want to deliver positive change, but those in the DUP now have to ask themselves, because of the way they have been treated by this Government: would a return to government mean relinquishing power? This inversion of the very principle of government, this absurdity, is a direct consequence of the manner in which Northern Ireland has been treated by this Government and the other Conservative Administrations over the past 13 years.

I want to be clear to Members who represent communities in Northern Ireland on what they can expect from a future Labour Government, to answer the point of the previous intervention. Let me reassure them that we have not forgotten the lessons of 25 years ago and the tough years following the peace deal. To me, those lessons are, first, that leadership matters. Tony Blair’s first visit outside of London as Prime Minister was to Belfast. He visited five times in his first year as premier. He did not neglect Northern Ireland, and nor will my right hon. and learned Friend the Member for Holborn and St Pancras.

Secondly, we need to work towards a strong, trusting relationship with the Irish Government, because when our two countries work together closely, it eases the anxiety that some people in Northern Ireland feel regarding their Irish or British identities, and creates the conditions for economic progress across the island of Ireland.

[Karen Bradley (Staffordshire Moorlands) (Con)]

The hon. Gentleman is absolutely right to say that the agreement 25 years ago would not have been possible without the sacrifices and statesmanship of so many, but will he acknowledge that it was John Major and his Government who started that process and that this is not a party political matter but something of which this whole House should be proud?

[Peter Kyle]

First, I thank the right hon. Lady for her time as Secretary of State for Northern Ireland. I readily acknowledge that many people made peace possible in Northern Ireland 25 years ago. We in this House will have the opportunity to debate those issues in a forthcoming general debate, and there will be plenty of opportunities to do so over in Belfast when dignitaries from across the world come to celebrate the great achievement of that time. John Major of course laid the foundations and, at the time and subsequently, all Labour leaders, including Tony Blair, paid great respect to his contribution. If I were to start listing the names of everyone, we would be here for a very long time indeed.

Thirdly, we need to have the same ambition for Northern Ireland as we do for every other part of our Union. For example, it is not good enough to roll out home heating support months after citizens in every other part of the UK have received it.

Fourthly, we should aspire to build respect among communities and be a voice for all communities here in Westminster. The last Labour Government positioned the UK as an honest broker for all of Northern Ireland, and so will the next.

Finally, Labour will never give up on Northern Ireland, however insurmountable the challenges might seem. Those involved in the negotiations 25 years ago have plenty of stories of frustration and moments of hopelessness, but perseverance is rewarded. It was then and it will be again today and into the future. It always is in Northern Ireland.

Although this deal is not perfect, it is an improvement, so in the interests of Northern Ireland and the rest of our country we will be voting for it today.

--- Later in debate ---

[Karen Bradley (Staffordshire Moorlands) (Con)]

My right hon. Friend the Secretary of State knows that I rarely rise to speak in debates that he leads, not because I disagree with what he is doing but because I think it is important that predecessors do not comment too often on their successors’ work. I know how hard the job of Secretary of State for Northern Ireland is. Today though, I rise to speak because I support wholeheartedly what he and the Prime Minister have achieved and want the statutory instrument to go through with the support of the overwhelming majority of this House.

Two weeks ago, the British-Irish Parliamentary Assembly, which I co-chair, met in Belfast to commemorate the 25th anniversary of the Belfast/Good Friday agreement. We met in the currently empty Assembly Chamber in Stormont. We met representatives of legislatures across the islands that make up the British Isles, and we reflected on the leadership that had been required to deliver that deal 25 years ago—leadership not just for a few weeks, but for years. People made sacrifices and went above and beyond, because they were prepared to recognise that, while no deal is perfect, the result of achieving the Belfast/Good Friday agreement for the people of Northern Ireland and people across these islands was so significant that the sacrifices were worth making.

[Sir Robert Neill (Bromley and Chislehurst) (Con)]

Does my right hon. Friend agree that another great virtue of this framework agreement, which is much to be commended, is that it enables us to resolve the issues in a way that does not lead us into breach of any of our international law obligations, as would have been the case had we proceeded with the Northern Ireland Protocol Bill? That has to be a win for the UK’s reputation, as well as for the people of Northern Ireland.

[Karen Bradley]

I agree wholeheartedly. My hon. Friend always speaks with great wisdom.

