Oral Answers to Questions

Tony Lloyd Excerpts

Tuesday 22nd March 2022 Commons Chamber

[Dominic Raab]

I thank the hon. Gentleman, who makes a really important point. Of course, I must at this point say that it will be for the ICC, which operates independently, to determine the temporal scope of its jurisdiction.

[Tony Lloyd (Rochdale) (Lab)]

The Justice Secretary made a very important point earlier when he said that this is about not just those in Moscow, but the commanders on the ground, although in fact it is even about individual soldiers. What can we do as a nation to help the ICC get the message across that those in the field could find themselves before the Court?

[Dominic Raab]

I thank the hon. Gentleman, and I think he is right. Of course, one of the things Putin has done is to clamp down on all independent sources of media, but that is of course something that we are looking at trying to support so that Russians get the facts on the ground. He is also right to say that the conscripts, as well as the commanders, are at risk here. Many of those young Russian conscripts, who were told they were going in as peacekeepers, will have points at which they are not sure whether to follow essentially illegal orders either for their own welfare or for the good of Ukraine itself.

Strategic Lawsuits Against Public Participation

Tony Lloyd Excerpts

Thursday 17th March 2022 Commons Chamber

[Dominic Raab]

As ever, my hon. Friend absolutely nails the point. These reforms are targeted at a specific problem, which is recent and burgeoning, and we do not want to conflate that because it might hit other areas and do ancillary or incidental harm and because that is a displacement of our effort and our energies.

My hon. Friend asked more generally about what we are doing around the world. When I was Foreign Secretary, we ramped up the Media Freedom Coalition, which, in my time, we chaired with the Canadians. I am not sure whether it is them or us who currently hold the chairmanship—I think it is the Canadians. We expanded that coalition. The idea was to help with the legislation that countries have to protect free speech and to ensure that, when journalists come under attack, they get legal support. We raised quite a lot of money and we keep working on it. I know that the current Foreign Secretary is enthusiastic and energetic about it.

[Tony Lloyd (Rochdale) (Lab)]

I, too, welcome the Justice Secretary’s statement. He has well specified the problem and the need for urgency, so I urge maximum speed, although he is right to be cautious about getting the legislation right. There should be a presumption that the public interest test is right. That test is not synonymous with the British state; I hope he would agree with that. Nor is it necessarily, in this complicated world, synonymous only with the UK national interest. Will he ensure that the test takes the widest possible view about what is good for this complicated world, because that matters against the oligarchs?

[Dominic Raab]

The hon. Gentleman is absolutely right and makes one of the most important points. If he looks at the call for evidence and the menu of options that we set out, we look at the threshold for bringing SLAPPs and whether there ought to be a new right of public participation. We look at the various defences in defamation law to see whether they are sufficient to deal with this problem. That includes the public defence and the serious harm test of a defamatory statement. We are trying to look at it from every angle. I should add for completeness that we will look at whether we are getting the right balance in terms of being an attractive destination for litigants to want to solve disputes, which is a great USP for the country, and whether we have allowed and given succour to libel tourism in this particularly pernicious area. We will look at all those things and I look forward to his further thoughts in those areas.

Ukraine

Tony Lloyd Excerpts

Thursday 24th February 2022 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

Yes, and what is so encouraging is that the whole House understands the vital importance of that article 5 guarantee that we make to every one of the 30 members of NATO.

[Tony Lloyd (Rochdale) (Lab)]

The Prime Minister quite rightly pitches this as a battle between the party of war and those who support international law. There is only one lawful Government in Ukraine—the Government of President Zelensky. If they are forced to move or possibly forced into exile in the short run or the longer run, will the Prime Minister state clearly that we will ensure they can be a functional and effective Government, wherever they operate from?

[The Prime Minister]

The hon. Gentleman raises an important point. That is why in our discussions with President Zelensky we are seeing what we can do to give them the practical support they need to continue.

Ukraine

Tony Lloyd Excerpts

Tuesday 22nd February 2022 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

My right hon. Friend has recently written and spoken powerfully about the subject and he is completely right that we will have to dig in for the long term to support Ukraine in every way that we can: economically, diplomatically, by the provision of military support in the way that we are already. It will take time, but to return to the point I made in my statement: it is vital that President Putin should fail. I believe that he will fail because the giant facts are against him. He is taking on Ukrainian national feeling and in the end he will not succeed. We will help the Ukrainians to succeed.

