Care Bill [HL]

Earl Howe Excerpts

Tuesday 16th July 2013 Lords Chamber

[Lord Hunt of Kings Heath]

My Lords, I, too, have a great deal of sympathy for the core of my noble friend’s proposal to change the means test to increase personal allowances to support people so that they have enough money for what he described as “small treats”. Like my noble friend Lord Warner, I should be interested in the noble Earl’s response to that point.

I also sympathise with my noble friend’s second proposal to help those with modest assets by making the means test less severe. It is clear to most of us that the benefits of Dilnot will go to the better off. I think that one must be sympathetic to my noble friend’s aim of trying to spread the benefits more widely. Of course, that comes with a cost, and my noble friend’s answer to that is the proposal to abolish the nursing care allowance or to phase it out. Perhaps the term is grandparenting; I am not sure of the phrase but the Lords reform proposals come to mind—the transition.

Whether that is the right approach must of course be subject to some debate, and I would certainly need some convincing about the phasing out of the nursing care allowance. However, I think that my noble friend has done us a service and I hope that we will have further discussions on it between now and Report.

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department of Health (Earl Howe)]

My Lords, on one level I sympathise with the intention of the noble Lord, Lord Lipsey, to redistribute funding between health and care and support so as to increase the personal expenses allowance and local authority support for those in residential care. However, we need to face the reality of the current economic climate. One important aspect of our reforms is that the greatest support will go to those with the greatest need, and that is surely the policy aim that we need to keep most closely in mind in this context.

Currently, the NHS funds nursing homes to support the provision of registered nursing care. This reduces the burden on the NHS of having to provide NHS nurses in residential care homes. Removing this funding would risk increasing costs elsewhere in the NHS, but it would also breach a serious point of principle. If we were to stop people in residential care homes from being eligible for NHS-funded nursing care, it would undermine one of the founding principles of the NHS, which is that it should be a service free at the point of delivery. I am sure that noble Lords would agree that we would not like to see that.

I understand why the noble Lord seeks to increase the personal expenses allowance. If someone is contributing to the costs of their residential care from their net income, for example from their pension, the personal expenses allowance is the amount people can retain to spend as they wish. This is currently set, as he rightly said, at £23.90. The amendment would increase it to £32.75. When living at home, people pay for their food and heating from their income. It is right that people should continue to contribute towards these costs in residential care. The personal expenses allowance reflects the fact that for most people these costs represent a large proportion of their income, but it allows people to retain some of their income for other uses. The reality is that spending additional resources on the personal expenses allowance would reduce the resources available to provide support to those with the greatest needs.

I heard what the noble Lord, Lord Lipsey, said about the loss of the attendance allowance meaning that people would be worse off. Local authorities should support people to maximise their income. If a given individual would be better off receiving the attendance allowance, the local authority should support them to achieve this. We will bear this in mind as we draw up the regulations.

I turn now to Amendment 91, which relates to financial assessments. One of the problems the Dilnot recommendations attempt to tackle is the cliff edge between being a self-funder and being supported by the local authority. By extending the means test for people in residential care, we aim to avoid a situation where a small change in a person’s capital results in a large change in what they pay for care.

From 2016, the maximum tariff income for someone with £118,000 in assets will be £404 per week. If we reduced the rate at which people contribute toward their care costs from their assets to £1 per week for every £500 of assets, the contribution for someone with £118,000 in assets would become £202 per week. This means that an individual facing a typical care home fee would be over £200 per week better off if they had assets of £117,000 than if they had assets of £119,000. This would reintroduce the cliff edge that surely none of us wants to see.

I believe that our plans represent a fair balance between the individual and the state. People with care needs will receive additional support with care and support costs through the extended means test, safe in the knowledge that health services will remain free at the point of use and that they are protected by the cap from unlimited care costs. I hope the noble Lord will see that there is method in the Government’s proposals. While I totally understand much of his rationale, I think our proposals have a better balance. I hope that he will feel able to withdraw his amendment.

