Oral Answers to Questions

Gerald Jones Excerpts

Thursday 2nd May 2024 Commons Chamber

[Kemi Badenoch]

The Department has declared this year the year of the SME. People often hear news that sounds as though it is just about big business, but SMEs employ most of the people in the UK. We have a network of 160 international trade advisers and our export support services. We have also put in place schemes such as a Help to Grow management course, which 5,290 participants had completed by November. We also have a business support service, which provides support to about 30,000 people in England every year.

[Gerald Jones (Merthyr Tydfil and Rhymney) (Lab)]

Further to those comments about SMEs, in the light of the termination of the trade show access programme, which supported SMEs in gaining international market exposure, what is the Government’s strategy to provide equivalent or enhanced support to ensure UK food products remain competitive within EU markets?

[Kemi Badenoch]

We know that a lot of people are disappointed that we closed the trade show programme, but it was a pilot programme and it did not yield the business successes that we had hoped. We are investing in those things that are providing success and demonstrating real benefits. The UK Export Academy is one of them, along with the export support service, as I mentioned, and the international trade advisers. Many of them will have expertise in food and drink. If the hon. Gentleman writes to us with a specific case, we will be happy to help.

Oral Answers to Questions

Gerald Jones Excerpts

Thursday 7th March 2024 Commons Chamber

The Secretary of State was asked—

[Gerald Jones (Merthyr Tydfil and Rhymney) (Lab)]

1. What steps she is taking to support small and medium-sized businesses to export.

[Feryal Clark (Enfield North) (Lab)]

6. What steps she is taking to support small and medium-sized businesses to export.

[The Minister for Industry and Economic Security (Ms Nusrat Ghani)]

My Department continues to help small and medium-sized enterprises to grow overseas and export to the world, especially this year—the year of the SME. Businesses can access a digital self-serve offer and a wide network of support, including trade advisers, export champions, the UK Export Academy, our international markets network and UK Export Finance. Last year, UK Export Finance provided £6.5 billion to exporters of all sizes, with SMEs comprising a record 84% of those supported directly with a product.

[Gerald Jones]

SMEs in Merthyr Tydfil and Rhymney tell me of their frustrations around exporting goods and now the Government have scrapped the trade show programme, which was set up to support British businesses to attend events and win overseas orders. Will the Minister tell the House and the thousands of businesses that rely on that vital support when there will be a replacement?

[Ms Ghani]

UK exports are increasing. Using current prices, they are up by £21 billion compared with 2023. The UK trade show was a pilot programme that did not yield the successes we thought it would, so we have other schemes in place, including the UK Export Academy, international trade advisers, Help to Grow and the export support service. Focusing on Wales, we will soon be appointing a new international trade adviser to help SMEs.

Financial Risk Checks for Gambling

Gerald Jones Excerpts

Monday 26th February 2024 Westminster Hall

[Carolyn Harris (Swansea East) (Lab)]

It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Sir Edward. I congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Neath (Christina Rees) on leading this petition debate.

It is an honour to speak about a topic that I am truly passionate about: reducing gambling harm and protecting the most vulnerable. According to the Gambling Commission, 22.5 million people in this country gamble, which equates to about 44% of the adult population. The overwhelming majority do so without any issue, but not everyone. When it comes to those for whom gambling is an addiction, the Gambling Commission and the Government have a duty to act responsibly and protect them from harm. The publication of the long overdue gambling White Paper last April was therefore widely welcomed by the all-party parliamentary group on gambling related harm, which I chair, as well as by a growing community of organisations, charities, academics and clinicians, all intent on reducing gambling harm, protecting the vulnerable and saving lives.

While concerns remain about the consultation times on the proposals in the White Paper and how long it will subsequently take us to get where we need to be, what is important today is that we lay out why the changes are so critical—specifically, the positive impact that affordability checks will have in reducing harm and saving lives.

In its patterns of play research, the Gambling Commission identified that the most profitable 1% of accounts make up 70.4% of the gross gambling yield, echoing previous research from the University of Liverpool. The gambling industry relies on a hugely disproportionate percentage of its profits coming from those affected by gambling addiction, who are subsequently harmed by unaffordable losses.

Historically, the industry has recognised the need for responsible gambling and ensuring that customers spend within their means. In 2018—that seems a life-time ago—the Senet Group, the industry standards body that was later absorbed into the Betting and Gaming Council, set out three steps that responsible gamblers should adhere to: only gamble what you can afford, set limits and do not chase losses. Suggesting that someone gripped by addiction would be able to make rational decisions on what is affordable is naive. Nobody would even contemplate that for any other addiction. The logical way forward would be to proactively introduce affordability checks on anyone gambling larger sums.

[Gerald Jones (Merthyr Tydfil and Rhymney) (Lab)]

I thank my hon. Friend for giving way and congratulate her on the work that she does on this matter. Does she agree that primarily the focus should be on protecting the most vulnerable people in our communities? It is not about being anti-gambling per se. The industry has failed to act, which is why measures are needed to protect the most vulnerable in our communities. It is a small price to pay to protect those people.

