Oral Answers to Questions

Gemma Doyle Excerpts

Monday 23rd February 2015 Commons Chamber

[Anna Soubry]

The hon. Gentleman makes a good point and I have to say my own county council in Nottinghamshire did not understand the covenant when it came to a soldier constituent of mine coming down from Catterick who needed to have a place for his child. I reminded the county council of the covenant. That is the sort of work that local MPs can do when these cases come to us through our casework. It is about making sure we share best practice. There is masses more work to be done, and it would be nice to think I might be able to continue after 7 May, Mr Speaker, but that takes us into different territory.

[Gemma Doyle (West Dunbartonshire) (Lab/Co-op)]

The Minister of State says that other people do not get it. I am not sure that she gets it, because why else would she be consulting on removing the principle of no disadvantage from the armed forces covenant? I refer of course to the consultation she has commissioned through her officials that Woodnewton Associates is carrying out. She looks confused; I am surprised if she does not know that her own officials are carrying out this consultation. Is that because the Government are still refusing to test their own policies against the principles of no disadvantage? A Labour Government will test our policies against the armed forces covenant, and we will not drop the principle of no disadvantage, which this Government are apparently thinking about doing.

[Anna Soubry]

Of course the hon. Lady forgets that she has got to win an election, and there is every chance she will not do so. Let me make it absolutely clear: as far as I and the rest of the team here are concerned, this is news to us and we are absolutely committed to the principle of no disadvantage. [Interruption.] It is in the covenant, and chuntering from the sidelines achieves nothing.

Trident Renewal

Gemma Doyle Excerpts

Tuesday 20th January 2015 Commons Chamber

[Pete Wishart]

Let me tell the hon. Gentleman about the front page of a national newspaper in Scotland today showing that 60% of the Scottish people are now opposed to nuclear weapons. That is people in the constituency of the hon. Member for Paisley and Renfrewshire North, in my constituency, and in the constituency of the hon. Member for West Dunbartonshire (Gemma Doyle). This is now a popular movement that is beginning to gain traction.

[Gemma Doyle (West Dunbartonshire) (Lab/Co-op)]

Let me clarify this for the record. I have seen the figures that the hon. Gentleman mentions, and he excluded the “don’t knows” in that poll. In fact, fewer than half, not 60%, of people hold the position that he describes.

[Pete Wishart]

The hon. Lady and I have been through lots of opinion polls in the past year. If she is so confident about her position, she should go out on the hustings and explain why Scottish Labour is a nuclear party that is prepared to spend £100 billion on Trident renewal. That is what she will have to do, and I wish her all the best in trying to get re-elected on that basis, because there is now an alternative.

There is a new way of doing things. The Westminster establishment and the Westminster elite that run this place are beginning to experience real electoral difficulties. People across the country are recognising that the old ways of doing things are not good enough. Cold war weapons for an austerity future: that is what both parties are promising, and that is what will be rejected at the next election.

Oral Answers to Questions

Gemma Doyle Excerpts

Monday 12th January 2015 Commons Chamber

[Michael Fallon]

Reserve service offers exciting opportunities to serve overseas in formed units. For example, a platoon from 3 Princess of Wales’s Royal Regiment will be supporting 1 Royal Anglian in Kabul from February onwards, and 4 Mercian, based in Wolverhampton, recently deployed two platoons to Cyprus. This is exactly what Future Force 2020 was intended to do—making the most of reservists’ skills by integrating them with our regulars.

[Gemma Doyle (West Dunbartonshire) (Lab/Co-op)]

In the recent armed forces covenant report, the three service families federations state:

“We remain disappointed that a sizeable proportion of our people continue to say that they have little or no knowledge of the AF Covenant and the principles that underpin it.”

Three years after Conservative and Lib Dem MPs were initially whipped by the current Armed Forces Minister to vote against enshrining the principles of the armed forces covenant in law, this Government have failed to test their own policies against the covenant, failed to support local authorities to implement it and, we now know, even failed to ensure that forces families know about it. When are they going to get a grip?

