Marcus Jones
Main Page: Marcus Jones (Conservative - Nuneaton)Housing and Planning Bill (Sixteenth sitting)
Marcus Jones Excerpts
The Chair
I welcome the Committee to the final day of its consideration of the Housing and Planning Bill. [Hon. Members: “Hear, hear.”] I remind Members that, under the programme motion, the Bill has to be out by 5 pm.
New Clause 2
Revocation or variation of banning orders
“(1) A person against whom a banning order is made may apply to the First-tier Tribunal for an order under this section revoking or varying the order.
(2) If the banning order was made on the basis of one or more convictions all of which are overturned on appeal, the First-tier Tribunal must revoke the banning order.
(3) If the banning order was made on the basis of more than one conviction and some of them (but not all) have been overturned on appeal, the First-tier Tribunal may—
(a) vary the banning order, or
(b) revoke the banning order.
(4) If the banning order was made on the basis of one or more convictions that have become spent, the First-tier Tribunal may—
(a) vary the banning order, or
(b) revoke the banning order.
(5) The power to vary a banning order under (3)(a) or (4)(a) may be used to add new exceptions to a ban or to vary—
(a) the banned activities,
(b) the length of a ban, or
(c) existing exceptions to a ban.
(6) In this section ‘spent’, in relation to a conviction, means spent for the purposes of the Rehabilitation of Offenders Act 1974.”—(Mr Marcus Jones.)
This amendment allows a banning order to be revoked or varied in certain circumstances.
Brought up, read the First and Second time, and added to the Bill.
New Clause 3
Offence of breach of banning order
“(1) A person who breaches a banning order commits an offence.
(2) A person guilty of an offence under this section is liable on summary conviction to imprisonment for a period not exceeding 51 weeks or to a fine or to both.
(3) If a financial penalty under section 17 has been imposed in respect of the breach, the person may not be convicted of an offence under this section.
(4) In relation to an offence committed before section 281(5) of the Criminal Justice Act 2003 comes into force, the reference in subsection (2) to 51 weeks is to be read as a reference to 6 months.”—(Mr Marcus Jones.)
This amendment makes it an offence to breach a banning order.
Brought up, read the First and Second time, and added to the Bill.
New Clause 4
Offences by bodies corporate
“(1) Where an offence under section (Offence of breach of banning order) committed by a body corporate is proved to have been committed with the consent or connivance of, or to be attributable to any neglect on the part of, an officer of a body corporate, the officer as well as the body corporate commits the offence and is liable to be proceeded against and punished accordingly.
(2) Where the affairs of a body corporate are managed by its members, subsection (1) applies in relation to the acts and defaults of a member in connection with the member’s functions of management as if the member were an officer of the body corporate.”—(Mr Marcus Jones.)
This amendment ensures that officers of a body corporate can be prosecuted for offences committed by it under NC3. “Officer” is given a broad definition by clause 48 of the Bill.
Brought up, read the First and Second time, and added to the Bill.
New Clause 5
Power to require information
“(1) A local housing authority may require a person to provide specified information for the purpose of enabling the authority to decide whether to apply for a banning order against the person. It is an offence for the person to fail to comply with a requirement, unless the person has a reasonable excuse for the failure. It is an offence for the person to provide information that is false or misleading if the person knows that the information is false or misleading or is reckless as to whether it is false or misleading.
(2) A person who commits an offence under this section is liable on summary conviction to a fine.”—(Mr Marcus Jones.)
This amendment allows a local housing authority to require a person to provide information for the purpose of deciding whether to apply for a banning order. For example, the number of properties that a landlord has may be relevant to whether an authority applies for a banning order. The power would allow the authority to require the landlord to provide that information.
Brought up, read the First and Second time, and added to the Bill.
New Clause 6
Removal or variation of entries made under section 24
“(1) An entry made in the database under section 24 may be removed or varied in accordance with this section.
(2) If the entry was made on the basis of one or more convictions all of which are overturned on appeal, the responsible local housing authority must remove the entry.
(3) If the entry was made on the basis of more than one conviction and some of them (but not all) have been overturned on appeal, the responsible local housing authority may—
(a) remove the entry, or
(b) reduce the period for which the entry must be maintained.
