Ann Clwyd

Beth Winter Excerpts

Tuesday 19th September 2023 Commons Chamber

[Beth Winter (Cynon Valley) (Lab)]

Thank you for granting this debate, Mr Deputy Speaker. First of all, I thank Ann’s family and friends, some of whom have joined us in the Gallery, for their support as we in the Chamber pay tribute to Ann Clwyd. Croeso i chi—welcome to you. I did not know Ann as well as many of those present this evening, having met her on only a handful of occasions. However, since I was elected I have had many positive conversations with local people and activists who knew her. Others will have had much more direct experience of working alongside Ann, and I thank them for coming to pay their tributes.

When I look back at Ann Clwyd’s life and career, I so much respect her work, and I think so much of it resonates with what we face today. Ann was a strong, independently minded woman, an advocate for women’s rights, international human rights, the Welsh language, good-quality public services and so much more. She was the first woman to be elected as an MP for the south Wales valleys, so I take pride in having had the opportunity to follow in her footsteps in Cynon Valley.

[Kevin Brennan (Cardiff West) (Lab)]

Having sat for many years next to Ann on this very spot on the Back Benches, and on the other side of the House as well, I want to echo my hon. Friend’s remarks about Ann’s incredible passion, pride and sense of justice, but I also want to mention her sense of mischief and the twinkle in her eye. She brought both passion and humour to this Chamber. She is sadly missed, and we are all greatly diminished by the lack of her presence in this House. Certainly in Cardiff West, where in her latter years she was a very active constituent and correspondent with me as her local MP, I certainly miss her letters, even though they created a great deal of work for me here in this place.

[Beth Winter]

I thank my hon. Friend for that intervention.

Ann understood the need to keep jobs in local communities. Tyrone O’Sullivan, leader of the Tower Colliery buy-out, who sadly also passed away earlier this year, spoke at an event for Ann that was organised in March last year by our local Labour women’s branch in Cynon Valley. Tyrone acknowledged and celebrated Ann’s contribution to the fight for Tower Colliery, and he reminded me, only weeks before his death, of the importance of the working-class struggle for today. They showed the way to build local economies, building local wealth for local people, not encouraging local people to leave in order to get on in life. I share that vision and I try to carry on in the same vein with my work on the local economy in Cynon Valley.

Ann fought battles on behalf of miners. When she became MP, our constituency was in the throes of fighting to keep the mining industry alive. Next year, we will remember 40 years since the 1984 miners’ strike—the year when Ann became MP for Cynon Valley. I was, as a child, on the demonstration through the town of Aberdare with Ann. In her maiden speech in Parliament, Ann said that the miners’ strike was

“a symbolic fight, a fight against the two Britains—the haves and the have nots. It is a protest on behalf of a lost generation of young men and women who have never been able to find a job in the valleys of South Wales.”

That fight continues. Public service workers, rail workers and health workers today are fighting against two Britains—the haves and the have nots.

Ann also fought tirelessly for compensation for miners suffering health problems as a result of their work. As she said in the same speech:

“It is a heartbreaking experience—I wish that Conservative Members could share it—to see a miner gasping for breath even while using an oxygen mask. Yet, because he has not been diagnosed as suffering from pneumoconiosis, he does not get a penny in compensation. That is more than wrong, it is cruel and unjust.”—[Official Report, 7 June 1984; Vol. 61, c. 476-77.]

I, like other Members in the Chamber, am currently involved in the ongoing battle for miners’ pension rights and compensation, so again the fight goes on; the thread of history continues.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I commend the hon. Lady for securing the debate. I know that I have not been in the House as long as other Members who will speak, but I just wanted to add a very quick contribution if she will allow me.

When I came here in 2010, Ann Clwyd would sit just about there, and I sat here. She was always a very strong and determined lady—I found her a lady of strong will. Although she was always charming and had a lovely smile, I always figured that it would not be a good thing to get on the wrong side of her. I have always been surrounded by strong ladies so I know how to adapt to that.

Here is a story. Ann was sitting here one night during an Adjournment debate, with just the Minister, the previous Mr Speaker and—as usual for the Adjournment, as everyone knows—myself in the Chamber. Her phone went off and was ringing quite loudly. I looked up at her and she never flinched. The phone kept ringing. I looked at Mr Speaker, and he mumbled something to me like, “Get the handbag!” So I took the handbag, with the ringing phone, out the back and left it there. I could still hear it ringing away, but I could not get it turned off—that was part of the problem.

