Renters’ Rights Bill

Lord Empey Excerpts
Tuesday 6th May 2025

(4 days ago)

Lords Chamber
Read Full debate Read Hansard Text Watch Debate Read Debate Ministerial Extracts
Baroness Jones of Moulsecoomb Portrait Baroness Jones of Moulsecoomb (GP)
- View Speech - Hansard - - - Excerpts

My Lords, my Amendments 178 and 191, along with Amendment 133 in the name of the noble Baroness, Lady Janke, highlight some of the challenges that disabled people face living in rented accommodation. Life is hard if you have to live with a disability, and it makes sense if where you live can help you have as much of an active life as possible. When we talk about disabled people, we are not just talking about wheelchair users; we are talking, for example, about people who might react badly to certain colours or intensity of lighting. Step-free access these days ought to be almost automatic, given our ageing population.

The sad reality is that Britain’s housing stock has not been designed with disabled people in mind, and the provision of adaptations for disabled housing is quite scarce. My Amendment 191 would give people reassurance that they can ask about and discuss disability adjustments when looking for somewhere to live, without being disadvantaged. Amendment 178 would take this further and give tenants a right to make minor adaptations for disabilities without needing consent from the landlord.

Taken together, these amendments would support people with disabilities to live healthier, happier lives by ensuring that they have specific rights to meet their needs. I hope that the Minister can take this issue away and look at it, as there are some simple ways forward that will have a huge beneficial impact on disabled people and their families.

Lord Empey Portrait Lord Empey (UUP)
- View Speech - Hansard - -

My Lords, I think the objective of the noble Baroness’s amendment is commendable. I worry, however, that if a property is altered, it will be limited by the assessment made by occupational health, within the limitations of local authority budgets and what the cost is estimated to be. In some properties, particularly older ones, these alterations can be very substantial.

The question arises: what happens if the tenant leaves the property and it has to be reinstated? That would be a relatively simple operation for a straight stairway, but not all properties are like that. Installing a lift would be a major structural operation. I wonder whether the noble Baroness could assess what the implications would be when someone left a property and how it would be reinstated. Reinstatement can often be more costly than the installation.

With regard to undertaking minor amendments, it depends on what we mean by minor. If building control consent is not required and people alter a property, they can undermine the structure very simply. It is not difficult—a lot of older properties may not have the same structural integrity as more modern ones. If people can say that a change is only minor, what is the boundary and what are the limitations if we have no definition of what a minor alteration is? If someone starts interfering with the structure of a property without the requirement of building control consent, there will be difficulties ahead, as there can be implications for the adjacent property. If various adaptations are needed in a terraced house, it can affect properties on either side.

Who would pay for the removal of the adaptations in the first place? Although the noble Baroness has tabled a very well-meaning amendment, I fear that, if given an inch, people would take a mile because they would not want to bother with getting the various consents. People could undertake quite substantial and perhaps even risky amendments to property without consent. Again, the question arises: how do we reinstate them afterwards?

Baroness Scott of Bybrook Portrait Baroness Scott of Bybrook (Con)
- View Speech - Hansard - - - Excerpts

My Lords, I thank the noble Baronesses, Lady Janke and Lady Jones of Moulsecoomb, for their important amendments on disability adaptations. This is a crucial issue, and the Government have a duty to find the correct balance again between ensuring that disability adaptations are available to tenants and considering the significant impact that some provisions could have on our landlords.

Amendment 133, which proposes an obligation for landlords to grant permission for home adaptations following a local authority assessment under the Equality Act 2010, rightly highlights the importance of accessibility. However, we must also consider the practical and financial implications. Landlords, particularly those with smaller portfolios or those who operate on very tight margins, are already contending with a range of rising costs and regulatory pressures. Although the amendment’s intention is clear and commendable, the Government, we believe, must ensure that any new duty is accompanied by adequate support mechanisms so that landlords are not forced to absorb potentially substantial costs that could threaten the viability of their business or the quality of their housing stock.

Amendment 178 would allow tenants to undertake minor adaptations without seeking landlords’ consent. This is not merely a modest proposal—it raises some serious questions. Although “minor adaptation” may sound innocuous, this interpretation is highly subjective. One tenant’s minor change may in reality be a significant alteration that affects a property’s structure, aesthetics or marketability.

We must be clear that even small, cumulative changes can lead to a loss of value, future repair costs or regulatory complications for the landlord. Properties not designed or built to accommodate such modification may be especially vulnerable. This amendment risks creating confusion, undermining landlord confidence and ultimately reducing the availability of homes to rent, particularly in lower-cost segments of the market. Landlords must have clarity, and they must be protected from unintended consequences. As we heard from the noble Lord, Lord Empey, what happens when the tenant leaves, and who pays for reinstating the property?

