Draft Trade Union (Deduction of Union Subscriptions from Wages in the Public Sector) Regulations 2023

Debate between Nia Griffith and Simon Clarke

Tuesday 30th January 2024 General Committees

[Dame Nia Griffith]

Indeed I am. As the hon. Member will know, reflecting the will of the people of Wales, the Trade Union (Wales) Act 2017 disapplied devolved Welsh public sector employers from the provisions of the Trade Union Act 2016. Non-devolved bodies that operate in Wales are subject to the jurisdiction of the 2016 Act, however, so there is certainly an impact on people in Wales. There should have been full and proper consultation with the devolved Governments.

I hope the Minister will address this in his concluding remarks, but will he look again at what happens if the charges that the employer wishes to impose upon a trade union for providing check-off are considered unreasonable by the trade union? Will he look at working with trade unions and employers to agree some form of mechanism to resolve a disagreement?

In the draft impact assessment, the estimates for the scale of the use of check-off range from the 10-year-old TaxPayers’ Alliance figure of 90% of the workforce to the more recent Department for Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy figure of 65% of the workforce. The TaxPayers’ Alliance says that some 22% are already paid for by trade unions, whereas the Local Government Association says that 67% are already paid for. One would think that the Government could, without relying on external organisations, produce an accurate figure for how many employees are served by check-off and whether the costs are recovered from the trade unions. They certainly expect trade unions to have accurate information on whether their members are up to date with their subscriptions when they ballot for industrial action.

The current cost of check-off, which is estimated to be some £1.5 million, pales into insignificance when compared with the latest figures we have of nearly £10 billion wasted on personal protective equipment. Only last Thursday, the Department of Health and Social Care published its annual accounts, and figures showed that some £9.9 billion of the £13.6 billion-worth of PPE that the Department bought between 2020 and 2022 was unusable, and its value is now less than the Government paid for it. Rather than scrabbling to claw back a few pence from their employees, the Government should be making much more effort to chase down those who ripped off the British taxpayer by millions and billions, but they have done nothing to recoup that money. That is why Labour is committed to creating a powerful covid corruption commissioner to help recoup billions of pounds that has been lost to waste, fraud and flawed contracts.

[Sir Simon Clarke (Middlesbrough South and East Cleveland) (Con)]

I was not intending to intervene in this debate, Mr Paisley, mindful of your stricture at the outset, but we appear to have drifted into a wider consideration of the Government’s response to covid. I was the Chief Secretary to the Treasury at the time, and I gently point out that we did instigate a number of controls to try to make sure that wherever wrongdoing relating to the procurement of PPE had been perpetrated against the taxpayer, it would be followed up. That is something that the Department continues to do.

I further observe—I will conclude my remarks in a moment, Mr Paisley—that it was the Labour party that was urging us at the time to disregard ever more processes and to do ever more to procure at pace, to a point when the shadow Chancellor was urging us to go to historical re-enactment companies to procure PPE. I do think that in chiding the Minister and seeking to make a point, the hon. Lady—

[The Chair]

Order. We are not getting into the settling of scores. I encourage the shadow Minister to stick to the scope of the statutory instrument. Otherwise, we could be here for a very long time.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Nia Griffith and Simon Clarke

Tuesday 17th May 2022 Commons Chamber

[Mr Simon Clarke]

I pay tribute to the hon. Gentleman for his service as the Mayor of South Yorkshire; he did an outstanding job. It is very important that we recognise that we are going to need more great Mayors from across this House and from outside Parliament to help to deliver opportunity in the region. We are absolutely clear that our programme of investment, through a record spending review, is designed to make sure that levelling up moves from blueprint to reality over the course of the years ahead.

[Nia Griffith (Llanelli) (Lab)]

This Government have completely failed on growth in the economy, with the IMF, taking into account all the current Government proposals, currently forecasting that the UK will have the slowest growth in the G7 this year. The Minister will know that putting money into the pockets of the least well-off not only relieves their hardship but puts it into the local economy as they have to spend it, of necessity, back into the local economy, thus stimulating growth. Instead of choking off growth through the £20 universal credit cut, the national insurance hike and the refusal to use a windfall to relieve the hardship of these families, what new, additional measures do the Government propose to help hard-pressed families and to improve that IMF forecast on growth?

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Nia Griffith and Simon Clarke

Tuesday 15th March 2022 Commons Chamber

[The Chief Secretary to the Treasury (Mr Simon Clarke)]

People are rightly angry that fraudsters stole from covid support schemes, as am I. When the schemes were launched, there was cross-party consensus that we needed speed to protect jobs, and because of our action unemployment peaked at 5.2%, not the 12% predicted at the start of the pandemic. We designed the schemes to prevent as much fraud as possible, and lenders stopped nearly £2.2 billion of potential fraud from the bounce back loan schemes. We continue to take action on multiple fronts to recover money that was claimed fraudulently.

[Nia Griffith]

It is not just a matter of fraud; it is a matter of incompetence as well. The National Audit Office has been scathing about the UK’s wasteful spending of £37 billion on private contractors to deliver the test and trace system in England, while we in Wales had a more efficient system through partnership with the Welsh Government and local councils. What guidance is the Chief Secretary giving Departments on how to avoid giving such wasteful contracts in the future? Does the guidance include considering, wherever practicable, the delivery of service contracts through public authorities, where any profit remains in the public purse?

[Mr Clarke]

We always continue to encourage best value, and this is at the heart of all Treasury documents on the use of public money. On the hon. Lady’s point about test and trace, it is very important to reaffirm that the great majority of the costs associated with this scheme were about testing as opposed to tracing, and it was only that scheme that allowed us to come through the enormous challenges of the period, particularly prior to the availability of the vaccine, in a way that allowed our society and our wider economy to keep going to the extent that they could.