Africa and the Middle East

Ann Clwyd Excerpts

Wednesday 29th June 2011 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hague]

My hon. Friend draws attention to the point that I made earlier: the ICC has proved that it functions—people are hauled before it and there are consequences for crimes against humanity and other very serious, internationally recognised offences. How we can assist will, of course, depend on the situation in post-conflict Libya, but we will certainly stand by the activities of the ICC and will want to see its proceedings upheld.

[Ann Clwyd (Cynon Valley) (Lab)]

On the question of Syria, last week I raised with the Leader of the House the incident that the Foreign Secretary has mentioned concerning the intimidation of and threats against young Syrian activists in this country and their families at home in Syria. Will the Foreign Secretary enlarge on the conversation that he had with the Syrian ambassador? Did the ambassador admit to any of the suggestions that the Syrian embassy was complicit in such intimidation?

[Mr Hague]

I can tell the right hon. Lady only a little more. My officials have had that conversation with the Syrian ambassador, who did not admit to any of those activities. I can only repeat what I said in my statement: if these accusations of intimidation can be substantiated—they have not been so far, from what we can tell—appropriate action will be taken by the Government.

Oral Answers to Questions

Ann Clwyd Excerpts

Tuesday 14th June 2011 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hague]

I have already established a human rights advisory group, and at its second meeting last week we had a specific discussion about that very subject—freedom of religion and freedom of worship. The Foreign Office paper for that discussion will be discussed at a Wilton Park conference to be held shortly. This is a vitally important subject in which the Foreign Office and many other people are now engaged.

[Ann Clwyd (Cynon Valley) (Lab)]

The Foreign Secretary said that he had a conversation with the Crown Prince of Bahrain and that he is in favour of dialogue. It is all very well saying that, both here and in the United States, but at the same time the Government in Bahrain are crushing dissidents and locking up the people who should be part of the dialogue.

Middle East, North Africa, Afghanistan and Pakistan

Ann Clwyd Excerpts

Monday 16th May 2011 Commons Chamber

[Ann Clwyd (Cynon Valley) (Lab)]

I am glad that the Foreign Secretary mentioned Iraq, because it is seldom mentioned now, and needs to be mentioned far more often. I have three recent Amnesty reports on Iraq that are well worth reading, because they point out some of the deficiencies in the Iraq that we have left behind. Tens of thousands of Iraqis, emboldened by the successful uprisings in Tunisia and Egypt, have taken to the streets since early February to protest against the chronic lack of basic services, rising prices, mass unemployment and endemic corruption, and to demand greater civil and political rights. Unfortunately, the security forces have frequently responded with excessive force, using live ammunition, sound bombs and other weapons forcibly to disperse peaceful protesters, particularly during what the Iraqis called the “day of rage” on 25 February, when demonstrations were held across Iraq. At least 20 people were killed, many of those arrested say that they were tortured or ill-treated, and journalists trying to cover the protests, as well as political activists, have been targeted for attack or threats.

I obviously have a particular interest in this subject because, for seven years, I was special envoy on human rights to Iraq for the previous two Prime Ministers. I therefore have an ongoing interest in the development of human rights there. During this “day of rage”, protesters used violence, mainly by throwing stones at members of the security forces or public buildings, and on rare occasions by setting fire to public buildings, and as a result members of the security forces have also been injured. On 30 March, in a belated but welcome development, the Iraqi authorities announced that their security forces were under orders not to use firearms against demonstrators except where necessary for self-defence.

Up to now, the Iraqi authorities, in both Baghdad and Kurdistan, have sought to crack down on peaceful protesters. That obviously has to change. As Amnesty wrote:

“They should be cracking down on the use of excessive force and torture by their own largely unaccountable security forces, not on the right of people to peacefully protest. The Iraqi authorities should be upholding the rights to freedom of expression and peaceful assembly, including the right to protest, not trying to suppress them. It is high time to do so…Torture and other ill-treatment were widespread in Iraq before the US-led invasion in 2003”,

of which we were part,

“and continued in prisons and detention facilities controlled by coalition forces and the new Iraqi governments. Since 2004, suspects held in Iraqi custody have been systematically tortured and dozens of detainees have died as a result.”