(4) If the entry was made on the basis of one or more convictions that have become spent, the responsible local housing authority may—
(a) remove the entry, or
(b) reduce the period for which the entry must be maintained.
(5) If a local housing authority removes an entry in the database, or reduces the period for which it must be maintained, it must notify the person to whom the entry relates.
(6) In this section—
‘responsible local housing authority’ means the local housing authority by which the entry was made;
‘spent’, in relation to a conviction, means spent for the purposes of the Rehabilitation of Offenders Act 1974.”—(Mr Marcus Jones.)
This amendment allows a local housing authority to remove an entry in the database of rogue landlords and property agents or reduce the time for which the entry must be maintained in certain circumstances. See also NC7. There is no mention of clause 23 as an entry under that clause is maintained for as long as the banning order has effect.
Brought up, read the First and Second time, and added to the Bill.
New Clause 7
Requests for exercise of powers under section (Removal or variation of entries made under section 24) and appeals
“(1) A person in respect of whom an entry is made in the database under section 24 may request the responsible local housing authority to use its powers under section (Removal or variation of entries made under section 24) to—
(a) remove the entry, or
(b) reduce the period for which the entry must be maintained.
(2) The request must be in writing.
(3) Where a request is made, the local housing authority must—
(a) decide whether to comply with the request, and
(b) give the person notice of its decision.
(4) If the local housing authority decides not to comply with the request the notice must include—
(a) reasons for that decision, and
(b) a summary of the appeal rights conferred by this section.
(5) Where a person is given notice that the responsible local housing authority has decided not to comply with the request the person may appeal to the First-tier Tribunal against that decision.
(6) An appeal to the First-tier Tribunal under subsection (5) must be made before the end of the period of 21 days beginning with the day on which the notice was given.
(7) The First-tier Tribunal may allow an appeal to be made to it after the end of that period if satisfied that there is a good reason for the person’s failure to appeal within the period (and for any subsequent delay).
(8) On an appeal under this section the tribunal may order the local housing authority to—
(a) remove the entry, or
(b) reduce the period for which the entry must be maintained.” —(Mr Marcus Jones.)
This amendment allows a person to request a local housing authority to use its powers to remove or vary an entry in the database of rogue landlords and property agents (see NC6). If the local housing authority refuses, the person may appeal to the First-tier Tribunal.
Brought up, read the First and Second time, and added to the Bill.
New Clause 8
Meaning of “property manager” and related expressions
“(1) In this Part ‘property manager’ means a person who engages in English property management work.
(2) In this Part ‘English property management work’ means things done by a person in the course of a business in response to instructions received from another person (‘the client’) where—
(a) the client wishes the person to arrange services, repairs, maintenance, improvements or insurance in respect of, or to deal with any other aspect of the management of, premises on the client’s behalf, and
(b) the premises consist of housing in England let under a tenancy.”—(Mr Marcus Jones.)
This and related amendments are intended to ensure that a banning order can be made against any person who engages in property management work, not just letting agents who engage in such work.
Brought up, read the First and Second time, and added to the Bill.
New Clause 17
Default powers exercisable by Mayor of London or combined authority
“(1) After section 27 of the Planning and Compulsory Purchase Act 2004 insert—
‘27A Default powers exercisable by Mayor of London or combined authority
Schedule A1 (default powers exercisable by Mayor of London or combined authority) has effect.’
(2) Before Schedule 1 to that Act insert, as Schedule A1, the Schedule set out in Schedule (Default powers exercisable by Mayor of London or combined authority: Schedule to be inserted in the Planning and Compulsory Purchase Act 2004) to this Act.
(3) In section 17 of that Act (local development documents), at the end of subsection (8) insert—
‘(c) is approved by the Mayor of London under paragraph 2 of Schedule A1;
(d) is approved by a combined authority under paragraph 6 of that Schedule.’”—(Mr Marcus Jones.)
This new Clause and NS2 make provision for the Secretary of State to invite the Mayor of London or a combined authority to prepare or revise a development plan document for a local planning authority in their area that is failing to progress the document.
Brought up, read the First and Second time, and added to the Bill.
New Clause 18
Amendments to do with section 111 to 117
“Schedule (Right to enter and survey land: consequential amendments) amends legislation conferring rights of entry relating to the acquisition of an interest in or a right over land in England and Wales.”—(Mr Marcus Jones.)
