Mobile Telephones: Public Emergency Alert System

Baroness Smith of Basildon Excerpts

Wednesday 21st April 2021 Lords Chamber

[Lord True (Con)]

I agree with my noble friend and pay tribute to him, and all those who have spoken, for their interest in nudging—I guess that is the word—this forward. My noble friend is quite right to say that alerts must not scare or alarm people. The Government intend to launch a nationwide public information campaign to support the rollout of the service, to familiarise people with the look, sound and feel of the alert, and to inform them when it will be used and how it works.

[Baroness Smith of Basildon (Lab)]

It is great to have a public information system, but we do not know what it is for. This issue is so important because it is about managing risk. One of the problems at the moment is that it is not always clear where, in government, that responsibility lies. On 3 March, the Government said that they were actively

“reviewing where responsibility for biological security and the strategy sits within Government.”

The Minister said today that he understands the seriousness and urgency of these issues, and that he is satisfied with the progress, so can he update the House now, or write to me if he does not know, on whether a decision has been made and where that issue sits within the Government? If not, when can they tell us?

[Lord True (Con)]

I will have to write to the noble Baroness on biological security; I undertake to do so.

Gender-balanced Parliament and Male Primogeniture

Baroness Smith of Basildon Excerpts

Tuesday 20th April 2021 Lords Chamber

[Lord True (Con)]

The noble Baroness makes a very important point. Improving the diversity of Parliament is something to which I believe all political parties assent, and this Government no less than any other. Beyond your Lordships’ House, where we must sometimes look, there are now 220 female Members of Parliament; that is more women in the House of Commons than ever before. That is surely progress.

[Baroness Smith of Basildon (Lab)]

My Lords, the noble Lord, Lord Lucas, raises the issue of male primogeniture, which is clearly unfair, but I have to say that, of all the issues of gender equality where I would seek to make a difference, it is probably not top of my list. I bring the Minister back to the point made by the noble Lord, Lord Tyler. Hereditary by-elections have had their day; the legislation is outdated. If we want to address what is clearly an inequality, in that there are no female hereditary Peers in this House—the issue of peerages outside the House is a completely different one—surely the Government should support the Grocott Bill when it will undoubtedly come before your Lordships’ House again, and not let it be wrecked by a few. It is time for the Government to show some courage on this issue.

[Lord True (Con)]

My Lords, the Government assent to the rule of law, and I believe that the law as is should be applied in this respect.

Post Brexit: Economic and Political Opportunities

Baroness Smith of Basildon Excerpts

Thursday 25th March 2021 Lords Chamber

[Lord Frost (Con)]

My Lords, we obviously regret the situation that has arisen with the difficulties in exporting shellfish to the European Union after 1 January. Clearly, nothing changed in the safety of British shellfish or British waters at midnight on 31 December. We are continuing to work with the Commission and member states to see whether we can resolve this situation.

[Baroness Smith of Basildon (Lab)]

My Lords, like the noble Lord, Lord Hamilton, I want to return to an issue we touched on last week when the Minister appeared to dismiss concerns about the January fall in exports, saying:

“A unique combination of facts has made it inevitable”.—[Official Report, 18/3/21; col. 445.]


The Food and Drink Federation does not share his complacency, having seen its members’ exports to the EU collapse by 75% in the past year but by only 11% to the rest of the world. It is clear that the Brexit negotiations, which the Minister was part of, had a hugely significant impact, particularly on small businesses, so I have two questions for him. First, if the fall really was inevitable, why did he not tell businesses beforehand? Secondly, will he urgently convene a meeting, not- withstanding his earlier comments, of the partnership council and the special trade committees to try to save British exports?

[Lord Frost (Con)]

My Lords, the economic situation is clearly hugely influenced by many factors including stock building, the implementation of the Trade and Cooperation Agreement and the effects of the pandemic, which has dramatically affected markets in Europe, to which many of our smaller companies and food companies export. We are working very closely with all those companies to deal with the difficulties they face, and we will continue to do so in support of our great food and drink industry.

UK-EU Trade

Baroness Smith of Basildon Excerpts

Thursday 18th March 2021 Lords Chamber

[Lord Frost (Con)]

My Lords, the Government of course recognise the importance of the UK’s cultural industries. We made proposals during the negotiations last year that would have allowed musicians to travel and perform in the UK and the EU more easily without work permits. They were rejected by the European Union. Now that negotiations are over, we are working with the sector to help it adjust to this new relationship. We have a working group with industry representatives which is feeding into our process. We are of course discussing a range of issues with Maroš Šefčovič as regards the implementation of the TCA.

[Baroness Smith of Basildon (Lab)]

My Lords, I thank the Minister for agreeing to meet the noble Lord, Lord Adonis, on the issues he raised, but in response to my noble friend Lord McNicol, he seemed reluctant to admit that there was a problem and he certainly did not answer the part of the question about what the solutions were, so I shall try again. Your Lordships’ House has been fully engaged in preparing the UK for its new relationship with the EU. There has been an unprecedented number of documents, Bills and statutory instruments that we have all waded our way through to get to the detail, but all behind ensuring support for the Government’s border plans. Yet here we are, less than three months in, and that model is creaking. The Minister is now tearing up plan A in order to push back implementation dates. Can he tell us what he thinks has gone wrong?

