Child Support Collection (Domestic Abuse) Bill

Rachel Maclean Excerpts

Committee stage
Wednesday 14th December 2022 Public Bill Committees

[Jess Phillips (Birmingham, Yardley) (Lab)]

It is a pleasure to serve under your chairship, Ms McVey—especially as I seem to recall that when I was first in this place, you were in charge of this particular Department.

I rise in total support of the Bill, which seeks to address something that has long been a problem. The Labour party would never stand in the way of any such progress.

I want to push on some areas of the Bill that the Government may need to look at as it goes through the House, to ensure that it is what it should be. As the right hon. Member for Aldridge-Brownhills mentioned, domestic abuse victims using the collect and pay system, which is the better system for them, would currently have to pay 4% of any take. Through no fault of their own, these women are often destitute, and they would be being charged 4%. Will the Minister also tell us about the training that CMS officials will have? It is my understanding that it is in-house training, not provided by specialists, and concerns have been raised about the standards of domestic abuse training.

I want to make special mention of a woman called Emma Day. Emma Day was murdered by her partner, and I work with her family regularly. Her domestic homicide review stated:

“The current response of the CMS to domestic abuse could potentially heighten the risk to victims when making a child maintenance application.”

Emma was murdered by her ex-partner in May 2017. He had warned her not to pursue him for child support, threatening her life. Emma told the CMS staff this, but they reinstated a claim for Mr Morris to pay. He killed her shortly afterwards. The coroner’s inquest said:

“A public body has an obligation to minimize risk when there is evidence of a threat to life.”

Although the Bill is a step forward, it should be the first step in a long line. Frankly, anybody in this room who has done constituency casework will know how woeful the Child Maintenance Service is. There is also a problem of enforcement. Enforcement is used by the Department for Work and Pensions incredibly effectively in other areas, but not so much in this area, where very little is done when people do not pay, leaving women destitute, more vulnerable and more likely to end up in further danger and peril.

This is a brilliant Bill, and I commend the hon. Member for Hastings and Rye on it and support it completely. Could the Minister tell us when the review promised by the Government of the CMS response in the case of Emma Day will be with us? It was completed in May. We have had no response, and Emma’s family were told in October that it would be coming forward. On this day, as we are talking about domestic abuse and the Child Maintenance Service, I wonder if she could answer that question.

[Rachel Maclean (Redditch) (Con)]

It is a pleasure to follow the hon. Member for Birmingham, Yardley, and I give my strong support to my hon. Friend the Member for Hastings and Rye, who has done a fantastic job of progressing this really important piece of legislation. I will not detain the Committee long, but I want to reference the work she is doing, which sits in the wider context of all the work the Government are doing to tackle the horrendous, insidious, dangerous and life-threatening issue of domestic abuse.

What we are doing here is really important, because it shines a light on the economic abuse and coercive control aspects of domestic abuse, which we now understand, thanks to this Government passing the Domestic Abuse Act 2021 and implementing all the measures that flow from that, including the offence of coercive and controlling behaviour. We understand that domestic abuse can be about manipulating finances and manipulating access to children. Children are often at the frontline of the awful tension and dynamic between the partners, and are often used as a weapon by an abusive or manipulative man against a woman. As the hon. Member for Birmingham, Yardley rightly said, it can often become a threatening and escalating pattern of violence and abuse, which unfortunately all too often ends in a woman being killed.

The Bill is a really important piece of the jigsaw. We must keep pushing across the whole of Government to implement the series of measures highlighted in the domestic abuse plan. My hon. Friend the Minister and I have worked closely together, because of the vital links between the DWP, the Home Office and other Government Departments; this is not an issue that any Government Department can tackle on its own. I commend the Minister and her Department for all the work that they have done, including the vital responses in Jobcentre Plus, the training that the Minister has brought in, and initiatives such as the black dot. All that work adds to the frontline support for victims of abuse, alongside things such as the Ask for ANI—Action Needed Immediately—service, and the other vital helplines that the Government have provided.

I thank the organisation Surviving Economic Abuse, which has done some fantastic work, supported by the Government, and has provided vital advice. It has really raised the game in highlighting what economic abuse looks like and where people can go to get help. My right hon. Friend the Member for Aldridge-Brownhills rightly highlighted the issue of deductions from payments. These people really need those payments, especially in a cost of living crisis. Surviving Economic Abuse, in its report “The Cost of Covid-19”, highlighted that 84% of women were worried about access to child maintenance payments

“as a result of the perpetrator’s actions”.

Often the fear of being unable to support their children if they leave can be a reason why women choose to stay in an abusive relationship. Sorting that out will be tremendously helpful. We found that during covid sometimes people stopped making payments, adding to the already unbearable pressure.

I look forward to hearing from the Minister how she will continue all the work she is already doing to ensure that frontline staff understand the issues. We talk about domestic abuse needing to be evidenced by the victim. We must remember that these are traumatised women, who are already facing an incredibly difficult situation. We need to make the process as light-touch, trauma-informed and compassionate as possible, so that when they come and explain their situation, they will be received sympathetically and measures can be put in place swiftly. I would be keen to hear what the evidence gathering process will look like, to ensure that the DWP is working with the specialist organisations that are doing so much on this front.