This amendment, together with amendment 257 and new Schedule (Right to enter and survey land: consequential amendments), clarifies how the new right of entry in clause 111 will interact with a number of existing rights of entry.
Brought up, read the First and Second time, and added to the Bill.
New Clause 23
Procedure for redeeming English rentcharges
“(1) The Rentcharges Act 1977 is amended in accordance with subsections (2) to (5).
(2) Before section 8 (but after the italic heading before section 8) insert—
‘7A Power to make procedure for redeeming English rentcharges
(1) The Secretary of State may by regulations make provision allowing the owner of land in England affected by a rentcharge to redeem it.
(2) Regulations under subsection (1) may not make provision in relation to—For the purposes of subsection (2)(d) a rentcharge is variable if the amount of the rentcharge will, or may, vary in the future in accordance with the provisions of the instrument under which it is payable.
(a) a rentcharge that could be redeemed by making an application under section 8(1A),
(b) a rentcharge of a kind mentioned in section 2(3) or section 3(3)(a),
(c) a rentcharge in respect of which the period for which it is payable cannot be ascertained, or
(d) a variable rentcharge.
(3) Regulations under subsection (1) may, in particular—
(a) provide for the owner of land affected by a rentcharge to be able to redeem a rentcharge by taking specified steps, including making payments determined in accordance with the regulations;
(b) require a rent owner or other person to take specified steps to facilitate the redemption of a rentcharge, such as providing information or executing a deed of release;
(c) where the documents of title of the owner of land affected by a rentcharge are in the custody of a mortgagee, require the mortgagee to make those documents or copies of those documents available in accordance with the regulations;
(d) permit or require a person specified in the regulations to design the form of any document to be used in connection with the redemption of rentcharges under the regulations;
(e) provide for a court or tribunal to—
(i) determine disputes about or in relation to the redemption of a rentcharge;
(ii) make orders about the redemption of a rentcharge;
(iii) issue a redemption certificate;
(f) make provision corresponding to any of the provisions of section 10(2) to (4).
(4) Nothing in this section prevents the redemption of a rentcharge otherwise than in accordance with regulations under subsection (1).’
(3) In section 8—
(a) in subsection (1)—
(i) after ‘land’ insert ‘in Wales’;
(ii) for the words from ‘a certificate’ to the end substitute ‘a redemption certificate’;
(b) after subsection (1) insert—
‘(1A) The owner of any land in England affected by a rentcharge which has been apportioned to that land by an apportionment order with a condition under—
(a) section 7(2) above, or
(b) section 20(1) of the Landlord and Tenant Act 1927,
may apply to the Secretary of State, in accordance with this section, for a redemption certificate.’
(4) In section 12—
(a) in subsection (1), after ‘this Act’ insert ‘, apart from regulations under section 7A,’;
(b) after subsection (1) insert—
‘(1A) Regulations under section 7A are to be made by statutory instrument.
(1B) A statutory instrument containing regulations under section 7A may not be made unless a draft of the instrument has been laid before and approved by a resolution of each House of Parliament.’
(5) In section 13(1), in the definition of ‘redemption certificate’, for the words from ‘has’ to the end substitute ‘means a certificate certifying that a rentcharge has been redeemed’.
(6) The Leasehold Reform Act 1967 is amended in accordance with subsections (7) and (8).
(7) In section 8(4)(b), for ‘8’ substitute ‘7A’.
(8) In section 11—
(a) in subsection (6), after ‘1977’ insert ‘or the amount that would have to be paid to secure the redemption of that rentcharge in accordance with regulations made under section 7A of that Act’;
(b) in subsection (7)(a), after ‘specified’ insert ‘or required’;
(c) in subsection (8), for ‘8’ substitute ‘7A’.”—(Mr Marcus Jones.)
This amendment will permit the Secretary of State to make regulations allowing the owner of land in England that is affected by a rentcharge to redeem that rentcharge without making an application to the Secretary of State as the procedure in section 8 of the Rentcharges Act 1977 would involve.
Brought up, and read the First time.
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government (Mr Marcus Jones)
I beg to move, That the clause be read a Second time.