[Lord Lipsey]

My Lords, I am usually extremely complimentary about the noble Earl’s replies to debates, but I do not think that he lived up to his normal standards in that one. He seems to be under a number of illusions. He seems to think that this Bill increases the amount of public spending that goes to the worse off, rather than the better off. It does not. The Bill incorporates what is a most extraordinary priority in terms of distribution, for reasons that I believe to be compelling. Concentrating money on those most in need may indeed be the Government’s general philosophy, I do not know, but this certainly is not implicit in this Bill.

The noble Earl seems to say that if you do as I suggested on the nursing care allowance, you would increase spending by the NHS. The exact reverse is the case. The nursing cost allowance is paid for by the NHS. I am subject to correction, but I believe it to be paid for by the NHS, so you would have an immediate reduction in NHS spending of some £500 million-plus a year.

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[Earl Howe]

My Lords, having disappointed the noble Lord, Lord Lipsey, on the previous group of amendments, for which I shall try to make amends over the summer holidays, I hope to do a little better with this one but I predict that he will not be completely satisfied with my answer.

People should be supported to receive the care they want and should be able to use their own assets to achieve this when they can afford to do so, but this should never be an excuse for local authorities to underfund the cost of meeting people’s needs. I agree with the noble Lord that people should be able to spend their money on purchasing more expensive care and support for themselves if they wish to do so, provided this is affordable. We are seeking better to understand the impact of such a relaxation and the protections that are appropriate for vulnerable people. It would clearly be undesirable for a person to spend their life savings on residential care and late in life be faced with the prospect of having to move to alternative accommodation purely on affordability grounds. I take that point absolutely. In addition, we want to consider the implications for the ability of local authorities to arrange services for other people. If individuals were to use their resources to purchase more expensive care, this could ultimately reduce local authorities’ income from charges. This in turn would reduce the amount of care the local authorities could arrange for other vulnerable people. There are a number of factors at play here, which we need to think through a bit more.

In principle, people should be able to use their savings to purchase more expensive care if they want to. We are determined to clarify and modernise the care and support arrangements in a way that is fair and reasonable to people who need care, their families and the taxpayer. The revised arrangements for people to use their savings to pay for their own care will be set out in regulations made under Clause 30(2) of the Bill. Through the public consultation on funding reform, we are seeking better to understand how relaxing the existing restrictions on making additional payments, which the noble Lord, Lord Lipsey, outlined, might impact on the wider care and support system. The evidence we hope to gather from the consultation will inform the regulations that will set out the revised arrangements. Those regulations will also be subject to further public consultation. In view of that, which is really a long-winded way of saying that this is work in progress but we are on the noble Lord’s side, I hope he will feel able to withdraw his amendment.

I can clarify one point in relation to when local authorities take over responsibility for funding care. It may be appropriate for the local authority to meet any additional cost, for example, where moving the person receiving care and support would adversely affect their health. However, where paying the higher cost might limit the local authority’s ability to support other individuals with care and support needs, the person may have to move to less expensive accommodation. In making any decisions, the local authority has to consider the exercise of its duty to promote that individual’s well-being.

I hope that those are helpful remarks. I would be happy to discuss this issue with noble Lords between now and Report.

[Lord Lipsey]

My Lords, I thank the Minister for that reply. Having berated him for his previous speech, I can more than fulfil his expectations on this. He has done all that I could have hoped for and more. It will be extremely well received in the world outside that the Government are finally getting to grips with this long-outstanding anomaly. I do not blame this Government. Various Governments have been exactly the same. We are going to get a solution that is essential if the Dilnot scheme is to work as we meant it to work. It is very good news to hear the Minister state so strongly in principle that if people want to use their own money to top up their fees, they should be able to do so, although I understand his reservations about the impact that might have on the local authority market. I look forward to his further work on the subject and to discussing it with him and his officials, as will, no doubt, other noble Lords who have an interest in this. I beg leave to withdraw the amendment.

