Infrastructure (Financial Assistance) Bill

Mark Lazarowicz Excerpts

Monday 15th October 2012 Commons Chamber

[Chris Leslie]

It is difficult to say, when looking at a guarantee scheme or underwriting scheme, because certain things are not wholly in the control of Ministers. They are putting the guarantee out there and waiting for organisations in the private sector or elsewhere to come forward and bid for the resource. It is a bit like pushing against a piece of string; it is impossible to know what the demand will be. We do not rule out the possibility of the proposal being of benefit—of course it could be—but it is impossible to know at this stage. We are holding up a finger to test the direction of the wind. There are no time scales in the Bill, and the explanatory notes do not add any information in that regard. We want to know the judgment of the studied intellects in the Treasury.

[Mark Lazarowicz (Edinburgh North and Leith) (Lab/Co-op)]

My hon. Friend mentioned the downturn in the house building industry. In my constituency, the total number of new house builds in the last quarter was just 10, and that is in a city whose population is growing. Does he accept that, in addition to the immediate difficulties that the construction industry is experiencing, companies that go bust and firms that close down cannot suddenly spring back into action when the economy changes? This is another reason why we need the measures that he is outlining, and that the Government have not yet put into operation.

[Chris Leslie]

That loss of productive capacity is another example of the permanent damage caused by recession, resulting in an inability to take advantage of the opportunities that present themselves when a recovery occurs. The International Monetary Fund released figures only last week to illustrate the damage being done by the recession to our ability to fulfil such expectations. In my city of Nottingham, not a single new affordable social house has been constructed in the past 12 months. Is that because there is no demand? Absolutely not. We have more than 12,000 people on waiting lists for decent homes. That applies in many other areas of the country as well, including Greenwich.

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[Chris Leslie]

I am not sure I agree with my hon. Friend on the particular example he provided. It is quite clear that there would be benefit for the economy within the UK if those offshore schemes proceeded. The frustration I have is with the rather hasty drafting. Yes, we accept that it is necessary to frame a scheme that has sufficient flexibility, but there are dangers in enacting legislation that does not focus sufficiently on significant financial schemes, employment and jobs here in the UK. That is the purpose of the amendment.

[Mark Lazarowicz]

I am sure that when my hon. Friend’s amendment is successful, he will arrange for his noble Friends in the other place to deal with any clarifications required as a result of our debate. Earlier today we heard a statement on the west coast main line franchise, and we saw how the whole franchising system is in a state of shambles. Is that not going to have an effect on private sector investment, making it important to get even quicker investment in rail projects across the UK, through Directly Operated Railways, through Network Rail and other means to ensure that we gain the benefit—to the rail industry, to passengers and to the economy—now and not four, five, six or seven years down the line?

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[The Economic Secretary to the Treasury (Sajid Javid)]

We have heard excellent contributions from Members on both sides of the House. The shadow Minister rightly noted that the time for the debate has been restricted. That is not unusual when we first come back after a recess, but he made a fair point. However, I was taken aback when he then went on about many different issues that did not much focus on the nature of his amendments, as he could have saved some time for hon. Members to continue with a proper debate.

On the Opposition amendments, amendment 11 is designed to limit the Bill’s geographical ambit. My response is that it is clear that the scheme relies on the spending cover provided by the Bill and is designed to facilitate and accelerate infrastructure investment throughout the United Kingdom economy. The eligibility criteria have been published. For example, the guarantee scheme contains provisions requiring the infrastructure to be of national significance to the UK. Such conditions will be sufficient to achieve protection against the UK supporting other economies. If I understood the hon. Gentleman correctly, he was concerned about the potential effect on economies outside the UK.

[Mark Lazarowicz]

Since Second Reading, have the Government been able to develop any further their ideas on how the spending under the Bill will be allocated within areas where there are devolved legislatures? In Scotland, for instance, how much will be allocated by the Scottish Government and how much will come directly from the UK Government? Can the Minister elucidate and illuminate us on that point?

[Sajid Javid]

Yes. There is no geographical division within the United Kingdom as regards the total amount of £50 billion that is being allocated in the Bill. Applications will be dealt with and assessed on a case-by-case basis as they come in from different areas of the UK, including the devolved authorities.

[Mark Lazarowicz]

rose—

[Sajid Javid]

If the hon. Gentleman will allow me to continue, there may be time for him to contribute later.

Any Government expenditure will need to satisfy the standard requirements relating to value for money, and the accounting officer will need to be satisfied about that expenditure. It is also worth noting that, as the hon. Member for Brent North (Barry Gardiner) said, making a very fair point, there may be instances where infrastructure that receives a guarantee is cross-border in nature. In those cases, we would not want to be prevented from providing financial assistance to the UK aspect of the project because of a technical limitation. I therefore beg the hon. Member for Nottingham East (Chris Leslie) to withdraw the amendment.

Amendment 9 would insert the word “childcare” after the word “health”. The amendment is unnecessary because social infrastructure, including child care, is already captured under the Bill, and so any child care facilities will be accommodated within the current definition. However, even including child care within the definition would not ensure that a provider of child care facilities was able to obtain financial assistance under the current scheme because the application will need to fall within the ambit of one of the schemes being operated which relies on spending cover provided by the Bill.

