Communications Act (e-Commerce) (EU Exit) Regulations 2020

Lord Stevenson of Balmacara Excerpts

Tuesday 10th November 2020 Grand Committee

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, I am grateful to the Minister for her very full introduction to this SI, which is much appreciated, and I thank her and her staff for offering the chance to talk over some of the issues the SI raises in a meeting earlier this week.

The noble Baroness, Lady Wheatcroft, picked up on a number of points, which I will not repeat, but I want to draw out a little further the question of the asymmetry of this SI. As she says, the main beneficiary appears to be Ofcom, and it is a pretty marginal benefit in the sense that it will no longer have to clear, in-country, issues raised by UK companies which have concerns about the way services brought into the UK are being regulated under the country of origin principle. As she pointed out, this seems a rather mixed blessing in some ways. It may well have been freed from the obligation, but the companies themselves will have to do the tracking around and chasing if they have an issue they want to raise in, as has been pointed out, any of the 27 countries with which they used to be able to deal on a relatively simple basis. The Explanatory Memorandum is a bit coy about this but the position is fairly clear, given the very wide range of organisations and companies—online retailers, video sharing sites, search tools, social media platforms and internet service providers—that will be caught by the provision.

Secondly, the main users of the process provided for under this SI are charities. The figures suggest that a number of charities, such as Red Nose Day, rely heavily on people phoning in their donations. Regarding the impact assessment, I cannot believe that some adjustment will not need to be made by bodies that are reliant on such forms of generating income. If the Phone-paid Services Authority does not have the necessary authority to deal with this issue, how on earth will such bodies cope if things go wrong? We have also heard about scams. I am anxious that the Minister deals with this issue when she responds.

Thirdly, although scams account for much of the downside of what happens in this world, as we have heard, there are also concerns about vulnerable people being drawn into conversations or receiving information they would not wish to receive. Effectively, this is another example of the online harms issue. Can the Minister confirm where we are with the forthcoming online harms legislation, and that the consumer and customer issues that this SI raises will be dealt with in it?

Both the previous speakers made a point about the wider context of this SI. I mean no disrespect, but it makes a very minor change. There are a number of discrepancies between how the UK and the EU, our nearest neighbour and largest market for our services, will regulate in this area post Brexit. When the Minister responds, can she give us a better sense of what is happening with roaming, an issue of great concern for many consumers? Will they be able to use their equipment in other countries and if so, under the current arrangements, or will costs be involved?

Spectrum management is an issue on which we need, and indeed have always had, the co-operation of many other players, mainly in the EU but obviously worldwide. As a sole player, we are in a much weaker position to negotiate the sort of spectrum we want. Using additional spectrum, spectrum that is not efficient or spectrum that is not as appropriate to the task will be more costly for British business. Do the Government have any plans to resolve this issue, and how will it be deployed in future?

On the wider question of net neutrality, which we were concerned about a few years ago, and on which we had many friends in the EU, how is that being managed as we go forward?

Covid-19: Support for Entertainment and Music Industry Freelancers

Lord Stevenson of Balmacara Excerpts

Monday 9th November 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

The Government absolutely recognise the importance of touring for musicians and other creative talent from this country. We continue to seek a reciprocal agreement with the EU, which would allow UK citizens to undertake some business activities in the EU without a work permit on a short-term basis. Unfortunately, however, I cannot comment on the detail of these arrangements.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, in response to the noble Lord, Lord Vaizey, the Minister mentioned that her department had done some research into the problems facing freelancers and the self-employed, most of whom have not been paid since March 2020. Does her research show how much funding the DDCMS estimates is needed to create a safety net for those workers in cultural industries? How much of the Culture Recovery Fund has actually been received to date by freelancers and the self-employed, and will she publish that information?

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

I am happy to share the detail of that information in a letter to the House and put a copy in the Library. We are working very hard. We have already disbursed over £500 million to 2,000 organisations as part of the Culture Recovery Fund. As I mentioned, that includes specific pots for music venues and cinemas, and we were pleased to announce additional funding for heritage and arts organisations just this weekend.

Covid-19: Cultural and Creative Industries

Lord Stevenson of Balmacara Excerpts

Monday 26th October 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

I agree with my noble friend that there are many brilliant examples of where the arts have helped to promote positive mental health. Indeed, the launch of the National Academy for Social Prescribing is an important recognition of exactly that point.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, the music sector is the original gig economy: no play literally means no pay. To its credit, the sector has come up with several suggestions to help it reboot, including a cut in VAT on tickets and, as the noble Baroness, Lady Bonham-Carter, said, backing an insurance scheme to encourage venues to reopen. The Minister seemed sympathetic to this last point; what more information does she need before she can support it?

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

As I said to the noble Baroness, Lady Bonham-Carter, we need absolute clarity that insurance is the real barrier to reopening, and, at a time when the pandemic is changing from week to week, obviously a number of wider issues have to be taken into consideration.