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[Baroness Wheeler]

My Lords, this has been a valuable debate and important issues designed to probe and improve aspects of these crunch stages in the care and support journey have been raised. The amendments relate to the duty of the local authority in respect of the care and support plan for the adult, the support plan for the carer, the personal or independent budget resulting from the assessment of the adult’s and carer’s needs, and care accounts and direct payments. This is a large grouping and we have nine amendments. I will speak to them as they relate to other amendments in the group as briefly as I can.

Amendment 92ZZG seeks to specify in the Bill that the adult or carer needs in the care and support plan or support plan include both social care, to be met by the local authority, and health needs, to be met by NHS bodies in the area. This requirement would reinforce the need for local authorities and primary, secondary and community health services to work closely together for the benefit of the adult and the carer. It would also provide a clear, joined-up picture of the adult and/or carer’s interlinking care and support and health needs and how they are to be met. Amendments 92ZZP and 92ZZQ also provide for this important joining-up mechanism to apply to the care and support plan and support plan reviews by underlining that in the review process, local authorities must have regard to any changes in the health needs of the adult or carer, including any health provision that they are entitled to receive.

Amendment 92ZZK, in the name of the noble Baroness, Lady Browning, extends the intent of our amendment by specifying that in a young person’s care and support plan, both health and education, in addition to care and support, should be included, integrating with any existing plan in these areas. The importance of this amendment to young people with autism—or indeed to their carers, as the amendment is not specific—has been underlined by the noble Baroness.

The noble Baroness, Lady Greengross, has tabled a number of amendments. In the time available I will refer to four of them. Amendments 92ZZCA and 92ZZR address the need for the Bill to be explicit and thorough in relation to the assessment and eligibility entitlements where the adult lacks mental capacity to arrange for the provision of care and support. The amendments are designed to ensure that the local authority provides free care and support in the circumstances where the person authorised to represent the adult under the Mental Capacity Act 2005 asks for the care and support on the adult’s behalf.

Amendment 92ZZR addresses concerns raised by the Alzheimer’s Society and other groups that Clause 28(7) does not offer adequate protection to people who lack capacity and puts people with deteriorating conditions such as dementia at risk of falling through the gaps. Government Amendment 92ZZQC is designed to address this and the Minister’s recognition that the clause is open to misinterpretation is welcome. These are complex issues but we all recognise the importance of ensuring that the Bill is watertight in respect of adults lacking capacity to arrange care and support, and of having clarity in respect of the local authority’s duty to carry out a needs assessment and to continue to maintain their care account. Can the Minister reassure the House that the Government’s amendment addresses the concerns raised by noble Lords in this debate?

The noble Baroness also raises a key issue in her Amendments 92ZZRA and 92ZZRB, which go to the heart of the choice agenda to ensure that the current right for individuals to choose a preferred care home, and the ability of their representatives to choose a home on their behalf when, for example, the individual has dementia, is upheld in the Bill. Currently the Bill does not make this mandatory on local authorities and it is important that it does. I ask the Minister how the Government’s policy on patient choice can be met when the Bill does not reinforce the current right for people to choose their preferred care home.

Our Amendments 92ZZRAA and 92ZZRAB probe this issue further and are intended to explore the Government’s appetite for including the right to express a preference for the nature and location of accommodation. We support the intention of the Government, the Law Commission and the Labour Party that the Care Bill should increase the choice and control of adults using social care and their carers. I am, however, intrigued to determine whether the Minister thinks that this right in Clause 30 might be made more meaningful if it were extended to include the nature and location of this accommodation. It is important to seek to give adults needing care and support both choice and voice, including them in decisions about them. I look forward to the Minister’s response.