[Tony Lloyd (Rochdale) (Lab)]

The Prime Minister will know that part of the calculation of the Kremlin and President Putin is that the west will lose interest, as unfortunately we have in the past. Can he make it one of his key tasks to ensure that our allies are there for the long run? We have to be there until this is brought to a proper conclusion.

[The Prime Minister]

The hon. Member is completely right. The biggest threat is apathy and indifference. That is why what my right hon. Friend the Member for Maidenhead (Mrs May) said was so important. This is about not just Ukraine but democracy and the security of many other European countries—indeed, countries around the world. That is what is at stake here today.

Covid-19 Update

Tony Lloyd Excerpts

Wednesday 5th January 2022 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

My hon. Friend makes an incredibly powerful point, which I think should be heard in all parts of the House. As for those calling for restrictions—as the hon. Member for Ilford North, who I think speaks on health matters, did repeatedly before Christmas—lockdowns have an effect on people, and particularly on mental health.

[Tony Lloyd (Rochdale) (Lab)]

Will the Prime Minister make it very clear to some of his Back Benchers that a strategy for living with covid cannot include every hospital in Greater Manchester being unable to deliver elective surgery? Other hon. Members have raised that point. Will he make it clear that the strategy will include resources being put in to make sure that we catch up in Greater Manchester for people such as one of my close friends, who needs a hip replacement because she is in such pain?

[The Prime Minister]

Yes, and that is why we have the NHS and social care fund. That is why we are putting that measure through. How unbelievable that you guys did not vote for it—not you, Mr Speaker.

Oral Answers to Questions

Tony Lloyd Excerpts

Wednesday 5th January 2022 Commons Chamber

The Secretary of State was asked—

[Tony Lloyd (Rochdale) (Lab)]

1. What plans the Government have to provide funding for rail infrastructure in Wales.

[Geraint Davies (Swansea West) (Lab/Co-op)]

9. What plans the Government have to provide funding for rail infrastructure in Wales.

[The Secretary of State for Wales (Simon Hart)]

May I wish you, Mr Speaker, and of course House staff and Members a very happy 2022? May I also take the opportunity to acknowledge some fantastic news for Welsh sheep farmers? As many in this House will be aware, the US ban on the import of UK lamb has been lifted as of 3 January, which brings Welsh farmers one step closer to putting their first-class lamb in front of more than 300 million US consumers for the first time in 20 years.

More than £340 million has been provided for enhancements to Welsh rail, including investing in the core valley lines, Cardiff Central station and the electrification of the Severn tunnel.

[Tony Lloyd]

Happy new year to you, Mr Speaker, and to all those involved with the House.

You will know, Mr Speaker, that the north Wales economy is massively integrated with the economy of the north-west. We have been promised, although it is very slow in coming, the northern powerhouse, because of the very poor infrastructure and very poor journey times across the north of England. Why have Welsh Ministers not demanded that north Wales be included in that northern powerhouse structure, and why are Welsh Ministers letting down north Wales so badly?

[Simon Hart]

I disagree with the hon. Member’s comments about infrastructure. As he knows, we introduced the Union connectivity review; its proposals have just been published and we are working through them as we speak. We have spent a huge amount of money on road and rail infrastructure throughout Wales—and, for that matter, the rest of the Union—so he should not take such a gloomy view of things. I absolutely endorse his comments, however, about the fact that north Wales and the north-west of England—and, indeed, the rest of the UK—are integrated economies, and we need to look at them holistically.

Human Rights Legislation

Tony Lloyd Excerpts

Tuesday 14th December 2021 Commons Chamber

[Dominic Raab]

Of course we live up to our international obligations, and it is precisely partly the aim of these reforms to protect the bespoke, tailored approach to primary legislation when it comes to protecting the most vulnerable in our society, including through the Children Act.