Mr Gray, it has been a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship these past few weeks, and it remains so today. With your permission, before I speak to new clause 23, I would like to inform the Committee that last night I sent the Clerks an updated assessment of the Bill’s legislative competence, following the amendments agreed so far and those being discussed today. I trust that it will help to inform Mr Speaker when he comes to re-certify the Bill at the appropriate time.
New clause 23 give the Secretary of State a power to make regulations setting out a new statutory redemption procedure for rentcharges, excluding those specified in new section 7A(2) of the Rentcharges Act 1977, as inserted by subsection (2) of the new clause. Currently, a rent payer can apply to the Secretary of State under section 8 of the 1977 Act for a redemption certificate. The rentcharge team will carry out the necessary checks and advise the rent payer on the amount needed for redemption. Once that amount has been paid, the team will issue a certificate of redemption.
We do not believe it appropriate in this day and age, and especially in the current financial climate, for the Government to continue to have a role in the redemption of rentcharges. The clause will allow the current procedure to be replaced with a mechanism that will be set out in regulations. The new procedure will no longer involve the Secretary of State in the redemption of rentcharges. Instead, the rent owner and the rent payer will be required to take certain steps for the redemption of a rentcharge. [Interruption.]
Mr Gareth Thomas (Harrow West) (Lab/Co-op)
On a point of order, Mr Gray. I am trying to listen to the Minister with great interest, but there is clearly a conversation going on elsewhere within the room that is preventing me from listening to what feels like an excellent contribution.
The Chair
I am grateful for that point of order from the Opposition Back Benches. The Government Whip might like to take note—[Interruption.] I repeat: the Government Whip might like to take note of the point of order, which is that there are too many conversations—mainly involving the Government Whip—happening on the Back Benches.
Mr Jones
Thank you, Mr Gray.
It will still be possible for the parties to reach a private agreement on redemption voluntarily outside the statutory regime. The existing redemption procedure is set out in primary legislation. The power to set out the new procedure in regulation provides the flexibility to make changes with greater ease than would otherwise be the case. The new regime is likely to contain a level of detail not suited to primary legislation, as the regulations will be concerned with substantive matters, such as the property rights of both the rent payer and the rent owner, and will include provision on dispute resolution. It seems appropriate for the regulations to be subject to the affirmative resolution procedure.
Dr Roberta Blackman-Woods (City of Durham) (Lab)
I do not wish to say too much about the new clause at this stage, because I am conscious that much of the detail will come in regulations, and I am partly assured by the fact that the regulations will be affirmative. Presumably, we will get an opportunity at a later stage to consider the implications of the new clause in more detail.
Mr Jones
I thank the hon. Lady for her contribution. On the basis of the assurance that we have provided to her, I commend the new clause to the Committee.
Question put and agreed to.
New clause 23 accordingly read a Second time, and added to the Bill.
New Clause 32
Secure tenancies etc: phasing out of tenancies for life
“Schedule (Secure tenancies etc: phasing out of tenancies for life) changes the law about secure tenancies, introductory tenancies and demoted tenancies to phase out tenancies for life.”—(Mr Marcus Jones.)
A secure tenant can currently live in a property for life. This amendment and NS4 phase out lifetime tenancies. In future secure tenancies will generally have to be for a fixed term of 2 to 5 years and will not automatically be renewed. Towards the end of the term, the landlord will have to do a review to decide whether to grant a new tenancy or recover possession.
Brought up, and read the First time.
The Chair
With this it will be convenient to discuss the following: Government new clause 33—Succession to secure tenancies and related tenancies.
Government new schedule 4—Secure tenancies etc: phasing out of tenancies for life.
Government new schedule 5—Succession to secure tenancies and related tenancies.
Mr Jones
New clause 32 and new schedule 4 together prevent local authorities in England from offering secure tenancies for life in most circumstances. They deliver on a commitment in the July Budget to review the use of lifetime tenancies, with a view to limiting their use. Currently, the vast majority of new social housing tenancies are offered on a lifetime basis, meaning tenants have the right to live in their social home for the rest of their lives, provided they keep to the conditions of their tenancy.