When I was Secretary of State for Northern Ireland, it was clear to me that leaving the European Union without a deal would have been devastating to Northern Ireland—devastating economically and devastating to community cohesion. That is why as Secretary of State and subsequently I have tried to find a way to make sure a deal was reached that we could all get behind. We reached a deal whereby the whole United Kingdom left the EU together, but that deal was not acceptable—not to those on the Opposition Benches and not to many of my right hon. and hon. Friends. I recognise and acknowledge the reasons for that: they felt it would leave us too close to the European Union, and I fully respect their view.

Then, a deal was presented to us by the former Prime Minister, my right hon. Friend the Member for Uxbridge and South Ruislip (Boris Johnson). The deal had many faults, but I believed my right hon. Friend when he said that he wanted me to vote for it because it was important for the people of Northern Ireland. I was willing to do that, even though I knew that it would result in checks on goods in the Irish sea—that was clear in the agreement—because it was so important for Northern Ireland and because my Prime Minister asked me to vote for it.

Remember that when the Belfast/Good Friday agreement was drawn up and the Northern Ireland Act 1998 implemented, the United Kingdom and Ireland were both members of the EU. As a result, many of the issues did not have to be codified. We did not have to set out what happened to goods travelling to and from Northern Ireland, or set out rights, because those rights came from both of us being EU members. Leaving the EU means that some of those issues now need to be codified, and that can be done only through negotiation and accommodation being made by both sides. The Windsor framework demonstrates enormous accommodation on the EU side; the Stormont brake is an extraordinary thing for the EU to agree to. People around the world are looking at the agreement and congratulating my right hon. Friend the Prime Minister on what he has achieved.

My question for this House is this: what is the alternative to the Windsor framework? What do we think we will get? There is nothing better on the table. This is a significant step forward, and I urge my right hon and hon. Friends to vote for it.

United Kingdom Internal Market Bill

Karen Bradley Excerpts

Monday 21st September 2020 Commons Chamber

[Gavin Robinson]

It is a pleasure to follow the hon. Member for Stone (Sir William Cash), who has that classic flair of oratory, as when he said that some Members may be somewhat bothered to some degree. Whether we agree or disagree with him, he raises a smile through the Chamber.

I rise to speak in support of the amendments tabled by my party. Before I do, I want to reflect on the comments from the right hon. Member for Maidenhead (Mrs May). I regret some of the comments she made about the implications for relationships in Northern Ireland and the consequences associated with the Bill. Be it her contribution or many others on Wednesday and no doubt later today, there is an awful lot being said that is not only at cross purposes across the Chamber but completely misses the point. The right hon. Lady embarked on a political strategy that was encapsulated by the phrase “Brexit means Brexit”, and for nine months there was no greater clarity than that. Here we are four years later, and we know that what was outlined as a national aspiration and what was agreed to in a referendum by the people of this country is not being delivered for the people of Northern Ireland.

Members will remember the week in December 2017 when there was a flurry of activity around the formulation of what became the UK-EU joint report. They will also remember the work that had to go into getting provisions placed in that joint report at paragraph 50, which not only represented the principle that it was of no concern for the European Union to impede or impose upon the integrity of a member state, but stated:

“the United Kingdom will ensure that no new regulatory barriers develop between Northern Ireland and the rest of the United Kingdom, unless, consistent with the 1998 Agreement, the Northern Ireland Executive and Assembly agree… In all circumstances, the United Kingdom will continue to ensure the same unfettered access for Northern Ireland’s businesses to the whole of the United Kingdom internal market.”

That was in paragraph 50 of the joint report, but it was never honoured in the withdrawal agreement.

[Karen Bradley (Staffordshire Moorlands) (Con)]

The hon. Gentleman is making some powerful points. Does he recall that, when the first version of the European Union (Withdrawal) (No. 6) Bill was brought forward before the election last year, I and others tabled an amendment that would have put paragraph 50 of the joint report into the Bill, but that was not accepted by the Government?

[Gavin Robinson]

It was not accepted by the Government, but the right hon. Lady was a member of the Government who brought forward three iterations of a withdrawal agreement that did not honour that provision. That provision was not honoured in the earlier iterations of the withdrawal agreement.

[Karen Bradley]

The hon. Gentleman will recall that there was an addendum to the withdrawal agreement that was agreed and would have been lodged in the international court that would have made paragraph 50 part of an international agreement, but that was rejected by this House.

[Gavin Robinson]

The right hon. Lady may be right on that point, but here we are yet again, seeking to legislate domestically within the United Kingdom to right the wrongs of a negotiation that should never have advanced in the way that it did. Our Government fell into the trap of trying to provide an answer when they did not know what the problem was. They did not know what the future trading relationship was going to be. They did not know what the overarching trade deal was going to be between the United Kingdom Government and the European Union, and yet they set out to solve the problem of the Irish border without knowing what the overarching provisions would be. That made no sense, and it led us to the position we are in today. Here I am this evening, asking Members to consider provisions that should be part of this Bill but are not and saying that there are aspirations associated with this Bill that should equally apply to Northern Ireland—the whole of the United Kingdom internal market, as stated in the joint report—but do not. That is hugely regrettable.