Amendment 191, which seeks to prohibit discrimination against prospective tenants requiring adaptations, addresses an issue of genuine concern. We support the principle of tackling discrimination wherever it occurs; however, we must also recognise that landlords will reasonably assess the suitability of their properties and the cost implications of meeting specific needs. To avoid placing landlords in an impossible position, any new obligations must be underpinned by clear guidance and, where necessary, financial support.

I urge the Minister to bring forward some proposals before Report that genuinely balance the rights of disabled tenants with the realities that landlords face. If we are to ensure that homes are both accessible and available for disabled people, we must avoid shifting the full cost burden on to landlords, particularly without due process, oversight or compensation. The aim should be a system that is fair, proportionate and sustainable for all the parties involved.

--- Later in debate ---
Baroness Taylor of Stevenage Portrait Baroness Taylor of Stevenage (Lab)
- Hansard - - - Excerpts

I will provide in writing all that I have just outlined.

Amendment 178 seeks to allow private rented sector tenants to carry out disability adaptations to their homes without first obtaining consent from their landlord if the cost of these adaptations is below a threshold set in regulation. I agree that the Government should seek to address barriers preventing disabled tenants getting the home adaptations that they require. However, this amendment is not the right way to achieve it. The amendment defines which disability adaptations are classed as minor solely by reference to cost. This would not capture a range of other factors—referred to by the noble Lord, Lord Empey, and the noble Baroness, Lady Scott—that a responsible landlord would need to consider when deciding whether to permit alterations.

These factors could include interactions with building regulation requirements—a very important set of requirements on landlords—the need for consent from third parties and how easy it will be to return the property to its original condition. As many of these factors will be dependent on the features of each individual property, it would not be possible to define “minor adaptations” in a way that works effectively for all housing in a private rented sector as diverse as ours. Given the challenge in defining which adaptations are minor, it is likely that some disabled tenants would make genuine mistakes, for the best reasons, and carry out adaptations that were not in scope of the legislation. If successfully challenged by landlords in the courts, this could result in negative consequences, such as being ordered to pay damages to remove the adaptation. The risk of this happening could deter tenants from exercising such a right.

This amendment would also create a new right for tenants alongside the existing obligation on landlords under the Equality Act 2010 not to refuse consent for disability-related improvement. That could make the system more confusing and more difficult for tenants to navigate. Therefore, the amendment would not be an effective way of supporting disabled tenants and could even make things worse. The Government are already taking strong action on this through the existing measures in the Bill and the further commitments that I have set out.

Amendment 191 seeks to extend the rental discrimination measures in the Bill to persons requiring home adaptations. We recognise very much the important issue that this amendment raises and agree strongly that people with disabilities should not face discrimination when accessing the private rented sector; nor should they be unreasonably refused the adaptations that they require. We hope that the transformative reforms to the private rented sector delivered through the Bill will make a substantial difference to support disabled tenants. The abolition of Section 21 and the new PRS ombudsman address the two key barriers identified by the 2024 report of the former Levelling Up, Housing and Communities Committee: retaliatory eviction and access to redress.

Disabled people are, however, already afforded the full protection from discrimination by the Equality Act 2010. As part of this, landlords and agents are forbidden from victimising or discriminating against a person based on a disability in relation to the offer of a tenancy, the terms on which a tenancy is offered or their general treatment of that person. Expanding the Bill’s rental discrimination provisions in this manner would create an unnecessary dual system, increasing complexity and causing confusion, leading to an overlap of responsibilities between local authorities and the courts.

Lord Empey Portrait Lord Empey (UUP)
- Hansard - -

Can I just come back on the reinstatement issue? Perhaps there was something in that response in the other place that the Minister referred to which would have covered this. Everybody is at one in wishing to provide people with the best possible circumstances to enjoy their tenancies; if that requires adaptations, so be it. Statistically, it is very important. However, some of these adaptations can be very substantial. If you have a lift, you have to cut the floor out from ground floor to first floor to take the machinery out; structurally you have to leave the lift shaft. That is one example. Bathrooms and stairlifts are others. If you take them away, they leave huge holes. Does the Minister have a response to that? How will it be repaired so that a landlord can resell or relet the property?