In my seven years as special envoy, I continually visited prisons and detention centres and spoke on many occasions to the Iraqi human rights Minister, to whom I pay tribute, because she has a difficult job but has not had enough support.

Amnesty also wrote that

“US forces handed over tens of thousands of prisoners to Iraqi custody between early 2009 and July 2010 without any guarantees that they will be protected.”

I argued constantly in this Chamber that they should not have been handed over to the Iraqis, because they did not have the capacity to deal with the thousands of detainees they were expected to hold. Amnesty also wrote that

“there is every likelihood that torture and ill-treatment will remain widespread. Such abuses have a devastating impact on the victims not just when they are being tortured or ill-treated, but often for years afterwards…Urgent action is needed to end the pattern of abuse and to help the victims and their families.”

I received an e-mail from an American working in Iraq. His name is Tom Cruise—not the actor Tom Cruise—and he is the former senior adviser to the Iraqi Ministry of Defence directorate of human rights. He came to see me several times in the Baghdad embassy because of his great concern about an Iraqi prisoner killed while in detention. He wrote to me in February saying that he was still trying

“to bring attention to the disturbing torture and murder of detainee Adnan in…the former Iraqi 2/3/6 brigade which was run by BG Nasser who is now the Commander of the Iraqi 2nd DIV in Mosul.”

He was tortured and murdered, and the person responsible was known to everybody. His name is Lieutenant Nabil Rahman Ali Mosa al-Yasseri. After eight months of intensive investigation by the FBI, he was located and arrested in al-Hillah. He was held for a mere 10 weeks, and then suddenly he departed. He was helped to escape. Tom Cruise wrote:

“I hope this communication can serve to bring the necessary attention to resurrect this matter and initiate further judicial action so the world can see that Iraq respects human rights and it is important for all and especially for Adnan Awad Mohammed Thaib Al-Jumaila and his family.”

Our embassy has raised this matter with the Iraqi President, Deputy President, Prime Minister and many others in Iraq, but with no results. Obviously, I think that the UK Government can play an important role in putting pressure on the Iraqi authorities to ensure that detainees are either released or brought promptly to trial on recognisable criminal charges, with full and fair trial rights and without recourse to the death penalty. We have invested too much—in money and blood—in the country to allow this abuse of human rights to continue in Iraq.

Future Diplomatic Network

Ann Clwyd Excerpts

Wednesday 11th May 2011 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hague]

I think that if my hon. Friend had his way, all our relations in Europe would be bilateral. He and I both opposed the Lisbon treaty and the creation of the External Action Service, but we have to work with what we have. As we are in this situation, and as we respect the fact that we are a coalition Government, our approach is to make the best of this and to ensure that there are British people working in the External Action Service. I hope that we shall not reach a point of conflict, as my hon. Friend puts it, between the External Action Service and the United Kingdom’s approach to foreign affairs, because decisions on foreign policy are taken by unanimity in the European Union, and in the event of a direct conflict arising, the British Foreign Secretary would be able to veto any such proposal in the EU.

[Ann Clwyd (Cynon Valley) (Lab)]

May I ask the Foreign Secretary to look carefully at any proposals to reduce the number of staff at our embassy in Iraq, because I believe that we have a certain responsibility towards Iraq? There is no dedicated human rights officer at the embassy. A human rights report was recently produced by Amnesty International about conditions in detention there. I always said that we should not hand over the detained prisoners until the Iraqis had the capacity to deal with them, which they do not have. It is therefore vital that we continue to have a considerable presence in Iraq, possibly with a dedicated human rights officer.

[Mr Hague]

I will look at the point that the right hon. Lady raises about a human rights officer. I can certainly reassure her that we will retain a very considerable presence in Iraq; there is no doubt about that. I should point out that it is one of our most expensive diplomatic operations, partly because of the security that is still required. The embassy in Baghdad and its associated posts amount to one of our five most expensive embassies in the world. At the moment, that is out of proportion with the strategic and economic importance of Iraq, although that remains considerable. That is why we have to look for savings there, but I fully take the right hon. Lady’s point and we will retain a very considerable presence.

