Brexit: Green Paper

Baroness Ludford Excerpts

Monday 9th January 2017 Lords Chamber

[Lord Pearson of Rannoch]

My Lords—

[Baroness Ludford (LD)]

My Lords—

[Lord Taylor of Holbeach]

I think that we will hear first from the Liberal Democrats and then perhaps we can then go to the noble Lord, Lord Pearson.

[Baroness Ludford]

My Lords, can the Minister clarify whether the Government think it important that we are within the single market and not just trading with it? Can he also explain to us precisely why the well-being of the country is being held hostage to squabbles within the Conservative Party and Cabinet?

[Lord Bridges of Headley]

I totally dispute the second part of the noble Baroness’s question, I am sorry to say. As regards the single market, my right honourable friend the Prime Minister set out our thinking on that yesterday. As she said, we are looking for the best possible deal for trading with and operating within the single European market, and we want that prosperity for all businesses.

Brexit: Constitutional Reform and Governance Act 2010

Baroness Ludford Excerpts

Tuesday 13th December 2016 Lords Chamber

[Lord Bridges of Headley]

First, I repeat what I said a moment ago: I thank the European Select Committees for their work. Christmas is indeed coming early for my department: there are large numbers of very useful contributions to the debate coming out. I am assured by my noble friend the Chief Whip that there are likely to be opportunities for debates on these reports in the near future. I will reflect on the other points which the noble Lord made.

[Baroness Ludford (LD)]

My Lords, the Minister made reference to the good reports coming from committees of this House, which I am sure would include the EU Select Committee and the Constitution Committee. In the light of that, will he share with us the fundamental reason why the Government refused to act sensibly and in good faith after 23 June? By making Parliament their partner in the Article 50 process and treating it as an equal, they would have obviated the litigation which involves so much delay—and angels on a pinhead—and acted in political and constitutional good faith.

[Lord Bridges of Headley]

My Lords, I dispute the premise of the noble Baroness’s question. The Government are treating Parliament with a great deal of respect. Regarding the legal case, the Government’s position has been clear all along. It is now a matter for the Supreme Court, whose judgment we await with great interest.

Brexit: European Union Citizenship

Baroness Ludford Excerpts

Tuesday 13th December 2016 Lords Chamber

[Lord Bridges of Headley]

I thank my noble friend for drawing my attention to that point and I will indeed look into it straight after Question Time. I was under the impression that we were in talks about those issues, but clearly I need to look into that and I will write to my noble friend.

[Baroness Ludford (LD)]

My Lords, we look forward to the publication tomorrow of our EU Select Committee’s report on acquired rights. Does the Minister acknowledge that Brexit would take an axe to the valuable EU rights that individuals have either as consumers, as we discussed yesterday, or as citizens, workers and students? Is that not why it is so important to let British voters decide whether they can support any eventual Brexit deal once they see its full implications for their lives and their families’ lives?

[Lord Bridges of Headley]

I am sorry to say that I disagree entirely with the noble Baroness’s final point about a second referendum. As regards the first point about rights, I draw her attention to the great repeal Bill, the whole premise of which is to transpose EU law into UK law, and to the commitment given by my right honourable friend the Secretary of State to ensure that workers’ rights are fundamentally protected.

Article 50 (Constitution Committee Report)

Baroness Ludford Excerpts

Tuesday 22nd November 2016 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Ludford (LD)]

My Lords, in commending both reports and the remarks of the noble Lords, Lord Lang and Lord Boswell, I note that it is important to remember that what we are talking about is the UK’s own domestic arrangements and constitutional requirements in the Article 50 withdrawal process. We determine these ourselves, not by any instruction from Brussels. Even if the Luxembourg court got involved via a reference from our own Supreme Court, or indeed from a national court in another member state, that would be purely to answer a point of EU law—“Is Article 50 legally revocable?”—though I happen to believe that politics may well overtake that question eventually; it would not be to address, let alone to decide, our own domestic arrangements. I hope, though I say this more in hope than expectation, that the press will remember that.

Both reports were written before the High Court judgment and do not depend on it. As the Constitution Committee report notes, it is the political and constitutional significance of decisions relating to the UK’s membership of the EU that makes the involvement of both Houses absolutely justified. The committee also notes, as did the noble Lords, Lord Higgins, Lord Bilimoria and Lord Balfe, among others, that the Government ought to want to work with Parliament in the spirit of co-operation—indeed, perhaps to share the burden of responsibility. The Constitution Committee was in fact very clear and strong in its language:

“It would be constitutionally inappropriate … for the Executive to act on an advisory referendum without … parliamentary approval—particularly one with such significant long-term consequences”.