Historic Statues

Lord Stevenson of Balmacara Excerpts

Monday 19th October 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

I am not aware that there are plans for a task force as the noble Lord suggests, but I am happy to take that back to the department. Obviously, move versus remove versus retain and explain has been carefully considered. Our view is that retain and explain is the best approach. My right honourable friend the Secretary of State will shortly have an online round table to discuss many of these issues with key stakeholders and arm’s-length bodies.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab)]

My Lords, we welcome the Government’s suggestion that the policy should be retain and explain. I think that gets across the point very well. Does the Minister agree that resolving this issue might be an opportunity for collaborative work with schools? What would children make of the way our local communities currently view local history through their statues? Will she pursue this with her colleagues?

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

The noble Lord’s suggestion chimes very well with our approach. It would be enlightening to hear what children think: they normally tell us the truth. I am happy to pick that up with colleagues.

Amazon

Lord Stevenson of Balmacara Excerpts

Monday 12th October 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

I cannot claim to have read every page of the US report, but I have looked at the headlines. There is a great deal of overlap with the principles that we have already accepted, both on anti-trust measures and on data interoperability and portability. Where the report differs, if I have understood correctly, is in its promotion of structural separations within the industry.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, the Government recently said that they could scrap the digital services tax to facilitate a trade agreement with the United States. Is that still our negotiating position? Can the Minister tell us whether the Government support the challenge that India and South Africa are making to the WTO moratorium on customs duties on goods transmitted electronically?

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

We are keen to have a free trade agreement with the US that strengthens our economic relationship with our largest bilateral trading partner. Once a global digital solution is in place, we will remove the DST. I will write to the noble Lord on the second part of his question.

Charitable Incorporated Organisations (Insolvency and Dissolution) (Amendment) (No.2) Regulations 2020

Lord Stevenson of Balmacara Excerpts

Friday 9th October 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, I declare my interests in charitable organisations as set out in the register. Like the noble Baroness, Lady Bowles of Berkhamsted, I am also a veteran of the Corporate Insolvency and Governance Act, as it now is, having spent many happy hours on it. Although I can confirm that we did not consult on or talk about this matter beforehand, I find myself in agreement with much of what she said in her presentation.

Before I get to that, I want to mention that, although I admire the effort of the noble Lord, Lord Kirkhope of Harrogate, to read through the entire saga of that Act, he missed the fact that both the noble Baroness, Lady Anelay of St Johns, and I raised the issue of CIOs and charitable bodies more generally in the then Bill, and their particular issues in relation to the legislation going forward. We asked that the interests they represent be taken care of as the Bill went forward both in Committee and on Report in your Lordships’ House, so I am a bit surprised that the noble Lord did not bring that up. However, I can understand that his eyes might have glazed over when we reached that point in the proceedings.

I agree with the noble Baroness, Lady Bowles, that the Explanatory Memorandum for this statutory instrument is not up to the standard that the House expects. There may be many reasons for that and, when the noble Baroness introduced the SI, she hinted at the problems it has been going through—but I found it very difficult to read. I am therefore very grateful that the Library decided to publish a little aide memoire on this debate, which I found much more helpful.

The problem is not so much that this is the second or third attempt to try to get right something that was going off track earlier; it is that some quite substantial issues do not seem to have been addressed. I ask the Minister whether she would consider having a meeting with noble Lords who are interested enough to want one—perhaps just those who are involved in this debate—to see whether we can find out what is happening on the ground. I am confused about it: not just on the pension issue but on what legislation might be coming down the track later in this area. We do not get much opportunity to talk about charities and, as my noble friend Lord Foulkes said, there are real issues affecting them at the moment. It would be useful to get a sense of where the department is going with this, so we can be sure, in our own minds, where we can be most helpful in trying to protect the interests of charities, as a way forward.

When the Minister introduced this SI, she said it was a necessary part of the process and was mainly about disapplying provisions that might otherwise cause complications or not be relevant to the charities involved. But I felt very uncomfortable with that approach. That might be resolved by a meeting but, at the moment, all we have to go on is the SI. I have five very quick points to make.

First, I did not agree with her analysis that the voluntary solvent dissolution procedures should be disallowed, because they go with the grain of what was intended by the Corporate Insolvency and Governance Act. If a charity is thinking about winding up and is solvent, it will probably have other charities to which it could transfer its activities and processes. I do not understand why it would be necessary to disapply the provision for dissolution, if that were the case. Surely it would be in the best interests of all concerned to quickly transfer the assets, as a going concern, to the new charity, and any hold-up in that would be a bad thing. I put that to the Minister and look forward to her response.