Points of Order

Ann Clwyd Excerpts

Tuesday 3rd May 2011 Commons Chamber

[Mr Speaker]

I am grateful to the hon. Lady both for her point of order and for advance notice of it. I have not been told of any intention on the part of any Minister, including the Minister to whom she referred, to make a statement. She has put her views on the record and can find other ways of pursuing this. I note in particular what she said about the code of conduct, and my response is that the question of purdah, and of statements not being made during a period of purdah, does not apply to or flow from any rule of the House. That is to say that there may be a ministerial procedure on this matter—the hon. Lady is welcome to pursue her line of questioning in relation to that—but there has, in short, been no breach of order. Her point will, however, have been heard, including by the Leader of the House.

[Ann Clwyd (Cynon Valley) (Lab)]

On a point of order, Mr Speaker. I know that half the Cabinet are not supposed to be talking to the other half, but I hope that Foreign Office Ministers are talking to one another. I say that because the answer given to me by the Under-Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs, the hon. Member for North East Bedfordshire (Alistair Burt) on the case of Bradley Manning is misleading.

I have raised this issue on several occasions. I raised it with the Foreign Secretary on 16 March and again during business questions on 17 March. I raised it once more during an Adjournment debate on 4 April, when I was told that

“a senior official in our embassy in Washington called on the US State Department on 29 March”

to discuss Private Manning’s terrible situation in prison. The Under-Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs, the hon. Member for North West Norfolk (Mr Bellingham) went on to say:

“the right hon. Lady's understanding of the British Nationality Act 1981 is accurate. Any person born outside the UK after 1 January 1983 whose mother is a UK citizen by birth is British by descent.”

He continued by saying that Mr Manning’s family had not made a “direct request” for help,

“but obviously, if it comes to consular assistance of any kind, we will look at that request as and when one is made.”—[Official Report, 4 April 2011; Vol. 526, c. 873-74.]

Such a request was made to the Foreign Secretary on 11 April by Bradley Manning’s mother, who said that she now understands that

“according to British law, Bradley qualifies as a British national.”

She continued:

“I visited Bradley at the end of February…I was very distressed by seeing Bradley”

in the condition he is in—

[Mr Speaker]

Order. I am extremely grateful to the right hon. Lady, who is a very experienced Member of the House. I know that she would not accuse any Minister of wilfully misleading the House; I am sure that she meant to say that she thought that the Minister was inadvertently misleading the House. She will understand, and the House will appreciate, that we cannot continue Foreign Office questions now. However, as the Minister, who is among the most courteous of Ministers in the House, is on the Bench ready and waiting with bated breath to respond, he should do so.

Oral Answers to Questions

Ann Clwyd Excerpts

Tuesday 3rd May 2011 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hague]

It would be surprising if there were not differing voices and internal tensions on these subjects. Clearly, many issues are moving in the middle east, with the changed situation in Egypt and pressure on the Syrian Government. Hamas has been encouraged by the new Government in Egypt to enter into the political reconciliation with Fatah, as discussed earlier. I believe that it might also feel less secure in its position in Syria. These are forces now at work on Hamas, and it is important in the light of the changes in the middle east that, as the Under-Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs, my hon. Friend the Member for North East Bedfordshire (Alistair Burt) has been saying, it makes concrete movement towards acceptance of Quartet principles, which the whole world looks to it to respect.

[Ann Clwyd (Cynon Valley) (Lab)]

17. What discussions his Department has had with the UN special rapporteur on torture on the case of Bradley Manning.

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs (Alistair Burt)]

We are aware of discussions that the UN special reporter on torture, Juan Mendez, has had with the United States Government, but the Foreign and Commonwealth Office has not had any discussions with him on the case of Bradley Manning.