I have one other quick wee story. Ann loved cats with a passion, as does my wife, so when Ann brought in her bags with cats on them, I said, “You and my wife would get on because she loves cats as well.” Ann left an impression on me, an MP since 2010, and I think it only right that the hon. Member for Cynon Valley (Beth Winter) has secured this debate. It is lovely to see Ann’s family—I had never met any of you before tonight. I say well done to the hon. Lady. We have fond, fond memories of a special lady.

[Beth Winter]

I thank my hon. Friend.

Ann also advocated strongly against cuts to benefits, recognising the need to fight against poverty and any policies that would further impoverish people. Her stand on any attempts to cut benefits is an ongoing battle that many of us continue to fight as the cost of living crisis hits the poorest the hardest.

[Mary Kelly Foy (City of Durham) (Lab)]

Is my hon. Friend aware of Ann’s important work in standing up for victims of abuse? Ann was a constant voice for the survivors of the north-west Wales care home abuse scandal, some of whom were her constituents. When others ignored those voices, Ann spoke out, not just once but many times, at a time when victims were often disbelieved, sometimes with tragic consequences. Does my hon. Friend agree that that speaks to Ann’s courage, fearlessness and commitment to human rights?

[Beth Winter]

I thank my hon. Friend. Ann was indeed fearless. This afternoon, we had the privilege of spending some time with her family, and we talked about her involvement with and advocacy on behalf of those suffering abuse, for whom she fought tirelessly.

Ann’s opposition back in 1997 to the abolition of lone-parent benefits was something she spoke passionately about. She said at the time:

“There is great concern in the Parliamentary Labour Party. Even people who voted with the government went into the lobbies feeling very distressed. They don’t want to see it happen again.”

Again, Ann’s opposition to cuts to benefits and her advocacy on behalf of the disadvantaged resonates strongly with us today, in particular the stand that many of us are taking in the parliamentary Labour party against the two-child benefit cap. I believe that Ann, too, would have supported this week’s Right to Food campaign, which is being led by my hon. Friend the Member for Liverpool, West Derby (Ian Byrne), and the fightback against the cost of living crisis.

It would be remiss of me not to say that Ann and I would not have agreed on everything. I believe she was wrong about the Iraq war. I will always also respect her stand in support of the rights of oppressed people throughout the world.

[Wayne David (Caerphilly) (Lab)]

I knew Ann for 40 years, and above all else, she was an internationalist; she cared about people and human rights. I remember that on one occasion she was dismissed from the Front Bench because she went to Kurdistan to show solidarity with the people there, without permission from the Whips. She was a passionate believer in the rights of people throughout the world. She should be remembered also for her commitment to the Inter-Parliamentary Union, of which she chaired the British group. Her support for human rights throughout the world, whether in Iraq, Kurdistan or anywhere else, was wonderful.

[Beth Winter]

My hon. Friend’s intervention is very timely, because I was just coming on to the point that Ann was renowned for her internationalism, from Cambodia to South Africa, to East Timor and Turkey, and of course, her commitment to supporting the Kurdish people. She was for over 20 years chair of the all-party parliamentary group on human rights, which continues to raise awareness of serious human rights violations throughout the world. She was also a member of numerous parliamentary Committees, including those on International Development and Foreign Affairs, and she headed the IPU Committee on the Human Rights of Parliamentarians throughout the world. As my hon. Friend said, Ann was sacked not once but twice from the shadow Cabinet.

[Angela Rayner (Ashton-under-Lyne) (Lab)]

May I thank my hon. Friend for securing this Adjournment debate and express my condolences to Ann’s family and her many friends? I thought that, with that reference to the shadow Cabinet, I should come in. I know that Ann was very keen to say that she was not sacked for incompetence.

I could always rely on Ann for support and wisdom. I even tried to repay it—I played an important role in Ann’s successful campaign for Westminster Cat of the Year, as her campaign manager for the ginger tomcat Alfie. Does my hon. Friend agree that, with her commitment to social justice and to the most vulnerable both at home and abroad, there will not be another MP like Ann again, but that does not mean we should not all try to be like her?