I spoke on Wednesday about clause 46, on the provision of financial aid, and my party’s amendment 22 to clause 47, to ensure that there was no restriction on such aid for Northern Ireland businesses. The response from Government was, “That’s great. Thank you very much. Let’s consider it on Monday.” Here we stand on Monday. I have enormous respect for the Minister, but we are hearing, “Don’t worry about your amendments. We’ll consider them in the Finance Bill.” There remain important concerns about the European Union state aid rules that will apply in Northern Ireland. There is nothing in this Bill, there is nothing in the Government’s approach, and there is nothing in their plan that seeks to amend or fetter the rule of EU state aid rules within Northern Ireland.

--- Later in debate ---

[Joanna Cherry]

That is correct, and it is worrying to hear my hon. Friend talk about the Kirk as he and I were both brought up in the opposite persuasion, but of course the Church of Scotland is also protected by the treaty of Union. So Members on the Government Benches can mock away; they should feel free to continue their mocking, which is seen in Scotland, and simply feeds the desire for Scotland to go a different way. They should keep up the mocking, because it is helping my party’s cause and it is helping the cause of my country.

[Karen Bradley]

It is an honour to rise today in this debate, following a number of very thoughtful contributions from right hon. and hon. Members across the Chamber. Although it is an honour to be called to speak today, I cannot pretend that it is an enjoyable experience, and that is because of the conflict that I feel. I feel desperately uncomfortable. I want to support the Prime Minister and the Government, and I know how the Minister feels. I have sat on that Front Bench far too many times, knowing that people behind me did not agree with my position.

I want to support the Prime Minister. I want to see the whole United Kingdom leave the European Union, respecting the referendum result, but I am desperately uncomfortable about being asked to vote to break international law. My instinct tells me that what the Government are asking me to vote for tonight is not the right thing to do or, to be charitable, may not be doing things in the right way.

The Government have been clear—they are on the record—that paragraph (5) is a breach of the withdrawal agreement, and we are angels dancing on the head of the pin as to when the law is broken. The law will be broken, if these clauses are used. It might be at Royal Assent, or it might be at commencement of the Act. It might be when the order is laid after the parliamentary vote—I thank the Government for agreeing to respect that and for agreeing to that amendment. I would like to hear from the Minister exactly what the Government’s position is now as to when the law will be broken, because no parliamentarian wants to walk through the Lobby knowing they are about to break the law.

Much has been made of the role that respecting the Belfast Good Friday agreement has in this debate. Let us be clear: the Belfast Good Friday agreement was the result of great statecraft and the power of words over violence, but it was also a triumph of compromise—or, as I used to be told I had to call it, accommodation. It was a settlement that meant that people living in Northern Ireland could be comfortable in their own identities, be that British, Irish, both or neither. As the hon. Member for Belfast South (Claire Hanna) said earlier, it was written at a point when both the UK and Ireland were members of the EU. I want to be absolutely clear: the Belfast Good Friday agreement was not contingent on our both being members of the European Union. It was a result of great statecraft, compromise and people being prepared to lead, and it would have happened if both countries had not been members of the same economic bloc. But the fact that both countries were EU members meant that the foundations of the Belfast Good Friday agreement—the Northern Ireland Act 1998 that this House passed—were written without the need to deal explicitly with matters that European citizenship and membership conferred. There was no need to write about citizens’ rights and how somebody who identifies as Irish and lives in Northern Ireland can exercise their right to be a member of the European Union when the country in which they reside is no longer a member of the European Union. It did not go into the points on customs and declarations. It did not talk about that because it did not need to. In fact, the reason we have the Bill—and I want to make it clear that I support the Bill as a whole; it is part 5 with which I have a problem— is because we need it, as the settlements on devolution were written at a time when we were a member of the European Union. We did not need frameworks on agriculture, because matters that will be settled by the devolved Administrations were governed by rules in Brussels.

I support our taking back control of those matters. Again, I have to make it absolutely clear that this has nothing to do with leaving the European Union. It is about how we make sure that we do so in the right way, so that I can hold my head up high and look people in the eye and say that I am proud to be a parliamentarian in this Parliament, which respects the rule of law. We have to remember that the world will judge us by the way in which we respect the Belfast/Good Friday agreement, even more than our breaking the withdrawal agreement.