I support the intention of my noble friend Lord Dubs in his Amendment 92ZZH to ensure that care and support plans or support plans specify contingency planning for an emergency, ensuring that plans reflect the flexibility needed for fluctuating conditions, such as MS and other conditions referred to by my noble friend, where there can be severe changes and rises and falls in care needs. Having discussions and planning in advance for this, so that the care is there when it is needed, would be a significant step forward.

It is also important to look at contingency plans in case the carer suddenly becomes ill or is unable to provide care. The self-direct assessment model includes discussion on contingency and risk, but the extent to which clear provision is covered in the care and support plan is patchy. Indeed, it is not always easy to be specific about what would happen because often the reality is that instant emergency care cover is hard to organise when relatives live a considerable distance away or the cared-for person is not able to summon emergency help themselves.

My noble friend also underlines the importance of including a review date in the plan. It would be valuable to require social services departments and providers to be clearer about not just the review date for the plan but what the monitoring and review process is, and what kind of client feedback, or complaints process, there will be, as well as client/carer involvement in assessing quality of care and standards of service. I suspect that very few care plans currently address these issues. Our Amendments 92ZZMA and 92ZZQB probe how a reasonable request for a review of a care and support plan is to be interpreted and, most importantly, to be interpreted fairly across the country. We support a national care service and a national entitlement to care.

We also in our Amendment 92ZZEC draw attention to the important issue of the need for the completion of the care and support plan and support plan to be conducted within a reasonable timeframe. The assessment is a worrying and often traumatic time for the cared for and carer, so knowing what the timeframe is from interview to completion, and then for the personal budget decision, is pretty important. Getting an early assessment and getting the clock ticking towards the cap will also be crucial, so there must be targets and timeframes for the local authority to adhere to and meet. Assessments under the self-directed support process in my local experience as a carer involved four meetings with social services, including with the domiciliary care agency provider and with the daycare provider, and a lot of supported work to be undertaken by the adult or the carer on the client’s behalf. Is the Minister confident that local authorities will really have the capacity and resources to cope with the demands of the new system, including the estimated quarter of a million additional assessments for self-funders that will need to be carried out?

Finally, our Amendment 92ZZSB seeks to implement the recommendation of the Joint Committee on lifting the Department of Health’s current ban on direct payments being used to pay for local authority services if the individual chooses to achieve the agreed outcomes. Our amendment would bring this into effect by underlining in the Bill that there should be no restriction in terms of type of provider placed on the services which can be purchased by direct payments. I hope that the Minister agrees, and I look forward to his response.

[Earl Howe]

My Lords, I thank all those who have contributed to the debate on an issue which is crucial to the Government’s vision for a personalised care and support system—the care planning process.

In relation to Amendment 92ZZCA, I hope I can reassure the noble Baroness, Lady Greengross, that it is already the case in the Bill—the Explanatory Notes make this clear—that where the adult lacks capacity to make a request, it may be made by someone else on their behalf. This is the effect of the Mental Capacity Act 2005. It is not necessary to set this out in legislation each time. We will also make this clear in guidance. Condition 3 in Clause 18(4) imposes a duty on the local authority to meet needs in cases where the adult lacks capacity and has no one to arrange care on their behalf. This is an additional safety net, enacting a provision previously set out in guidance.

On Amendment 92ZZEC from the noble Baroness, Lady Wheeler, it is vital that local authorities retain the ability to be proportionate to the needs to be met. For some people the care planning process may be relatively simple and therefore can occur relatively quickly, but that may not be the case for people with multiple complex needs. As we discussed earlier, there may be a need for experts to be engaged in some cases, and this should not be overlooked in order to meet a centralised target. Introducing a defined timescale may also have the unintended consequence of some plans being rushed in order to meet the deadline, or even introduce gaming into the completion of care plans. I hope that the Committee will agree that this does not fit very well with our vision of a personalised care and support system.

