Fuel Poverty

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Wednesday 6th November 2024 Westminster Hall

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

It is a pleasure to serve under your chairship, Sir Roger. I thank the right hon. Member for Orkney and Shetland (Mr Carmichael) for securing the debate, which gives us all an opportunity to participate. To be perfectly honest, I do not think that the right hon. Gentleman has ever had a debate that I have not come along to: he brings forward issues that I am very interested in, and I thank him for that.

I want to give a Northern Ireland perspective, which I hope will illustrate exactly what the issues are. Others have given theirs, and I am sure that those who follow will back up the theme. Reports on fuel poverty in Northern Ireland certainly make grim reading. Northern Ireland Fuel Poverty Coalition highlights comparative statistics showing that fuel poverty levels throughout the United Kingdom are as follows: 21.5% in Northern Ireland, 10.4% in England—people might be pretty lucky to live in England, but those in fuel poverty would not say that—26.5% in Scotland and 23% in Wales.

We should try to figure out exactly what those stats mean. A recent Northern Ireland Housing Executive report indicates that if the measure is based on 21° heat in living rooms, the figure for Northern Ireland is closer to 30%. In other words, it is the highest in the United Kingdom. It gives me no pleasure whatever to say that, but it gives an idea of where the problems are.

I should have said at the start—I apologise for not doing so—that it is nice to see the Minister in his place. I look forward to his response. I also look forward to the contribution by the shadow Minister, ever my friend.

The fact is that people have got used to dressing for outside when they are living in their house. The right hon. Member for Orkney and Shetland illustrated that incredibly well in his introduction, but that is a fact for those people. The hon. Member for Maidstone and Malling (Helen Grant), who is no longer in her place, also gave an illustration, describing a constituent she visited who was wrapped up almost like a teddy bear, with all the clothes that she had on. The fact is that if she had not had those clothes on, that lady would probably have been fairly close to hypothermia.

[Victoria Collins]

We all have those stories, and I am always heartbroken when they come in. One constituent told me:

“I live alone on my pension and will either have to stay in bed all day or keep a coat on and hot water bottle it, if I can afford the electricity to keep boiling the kettle.”

It is a very sad state of affairs, is it not?

[Jim Shannon]

The hon. Lady illustrates a point that she rightly says is replicated regularly among all our constituents. This debate today is about them, and that is why we are here. We are here to make a point on behalf of our constituents who are in those predicaments and under other incredible pressures.

From a quick survey I did in my own office, one staff member sets her heating temperature at 21°C, while the rest of the staff would set it at less, as they would just take the chill off by sitting under blankets. Fuel poverty may affect more people than perhaps the Minister, shadow Minister or anyone really understands. That staff member said that she has to do so because she has children, so she has to prioritise heat. That is understandable: if there are children in the house, we would want to keep them warm.

Here are some stats and figures, which are quite stark: the staff member’s gas statement showed that last November she topped it up with £294. She did the same in December and January, and then in February it was down to £245. For her, in that four-month period, the gas cost £1,127. If we add that up over the year, it is almost £3,500 for the energy, just to keep the house warm. Thank the Lord for summer and the heat that it sometimes brings—maybe it is not as much as we wish, but none the less it brings heat and we can have the gas on less.

My example illustrates the problem. My staff member is not in the house from 8.30 am until 5.30 pm, but for those months she is still in fuel poverty. By the way, she is well paid; I say that to make the point that many people find themselves in a predicament on this issue. How much more so for our pensioners, who are not out of the house and warm in their workplace—for the stay-at-home parents, for our disabled, or for all those people who have different pressures? I often think that when we illustrate something with an example, there are so many other examples of people who are in different circumstances but under the same pressures.

We have told people for years to get rid of the fire and get a cleaner heater that uses oil or gas. Now people cannot afford to turn it up, and that is all before we take into account the crushing blow of the removal of the winter fuel allowance, which affects millions in the UK. It particularly affects my constituents in Northern Ireland, who are so reliant on oil as their method of heating.

[Anna Dixon]

Does the hon. Gentleman agree that part of the solution is building more higher-quality housing for older people? In many of our communities, people are living in unsuitable homes that are cold and damp, but they do not have affordable alternatives to move to within their own communities. Does he agree that part of the solution is providing more high-quality but affordable housing to give older people, such as those he was describing, opportunities to move into much better-insulated homes that are easier to heat?

[Jim Shannon]

The hon. Lady is right. Others have illustrated the issue of house building. We live in older houses: that is a fact. The Government have committed themselves to 1.5 million new homes in this Session, and I wish them well in that, because I want to see that happen. We can only hope that those homes will be energy-efficient. I chair the healthy homes and buildings all-party parliamentary group, and one of the things we are pushing for is to ensure that whenever new homes come through, they will be energy-efficient and enable people with disabilities, vulnerable people or elderly people to have that quality of life in their homes. Within that, we must also look at upgrading older homes that do not have all the things rightly asked for by the hon. Lady, which we also try to bring forward.