Baroness Taylor of Stevenage Portrait Baroness Taylor of Stevenage (Lab)
- Hansard - - - Excerpts

I understand the noble Lord’s point about reinstatement. However, the property being adapted will usually extend the length of the tenancy, which is one of the initial objectives. This already happens where a tenant asks for a home adaptation to be carried out. That will usually mean that they will extend the length of their tenancy. If the tenant does decide to move out, the landlord can seek someone else who would benefit from that adaptation. I will come back to the noble Lord regarding his point about any necessary reinstatement costs. Normally, landlords will be able to find another tenant who would benefit from the adaptation that has been made to the property.

Renters’ Rights Bill

Lord Empey Excerpts
Monday 28th April 2025

(1 week, 5 days ago)

Lords Chamber
Read Full debate Read Hansard Text Watch Debate Read Debate Ministerial Extracts
Lord Empey Portrait Lord Empey (UUP)
- View Speech - Hansard - -

My Lords, in previous contributions to the Committee, I made the point that our objective should be to increase supply and simultaneously reduce demand. I think we are now facing a situation in which we are doing everything in our power to decrease supply. The amendments tabled by the noble Lord, Lord Young of Cookham, and the noble Baronesses, Lady Thornhill and Lady Scott, are all basically meritorious in their own way, but they are all trying to solve a problem that we foresee. It does not have to be thought about as something that may happen as a remote possibility: it is almost a certainty and therefore has to be addressed.

There are other things that I think the Government are doing that are decreasing supply. The prospect of a landlord entering into the relationship with a tenant is even further off-put by these measures in the uncertainty that they could be left with no income for very long periods of time and tenants could find themselves stranded if they cannot go to a court and have the thing settled.

I also raised with the Minister the ECHR implications. There is yet another matter that is arising: there are reports that the Government are effectively talking out of both sides of their mouth at once. Here they are telling us that we have to get rid of Section 21 as we do not want agreed-term tenancies; on the other hand, it appears that the Government are going to landlords and offering them up to five-year tenancies if they house asylum seekers. You cannot have it both ways. The Minister told me that you could not discriminate between one tenant and another, but in fact that is precisely what we are doing. We are introducing a new class of tenant—a tenant who is in a superior position to the ordinary tenants we have at the moment. There is a great deal of uncertainty around this. Common sense dictates that this matter of the courts has to be addressed, and the very fact that we are having to burden the courts with our legislation tells us that perhaps there is something fundamentally wrong with this in the first place.

Lord Wolfson of Tredegar Portrait Lord Wolfson of Tredegar (Con)
- View Speech - Hansard - - - Excerpts

My Lords, I speak in support of Amendments 279 and 280 in the name of the noble and learned Lord, Lord Etherton, who is unfortunately unable to be in his place today. I hoped to have added my name to them, but I think I got to the Public Bill Office after the Marshalled List had gone to print. These amendments, together with others in this group, address an issue that is central to the Bill: the capacity of the courts. I declare at the outset my interest as somebody who benefits from rental income from residential property, as set out in the register.

--- Later in debate ---
How these arrangements interact with the Renters’ Rights Bill will depend on the nature of the commercial agreement between the Home Office and Serco and on whether the accommodation being provided to asylum seekers amounts to an assured tenancy—which, of course, is the subject matter of the Bill. As I say, I do not have details of the progress that the Home Office is making on this, but I am happy to write to noble Lords on that point. Therefore, I would ask that the amendment is withdrawn.
Lord Empey Portrait Lord Empey (UUP)
- Hansard - -

Will the Minister agree to write to us about the Home Office and place a copy in the Library? Additionally, the Minister said on the previous day in Committee that she did not want to see different classes of tenant. How is it possible to have this Bill on the statute book and at the same time have the proposed Serco arrangements in operation without creating two classes of tenant?

Renters’ Rights Bill

Lord Empey Excerpts
Thursday 24th April 2025

(2 weeks, 2 days ago)

Lords Chamber
Read Full debate Read Hansard Text Watch Debate Read Debate Ministerial Extracts
Lord Empey Portrait Lord Empey (UUP)
- View Speech - Hansard - -

My Lords, I again note my interest in the register as the owner of a single rented property. The Minister has asserted, as Ministers are required to do, that, in her view,

“the provisions of the Renters’ Rights Bill are compatible with the Convention rights”.

I am just wondering, because it does tend to be a bit of a routine that those of us who have ever done this sign these things: can she tell the Committee whether there was a very specific examination of the circumstances in the Bill?

I must also say that the tour de force by the noble Lord, Lord Jackson, was impressive. We all felt that his Latin was very good—we will give him marks for that, I think—and he raises a very significant point. It is not unique to have retrospective legislation, but it is certainly frowned upon, bearing in mind the number of people who could be directly affected—their financial welfare, their own welfare, their concerns and the worries that can be generated by having something done, in effect, long after they had agreed and thought they had a deal. I am sure that President Trump will be listening to this debate, because he might be learning lessons; we might be teaching him things to do.