[Ann Clwyd]

I have raised the case of Bradley Manning on several occasions in this Chamber and outside it. Mrs Susan Manning, who is Bradley Manning’s mother, wrote to the Foreign Secretary three weeks ago. She has not yet had a reply. She asked for consular assistance and for somebody to visit her son in the very bad conditions in which he is being held. She also asked for any help that could be given, in Washington and elsewhere, to the family if they so request it. At the very least, Mrs Manning, who is very concerned by the situation of her son, should have had the courtesy of a reply.

[Alistair Burt]

The right hon. Lady knows from her Adjournment debate on precisely this subject that Bradley Manning does not consider himself a UK citizen and his lawyer has made it very clear that he does not consider that he has any contact with this country. We cannot therefore discuss his nationality and we are limited in both what we can say and what we can do in this case. Bradley Manning’s lawyer is well aware of the circumstances and of the United Kingdom Government's position.

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Speaker]

Order. We come now to a statement by the Prime Minister.

[Ann Clwyd (Cynon Valley) (Lab)]

On a point of order, Mr Speaker.

[Mr Speaker]

Order. Points of order come after statements. I shall await the right hon. Lady’s point of order with interest and anticipation.

Bradley Manning

Ann Clwyd Excerpts

Monday 4th April 2011 Commons Chamber

[Ann Clwyd (Cynon Valley) (Lab)]

I am pleased to have the opportunity to debate this issue, because it is important that the case is raised here in the House of Commons. I want to talk about the treatment of Bradley Manning. An early-day motion on this subject—early-day motion1624—stands in my name and is currently supported by 37 right hon. and hon. Members, and I hope that others will add their names.

I wish to speak this evening in terms very similar terms to those of the early-day motion, which reads as follows:

“That this House expresses great concern at the treatment of Private First Class Bradley Manning, currently detained at the US Quantico Marine Base; notes the increasing level of interest and concern in the case in the UK and in particular in Wales; appeals to the US administration to ensure that his detention conditions are humane; and calls on the UK Government to raise the case with the US administration.”

That is what I want to expand on in this short debate. I want to explain why I am so concerned about Bradley Manning’s case and why others should be too, and I want to ask the Minister to undertake to raise the case with the US Administration.

Bradley Manning is the US soldier imprisoned at the US marine base at Quantico, Virginia. He is accused of being the person responsible for the leaking of the US Government information—about Iraq and about Afghanistan, and from US embassies around the world—that was released into the public domain through the website WikiLeaks. Bradley Manning is a serving member of the US armed forces and he is detained in a military prison. It is important for us to note that he has yet to be convicted of any offence—I am not sure whether there is a confirmed trial date, but I understand that it will not be until May or June.

Like me, the Minister will want to be careful about describing the actions of which Bradley Manning is accused, because we have yet to have Bradley’s account and he has still to have that account considered by a court. That is why I do not want us to get drawn into a discussion of the rights and wrongs of the WikiLeaks revelations. However, I would like to concentrate on the current conditions of detention for Bradley Manning. I have read the several accounts of Bradley’s treatment which have appeared in the press. Some very good accounts that have appeared in The Guardian have come from David Leigh, in particular, but the one that I paid most attention to was the one from Bradley himself. On 10 March, in an 11-page memorandum from Bradley Manning to the commanding officer of the Quantico marine base, issued through his lawyer, Bradley Manning described for us the conditions of his detention. This is what he said:

“Since 2 March 2011, I have been stripped of all my clothing at night. I have been told that the PCF commander intends on continuing this practice indefinitely. Initially, after surrendering my clothing to the brig guards, I had no choice but to lay naked in my cold jail cell until the following morning. The next morning I was told to get out of my bed for the morning duty brig supervisor (DBS) inspection. I was not given any of my clothing back. I got out of the bed and immediately started to shiver because of how cold it was in my cell. I walked towards the front of my cell with my hands covering my genitals. The guard told me to stand at parade rest, which required me to stand with my hands behind my back and my legs spaced shoulder width apart. I stood at ‘parade rest’ for about three minutes until the DBS arrived. Once the DBS arrived, everyone was called to attention. The DBS and the other guards walked past my cell. The DBS looked at me, paused for a moment, and then continued to the next detainee’s cell. I was incredibly embarrassed at having all these people stare at me naked. After the DBS completed his inspection, I was told to go and sit on my bed. About 10 minutes later I was given my clothes and allowed to get dressed…Under my current restrictions, in addition to being stripped at night, I am essentially held in solitary confinement. For 23 hours per day, I sit alone in my cell. The guards check on me every five minutes during the day by asking me if I am OK. I am required to respond in some affirmative manner.”