By way of comparison, the figures in the latest census indicate that 62% of households in Northern Ireland use oil. Every time we have a war, we become incredibly worried, because oil prices will go up and the cost of oil in our central heating will therefore increase. Every time that happens, it affects 62% of households in Northern Ireland. The cost of oil is down a wee bit now, and it is good to have it down, but it is still an incredibly expensive way to heat a home.

Many houses in Northern Ireland depend entirely on oil, whereas the percentage of households in England and Wales was just 4%. Again, that illustrates the pressures that we have in Northern Ireland compared with other places. Oil can be expensive and inconvenient for Northern Irish consumers while also having high associated carbon emissions. Although the use of gas has expanded since 2011 to around 200,000 households, the usage of gas is still firmly behind that of oil, which has led to higher levels of fuel poverty.

Northern Ireland is currently preparing an energy strategy. The Minister is diligent, and he may have had the opportunity for discussions with his compatriots in Northern Ireland. Has that happened and what was the outcome? The energy strategy is due for release in 2025, so the skeletal story of what the energy strategy will be is probably there already, although it has not been released just yet. I quote its aim:

“Alleviating fuel poverty will have a positive impact on both mental and physical health,”—

the right hon. Member for Orkney and Shetland referred to that earlier—

“especially for more vulnerable populations. In addition, making our homes more sustainable and easier to heat”—

as the hon. Member for Shipley (Anna Dixon) said—

“will help fight climate change”.

The issue of climate change cannot be ignored either. It is all part of the strategy that the Government try to bring together, and it will lead to a more just transition. We all have aspirations, my goodness, but along with them we need factual, actual, physical help to make them happen.

The hon. Member for Winchester (Dr Chambers) referred to attendance allowance forms. I was on the election trail back in July and knocking on doors, as I do. I am of a certain age now, so I resonated with the pensioners, and I recognise that we can do things to help. During my time on the doors, I managed to get slightly over 80 of those applications filled in. They take an hour and a bit to do, and it took us quite some time to get them cleared up, but it helps those who have had their winter fuel allowance removed. If they are pensioners, have disabilities and are on medication, it is quite possible, as the hon. Member for Winchester said, that they will qualify for that attendance allowance. That is just a thought, but we should have a more positive reaction from Government to address those things and let people know their rights.

The fact is that words on paper have no impact on the pensioner who did not know that they could have saved more of their pension to get their oil this year, but they expected to have help with the winter fuel allowance that they relied on. I know that that is not the Minister’s responsibility—it is for the DWP—but I believe there is an onus on Government to introduce that option to as many pensioners as will qualify. The pensioners who I know had no time to prepare and save their pennies, and the outcome will be an uplift in cold-related illness and perhaps even cold-related death.

I will conclude, as I realise that I have gone on a wee bit longer than I thought. I seriously urge Government to do the right thing, even at this stage, and to reinstate this much-needed help for pensioners in the country. We discuss fuel poverty in this place, and yet Government then take help for warmth from them. I do not know about anyone else, but that certainly leaves me a lot colder and a lot poorer in spirit.

--- Later in debate ---

[Michael Shanks]

I am always willing to take help from any Member. If the hon. Gentleman can take some of this work off my plate, I will be very happy to work with him. Of course, we will first have to work out the answer to the question of where God comes from, but if we can settle on the fact that it is self-evidently Rutherglen in the central belt, I will be happy to work with the hon. Gentleman. That spoils the joke I was going to make about his comparison of temperatures, which is that seeing him wear a very woolly jumper this morning in London made me wonder what he wears in Skye, but that is for another debate.

Genuinely, though, we want to have an open and collaborative approach, and we want to make this work. The consultation that the previous Government carried out and the feedback we have from a number of partners show that there are really good examples of community benefits working well, along with a lot of examples where they are not working well. If we could build on that approach together, I would very much appreciate it.

While we are discussing the hon. Gentleman, he made a very good point about remembering the different types of fuel that households use, and the real issue for off-grid homes—particularly in the north of Scotland, but right across the UK. Again, fuel poverty is devolved, so some of those questions are for the Scottish Government to answer—I know that the questions will be put to them—but we are aware that in England, for which the Department for Energy Security and Net Zero is responsible, 12% of rural households are in fuel poverty, and those are the ones with the largest fuel poverty gap. Tackling those particular challenges in the rural context is therefore really important.

[Jim Shannon]

rose—

[Michael Shanks]

Ah! I was just going to refer to the hon. Member.

[Jim Shannon]

I am very much listening to the Minister, who was perhaps about to tell us what will happen in Northern Ireland, where 62% of households are dependent on oil. In comparison, the proportion for England—I say this gracefully, Sir Roger—is only 4%. The greater emphasis on Northern Ireland will therefore fall upon us. The Minister says that this is a devolved matter and that money has been set aside by Labour to help, but the differential is massive and cannot be ignored.

[Michael Shanks]

The hon. Gentleman, as always, makes a very good point, although I noticed that he called the shadow Minister his friend but not me. But, over time, I think we will build on that and—