Can the Minister assure the Committee that when she signed that, or gave her views on the convention rights, that it was actually properly assessed, and legal advice was provided, rather than it simply being a piece of routine that departments do when they bring legislation to Parliament? Having listened to the contribution of the noble Lord, Lord Jackson, I think there could very well be people who will feel aggrieved if something happens subsequent to an agreement that they entered into freely and, all of a sudden, things have changed. I think we do need an explanation.

Lord Cromwell Portrait Lord Cromwell (CB)
- View Speech - Hansard - - - Excerpts

Can I just add that I was disappointed that we did not have any phraseology in ancient Greek? We will have to put up with that for today, I suppose. I echo my noble friend Lord Carter’s point: I think it would be really helpful, whatever one thinks of the rights and wrongs of retrospective legislation, that a proper list is set out as to which rights are going to be affected. I think everybody outside this Chamber is going to need that, in practice, in the rental sector. It would be very helpful if something could be published that literally specifies which bits are going to be affected retrospectively and how.

Renters’ Rights Bill

Lord Empey Excerpts
Thursday 24th April 2025

(2 weeks, 2 days ago)

Lords Chamber
Read Full debate Read Hansard Text Watch Debate Read Debate Ministerial Extracts
Lord Empey Portrait Lord Empey (UUP)
- View Speech - Hansard - -

My Lords, I would have thought that common sense alone would have encouraged the Government to accept the amendment on the grounds that, surely, it is one way of avoiding potential legal arguments where people will get into a dispute over the actual process and will argue that form A should have been in one form and form B in another. Surely, it is relatively straightforward to ensure consistency, clarity and certainty. Having a position where forms are not published does not seem to make any sense, and I would appreciate it if the Minister could explain to the Committee why it would be in the Secretary of State’s interest even to have the burden of that responsibility, never mind the difficulties that tenants and others might have. Surely anything that could create certainty and remove grounds for illegal dispute would be in the interests of the Minister and the Government.

Baroness Taylor of Stevenage Portrait Baroness Taylor of Stevenage (Lab)
- View Speech - Hansard - - - Excerpts

My Lords, I hope that I can explain this very quickly and simply. I thank the noble Baroness, Lady Scott, for her amendment regarding the form of notice for proceedings. Clause 6 allows the Secretary of State to publish the prescribed form to be used when landlords serve notice of intention to begin possession proceedings. The form will continue to be published on GOV.UK. Amendment 68 by the noble Baroness, Lady Scott, would not affect whether the Government are required to prescribe that form. This requirement is already laid out in Section 8(3) of the Housing Act 1988 and is not repealed by any measure in the Renters’ Rights Bill.

Clause 6 provides that regulations may allow the Secretary of State to publish and update the required form without the need for any updates to be made by way of statutory instrument, as is currently the case. It is crucial that the information that landlords are required to provide reflects current law. This clause will allow regulations to be made so that we can update the forms at speed and respond to changing circumstances. As the notice of possession proceedings remains a prescribed form under Section 8(3) of the Housing Act 1988, the requirement for the Government to prescribe the form persists; however, Clause 6 provides a simpler mechanism in which the form can be updated—it is the mechanism that changes.

I therefore ask the noble Baroness to withdraw the amendment.

Renters’ Rights Bill

Lord Empey Excerpts
Tuesday 22nd April 2025

(2 weeks, 4 days ago)

Lords Chamber
Read Full debate Read Hansard Text Watch Debate Read Debate Ministerial Extracts
I ask the Minister to at least consider this amendment. It is a way that the Government can honour their overall generic manifesto commitment but not clog up the system and produce the perverse results—fewer properties and higher rents—that none of us in this Committee wants to see.
Lord Empey Portrait Lord Empey (UUP)
- View Speech - Hansard - -

My Lords, I declare an interest on the register in regard to this matter.

The Government cannot take this legislation in isolation. As a country, we are taking policy actions that diminish supply and increase demand. Our population is increasing—and that is a deliberate decision. The net effect of that, of course, is that, with local authorities not building properties in the manner and at the rate that they used to, we are creating circumstances where we have a perfect storm of increased demand and reduced supply. The supply is reducing, and the Bill will have the perverse effect of reducing it even further.

We have to take a holistic view. It is not simply a question of dealing with tenancies in isolation; we have to look at the big picture. As we have heard from the noble Baroness, Lady Scott, in her proposal, the vast majority of these people are small-business people. Most people in the sector have these properties as part of what they deem to be their pensions. But equally, we all want to see fairness. We know that “landlord” is almost a dirty word. Historically, we have had Rachman and suchlike tainting the whole sector. There has been a steady drip of measures over the years mitigating against provision in the rented sector, such as interest no longer being offset against tax for people who are doing buy-to-lets and so on. Regulation has increased—some of it very necessary for health and safety, but the burden is going up.