[Lord Frost (Con)]

My Lords, as I say, it is too early to draw conclusions from any figures in January; there are too many other factors influencing the economic situation. We have always made clear and are assiduously implementing our plans to get businesses the support they need to manage the changes to our trading relationship with the EU. There is a new Brexit support fund and a Brexit business taskforce. We are supporting the fisheries industries and many others through the initial difficulties of the change in relationship.

Taskforce on Innovation, Growth and Regulatory Reform

Baroness Smith of Basildon Excerpts

Wednesday 17th March 2021 Lords Chamber

[Lord True (Con)]

Absolutely not, my Lords. Again, the noble Lord does not show the respect due for the decision of the British people to leave the European Union. The reality is that this task force is asked to look at reducing barriers in whatever context, and I draw his attention to great steps forward. For example, there is the trade agreement with Japan.

[Baroness Smith of Basildon (Lab)]

My Lords, in response to three questions today, the Minister has said that he cannot answer because it is not his department. He is no novice at the Dispatch Box. Can I gently remind him that at the Dispatch Box he answers on behalf of the Government, not just one government department? My specific question is around the task force that he refers to; none of the questions on it should be a surprise to him at all. I have read the terms of reference. They are about business, environmental standards and workers’ protection, but the only members of this task force are three Conservative MPs. Does he think it has any credibility when there are no representatives of employers or employees on the task force? Would it not have been better set up as a Conservative Party task force, to report to the leader of the Conservative Party, rather than being able to get Civil Service support when it is clearly just a Conservative Party body?

[Lord True (Con)]

My Lords, I disagree. As to the first part, of course I acknowledge that I answer on behalf of government, but the competence of a Minister to answer on specific questions outside his departmental responsibility is not always the same as that of the Minister responsible. I refer comments on, as I said in another answer. Concerning the second part of the noble Baroness’s question, it is entirely reasonable for any Prime Minister to seek blue-sky thinking, and ideas outside and in parallel to the Government. Mr Blair, for example, did exactly that when calling in the noble Lord, Lord Birt.

Northern Ireland Protocol: Grace Period

Baroness Smith of Basildon Excerpts

Wednesday 10th March 2021 Lords Chamber

[Lord Frost (Con)]

I thank the noble Earl for his question, and I look forward to appearing before his committee again in the near future. We have been working through the joint committee mechanisms since the beginning of the year and before. The measures taken last week were operational, technical and temporary. We informed the Commission of those through the appropriate channels and at the appropriate level before the decision was made public.

[Baroness Smith of Basildon (Lab)]

My Lords, I think we all welcome that the noble Lord, Lord Frost, is now able to answer Questions from the Dispatch Box and we look forward to an ongoing dialogue with him about his Cabinet responsibilities. His role in the negotiations has been credited with getting the agreement and the Northern Ireland protocol over the line. He would have been aware then of all the implications. Given that he supported the creation of, and now co-chairs, the Joint Committees he has referred to, which are designed to resolve such disputes, would not the most mature and pragmatic way to deal with this issue be to continue with that process? Does he understand that the unilateral action he is championing is a double threat? It jeopardises the European Parliament’s ratification of his own agreement and damages our international reputation if we cannot be trusted to keep our word.

[Lord Frost (Con)]

I thank the Baroness and I look forward to answering many more Questions from this Dispatch Box about our approach to the relationship with the European Union. We would like to see a constructive relationship with the European Union in future. The difficulty we are faced with this year is that the EU’s decision to invoke Article 16 in Northern Ireland has created a new and very difficult situation that has undermined cross-community confidence and we have been trying to deal with that. We would like to do so in a constructive and consensual way but we also have to have to regard to the situation and the need to maintain confidence and consent across both communities in Northern Ireland.

House of Lords: Size

Baroness Smith of Basildon Excerpts

Wednesday 27th January 2021 Lords Chamber

[Lord True (Con)]

My Lords, my noble friend makes a strong point. The role and performance of the House are fundamental to the perception of the House, as I said earlier. That is much deeper than some of the froth on this Question and a matter to which not only the Government but all of us need to direct our attention. We are a revising Chamber, and it is as that that we merit our place and reputation.

[Baroness Smith of Basildon (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, I find myself in unusual agreement with the noble Earl, Lord Caithness. The fact is that form should follow the function of this House. It is about not some academic interest in the size of the House, but the optimum size and balance between the party groups that allows us to do our work most effectively. We can be effective as a House and helpful to the Government, as is evident in the number of amendments passed by your Lordships’ House that the Government agree to and put into legislation. I put it to the Minister that if the Prime Minister’s approach is to continue to prioritise the appointment of Government-supporting Peers, that balance fails and the value of the House falls. They cannot just ram through legislation with ever-increasing government numbers. Does the Prime Minister respect the role and value of your Lordships’ House?