[The Minister of State, Ministry of Defence (Anna Soubry)]

May I say how very disappointed I am at such an appallingly negative question that achieves absolutely diddly-squat? With the introduction of the covenant enshrined in law, this Government, more than any other, have ensured that our veterans, serving members of our armed forces and their families get the sort of recognition that they need. It is not disputed that we can do more, especially at local level. That is why, by the end of the day, I shall personally have topped and tailed a letter to every chief executive and every leader of every council in Great Britain. My next task is to write to every clinical commissioning group and hospital trust to ensure that we deliver on the covenant in the NHS as much as we are doing in government, and we now want to do it at local level.

Oral Answers to Questions

Gemma Doyle Excerpts

Monday 24th November 2014 Commons Chamber

[Anna Soubry]

Absolutely. It was a great pleasure to go to DMS Whittington back in October. This is where we now have to do the work—it is going to be quite difficult, because we have to get the message out right across the NHS that there should be no disadvantage to those who have served and that, in special circumstances, they should receive special consideration, based on bereavement and particularly bad injuries. GPs and all health professionals must be alert to that. We all have a role to play in making sure that in the NHS we deliver on the armed forces covenant.

[Gemma Doyle (West Dunbartonshire) (Lab/Co-op)]

Two weeks ago I met a veteran in Preston who was injured in service and now uses a prosthetic leg. He is being treated in a regular NHS clinic, not in the specialist veterans prosthetics centre in Preston. He wants to know why, and so do I. The Minister reportedly says that her job is not demanding. When will she start doing it properly and make sure that there is some connection between what she says at the Dispatch Box and the treatment that our veterans actually get?

[Anna Soubry]

I assure the hon. Lady that I never said any such thing. It is an absolute pleasure and a great honour to do the job that I do, and I like to think that I do it with total commitment. I, too, want to know why that man has not received the treatment he says he should have received, and I should be grateful if the hon. Lady met me so that we can discuss why that is. I have no difficulty whatsoever in taking up every single case and asking the questions. It was a challenge I threw down to the BBC; I said, “I want to know the names and I want to help.” I am waiting to hear of any of those details. I look forward to the hon. Lady’s supplying me with the details relating to her constituent; we will get it sorted.

Military Covenant

Gemma Doyle Excerpts

Wednesday 22nd October 2014 Commons Chamber

[Gemma Doyle (West Dunbartonshire) (Lab/Co-op)]

I am pleased to speak in this debate, and I welcome the motion before the House. I acknowledge the diligent work of the right hon. Member for Lagan Valley (Mr Donaldson) on defence matters, including his service on the Defence Committee, as chair of the first world war centenary committee in Northern Ireland, and as the local Member representing Thiepval barracks and the home of the 38 (Irish) Brigade. I recognise his unwavering commitment to our armed forces.

It does not seem too long ago that we last discussed this topic in the Chamber, but I appreciate the frustration that as yet no resolution has been found to the overall and full recognition and implementation of the armed forces covenant in Northern Ireland. Today more than 1,800 military personnel are stationed in Northern Ireland, along with the veterans who live there, including those at 38 (Irish) Brigade at Thiepval barracks, which is the headquarters of the Army in Northern Ireland. We owe a huge debt of gratitude to all our servicemen and servicewomen, their families and veterans who have, and continue to make, sacrifices of the highest order in defence of our freedoms and the freedoms of others around the world.

We are a couple of weeks away from our annual remembrance commemorations. The physical representation of our remembrance will soon start to appear on our lapels. I will be wearing mine following the launch of the annual Scottish poppy appeal this evening at Dover House. It is worth saying that whether people wear a poppy is entirely a matter of personal choice, but the wearing of a poppy is not a symbol of anything except remembrance. We should keep that in mind in the next few weeks.

The armed forces covenant is one of the ways we show our gratitude to our forces. It sets out the relationship between the Government, the people and the armed forces community, and the principles by which the service community should expect to be treated. It is the least the country can do to honour those who are prepared to make sacrifices every day on our behalf. I speak to many service personnel and their families, as I know does the Minister, and it is clear to me that they do not want to receive special treatment from anyone. They do not want special advantage because of their service. What they want is a level playing field, so that they do not feel they are a step behind everyone else because they may have spent the previous 10 years partially serving abroad or moving their families around from base to base. Importantly, one of the key principles of the covenant is that no member of the armed forces community should be disadvantaged as a result of their service.