We will work with stakeholders to set out best practice for conducting care and support plans in guidance. This will include indicative but not definitive timescales for care plans. Amendments 92ZZG, 92ZZP and 92ZZQ in the name of the noble Baroness, Lady Wheeler, raise the issue of specifying health needs in the care plan. The Bill creates a clear legal framework to enable such integration to happen in practice. However, it is not for the local authority to specify in the care plan which needs the NHS should meet. Clause 25 requires local authorities to involve the adult and carer, and take all reasonable steps to agree the plan with them, which would include whether to refer to any health needs.

In relation to Amendment 92ZZGA in the name of the noble Baroness, Lady Emerton, we believe that everyone should receive a personal budget as part of their care plan to ensure individuals are made aware of the cost of their care and the contributions both they and the local authority need to make. Giving local authorities discretion on whether to provide a personal budget would undermine our aim of giving people more choice and control over their care and support. Removing this duty will also affect the ability of the local authority and adult to track progress towards the care cap. I realise—at least I hope I realise—that the amendment was a probing one.

[Baroness Browning]

I think the concern of the noble Baroness, Lady Emerton, was not about the discretion over whether or not to give the budget, but about discretion over how that budget should be spent. I think that she was concerned that the personal budget, if it were put into the plan in a certain format, might start to prescribe how the budget was spent. That, I think, is what she was concerned about and why she suggested the change of wording.

[Earl Howe]

I am very grateful to my noble friend and I think I had better reflect further in the light of those comments.

I completely agree with the noble Lord, Lord Dubs, in relation to Amendments 92ZZH and 92ZZJ, that a modern, comprehensive care and support system should be able swiftly and effectively to respond to changing patterns of need. But the issue of fluctuating or emergency needs and anticipated review dates should be left to the local authority and the adult to discuss and agree when going through the care and support planning process. Again, we will consider these matters when producing statutory guidance with partners.

I turn to Amendment 92ZZK in the name of my noble friend Lady Browning. As I have indicated previously, the transition of children to adult care and links between this Bill and the Children and Families Bill merit further consideration and will be discussed at a later date. But I share my noble friend’s expectation. Where an adult has an education health and care plan, their care and support needs assessment and plan should be integrated with it. Both the guidance supporting the Care Bill and the SEN code of practice will set out how we expect this to work.

I turn to Amendments 92ZZLA and 92ZZQA in the name of the noble Baroness, Lady Greengross. The Bill is intentionally very clear that the personal budget and independent personal budget must be the cost to the local authority of meeting the adult’s needs, not an arbitrary or hypothetical figure. I can reassure the noble Baroness that the local authority may not set the personal budget to an amount which is less than it would cost the authority to meet the adult’s needs. The personal budget or independent personal budget must reflect the cost to the local authority of meeting the adult’s needs, not the cost to the individual of doing so himself or herself. Otherwise, this would create an unfair advantage for those with more means who are able to pay more for their care and would therefore reach the cap quicker.

I turn now to Amendments 92ZZMA and 92ZZQB, spoken to by the noble Baroness, Lady Wheeler. Enabling adults to request a review of either the care and support plan or the independent personal budget without a determination of reasonableness may leave the process open to abuse and create frivolous reviews costing the local authority time and money. For example, it would not be reasonable to request a review when a review has recently been conducted and needs have not changed. If an adult request is considered unreasonable, then the adult should be informed of the grounds for the local authority’s decision. We will cover this further in guidance.

On Amendment 92ZZR, we wholeheartedly agree with the noble Baroness, Lady Greengross, that if an adult lacks capacity the local authority must carry out the assessment if it believes that this would be in the adult’s best interests. We have addressed this in government Amendment 92ZZQC. This puts beyond doubt that the provisions of Clause 11 should apply to any refusal of a needs assessment by an adult with an independent personal budget. As a result, where an adult lacks capacity or is at risk of abuse or neglect, the local authority must carry out the assessment if it believes it to be in the adult’s best interests.

On Amendment 92ZZRA, I can reassure the noble Baroness that it is the Government’s intention to make regulations on choice of accommodation in residential care.

