Infected Blood Compensation Scheme

Clive Efford Excerpts

Wednesday 23rd October 2024 Commons Chamber

[Clive Efford (Eltham and Chislehurst) (Lab)]

First, I want to express my gratitude to Members of the House who have elected me as the designated chair of the all-party parliamentary group on haemophilia and contaminated blood. I say “designated” because we are lacking a Conservative officer in the group, so we cannot register it in the normal way—

[Sir Julian Lewis (New Forest East) (Con)]

I would be delighted to volunteer to fill that gap for the hon. Gentleman.

[Clive Efford]

The right hon. Gentleman would be most welcome, and I will pass on that information. I was hoping to tease someone out by saying that! It is an honour and a challenge to follow on from the excellent leadership of my right hon. Friend and colleague, the Member for Kingston upon Hull North and Cottingham (Dame Diana Johnson). She will be an extremely tough act to follow. She was forced to stand down from the role because she was appointed to the Government.

I welcome the progress that the Government are making and I welcome today’s regulations. For many, however, the victories that were celebrated when Sir Brian Langstaff made his final report and Sir Robert Francis was appointed to lead the Infected Blood Compensation Authority, were, rather than the beginning of the end, mere milestones on a path with many miles still to go. The fear among many campaigners is that the Cabinet Office, which was responsible for delay and obfuscation over decades, is now back in charge of the compensation scheme.

I know that the Minister is earnest in his wish to see the victims of this scandal given the justice they deserve, and that he understands that we are where we are because the campaigners refused to be silenced. They took on the establishment and won, and my right hon. Friend the Member for Kingston upon Hull North and Cottingham and I cheered them on and promised to deliver for them without equivocation should we get into government.

There has been progress, and we welcome today’s regulations, but for too many the euphoria has been replaced by frustration, leading to anger and a growing fear of betrayal. That stems from the fact that the campaigners feel that they are excluded from the process they brought into being. Decisions that they insisted should not be made without them are being made without the openness and candour the Government are legislating for. The Government have an excellent opportunity, ahead of that legislation, to show what candour means in public office. That is particularly true of how the tariff has been arrived at.

For the campaigners, it is like they have won the war, only to see those they vanquished put in charge of delivering the peace. There is growing unease that this is leading to the same tactics as before: delays, lack of information about how decisions are arrived at and lack of communication from the Cabinet Office. That lack of communication is causing people to look to small charitable organisations for advice, as they struggle to understand the complex compensation process. Will Ministers commit to providing support to those organisations, so that they can continue that work, as was recommended by Sir Brian Langstaff?

I understand that the Infected Blood Compensation Authority is starting to engage with the Haemophilia Society and campaigning groups about the process and technical matters, but there is an urgent need for much more engagement than has happened thus far. We are told that the Infected Blood Compensation Authority intends to settle 20 cases by the end of the year. Why only 20? How will they be selected? The victims call these the Willy Wonka golden tickets. In the meantime, while these 20 cases are completed, another 14 people are likely to die—one victim dies on average every four days.

Justice delayed is justice denied. When Sir Brian Langstaff published his interim report in April 2023, he appealed to the Government to get on with the compensation scheme, because he was alarmed that so many people were dying without receiving the justice they deserved. That makes it imperative that people, whether infected or affected, receive the interim payments without delay. Regulations for those affected by the scandal will not be published until March 2025—yet another year on from Sir Brian’s final report. Yet again, justice is delayed; yet again, victims will die without receiving compensation.

These are people who have suffered unspeakable harm: bereaved parents who lost children; bereaved children who lost parents and suffered bullying; bereaved partners who could not have families or who were advised to abort babies for fear they may have HIV; siblings who were bullied; and siblings who, under the tariff, are currently ruled out because they were over 18. There is so much more.