Clearly, in places such as London, there is massive demand that is basically impossible to meet. Unlike countries such as Germany, where the rented sector is totally different—in many cases it is the norm that people rent properties and do not own them—we are in a different place. We concentrate on private ownership of our own properties, so rental is different. Reference was made to assessment. I ask the Minister: has an assessment been made of the impact on the supply of properties?

The number of properties will, I expect, continue to diminish, and that puts extra pressure on local authorities. The LGA has been explicit about that. This is increasing homelessness, and we have the pressures there and the pressures from immigration and from asylum seekers. Yet we are taking measures—whether in this sort of legislation or others—that mitigate against people taking on a private property to rent. Unless somebody can make a profit out of renting, why would they bother? Then you have all the hassle of going through the courts, not getting paid, et cetera.

On the other side of the coin, there are properties that are in a very poor state. We have seen examples of landlords who do not maintain them properly. Nobody wants that, and the Government clearly have a mandate to make change. However, I am far from convinced that the fairness that we all want to see, and which the Government have a right to insist upon, is necessarily achieved by the measures in this Bill. While the proposal from the noble Baroness, Lady Scott, and the noble Lord, Lord Jackson, may or may not be to the Government’s liking, at least one can see where they are coming from and why they are doing it.

If the Government are not prepared to adopt that, let the Minister come forward with a coherent mechanism that a landlord can use if they happen to have a tenant who is not abiding by the rules. It does not have to be Amendment 8; it could be something else, but let us see it, get it on the table and discuss it, so that the consensus whereby we all wish to see improvements can be achieved. There is no point having a Bill the perverse effect of which will be to reduce supply. Nobody will gain from that. I ask the Minister kindly to address that in her summing up.

Lord Murray of Blidworth Portrait Lord Murray of Blidworth (Con)
- View Speech - Hansard - - - Excerpts

My Lords, I too support the amendment tabled by my noble friend Lady Scott of Bybrook. I should say that my wife owns a one-bedroom property which she is in the process of selling, in part because of the potential effects of this Bill and the reasons so eloquently outlined by the previous three speakers.

As a young barrister, I used to practise landlord and tenant. I used to go around the country defending and prosecuting cases of repossession or otherwise, or resisting possession claims for properties. I know how long and painful the process is to try to repossess a property in circumstances where a tenant has not paid rent. I also know the pain that that can inflict on a small landlord who is using the rent to pay the mortgage and to pay the maintenance on that property.

As the noble Lord made abundantly clear in his speech a moment ago, not all landlords are of the Rachman ilk, with thousands of properties under their belt, and out to do down the tenant. As the noble Lord, Lord Jackson, said, in so many cases, this is a relationship of happiness and contentment. The landlord looks after the property and uses the rent money to pay the mortgage on the property and maintain it for the tenant. The tenant has the flexibility of being able to leave that property when they wish, and they do not have the burden of maintaining it. It is an important flexibility within the labour market.

The abolition of Section 21 will have a very damaging effect on our housing market. I say that because the court system is simply not ready for a situation where the only grounds upon which you can take back a property in a circumstance where a tenancy has failed would be by bringing proceedings for non-payment of rent or for some other breach of the tenancy. Those sorts of proceedings take a very long time to work their way through the court system. I recall, as a young practitioner, there still being cases under the 1977 Rent Act where the rent had stayed the same as it was in the 1970s and the tenant was effectively irremovable. It was a nightmare for the owner. It was a rigidity in the housing system, which was ended by the use of Section 21 notices.

To describe those notices as being no-fault evictions is very much only half the story. As the noble Baroness, Lady Scott, pointed out, the purpose of Section 21 notices is to enable an agreement to rent a property to come to an end, perhaps because you want to live in the house yourself, or you want to sell the property because you need the money for some other purpose. Section 21 serves a vital role in the housing market and its abolition is something we would all come to regret.

I therefore strongly urge the Government to consider carefully an exemption for small landlords of the type suggested by my noble friend in this amendment. This is worth very careful consideration. We have not heard enough about the readiness of the court service to implement this abolition.

--- Later in debate ---
Baroness Taylor of Stevenage Portrait Baroness Taylor of Stevenage (Lab)
- Hansard - - - Excerpts

I was just about to respond to the point made by the noble Lord, Lord Empey, which may answer that question. As usual, we are working with the Ministry of Justice to complete a justice impact test. This will identify the additional burdens on the justice system arising from new policies in the Renters’ Rights Bill, and it will ensure that the system is fully prepared for any increase in workload. I hope that reassures the noble Baroness.