[Carolyn Harris]

I totally agree. Anti-gambling is one thing that I am not. I am very fond of visiting the racetrack, as I am the bingo hall. My motive does not come from being anti-gambling. I want to protect vulnerable people.

The logical way forward would be to protect and proactively introduce affordability checks on anyone gambling larger sums. Those would not stop anyone who can afford it betting as much as they choose, but it would stop those who cannot. After carefully considering the evidence, the Government included a consultation on two forms of affordability checks in their proposals in the White Paper. The first would consist of background checks on those spending moderate levels, which would look at financial vulnerability. The proposed limits for the checks to be triggered would be a net loss of £125 within a month or £500 within a year.

The second would be a more enhanced check for those regularly spending higher levels, which might indicate a binge gambling problem. The proposed thresholds for them would be a £1,000 net loss within 24 hours and £2,000 within 90 days—halved for those aged between 18 and 24, given that that group has already been identified as being at greater risk of harm.

Although many have jumped to condemn the checks, it is important to be clear about who would be impacted by them. Recent research conducted by Dr Philip Newall from the University of Bristol and Dr David Zendle from the University of York using open banking data found that the unharmed gamblers have an average monthly spend of £16.41, compared with £208.91 for the highest risk group. That suggests that risk-free gamblers would very rarely trigger any affordability checks. If anything, the figures highlight the fact that the proposed thresholds are far too high and could be set at a lower level. To be clear, the initial background checks of financial vulnerability would be frictionless, using publicly available information such as credit reference data alongside negative indicators such as county court judgments and insolvency checks. The enhanced checks would initially use open banking, with more intrusive checks only being triggered further down the line.

It must also be put into perspective that the enhanced checks would be narrowly targeted to around 3% of the online gambling accounts affected. I can say at this point that it is the online accounts that are key. Online is where the most harm is taking place. It is where people—incredibly vulnerable people—can spend money they just do not have, with no intervention, with no contact with anyone that might notice a problem, and, until last week’s announcement, without limits. Online is causing harm at rates far in excess of any land-based venue, and it is important that we keep that in mind. The APPG’s focus has always been on that, and we have continually called for the likes of horseracing tracks and bingo halls to be considered separately in legislation.

For the 3% of affected online gambling accounts, the vast majority of checks would be frictionless. The Gambling Commission has already advocated for the focus of checks to be on publicly available data. Research suggests that only 0.3% of account holders would be subject to the level of checks that would require them to hand over any additional financial information. However, it seems that the smaller number of enhanced checks that would require consent on the part of the individual are being used as a scaremongering tactic to turn the debate on affordability into a controversial topic. Given that those checks have such a minimal impact, it is difficult to see why they have been contested so vehemently.

We know that the industry has stirred up the controversy by exaggerating the levels of intrusion and suggesting that the checks would drive gamblers to the black market. That loses sight of the whole point of the checks, which is to protect gamblers from harm by ensuring that they are spending within their means. Surely that is in the interest of the industry, which currently has a reputation for allowing those unable to control their gambling to gamble far in excess of what they can afford to spend.

Post Office Governance and Horizon Compensation Schemes

Gerald Jones Excerpts

Monday 19th February 2024 Commons Chamber

[Kemi Badenoch]

The hon. Gentleman will know that Stormont is now up and running, and that we will be having conversations with devolved Governments on the best way to resolve this. We do not have an answer now, but we are aware of the issue and are working on it.

[Gerald Jones (Merthyr Tydfil and Rhymney) (Lab)]

The reports on the weekend were extremely alarming, given how sub-postmasters have been treated in recent years. On the obvious question, can the Secretary of State give any assurance or guarantee that the compensation will be paid and taken forward before the general election is called? That surely is what sub-postmasters would ask for, and it is the least that they deserve.

[Kemi Badenoch]

That is absolutely the right thing to do. I thank the hon. Gentleman for his question, because it gives me another opportunity to restate that the very idea that compensation would be delayed until after the election is complete nonsense. It does not even make political sense. We want to ensure that people get their money as quickly as possible.

Post Office Services: Isolated Communities

Gerald Jones Excerpts

Thursday 8th February 2024 Commons Chamber

[Andrew Western]

The hon. Gentleman is absolutely correct and, in fairness, there is a Government grant to support the subsidisation of post office services in isolated and rural communities. There is, however, a question of whether that grant is sufficient or, indeed, whether it is reaching the right places.

For the people of Partington, their nearest post office is now several miles away, and the lengthy round trip for those without transport is prohibitively expensive for many local residents. People in Partington are now in the 1% of post office customers whose nearest branch is more than 3 miles away.

