Retained EU Law (Revocation and Reform) Bill

Debate between Nigel Evans and Alyn Smith

Consideration of Lords message
Monday 12th June 2023 Commons Chamber

[Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans)]

Congratulations on your latest recognition, Sir Bill.

The debate finishes at 4.39 pm, and Members can see how much interest there is. Alyn Smith is next, and I have to put the question at 4.39 pm, irrespective. All I would ask now is for some time discipline, in order to get as many views in as we possibly can. I call Alyn Smith.

[Alyn Smith (Stirling) (SNP)]

Thank you, Mr Deputy Speaker. I would be perfectly happy to summarise the Bill in one word, if you would allow me some unparliamentary language, but I will be brief.

The SNP’s position on the Bill is well rehearsed. We regret this piece of legislation. We do not think it is necessary. We do not like what it is trying to achieve, because we think targeting laws on the basis of where they came from, rather than what they do or how effective they are, is a poor way of doing it. We also are not interested in fighting old battles, but the Bill is all about fighting old battles—that is where it has come from.

I will focus only on amendments 15B, 16C and 42B. During the Bill’s passage, we of course saw the gutting of its major provision—the sunset clause—so it is not as bad as it might have been, but we think it remains a significant blank cheque for Ministers, with insufficient scrutiny. Ministers want as much power as possible, with as little scrutiny as possible. Ministers in any Parliament want that, but I think it is perfectly legitimate for the House here to demand greater scrutiny than we have seen.

We on the SNP Benches are particularly concerned—it staggers me that this has not been mentioned throughout the debate—that the Scottish Parliament and the Welsh Senedd have not consented to the Bill. I have much respect for a number of people on the Government Benches, but I would gently say that, if one wants to talk about a precious Union, it is quite important to observe it. We have yet to hear a proper answer to that point. We have had various reassurances, but we are not going to see sufficient protection in the Bill. We are concerned that this Bill, when it becomes an Act, is going to be used to undermine the devolution settlement that was endorsed by the people of Scotland and the people of Wales. We think that is a poor way of making law.

On amendment 15B, which deals with environmental standards, I found much to agree with in how the Labour spokesperson, the hon. Member for Ellesmere Port and Neston (Justin Madders), presented it. We are taking the Ministers at face value that we do not want to see a regression from international standards—the standards that we have. Let us put that in the Bill. We think that is a proportionate and workable thing to do, and I do not see how it would fetter the Government to any great extent. We are glad to see a bit of a compromise on amendment 16C, although I have to say that it is pretty weak beer when it comes to clarity on the EU law dashboard and its operation. We will not stand in its way.

On amendment 42B, which would provide for greater parliamentary scrutiny of future revocations of EU law, I think it is workable. I urge Members on the Government Benches to think hard about the fact that enough people in the House of Lords and in this place think it is necessary, as part of the Bill, which gives Ministers a lot of power, to find a new way of scrutiny. I accept the point that it is a novel way of doing things, but we think that is proportionate, and I think history will vindicate us on that view.

Mr Deputy Speaker, we regret the Bill. We are not about fighting old battles, but we do not think this is the way to go. Sadly, I think we will see that the Bill is a bad piece of legislation. There are ways of making it better, which we will support, but the Scottish Parliament have not consented to the Bill. Government Members should be in no doubt that the Bill will be passed against the interests of Scotland.

[Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans)]

Alyn, thank you for your co-operation—I appreciate it. Whoever is on their feet at 4.37 pm I will ask to resume their seat, because I am going to give the Minister two minutes to respond to contributions.

Withdrawal from Afghanistan: Joint Committee

Debate between Nigel Evans and Alyn Smith

Wednesday 15th September 2021 Commons Chamber

[Alyn Smith]

I strongly agree; in fact, that was going to be the next line of my remarks. Indeed, a number of Members across the House have been pressing for details on family reunion. There is also the question of funding for local authorities to keep people safe. I have met three families from Afghanistan who have already been settled in Stirling in the last couple of weeks, and they were particularly concerned about friends and family who were still in the country and still very much in harm’s way. I pay tribute to Stirling Council and to Forth Valley Welcome, who have done so much to make these refugees feel safe and secure in the Forth Valley. I say, in a genuine and constructive offer to the Government, that we can do more: the Forth Valley can do more and Scotland can do more. We need the details of the scheme and particularly of the funding, because we are not going to make promises that we cannot keep, but we are willing to play our part constructively.

There are wider and longer-term implications to the Afghanistan situation. It is not just about Afghanistan. Where is your global Britain now? After Afghanistan, it is clear that the UK cannot operate significant independent engagement and that it has precious little influence on US engagement. This was a collective failure of the US, the UK and others; many countries have failed in this. The world is less secure than it was, and the bad guys are now feeling more confident than they should be. That is something we should all be deeply concerned about.

Domestically, the integrated review is out of date within six months of its publication. We also see that the UK’s Indo-Pacific tilt looks even less credible than it did—and frankly that was not much, from our perspective. Global Britain is not the SNP’s project. That stands to reason, as we have a different world view. We believe that Scotland’s best future is as an independent state within the European Union, but we do not wish global Britain harm. The UK is always going to be our closest neighbour and our closest friend. The SNP submitted constructive suggestions to the integrated defence and foreign affairs review, and they are even more relevant now than they were. We will continue to work constructively, from our perspective, to help our nearest friend and neighbour to learn the lessons of the last few months, but that needs to be done on the basis of humility and reality. Learning lessons would go a long way to support the motion put forward by Labour today, which we are very pleased to support.

[Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans)]

Order. We are going to try to get everybody in, but I am afraid that the time limit forthwith is four minutes.

Business of the House

Debate between Nigel Evans and Alyn Smith

Thursday 9th September 2021 Commons Chamber

[Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans)]

I call Richard Thomson.

[Alyn Smith (Stirling) (SNP)]

rose—

[Mr Deputy Speaker]

Oh, it is Alyn Smith. I am sorry—it is the mask.

[Alyn Smith]

I will reveal my face to you, Mr Deputy Speaker. I have been called worse, so not to worry.

The chaos of Brexit becomes clearer on a daily basis, as reality dawns. Foreseen in the legislation is the establishment between the European Parliament and this place of a parliamentary partnership assembly. The efficient, dynamic, orderly European Parliament has done its bit in establishing this important forum. Will the Leader of the House give us some insight on when the UK will match its ambition and speed?