--- Later in debate ---

[Martin Docherty-Hughes]

On the reputation of the United Kingdom and the identity of Irishness and Britishness in Northern Ireland, why was it up to Emma DeSouza to drag the right hon. Member’s Government through the courts fully to exercise their rights to identify as Irish and their rights as a European Union citizen in the High Court in Northern Ireland?

[Karen Bradley]

The hon. Gentleman would have to take up the reasons why the case was taken with the lady in question, but the DeSouza case is a clear example of how the Northern Ireland Act 1998 did not address these matters. I have been clear, in many interventions since I left my post last summer and while I was in post, that respecting the right of everybody who lives in Northern Ireland to identify in the way that they are comfortable with is incredibly important and we must respect it. So I say to the Minister: part 5 should not be in this Bill. The Government should not ask MPs to vote for an illegal law as a negotiating tactic. This part should be in a separate Bill, if these clauses are needed, and it should be debated separately; it should not be polluting what is otherwise a good and necessary piece of law. All possible steps to avoid needing these clauses should be taken.

I say to the Minister that I am undecided as to which way I will vote this evening, because I respect the fact that Government have moved and compromised, and I understand that that is a difficult thing for Governments to do. But I ask the Minister to give me clarity: if I walk through the Lobby today, am I breaking the law? If I walk through the Lobby today, will the law be broken as a result of my doing so? Will I have the answer for me at 3 am, not for my constituents or others, that I have done the right thing and that this will lead to a better result for the UK?

[Hilary Benn]

It is a great pleasure to follow that fine speech by the right hon. Member for Staffordshire Moorlands (Karen Bradley). I want to concentrate on how we get out of this mess without breaching international law and the treaty we signed up to. Four issues have caused all this: the question of exit summary declarations, the definition of “at-risk goods”, state aid and third country listing. The Bill deals with only some of those; further legislation is threatened to deal with the rest, but one has to look at them together.

The first thing I want to say is that it seems the Government are in a state of hopeless confusion on two questions. The first is: is the EU negotiating in good faith or not? I asked the Prime Minister that last week at the Liaison Committee and he told me it is not. Earlier that same day, the Northern Ireland Secretary told the Northern Ireland Affairs Committee that the EU is negotiating in good faith, and indeed the Government’s response to that Committee’s report confirmed that. I do not know whether that makes the Minister, for whom I have a great regard, the adjudicator in this matter, but perhaps he might offer his opinion in his wind-up, because the Government do not appear to be of one mind.

Secondly, I believe the Minister referred in his speech—I tried to write down the phrase as I recall it—to, “Harmful legal defaults that were never intended to be used” or words to that effect. If they are legal defaults that the Government object to, it really does raise the question: why did the Government sign up to those legal defaults when they negotiated the protocol and the withdrawal agreement, and signed that and extolled its virtues to the House of Commons?

On exit summary declarations, there is a place for this and other concerns to be resolved, which is in the Joint Committee, through the article 16 process. The House needs to ask itself why the Government have said so little thus far about their intention to use article 16 if a satisfactory agreement cannot be reached; I did not get an answer from the Prime Minister last week and, with respect, I did not get an answer from the Minister today, but it seems that the Government have so little faith in the mechanism they negotiated that they have decided that they need to take powers to breach the terms of the treaty, even though—I remind the Minister—article 168 of the withdrawal agreement says that, “For any dispute between the EU and the UK arising under this agreement, the EU and the UK shall ‘only’ have recourse to the procedures provided for in this agreement. This Bill drives a coach and horses through that sentence, which the Government agreed. In the statement that Ministers put out last week, the Government said that they would use the provisions of article 16 “in parallel with” the powers they wish to take in this Bill. In parallel? I really do not understand that as an argument, because surely they should use the mechanism they have negotiated first, and then if they are absolutely determined to break international law, they can get to that subsequently.

I come back to the point about the Joint Committee. Why have the Government not shared with the House the proposals they have made to the EU side about how goods at risk can be identified? It is simply not good enough. Part of the reason why the Government have got into such a mess is that they have not shared with us how the negotiations are going and have then suddenly produced a remedy that is contrary to international law to solve a problem the contents of which we are not aware of because Government have not shared with Members how things are going.