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

Will the right hon. Lady give way?

[Ann Clwyd]

I have very little time, but yes, I will.

[Jim Shannon]

Is the right hon. Lady aware of when the trial will take place?

[Ann Clwyd]

No, I do not yet know that, but I think that it will be in a couple of months’ time.

Bradley Manning’s account continued:

“At night, if the guards cannot see me clearly, because I have a blanket over my head or I am curled up towards the wall, they will wake me in order to ensure that I am OK…I am prevented from exercising in my cell. If I attempt to do push-ups, sit-ups, or any other form of exercise I am forced to stop. Finally, I receive only one hour of exercise outside of my cell daily. My exercise is usually limited to me walking figures of eight in an empty room.”

We also learn from this memorandum, issued through his lawyer, that his treatment ignores the repeated recommendations of the Marine Corps’ own appointed psychiatrists. They repeatedly say that Bradley Manning’s detention status should be changed. That treatment serves no purpose other than to humiliate and degrade Bradley Manning. I regard it as cruel and unnecessary.

Bradley Manning calls his conditions “improper treatment” and “unlawful pre-trial punishment”. Human Rights Watch has called on the US Government to

“explain the precise reasons behind extremely restrictive and possibly punitive and degrading treatment that Army Private First Class Bradley Manning alleges he has received”.

Amnesty International has said:

“Manning is being subjected to cruel, inhuman and degrading treatment. This is particularly disturbing when one considers that he hasn’t even been brought to trial, let alone convicted of a crime”.

The United Nations special rapporteur on torture, who I have spoken to in the House of Commons about the case, has officially raised his concerns with the US Administration and is awaiting a response.

We have not only those views but a view from inside the US Administration. Until recently, P. J. Crowley was the spokesman for the US State Department. He was a senior and well respected official and a career member of the US armed forces. Early in March he was forced to resign following comments he made about the treatment of Bradley Manning at a university seminar. He called the treatment of Bradley Manning “ridiculous”, “counterproductive” and “stupid”.

Since his resignation, P. J. Crowley has gone on to explain why he said what he did, including in a column in The Guardian last week. He says:

“As a public diplomat and (until recently) spokesman of the department of state, I was responsible for explaining the national security policy of the United States to the American people and populations abroad. I am also a retired military officer who has long believed that our civilian power must balance our military power. Part of our strength comes from international recognition that the United States practises what we preach.”

He goes on:

“Based on 30 years of government experience, if you have to explain why a guy is standing naked in the middle of a jail cell, you have a policy in need of urgent review.”

Finally, he says:

“So, when I was asked…I said the treatment of Private Manning, while well-intentioned, was ‘ridiculous’ and ‘counterproductive’ and, yes, ‘stupid’.

I stand by what I said.”

In the article and the interviews he has given, P. J. Crowley—a career US military and Government man—sets out why Bradley Manning’s case is important. It is important because of the message it sends to the rest of the world about what kind of treatment the United States thinks is acceptable for people in detention. As for us, it is important what we say—or what we do not say—because of the message that it sends about the kind of treatment we in the United Kingdom and in the UK Government think is acceptable. That matters in countries where human rights are not so well observed. People will pay attention in China, in Russia, in Libya, where we want to be on the side of those fighting for freedom from state repression, and most of all in Afghanistan. The image that Britain and the US have in the world matters to the UK and US service personnel fighting in Afghanistan.

I know that only too well from my experience in Iraq as special envoy on human rights over a seven-year period. In my view some of the greatest damage was caused to British and American efforts in Iraq when the stories of prisoner abuse emerged. It undermined our moral authority at a time when we needed to explain that we were fighting for a better future for Iraq, free from the torture and abuse suffered under the regime of Saddam Hussein. The United States and the UK, in the way we respond to US actions, need to preserve that moral authority if we are to have a positive impact on the world and lead by example.

