House of Lords (Hereditary Peers) Bill Debate

Full Debate: Read Full Debate
Department: Cabinet Office
Gavin Williamson Portrait Sir Gavin Williamson
- Hansard - - - Excerpts

The hon. Gentleman flatters me by suggesting that I have any power. Once, as Chief Whip, I could have had a gentle nudge on the tiller to make things happen, but sadly the only army I can now bring to bear is me. I will happily do what I can on these important new clauses, and I will walk side-by-side with the Paymaster General, through the Lobby to deliver for his party on its manifesto commitment, but I am afraid that is the only commitment I can make, because I would not wish to over-promise.

John Slinger Portrait John Slinger (Rugby) (Lab)
- Hansard - -

I thank the right hon. Gentleman for giving way in his entertaining speech. He makes several references to our manifesto, but I would like to make some references to the Conservative party’s manifesto—

Judith Cummins Portrait The First Deputy Chairman of Ways and Means (Judith Cummins)
- Hansard - - - Excerpts

Order. I hope the hon. Member’s intervention is on the House of Lords and within the scope of the Bill.

John Slinger Portrait John Slinger
- Hansard - -

It is related to references to reform of the House of Lords. There are no references to reform of the House of Lords in the Conservative party’s manifesto. There is one reference to peers but not to peers in the other place, and there are a few references to the constitution but not to our unwritten constitution. Will the right hon. Gentleman tell the House why he is now so fascinated by these measures?

Gavin Williamson Portrait Sir Gavin Williamson
- Hansard - - - Excerpts

I thank the hon. Gentleman for making a point, and I hope that his Whips have noted the support that he was trying to offer. I bring his attention to 2012, when there was an attempt at a major body of reform of the House of Lords. That was something that I was going to vote for; I wanted to see that reform in 2012 as I wish to see that reform in 2024. This may shock him and start to undermine his faith that he joined a party with radical traditions or a wish to deliver reform or change: it was the Labour party—his party—that voted that attempt down and made sure that it could not proceed.

--- Later in debate ---
John Hayes Portrait Sir John Hayes
- Hansard - - - Excerpts

Many of my newer parliamentary opponents—I would never say enemies, of course—wish to intervene. I shall take them in order, with the Member on the right first.

John Slinger Portrait John Slinger
- Hansard - -

The right hon. Gentleman was keen to score my hon. Friend the Member for Bolton West (Phil Brickell). He gave him four out of 10, and I think he was rather unfair.

Alex Burghart Portrait Alex Burghart
- Hansard - - - Excerpts

What would you give him?

John Slinger Portrait John Slinger
- Hansard - -

Significantly higher, let us put it that way—eight or nine, I would say. If I may, I suggest that I would give Opposition Members between seven and 10 out of 10 for being patronising.

John Hayes Portrait Sir John Hayes
- Hansard - - - Excerpts

I did not mean to patronise the hon. Member for Bolton West (Phil Brickell). I was being paternal or avuncular, rather than patronising, in how I dealt with him. It is a known fact, proven by events, that I have tended to encourage new Members to this House, perhaps to a greater degree than many other senior Members, and that includes Members from across the House. One of the things that one learns here—I spoke about the learning curve we all face—is that the relationships that pervade across this House are as important as the relationships we form on our own Benches.