Secondly, the noble Baroness, Lady Bowles of Berkhamsted, is a much more expert observer of the pension schemes issue than I am, but I thought the point was that pensions issues should be within the scope of the moratorium. In other words, the creditor interest represented by the pensions due to those people who are employed by the charity needs to be protected, and that trumps the worry about this being overcomplicated. I understand that the issue has arisen because of a lack of communication with the Department for Work and Pensions, but it is still not clear—nor is it in the Explanatory Memorandum—exactly why the Government have chosen to act as they have, particularly as they now think they have got it wrong and want to bring further legislation later. That seems a very complicated way forward.

Thirdly, the Minister paid tribute to the work of charities during the Covid-19 pandemic, as did other noble Lords who spoke during this debate. But the issue is that the voluntary and community sector is facing a huge deficit in its processes, as my noble friend Lord Foulkes mentioned. While the Government have brought forward a tiny proportion, the gap between where the charities would expect to operate and where they are at the moment is enormous. Is there any hope for more funding here? Could the Minister respond?

Fourthly, I will address a question that was touched on earlier in the debate and that I want to make sure was registered by the Minister. The charitable sector is very pleased that the Government took steps to make sure that the quite difficult end-of-year processes and governance arrangements in relation to lockdown and restrictions were being dealt with, and they welcome the Government’s idea that trustees could have more time on these. However, I still think that there are concerns there. Could she put pressure on the Charity Commission to put out more practical guidance on this? From my own discussions, I understand that there are still concerns here.

Finally, a minor point was raised during the process of the Corporate Insolvency and Governance Act in relation to some charities who have collections within the ownership of the charitable bodies, which might be vulnerable if there were to be an insolvency. Clearly, the collections should be retained in the public interest, but there did not seem to be any mechanism when we raised this in the Bill for proceeding with that. Could the Minister respond to that?

Covid-19: Regional Theatres

Lord Stevenson of Balmacara Excerpts

Monday 28th September 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

I thank the noble Earl for helping me to answer the question. He is quite right that there are two key criteria in the culture recovery fund: institutions of national importance, and making sure that we use that money to continue to help level up all our communities.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, some 90,000 jobs are currently at risk in the creative industries, and regional theatres right across the country are under threat. As my noble friend Lord Foulkes said, Treasury schemes have not helped the creative freelance sector, and we now know that this is because the Chancellor does not regard them as being viable jobs. Does the Minister agree with him? The film and TV sector now has a government-backed plan to help it restart productions. Why cannot that scheme be extended to regional theatres with immediate effect?

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

I am not clear where the Chancellor said he did not see these as viable jobs. We have used every effort to make sure that the unprecedented level of support for these sectors is as wide and comprehensive as possible.

Covid-19: Creative Industries

Lord Stevenson of Balmacara Excerpts

Tuesday 22nd September 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

We are absolutely clear that the role of the creative industries in protecting our mental health in particular has been vital during lockdown.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, the Film and TV Production Restart Scheme’s rules, which were published last week, say in rule 11 that it is expected that funding granted under the scheme will comply with social commitments that address issues such as lack of diversity. This is very welcome. However, there appears to be a let-out clause for pre-existing productions. Can the Minister confirm that the Government will scrutinise this issue carefully and that any attempts by producers in receipt of these funds to weaken commitments to diversity will be rigorously challenged?

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

I am very happy to take back the noble Lord’s point and ensure that this is looked at carefully, as he suggests.

Gambling Legislation

Lord Stevenson of Balmacara Excerpts

Thursday 10th September 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

My noble friend will be aware that we committed in our manifesto to tackle issues around loot boxes. We have announced that we are launching a call for evidence to inform the next steps on this.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) (V)]

My Lords, is not one of the great problems the lack of statutory control of advertising, which largely lies in the hands of the industry? I am delighted to hear that the long-delayed DCMS review of gambling legislation is to be restarted. Can the Minister confirm that it will cover this important lacuna?

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

I cannot be specific on the scope of the review, but the evidence is not clear about the link between advertising and problem gambling, particularly among young people. The evidence points rather to the behaviour of parents and peers in influencing them.

Music Industry

Lord Stevenson of Balmacara Excerpts

Thursday 10th September 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

There are no current plans that I am aware of to extend the self-employed scheme to that group, but the £95 million fund announced by Arts Council England is trying to maximise employment opportunities, including for those early in their careers.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, while the total funding made available by Her Majesty’s Government is welcome, the Minister will be aware—we have raised this with her before—of the problem facing freelancers who operate under a limited company and take dividends as a source of income. They are unable to claim through the current SEISS. This issue also affects high-tech start-up entrepreneurs. It is clearly a problem that has not been properly addressed. Can the Minister take this up with the Treasury and press for support to be extended to this group?

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

I am happy to raise this issue as the noble Lord suggests, but one issue that we have struggled with is separating out and identifying dividend income in the kind of examples that he has given us for those getting dividend income from their investments.