This is not an academic issue: many businesses that trade into Northern Ireland have absolutely no idea, with just over three months to go, of what the arrangements are going to be—none. There is a responsibility on both parties—the EU and the UK—to give them some clarity. Have the Government proposed using, for example, tariff lines as the way to define goods at risk? Or products and shipments, or companies as the basis? To those who have looked into the issue in great detail, it seems that those are probably the three broad approaches that might be taken. I ask the Government to please be open with the House of Commons on this matter.

On state aid, I find it impossible to believe that the Government did not realise what the full implications of article 10 might be. Everybody recognised that it brought into the ambit of the state aid rules what happens in Northern Ireland, but had it really not occurred to Ministers that there might be reach-back—I think that is the expression—implications for state aid in the United Kingdom? This is currently a theoretical issue, because there are not any cases. The Minister will be well aware that in the wake of covid, the EU Commission has significantly relaxed the state aid rules. Other EU members are giving state aid to all sorts of companies. The question is how the matter is going to be resolved by means other than resorting to the breaking of international law.

There is a great puzzle in respect of the Government’s position. When the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster appeared before the Select Committee on the Future Relationship with the European Union on 11 March and we asked him whether businesses that trade out of England into Northern Ireland were going to be subject to the full panoply of state aid regulations, he replied:

“No, we do not believe so.”

That was in March, but apparently the Government do now believe so. What happened between March and now to lead them to that conclusion?

The Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster also said:

“The subsidy regime that the UK proposes to put in place after we have left the EU”—

we have now left the EU—

“will be one that the EU will recognise as a robust system.”

Here we are in September, and of a robust system for state aid there is no sight yet. How can that be the case? We read reports in the paper that the reason is because Ministers cannot agree on what kind of state aid policy they want.

The publication of such a policy is urgent for two reasons: not only for the purposes of sorting out the problem of potential reach-back, but for making a breakthrough in the trade negotiations. To be fair to the EU, it has moved from saying at the beginning, “You must follow all our rules on state aid in perpetuity,” to now saying rather plaintively to the Government, “Would you be so kind as to give us just an inkling of what your state aid regime is going to look like?” To announce that we are going to follow the World Trade Organisation rules is hardly a revelation, because as an independent member of the WTO we are obliged to follow the WTO rules. As we know, though, they lack important details and do not cover services.

The sooner the Government publish a state aid regime to answer the EU’s question, the sooner they can help the trade negotiations to move forward. Assuming that an agreement could be reached on that regime as part of the negotiations, the Government could, as the Minister will know, use article 13(8) of the withdrawal agreement to amend article 10, which is the cause of the potential problem—namely, reach-back.

The Bill does not deal with third-country listing, and no Bill could, because it is a regulatory decision of the European Union about the terms on which it lets third-country food and animal product imports into its jurisdiction. I happen to think that if the EU were to deny us such listing, arguably the UK could take the EU to the European Court, on the grounds that it was a perverse decision, or indeed the UK could certainly invoke article 16, on the grounds that denying the UK third-country listing was a breach of the good faith obligation under article 5.

Victims of the Troubles: Payment Scheme

Karen Bradley Excerpts

Thursday 4th June 2020 Commons Chamber

[Mr Walker]

If I may correct the hon. Gentleman, I do not think I said it was an excuse. I think I made it very clear that it is not an excuse. This is a case of the Executive needing to get on and designate the Department, and then this can go ahead. There is no technical reason why any discussions about funding should hold this up. We need to move forward with the process. We have put the legislation in place, and it is in the hands of the Executive to nominate a Department to take that forward so that we can get on and do it.

[Karen Bradley (Staffordshire Moorlands) (Con)]

I join the hon. Member for Cardiff West (Kevin Brennan) in paying tribute both to the hon. Member for Sheffield, Heeley (Louise Haigh) in her new role and to her predecessor, the hon. Member for Rochdale (Tony Lloyd), who in my time as Secretary of State provided fair, reasonable and very constructive scrutiny of the work that I was doing. He was particularly keen that we should see progress in this area, and he raised it on a regular basis. I agreed with him that we needed to see progress made, and I commend my right hon. and hon. Friends the Minister and the Secretary of State for making that progress. However, does the Minister agree that too much time has been wasted arguing over small technicalities when, actually, the politicians need to put first the humanity of those victims—entirely innocent victims—who suffered? They have waited far too long for this money. They need it now.

[Mr Walker]

My right hon. Friend obviously speaks with considerable experience. She is absolutely right. We need to get on with this. We need to make sure that this is delivered as soon as possible. The kinds of arguments that she refers to have held this process up for far too long and have been settled. They are settled in the legislation. We now need to get on and make sure that the money starts flowing.