I urge the Government again to get their own house in order. I say that gently, because I recognise the Government’s work on the armed forces covenant. As I understand it, there is no mechanism—I have asked this question before—in government for testing a policy against the principles of the armed forces covenant. As long as that remains the case, we will end up in the situation we had with the bedroom tax. Armed forces families were hit by the bedroom tax and it took months of our raising the matter with the Government before they finally made a statement that, from then on, service families would be exempt. The other issue that has come to light—[Interruption.] I hear the Minister saying that that is ridiculous. It is a fact. If he would like to intervene, he is very welcome to do so.

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Northern Ireland (Dr Andrew Murrison)]

I am very grateful to the hon. Lady for allowing me the opportunity. I cannot think she can sustain her argument. We have a Cabinet Sub-Committee dealing with this matter at ministerial level and we have the covenant reference committee dealing with it. We are looking at it constantly, in real time, all the while. I cannot possibly see how she can say that policy ideas are not tested against their potential impact on members of the armed forces, current or past.

[Gemma Doyle]

If the Minister is telling me that there is a mechanism in place—I do not think that there is—by which policies that are developed by the Government, Ministers and officials are tested against the principles of the armed forces covenant, I would be very happy to receive the details. All the points the Minister outlined are very welcome—[Interruption.] If he stops chuntering, I will finish my point. All those things are very important in upholding the principles of the covenant, but if there had been a proper mechanism in place, we would not have had the ridiculous situation of armed forces families being hit by the bedroom tax. That is what happened, and that is why the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions eventually, after months of our asking him, had to come forward with an amended position. I therefore disagree strongly with the Minister on that.

We have also seen—I raised this with the Minister of State, Ministry of Defence, the hon. Member for Broxtowe (Anna Soubry) on Monday—the differential in the amount of money that veterans and civilians diagnosed with mesothelioma will receive. I appreciate that she said on Monday that that is now being looked at, and I hope that we can find a resolution, but if policies are tested as they are developed, we will not have to sweep up afterwards when a policy disadvantages a member of the armed forces community.

There might be times when special consideration is appropriate for those who have served their country, and it is incumbent on the UK Government and devolved Administrations to take that into account, test their policies and make special provisions where necessary or justified. I welcome the reports published by the Scottish and Welsh Governments providing details of how the covenant is being implemented in their respective nations, but it is disappointing that as yet we do not have such a report from the Northern Ireland Executive.

We do not necessarily need uniformity across the four nations in how the covenant is implemented and reported on. Indeed, one of the benefits of devolution is that we can develop local services according to the issues in each area. However, we need to know what is going on, because if the covenant is not being upheld in some way, it is a matter of concern and we should know about it so that we can look at the reasons.

I welcome the work done in Northern Ireland on the covenant and I am grateful to the Northern Ireland Affairs Committee for highlighting some of that good work. In particular, the right hon. Member for Lagan Valley (Mr Donaldson) mentioned the Royal Irish Aftercare Service. I know that the Minister has already offered to visit, but if it is welcome, I would be happy to come over and visit that service and anything else Members think would be useful. [Interruption.] We can come separately or together—whichever arrangement is best.

According to the Committee’s report, however, there remain several areas where the armed forces community in Northern Ireland does not receive the same level of benefits—I use that word in the broadest sense—in relation to health, housing and education as it does in the rest of Great Britain. I think we have heard some of those details already today.

As has also been mentioned, Northern Ireland is not a signatory to the community covenant, which is disappointing. I would be grateful to hear more from the right hon. Gentleman about why that is and how the matter could be taken forward. By comparison, 400 local authorities across the rest of the UK have signed up to that agreement.

The veterans transition review carried out by the noble Lord Ashcroft, which we have welcomed, also highlights some of the problems facing the armed forces community in Northern Ireland. It sets out how the history and political landscape have perhaps interrupted the focus on service leavers and veterans and covers the issue we have discussed of equality legislation and section 75 of the Northern Ireland Act 1998 being a potential barrier to the implementation of the principles of the armed forces covenant.

I acknowledge that those are not issues that can be easily solved, but at its heart the armed forces covenant is about people and fairness, and it is up to us and, in particular, the two Governments, to find a way through it. The Equality Commission for Northern Ireland has said that there is no conflict between section 75 and the principle of no disadvantage for armed forces personnel and families, so it is concerning to hear that some officials might be using it as an excuse not to respect fully the principles of the covenant. To be clear, section 75 should not be used as an excuse for inaction.