So what am I asking the Minister to do? Let me address the issue of British nationality, because it seems to me to have been something of a red herring. I am not raising Bradley Manning’s case because he is a British national but because I believe his treatment is cruel and unnecessary and that we should say so. I am also chair of the all-party group on human rights and so I often raise human rights cases from around the world. They might be in Burma, Chechnya, East Timor, China, or, sadly, too many other places besides. I do not raise them because they involve British citizens, but because they involve human rights abuses or wrongdoing and because I am in politics because I want to do something to try to stop those things happening.

I want the British Government to raise Bradley Manning’s treatment with the US Administration because his treatment is cruel and unnecessary and we should be saying so. We cannot deny, however, that Bradley’s connection to the UK adds an additional dimension. Bradley’s mother, Susan, is Welsh and lives in Pembrokeshire. Bradley lived and went to school in Wales between the ages of 13 and 17. There is a great deal of interest in the UK, and in particular in Wales, in Bradley’s case and much of that is grounded in his close connection to the UK. Both London and Wrexham have seen protests against Bradley Manning’s treatment, and I pay tribute to those people in the UK who have raised his case.

Perhaps the Minister will take this opportunity to clarify, on the record, just what the position is with regard to British nationality. My understanding is that under the British Nationality Act 1981 anyone born outside the UK after 1 January 1983 who has a mother who is a UK citizen by birth is British by descent. Perhaps the Minister will assist us by confirming that that is the case. I am aware that Bradley Manning’s lawyer has issued a statement that Bradley is not asserting any kind of UK nationality. I know that, but from the point of view of British law, is it the case that Bradley Manning qualifies for British nationality?

I shall mention briefly the British aspect of the case, which concerns Bradley’s mother and family in Wales. I have met some of Bradley’s family—his aunt and uncle—and I am in contact with them. This will be an exceptionally hard time for Bradley Manning’s family, not just for his mother and family in Wales, but for his father and that side of his family in the United States. He is accused of the gravest of crimes which, according to some reports, can attract the death penalty, and there is intense media interest in Bradley, in anything to do with WikiLeaks and in the information that was revealed about the US Government.

Part of Bradley’s family live in Pembrokeshire and their son is in a military prison in Virginia in the US. They are being contacted by journalists, campaigners and politicians who are trying to raise the case. This is a difficult situation for any family to deal with. What kind of consular, official or other support could be made available to Bradley’s mother and family? When they visit Bradley in the US, for example, can they expect assistance from British embassy staff in the US? Can they receive advice and assistance in understanding the charges faced by their son, and perhaps advice, too, about the issue of British nationality?

I look forward to hearing what the Minister has to say. I hope that in his reply he does not say that we do not know what Bradley Manning’s conditions are. We have his own statement, backed by his lawyer, from which I read earlier. I am sure the Minister will not try to defend the harsh treatment that Bradley Manning is experiencing because of the gravity of the charges. That is beside the point. I hope the hon. Gentleman does not try to say that as he is not a British citizen, it is not appropriate to raise Bradley Manning’s case with the US Administration, because we raise cases with other countries all the time. I hope he will not fail to acknowledge that Bradley Manning’s having lived for a time in the UK, and given that his mother and that side of his family are British, creates an additional obligation on the Government to act in that family’s best interests.

I hope that the Minister can give two undertakings tonight—first, that the British Government will officially raise the case with the US Administration, and secondly, that the Government will consider what support they could provide to the British family of Bradley Manning as they try to do whatever they can to help Bradley.

North Africa and the Middle East

Ann Clwyd Excerpts

Thursday 24th March 2011 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hague]

Those are perfectly legitimate questions, but slightly in advance of where we have got to. My right hon. Friend the International Development Secretary is engaged in discussions about that. There are a variety of agencies and a variety of individuals who can lead it. That is one of the things that we will be able to discuss with our partners at the conference next week.