Lord Empey Portrait Lord Empey (UUP)
- Hansard - -

The Minister made the valid point that tenants with different landlords should not be treated differently. If a landlord owns 30 or 40 properties, and one or two are caught in a dispute and no rent for them is coming in, that is manageable; but if they own only one or two properties, 100% or 50% of their income goes. I accept that the Minister has a valid point about the treatment of tenants; but given that the majority of landlords own single or small properties, there is a specific issue. Can the Minister say whether she has had any communication with local authorities? They are the people who would have to pick up the pieces if there is a diminution in supply. Has the Minister given any consideration to that?

Baroness Taylor of Stevenage Portrait Baroness Taylor of Stevenage (Lab)
- Hansard - - - Excerpts

I will respond to that in two ways. First, the work that has been done on the court system is both for landlords and tenants. We want it to work for both sides, so that when a landlord needs to seek possession they can do that quickly. I think any landlord’s business model should account for the possibility of a slight break in rental payment, but obviously we want to resolve these issues as quickly as possible, and to do the same for the tenants. There needs to be quick access to recourse if they need it, and we will do that.

Secondly, in respect to the point about local authorities, I have covered extensively the Government’s assessment of whether this will have an impact on supply issues. I reiterate that the Bill’s impact assessment has received a green rating from the Regulatory Policy Committee. We do not believe there will be a sustained or significant impact on supply, but we will monitor that very carefully once the Bill is passed.

I hope I have answered all noble Lords’ points on this but, for the reasons I have set out, I hope the noble Baroness will withdraw her amendment.

Tell MAMA: Funding

Lord Empey Excerpts
Thursday 13th March 2025

(1 month, 3 weeks ago)

Lords Chamber
Read Full debate Read Hansard Text Watch Debate Read Debate Ministerial Extracts
Lord Khan of Burnley Portrait Lord Khan of Burnley (Lab)
- View Speech - Hansard - - - Excerpts

My Lords, the noble Lord made an interesting point, but it would be remiss of me to comment on negotiations we are having with Tell MAMA. I had a very productive meeting with Tell MAMA and its legal representative. It was very productive and hopefully everything will be resolved soon.

Lord Empey Portrait Lord Empey (UUP)
- View Speech - Hansard - -

My Lords, would the Minister be prepared to let us know, and publish and put a letter in the Library about, the terms, conditions and criteria that are applied not only to this group but to similar organisations? The Community Security Trust does similar work for the Jewish community. It might be helpful to have some clarity on that, so there is no risk of other organisations finding themselves in the same situation.

Lord Khan of Burnley Portrait Lord Khan of Burnley (Lab)
- View Speech - Hansard - - - Excerpts

My Lords, because this is a competitive bidding and an open-ground process, that will be published as we open that process for people to apply for government services. Everyone is welcome to apply. The service is going to continue and everyone is invited to apply, including Tell MAMA.

Lord Empey Portrait Lord Empey (UUP)
- Hansard - -

I am most grateful to the noble Baroness for giving way. She mentioned a list of people who had a degree of responsibility. One of them, of course, is building control. My experience of building control in local authorities is that they can be extremely pernickety and difficult, and can enforce very high standards. All of us, in our different cities, will have seen examples of absolutely grotesque omissions and failures. But is it not the case that a local authority has a statutory liability, through building control, and that that, in and of itself, could and should be a source of remedy for a person who finds themselves in this position? On top of that, is there not an incentive for a developer, having built a structure and sold on the units, to wind up and move on to a different company to build the next one? We end up with people slipping out of the net entirely.

Baroness Thornhill Portrait Baroness Thornhill (LD)
- Hansard - - - Excerpts

The noble Lord has hit on a point; in some estates, you build one building that might just meet the requirements, and then more and more are built, and it expands the problem. I agree with a lot of what he said. I was trying to point out that we tend to say it is all on the developers, but I think this is a systemic failure of a series of accountable people. That is what I am trying to say.

Ultimately, I am saying that, sadly for democracy, this is yet another state failure—like WASPI, blood contamination and Windrush, to name but a few. The harsh reality is that the impact of this is felt every day by some people, and is growing: when a leaseholder decides that they want to reinsure or somebody decides that they want to sell, suddenly they are faced with, “Wow, I didn’t realise that there was all of this”. Therefore, the number of people affected is actually growing.