Those are very strong words.

Between them, the two committees amplify that strong argument. First, enacting the result of the referendum should require at least the same level of parliamentary involvement as a decision to authorise military deployment. If that point has been conceded in the last few years, why are we even talking about it now? Secondly, Parliament would have to legislate to implement any relationship with the EU, so the Executive must ensure that they have proper parliamentary approval for the process leading up to that new relationship. Thirdly, one consequence of Brexit is that many key aspects of domestic policy could potentially be determined not by Parliament but in negotiations conducted behind closed doors, which is invidious. The Brexit Secretary has said that the Government are determined,

“to build national consensus around our approach”.—[Official Report, Commons, 5/9/16; col. 38.]

How better to do that than in Parliament?

We on these Benches entirely agree with the thrust of the two reports that Parliament must be involved in all the stages—I cannot now remember if there are three or four—of the Brexit process. “Taking back control”, as my noble friend Lord Beith said, does not mean handing control to the Executive. Parliament’s demand is to be involved in setting the strategy, not, as Mr Davis has claimed, in micromanaging to deprive the Government of room for manoeuvre or indeed, as the Chancellor said in an interview at the weekend, an involvement in the tactics of the negotiations. It is the overall picture that Parliament needs to be involved in.

Parliament adds value to the process of the Brexit negotiations. We are not to be regarded as some pesky nuisance. Our active scrutiny can assist the Government in a proactive way to achieve a successful outcome. All we need to do is look around on these Benches at the amount of expertise. On options, risks and opportunities, we are expecting 20 or so short reports on the impact of Brexit from the EU Select Committee under the noble Lord, Lord Boswell, and I believe they will provide a wealth of material. Far from undermining the Government’s negotiating stance, parliamentary approval of the negotiating guidelines can strengthen the Government’s hand, as several noble Lords have mentioned, when dealing with their partners in the negotiations. Indeed, we can protect the Government from the wild and irresponsible hard Brexiteers in their own party. One senior commentator has remarked that,

“The expectation that May will be pushed around by the Tory party right wing explains some of this pessimism”,

about the possible breakdown of Article 50 talks and Britain crashing out into a hard WTO-only exit, which of course would be disastrous for the economy, business, jobs and citizens.

So the Government are not respecting the will of the people—that much used and abused mantra. If they were, they would be planning a referendum on the outcome of the negotiations, because you cannot respect the will of the people if you do not allow them a say in the final outcome. They are not seeking a national consensus. All they seem to be doing is obeying the will of the Tory right-wing and UKIP, and that is not the same thing at all.

My noble friend Lady Suttie dealt with the refusal to give information on the Brexit terms on the basis of the “no running commentary” excuse. She cited the precedents of previous treaties. The noble Lord, Lord Hannay, cited the example of the justice and home affairs mass opt-in. There is plenty of precedent for keeping Parliament informed. Indeed, Ministers are doing plenty of whispering to their friends in the press. It is quite insulting to be told that Parliament, uniquely, cannot be kept informed.

I fear that it gives the game away on the real reason for the Government’s doctrine of unripe time that there is in fact no political consensus in government; it is really about time that there was. Many of us are weary of the Prime Minister talking in “Brexit means Brexit”-type riddles, which is becoming as demeaning to the Government as it is disrespectful to Parliament and the people.

The Secretary of State for Exiting the EU gave a pledge that we would not be second-class to MEPs. Indeed, my noble friend Lord Teverson provoked that promise. This means, as the report tells us, access to all the negotiating documents and at every stage of the negotiations, giving feedback and being listened to and responded to through a sort of flexible scrutiny reserve process. It means being told the response to Parliament’s concerns. Of course, it means safeguarding confidential information.

The reality so far is very different. The Government have already taken a number of steps without any reference to Parliament, leaving us to read the tea leaves. In no particular order, we have had the following. The noble Lord, Lord Hill, resigned his Commissioner post, so we lost the financial services portfolio. The Government renounced the presidency slot in 2017—perhaps inevitably, but it was done without any reference to Parliament. The Government said that they are giving priority to curbs on free movement of people, even if it means leaving the single market; but they are leaving UK and other EU nationals who have taken advantage of freedom of movement rights in total limbo, which is shameful. The Government have said that they want us to be outside the jurisdiction of the Court of Justice of the European Union, which will be very problematic for future relations. They have announced the fact but no details of a deal that satisfies the car company Nissan, which begs the question of whether that could fall foul of state aid rules and whether some special inclusion in the customs union for cars is expected.

