Government PPE Contracts Debate
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Will Quince
Main Page: Will Quince (Conservative - Colchester)Department Debates - View all Will Quince's debates with the Department of Health and Social Care
(1 year, 11 months ago)
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The Minister of State, Department of Health and Social Care (Will Quince)
I am grateful for this opportunity to come to the House to talk about our vital national efforts on personal protective equipment. Colleagues must cast their minds back to where we were three years ago as we stood on the precipice of a global health emergency, the likes of which had not been seen for over a century. SARS-CoV-2 was not even called covid-19 at that point, and little was known about its impact and transmission. In a matter of a few short weeks, this novel coronavirus pushed global health systems and global PPE supply chains to near breaking point, yet here at home, from a standing start, we initiated work on one of the toughest logistical challenges ever undertaken in peacetime: the provision of PPE for frontline colleagues in health and social care.
Neale Hanvey
At the beginning of the pandemic in one of my first Prime Minister’s questions, I asked the then Prime Minister if he would ensure that profiteering would have no place in this Government’s response to the covid pandemic. Now, when we fast-forward to all these years later, that seems to have been at the very heart of it. The British people were told that this Government were helping them. British industry was told that it was going to be supported. I have persisted in my questions about how the domestic diagnostic industry has been promised work by this Government, yet it is being charged for doing the right thing. Will the Minister apologise—
Will Quince
I will come on to many of the points the hon. Gentleman has raised, but I will just say this about UK supply chains. At the beginning of the pandemic, only 1% of PPE used in the UK was produced here. At present, three quarters of the FFP-3 masks provided to the NHS and social care are now manufactured in the United Kingdom and contracts were signed with around 30 UK-based companies to manufacture around 3.9 billion items of PPE.
Colleagues will recall those early days, with planes being turned around on the tarmac, countries imposing export bans, huge inflation in global prices and the price of crucial items such as glass increasing sixfold. These were the conditions under which tough decisions were taken, and these were the decisions under which PPE was procured. These were the conditions under which we stepped up to protect our most vulnerable and to save lives.
Karl Turner (Kingston upon Hull East) (Lab)
How can the Minister possibly square the fact that Arco, a leading clinical PPE supplier to the NHS since its inception —the company has existed in Hull for more than 100 years—did not get a sniff of a contract from the Department of Health and Social Care because it was nowhere near a VIP lane? He should be saying sorry from the Dispatch Box, not all this nonsense. Just ‘fess up and say sorry.
Will Quince
There were lots of words there, and lots of aggression. [Interruption.] Let us be frank, there was.
I will address many of those points. I fear the hon. Gentleman forgets the pressure under which civil servants were working at the time and the pace at which decisions had to be taken. [Interruption.] If he would like to write to me with those exact conditions—
Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Rosie Winterton)
Order. The hon. Gentleman must allow the Minister to answer. It is not fair to shout back as soon as he starts answering.
Will Quince
The hon. Member for Kingston upon Hull East (Karl Turner) will know that civil servants had to take decisions about speed, pace and quantity. They were looking at contracts that would get the most amount of PPE for the best value for money as quickly as possible.
Simon Hoare (North Dorset) (Con)
Was everything that was done, done perfectly? No, and no doubt all the lessons will be learned but, as the Minister says, we would all be well advised to remember, because it was a long time ago now, the absolute panic and fear. The whole world was trying to buy any of this stuff they could get hold of at any price. If we neglect to remember the doctors, nurses and care home operators in our constituencies who were knocking on our doors asking for emergency help, we cannot have a proper debate about this issue.
Will Quince
My hon. Friend is absolutely right. Under those circumstances, in those conditions, we had to be quick and decisive to protect colleagues on the frontline so that they could continue providing life-saving care. With lives on the line, of course we had to change our approach to procurement and adjust our appetite for risk. I do not believe the British people would have forgiven us if we had stuck to the same old processes. We had to balance the risk of contracts not performing and supplies being sold at a premium against the real risk of harm to the health of frontline workers, the NHS and the public if we failed.
Dr Mullan
Does my hon. Friend agree that the Opposition want to have it both ways? They criticise us for our procurement decisions but, as I said earlier, they recommended a football agent to supply ventilators, and the Labour Welsh Government procured PPE from the same Serco company that they criticise us for procuring PPE from,
Will Quince
I am keen not to get into a political slanging match on this point, but my hon. Friend is right that all Members on both sides of the House were receiving multiple emails from people who, as my hon. Friend the Member for North Dorset (Simon Hoare) said, were panicking because they wanted to ensure that we procured PPE as quickly as possible.
Colleagues across Government and beyond worked day and night, taking tough decisions, to keep our country safe. Those efforts secured billions of items.
Several hon. Members rose—
Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Rosie Winterton)
Order. The Minister has indicated that he will give way shortly. Let him make a bit of progress.
Will Quince
I have given way equally to both sides so far in this debate. I have some reluctance to give way to Members who tell others to sit down while they are speaking or making interventions.
Will Quince
I said I will, and I will.