It is not possible to deal with these cases without understanding each individual’s circumstances and the suffering they endured through so many years. What is needed is a bespoke system that meets individuals’ needs, but that requires far more engagement than is currently happening. The lack of engagement with victims is leading to a lack of understanding about how decisions are reached and how compensation is calculated, fuelling mistrust in the process. Many victims, whether affected or infected, have lost their faith that the full extent of their suffering will be recognised through the compensation scheme. Indeed, some campaigners have concluded that their suffering will not be recognised through the compensation scheme and that they must return to court to get the compensation they deserve.

Those suffering from hep C do not understand why their experiences mean they receive different treatment from those with HIV. That requires urgent explanation. Again, the scale of the suffering needs to be looked at case by case, and there needs to be greater engagement, so that both sides understand the concerns. Why are people with hep C being offered much lower rates of compensation unless they are near death?

Similarly, the additional payments for those experimented on, of £10,000 or £15,000, have been met with widespread derision. My constituent, Mr Lee Moorey, was a pupil at Treloar school. Having read his testimony to the inquiry, I share his sentiments. Will the Minister guarantee that that will be looked at?

We need to remind ourselves of the scale of the scandal and just how many people have died without justice. All along, people have had to fight to get justice, but they will only believe in justice if they have faith in the process. That requires the decisions to be made about them to be made with them. We have to restore their faith in the process. I understand that Sir Brian Langstaff has kept his inquiry open so that he can keep a watching brief. It would be a shame if the Chancellor, the Paymaster General or even the Prime Minister found themselves summoned before him.

Finally, my right hon. Friend promised that there will be a full debate in Government time on the scandal. When will that take place?

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Ms Nusrat Ghani)]

I call the spokesperson for the Scottish National party.

--- Later in debate ---

[Nick Thomas-Symonds]

As the right hon. Member for Salisbury (John Glen) and I have indicated, Sir Robert Francis engaged extensively around the country during the general election. The point the hon. Lady makes about continuously trying to make what is a complex scheme open and transparent is entirely fair and I share the desire to do that.

My hon. Friend the Member for Blyth and Ashington (Ian Lavery) has constantly been a powerful voice for victims of the infected blood scandal. I have indicated in previous remarks that we will engage with the charities and groups on what more support we can give to them. On the 20 cases, that is about a test-and-learn approach to try to be able to ramp up the scheme and make it operate more quickly.

On the unethical research—an appalling and dreadful practice—the Government have accepted the amount of money that was suggested, but it should be emphasised always that these are not payments in isolation; they are just a part, and in the vast majority of cases will be a small proportion, of the amounts of money that will be paid out.

The right hon. Member for Rayleigh and Wickford (Mr Francois) spoke powerfully, and I echo his words about the former right hon. Member for Horsham, with whom I had a number of conversations about this matter. I know that he was concerned and wanted to drive the matter forward. The right hon. Member for Rayleigh and Wickford spoke powerfully about the two cases in his constituency and the need for closure, which is a hugely powerful emotion.

My hon. Friend the Member for Bournemouth West (Jessica Toale) spoke powerfully about Jane Fitzgerald. She also spoke about Ronan Fitzgerald, who I understand is in the Gallery today and who is continuing the extraordinary fight for justice in which he has been engaged for so long. My hon. Friend asked a series of questions. If she writes to me with each of them, I will ensure that she receives a response.

The hon. Member for Sutton and Cheam (Luke Taylor), who is back on the Liberal Democrat Benches, raised the issue of siblings, which I addressed a moment or two ago. He is entirely right to highlight the importance of communications and transparency.

My hon. Friend the Member for Eltham and Chislehurst (Clive Efford) steps into giant shoes as the chair-designate of the APPG, because my right hon. Friend the Member for Kingston upon Hull North and Cottingham (Dame Diana Johnson) did an extraordinary job in taking this matter forward. He talked about different Government Departments. The Cabinet Office has led on this issue because of the history of the Department of Health in the 1970s and 1980s. That is why I and the previous Paymaster General took on this responsibility. My hon. Friend is right to emphasise that we should continue to engage with the infected blood community; that is a discussion I frequently have with the chair of the Infected Blood Compensation Authority, who I know shares my hon. Friend’s desire to do so.