I will end on what my noble friend Lady Pinnock always says: leaseholders have done nothing wrong and everything right. Excellent campaigning from groups such as End Our Cladding Scandal and the non-qualifying leaseholders group has helped us achieve the progress we have made on remediation support. We owe it to them to keep pressing the Government on making sure that all leaseholders are protected from the costs of a situation they did absolutely nothing to cause.

--- Later in debate ---
The noble Earl, Lord Lytton, asked what would happen to buildings that needed remediation if the landlord went into insolvency. An application for a remediation contribution order can be made by an interested party under Section 124 of the Building Safety Act to recover contribution costs of remediation from a past landlord, a developer or a person associated with those entities, including a person associated with the current landlord. It follows that a leaseholder or other interested person would be entitled to apply for a remediation contribution order even if the current landlord was insolvent. As any proceedings would not be against the current landlord, the insolvency of the landlord does not preclude this course of action. If an application for an order is successful, the tribunal has the power to order that payment is made directly to a specified person.
Lord Empey Portrait Lord Empey (UUP)
- Hansard - -

On that matter, if a company was responsible for defective property and the company became insolvent, am I to understand that the directors of that company would be capable of recommencing building another property? Or is the Minister saying that the individuals could be followed through the courts for remediation, rather than being able to sidestep their responsibilities?

Baroness Scott of Bybrook Portrait Baroness Scott of Bybrook (Con)
- Hansard - - - Excerpts

My Lords, that is an interesting and very legal point. Rather than speaking off the top of my head, I would like to get it right and write to the noble Lord.

I move to Amendments 96, 97, 99 and 100. I thank my noble friend Lord Young of Cookham for these amendments. Amendments 96 and 99 would extend the leaseholder protections to buildings under 11 metres and to collectively owned leaseholder buildings. It is generally accepted that the risk to life from historic fire safety defects is proportionate to the height of buildings. As this risk is lower in buildings under 11 metres, such buildings will require remediation only in very exceptional circumstances. Given the small number of buildings that have required this—it is three across the country; the developers have remediated two of them and we are in negotiations on the third to get that remediation done—our assessment remains that extending the leaseholder protections to these buildings is neither necessary nor proportionate.

Where leaseholders in buildings under 11 metres face remediation costs, it is important, as I have said so many times at the Dispatch Box, that they contact the department immediately and we will look into that individual building on a case-by-case basis. If necessary, we will write to the building owner to seek assurances that any proposed works are necessary and proportionate, and that the rights to redress are being fully utilised.

The Government understand that some leaseholders in these buildings are still facing higher insurance premiums, with insurers citing building safety as the reason for the increase. The Association of British Insurers and its members have stated that premiums should reduce where buildings comply with building regulations. We expect insurers to honour their commitments and make sure that premiums are priced fairly and appropriate to the level of risk.

Regarding collectively owned leaseholder buildings, the Government made the decision that the leaseholder protections in the Building Safety Act would not apply to these buildings. As a result, people would still have to pay to remedy the safety defects in their building as owners. Residents who own the freehold would have to pay not only their portion of remediation costs but for any residents who did not participate in the purchase of the freehold.

Since the Building Safety Act, the Government have continued to examine the situation faced by collectively owned leasehold buildings. For instance, the Building Safety (Leaseholder Protections) (England) Regulations 2022 provide owners in these leaseholder-owned buildings with access to remediation contribution costs. We have listened and we have acted.

I turn to Amendment 97. The existing leaseholder protection package is designed to maintain a fine balance between leaseholders’ and freeholders’ rights. The amendment distorts the balance disproportionately in favour of leaseholders and risks unfairly benefiting one group of investors, leaseholders, to the detriment of another—the freeholders.

Regarding Amendment 100, our intention has always been to protect individuals living in their own homes, rather than those who have purchased property for financial or commercial reasons. Changing the leaseholder protection regime so that it is linked to a share of ownership, rather than individual properties, would also introduce an unnecessary level of uncertainty and complexity into the protections.

Regarding cessation certificates, it is not clear what effect such a certificate would have or how a landlord would know when to serve one. The responsibility for the costs of fixing historical building safety defects should rest with those responsible for creating them. The Building Safety Act was clear that, when this is not possible, responsibility for remediation should be shared between stakeholders in the property. Concentrating responsibility on a single group would risk a number of unintended consequences, including freeholders becoming insolvent. Taken together, the changes made by this amendment would therefore complicate the regime unnecessarily and slow the progress made towards the remediation of buildings.