[Gerald Jones (Merthyr Tydfil and Rhymney) (Lab)]

It is clear that the Post Office’s treatment of isolated communities is increasingly poor, and two post offices in my constituency, in Treharris and Deri, have closed, with Pantyscallog in Merthyr Tydfil closing temporarily next week. Without a full consultation, we know that closures are usually permanent. Does my hon. Friend agree that, in terms of access for geographically isolated communities in which transport is poor and in which people have mobility issues or are elderly, not having a post office within 3 miles is placing services out of reach?

[Andrew Western]

I absolutely agree with my hon. Friend.

Partington’s nearest recommended post office site, as advised by the Post Office, is 3.9 miles away. Although that is a significant distance in and of itself, the post office is within a local Co-op store. Residents are unable to access the full range of services at that location, and to do so they have to travel even further into Urmston town centre. Having these services in local communities is incredibly important, and my hon. Friend is right to highlight that, once they are gone, they often do not return.

Like my hon. Friend’s constituency, there is not only one recent example of a post office closure in my constituency. The Woodsend Road post office has also been closed since last summer, and the loss of two local post office branches within a few months—like my hon. Friend’s example of three closures in his constituency—gives an insight into the scale of the challenge nationally. We know that many branches, particularly those in isolated communities, are struggling.

As well as losing access to vital banking and postal services, people in Partington and Woodsend Road have lost something else—an important community hub. I know the Minister recognises that the value of post offices goes beyond the provision of mere services; they can contribute to tackling loneliness, they can prevent older or more vulnerable people from becoming digitally excluded, and close and trusting relationships are built between staff and customers. Indeed, research from the Post Office shows that three in four people who use branch services list face-to-face interaction as their main reason for choosing to do so.

In preparation for this debate, I reached out to residents in Partington and around Woodsend Road asking them to contact my office to share the impact that the closure of their post office has had on them. I am grateful to everyone who did, and I will share a snapshot of their experiences.

One resident, aged 77, told my team that conversations with post office staff were the only human interaction he had. If losing this was not bad enough, the gentleman in question had to start relying on Partington’s one ATM to access cash. He was recently mugged just after using the machine, because criminals know that vulnerable people have no other place to go in Partington to withdraw cash. He is now understandably scared to use the ATM again, and he instead has to rely on a friend to drive him to the closest post office, several miles away.

Another resident, aged 89, described the loss of the post office as “devastating” to her independence. She explained how in the past she used to walk to her local branch, but now her family must travel from Oldham, in the north of Greater Manchester, to drive her all the way to the Sale post office for her to access the services she needs. Her family’s journey will take upwards of two and a half hours to complete, on a good day. Another constituent is now spending £20 a week on taxis to go to her nearest post office, following the closure of her local branch on Woodsend Road.

This is unacceptable, not least because often those most affected are pensioners and are therefore necessarily on fixed incomes. I have written to the Post Office about both branch closures in my constituency on multiple occasions to try to find a resolution. At both branches, the Post Office could have been better prepared in terms of recruiting a new postmaster to run the branch and providing some sort of alternative provision in the short term. The postmistress in Partington gave the Post Office three years’ notice of her impending retirement, yet we find ourselves in this unacceptable situation. I am still awaiting news on whether a mobile or drop and collect service could be put in place as a temporary measure to provide residents with access to post office services while a longer-term solution is sought. I had to request that, as, seemingly, it had not been proactively considered by the Post Office.

I understand from the Post Office that recruiting new postmasters can be challenging. That reflects a wider challenge nationally about the viability of branches in isolated communities and the remuneration of the people running them. That brings me on to the issue of the support that post offices need. Like any other retailer, post office branches are facing the challenge of declining footfall, as more and more people go online for services. That makes the host shops from which post offices often operate less commercially viable. We should also reflect on the provision of Government services through post offices, which have declined by more than 75% since 2010 and today make up only 4% of their overall revenue. In March 2024, the Government are set to withdraw their Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency services from post offices.

We also need to look at the relationship between banks and post offices. With high street banks, including those in Partington, closing en masse in recent years, post offices have increasingly had to step in to provide banking services in communities. The 5,500 bank closures since 2015 have saved those banks about £2.5 billion to £3 billion a year. There is a strong case, which the Minister has articulated previously, for some of that money to be redirected to support the post office network. I would be grateful if he could update us as to whether any progress has been made in talking to the banks about their potentially providing some revenue to support post office services. One of my local post offices, in Stretford, hosts pop-up banks regularly and that town centre also is to lose one of its banks in the near future.

Last but by no means least, we face the big issue that the cost of sustaining the loss-making post office network is significantly greater than the £50 million in annual network subsidy that the Post Office receives from the Government, as I highlighted earlier in my response to the hon. Member for Strangford (Jim Shannon). As the Post Office itself has said, the pressures on branches in isolated communities have increased, but the subsidy the Government have in place to support them has not reflected that. I understand that it has declined over the past decade, from £210 million in 2012 to £50 million per year in recent years. Will the Minister assure me that the £50 million subsidy and/or other forms of financial support is available to provide post office services in places such as Partington, which, although not rural, are certainly isolated? I understand that if the money has been reduced, there is less to go around, but it would be reassuring to know that somewhere such as that would be eligible. The previous postmistress was not accessing this grant in order to run her post office, but the difficulties in attracting a new postmaster to run the service suggest that it may be something that should be considered in the future. I would be incredibly grateful for the Minister’s support in working with the Post Office to try to establish that, and in looking at any ways in which we can restore post office services on Woodsend Road and, in particular, in Partington.