All this has happened without Parliament being given any chance to influence the Government’s stance. Finally, we have had signalling of a slashing of corporation tax which, along with the rhetoric of some in their party, makes some people fear that the Government are set to make the UK the Singapore of the north Atlantic, which could make recognition and equivalence regimes much more difficult to achieve. The Government have also opted into the new Europol regulation, which is extremely good news, but begs the question about future security co-operation, which is vital.

I conclude by asking for the Prime Minister, instead of giving drip-drip to the press and making inscrutable utterances, to articulate her choices. Parliament, with or without a Supreme Court judgment, must be fully involved in the pursuance of them. Taking back control means no less.

United Kingdom: Single Market

Baroness Ludford Excerpts

Tuesday 15th November 2016 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Jones of Moulsecoomb (GP)]

My Lords—

[Baroness Ludford (LD)]

My Lords—

[Lord Pearson of Rannoch (UKIP)]

My Lords—

[The Lord Privy Seal (Baroness Evans of Bowes Park) (Con)]

My Lords, it is the turn of the Liberal Democrats.

[Baroness Ludford]

My Lords, clearly, when the Conservative Party offered the emphatic pledge of saying yes to the single market in its manifesto last year, as cited by my noble friend, it had in mind the national interest. Equally clearly, now the Conservative Government are focusing purely on their internal party interest. When will they get back to prioritising the interests and needs of the United Kingdom people and businesses, which means avoiding a destructive hard Brexit?

[Lord Bridges of Headley]

I am very sorry to say that I totally refute what the noble Baroness says. We are putting the national interest absolutely first and are doing so in a calm and measured way. Quite frankly, if I had turned up at this Dispatch Box four or so weeks after the referendum result and had come out with answers to the very complex challenges that this Government face—among the most serious challenges that any Government have faced since 1945—I think she would have asked us, “Where is all the planning? How has it all been carried out?”.

Brexit: Article 50

Baroness Ludford Excerpts

Monday 7th November 2016 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Hayter of Kentish Town (Lab)]

I thank the Minister for repeating the Statement, which I feel he had no hand in drafting. My guess is that he would have preferred to get on with allowing Parliament to trigger Article 50. Indeed, how much better it would have been if the Government had listened to the wise words of our Constitution Committee in September, when it said that a parliamentary vote would be needed. It is hard to understand why the Government are getting in such a tizzy about this. Rather like after their tax credit defeat, they overreact when faced by any challenge.

In September, I commented that,

“leaving the EU is not a simple step outside but a journey”.—[Official Report, 8/9/16; col. 1131.]

But will we leave Brussels via Dunkirk or Ostend, by train through Calais, by plane via Dublin or, heaven forfend, by the good ship “Titanic” piloted by Boris Johnson?

These are serious matters. In our economy, highly dependent on services, we have to secure a future for our creative, internet, design, legal, engineering and financial services and for intellectual property. We must be sure that our insolvency practitioners, chasing down funds for UK-based creditors, have access to squirrelled wealth in EU countries—currently allowed for under the mutual recognition of appointments—and that our lawyers retain rights of address and legal privilege. We need to safeguard the future of UK nationals living abroad as they lose their EU citizenship. We have to disentangle our competition law from that of the EU, law developed to protect consumers from monopolies and cartels, while helping our exporters, who will still be subject to EU competition rules.

Until we know the terms on which we will leave the EU and our relationship with the remaining 27 member states after we leave, we cannot negotiate trade deals with the rest of the world, so the terms on which we disengage from the EU and their consequences should be debated in Parliament. Parliament needs to question whether the Prime Minister has the right negotiating objectives for how we leave the EU. What priority will she give to remaining in the single market? Is she safeguarding—indeed, promoting—our regions, which have done less well from globalisation? Is she seeking to enhance consumer, environmental and workplace protections? Are her objectives grounded in security considerations and promoting human rights and are they acceptable to the electorate?