I would also place on the record my appreciation and support for the many service charities, including but not limited to the Royal British Legion, SSAFA and Combat Stress, working in Northern Ireland and across the rest of the United Kingdom. Without their tireless work, our armed forces community would not be as well supported as they are now. However, as always, we should not expect the voluntary sector to step in and do the work of Government. Similarly, we cannot expect local authorities to bear the full brunt of responsibility.

It is worth looking back at the armed forces covenant report from last December—I appreciate that this year’s report is due quite soon—as it contained a quote from the families federations of the three services:

“Central Government has asked local authorities to implement many aspects of the AF Covenant with little additional resources in terms of financial support, staff or guidance.”

I have raised this point previously and I reiterate it: we must ensure that we do not end up with central Government pushing extra responsibilities on to local authorities, which might not have the resources or be equipped to deliver the commitments we make here. That might result in the service community being let down. I urge the Minister to undertake and publish an audit of what local authorities are being asked to deliver for the service community and what resources are being provided to them to do that. At the moment, I remain concerned that there is a gap, as reflected in the comment I cited from the families federations.

The armed forces community has made many sacrifices in defence of our country and continues to do so. We are grateful for its professionalism and dedication. We should recognise, too, the continued support of their families and the wider armed forces community. We know that Northern Ireland has faced particular challenges in taking the covenant forward, but I hope the Northern Ireland Executive will do all they can to ensure that veterans who have settled in Northern Ireland are supported, and that families and serving personnel there are treated in line with the principles of the covenant.

I note the Northern Ireland Committee’s particular recommendations for mental health provision and the appointment of an armed forces advocate. In line with the motion before us today, I urge the Government to ensure the full implementation of the armed forces covenant throughout the United Kingdom, including in Northern Ireland.

Oral Answers to Questions

Gemma Doyle Excerpts

Monday 20th October 2014 Commons Chamber

[Anna Soubry]

I absolutely agree with my hon. Friend. It is completely lost on me as to why the European Court of Human Rights should be involved, when, as he says, there is already international humanitarian law and, of course, the Geneva convention, both of which are tried and tested. That is how we make sure that things are done properly; we do not need the ECHR in this respect at all.

[Gemma Doyle (West Dunbartonshire) (Lab/Co-op)]

On the subject of legal claims, I am sure that the Minister has seen the Royal British Legion’s 2015 manifesto, which brings to light a breach of the principles of the armed forces covenant whereby veterans who contracted mesothelioma as a result of their service before 1987 are unable to sue the MOD and instead apply for 100% war disablement pension. That means a difference of over £100,000 less in the possible total payments to those veterans compared with their civilian counterparts, because the newly established compensation scheme for civilians pays a lump sum, whereas the war pension scheme does not. Will she review this matter urgently to avoid unnecessary legal action and to ensure that the principles of the covenant are being applied across Government?

[Anna Soubry]

I do not need to review it urgently because the review is under way. Indeed, I have had a meeting with my officials in the past few weeks, so I am very much alive to the issues. The situation is a bit more complicated than the hon. Lady has explained it, because further complications are involved. However, I hope to be in a position to be able to explain the conclusions that we hope to come to very swiftly.

Oral Answers to Questions

Gemma Doyle Excerpts

Monday 14th July 2014 Commons Chamber

[Mr Francois]

I am very happy to praise my hon. Friend’s council and the volunteers who do such vital work for the wider armed forces community, and I am extremely happy to praise those two very good charities, not least as we in the Ministry of Defence have for some while been encouraging charities to work more closely together—what one might in the military community call the principle of combined arms—and to see these two great charities combining forces for the benefit of the wider armed forces family is excellent, and I commend them for their efforts.

[Gemma Doyle (West Dunbartonshire) (Lab/Co-op)]

The Prime Minister has found rather a large amount of cash down the back of the Secretary of State’s sofa, with which he is now playing catch-up with the UK’s defence capabilities. But did any of the Ministers argue at any point that some of this money should be spent on armed forces housing, which remains a key priority for armed forces families, or in addressing the unfairness in the previous war widows’ pension schemes? I remind the Minister that the noble Lord Astor has estimated the cost of sorting out one of those schemes at £70,000 a year.