To conclude, I hope I have highlighted the importance of post offices to isolated communities, particularly those such as Partington, as well as those mentioned by my hon. Friend the Member for Merthyr Tydfil and Rhymney and the hon. Member for Strangford. When residents lose these services, the impact can be devastating as they often support incredibly vulnerable customers. I again thank everybody affected by the post office closures in Partington and Woodsend Road who took the time to contact me and share their stories. I am pleased the Minister has had the chance to hear them today. I hope they help him to push for the changes needed to support our post office network moving forward and ensure those services are retained in isolated communities.

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Business and Trade (Kevin Hollinrake)]

I congratulate the hon. Member for Stretford and Urmston (Andrew Western) on securing this important debate on a subject close to my heart, as the representative of the rural seat of Thirsk and Malton.

We all know how highly our communities value post offices, and our constituents have deep concern whenever they are closed, even temporarily. They value them because of the services they provide but also, as the hon. Gentleman puts it, because they are the provider of trusted relationships—I could not agree more. The post office network is still significant, with over 11,500 branches across the country. Recent research by the London School of Economics highlighted that the network makes a valuable contribution to the economic health of our high streets, generating £3.1 billion of additional spending every year. It is understandable that the hon. Gentleman wants to debate the issue, given that his constituency has seen changes in its provision of post offices in recent months and years.

The Post Office has the commercial freedom to deliver the branch network within the parameters set for it by Government. Those parameters include minimum access criteria and minimum services to be provided at branches across the country. For example, 99% of the population must live within three miles of their nearest branch and 95% of the total urban population must live within one mile of their nearest outlet, which relates to the hon. Gentleman’s constituency because it is in an urban area. Despite all the challenges faced by retailers in recent years, it is pleasing that the Post Office meets and exceeds those criteria at a national level. In fact, more post offices have opened this year than have closed and the network is as large today as it has been for five years, with around 11,700 branches open.

As the hon. Gentleman will know, 12 branches are operating in in Stretford and Urmston, serving around 13,000 customers each week. The post office network in the area supports around 60 full-time equivalent jobs and has an economic contribution to his constituency of over £6 million each year, as well as driving an additional wider high street spend of £5 million a year.

I am aware of the hon. Gentleman’s concerns about the situation in Partington, where I understand the post office branch closed last year when the postmistress retired after an incredible 35 years serving her community. From my own constituency experience, I fully appreciate the impact a branch closure can have on a community. It can be disruptive, particularly for communities without nearby alternatives, but that fluctuation is part of the modern, dynamic, franchise-led business that the Post Office primarily is. The network is made up of small businesses and, just like any other franchise-based business, the Post Office cannot control a franchise’s decisions about their future. As postmasters move on, branches close and new ones open, as the hon. Gentleman has experienced at first hand, with the opening of Stretford post office in its new permanent location late last year.

The reasons for a temporary branch closure are generally outside the control of the Post Office. However, in such instances, the Post Office ensures services are maintained as quickly as it can. I understand from the Post Office that there is interest from a community group in taking on the Partington branch, with a further meeting scheduled next week, so I am hopeful that the branch can be reopened as soon as possible. I note the hon. Gentleman’s point about the provision of a mobile service, and I am happy to take that away and update him. It is not easy to secure, as I have experienced myself, but we will do whatever we can.

We are not blind to the realities of taking on and running a post office. Like any other retailer, post offices face pressures from continually evolving consumer behaviours, particularly as consumers shop online more, driving footfall away from our high street. When it comes to consumer habits and accessing Government services, it is not our place to dictate to people where they should access those services—I think that we often like to access those services online. None the less, we are keen to retain what services we can. The hon. Gentleman did point to the DVLA contract, which has been extended for another year. I think that everyone would like to see that contract extended on a longer-term basis, but negotiations will have to continue.

Changes in consumer behaviour are significantly driving down the number of letters being sent, which is also having an impact on post offices. Nevertheless, there are reasons to be optimistic. We were pleased to see the Post Office launch its Parcels Online business last year, whereby customers can select and pay for Evri and DPD products online before dropping parcels off at their nearest post office. The Post Office is now also rolling out a similar proposition across the physical network, which means that customers can compare different carriers to choose the option that best suits their needs. We see this as a significant opportunity to improve competitiveness and competition in the market, and I am keen that the Post Office expand that proposal further to include more carriers.