The British people decided that we should leave the EU, but it is for Parliament, not simply Downing Street, to debate the exit details. Whichever route we take, we have a long journey ahead of us. In that time, my fervent hope is that we see no more of the British press, which ought to recognise the sovereignty of Parliament and the independence of our judiciary, printing 72-point headings naming the Master of the Rolls and the Lord Chief Justice as “Enemies of the people” simply for doing their job and pointing out that, constitutionally, the Government,

“does not have power under the Crown’s prerogative to give notice pursuant to Article 50 … for the United Kingdom to withdraw from the European Union”.

The High Court ruling will not derail Brexit. However, given that the Government were caught short by the referendum result and none of the preparatory work was done in the case of a Brexit outcome, can the Minister assure the House that they will not find themselves in the same position this time if the judgment is upheld, and that a Bill is in preparation? Our EU committees have already started work on the myriad issues to be addressed. Could the Minister confirm that the Government will listen to the experience and knowledgeable words of these colleagues as they go forward?

[Baroness Ludford (LD)]

My Lords, I also thank the noble Lord for repeating the Statement. I could not agree more with the assertion in it that implementing the decision to leave the EU means following the right processes, including securing the time to develop a detailed negotiating position. The right processes mean implementing the repeated pledge to honour UK parliamentary sovereignty and seeking parliamentary approval for the negotiating position.

By December, the Government will have lost six months in that process. In fact, they seem to be tying themselves up in knots trying to avoid such parliamentary involvement, getting bogged down in their misguided pursuit of executive autonomy over the Article 50 process in an unnecessary and delay-inducing court case. Their incoherence is displayed in having to offer special comfort deals to particular firms such as Nissan instead of being clear in regard to the single market and the customs union. This is creating destabilising uncertainty for all kinds of economic operators and other bodies. Now we hear the Prime Minister talk about putting on the table more visas for Indian nationals, while apparently immigration is treated as a barrier to the single market. That seems somewhat contradictory.

We must rely on leaks in the press to try and read the Government’s mind—or read the tea leaves. Indeed, there is much speculation about a Bill but no such indication in the Statement today. I join the noble Baroness in asking for clarification on that. We need a respectful relationship between Government and Parliament, one indeed sketched out in several reports of our own EU Select Committee under the chairmanship of the noble Lord, Lord Boswell, and one last month from the Constitution Committee under the chairmanship of the noble Lord, Lord Lang of Monkton. A lot of work and evidence went into those reports but the Government just brushed them aside.

The Government are not only behaving arrogantly towards Parliament when the political constitutional basis for Parliament’s role was in fact clear without the legal process, but also—to the dismay of people across the political spectrum—indulging in populist and xenophobic language, culminating in the failure to properly defend the institution of the judiciary. Freedom of the press may incorporate a freedom to criticise a particular judgment but not to indulge in scurrilous personal and institutional abuse of judges and the judiciary. It is very disappointing that neither in the days since the High Court judgment nor today have the Government rebuked the nature of the press comments notably in the Daily Mail and rather more shockingly in the Daily Telegraph, including the famous “enemies of the people” slogan evocative of Nazi Germany. It would be good to hear from the Government a condemnation of that kind of press coverage, and of the incitement to rioting in the streets from the former leader of UKIP, Mr Farage.

The Government say they intend to act on the decision to leave but it is on the character of that action that we need clarity since there are many different varieties of Brexit—probably more than 57. It is necessary to be respectful to those who voted remain if the Prime Minister genuinely wants to unite the country. The phrase in the Statement about giving no quarter is a rather disturbing signal.

Liberal Democrats in no way seek to undermine the negotiating position of the Government. Parliament having an overview of the objectives would not do so. Indeed, having the backing of Parliament, as was mentioned in our several reports, would strengthen the Government’s hand in those negotiations. We are not asking for details of particular trade-offs or red lines.

Any delay is down to the Government. If they act in good faith, there is no reason not to meet a March timetable. This does not mean a series of interesting but essentially purposeless general debates in which the Government stonewall, but an opportunity to get to grips with a concrete plan and a substantive strategy. Can the Minister therefore tell us whether the Government are planning to inform Parliament about their negotiating objectives in a White Paper, as is rumoured, and what kind of Bill they are planning to produce? The Government need to stop waffling and sidestepping and give us enough meat to be able to vote for the triggering of Article 50.