At this point, I would like to deal with the comments of the hon. Member for York Central (Hugh Bayley). I well remember that he raised the issue of flood defences on Second Reading, and he is right to do so again. It shows just how deeply he is concerned about the issue on behalf of his constituents, and I respect that. I can say again that his local flood defences are not excluded within the definition in the Bill. In the case of projects of that nature, applications should be made under the process and they will be considered like all others.

I thank my right hon. Friend the Member for Wokingham (Mr Redwood) for his kind words regarding my new position. He made two broad points. First, he rightly raised issues about overall deficit targets for the Government and their overall plan to deal with the reckless deficit inherited from the previous Government. Let me assure him that the reason we can have this programme of guarantees is the credibility that this Government have built up. Long-term interest rates and Government debt are less than half what they were when this Government came to power. That credibility is recognised by the financial markets. Sadly, the financial markets are not open for all borrowers as they were in the past. Some very viable commercial infrastructure projects cannot tap into lending in the financial markets, whether through bonds or other types of debt mechanism. The Government are using the credibility that they have built up to offer and provide these guarantees.

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[Mark Lazarowicz]

I want to pursue an important point. Will any of the £50 billion of loans, guarantees and financing be allocated directly to the Scottish Government, the Welsh Assembly Government and the Northern Ireland Government to allocate themselves, or will every project in Scotland and the other devolved regions have to go directly to the Treasury, or will there be an intermediary mechanism to ensure that the funds will be allocated throughout the UK? An answer from the Minister would be genuinely helpful.

[Sajid Javid]

That is a good question. It reminds me that I cannot remember any Member from Scotland or Northern Ireland being present during our lengthy debate on Second Reading. The recess was about to start, so perhaps they though it was a good opportunity to take a longer break. Let me be clear: this is a United Kingdom Government Bill. It is based on macro-economic policy, which is a reserved power for the United Kingdom Government, and takes advantage of the credit-worthiness of the United Kingdom Government. Members discussed the referendum on Scottish independence earlier, and this scheme is a great example of the strength of the United Kingdom when it works together. If we asked project sponsors in Scotland whether they would prefer a United Kingdom Government guarantee or a Scottish Government guarantee, I know which one they would pick. On deciding how those guarantees are used in devolved areas such as Scotland, the United Kingdom Government would work closely with their counterparts in the Scottish Executive, but the final decision would be for the United Kingdom Government.

I do not want to say too much about amendment 10, tabled by the hon. Member for Hayes and Harlington (John McDonnell), because the issue has come up a number of times, but I will point out that international connectivity is an important issue for overall economic growth. This Government believe that maintaining the UK’s status as a leading global aviation hub is fundamental to our long-term international competitiveness, but we are also mindful of the need to take full account of the social, environmental and other impacts of any expansion in airport capacity. That is why we set up the independent commission under Sir Howard Davies, which will issue its final report in the summer of 2015. Any decision on whether to support any of that report’s recommendations will be taken by the next Government. In any case, the coalition agreement is clear on this issue. That represents the Government’s position clearly, so I do not think there is any need for the amendment and ask the hon. Gentleman not to press it..

Amendment 4 was tabled by my hon. Friend the Member for Reigate (Mr Blunt), who said that he raised the issue on Second Reading. I remember discussing it with him at the time and afterwards. The Government believe that the definition of “infrastructure” should be broad enough to include housing, because housing and rented homes are a fundamental part of supporting a young dynamic work force and millions of other people, as well as of increasing the overall supply of housing. Including housing in the Bill’s non-exhaustive, illustrative list makes clear our intention to introduce major investment in the UK and increase the number of houses being built and occupied.

I reassure my hon. Friend, however, on one of his key points. In no way does this deal with planning issues or take away planning authority from local authorities. He should be reassured that the Localism Act 2011 is unaffected —there is no change to that—and the Government have no plans under this Bill to impose housing on any local authority with different views. This is about providing financial support for housing projects that meet the Bill’s criteria.

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[Sajid Javid]

I beg to move, That the Bill be now read the Third time.

We have had an excellent and informative debate. I am grateful to everyone who has taken part in scrutiny of this important Bill and to members of all parties who have contributed as it has passed through the House, and I am grateful for the constructive, thoughtful and considered approach that has been adopted by most Members.

When the global crisis hit, the United Kingdom was among the hardest hit. Our recession was among the deepest, our deficit was among the largest, and our challenge to deliver sustainable recovery was among the greatest. The Government have set out a comprehensive strategy to deal with the challenges that we face. Fiscal, monetary, tax and structural reform are all playing their role to deliver our objective of lasting recovery and sustainable public finances. That strategy has reduced the deficit and helped to deliver near-record low interest rates.

As a result of the tough decisions that the Government have made and the responsibility and credibility of our long-term fiscal plans, the UK is a safe haven in a global debt storm. Ten-year gilt interest rates are now 1.9%, less than half what they were when we came to power. We are in a position to help unlock private sector infrastructure investment because of the strength and credibility of the UK Government’s balance sheet.

[Mark Lazarowicz]

May I briefly develop a point that I raised earlier? The Minister confirmed then that the Bill was a UK-wide measure, and that funding from the scheme would be provided for all parts of the UK from the Treasury. Will he now confirm that it will be possible for a private sector project in my constituency in Edinburgh to apply directly to the Treasury for support, without needing to go through the Scottish Government?

[Sajid Javid]

Yes, I can confirm that any application will go directly to the UK Treasury. If an application were made by one of the devolved areas, the Treasury would consider working with its counterparts in that area, but the decision would be made by the Treasury itself.