[Mr Francois]

I thank the hon. Lady for her welcome for our equipment announcement today. The Government are committed to removing the disadvantage faced by our armed forces, and that is why we enshrined the key principles of the covenant in law. We have committed £105 million during the past four years to upholding the covenant; £30 million for the community covenant; £35 million for the LIBOR fund; and £40 million to fund a range of accommodation projects for veterans. In addition, £10 million per annum will be available in perpetuity to support the commitments for the armed forces covenant from 2015.

Oral Answers to Questions

Gemma Doyle Excerpts

Monday 12th May 2014 Commons Chamber

[Dr Murrison]

We have not ordered warships from another country for 100 years, outside the two world wars. Article 346 of the treaty on the functioning of the European Union makes the situation clear: it would not be possible to order such vessels in the event that Scotland and the United Kingdom became foreign countries to one another.

[Gemma Doyle (West Dunbartonshire) (Lab/Co-op)]

There is not a single costed commitment to build or purchase any defence equipment in the SNP’s manifesto—or “White Paper”, as they like to call it—over and above existing UK Government plans. In fact, a letter from the Deputy First Minister indicates that the frigates they refer to are actually four of the 13 that we expect and hope the UK to order later this year. Are not the jobs of those working in the defence sector in Scotland, which are reliant on UK contracts, some of the most at risk if Scotland becomes independent from the rest of the UK?

[Dr Murrison]

I am not sure about the figures that the hon. Lady cites, which I think are optimistic. What I would say is that £2.5 billion is 7% of the £33 billion to £34 billion that we currently spend on defence, and Scotland represents 8.4% of the UK population. I think we can all do the figures ourselves and realise that Scotland gets a very, very large chunk of the defence cake; furthermore, it benefits from every single pound of the £34 billion that we spend on defence every year. It is inconceivable that Scotland would be better defended in the event that it became independent.

Military Credit Union

Gemma Doyle Excerpts

Tuesday 8th April 2014 Westminster Hall

[Gemma Doyle (West Dunbartonshire) (Lab/Co-op)]

It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mrs Riordan. It is also a pleasure to follow the hon. Member for Strangford (Jim Shannon), who made a welcome and constructive contribution to the debate. I congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Harrow West (Mr Thomas) on securing the debate. I am delighted to be able to follow him by speaking in support of the establishment of an armed forces credit union.

I pay tribute to the commitment and service of our armed forces, our veterans and their families. Without them, our country would not be as successful or as safe as it is. It is therefore my utmost belief that we have a duty to ensure that our servicemen and women and their families are treated fairly, protected from discrimination and supported in all aspects of their civilian life where necessary. That includes in their finances.

It is already hard enough for an individual or a family to save money and build up a strong credit history. For armed forces personnel, the struggle to become financially secure can sometimes be even more difficult. Military families face specific circumstances that can make it difficult to access financial services via the traditional routes, such as high street banks or building societies. Long periods spent outside the UK mean that some kinds of financial benefits, such as no-claims bonuses, are not easily acknowledged. It becomes harder to build up a credit history if someone’s address changes every two years as they move around. Fluctuations between an individual’s regular pay and deployment pay can mean that income is hard to predict. That is not just detrimental to the individual, who may be unable to develop a long-term budget but also influences things such as mortgage and credit card applications. Frequent relocations have a knock-on effect for partners, spouses and children, whose employment opportunities may be reduced, resulting in a drop in household income.

It can be hard for servicemen and women to save during deployment, but on leaving the military, the situation may become harder. More than 20,000 people leave the armed forces every year, and that number is rising as the Government reduce personnel numbers. Because of the institutional way in which the armed forces work, some of those people will have had little experience of budgeting, costing, saving or spending. Many people struggle with those things, and those in the armed forces are no different. That added burden can leave them at risk of financial difficulty. The 2012 issue of Homeport, a magazine distributed by the Navy and the Marines to naval families, said:

“The inability to manage personal finances is one of the single greatest welfare challenges facing members of the Armed Forces.”