[Lord Bridges of Headley]

I thank the noble Baronesses, Lady Hayter and Lady Ludford, for their contributions. I am determined to work constructively with Members of this House who want to make a success of Brexit. I said that at the start, that offer remains, and I am grateful to noble Lords who have spared their time and their expertise to meet me in private. As I say, my door remains open to anyone who wishes to have any conversation with me.

The noble Baroness, Lady Hayter, asked why we are appealing. As I said in the Statement, our position has been and remains that the decision to leave the EU was taken by the people in a referendum and that triggering Article 50, the starting point of the process, is a matter for the Government. That is an important principle, which is why we are appealing the judgment. As regards what would happen were we to lose, we are obviously prepared for all eventualities, but equally obviously, we are focused on the appeal to the Supreme Court. As we said last week, the logical conclusion to draw from the High Court judgment is that legislation would be necessary, but we are appealing the judgment and hope that the Supreme Court will rule differently. In the event that it does not, we will assess what remedy the Supreme Court requires and will set out our approach at that point. Therefore the speculation about a Bill is just that at this juncture—speculation.

The noble Baronesses, Lady Hayter and Lady Ludford, referred to the response to that court ruling. To embellish a little what I said in the Statement, I strongly believe, as the Government do, that one of the basic tenets of a free society is freedom of speech and expression, but so too is the independence of the judiciary, which is clearly a cornerstone of our democracy in maintaining the rule of law. We must observe due process and the independence of the judiciary and abide by its rulings. Meanwhile, however, we must all respect the outcome of the referendum and the wish of 17.4 million people to leave the EU.

On the role of Parliament, the noble Baroness, Lady Ludford, said a fair amount just a moment ago. She also talked about this on the “Today” programme this morning, when I was munching on my cornflakes, saying that the Government were completely excluding Parliament, and she just said that the Government are being arrogant towards Parliament. I will not get into a war of words on this. I will just put on the record what the Government have done so far. They have answered 302 Parliamentary Written Questions, made three Oral Statements, answered seven Oral Parliamentary Questions, given four Ministerial Statements and made 10 Select Committee appearances, and have replied to over half a dozen other debates. Currently there are over 30 Brexit-themed Select Committee inquiries. I make that point to say that we are giving Parliament the chance for scrutiny. On top of that, Parliament will vote to repeal the ECA and, as I said in the Statement, parliamentary procedure will be followed to ratify any treaty.

Furthermore, on the role of Parliament, our key aim in the negotiations will obviously be to deliver the best outcome while protecting the national interest. The Government have said that we will be as open as we possibly can be and we have set out our strategic aims. I argue, as I have done before, that we will not achieve a good outcome if this negotiation is run from the back seat by the House of Commons and this House. No negotiation can possibly be run in that way. Indeed, if Parliament insists that triggering Article 50 should be conditional on us going into this negotiation with all our cards face up for everyone on the other side of the table to see, that detailed minimum negotiating position will quickly become the maximum possible offer from our negotiating partners. Furthermore, the talk of a second referendum from some in this House and elsewhere will simply encourage the EU to impose difficult terms in the hope that the British people will change their minds if only the question is put to them again. To those who argue for certainty I ask: what greater uncertainty can there be than for that to be injected into the system?

Therefore, parliamentary scrutiny? Absolutely. But telling the Prime Minister which cards to play and seeking to force her to disclose her hand to those with whom she will be negotiating? I say no.

Brexit: Single Market

Baroness Ludford Excerpts

Monday 24th October 2016 Lords Chamber

Asked by

[Baroness Ludford]

To ask Her Majesty’s Government how they intend to fulfil the pledge in the 2015 Conservative Party manifesto to “safeguard British interests in the Single Market”.

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department for Exiting the European Union (Lord Bridges of Headley) (Con)]

My Lords, we will seek the right deal to give UK businesses the maximum access and freedom to trade with and operate in the single market. We are analysing the entire UK economy, looking in detail at over 50 sectors and cross-cutting regulatory issues to understand the key factors for business and the labour force.

[Baroness Ludford (LD)]

I thank the Minister for that reply. Given the importance of trust in politics, is it not a problem that the resounding yes to the single market in the Conservative manifesto, on which this Government were elected just last year, has become, in effect, a no to the single market? Even more important, is it not a huge blow to this country’s economic prospects if there is no coherent and responsible objective to keep all parts of the UK and all sectors of the economy in the single market?