The hon. Member for Perth and Kinross-shire (Pete Wishart) asked me about legal support, and we have accepted that it should be provided. He talked about my powers in that regard, which have been exercised. That legal support will happen, and it is hugely important that it does. We want the tariff scheme to be as quick and accessible as possible, and we want people to have that level of support.

My hon. Friend the Member for Normanton and Hemsworth (Jon Trickett) spoke powerfully of people’s scepticism about state institutions. The introduction of a duty of candour is hugely important with regard to not only this scandal, but others such as Horizon and Hillsborough. His point about document destruction was very well made, but one of the reasons for using a tariff-based scheme, rather than having thousands of individual court cases, is precisely that the documents that are available can be treated more sensitively and on the basis of the balance of probabilities.

The hon. Member for Mid Sussex (Alison Bennett) spoke extraordinarily movingly about her constituent Graham Knight, his wife Sue and the support that she provided.

It was a privilege to listen to a fantastic maiden speech by my hon. Friend the Member for Leeds North West (Katie White), who is the first female Member of Parliament for her constituency. She spoke with great Yorkshire pride and about her constituents understandably feeling let down in the past. She certainly did not let them down today with her maiden speech, which was positive about the way that politics can deliver real change. I am sure it is the start of a very fine parliamentary career. Her grandmother, Marjorie Simms, would have been extraordinarily proud of her today.

The hon. Member for South Devon (Caroline Voaden) spoke about her constituent Philip, who summed up one chilling aspect of this scandal when he said,

“our ignorance was engineered by those in power.”

It is worth reflecting on that sentence as we look at the changes that we will need to make, beyond ensuring that people receive compensation.

My hon. Friend the Member for Glasgow South (Gordon McKee) spoke powerfully about his constituent, Roberta, and the stigma that she suffered. He also spoke about the Murray family, and if he writes to me about their specific circumstances, I will ensure that he gets a response.

The hon. Member for Stratford-on-Avon (Manuela Perteghella) spoke movingly about family members and carers, and I agree with her about their huge importance. My hon. Friend the Member for Welwyn Hatfield (Andrew Lewin) spoke about the Blake family. I think that caseworkers will be hugely important in the work of the Infected Blood Compensation Authority.

I note that, understandably, the first constituent the hon. Member for St Neots and Mid Cambridgeshire (Ian Sollom) mentioned did not even want her name to be mentioned. That is an indication of the ongoing pervasive nature of this scandal.

My hon. Friend the Member for Cramlington and Killingworth (Emma Foody) spoke for all of us when she said it had taken far too long to reach justice. She is welcome to write to me about the point she raised. I think she was talking about legal fees that have already been incurred, but if she writes to me I will ensure that she gets a response.

[Clive Efford]

I am grateful to my right hon. Friend for his answers. Notwithstanding his reassurances, widespread concerns are still being expressed by those who have been affected or infected as a result of this scandal, so will he agree to a meeting with the all-party parliamentary group on haemophilia and contaminated blood, in his Department, to discuss the issues that they still want to raise?

[Nick Thomas-Symonds]

I would be only too delighted to engage with the all-party parliamentary group, and I am sure that if my hon. Friend sends an invitation in the usual way, we can find a mutually convenient date.

My hon. Friend has just referred to the all-party group, and the spirit in which this debate has been conducted is really important. It is crucial that that cross-party approach continues. We are dealing with people who have been failed by the state, and we must acknowledge that. The regulations we are debating ensure that we can finally deliver compensation to those who have fought so hard and waited so long for justice in the most harrowing of circumstances. They deserve nothing less, and I hope that colleagues across the House will join me in supporting the regulations. I commend them to the House.

Question put and agreed to.

Resolved,

That the Infected Blood Compensation Scheme Regulations 2024 (SI, 2024, No. 872), dated 22 August 2024, a copy of which was laid before this House on 23 August, be approved.

