Baroness McIntosh of Pickering
Main Page: Baroness McIntosh of Pickering (Conservative - Life peer)Local Government Finance Bill
Baroness McIntosh of Pickering Excerpts(12 years, 10 months ago)
Commons ChamberRead Full debate Read Hansard Text
Mr Howarth
George—not only a different party, but an entirely different politics, Miss McIntosh.
It is a pleasure to follow the hon. Member for Portsmouth South (Mr Hancock). Both he and the hon. Member for Mid Dorset and North Poole (Annette Brooke) made a plea for constructive suggestions. I tried to intervene on the hon. Lady’s contribution with a constructive suggestion, but I think she thought that I was going to be disagreeable, and she refused to accept my intervention.
Many hon. Members have mentioned the consequences of protecting pensioners in the overall scheme, and I will not labour the point. It is important to say at the outset that nobody on the Opposition Benches and, I am sure, elsewhere, disagrees with the principle that pensioners should be protected. It is an important principle, to which we all subscribe. The difficulty that we are trying to address is not the Government’s decree that pensioners should be protected but their failure to deal with the consequences of that in the context of a 10% overall cut.
Some contributions have referred to the impact. For example, the hon. Member for Poole (Mr Syms) wanted more information about how the proposal would work in practice. I would like to rely on a briefing that the special interest group of municipal authorities—SIGOMA—has given me. It is a local government representative group, but of a particular set of local authorities. It concludes that, to protect pensioners’ council tax credit, the rest of council tax payers nationally will face a reduction of 17% rather than 10%. We are talking about averages, and we discussed the problem of averages earlier. The range means that, at the bottom end, the figure will be 13.4%, and at the high end, it will be 25.2%. Those who have concerns should take those figures into account.
I will talk about Knowsley shortly. It is a Knowsley problem—there is a distinct flavour of Knowsley to it—but every hon. Member will be confronted with it if the scheme is implemented in its current form.
The Temporary Chair (Miss Anne McIntosh)
Order. Will the hon. Member for North Durham (Mr Jones) contain himself?
Mr Ward
I sincerely doubt it, but thank you, Miss McIntosh.
Members have noted that if pensioners are protected, the burden will have to be picked up by others, who may be on low incomes. [Interruption.] That is not necessarily the case, because we do not know what the new freedoms will generate, and they may generate sufficient funds to make up the gap.
As a result of the proposals, Bradford faces a £4 million loss in council tax. The figure for the funding that will be generated from the new-found freedoms, if they are extended to new areas, is actually very substantial, and it is not far off that £4 million figure.
The Temporary Chair (Miss Anne McIntosh)
In view of the debate that we have just had, and the nature of the next two groups of amendments, I inform the Committee that I am unlikely to allow a separate debate on clause 8 stand part.
Helen Jones
I beg to move amendment 66, page 5, line 6, at end insert—
‘(1A) In exercising its powers under section 1(b) the authority must have regard to the impact of the scheme on—
(a) those persons in the area who are in employment or actively seeking employment, and
(b) the levels of poverty in the area, including the levels of child poverty.’.
The Temporary Chair
With this it will be convenient to discuss the following:
Amendment 49, page 5, line 17, at end insert—
‘(4A) In exercising its powers under subsection (1)(b), each authority must have regard to the impact of its scheme on the living standards of those persons in its area who, prior to the introduction of the scheme, were receiving council tax benefit.
(4B) In exercising its powers under subsection (1)(b), each authority must have regard to the impact of its scheme on the living standards of those persons in its area, below pensionable age, who are in employment or are actively seeking employment.’.
Amendment 59, page 5, line 28, leave out ‘2013’ and insert ‘2014’.
Amendment 60, page 5, line 29, leave out ‘2013’ and insert ‘2014’.
Amendment 67, in schedule 4, page 47, line 6, at end insert ‘and set out the steps which the local authority will take to ensure that—
(a) persons entitled to a reduction will be made aware of their entitlement, and
(b) assistance is available to such persons who wish to make an application.’.
Amendment 56, in schedule 4, page 48, line 7, at end insert—
(e) require authorities to have regard to the impact of its scheme on—
(i) the numbers of persons in its area expected to receive a greater or lesser reduction in council tax than that which they had been entitled to receive under council tax benefit, and the amounts by which their entitlement are likely to increase or reduce,
(ii) the living standards of such persons,
(iii) the financial incentive on persons below pensionable age to seek or maintain employment.’.
Amendment 68, in schedule 4, page 48, line 15, at end insert—
‘including local charities, organisations providing advice on benefits and organisations representing older people.’.
Amendment 54, page 48, line 39, at end insert—
(f) include estimates of the likely impact of its scheme on the living standards of those persons in its area who have been receiving council tax benefit.’.
Amendment 57, page 48, line 44, leave out ‘2013’ and insert ‘2014’.
Amendment 58, page 49, line 5, leave out ‘2013’ and insert ‘2014’.
Amendment 70, page 49, line 13, at end insert—
‘In considering the need for replacement or revision of the scheme the authority must have regard to the impact of any such revision or replacement on the living standards of people in the area including—
(a) those of working age in employment and actively seeking work,
(b) those in receipt of benefits including disability benefits, and
(c) persons of pensionable age.’.
Amendment 71, page 50, line 23, at end insert—
‘Before issuing such guidance the Secretary of State must have regard to the impact on—
(a) those of working age in employment and actively seeking work,
(b) those in receipt of benefits including disability benefits, and
(c) persons of pensionable age.’.
Helen Jones
This group of amendments deals with the impact of the proposed changes in council tax benefit on some of the poorest people in the country. One of the keys to this issue is something that we started to debate when discussing the previous group of amendments—the fact that people in the same circumstances will no longer receive the same type of benefit. Entitlement will depend on where a person lives and on the population of that area. That is a major change to the way that we treat people in this country. The circumstances of someone who lives in Birmingham could be exactly the same as those of someone living in Bradford, but their benefit could now be different. Someone who lives in Chichester could be treated differently from someone who lives in Carlisle.