[Lord Bridges of Headley]

I entirely agree with the noble Baroness about maintaining trust in politics. She is absolutely right about quoting page 72 of the Conservative Party manifesto, which I have in front of me. However, I draw her attention to the next paragraph, which says:

“We will hold that in-out referendum before the end of 2017 and respect the outcome”.

It is important that we respect the outcome of the referendum. Regarding the deal that we are seeking, we obviously wish to get the best possible arrangement for British companies to trade in goods and services across Europe while taking control of immigration. I am not going to speculate on what that looks like at this stage—I am sorry, but that is a refrain noble Lords will hear a lot—but the UK is in a unique position and we will be seeking a bespoke agreement with the EU.

Next Steps in Leaving the European Union

Baroness Ludford Excerpts

Monday 10th October 2016 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Hayter of Kentish Town (Lab)]

I thank the Minister for repeating the Statement and I welcome the chance for the House to hear formally, rather than through the press, the decision to trigger Article 50 by the end of March and the plans for the great repeal Bill—a decision which otherwise, of course, we heard about on television. We trust that this is just the first of a number of regular attendances at the Dispatch Box to brief the House on the approach being taken and on progress being made. The decisions that the Government take over the coming months and years, regarding how we exit the EU and our new relations with both the remaining EU and the rest of the world, carry huge implications for us and for future generations.

I am old enough to remember, 44 years ago this month, that it took 69 Labour MPs to defy a three-line whip to take the UK into the Common Market, contributing to the Government’s 112 majority. Without those 69—which included the noble Lords, Lord Maclennan, Lord Owen and Lord Rodgers, Lord Hattersley, Lady Williams and Lord Sheldon, and our late colleagues Lord Barnett, Lord Roper and others—Ted Heath would have been defeated. We know the implication of that vote for my party, but all of us also know it was a parliamentary vote: a key, much-discussed, vital, and, for some of those involved, very brave vote that took us into Europe.

How, therefore, can the Government now say that the trigger—the starting gun from which there is no going back—can be fired without a vote in Parliament? The Minister spoke of returning sovereignty to the UK, yet the Government want to exclude Parliament from this process, not simply on triggering Article 50 but also in debating the negotiating terms or the evolving agreements. That is not making Parliament sovereign; it is sidelining Parliament.

Will the Minister explain why the Government will not reconsider their decision to rule out a vote on the basic terms they propose before Article 50 is triggered? We understand the Government were caught short, having had no plans for Brexit in their 2015 manifesto—indeed, they were committed to,

“safeguard British interests in the Single Market”.

They then forbade Whitehall from making plans for a leave vote. But that is no excuse for not being ready by early next year to articulate their approach. If the Government proceed to an exit deal without a vote in Parliament, their specific plans will never have the approval of the public or of Parliament. We therefore ask the Minister: when do the Government propose that Parliament should vote on their negotiating objectives?

We nevertheless accept—for some of us, with much sadness—the outcome of the referendum, but that result does not give the Government a blank cheque to negotiate away vital protections for workers, consumers, the environment or, indeed, the interests of business. Throughout these coming years and the complicated negotiations, the national interest—not just the Conservatives’ interests—must come first. Aside from defence and national security, and our continuing membership of Europol, the economy and jobs are central to the national interest. Yet, it appears from the Prime Minister’s statement to the Conservative conference that Brexit means hard Brexit and that continued access to the single market is at risk, with huge risks for the economy, jobs, business and working people. Will the Minister assure the House that the Government will seek continued access to the single market on the best possible terms? Can he rule out a default position of falling back on to the WTO terms?

For my generation—perhaps for me in particular, having been born in a war-torn Germany in the late 1940s, growing up in a divided Europe, but then able to witness the blossoming of a free, open and prosperous Europe, built on free trade in a single market—the next two and a half years will be utterly demanding as we seek a new relationship with our continental allies. It is the defining issue of this Parliament and a major task for the House. Perhaps the Minister could tell us: when is the next parliamentary Session, when the great repeal Bill will arrive? Will he confirm that he will take the House with him every step of the way?

[Baroness Ludford (LD)]

My Lords, I also thank the Minister for repeating the Statement. I start, though, by querying the claim that the mandate of 23 June was “overwhelming”. Compared with the overwhelming mandate of the 1975 referendum, which was a 2:1 vote, this was a narrow majority, sending a rather unclear message that the Government are overinterpreting. While it may have been a narrow decision to leave on 23 June, it was not the decision to trigger Article 50, which first requires a great deal more knowledge of the destination.