Oral Answers to Questions

Karen Bradley Excerpts

Wednesday 5th February 2020 Commons Chamber

[Mr Walker]

I congratulate my hon. Friend on his re-election as Chair of the Select Committee. He makes a very important point, which I have also heard loud and clear from Northern Ireland businesses. I think they welcome some of the indications from the Migration Advisory Committee report. Of course, the Northern Ireland Office will ensure that the concerns and interests of Northern Ireland businesses are communicated across Government, including to the Home Office.

[Karen Bradley (Staffordshire Moorlands) (Con)]

The Minister is right to say that the Northern Ireland economy has enormous potential, and there is no doubt that restoration of the Executive will unlock a great amount of that potential. Will he also explain the benefits that the Northern Ireland economy will receive from being part of the fifth largest economy in the world—that of the United Kingdom?

[Mr Walker]

My right hon. Friend speaks with enormous knowledge of this area. She is absolutely right: Northern Ireland’s economy benefits enormously from its membership of the United Kingdom, and there will be new opportunities for Northern Ireland as we trade more globally and strike new free trade deals around the world.

Northern Ireland Executive Formation

Karen Bradley Excerpts

Thursday 16th January 2020 Commons Chamber

[Julian Smith]

Going back to the financial package, there will be £2 billion up front and then, obviously, the usual Budget arrangements in March. It is not for me to comment on those Budget arrangements—I think I would get into huge trouble with the Treasury if I did —but all of us in this House and across Government realise that, when the Executive come forward with their programme for government and as they work through the coming months, we need to stand ready to assist them.

The Executive need to take a different approach from the one they have historically taken. They need to reform. We are setting up a board, and we are looking at how to encourage greater productivity. I was slightly disappointed to hear this week that water rates have been ruled out. The Executive need to look at their own revenue-raising measures, as well as coming to the UK Exchequer for cash.

[Karen Bradley (Staffordshire Moorlands) (Con)]

I join others in paying tribute to my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State and the Tánaiste, Simon Coveney, for the work they have done. I know too well the hours and hours that have been put in to get to this point, and my right hon. Friend deserves great credit for being able to stand here today to deliver this statement. The new deal includes the setting up of an office for identity and cultural protection. I would be interested to hear from him how he sees that office being used to bring the community together, rather than driving a wedge between.

[Julian Smith]

I thank my right hon. Friend for that and I again pay tribute to her work; there were many, many references to specific meetings and engagements, and to a specific bottle of wine, when she hosted party leaders, and she made a big difference to the overall process. I thank her for her efforts.

On the office of diversity, these now are devolved matters, but I absolutely concur with the direction of my right hon. Friend’s question: let us not make this deal add to the division. Everything needs to focus on bringing the community in Northern Ireland together.

Historical Institutional Abuse (Northern Ireland) Bill [Lords]

Karen Bradley Excerpts

2nd reading: House of Commons
Tuesday 5th November 2019 Commons Chamber

[Karen Bradley (Staffordshire Moorlands) (Con)]

May I say, Madam Deputy Speaker, what a privilege it is to have you in the Chair for this debate? I know that you have such humanity and that you will be touched by this debate and all that you have heard. I know, too, that you will be pleased that you were chairing this particular debate.

I also thank my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for his incredibly moving and powerful speech. I congratulate him on our being here today. I also join you, Madam Deputy Speaker, and everyone in this House in saying that the hon. Member for Ealing North (Stephen Pound) made one of his finest speeches. It is his last speech, which is a great shame to so many of us who know just how he has worked for his constituents, for the people of Northern Ireland as a shadow Minister, and also for this House, because he is a true parliamentarian and will be desperately missed.

We stand here today just before we go into an election. We are going into an election because politics is broken, yet here we can prove that it is not broken. Here, we can prove that we can come together and do something. We can deliver something that is right for people who have been through the most agonising, dreadful experiences— experiences that no person, and particularly no child, should ever suffer. We have a chance to make that right today. I trust and know that we will come together, that we will pass this Bill and that, by this evening, this Bill will have Royal Assent, and then we can get on with delivering redress for those victims. They need it, they deserve it, and it needs to happen as soon as possible.