I thank the noble Baroness, Lady Thornhill, who spoke on behalf of the noble Baroness, Lady Pinnock, to Amendment 102 about the reporting requirement for building safety remediation. The Government are committed to accelerating remediation and protecting affected residents. The total number of buildings reported to have started or completed remediation works in England has more than doubled since the end of March 2023. Along with monthly updates, Ministers have also committed to providing the other place and those interested with regular updates on progress, the latest of which was provided on 26 March.

My noble friend Lord Young of Cookham asked about ACM cladding. Another noble Lord mentioned pathways. I realise that pathways do not mean delivery, but, importantly, all residential buildings in England taller than 11 metres have a pathway to fixing unsafe cladding, either through taxpayer-funded schemes, developer-funded schemes or social housing provider-led remediation. This protects leaseholders from these costs. In addition, 99% of high-rise buildings with unsafe Grenfell-style ACM cladding identified before 2023 have been made safe or have work under way to make them safe. The proportion of buildings remediated continues to shift as more buildings are being identified and 90% of all high-rise buildings with ACM cladding have been made safe or have work under way on them.

My noble friend Lord Young also brought up the issue of decanting. The Government amended the Bill in the other place to make it explicit that the costs of alternative accommodation for residents, when they are decanted from their homes to avoid imminent threat to life or of personal injury, or because remediation works cannot take place while residents are in occupation, can be recovered. They can recover those costs through a remediation contribution order, which is an important change to the Bill.

The department continues to take steps to support applicants to start on site more quickly. Local authorities, fire and rescue authorities and the Health and Safety Executive can take enforcement action against those not progressing remedial works. Where building owners are failing to make acceptable progress, those responsible should expect further action to be taken.

Some 55 of the largest developers signed legally binding contracts committing to remediate, or to pay to remediate, life-critical fire safety defects in 1,500 buildings over 11 metres that they had a role in developing in England over the 30 years to April 2022. Together with the building safety levy, this will see industry contribute an estimated £6 billion. The department publishes information on developer progress based on quarterly returns submitted by developers, and this is available. I make it clear that the introduction of new reporting requirements involves time and cost, which need to be balanced against the need to continue our progress in building remediation. So I ask the noble Baroness not to press the amendment.

I thank the noble Baroness, Lady Taylor of Stevenage, for her Amendment 105. Similarly to Amendment 97, it would open the door to changes which distort that balance disproportionately in favour of one group, to the detriment of another. It is important that legislation provides clarity for leaseholders, freeholders and the courts. The Government believe that having definitions of qualifying and non-qualifying leases in primary legislation provides greater certainty to all interested parties—an important consideration given that this is a pivotal part of the legislation for so many people across the country.

I thank the noble Earl, Lord Lytton, for Amendments 105C to 105G, which seek to make several changes to the building safety regime and, in the case of Amendment 105G, the insolvency regime. Amendment 105C would rewrite the developer remediation contract by statute. This would unfortunately serve to create operational legal confusion about what developers’ obligations are, which buildings need to be identified and remediated, and what standards this should be done to, resulting in delay and litigation. I hope the Committee agrees that the Government should instead focus on holding developers to account for remediating unsafe buildings as quickly as possible.

On Amendment 105D, it is right that the Government have worked with major developers that have built defective buildings to secure binding commitments to remediate, worth an estimated £3 billion. However, I do not believe it would be fair also to target these specific developers to pay a disproportionate share of other remediation costs for buildings that they have no connection with. That is why we are focused on setting up the building safety levy to contribute funds to our programmes to remediate buildings over 11 metres. The levy is estimated to raise a further £3 billion over 10 years, or more.

We have had much debate on the merits of Amendment 105E, and I gave my views on Amendments 96, 97 and 99. As I mentioned, relatively small numbers of residential buildings under 11 metres or five storeys require remediation. These buildings are considered to be at low risk of historical fire defects, and I maintain that this change would disproportionately and unfairly place the obligation for remediation of non-life-threatening defects on freeholders. Meanwhile, extending protection to leaseholders who have not purchased the freehold would place the financial burden of remediation entirely on leaseholders who own a share of the freehold, making it less likely that these buildings will be remediated.

As for providing leaseholder protections to leaseholders who own more than three dwellings, I reiterate the points raised earlier. Landlords owning a number of properties are likely to have these as investments, and a fair balance needs to be met. The Building Safety Act was not designed to benefit investors; it is to help individuals living in their own homes.

On Amendment 105F, removing qualifications for passing on costs for defects in service charges would widen the scope of the leaseholder protections considerably. This would risk the burden of remediation costs falling disproportionately on landlords, whether or not those landlords are also some or all of the leaseholders in the building. The amendment also provides for members of a building industry scheme to cover remediation costs. I have already mentioned my concerns with the similar approach in Amendment 105D.