[Ann Clwyd (Cynon Valley) (Lab)]

Next week the Government intend to change the law on universal jurisdiction, making it more difficult to get an arrest warrant in this country for those accused of war crimes. Where is the logic in that?

[Mr Hague]

The logic is that it will still be possible to get an arrest warrant if there is a reasonable chance of prosecution. It makes this country rather ridiculous if people can get an arrest warrant for people from other countries where there is no realistic chance of prosecution. It is therefore important to change that law. The law as it stands has been abused in relation to visitors from several other countries. It was abused, in my view, when there was a threat to the proposed visit of Mrs Livni to the United Kingdom. She is an Israeli politician of great importance, and a strong advocate of the peace process, but she feels unable to visit the United Kingdom because of that law. If we want, as we do, to be able to engage in pushing forward the peace process, we need such people to be able to visit the United Kingdom.

Oral Answers to Questions

Ann Clwyd Excerpts

Tuesday 15th March 2011 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hague]

My hon. Friend will be pleased to know that the BBC World Service, and in particular the Arabic service, will continue to play a very valuable role in the region: it will continue its 24-hour television channel, and its radio services will continue through FM relays as well as through shortwave services in the region. Those are a continuing and important part of the BBC World Service. Indeed, in the light of recent events, the BBC has already revisited some of its recent decisions that would have affected Arab nations.

[Ann Clwyd (Cynon Valley) (Lab)]

I took part in a special United Nations conference on the plight of Palestinian prisoners last week, and the descriptions of the conditions in which they are held in Israeli prisons and detention centres were appalling. We were told of torture, inhumane treatment and so on. Some 200 to 300 young people under the age of 18 are held in those conditions. What will the Foreign Secretary do to prevail on the Israelis to adhere to the conventions to which they have signed up?

[Mr Hague]

Of course we believe that there should be the proper treatment of prisoners throughout the world, including in Israel and anywhere else in the middle east. We have taken up concerns about such issues in the past. If the right hon. Lady would like to give me more details of what she found in that particular case, I will of course look to take them up with the Israeli authorities.

Afghanistan

Ann Clwyd Excerpts

Wednesday 27th October 2010 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hague]

To be fair to General Richards, I think he was talking about the efforts that will be required to sustain reconstruction, economic progress and regional stability in Afghanistan. I do not think he was talking about a large British military presence or involvement in combat operations for 30 or 40 years. Again, I know that there are legitimate alternative points of view, but we consider it to be right and best to make clear our position that we will draw down from combat operations by 2015. That means that the Afghan Government know that, and it goes alongside our determination to build up rapidly the capabilities of the Afghan national security forces. It also leaves our allies in no doubt about our position. It should be remembered that if we are still there by 2015, we will have been involved in Helmand for much longer than the second world war lasted. British troops will have made an immense contribution therefore, and, in line with the goals for the Afghan forces by 2014, we should be able to speak confidently about 2015.

[Ann Clwyd (Cynon Valley) (Lab)]

As the Secretary of State has said several times in the last hour, human rights and women’s rights are important aspects of our work in Afghanistan. Everybody will agree that the empowerment of women has proceeded—women have returned to the professions and girls have returned to school. Will the Secretary of State give an assurance that in any settlement talks, particularly with the Taliban, if there are arguments for an extension of extreme Sharia law—which would, of course, disempower women—he will continue to fight for progress in women’s rights in Afghanistan, and that there will be no sell-out on those issues?

[Mr Hague]

In this country and across the House we will always stand up for human rights—of which women’s rights are an indivisible part—all over the world, including in Afghanistan. We all strongly welcome the much more extensive involvement of women in Afghan civil society and political life, of which I spoke earlier and to which the right hon. Lady just referred. We are not laying down the terms of a political settlement, however; we are not remotely near that stage. There is no political settlement currently being discussed around a table, whether by the Afghan Government and the leaders of the Taliban or anybody else. That is not the stage that we are at, so it is premature to talk about what might emerge from any such discussions, but the conditions set out by President Karzai include adherence to the Afghan constitutional framework, and we should continue to give that robust support.