[Beth Winter]

I could not agree more with my right hon. Friend’s sentiments.

Ann was opposed to the sale of arms to oppressive regimes. These fights, again, sadly continue, and we continue to live in a dangerous world.

[Richard Burgon (Leeds East) (Lab)]

My hon. Friend is giving a fantastic tribute to Ann, who so many Members on both sides of the House, as well as her constituents, loved so much. Ann was Labour through and through, very principled and a lovely person. Does my hon. Friend agree that she also represented the best in our party’s tradition, this Parliament’s tradition and our democracy’s tradition of independent-minded public service and being a true conviction politician? As my hon. Friend said, not everyone would have agreed with everything that Ann said, but that is fine—that is what our democracy is all about. We can all learn from Ann when we think about how we go about our politics, and I thank my hon. Friend for paying such a well-deserved tribute to somebody we loved so much.

[Beth Winter]

I thank my hon. Friend for his comments. Again, I could not agree more.

Ann was 100% right in the stand that she made on those humanitarian issues and so many others, such as ending female genital mutilation, and she was not afraid to take unpopular positions on issues she felt very strongly about. Nicole Piche, who was co-ordinator and legal adviser to the all-party parliamentary human rights group when Ann chaired it, said:

“Although she was firmly rooted in and a staunch advocate for the Labour Party, having held a number of Shadow portfolios when Labour was in opposition, she did not hold back when she disagreed with its policies, and was happy to work cross-party to advance the many causes she espoused.”

As we all know, Ann was not afraid to speak her mind without fear or favour. Agree with her or not, whether on the Iraq war or her stance on Brexit, we all have to admire her forthrightness and her ability to keep to her beliefs.

[John McDonnell (Hayes and Harlington) (Lab)]

I am grateful to my hon. Friend for giving way, and I apologise: I am speaking at a rally in a few minutes’ time, which Ann would have agreed with, so I will have to leave.

The one thing about Ann was that she never gave up, and if you ever crossed her, she never gave up either. I was on a Select Committee last year that was interviewing someone—I will not go into the detail of it, but it was someone she had come across in the 1980s with regard to Vietnam and Laos. She noticed that we were interviewing this individual, so she sent me a 20-page briefing on them and all the subsequent offences, crimes and so on that they had perpetrated. She was not doing it out of spite or anything like that; she was doing it as part of her campaign to expose the injustices that went on at that time and all those who were implicated in them. In some instances that annoyed people, and sometimes her persistence rubbed people up the wrong way, but for me, it made me love her even more.

[Beth Winter]

I thank my right hon. Friend—“persistence” describes Ann in many respects. I have also had the honour of speaking to her longest-standing colleague in Parliament, Lord Campbell-Savours, who referred to Ann as “Clwyd”. He said that “Clwyd was the most courageous woman I have ever met in my life. She was fiercely independent, knew her own mind and refused to be labelled. Clwyd was what I call a real radical.” He repeated the term “radical”—to him, she was the most radical person he had ever met. They were long-standing friends.

I have also spoken to lots of constituents. A local story about Ann’s forthright approach relates to her canvassing in an election. She was using a loudspeaker, which she did very often throughout the Cynon Valley. A local resident came out and started to harangue her, so in very colourful language—not unlike that used recently by the Secretary of State for Education, which I am unable to use here—Ann told him to go away. Unfortunately, she forgot that the loudspeaker was still on, so everybody got to hear Ann’s colourful language. Her language could be colourful at times, as I am sure her family would agree. Another story that I was told was of Ann comparing a Tory MP’s fur collar to a dead cat around her neck when she criticised Ann for her position on late abortions. Ann did a lot of work on abortion rights, which again is an issue that is still in the political melting pot, as women are still having to fight to decriminalise abortion.

Ann had a very deep and personal interest and involvement in health matters over many years, particularly in a personal capacity in her latter years. At one time, she sat as a member of the South Glamorgan health board alongside a Cynon Valley GP, the late Dr Alistair Wilson, who always felt that Ann wanted services to be the best possible for people. She fully supported the national health service, but with a critical eye—and, oh, did she have a critical eye.

Ann did move on the international stage, but that did not prevent her from paying attention to local issues. Like many other people, one young local person—Richard Jones, who is now a disability rights local champion—asked for help. He recalls that when he asked her for help with a school project as a schoolboy, she sent him so much information that he got top marks for it. Later, he was the constituency Labour party chair when she made her retirement speech at the constituency party, so he had known her throughout his life.