There is also a major opportunity, as the hon. Gentleman puts it, in banking services. All customers should have appropriate access to banking and cash services wherever they live. That is why we have legislated to protect access to cash to ensure that customers can continue to access everyday banking services at the post office. This development is important for the hon. Gentleman’s constituency as, for example, around 50% of bank branches in Stretford and Urmston have closed since 2015, so post offices are key in providing access to cash in the constituency, as they are across the country.

In December, £3.3 billion in cash was either deposited or withdrawn across the country. The post office network is therefore a crucial component of this country’s long-term provision of cash and banking services. And that is why I have been clear that the Post Office should be ambitious in its negotiations with the banks for the next iteration of the banking framework agreement, which already provides significant revenue into the post office network. We welcome that, but there are further opportunities. The hon. Gentleman may want to speak to the Economic Secretary to the Treasury about other services, such as banking hubs. As I said earlier, there are 30 hubs around the country already and 70 more in the pipeline, but our aspiration is to get 500, and it may be suitable to provide a hub in his constituency.

[Gerald Jones]

I thank the Minister for giving way. I fully accept that there are challenges. For example, many of the people working in our post offices have done so for many years and when they come to retirement, it really is a challenge to get people to take on those businesses. The communities that we have described this afternoon—geographically isolated communities and communities with public transport issues—tend have many older people who often use cash in their transactions. Banking hubs are great in larger towns perhaps, but things are much more difficult in smaller, isolated communities. What other options can be considered so that those communities do not become financial deserts?

[Kevin Hollinrake]

The hon. Gentleman raises an important point. Banking hubs are not a one-size-fits-all solution. There are other solutions, some of which are facilitated by the banking framework. Enhanced facilities in post offices is one such solution—for example, a separate line in the post office. Smart ATMs are part of the solution. OneBanx provides a mini-banking solution that can be provided in libraries, for example. Different financial organisations, such as some of the building societies, are rolling out such provisions, but we see banking services, and the remuneration that flows from them, as critical to ensuring that we have a sustainable network of post offices. I have always been clear in this House that if Members have particular local issues, I am happy to work with them and the Post Office to try to deliver solutions on a case-by-case basis.

Although there are opportunities, that does not mean we are out of the woods. Branch profitability is a top priority for postmasters, and I am keen to ensure that it can be enhanced wherever possible. I assure Members that we remain steadfast in our support for the network. We have provided significant financial support to sustain the nationwide network—over £2.5 billion in funding in the past decade alone—and we are providing a further £588 million for the Post Office between 2022 and 2025. The moneys include investment and, as the hon. Member for Stretford and Urmston referred to, an annual network subsidy of £50 million, which helps to safeguard services in the uncommercial parts of the network.

The Government have been clear that post offices should be a valuable social and economic asset for communities and businesses for years to come. We continue to work with the Post Office to ensure that the organisation and the network are fit for the future, and we always welcome views on the network, such as those expressed today. I thank the hon. Member for Stretford and Urmston for introducing this important debate, and the other hon. Members who contributed to it.

Question put and agreed to.

Post Office (Horizon System) Compensation Bill

Gerald Jones Excerpts

2nd reading
Tuesday 19th December 2023 Commons Chamber

[Gerald Jones (Merthyr Tydfil and Rhymney) (Lab)]

Thank you, Mr Deputy Speaker. I rise to make a brief contribution. As we know, the Post Office Horizon scandal is one of the most insidious injustices our country has ever seen. The Post Office was one of Britain’s most well-known and trusted brands, but the sheer scale of false prosecutions and the aggressive way in which they were pursued has destroyed its reputation. But more than that, it destroyed the reputations, lives and livelihoods of former sub-postmasters who had been upstanding members of their local communities. Post Office managers decided to aggressively pursue prosecutions against sub-postmasters even when they knew that the Horizon system had deep-rooted faults. The Post Office compounded that by telling individual sub-postmasters that they were the only ones experiencing problems. That was clearly not the case. Quite simply, those cold, calculated decisions ruined lives, including those of some of my constituents in Merthyr Tydfil and Rhymney. I have learned from them, over a number of years, about the impact on their lives, livelihoods, mental health and wellbeing. The fact that the Post Office was able to mount prosecutions in such a cavalier way is simply shocking.

Today, we are talking about compensation for former sub-postmasters. Members from across the House are clear that the compensation is for wrongful and malicious prosecution, and that getting compensation to all victims as quickly as possible is vital if we are to right the wrongs of that injustice. As the shadow Minister said, Labour will work with the Government to do whatever is required to deliver justice, and I will support the Bill.

However, the Government originally committed to resolving all compensation cases by Christmas. It appears that that has not happened, so will the Minister explain why that target was missed and how the extra time provided in the Bill will help to deliver justice to everyone as quickly as possible? As we all know, it simply cannot come soon enough.