The efforts of civil servants secured billions of items and, by June 2020, we had obtained 30,000 ventilators and delivered more than 17.5 billion items of PPE to protect frontline workers. What does this mean in practice? It means that we were able to keep our NHS open throughout the pandemic; emergency operations went ahead; and once some of the toughest restrictions were eased, relatives could visit their loved ones in and around care homes.
Dawn Butler
I want to take the Minister back to where he mentioned civil servants. According to the Government’s own records, civil servants were begging Ministers not to give contracts to some of these companies because they had red flags and they were overcharging the Government—we are talking about almost double the price they agreed to be paid. This was an extra cost of £50 million to taxpayers. Civil servants were begging the Government not to act in the corrupt manner that they did.
Will Quince
I am pleased that the hon. Lady made that intervention, because it is the first I have heard of such an accusation being made. If she has evidence of such, I suggest that she presents it.
It might be helpful if I just talk through the process. Thousands of companies made offers; around 430 were prioritised through the high-priority lane; only 12% of those resulted in a contract; and due diligence was carried out on all companies by civil servants. Financial accountability sat with a senior civil servant, and Ministers—this is important—were not involved in the decision-making process. A team of more than 400 civil servants processed referrals and undertook due diligence tests.
On that basis, we will make no apology for procuring PPE at the pace and volume we did. Now that the global market for PPE has stabilised, it is easy for some people to point to the value of goods that are inevitably now sold at a much lower price than we paid, but that is a cheap shot, and one that entirely misses the point. We adjusted down the value of our PPE holding as market prices have changed—that is just standard accounting practice—and even then, we are still putting large quantities of it to use. Our successes should be judged on the conditions we faced at the height of the pandemic, not with the convenient benefit of hindsight.
Let me come to civil servants. If I may, I will give the right hon. Member for Ashton-under-Lyne (Angela Rayner) the benefit of my fast-approaching four years’ experience as a Minister. We rely on hard-working civil servants; they are the backbone of our state and it is my privilege to work with them. She knows that Ministers were not involved in the decision-making process for PPE procurement, and the due diligence, as I have said, was undertaken by a team of more than 400 civil servants. Although I am a Health Minister now, I was not at the time; I was a Minister at the Department for Work and Pensions. I recall how hard civil servants worked, under the most trying conditions, during the pandemic.
Will Quince
I promise I will come to the hon. Lady.
Those 400 civil servants working on PPE and a senior accounting officer took decisions at pace and under huge pressure, as lives depended on them. Did they get everything right? No, they did not. But they did try their best in a highly competitive global market, with significant challenges in sourcing, procuring and distributing PPE. [Interruption.] Yes, they absolutely did. I gently say to the right hon. Member for Ashton-under-Lyne that her implied criticism of their professionalism, integrity and independence at a time of crisis, with the convenience and luxury now of hindsight, is deeply regrettable.
Angela Rayner
The Minister is being disingenuous to say that. I have never suggested for one moment that civil servants do not do an excellent job and work diligently. But why will he not publish the documents and emails about what Ministers, Tory peers and Tory MPs have been up to during the pandemic and these contracts?
Will Quince
I will come to that. As I said, due diligence was carried out on all companies. Procurement decisions were taken by civil servants. Financial accountability sat with a senior civil servant. I thank and applaud our hard-working civil servants, and I humbly suggest that someone aspiring to be our Deputy Prime Minister should do the same and not seek to throw them under the metaphorical bus.
Dame Meg Hillier
Very early on, the Public Accounts Committee and the National Audit Office were looking into the issue. We know that it was a rush at the beginning, but we were warning about the problems early on, and still they persisted. There was poor record keeping—frankly, it was a lack of record keeping in many cases. This House gave the Government permission to act fast, but not to act fast and loose, and the Minister just needs to acknowledge that.
Will Quince
I thank the hon. Lady for her intervention, and I will come on to some of the action that we will take. She rightly mentions accountability. Details of the high-priority lane were published on 17 November 2021 and updated in February 2022. This is an important point, because the right hon. Lady, the deputy Leader of the Opposition, suggests that there is some kind of cover-up. If there is, Madam Deputy Speaker, listen to this, because this is some kind of cover up! As I have said, high-priority lane details were published on 17 November and updated in February this year. The National Audit Office has written three reports specifically about PPE. The Public Accounts Committee has held a number of evidence sessions. The Boardman review of procurement has taken place and we are implementing its findings in full. The independent public inquiry into the Government’s handling of the pandemic is ongoing. Of course there are lessons that we have to learn, and that we can and should learn, but there is clear accountability in this process.
As I have mentioned civil servants, I want to put on the record my thanks to the 400 civil servants who worked tirelessly to source deals from around the globe, buying PPE to the highest standards and quality and, yes, for the best value at the time. It was not only them; it was a true team effort—one that was made possible through some incredible collaborations, including everyone from industry to the NHS, and from social care providers to our armed forces. They all played their part and they played it well.