[Lord True (Con)]

I am certain that my right honourable friend respects the role and place of your Lordships’ House, as, I believe, for all the difficulties that there have been at times, previous Prime Ministers of all parties have. It is reasonable that the House of Lords has been refreshed. As long as it is a nominated House, that should remain the case. On the question of 600 Members, which is often mentioned, I remind your Lordships that there have only been two Divisions in your Lordships’ House since 2015 in which more than 600 people voted.

Protocol on Northern Ireland: Disruption to Trade

Baroness Smith of Basildon Excerpts

Thursday 14th January 2021 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Smith of Basildon (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, shoppers in Northern Ireland supermarkets were surprised to find competitors’ products on the shelves. Of greater concern, some products have disappeared entirely, with the Government saying that

“the situation is likely to get worse before it gets better.”

This is unacceptable. Michael Gove admitted yesterday that mistakes had been made, but that is not good enough and it fails to explain why the Government did not prepare for something that they had been warned about for more than a year. It is just shambolic. The protocol is not perfect, but it needs to be made to work. I have two questions for the Minister. Why did Ministers spend so much of last year denying the challenges, leaving it to business to make contingency plans? I also ask him to explain what urgent steps the Government are taking to get shelves stocked and trade moving today.

[The Minister of State, Cabinet Office (Lord True) (Con)]

My Lords, it is important that we are clear about the overall picture. One must not overstate individual anecdotes into a systemic picture. I acknowledge that there have been issues—that was never denied—but, overall, goods are continuing to flow effectively. Supermarkets are able to move their lorries into Northern Ireland. There are some specific issues, as we have seen with individual suppliers, but it is holding up well overall. The UK Government will continue to work with supermarkets, retailers and suppliers to move in the longer run to end-to-end digital systems that enable goods to be moved in accordance with the protocol in the most streamlined way possible.

House of Lords Appointments Commission

Baroness Smith of Basildon Excerpts

Tuesday 5th January 2021 Lords Chamber

[Lord True (Con)]

I am grateful for my noble friend’s comments. There is a certain imbalance in some of the response to the Prime Minister’s appointments. My position is to welcome all those coming to your Lordships’ House, including the person who has been unfairly attacked today.

[Baroness Smith of Basildon (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, I listened carefully to the Minister’s answers and I do not think he has addressed the Question first put to him by the noble Baroness, Lady Hayman, who was the first Lord Speaker of this House, or that of the noble Baroness, Lady Jay, a former Leader of the House. They asked what he is going to do to restore public confidence. While the noble Lord, Lord McLoughlin, is right that the role of the commission has not changed, the attitude of the Prime Minister to its recommendations has changed. In three key areas—the size of the House and the Burns committee report, by-elections of hereditary Peers, and now the integrity of the appointments system—the Government are lagging behind the House of Lords. I take the Minister back to the original Question: what do he and the Government intend to do to restore and improve the reputation of the House, which has been damaged by ongoing appointments and an increase in size?

[Lord True (Con)]

My Lords, I disagree that appointments are damaging the reputation of the House, as keeps being put. I am grateful that all noble Lords are, as I am, jealous of the reputation of the House, but if quantity of appointments were the issue, it would have been badly damaged under a previous Administration. The noble Baroness referred also to appointments of hereditary Peers. If we are talking of statutory matters, I suggest that the House of Lords looks at the statute on this matter.

Covid-19: Public Health Information

Baroness Smith of Basildon Excerpts

Tuesday 8th December 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord True (Con)]

My Lords, I endorse the need to reach all vulnerable groups. I take the noble Baroness’s suggestion seriously and will ask colleagues to reflect on it.

[Baroness Smith of Basildon (Lab)]

My Lords, we were all delighted to see the news this morning that 90 year- old Margaret Keenan got the first vaccination from nurse May Parsons. However, can I take the Minister back to two points? First, he said that the information was available in many languages and different formats; yet, as the noble Baroness, Lady Jolly, has pointed out, that is not available on the NHS website. I know that he would never want to—even inadvertently—mislead the House, so will he check with his department and report back to the House on how that information is available? I am sure that it is in everyone’s interest that it is as widely available as possible.

Secondly, what are the Government doing to combat the anti-vaccination messages online? There has to be some action taken against social media firms. When Margaret Keenan and others come forward to show how important it is that they are taking the vaccine, it is very sad, disappointing and worrying if no action is taken against social media when they try to deny people the protection offered by the vaccine.

[Lord True (Con)]

My Lords, I would never wish to mislead the House; I hope that Hansard will reflect that I said that I would take back to colleagues the point about the NHS. The point that I made about languages is broader. I totally agree with the noble Baroness that vaccine disinformation, spread unchecked, could cost lives. We take the issue seriously: we have secured a commitment from Facebook, Twitter and Google to tackle it by not profiting from this material and by responding to flagged comment more swiftly.