Reporting Ministerial Gifts and Hospitality

Clive Efford Excerpts

Monday 14th October 2024 Commons Chamber

[Ellie Reeves]

As I said to the right hon. Gentleman in my first response, this Government are committed to rebuilding trust in politics. The Prime Minister has commissioned a new set of principles on gifts and hospitality, which will be published shortly. That will outlaw the Tory freebie loophole, because this Government are committed to being more up front and open than our predecessors.

We will take no lectures from the Conservative party on gifts and hospitality, standards in public life or trust in politics. Let me tell the right hon. Gentleman what shattered trust in politics: the behaviour of the Conservatives in their 14 years in power. They partied in Downing Street while the whole country sacrificed its freedom. They handed lucrative covid contracts to friends and donors, and failed to expel MPs who were caught breaking the rules. That is the difference between this Government and the last one.

We are strengthening the rules. When Owen Paterson was found to have broken the rules, the Conservatives tried to rip them up, and now they want us to believe that they care about trust in politics. This is utterly shameless. Of course, it was not just Tory sleaze and scandal that eroded trust; just as corrosive has been the complete and utter failure of Conservative politicians to keep the promises they made to the British people. Now the work of change begins. As I have already set out, it starts with rebuilding trust in our politics, which we are committed to doing. The cynical and confected outrage that we have heard from the right hon. Gentleman today is fooling no one. If Conservative Members really want to help repair the damage they caused to trust in politics, they would do well to back the changes we are making, and to say sorry for the sleaze and scandal that plagued their 14 years in power.

[Clive Efford (Eltham and Chislehurst) (Lab)]

The Conservatives have some brass neck criticising the Government on this subject when it was the Conservatives who set up the VIP lane for contracts during covid, and who accepted many gifts that they did not have to declare. My hon. Friend is absolutely right to close the loophole. I point out to the right hon. Member for Salisbury (John Glen) that he refused to vote for the Committee of Privileges report on Boris Johnson, who lied to this House. How is that improving standards in political life? What a performance!

[Ellie Reeves]

My hon. Friend is right to point out the VIP lanes for covid contracts. The fact is that Conservative Members had the opportunity to take a stand when Owen Paterson broke the rules, and they voted instead to rip up those very rules.

Anniversary of 7 October Attacks: Middle East

Clive Efford Excerpts

Monday 7th October 2024 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

I agree with the right hon. Gentleman that we must stand by Israel and be absolutely clear about Israel’s right to defend herself, particularly at this time of escalation by Iran. On the Iranian regime, we have to be really clear that we stand with Israel and clear in condemning Iran, and we have to do that with our allies with one voice, so that the message is heard very powerfully.

[Clive Efford (Eltham and Chislehurst) (Lab)]

May I associate myself with the condemnation of the atrocities committed by Hamas a year ago? That said, there is a growing humanitarian crisis in Gaza, and the restriction on aid is unacceptable. What more can the international community do to achieve the free movement of aid into Gaza?

[The Prime Minister]

I addressed that in my statement: we need to get more humanitarian aid in; it is desperately needed, and has been needed for a very long time. That is why we continue to press for that aid to go in, and for the protection to go in for those who will be delivering it once the aid gets into Gaza, as is desperately needed.

Grenfell Tower Inquiry Phase 2 Report

Clive Efford Excerpts

Wednesday 4th September 2024 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

Yes, and that is a really important point. Regardless of where someone lives or which Government they live under, the right to safe and secure housing is important. The Deputy Prime Minister has already met the First Minister of Scotland, and we will take every opportunity to work jointly on this issue.

[Clive Efford (Eltham and Chislehurst) (Lab)]

How many times must we come here and hear another example of how the state, which should be on the side of ordinary people, becomes the enemy of working-class people? We have had Hillsborough, the Horizon Post Office scandal, the contaminated blood scandal, Windrush, and the treatment of former armed forces personnel who are members of the LGBT community. In each of those, the state has become the enemy of the people and delayed paying compensation to them.

Can the Grenfell inquiry be a watershed when we end the process by which the state becomes the enemy of working-class people, we treat them with the dignity they deserve, and we ensure that their compensation is paid rapidly and not delayed, as it has been in all those other cases? In the case of freeholders who are still holding out and not paying for the remedial work to their properties, it is about time they paid fines for delaying that work.