Turning now to unsuitable PPE or potential fraud, it is a simple truth that 97% of all PPE that we ordered was suitable and fit for use, with only a small proportion of the billions of items procured deemed unsuitable. Where that has been the case, we are actively seeking to recover costs from suppliers and we are working to maximise the value from our stockpiles, including using PPE in other settings outside of our NHS. Equally, in those rare instances where there have been allegations of fraud, my Department’s anti-fraud unit has worked quickly to investigate and move to recover costs.
With respect to some of the specific points raised in today’s motion, of the thousands of companies that made offers, around 430, as I have said, were processed through the high-priority lane, and only 12% of them resulted in a contract award. The right hon. Member for Ashton-under-Lyne knows that all contracts went through the same due diligence process regardless of the source of the offer. She also knows that the NAO has written three reports about PPE, and the Public Accounts Committee has held a number of hearings. I know that she would like me to go into the detail of individual contracts, but she knows—she even alluded to it—that my Department is engaged in commercially sensitive mediation with the relevant companies with a view to resolving the issue without recourse to formal legal action.
Responding specifically to the terms of the motion, the Government are committed to releasing information when all investigations are concluded. Our response will necessarily take into account the wider public interest and the commercially sensitive nature of the material. It is only right that we work with the Public Accounts Committee on the terms on which information might be shared. I understand that the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster will soon begin a dialogue with the Chair of the PAC on how we enact those information-sharing arrangements.
Dame Meg Hillier
I thank the Minister for giving way again. I reassure him and the House that the Public Accounts Committee is responsible, not reckless. We have previously received papers from this House and we have a well-established protocol for receiving and dealing with such papers. The Committee is trusted—we never leak. If we decide to publish, that is a choice that we would make, but it is a responsible decision that we would take.
Will Quince
I thank the hon. Lady for that response, and I know the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster will soon begin that dialogue with her.
Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)
Order. The hon. Lady should not be on her feet when the Minister is answering an intervention from another Member. She is simply getting in the way of the dialogue, and that is not the polite way to do it. If her intervention is to be taken, it will be taken in due course. Standing up for a long time while there is another dialogue going on is really not very polite.
Will Quince
I have given way to the hon. Lady once already, as I promised I would, and I have been generous with my time, so I will not give way again.
Will Quince
I also gave way to the hon. Gentleman, so let us leave it.
We should be proud of the remarkable progress we have made on PPE. We are now confident that we have enough stock to cover all future demands arising from covid-19. The right hon. Member for Ashton-under-Lyne mentioned some figures in relation to storage costs, and I am pleased to say that those are now significantly reduced—I will write to her about the cost of storing that PPE here in the UK.
Moreover, we have strengthened our country’s PPE supply chain for the long term, including manufacturing more PPE here in the UK. Before the pandemic, as I said at the beginning of my speech, just 1% of our PPE was produced here. Now the Government have awarded contracts to around 30 manufacturers for the supply of almost 4 billion items of PPE.
We have learned many lessons from this pandemic, and when it comes to PPE we are on a stronger footing today than ever before, but the successes of our enormous national effort at a time of unprecedented national crisis deserve to be recognised. People from all walks of life came together to protect people in the NHS and social care, and in doing so they saved lives. Even as we continue to learn and to build a system fit for the future, this Government will remain enormously proud of everything that was achieved.
Brendan O’Hara
One would have hoped that people in glass houses, having thrown the first stone, would have realised that it was not the best idea.
Let me put on record that the NHS in Scotland used emergency procurement provisions to award PPE contracts without competition during the first wave of covid-19 but, crucially, the auditors are completely satisfied with the procurement arrangements in place and said that there was
“No evidence of preferential treatment or bias”
in the awarding of contracts in Scotland. I believe that that is the significant reason why our overall costs of pandemic procurement were less than a third of the UK’s, and it perhaps explains why the Government are now paying £770,000 every single day to store PPE in China. The Minister will be aware that I have tabled a series of questions today to ask how much of that PPE is still usable, how much of it meets the standards required for the UK, what quality control methods were used in securing it and the proportion of PPE that did not meet the standard required.
Brendan O’Hara
I will give way if the Minister can tell us the exact proportion of PPE produced that did not meet the standard in the UK.
Will Quince
I will quickly update the House. As of October, we hold 13.1 billion items of PPE and we have disposed of 145,000 pallets of excess stock so far. The majority is stored in UK sites; about 120 million items are still stored in China. The total cost of storage is now below £400,000 a day, so significantly less than the hon. Gentleman says, and the total cost for storage in China is £35,000 a day.
Brendan O’Hara
I genuinely thank the Minister for that information and I look forward to reading it in Hansard so I can digest it. If I heard correctly, we are now on half a million pounds a day for storing PPE.
In conclusion, having to do things differently does not give anyone, whether they are a private individual, an elected politician or an unelected politician, a licence to rip up the rulebook and behave as if we live in an unregulated wild west of public procurement. That is why it is vital that these papers are released. The public have a right to know why, while doctors, nurses and other medical staff battled unvaccinated through the worst of the pandemic, and as the public stood and cheered them in grateful thanks, some people with connections to this Government saw only the opportunity to make themselves a quick buck. I predict that this PPE Medpro scandal is the tip of a very large iceberg—an iceberg that will eventually sink this ship of fools.