Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Gillian Keegan and Kate Green

Monday 6th September 2021 Commons Chamber

[Gillian Keegan]

My hon. Friend makes a good point. Awareness is often one of the challenges of Government and it is why careers are a key pillar of our Skills and Post-16 Education Bill. We are investing over £100 million in financial year 2021-22 to help young people and adults get high-quality careers provision. This includes funding for the Careers & Enterprise Company to roll out its enterprise adviser network, on which there has been excellent feedback with more than 94% reporting that they are happy with it. Schools, colleges and businesses will be working ever more together; over 3,000 business professionals are already working as enterprise advisers, but I urge any businesses that have not yet signed up to get involved. If they want to build their talent pipeline, that is the place to start. I also urge all Members to encourage businesses to get involved.

[Kate Green (Stretford and Urmston) (Lab)]

Literacy and numeracy, digital and life skills are essential for young people to succeed at work, but progress on closing the attainment gap has stalled—indeed, it has gone into reverse—so will the Minister say exactly what steps the Government are taking to ensure that all children reach their full potential?

[Gillian Keegan]

Obviously it is vital. There has been much disruption during the pandemic. The first thing is to ensure that all children are back in school and able to stay in school and enjoy all their lessons. All of us will have been to schools and seen the joy in children as they go back to where they belong.

In addition, as the Minister for School Standards has made clear, up until the pandemic the attainment gap was closing; it had narrowed by 13% at the age of 11, and by 9% at the age of 16. Of course, the pandemic has had implications. That is why we have put forward a considerable long-term plan to help recovery in our schools, and every school will be working on that in the next year or two, but we are always focused on the most disadvantaged children and on making sure that we narrow that attainment gap after the terrible record of the last Labour Government.

[Kate Green]

But today’s Institute for Fiscal Studies report shows that two in five children did not even get minimum learning time during covid school closures, half a million left school this summer having received no catch-up support whatsoever, and the Government are funding just 10% of what Sir Kevan Collins says is needed for recovery. Will the Government finally adopt Labour’s children’s recovery plan? When we say we will invest in the skills young people and employers need, we really mean it.

[Gillian Keegan]

We set minimum requirements for all schools for what was required in terms of lessons, and of course we provided extra support, with BBC Bitesize, the Oak National Academy, additional devices—all the support we could. Clearly, it took a bit of time, because we were responding to a pandemic. However, it is clear that under the education recovery fund, which will remain under review, we have millions and millions of student tuition hours still to be taken. Many students are signing up for it; many of them will be receiving that additional support right now in classrooms. However, this is not a short-term solution; there will be longer-term answers.

Draft Apprenticeships (Alternative English Completion Conditions and Miscellaneous Provisions) (Amendment) (Coronavirus) Regulations 2020

Debate between Gillian Keegan and Kate Green

Wednesday 30th September 2020 General Committees

[Gillian Keegan]

I thank the hon. Member for Stretford and Urmston for her comments. I also thank my hon. Friend the Member for Stoke-on-Trent North, who is as passionate as I am about apprenticeships. They are a brilliant way for young people to get the skills that are relevant to the workplace.

Those 570 apprentices in Stoke-on-Trent have made a good decision and we will be there to make sure that it pays off for them. The increasing focus on small and medium-sized companies is vital, because areas such as Stoke have a lot of employers in that bracket, which is why we need to make sure that the apprenticeship system works well for them and for all young people in Stoke-on-Trent so they get that opportunity.

In relation to my hon. Friend’s comments on kickstart and the apprenticeship scheme, they are designed to work together. We expect young people who benefit from kickstart to be taken on and employed full time or to go into the apprenticeship system, learn new skills and progress in the workplace.

[Kate Green]

I, too, was interested in what the hon. Member for Stoke-on-Trent North said about the kickstart scheme, because obviously, ideally, there would be a continuum from kickstart to apprenticeship. Will the Minister commit to publishing indications of the journeys that those who begin on kickstart make so that we can see if they do indeed transition into apprenticeships? There is a real concern that the financial incentive for some employers is simply to do the kickstart element at the expense of offering a much richer and more valuable career through an apprenticeship. Obviously that would be of concern to the Minister, as it is to us.

[Gillian Keegan]

I know that there has been a question about the eligibility for kickstart and apprenticeships and how those two schemes work together, but they do work together because they have different eligibility criteria. For example, to take part in the kickstart scheme, someone would usually be unemployed already and receiving universal credit, as well as meeting other criteria.

It is important to make sure that those opportunities work well together, which is why we are very much focused on the quality of apprenticeships as well. We look at and publish the destination data, certainly for apprenticeships. The kickstart scheme is run by the Department for Work and Pensions, but I am sure that it will look at destination data, because it is a huge investment and it is important that we get it right.

I thank Committee members for their contributions to the debate. I am delighted that apprenticeships seem to be hugely popular. People are focused on understanding how we can improve them, how we can improve the system, how we can create more of them and how we can make sure that every young person is aware of them, because we know that some young people do not hear about those fantastic opportunities to train and have career-led study until it is too late.