Menopause

Gerald Jones Excerpts

Thursday 26th October 2023 Commons Chamber

[Gerald Jones (Merthyr Tydfil and Rhymney) (Lab)]

I thank my hon. Friend the Member for Swansea East (Carolyn Harris) for securing this important debate during World Menopause Awareness Month, and my hon. Friend the Member for Bootle (Peter Dowd) for his powerful opening speech.

When I first came to this place, I never imagined that I would be standing here talking about menopause, but I am delighted to say that tomorrow in my constituency of Merthyr Tydfil and Rhymney we are hosting a menopause in the workplace workshop. This is the third event of its kind in south Wales, following on from others in Swansea and Cardiff, and I am thrilled that I am able to help local businesses in our community to better understand what they can do to support the people who work for them.

As my hon. Friend the Member for Bootle mentioned, in its manifesto for menopause, launched last week, the all-party parliamentary group on menopause called on all political parties to commit to supporting those experiencing the menopause in their own manifestos ahead of the next general election. One of the calls was for future Governments to mandate companies that employ more than 250 people to introduce menopause action plans—something that Labour has already said that it will commit to.

Almost half of the UK working population are women, and those over 50 are the fastest growing group in the workplace, which highlights why this issue is such a priority. We need to retain the skills and experience that those women have and support them so that they continue to thrive in their careers as they grow older, but evidence suggests that there is a lot of work to be done. With one in 10 women leaving the workforce because of their menopause symptoms, and thousands more reducing hours and avoiding promotion, it is vital that employers are given the tools to support those women and to change that.

There is no one-size-fits-all answer. Working environments differ greatly, as do women’s experiences. With more than 40 possible symptoms, from hot flushes to brain fog, and insomnia to anxiety, women will all have their own individual needs when it comes to support at work, so we need businesses to commit to putting an action plan in place that works for them and their employees. It might include flexible working hours, if women are having to travel on busy public transport; alternative uniforms that are considerate of the symptoms that women may experience; a guaranteed desk near a window that can be opened; or the introduction of support groups, menopause champions, or management training in the business.

We need a guarantee from employers that they will support staff who are experiencing symptoms to remain in work and to progress in their careers. As I mentioned, tomorrow in my constituency of Merthyr Tydfil and Rhymney we are welcoming a host of businesses to an event at Merthyr town football club, to give them guidance on what more they can do. I am delighted to do my part to help with that, and I am grateful for the support of my hon. Friend the Member for Swansea East in making it happen. The whole House will know just how powerful an advocate my hon. Friend is. I can think of no one better to be a menopause champion than her. I pay tribute to her for all the work that she has done, and continues to do, on this and many other topics.

We have come a long way in recent years, breaking down the barriers and making the menopause something that we are now all talking about. There is still lots to do in terms of raising awareness, but a start has been made. Attending a session of menopause word bingo with my hon. Friend was not something that I had thought I would do, but it helped to raise my awareness, which in turn will help me to advocate on behalf of the constituents I represent. Now we need to take the next steps to ensure that women are supported and given the help that they need in the workplace and beyond.

PANS and PANDAS

Gerald Jones Excerpts

Tuesday 12th September 2023 Westminster Hall

[Wendy Chamberlain (North East Fife) (LD)]

I beg to move,

That this House has considered PANS and PANDAS.

It is a pleasure to serve under your chairpersonship, Mr Dowd. I will refer to paediatric acute-onset neuro- psychiatric syndrome—PANS—and paediatric autoimmune neuropsychiatric disorders associated with streptococcal infections—PANDAS—as PANS/PANDAS throughout. Before I begin my speech, I welcome members of the all-party parliamentary group on PANS and PANDAS who are here and those Members who supported the Backbench Business debate application that brought us here. Most importantly, I welcome representatives from PANS PANDAS UK and medical specialists who are here to watch the debate; they will be available to meet MPs in room W3 afterwards.

I acknowledge that there may well be a significant variation in knowledge of the conditions PANS/PANDAS in the room. On the one hand, we are joined by experts and many MPs, including me, who know a little or something about the condition through our casework and campaigning, but I would not be surprised, Mr Dowd, if you did not know what we are here to discuss. The reason that that would not surprise me is because it is also the reason that we are here today: despite becoming increasingly widespread among children and young people, there is little awareness of or treatment for PANS/PANDAS. I hope that colleagues will bear with me if I briefly set out what PANS/PANDAS are.

[Gerald Jones (Merthyr Tydfil and Rhymney) (Lab)]

I congratulate the hon. Lady on securing this debate. She mentioned that awareness is crucial. A family in my constituency of Merthyr Tydfil and Rhymney has been living through what has been described as a living hell—it is a really heartbreaking story—since their daughter first had symptoms back in January. Awareness is low across the country, including in the medical profession in, and the APPG will undoubtedly help with that. I am sure that we are all rallying to raise awareness and support and get awareness out there across the country.

[Wendy Chamberlain]

A “living hell” is certainly how it has been described to me in conversations that I have had, not only because of the symptoms themselves and dealing with them, but because of the lack of support compounding that distress.