I turn to Amendments 92ZZRAA and 92ZZRAB, spoken to by the noble Baroness, Lady Wheeler. It is important that people should, as far as reasonably possible, be able to choose the accommodation they live in. People may wish to move into a care home in a new area—for example, to be close to relatives—and they should be able to do this even if this is in another local authority area. I can reassure the Committee that we intend to make regulations that enable people to exercise choice of accommodation both within and outside their current local authority. However, we do not believe that it would be appropriate to require local authorities to find and arrange care in another local authority area. While some might choose to do so, others might lack the local knowledge effectively to undertake this task. The requirement may also potentially have significant costs and could reduce the funds available to support those with the greatest needs.

I turn to Amendment 92ZZRB of the noble Baroness, Lady Greengross. Our approach in the Bill is simple. It allows any “person” nominated by the adult to receive a direct payment on their behalf, provided of course that the conditions specified in the Bill are met. In legal terms, a “person” means anyone with legal personality. Therefore, Clause 31 already allows the local authority to pay the direct payment to a person of a type specified by the adult. This includes user trusts set up as companies and organisations set up as companies.

On Amendment 92ZZS, I understand my noble friend Lord Sharkey’s concerns, and I hope I can reassure him that the local authority cannot fulfil its duties under the Bill unless it tells the adult what he or she needs to know in order to make a decision and reach agreement about whether or not to take a direct payment. Further, the Bill contains a regulation-making power at Clause 33(2)(f) to set out cases or circumstances in which the local authority must review the direct payment to ensure that it is being used and managed appropriately.

I turn now to Amendment 92ZZSA of the noble Baroness, Lady Campbell, to which the noble Baroness, Lady Wilkins, spoke. There may be only a limited set of circumstances in which a direct payment would not be appropriate, such as where needs can be met only through local authority-provided care and support. It is not our intention to for this to be used to limit access to direct payments. However, it is important that this provision remains in order to ensure that the adult’s needs are met via the most appropriate method.

Finally, I turn to Amendment 92ZZSB, spoken to by the noble Baroness, Lady Wheeler. It has always been our policy that, as long as used legally, there should be no restrictions on the type of services purchased with a direct payment, provided it accords with the care and support plan. Indeed, this reflects current guidance. Clause 25 requires the care plan to detail the needs to be met by the direct payment and, under Clause 31, a direct payment must be an appropriate way to meet those needs. There is no need to state in the Bill the type of providers from which people can purchase care and support.

The noble Baroness asked me what kind of client feedback there will be in the planning process. I am sure that she will agree that deciding the way that care needs are to be met is at the heart of a person-centred care and support planning process. These decisions should be agreed between the local authority and the person after considering the range of options and the person’s own wishes and goals.

We have made a number of changes to the draft Bill to address some of the concerns that we heard—that the balance of the care and support planning process was not adequately weighted towards the wishes of the adult. The process must also include involvement with the carer or any other nominated person, so that all people who can contribute have the opportunity to do so. It will in some circumstances not be possible to reach agreement between the local authority and the service user on the care and support plan, much as that is the aim. In those cases, the local authority will have to act to ensure that the person’s needs are met and that any risks to their safety are prevented. I hope that I have reassured the Committee that the care and support planning process is robust, and that the noble Baroness will feel able to withdraw her amendment.

[Baroness Greengross]

My Lords, I thank all noble Lords who have raised issues and amendments in this discussion, which has been extremely interesting. I also thank the Minister for his response, which was very positive in all but one or two areas, where I am still not absolutely certain that we are clear on the different levels of payments in care homes. However, I shall come back to the House on Report or speak to the noble Earl later. Again, I thank everybody, and particularly the Minister for his very positive responses. I beg leave to withdraw the amendment.

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Moved by

[Earl Howe]

92ZZQC: Clause 28, page 24, line 23, leave out from “assessment” to first “the” in line 25 and insert “and”