[The Prime Minister]

That is a really important point, because there have been I don’t know how many examples of injustice where people have not been listened to and have been disregarded. Different Prime Ministers over the years have stood at this Dispatch Box and quite genuinely made commitments on the back of reports. I do not doubt that for a minute. I think every Prime Minister who has stood here in relation to any of those injustices meant every word that he or she said in response, and yet it goes on. So there is something more fundamental that we have to make time to consider, because I do not want to be back at this Dispatch Box—or any future Prime Minister to be at this Dispatch Box—having a version of the same discussion about injustice, about people being disregarded, not listened to and not taken seriously after the event for too long, and about justice coming too late for people who desperately need it. That is what I mean by turning a corner.

Infected Blood Compensation Scheme

Clive Efford Excerpts

Monday 2nd September 2024 Commons Chamber

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Caroline Nokes)]

I call Clive Efford.

[Clive Efford (Eltham and Chislehurst) (Lab)]

Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker. I congratulate you on your new position.

I am grateful to the Minister for keeping in contact and keeping me informed of progress on this matter. I have two constituents who are directly affected—one affected and one infected. My constituent’s husband, who died 30 years ago, was a former Treloar’s pupil, and she has recently received a payment, but there is no written explanation of what she has received. She does not know if it is for her, her son, her husband, or all three of them, and she does not know how it is going to be delivered, including whether it will be through her husband’s estate and if that will plunge her back into probate. Some affected people are still experiencing issues.

My other constituent is a former Treloar’s pupil, and he is upset about the £15,000 payment and does not think it is anywhere near enough. I think this shows that those people who have been campaigning for 40 years want to be more involved in the decisions being made about them. I hear what the Minister has said, but I certainly think that they want to hear how they are going to be engaged so that they can make their voices heard about the issues. While generally welcoming what has been proposed, they want to be able to influence things as they go forwards, and I would like to hear from him how he thinks that can be achieved.

[Nick Thomas-Symonds]

I am very grateful to my hon. Friend for his question. On the first point he makes about his constituent who has received a payment but without any clear explanation, one of the things the Government are committed to do is to try to make this whole process as clear as we possibly can. If he wants to write to me about that particular case, I can ensure that the explanation and, indeed, the correspondence is looked at appropriately.

On my hon. Friend’s second point, he is absolutely right that the voice of victims must continue to be heard. I think the consultation exercise that took place during the general election campaign was hugely important. It is important that the Government listened and made the substantial changes to the scheme we have made on that basis. It is hugely important, too, that the voice of victims continues to be heard as the infected blood compensation scheme continues its work, and I know that is a shared priority for Sir Robert Francis. On the £15,000, can I also say that we accepted that recommendation in full from Sir Robert Francis? It is a marker of the appalling unethical medical research, but as I said in my response to the shadow Paymaster General, the overall awards, which appear under five different heads of loss, will of course be substantially larger, and that is a very small part of them.

Infected Blood Inquiry

Clive Efford Excerpts

Friday 26th July 2024 Commons Chamber

[Nick Thomas-Symonds]

I am very grateful to the right hon. Gentleman for the characteristically collegiate way in which he approached his perfectly reasonable questions. I shall deal with them one by one.

I will certainly push for the debate to be scheduled as soon as possible. It is really important that across the House we are able to comprehensively consider not just the recommendations, but the level and scale of the criticisms that have been made. Yes, the Government will respond one by one to the 12 recommendations made by Sir Brian Langstaff. In relation to Sir Robert Francis, I entirely agree with the right hon. Gentleman about the need for transparency. I certainly undertake to publish those findings and that report ahead of the regulation to operationalise the scheme being laid by 24 August.

In relation to the right hon. Member’s point about the 90 days, my understanding is that the payments were completed on 24 June, which is within that 90-day period, but there will be, as I announced in my statement, additional interim payments to the estates of infected people and that process will begin from October.