Every one of those things makes our military personnel and their families more likely to search out alternative options for financing. When circumstances mean that they are refused assistance from high street banks or building societies, they become more susceptible to payday lenders offering sums of cash on the spot, as we have heard. Citizens Advice has reported dealing with an increased number of cases of British armed services personnel and their families being targeted by payday lending companies. A couple of payday lenders—I am struggling over whether to name the companies that I have in mind; on this occasion I do not think I will—have specialist sites aimed at the armed forces, and one of them has an interest rate of 1,734%. My hon. Friend the Member for Harrow West has outlined the interest rates of a number of other companies. In targeting armed forces families in such a way, they are exploiting for their own gain service personnel who have poor credit histories or difficulty accessing credit. Of course, payday lenders do not just target military families, and we have heard a good deal about that already. Which?, Citizens Advice, the Office of Fair Trading and the Business, Innovation and Skills Committee have all criticised payday loan companies for offering exploitative loans to people who are at their lowest ebb and charging extortionate fees that simply push those people into further financial difficulty.

According to the Debt Advice Foundation, one in four people who take out payday loans need the money to buy food or essentials, and 44% use them to pay off other debts. Some in the forces may turn to payday loan companies because they see them as a quick and easy solution to a lack of finance. Initially, they are a quick way of getting money, but unfortunately it does not turn out to be easy in the long run.

Establishing a military credit union would not only shield our military families from exploitation but help them to become more financially stable and financially literate, and to live a more secure and stable life outside the armed forces when they leave. That would reduce the need for intervention further down the line. I appreciate that the Ministry of Defence has already recognised that something needs to be done, which is why it introduced the MoneyForce programme last year to provide service personnel with advice and training on finances. Although the scheme is a good step in the right direction, it does not offer our armed forces an alternative to the arrangements on offer.

As we have heard, the Royal British Legion operates its own money advice service, which gives service personnel, veterans and their families impartial and non-judgmental financial advice. I believe that it has helped more than 35,000 people; worryingly, about 11,000 of them in 2012 alone, so the numbers appear to be going up. About 70% of those people are ex-service rather than currently serving, which shows that there is a problem here that we must look at. In addition, research by the Royal British Legion in 2011 showed that almost a third of the debt problems it deals with involve unsecured loans from payday lenders and other providers. That is yet another reason why we should be providing servicemen and women with another option.

Given the facts, and given that is not difficult to see where and how the problems arise, I hope that Ministers will take the opportunity to do something positive about the matter. In February 2013, the Minister with responsibility for international strategy, the hon. Member for South West Wiltshire (Dr Murrison), said that the concept of a credit union had been considered but that the MOD believed that it was

“likely to be too restrictive in how it might operate and what it can provide.”—[Official Report, 4 February 2013; Vol. 558, c. 440W.]

Earlier this year, however, he updated the position, saying that the MOD was considering the option of an armed forces credit union but a decision had not yet been made. I hope that the Minister can tell us where the Department stands and whether he has been convinced that a military credit union would offer a financial lifeline to thousands of serving personnel, veterans and their families. I back my hon. Friend the Member for Harrow West in calling for a feasibility study into the matter and into deductions at source from salaries.

As we have heard, the Department for Work and Pensions has supported the expansion of credit unions across the UK. The Department’s feasibility study found that some 7 million people fall into the trap of high-cost credit. As a result, a significant amount of money has been set aside to invest in credit unions, and I hope that that might be one way of moving forward. Tackling high-interest consumer credit is a priority for the Opposition, as is supporting our armed forces and their families. Unfortunately, too many people in the UK have been forced into using food banks and relying on welfare payments to try to deal with the cost of living crisis. The armed forces and their families are facing their own cost of living crisis, because they have had reductions in their allowances and their pensions.

Considering all the evidence, I cannot see a single reason why we should not move ahead with the policy. The armed forces covenant states that, where possible, disadvantages should be removed so that military personnel can enjoy the same opportunities and outcomes as the civilian community. When it comes to personal finance, there is clearly a problem that we want to address. Credit unions provide a fair and affordable alternative to payday lenders. They are an option for those who are otherwise unable to access mainstream sources of high street credit from traditional banks or building societies. They are also a way forward for people who want to take an ethical approach to personal finance. They are trusted by more than 200 million people across the world, who use them to manage more than £700 billion in assets. In West Dunbartonshire, we have three community-based credit unions, not to mention some hugely successful workplace schemes, which help more than 12,000 people to manage their money in the best possible way. I want that service to be available to our armed forces community as well. I cannot think of a reason why they, too, should not have access to a workplace credit union.