One of the privileges of the job that I used to do, that my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State does now, and that my right hon. Friend the Member for Old Bexley and Sidcup (James Brokenshire) and others have done, is to realise that, very often, we are in the presence of people who have suffered the most incredible, dreadful experiences. Northern Ireland is like no other part of the United Kingdom for having put people through experiences that no one should ever have to go through. I, as Secretary of State, spent time listening to people who had been through horrendous experiences in the troubles and who had been treated in a way that nobody should be treated, and listening to people who were victims of historical institutional abuse. As Secretary of State, or any Minister in the Northern Ireland Office, one cannot fail to be touched by that and to be determined to do everything possible to help those victims. I was absolutely determined that we should do that, and I am so proud that we have got here today, but it had to be done in a way that was sustainable and robust. Neither I nor my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State could just wave a magic wand and make it all right. We have to go through the proper processes, because we must make sure that this redress scheme and the measures that are put in place will be robust, will not be challenged and will be delivered—and delivered as quickly as possible for the victims.

That is why it was a matter of the most enormous regret that the Hart report was delivered at the point that the Executive collapsed. Had the Executive not collapsed, we would have had ministerial direction to know what Ministers thought of the recommendations. We would have had something to work with. In fact, had the Executive been there, they could have delivered interim payments without the need for primary legislation. They could have delivered so many of these things so much sooner, but they were unable to do so, which is why we had to go through a long consultation process that victims felt was delaying matters and making them worse. It was not doing so; it was there to give a robust legal framework so that we could deliver this scheme.

I want to pay tribute, as my right hon. Friend did, to the six parties. Earlier this year, when we were starting on a talks process, we got all the parties from Northern Ireland in one room and used that opportunity to get them to talk about this matter, so that we could have a united position from them. Although we may still not have an Executive, it will be those politicians and those parties that will have to administer this scheme as Ministers. Therefore, it was absolutely right that it was they who helped to draft this legislation. If that had not been done, and we had used the normal primary legislation route in this place, it would have taken far, far longer, which would have meant that victims had to wait longer.

I have to say to the parties in Northern Ireland that this really needs to be a wake-up call. Yes, we are putting this Bill through here today—I know the hurdles that my right hon. Friend has had to go over and how he has had to jump over obstacles and everything else to get this Bill here today. I know full well what he has come up against, trying to get matters such as this through the collective responsibility of Government, but he should not have had to do that, because there are politicians in Northern Ireland who are elected to do this work. This needs to be the wake-up call. They should put their differences aside. I know that they want to go back into Government and do the right thing by the people of Northern Ireland. This is their opportunity. Please, I say to them, do the right thing for those people.

Finally, I just want to talk about the victims, many of whom I can see today. I know that we should not refer to those in the Gallery, but I will, because those victims are there. I had the honour and privilege of meeting them. I sat through meetings in which they told me about their experiences. There is nothing more humbling than listening to people telling you what they have been through—especially when it is something that they should never have had to go through. This is a Bill for them. This is something that we are delivering in this broken Parliament for people for whom we should be standing up. I congratulate my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State on this Bill and I will wholeheartedly support it here today.

--- Later in debate ---

[Emma Little Pengelly]

I absolutely agree with all that my hon. Friend has said.

I am so glad that this legislation for the victims and survivors of abuse is one of the last things that this House will have achieved in this Parliament. This is a Parliament that has been dominated by a small number of big issues, and we know very well what those are; I am not even going to say the word. Yet I know that Members from every single party right across this House and the elected representatives in Northern Ireland get into politics because they want to make change on these types of issues. They want to make changes on education, health and public services, and to address great wrongs and injustices. It is such a good thing that we are ending this Parliament on such an issue, and that the many hundreds and thousands of people who suffered appalling abuse, as the Secretary of State outlined, will finally get the last piece of this process: redress. But redress will not be closure. It will never undo the dreadful wrongs that happened to all those children in those settings.

[Karen Bradley]

The hon. Lady was instrumental in setting up the inquiry from the beginning. Let me make a point to her that always struck me when I was in the Home Office dealing with these matters for England and Wales, which is that to call this historical abuse is absolutely wrong. It is not historical; it is current and present. It is with the victims every single day.

[Emma Little Pengelly]

Absolutely. I was involved in this process right from the start, seven years ago. I pay tribute to the right hon. Peter Robinson and the late Martin McGuinness, because I was present at the meeting when the victims and survivors came in and told us of the terrible, terrible experiences they went through, and both those men were genuinely moved. Who could not be moved by hearing those personal experiences and the terrible wrongs? But both of those men were very moved, and they worked together, and tasked me and some others to go away and try to drive this work forward. Throughout those seven years, civil servants at all levels, the late Judge Hart and all those who gave support and help were really motivated to get through the process and to do so swiftly, because they had heard the terrible things that had happened and had seen the injustice that they wanted to address.