I will outline what PANS/PANDAS are. PANS is a condition in children and young people that can result from an initial mild infection such as chickenpox or covid. PANDAS is a specific sort of PANS that stems from strep. While the initial infection might be mild, in some cases it triggers a misdirected immune response and/or a brain inflammation that causes the rapid onset of severe symptoms, which can include obsessive compulsive disorder, tics, severely restricted food intake, anxiety, aggression, depression, memory deficiency, poor cognitive function and behavioural and developmental regression. These changes can and do take place literally overnight. Understandably, the impact of those symptoms on a child and their family is monumental. We do not need to be parents ourselves, although many of us here may be, to understand how utterly distressing it must be to have a formerly healthy, happy child suddenly find themselves unable to leave their bedroom, dress, eat, wash, talk to others or attend school and to see them vanish as the illness takes over. Sadly, that distress is compounded and worsened many times over by the lack of available support for patients and their families, as PANS is often not even suggested, considered or acknowledged.

Globally, PANS/PANDAS are recognised and treatment pathways have been set up. The World Health Organisation has explicitly acknowledged the conditions in its latest guidance. However, as things stand, there is neither NHS nor National Institute for Health and Care Excellence guidance on the diagnosis or treatment of PANS/PANDAS in any part of the UK. That leaves patients subject to an unfair and arbitrary lottery. All the evidence suggests that the best treatment is early diagnosis and a two-week course of antibiotics. If that window is missed, antibiotics may become less effective and other treatments are needed.

However, in the UK, without those pathways the vast majority of children are given inappropriate and ineffective treatment for their symptoms, rather than for the underlying cause. That often involves long waits for mental health treatments from child and adolescent mental health services, which I think we all know and recognise are overburdened. In a survey carried out in 2020 for PANS PANDAS UK, 95% of parents said that their GP had not suggested PANS/PANDAS as a diagnosis. Often, they can suggest no diagnosis at all; families must then research and fight for treatment themselves. The reality is that, after months of seeing their child suffer without any explanation, families end up turning to private healthcare, but that it only an option for a few. It is only at that point that a diagnosis is forthcoming.

I suspect that I am like most MPs, in that I became aware of PANS because a constituent approached me for support with her local NHS doctor. In the run-up to this debate, I had the privilege of speaking to some of the children and young people who sit on the PANS PANDAS UK youth advisory board, who shared their experiences with me. Their experiences of being diagnosed are all different, with only one exception: they were all negative. If any of them are watching today, I want to thank them for being able to talk to me about their experiences. It was really important to hear directly from them, and I thank them very much for that.

One of the children on the board talked about the fact that the doctors really did nothing for her. Every time she went to the hospital, she was made to feel like a mystery. Because the doctors did not understand what was wrong with her, it felt as if they were just going to leave it and give up. Another child told us about being sent from place to place, with no medical department taking responsibility. She went through waiting list and waiting list, with no resolution, as the symptoms continued and worsened.

It is really important to remember that the initial recommendation on diagnosis is for two weeks of antibiotics. As a parent, I find it quite difficult to understand why that is not being pursued by GPs, because it treats the initial infection if it is PANS/PANDAS. It would prevent the symptoms from deteriorating further, which might lead to someone needing more mental health support. Frankly, if it is not PANS, the antibiotics will not work and we will be able to rule that out pretty quickly.

Almost all the children I spoke to had received private treatment and given up on the NHS, but private diagnosis and treatment plans are often rejected by local GPs and health boards. One child remembers a doctor saying that he would refuse to treat an American illness. Another was refused ongoing treatment because the consultant did not believe that PANS was real. Many children have their medications stopped when their parents move back to NHS care; indeed, this is something I am supporting one of my constituents with now, with NHS Fife newly refusing to provide prescriptions for privately recommended medication. That is despite the fact that my constituent’s child has had both an NHS and private diagnosis. Imagine being a child and going through the trauma of this change in your life and condition—it is terrifying—then being told by the adults treating you that they do not believe that what you are experiencing is real or exists.

There is a lack of direction from the top. I have asked before about the implementation of the World Health Organisation guidelines that will formally acknowledge PANS/PANDAS and its treatments within our domestic health systems, and I have been told it will take some time. In the meantime, children are suffering needlessly, as are their families. We have to consider the wider impact on the siblings of children experiencing this condition.

I understand that the Minister might not want to pre-empt the independent medical process relating to the NICE guidelines, but if she would confirm her position that PANS/PANDAS is as real as having a broken leg or the flu, I really believe that that would be a significant step. I hope that that will not be a difficult ask.

Pride Month

Gerald Jones Excerpts

Thursday 15th June 2023 Commons Chamber

[Gerald Jones (Merthyr Tydfil and Rhymney) (Lab)]

I am delighted to speak in this debate to mark Pride Month. As the years pass, we could be forgiven for thinking that the need to hold an annual Pride debate could be diminishing, as we should be making huge progress. We should live in a world of equality in the truest sense of the world, and of tolerance and respect. Sadly, that is not the world in which we live in 2023.