We have heard about Navy Federal, which is the biggest credit union in the United States with 4 million members, so it cannot be that our armed forces are too big to establish such a scheme. One of the unique selling points of a credit union is that it can offer specialised financial products and services that are designed to meet the specific needs of the community it serves. The hon. Member for North Antrim (Ian Paisley), who has left, spoke about insurance products, which I think Navy Federal offers. The specific circumstances and situations that military personnel face, such as families living apart, or moving house several times, could be factored into decision making.

The Co-operative party has launched the “Give Me Credit” campaign for a military credit union, with the simple expression: “Because service personnel and their families deserve better.” I could not have put it better. Like my hon. Friend the Member for Harrow West, I am proud to be a member of the Co-operative party and one of its Members of Parliament, because those are the sort of policies that make people’s lives better. I hope that the Minister and the MOD will commit to giving our service community what it deserves—an opportunity and an outlet by which they can become financially stable, through the establishment of a military credit union.

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Defence (Mr Philip Dunne)]

It is a great pleasure to serve under your chairmanship today, Mrs Riordan. For me, as for the hon. Member for Harrow West (Mr Thomas), this is the first opportunity to do so. I congratulate him on securing the debate. He has been a persistent advocate of an armed forces credit union—I think he presented a ten-minute rule Bill earlier in the year—and I am pleased that he has managed to secure a full 90-minute debate today. It is good to see colleagues from Northern Ireland supporting it.

There is no fundamental disagreement between us on the proposal. The Government have actively supported credit unions since we came to office and we have been working energetically to increase access to affordable credit by modernising and expanding the sector. That is why we are investing up to £38 million in the credit union expansion project, providing an increased range of financial services for up to 1 million more customers, which we anticipate will save them up to £1 billion in loan interest repayments over the period to March 2019. We also believe that credit unions have a role to play in supporting our armed services.

Financial pressures exist within service households just as they do in the wider community, as all those hon. Members who spoke explained. Indeed, many hon. Members may have received letters from members of the armed forces or their families who have been denied credit, have struggled with obtaining a mortgage or have been refused the opportunity to purchase a financial product as simple as a product warranty. Often that has nothing to do with their creditworthiness per se, but is due to the nature of a peripatetic career that can prevent some in the armed forces community from developing a consistent credit history in the area where they live; that is often used by credit referencing companies to determine credit credentials. We recognise that that is a problem within the structure of employment in the armed forces, and have been actively taking steps to ease the problems for service personnel, as an important component of the armed forces covenant, which the hon. Member for West Dunbartonshire (Gemma Doyle) mentioned.

Two years ago, in April 2012, working with credit reference agencies and the Royal Mail, we introduced “shadow” postcodes against British forces postal addresses, to try to establish consistency of address. That helps armed forces personnel serving overseas to maintain a UK credit history that is recognised by financial service providers and allows improved access to financial products. The MOD has also secured an important pledge from, among others, the UK Cards Association, the British Bankers Association, and the Council of Mortgage Lenders to treat

“applications for credit and mortgages...fairly and consistently with civilian counterparts”.

Last year, as other hon. Members have mentioned, we launched MoneyForce in partnership with the Royal British Legion and the Standard Life Charitable Trust. That has been providing training, briefings, resources and online support, helping the armed forces community to manage its money and financial affairs better.

Despite that support, there are still those in the forces, as there are among the public at large, who end up requiring a loan just to make ends meet. I am sure that the hon. Member for West Dunbartonshire was not suggesting, in her remarks, that armed forces personnel have increasingly become users of food banks, because I am aware of no evidence of that. If she has any I should be interested.

[Gemma Doyle]

indicated dissent.

[Mr Dunne]

I think she is indicating that she did not mean that, and I am pleased to hear that, because there is no reason for it.

Citizens Advice has said that it is dealing with a significant number of cases of service personnel and their families who get into difficulty with debts at high interest rates owed to payday lenders. Those lenders appear to be specifically targeting the armed forces because some personnel have problems with credit ratings. The hon. Members for Harrow West and for West Dunbartonshire both mentioned some of those payday lender adverts, and the extortionate rates of interest that they charge. I searched the internet to see what claims those companies make. Entering “armed forces loans” into the search engine generates a list of companies promising no credit checks, rapid payment and 100% satisfaction. One website even depicts a smiling soldier in uniform giving a thumbs-up in front of the Union flag, with the claim that it is the

“Number One lender to the military”.