The Government’s conduct of the Brexit process needs to meet at least four criteria. First, given the enhancement of parliamentary sovereignty and supremacy promised by the Secretary of State in his Statement of 5 September, the pledge in the Conservative manifesto of 2010 to reform the use of prerogative powers, and the claim in today’s Statement that the,

“whole approach is about empowering this place”,

I am surprised by the Prime Minister’s refusal of a parliamentary vote. The claim is that sovereignty is being returned to the institutions of the UK. That must mean Parliament, but it is not being done. I would like the Minister to explain why.

The Constitution Committee of this House said in its report last month:

“It would be constitutionally inappropriate, not to mention setting a disturbing precedent, for the Executive to act on an advisory referendum without explicit parliamentary approval—particularly one with such significant long-term consequences”.

I think that many in this House would agree with that. Indeed, Professor Mark Elliott, who is the legal adviser to that committee, has said in a blog that the Government’s “grounds of resistance” in the current litigation concede that permission is required from Parliament. They then say that permission was given by the referendum Act, which many of us would dispute, but they have conceded in that court case that Parliament’s permission is needed.

The second criterion, referred to by the noble Baroness, would be fulfilment of the 2015 Conservative manifesto pledge to stay in the single market. That is supported by the point stressed by the leave campaign that people voted in the 1975 referendum for the common market. Many people agreed with that, so, by implication, most people are happy to stay in the common market. Why are the Government not aiming to stay in the single market?

Thirdly, we need good governance. I perfectly agree that it is,

“now incumbent on the Government”,

as the Statement puts it, to deliver as orderly and smooth an exit as possible, providing maximum certainty for businesses and workers. Well, with business up in arms about the current uncertainty and the pound dropping like a stone, that is going well, isn’t it? The Government owe us all some certainty.

Fourthly, the Chancellor remarked that the British people did not vote to become poorer. That is on the cards, with import prices set to rise heavily in the new year, affecting everybody’s pocket and wallet.

Finally, the Government say that they want to move forward on a repeal Bill in parallel with the Brexit negotiations. Whatever the timing of such legislation, for which the implementation will fall due in 2019 at the earliest, it should not distract from the overwhelming need for this Parliament to be in the driving seat for the negotiations, and to not be a left-behind passenger.

Brexit: Single Market

Baroness Ludford Excerpts

Wednesday 14th September 2016 Lords Chamber

[Lord Bridges of Headley]

My Lords, all I have to add to the Statement that the Government set out in this House last week is that the next milestone in this process will be the triggering of Article 50, which will make our position clear. Clearly, we are looking at all the options open, which the noble Lord so eloquently outlined.

[Baroness Ludford (LD)]

My Lords, does the Minister accept that, essential as it is, membership of the single market short of EU membership, let alone mere access to it, entails a severe loss of sovereignty, especially if we leave the customs union—what my right honourable friend Nick Clegg called a potential tsunami of red tape? So were not the promises of taking back control and slashing bureaucracy if we left the EU a complete work of fiction?

[Lord Bridges of Headley]

The noble Baroness makes a number of points. We are assessing all these options. I am not in a position to comment further right now.

Exiting the European Union

Baroness Ludford Excerpts

Monday 5th September 2016 Lords Chamber

[Lord Collins of Highbury (Lab)]

My Lords, I thank the talented Minister for repeating that Statement. We have heard the mantra that “Brexit means Brexit”— simply leaving the EU—but the Prime Minister has suggested that she does not see the UK making an Article 50 application before the end of the year. Would the Minister explain in a little more detail—in these circumstances, he needs to—what he expects to happen between now and the end of the year with regard to that application?

The Secretary of State wrote in July:

“The negotiating strategy has to be properly designed, and there is some serious consultation to be done first”.

This is one reason for taking a little time before triggering Article 50. We have heard in the Statement about the numerous consultation meetings that have been taking place. I welcome those meetings, but the Government have to set out in starting proper consultation what are their objectives. Consultation is meaningless if you do not know what you are being consulted about.

It is also unacceptable that the Prime Minister has taken the undemocratic step of refusing to guarantee Parliament a vote on triggering Article 50. It is vital that Parliament is engaged in the process; we received assurances on this in the past. The specifics of the UK’s future relationship with the EU are not yet known, and such a constitutional change needs direct parliamentary involvement.