[Tony Lloyd (Rochdale) (Lab)]

How will the Secretary of State convince me that his biggest supporters in this will not be President Erdoğan of Turkey and President Putin in Russia? Can he also tell me this: if the Government move ahead with his proposal to give an amnesty to those who committed murder during the troubles in Northern Ireland—and they do have that intention—and given that he says he supports the article 13 of the European convention, on the right to an effective remedy, how will the families of those murdered get justice if there is not proper access to the Strasbourg Court?

[Dominic Raab]

We are very confident that the proposals that we have put forward, given the passage of time, are ECHR-compliant. The hon. Gentleman talks about being friends with dictatorial countries. Frankly, this reform will be about restoring some common sense and some credibility to human rights in this country. He asks whose side we are on. We are on the side of the British public, and he should get on board.

G20 and COP26 World Leaders Summit

Tony Lloyd Excerpts

Wednesday 3rd November 2021 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

On livestock emissions, my hon. Friend is right that methane is a very powerful greenhouse gas. It degrades quite fast, so it is not as bad as CO₂ in some ways, but we do need to cut methane emissions and we have committed to doing it by 30%. Agriculture is a particularly difficult problem, but there are ways of doing that, without moving away from livestock farming. There are things we can do with breeding and other techniques to reduce methane emissions and we are certainly looking at that.

[Tony Lloyd (Rochdale) (Lab)]

The Prime Minister is right to tell the House, and indeed the world, how exciting these promises on reforestation and methane reduction are. However, he will recall that, 12 years ago, when the rich countries committed themselves to transferring $100 billion to the poor countries every year, there was no mechanism for measuring the progress of that transfer, and the world failed. Can the Prime Minister tell us what the legacy will be, particularly in respect of deforestation? Will there be a proper mechanism to hold to account President Bolsonaro, or the Indonesians, or any other country, wherever it may be?

[The Prime Minister]

The hon. Gentleman has made an incredibly important point. There are two ways of holding Governments to account, whether they are the Governments of China, Brazil or Russia, or indeed ourselves. First, it is not only the Governments who have signed up, but corporations—the big commodities corporations, such as Cargill. They have agreed no longer to use products that are sourced as a result of deforestation, and consumers will hold them to account, as well as Governments, for what they do.

Secondly, the financial institutions, worth trillions—Barclays, Aviva, and many others around the world—have agreed that they will not finance projects that depend on deforestation. Again, their investors and shareholders, and everyone involved with them, will hold them to account for what they do. If they cheat and invest in deforestation, they will suffer, because, as I said to the House earlier, what is changing now is the power of the consumer, the power of the voters, the power of the world —the power of those who want their Governments to do the right thing now.

AUKUS

Tony Lloyd Excerpts

Thursday 16th September 2021 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

Yes. I wish to repeat that this makes visible and incarnates the Indo-Pacific tilt that we have been talking about. It is an incredibly important development for our relations in the Indo-Pacific. However, it in no way detracts from our commitment to the north Atlantic area, to the European theatre and to our overall security.

[Tony Lloyd (Rochdale) (Lab)]

Obviously we have an interest in maintaining a peaceful region in the Indo-Pacific, so I welcome this, but will the Prime Minister make something clear? He has described the agreement as being essentially about technological transfer, not about a major commitment of military assets. Can he guarantee that that is where we are going, and that no overstretch will be involved as a result of this agreement?

[The Prime Minister]

Yes, of course, although I remind the House that the carrier strike group is out there expressing British influence—hard power and soft power—8,000 miles away, which is something that very few other countries can do.

Afghanistan

Tony Lloyd Excerpts

Monday 6th September 2021 Commons Chamber

[Tony Lloyd (Rochdale) (Lab)]

The Prime Minister will know that after the calamitous collapse of the Government in Kabul and the disorderly retreat by western powers, there was rejoicing in parts of Mozambique, across the Sahel and, of course, in Somalia. Those are countries in which we have an interest because, if nothing else, they can be a source of terrorism here. What messages is he prepared to give about the UK working with partners to guarantee a proper, measured response that ensures we are not at risk of terrorism?

[The Prime Minister]

The hon. Gentleman is focusing on exactly the right question and the right response from the western world and, indeed, the global community. We need to work together to ensure that, as far as we possibly can, we condition the new Government and new authorities in Kabul to understand that Afghanistan cannot slide back into being a cesspit of terror. That is our effort today.