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Dunne]

Before the Division, I was explaining how credit unions must be properly regulated, and the fact that we need to be confident that any credit union established with military branding has some financial security. Credit unions offer access to good-value savings and loan products for a customer base that has historically found it hard to access such services. They are registered as industrial and provident societies and are regulated by both the Financial Conduct Authority and the Prudential Regulation Authority.

Unlike payday loan companies, credit unions are, in my view, a positive force for the community around them, benefiting members and local economies alike. Their role in developing alternative financial services for member groups has been well championed in this House, not only by the hon. Member for Harrow West but particularly by the all-party group on credit unions, which my hon. Friend the Member for East Hampshire (Damian Hinds) has chaired so admirably since he was elected, among his many other duties, including his support for me today, for which I am extremely grateful.

Of course, provided that they meet the common bond for membership, members of the armed forces and their families can already apply to join an existing credit union local to them in order to access the range of financial services on offer. However, coverage is not national and the services vary. As the hon. Member for Harrow West pointed out, the Navy Federal credit union in the US is a model of what can be achieved. It has around 5 million members and some £50 billion in assets. I agree with the hon. Gentleman that a well-managed credit union for our soldiers, sailors, airmen and women, as well as their families and veterans, could be of considerable benefit if established for United Kingdom armed forces.

However, there is a “but”. What makes credit unions unique and makes them work is their independent spirit. They are created by the people for the people, offering products that their customers want because their customers are also their members. Typically, credit unions grow steadily and organically from small beginnings, normally taking many years to cultivate their membership. To give one example, the Glasgow Credit Union was founded by two members in 1989 as the Glasgow District Employees Credit Union. In the following 25 years, it grew to a membership of 32,000 and now has some £100 million in assets. Although this is an excellent example of localism in action, it demonstrates the time that it can take a credit union to develop proper traction and critical mass. Also, it would not be in the interests of anyone—the taxpayer, UK financial services or credit union members themselves—to try to shoehorn an institution of this kind into a Whitehall Department. The organisation of credit unions has always been, and must continue to be, the remit of the private and voluntary sector. It is no small undertaking to establish one.

[Gemma Doyle]

Could the Minister explain, therefore, why the Department for Work and Pensions has put aside £38 million to support credit unions, because that does not seem to sit with the point he has just made, namely that supporting credit unions is not the business of Government?

[Mr Dunne]

The Government are keen to support the development of credit unions but we are not keen to be the operator. The funding is available to provide support. I am not familiar with all the detail about what the DWP funding has provided, but I can certainly look into that matter and write to the hon. Lady if she would like clarification. Nevertheless, as far as I am aware, it is not the business of the DWP to establish credit unions. I think that it is providing support for existing or start-up unions being established around the country on an initial basis, effectively like providing start-up funding for a business.

Oral Answers to Questions

Gemma Doyle Excerpts

Monday 17th March 2014 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hammond]

As I explained to the House when I made my statement, the purpose of the naval test reactor at Dounreay is to run the reactor hard and flat out, as it were, ahead of the operational reactors on the submarines, to see what happens as they approach the end of their planned life. The reactors on board our submarines have nothing like the percentage fuel burn that the reactor at Dounreay has now experienced, so we are looking at something that has developed at a much further advanced stage of the life of the reactor. We have, however, taken the decision, on a precautionary basis, to refuel HMS Vanguard during her planned deep-maintenance period. Once the reactor at Dounreay is decommissioned, it will be examined in detail and we will then have much greater evidence of what has caused the issue and be able to make sensible decisions about the future.

[Gemma Doyle (West Dunbartonshire) (Lab/Co-op)]

Will the Secretary of State advise whether and when the Commodore at Clyde naval base was alerted to a potential issue with the reactors of the Vanguard submarines, and whether, no matter whose responsibility it was, he would have expected the relevant local authorities— namely Argyll and Bute and West Dunbartonshire councils—to be alerted?

[Mr Hammond]

If there had been any health and safety risk or any risk to the environment, I certainly would have expected the relevant local authorities to have been notified, but there was none at any time. The Scottish Environment Protection Agency has a written agreement with the MOD that allows it oversight of these matters in military bases in Scotland. If it had thought there was any risk at any time, it would have notified the necessary civil authorities.