If Brexit is seriously about seizing opportunities and putting the national interest first, it means that the Government must have a view on what a successful outcome to negotiation looks like. If they do, when will they tell Parliament and the British people? We need to know.

The Statement refers to uncertainty, and of course we have seen uncertainty creating stress to our economy and particularly in our communities. I return to the subject of EU citizens currently living and working in the UK. They must not be used as a bargaining tool. There are first principles here that need to be addressed. I again ask the Minister to reassure those citizens that they will have the right to remain—to stay—after Brexit. It is not good enough simply to say, “If this happens, that will not happen”. It must be a matter of first principle.

Finally, many parts of the Statement talk about seizing this opportunity. Let me make clear that one thing that I hope will not be seized is the removal of the hard-won rights of workers and people in employment in this country. The protection of those rights will be one of the tests we will put on the successful outcome of the negotiations.

[Baroness Ludford (LD)]

My Lords, I, too, thank the Minister for repeating the Statement. We on these Benches are very glad to get this opportunity to try to get information from the Government. I fear, however, that we have not got much beyond the slogans of “Brexit means Brexit” and “We’ll make a success of Brexit”—those soundbites. We do not have much that is more concrete. Even if the machinery of government could not have been prepared for a leave result—which I doubt anyway—the apparent lack of political consensus at the top of the Conservative Party on the aims of a Brexit negotiation is disconcerting, to put it mildly. There is anxiety and puzzlement across the political spectrum. For instance, former Education Secretary Nicky Morgan in the Times today demanded a clear plan. On the constitutional side, there is great concern about the unity of our kingdom and the future of peace in Ireland.

The Statement says that there will be no hard border in Ireland, which would indeed be welcome—but how realistic this is depends on whether we are in the single market, whether there is free movement and whether we are in the customs union.

In the words of our EU Select Committee, it would be “inconceivable” that that negotiations on withdrawal and future relations should be conducted “without effective parliamentary oversight”. In the Statement, we are told that the Government want to put,

“the sovereignty and supremacy of this Parliament beyond doubt”.

But the only promise is that we will be,

“informed, updated and engaged”.

That is much less than accountability and real oversight. We on these Benches, like the Opposition, believe that accountability and oversight should be marked by a parliamentary vote on triggering Article 50. Liberal Democrats do not seek or support a second referendum in the term of art which means a rerun of 23 June—but the need for public endorsement of a Brexit deal is an entirely different matter. That is essential, because it will be the first time that voters get any chance to evaluate the reality, and not the fantasy, of Brexit. We on these Benches will hold the Government very carefully to account on how their Brexit actions meet the real interests of this country.

[Lord Bridges of Headley]

My Lords, I thank the noble Lord and the noble Baroness for their contributions. Between now and the end of the year we will continue to do what we have started to do: to collect, analyse and look at the evidence on the challenges we face with Brexit. That is the right process and I am very keen to ensure that all noble Lords are involved in it. I have written to the chairmen of the major committees of the House, offering to meet them, and obviously I am willing to give evidence to them. We will do that in a structured way and as openly as possible. As I said, I am very keen that we build a national consensus on this point. On workers’ rights, we wish to consult very closely with the Trades Union Congress—we have already begun this—and others on that precise point and I heed what the noble Lord said.

I know from what noble Lords have been saying from a sedentary position, as well as in the last few minutes, what the views are in some parts of this House on triggering Article 50. I will repeat what the Prime Minister said. The British public gave a very clear instruction on Brexit. We intend to see that through and not to backslide from it. However, we believe—although this matter has been challenged—that the decision to invoke Article 50 is a matter on the international plane and is governed by royal prerogative. As I have said, we will involve Parliament: we will abide by the conventions that already apply and, when it comes to looking at the European Communities Act, by the necessity of Parliament taking votes on that Act and elsewhere.

I am not able to say more than I have already said on reassuring EU citizens. I hear what the noble Lord said about the need to reassure them. As the Prime Minister has already said, we wish to ensure that the rights of EU citizens are protected, so long as the rights of UK citizens across the EU are also protected. We do not imagine that that will not be possible—but that will be a matter for the weeks and months ahead.

Finally, I am sure that noble Lords will have views on what kind of outcome we should look for in these negotiations. Again, as the Prime Minister has said, we are starting the process of looking at the position, analysing the data and coming to a view on what the outcome will be. We are not, therefore, looking at an off-the-shelf approach. This will be a British solution to the challenges that lie ahead.