[Dame Nia Griffith (Llanelli) (Lab)]

I congratulate my hon. Friend on securing this debate and on her excellent speech. Does she agree that, in addition to her many political achievements, Ann was a true friend to us all? As my hon. Friend has described, Ann took a genuine interest in all our concerns. She commanded our trust and she did that challenging task of showing real leadership as chair of the parliamentary Labour party—quite a task to fulfil. It was that genuine interest in people and the trust that we were able to put in her that enabled her to do that. I do agree with my hon. Friend, and I hope she agrees with me.

[Beth Winter]

I completely agree. Ann did take an interest in people and was very patient when listening to their concerns.

Ann had first-class support from staff in her constituency and in Parliament, and I recognise the importance of that as a Member of Parliament. I have had a conversation with the family today, and I am sure nobody will mind if I make specific reference to one person in particular: her friend, confidant and mainstay in Cynon Valley, Jean Fitzgerald, who was also a great support to myself. Sadly, Jean died shortly after Ann retired, but the closeness between them was so evident, particularly when Ann paid tribute to Jean at her funeral.

[Mary Kelly Foy]

I thank my hon. Friend for giving way again. I did not know Ann at all, but my parliamentary assistant worked for her and has relayed very fond memories of her. One in particular was about Ann’s kindness to her late friend and colleague, John Stevenson. Members will know that John was a political correspondent for BBC Wales, but for several years before that he had been homeless and had struggled with alcohol addiction. Ann had known John when they were young journalists in Wales, and she sought him out when she became an MP. She knew he had fallen on hard times, so she gave him a job working for her. It was his second chance and a chance to rebuild his life, and it was something he never forgot. I am sure the whole House will agree when I say that that just shows the depth of Ann’s compassion towards people, the breadth of her humanity and kindness, and the essence of her remarkable character.

[Beth Winter]

I thank my hon. Friend for that, and I think that kindness, compassion and humanity are words that really do sum up Ann in so many ways.

I am almost at my conclusion, but I need to say that the fight does continue. Just as Ann fought so fearlessly for what she believed in, we in this place must continue those fights. I know that she would want us to do that so that the people we represent can benefit from a just and more equal society with international peace and justice.

Before I conclude, I want to say that many other Members wished to contribute today, including my hon. Friend the Member for Gower (Tonia Antoniazzi), my hon. Friend the Member for Lancaster and Fleetwood (Cat Smith), who worked with Ann on social work to a large extent, my hon. Friend the Member for South Shields (Mrs Lewell-Buck) and my right hon. Friend the Member for Hackney North and Stoke Newington (Ms Abbott), who unfortunately cannot be here this evening, and also the right hon. Member for Clwyd West (Mr Jones), from the Government Benches. Many, many more MPs have paid tribute to Ann and would have been here if they could.

Felly, Ann, diolch i chi am helpu i gadw ein hiaith yn fyw, a diolch am frwydro dros hawliau dynol, yn erbyn anghyfiawnder, dros y tlawd, i gael gwasanaethau da i bobl, a dros hawliau menywod. A diolch am fod yn fenyw oedd yn barod i sefyll i fyny a siarad ei meddwl—heb os nac oni bai, menyw gadarn gydag egwyddorion cryf. I orffen, gair i’r teulu a ffrindiau agos: mae mor bwysig ein bod ni’n cofio Ann, yn siarad amdani ac yn dathlu ei bywyd fel hyn. Diolch i chi am gytuno i ni, fel Aelodau Seneddol, i gael y cyfle yma heddiw. Pob cydymdeimlad gyda chi, ac atgofion da.

I have been told that I have to repeat that in English, but then I am finished. Ann, thank you for helping to keep our language alive. Thank you for fighting for human rights and the poor, fighting against injustice, fighting to get good services for people and fighting for women’s rights. Thank you for being a woman who was ready to stand up and speak her mind. Without a doubt, you were a strong woman with strong principles. To finish, a word to Ann’s family and close friends: it is so important that we remember Ann, talk about her and celebrate her life in this way. We all wish to offer thanks for us as Members of Parliament having been allowed this opportunity today. My condolences, and our condolences, to you, and fond memories.