Public Sector Pay Policy

Albert Owen Excerpts

Tuesday 5th June 2018 Westminster Hall

[Neil Gray]

I am sure the hon. Gentleman understands and appreciates that the terms and conditions of armed forces personnel ensure that there is an even playing field between different areas of deployment. That means that if there are spikes or drops in taxation or any other cost of their employment, they do not have to suffer those themselves. They will get the pay rise, but they will not have to suffer the tax rise.

[Albert Owen (in the Chair)]

Order. Mr Gray will respond to the debate from the Front Bench, so he will have protected time. I ask him to be a bit more disciplined and allow Back Benchers to have their time, too.

[Luke Graham]

Thank you, Mr Owen. I always welcome a lively debate.

To be clear, that pay rise will not come from the devolved Administration that imposed the tax; it will come from the UK Government, who will have to cough up to bridge the gap. It was not me who said that Scotland has the highest rate of tax for armed forces personnel; it was Lieutenant General Nugee at a hearing of the Public Accounts Committee just yesterday. That is fact. It is clear that it will be left to Her Majesty’s Treasury to try to bridge the gap and ensure that people are not disadvantaged.

Scotland was already the most taxed part of the United Kingdom, and nurses, teachers and other public sector staff have been forced to pay, at least in part, for the pay rises they have been given. Money that they have been given through pay rises has been taken away through more tax. That is happening at a time when Scotland badly needs to attract more public sector workers to deal with the horrendous staffing shortages that have developed in the NHS and schools in the past 10 years. The UK Government and the devolved Administration should do as much as possible about that.

Let me make one more point about tax, which is a topic that generates lively conversation across the Chamber and will—and should—continue to be debated during this Parliament. The tax increases in Scotland, which were meant to be a progressive move, deliver only 38p more per week for those on the lowest incomes. That is not progressive; it is pathetic. It shows the contrast between the UK Administration and the SNP Administration in Edinburgh: the SNP does not have a grip on our public services in this day and age, and plenty of people in Scotland are being disadvantaged as a result. The UK Government have shown that it is possible, through a strong economy, to give public sector workers a sustainable pay rise without them having to pay for it through increased taxes.

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[Several hon. Members rose—]

[Albert Owen (in the Chair)]

Order. Four Members are indicating that they wish to speak. I will bring in the Front Benchers at half-past three, so if Back Benchers take about seven and a half minutes each, they will have equal time.

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[Rachael Maskell]

Does my hon. Friend recognise that many public servants have been down-banded and as a result given up more money and experienced even more detriment than that from the increases of only 1%?

[Albert Owen (in the Chair)]

I call Grahame Morris to wind up.

[Grahame Morris]

I will be quick, Mr Owen. I agree with my hon. Friend the Member for York Central (Rachael Maskell). There have been numerous surveys. A recent one by Unison showed that almost 73% of respondents have had to borrow money from family and friends to get by. We know anecdotally about civil servants using food banks, and workers in my constituency are struggling to support themselves and their families. I do not think we can run public services on the backs of poorly paid public sector workers. Something must be done to lift the cap and properly fund Government Departments.

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[Hugh Gaffney (Coatbridge, Chryston and Bellshill) (Lab)]

It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mr Owen, and I thank the hon. Member for Glasgow South West (Chris Stephens) for securing this debate.

There has been a public service pay freeze for seven years, held at 1%. Now the Government say there can be a pay rise, but only according to budgets, and it may damage the Chancellor’s Treasury plans. Already the Government are playing worker against worker, telling some workers they can have a pay rise, but others they will need to wait.

When the word “budget” is used, what we are really saying is “job losses”. We have already seen what happens when job losses are created: for those staff who can keep their jobs it creates more work and pressure, and they are told, “Be grateful you have a job.” Is it any wonder that stress levels and illness at work have multiplied? The trade unions are right to ask for a bigger rise. It is their duty to speak up for workers, and I say again, as I have said since I came to Parliament last year: join a trade union today. People’s rights at work are important. Workers have a voice in the trade union movement and I urge all workers to join.

In conclusion, public sector workers need a decent pay rise, not a token gesture. They should not be used as the bargaining chips of austerity. They do us proud as public workers, they protect our public services and they stop the private profiteers.

[Albert Owen (in the Chair)]

I remind Members that the debate will finish at 4pm, but the Minister has agreed to give a couple of minutes at the end for the hon. Member for Glasgow South West to wind up.

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[Luke Graham]

That is not answering the question.

[Albert Owen (in the Chair)]

Order.

[Christian Matheson]

I suggest that the hon. Gentleman comes down to any food bank and finds out whether its recipients believe that equality is greater or worse.

The Government talk of lifting the public sector pay cap, but that is nothing more than a politically cute headline. After seven years of crippling pay freezes, the real-world consequences of the Government’s policies are half a million children of public sector workers in poverty, while Ministers have dished out a £70 billion tax break bonanza.