I have to say that I am angry that it has taken this long to get to this point of redress. The inquiry was unusual in that the timeframe was put down in legislation. The late Judge Hart made it absolutely clear that, yes, he would request the extension that he was allowed by the legislation, but he would also meet the timeframes set out, so we always knew when the inquiry was going to report, because he made that clear. I and others made representations to those who pulled down the Assembly, asking them not to do so in order to allow the report to come forward, and I am genuinely angry that it happened. I am angry that we have had to wait for those years for the victims and survivors to get the redress they deserve and that we knew was coming.

But today is not a day about recriminations. In fact, this has been a good example of how the political parties can work together and the difference that they can make—not, perhaps, on the bigger issues that will always be challenging, but on these types of significant issues that are so meaningful to people’s lives.

I pay tribute to all the victims and survivors, who have been on this journey right from the start, including Margaret, Kate, Gerry and Jon McCourt, all of whom have been mentioned in this debate. They have done incredible work because they have represented not just themselves, but the many thousands of victims across Northern Ireland—in fact, across the world—who perhaps could not step forward. They were brave enough to do so no matter how difficult it was, and it must have been incredibly difficult for them to tell their own stories again and again and again to try to get the inquiry and the justice they deserved.

I have been involved in this process for seven years, so it is really good to see it come to an end today, but the victims and survivors have been involved for decades and decades before that. As I have said in the House many times, many of these children came from very challenging and difficult circumstances, and what they needed was love, protection and support. But when we read the report and listen to their experiences, we know that what they got was cruelty, depravity and harshness. That is appalling. Right from that very first meeting with Martin McGuinness and Peter Robinson, those who were in the room were absolutely struck that the right thing to do was to try to get justice for the victims. There is very broad consensus on that in every political party and right across this House.

I pay tribute to all the victims and survivors. This is not the end of their journey. They will continue with all the pain and suffering—the legacy of what happened to them. I hope that this redress and financial support—and what it symbolises—will be of some comfort, as well as a recognition of their hard and incredible work to stand up and address the terrible, terrible wrong that was done to them and many thousands of other children.

Wrightbus (Ballymena)

Karen Bradley Excerpts

Monday 30th September 2019 Commons Chamber

[Julian Smith]

As I said in my statement, it is really important that everybody who thinks they could help to unlock this process does what is in the best interests of the people of Ballymena and the employees of the company.

[Karen Bradley (Staffordshire Moorlands) (Con)]

It seems ironic on the day that announcements are made about money for new buses—I hope a significant amount of that money goes to my constituents in Staffordshire Moorlands—that we are here debating a bus manufacturer in Northern Ireland going into administration. Will my right hon. Friend join me in paying tribute to Sue Gray, the permanent secretary at the Department of Finance in Northern Ireland, who has worked tirelessly and I know will continue to do so to do all she can for the employees?

Northern Ireland (Executive Formation etc) Act 2019 Section 7

Karen Bradley Excerpts

Monday 30th September 2019 Commons Chamber

[Julian Smith]

My hon. Friend makes an important point. Again, we need to encourage Stormont to get up and running and we need to deliver on this legislation, and I believe that we can achieve both.

[Karen Bradley (Staffordshire Moorlands) (Con)]

I thank my right hon. Friend for giving way; he is being generous with his time. We want this legislation to progress as quickly as possible, but it has to be watertight and robust, and it has to have proper scrutiny, because otherwise it will be challenged. The quickest way to get redress for the victims is to have proper, robust legislation that has been properly scrutinised.

[Julian Smith]

I thank my predecessor for those remarks, and I will take this opportunity to pay tribute to her for her relentless work to get the legislation to this stage. I am acutely aware that she has played a really important part in getting us where we are. She is right; we need to move things on, but we need to be as careful as possible in how we do so.

On 23 August I met representatives of victim and survivor groups, and I intend to meet them again later this week. These people’s lives have been blighted by unforgivable, horrendous acts, yet they have engaged patiently and respectfully with politicians and with the legislative process. It is imperative that we do all within our power to support the Bill so that they can finally receive a measure of redress.

This House is well aware of the stain of child abuse that shames our country. It took place in every corner and it went unchecked for decades. The Hart report outlines starkly the degrading acts perpetrated by those responsible for caring for vulnerable children at Kincora boys home, Nazareth House and Lissue Hospital. In fact, there were only two institutions across Northern Ireland where evidence of systemic abuse was not found. In most instances it was the poorest and most vulnerable young people who were affected, and in some instances the same vulnerable children were then sent to unsuitable homes in Australia, with their whereabouts unknown to their family members.