Next year marks 30 years since I became an elected representative. I was co-opted as a community councillor in autumn 1994, and then stood for election as a county borough councillor in May 1995. I remember a feeling of elation mixed with trepidation, but as a 24-year-old gay man growing up in a tightly knit Welsh valley, I also remember the fear, as no one knew my sexuality. I remember thinking, “Would they vote for me if they knew?” At that point, I had not talked about my sexuality openly. Possibly, I was too scared to mention it, because society was very different in the ’80s and ’90s, as we have already heard. There was very little in the way of advocacy or support for LGBTQ+ people, and certainly not in geographically isolated communities in the south Wales valleys, as well as lots of other communities in all parts of the country.

We have, of course, made much progress. There is much more awareness and support available for people, particularly young people, and it is no longer a taboo subject for most people. However, I recognise, as we have heard today, that that is not the case for everyone and there is still intolerance and ignorance in society, both in this country and in many other countries around the world, as I will come back to later. But there is much to celebrate. This weekend, Wales’s biggest Pride event, Pride Cymru, takes place in Cardiff, and I wish everyone attending a very happy Pride. We all know that Pride Month is a great opportunity to reflect on the hard-won rights of the LGBT+ community.

We in the Labour party know that our movement has delivered monumental change for the LGBT+ community time and again. As anyone who has seen the amazing and inspirational film “Pride” will know, Labour’s 1985 party conference voted for a resolution committing the party to lesbian and gay rights. The move was a response to the solidarity shown by Lesbians and Gays Support the Miners during the 1984 miners’ strikes. The motion was successful in no small part because of the bloc vote of the National Union of Mineworkers, returning their solidarity.

The Labour Governments between 1997 and 2010 accelerated rights for LGBT+ people in the UK. As we have heard from my right hon. Friend the Member for Exeter (Mr Bradshaw), that included ending discrimination for gay and lesbian couples for immigration purposes, lifting the ban on lesbians, gay men and bi people serving in the armed forces, equalising the age of consent for same-sex couples, scrapping the Thatcher-era section 28 policy and introducing the UK’s first ever law to prevent discrimination of lesbians, gay men and bi people in the workplace.

The Civil Partnership Act 2004 gave same-sex couples almost identical rights as married straight couples, which was first time that the legal status of same-sex relationships was fully acknowledged in law, and the Gender Recognition Act 2004 allowed trans people to have their true gender recognised in law. In Wales, our Welsh Labour Government are committed to making Wales the most LGBTQ+ friendly nation in Europe.

As numerous and welcome as those achievements are, there is, as I highlighted earlier, clearly more that needs to be done to embed equality in our society. A good start would be the Government bringing forward the ban on conversion therapy without delay, as we have heard time and again this afternoon.

On 19 August, Merthyr Tydfil will hold its first ever Pride event. Alongside our Member of the Senedd, Dawn Bowden, I have been pleased to work with local volunteers and members of the LGBTQ+ community to set up the Merthyr Pride committee. I am incredibly grateful to organisations such as Merthyr Valleys Homes and Merthyr College for supporting the committee to plan and put on what I am sure will be a fantastic celebration of diversity, equality, and inclusivity.

Sadly, the event has already drawn predictable, hate-filled comments from a small number of online bigots, showing exactly why a Pride event is needed and why we must continue to celebrate Pride every year, with events up and down the country and across the world. As we know, the LGBTQ+ community is not a separate group, removed from our society. LGBTQ+ people are our sons, daughters, friends and colleagues. We are an integral part of our society, and Pride Month is the perfect opportunity to celebrate our achievements and renew ourselves to the work that is still needed in 2023 and beyond.

Oral Answers to Questions

Gerald Jones Excerpts

Wednesday 8th March 2023 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

My hon. Friend has raised this issue before, and he is right to do so. The Government have doubled our investment in flood defences over this Parliament, to £5.2 billion. I know that the DEFRA Secretary will talk to him and his communities on her visit, and I look forward to hearing back from her after that.

[Gerald Jones (Merthyr Tydfil and Rhymney) (Lab)]

Q11. Between 1997 and 2010, Labour Governments across the UK lifted 800,000 children out of poverty. Since 2010, the Conservatives have driven half a million children into poverty, with child poverty next year predicted to reach levels not seen since the 1990s. There is not enough parliamentary time this year for the Prime Minister to say sorry to each child damaged by the Conservatives’ policies, but will he start today by saying sorry to all the children he failed during that time?

[The Prime Minister]

The exact stats are that, since 2010, 1.2 million fewer people are in poverty, because of the actions that this Conservative Government have been putting in place, such as raising the national living wage. The best way to ensure that children, especially, do not grow up in poverty, is to ensure that they do not grow up in workless households. As a result of the actions of this Government in getting people into work, there are now several thousand fewer workless households than there were in 2010.