I wish the Bill well. I again thank my hon. Friend the Member for Hastings and Rye, and I look forward to hearing from the Minister.

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Work and Pensions (Mims Davies)]

It is a great pleasure, as ever, to serve under your chairmanship, Ms McVey. I thank all hon. Members who have joined us this morning, in particular my hon. Friend the Member for Hastings and Rye, who has made a brilliant contribution in introducing the Bill, and covered it in great detail. I thank the Minister for Disabled People, Health and Work, my hon. Friend the Member for Corby (Tom Pursglove), for his excellent speech and engagement on Second Reading, and all Members who have contributed to, and helped to shape, the process. I also thank the charities that campaign on this important issue, particularly Gingerbread and, as we have heard, Surviving Economic Abuse.

Hon. Members have highlighted just how important the Bill is to better support those who have suffered domestic abuse. I will cover some of the Bill’s content and underline the points made by my hon. Friend the Member for Hastings and Rye, and by other colleagues. I will pick up on the points made by the hon. Member for Birmingham, Yardley and my right hon. Friend the Member for Aldridge-Brownhills regarding cost, and I will talk about the training of our CMS officials. I will also of course pick up on the Emma Day case. I thank my hon. Friend the Member for Redditch for the points she made and for her work in the area, in particular in highlighting coercive control and the need for women in that position to be able to move forward, which has to be with financial support.

This weekend marks two years since the DWP and our partners launched the employers domestic abuse covenant, which is about supporting women in such situations with employment or to stay in employment. I am wearing my J9 badge; the Ask for ANI campaign and the J9 work are incredibly important in our jobcentres. I remind anyone listening to or reading the debate that our jobcentres are a safe place to disclose, and to get support and help.

--- Later in debate ---

[Mims Davies]

I am telling the Committee the steps we have taken to secure better training for the people on our phones, but I appreciate the hon. Lady’s point and that her for it. A complex needs toolkit has been developed for caseworkers that includes clear steps to follow to support customers who are experiencing abuse. The toolkit is regularly reviewed and strengthened on the basis of customer insight to ensure that we evaluate the effectiveness of the guidance and training on domestic abuse. This is a complex area that I cannot cover fully in Committee, but I am happy to take the hon. Lady’s points, including on Women’s Aid, to the service as a challenge. I hope that comforts her.

[Rachel Maclean]

Does the Minister recognise that it is vital that frontline services, such as Jobcentre Plus and the DWP, pay attention to and access the statutory guidance that the Government have already published? That is guidance to which they must have reference, and it covers issues such as that mentioned by the hon. Member for Birmingham, Yardley—namely, when it is appropriate to phone the police. The police are a vital partner in the fight against domestic abuse; they are trained to deal with it. It is vital that all authorities work together. That guidance is there, so will the Minister ensure that her frontline staff read it and refer to it?

[Mims Davies]

My hon. Friend speaks with real knowledge and experience, and I shall take all those points to my officials. She spoke about a joined-up approach in Government, which is key. We know that the financial challenge—both to people leaving domestic abuse, and to those who wish to continue to exert control and power—is one of the potential touchpoints. I take my hon. Friend’s point, and we will take on that challenge.

Let me make some progress. I want to say something in support of the Child Maintenance Service, which has some great, hard-working people, who are very committed to their roles. They focus on doing the right thing to support children and do what is needed to get support to them. The impact of domestic abuse on how the service works for people was discussed on Second Reading, and it is no surprise that it has been raised today. The CMS is fully committed to ensuring that all parents feel positive and safe when using the service. Whatever parents’ circumstances, the CMS has procedures in place to ensure that cases are handled appropriately. The application fee is waived for survivors of domestic abuse, and, as I have said, CMS caseworkers will signpost people to suitable domestic abuse support organisations where necessary.

As I mentioned, domestic abuse training has been developed with input from Women’s Aid, but I take the challenge from the hon. Member for Birmingham, Yardley as to whether that is enough. She speaks with passion and conviction on the issue, and I am happy to ensure that we match that in our response. Our caseworkers are involved in difficult and complex cases—as MPs, we know that what people bring to us is not always exactly what is going on—so we have to ensure that caseworkers are well equipped to support parents in vulnerable situations.

Domestic abuse can take various forms, and that is exactly what our caseworkers look for. They signpost, call in authorities where appropriate and follow the guidance, including the complex needs toolkit. I reiterate that the toolkit has clear steps to follow to support customers experiencing abuse. It is regularly reviewed and strengthened on the basis of customer insight and input from organisations. I take the challenge from the hon. Member for Birmingham, Yardley, and will ensure that the toolkit is fully rounded.

Members raised several issues on Second Reading, including an incredibly important issue about the banking system in relation to the CMS, which I want to address. The CMS can act as an intermediary to facilitate the exchange of bank details, to ensure there is no unwanted contact between parents and no personal information is shared. CMS caseworkers also provide advice on how to set up bank accounts with a centralised sort code, so that parents cannot be traced. However, I acknowledge that, despite having those measures in place, the banking system can sometimes be used to continue to perpetrate abuse. I assure Committee members that the CMS is doing everything in its remit to look at this matter, but this is one of the reasons why the Bill is so important, as parents will be able to fully avoid transacting with each other in these situations.