The hon. Member for Stretford and Urmston asked about the length of time that this process has taken. Obviously, the initial focus was on making sure that every apprentice could move their training online. That was really the first focus, because during the lockdown—the first phase of this pandemic—nobody was able to go anywhere, and we did not know how long that lockdown was going to last. So, the initial focus was on making sure that the furlough scheme applied to apprentices, and that they could continue their training and access it at home.

The redundancy support package that we already had was for those apprentices who had less than six months of their apprenticeships to go. During that period of the lockdown, very few apprentices were made redundant, because obviously the furlough scheme was in place, it was very generous and it provided ongoing support. However, the hon. Lady mentioned the British Airways worker. I actually spoke to British Airways about some of their apprentices and some of the apprenticeship changes that they were making, because clearly the business has been absolutely devastated by coronavirus; there is no getting away from that for airports and airlines.

The British Airways scheme really depends on the length of the apprenticeship. Most of the BA apprenticeships were for less than two years; in fact, a lot of them lasted for only one year or less. So, if apprentices still had six months of their apprenticeship to go, they could continue to the end-point assessment. And I believe that BA also decided to transfer some of the apprentices into their cabin crew, to make them full-time, and to bring that scheme forward as well.

The end-point assessment is the most important thing for people on the apprenticeship scheme, so that they can demonstrate the skills, knowledge and behaviour that they have learned, and those skills are transferable, so these apprenticeships still have currency. It is important that we get that balance right.

As for how the service—the job-sharing service—will work, the first aspect is making sure that we write to all employers, ensuring that they know it is available and encouraging them to bring forward any vacancies they have. The next step is to ensure that we also look after the apprentices. So, we are in contact with apprentices. If they make it known that they are redundant, we offer the service to them and we will also keep in contact with them later to check on how they are doing and to find out whether they have got a job. I believe I am right in saying that the service is run by the National Careers Service, and there has been more investment in the National Careers Service overall to ensure that it has the capacity to deal with this.[Official Report, 7 October 2020, Vol. 681 c. 8MC.]

The hon. Lady mentioned Hannah and, yes, I very much enjoyed speaking to Hannah on “Any Questions?” I will just relate this legislation to Hannah’s case. She was at the end of a three-year gas engineering apprenticeship. If she had been, say, two years and three months into that apprenticeship, this legislation would have made the difference for her. Without it and before it, Hannah could have done two years and three months of her apprenticeship and then, although she would have a partial completion record, she would not have been able to complete the apprenticeship. This measure would allow her to complete.

Regarding the end-point assessments, the vast majority of them happened, whether remotely or in some other way. The institute—the Institute for Apprenticeships and Technical Education—and the awarding organisations went through every single apprenticeship standard, and as many end-point assessments as possible took place.

However, there were some apprentices who could not complete their end-point assessments, as I explained to Hannah. She asked why a predicted grade could not be used for her apprenticeship. However, there are certain professions, such as being a gas engineer, where we absolutely need to check the competency of somebody to practise. The end-point assessment is a licence to practise, including dealing with some very dangerous substances and materials, and there are a number of apprenticeships that fit into that category. With those, we regretfully had to delay the end-point assessment because it had to be done in person.

Now that colleges are back and now that independent training providers are back, the hon. Lady is right that it is perfectly viable for those end-point assessments to be made and they are now taking place. We have a team of people in the Department who are in touch with Hannah and her training provider, to make sure that she will get her end-point assessment.

The other thing I would say is that Hannah will be a qualified gas engineer quite soon and there is a great demand for them. The hon. Lady talked about skill shortages and there is a great demand for qualified gas engineers. I believe that somebody phoned into the programme to offer her a job; it was not near where she lives, but that still shows the demand for her skills. So, I am very confident that she will have a lot to offer the workplace. Nevertheless, we really need to ensure that, where someone will be operating dangerous equipment or using other things that can endanger themselves or someone else if they do not have the required competency levels, we do not take any risks with that.

As for skills shortages, we ought to remember that before coronavirus we had 3.8% unemployment in this country and massive skills shortages. In my first six weeks as the Minister with responsibility for apprenticeships and skills, I spent all my time talking to various sectors about the tens of thousands—even hundreds of thousands—of vacancies in their particular sector. That is why yesterday’s announcement was so important, with respect to how we help people affected by coronavirus, where their sector has been badly hit and may take longer to recover—or may, indeed, not recover to the full extent—into areas where there are massive skills shortages. That will still go on.

The hon. Lady mentioned setting up a skills shortage taskforce. We have many initiatives to focus on skills shortages and on trying to match people at risk of redundancy, or who are made redundant, with the relevant areas and with the right training, whether through the apprenticeship system, online, through a full-time course or even, now, a boot camp—or via any of the other schemes that we have put in place.

Those initiatives are run with the mayoral combined authorities, local enterprise partnerships, local authority groups and employer groups. We have them in construction, the creative industries, engineering, shipbuilding and green jobs, to name just a few.