With regard to parliamentary scrutiny, I welcome the scrutiny that there rightly will be on this, whether it is by PACAC or, indeed, by the House more generally. I certainly undertake, as the right hon. Gentleman did, to ensure that all relevant information is provided to the prosecuting authorities as they see fit for any action that needs to be taken against specific individuals.

Finally, in respect of memorialisation, Sir Brian Langstaff set out that there should be memorials in the constituent parts of the United Kingdom, and also a specific memorial to those children who were sent to Treloar’s for protection, but who ended up in the hideous situation of being experimented on when they were at their most vulnerable. I look forward to taking forward the process, as the right hon. Gentleman committed to do, of ensuring that we do have appropriate memorialisation, which is crucial to recognising the scale of what happened.

[Clive Efford (Eltham and Chislehurst) (Lab)]

May I congratulate you, Madam Deputy Speaker, on your elevation to your position?

I welcome the Minister’s statement this morning, but can he say a little more about how the compensation authority will arrive at its decisions? There is concern that advisers have undue influence on the Cabinet Office and that the voices of those who have been infected and affected are not being heard sufficiently in this process. There are concerns about the compensation process and whether that will be in addition to, or conflated with, support payments; the non-payment of exemplary or punitive damages; the lack of recognition of the impact of illegal experimentation or the knowing use of contaminated blood products; and the payments that will be made to estates where people have died. The people who really should be scrutinising this are those who have been infected and affected, so will the Minister commit to involving them in the compensation authority, so that they can have confidence in the decisions that are being made?

[Nick Thomas-Symonds]

I am grateful to my hon. Friend for his questions. First, may I say that, of course, the voice of victims should be absolutely central to this. I thank Sir Robert Francis for the work that he did in the general election purdah period to ensure that that is the case. I will consider very carefully the recommendations that Sir Robert makes on the basis of that engagement and hearing the voice of the victims.

I want to deal with one other point that my hon. Friend raised, which was to do with the future of the infected blood support schemes. I understand that there has been concern about this. The current proposal is that no immediate changes will be made to the infected blood support schemes. Payments will continue to be made at the same level until 31 March next year, and they will not be deducted from any compensation awards.

From 1 April next year, people who receive the England infected blood support scheme payments will continue to receive them until such time that their case is assessed under the new scheme by the Infected Blood Compensation Authority. Once assessed under the scheme, the applicant will be able to choose how to receive their compensation, either as a lump-sum or periodic payment. I hope that that gives my hon. Friend the reassurance he seeks.

I have absolute confidence in Sir Robert Francis to run the Infected Blood Compensation Authority in an entirely appropriate way. I was in the Chamber when his appointment as the interim chair was announced, and it was welcomed warmly, as I recall, from the Public Gallery by the infected blood community.

Infected Blood Compensation Scheme

Clive Efford Excerpts

Tuesday 21st May 2024 Commons Chamber

[John Glen]

I thank the hon. Lady for point about a duty of candour, which several hon. Members have made. The Government will reflect very carefully and respond in due course.

[Clive Efford (Eltham) (Lab)]

I welcome the Paymaster General’s statement, but many of us have been coming here for the past year asking for a response to Sir Brian Langstaff’s interim report from last April. We have been told that the Government are moving at pace, but there is no evidence of that, even with today’s statement. Sir Brian Langstaff has made some clear recommendations about how he wants oversight of the recommendations going forward. That must involve the victims, because that is why we are here today. The victims, who have doggedly and determinedly demanded that they have justice in this affair, have brought us to this point, where the Paymaster General is making a statement, and they must have oversight of how we respond to Sir Brian Langstaff’s report, just as the House must have. Members from across the House have been trying to hold the Government to account. The Horizon scheme has an advisory body to oversee compensation, which includes hon. Members from this House and the other place. Does the Minister envisage having a similar advisory body for this compensation scheme?

[John Glen]

I do not think the hon. Gentleman can characterise what I have announced today as not making significant progress. I am not here to claim credit for it or to say what it is attributed to, other than the work of Sir Brian Langstaff and those who have campaigned. The immediate next steps will be the work of Sir Robert Francis—this is at the core of what I have said—to engage with the infected and affected community, and to define the regulations that the Government are rightly obliged to bring to the House within three months of the Bill receiving Royal Assent. The hon. Gentleman makes another point about how the House can be involved in the accountability of that arm’s length body. I am happy to reflect on that and come back at another point.

Infected Blood Inquiry

Clive Efford Excerpts

Tuesday 23rd April 2024 Commons Chamber

[Clive Efford (Eltham) (Lab)]

“Cheaper than chimpanzees” was how former pupils of Treloar’s school described themselves when they gave evidence to the inquiry. My constituent, Lee Moorey, was one of the pupils of that school, and has described to me how he felt that he was experimented on all those years ago. We have set up the Brian Langstaff inquiry; what more can the Government possibly want to know than what that inquiry is going to uncover, and why are they delaying compensation? Will the Minister confirm that nothing has been preventing the Government from paying compensation since the date that Brian Langstaff published his interim report last April?

[John Glen]

There is a challenge in translating 18 recommendations into numbers and into the reality of a transmission mechanism, as well as in the quantification and agreement across Whitehall. The work on the first part is under way: that is why we have engaged the experts to work out how to quantify the payments that will be due across different heads of loss. Quite reasonably, those numbers were not in the report—it would not be for Sir Brian Langstaff to put numbers on every single individual—but that work is under way. We are now working to agree the substantive response as soon as we can after the final report is published.

Tributes to Sir Tony Lloyd

Clive Efford Excerpts

Tuesday 23rd January 2024 Commons Chamber

[Clive Efford (Eltham) (Lab)]

I wanted to speak today to pass on my condolences to Tony’s family, but also to mark somebody who is one of the most standout individuals I have come across in the 27 years that I have been in this House. I first got to know him soon after I was elected in 1997; we were members of the same trade union group. He was somebody who you looked forward to meeting socially around the place because he was always good company, and he was somebody who was always wise and worth listening to, whether it was here in the Chamber or in discussions elsewhere.

Perhaps I got to know Tony best when I joined the parliamentary Labour party committee when he was chair of the PLP. You will remember, Mr Speaker, as will those of us who were here at the time, what we went through with the expenses issues, where MPs came under a considerable amount of criticism. Tony’s leadership really came to the fore there. His calmness and his ability to influence what was going on were really exemplary. I used to sit in the committee when the civil servant—I will not name him—who had been invited to set up the Independent Parliamentary Standards Authority came in to talk down to us, I have to say. Tony was very calm, as always, and I was not. I always thought that in his negotiations, Tony went away and said, “If you don’t negotiate with me, I’m going to set him on you.” His personal skills really got us through that time; I remember that time very well.

I was also a member of the Justice for Colombia group, and I know that they will want to pass on their sympathies to Tony’s family. He had enormous influence on the work of Justice for Colombia and in supporting the peace process in that country, which has eventually made enormous changes there. Tony was a driving force, both in the trade union movement and in this place, in supporting Justice for Colombia. He was the embodiment of the word “comradeship”—whether it was through his kindness and decency, his compassion, his courageousness, it all shone through. He was among the best of us, and we will miss him dearly.

Oral Answers to Questions

Clive Efford Excerpts

Thursday 18th January 2024 Commons Chamber

[Oliver Dowden]

I would be very happy to do so. As my right hon. Friend points out, cyber-insurance plays a vital role in helping to build resilience and we have a shared interest in developing it. The National Cyber Security Centre has stood up the cyber-insurance industry working group, which is working through all these issues. I have met with Lloyd’s of London, and both I and Treasury Ministers will be happy to have further such meetings.

[Clive Efford (Eltham) (Lab)]

Has the Secretary of State read the speech made by the Auditor General this week about cyber-security, which said that lack of investment in upgrading our infrastructure makes the Government vulnerable to cyber-attack? Is he comfortable that we are safe from such attack? Does that not show that the Tories are penny wise but pound stupid?