Since April 2012, following changes introduced by the coalition Government’s Localism Act 2011, local authorities have been able to offer so-called flexible tenancies—tenancies of a fixed term of no less than two years. However, they are not taking advantage of that flexibility. In 2014-15, only 8% of social tenancies granted by local authorities were flexible tenancies. That is only just over than 9,000 in all. At present, 236,000 social tenants are forced to live in overcrowded conditions due to the lack of suitably sized properties, while 380,000 households occupy social housing with two or more spare bedrooms. Under those circumstances, we believe that continuing to offer social tenancies on a lifetime basis is not an efficient use of scarce social housing.
The new clauses will significantly improve landlords’ ability to get the best use out of social housing by focusing it on those who need it most for as long as they need it. That will ensure that people who need long-term support are provided with more appropriate tenancies as their needs change over time and will support households to make the transition into home ownership where they can. In future, with limited exceptions, local authority landlords will only be able to grant tenancies with a fixed term of between two and five years, and will be required to use tenancy review points to support tenants’ move towards home ownership where appropriate.
Let me be clear: we are not taking away security of tenure from existing lifetime tenants who remain in their home. Moreover, these amendments will ensure that where existing lifetime tenants are moved by their landlord—for example, as part of an estate regeneration—they will retain their lifetime tenancy. We want to ensure that fixed-term tenancies do not act as a barrier to mobility.
Where lifetime tenants choose to move, local authority landlords will have limited discretion to offer further lifetime tenancies. We will prescribe the circumstances in which local authorities may exercise that discretion in regulations. We expect that such circumstances will include tenants downsizing to a smaller property and moving for work. We will obviously ensure that we develop the regulations in discussion with local authorities. Outside those limited exceptions, if local authorities try to offer a lifetime tenancy or one that is shorter than two years or longer than five, whether deliberately or by mistake, the tenancy will default to a five-year fixed term.
In the main, the statutory protections that the amendments provide for those granted a fixed-term tenancy are similar to those currently enjoyed by flexible tenants. A person who is offered a fixed-term tenancy by a prospective landlord may request a review of the landlord’s decision on the length of term offered. The landlord will be required to look at their decision again and explain how it was reached in the light of their published tenancy policy.
Mr Jones
The hon. Gentleman raises a good question, which I will come to later in my remarks.
Tenants will usually be able to terminate their tenancy at any stage, while enjoying protection from eviction during the fixed term. The local authority landlord will need to demonstrate to the court that one or more of the grounds for possession is proven and that they are acting reasonably in seeking possession.
The amendments will introduce an important new statutory protection. Local authority landlords will be required to carry out a review of the tenant’s circumstances between six and nine months before the end of the fixed term, so that they can take an appropriate decision about the household’s housing need and advise the tenant on their housing options. That will include moving into home ownership where that is a realistic option. The new review process will also apply to existing flexible tenants unless they have less than nine months to go on their tenancy agreement.
Mr Jones
I thank the hon. Lady for her question. She makes a very good point, to which I will return.
We are including protections for existing introductory and demoted tenants at the time that the Bill comes into force. Where tenants have a legitimate expectation that they would be granted a lifetime tenancy at the end of the tenancy—because, in the case of demoted tenants, they were previously lifetime tenants, or because, in the case of introductory tenants, the tenancy would otherwise automatically convert to a lifetime tenancy—they will still be given a lifetime tenancy.
I believe that, taken together, the amendments strike the right balance between stability and quality for tenants—new and existing—flexibility for the landlord and a move towards home ownership.
Dr Blackman-Woods
Will the Minister clarify the previous point? If a tenant is currently a local authority tenant with a lifetime tenancy and they move within the stock, does the lifetime tenancy move with them or will they then have to be offered a two to five-year tenancy?
Mr Jones
In my comments earlier, I set out clearly that that can be the case, but that will depend on the circumstances of the tenant at the time and the policy of the local authority.
We want housing association landlords and tenants to reap the benefits from shorter-term tenancies as well. However, we clearly need to consider any changes to housing associations in the light of the recent decision of the Office for National Statistics on classification. We are working through the ONS reclassification decision and considering the options but, given the complexity of the matter, careful consideration is needed. We will continue to work closely with the housing association sector, the social housing regulator and other stakeholders to finalise the deregulatory package, and we will consider any changes to lifetime tenancies in the context of that work.
New clause 33 and new schedule 5 change the rules on succession to secure tenancies and make equivalent changes for introductory and demoted tenancies. Currently there are significant differences between the succession rights for secure tenancies granted before April 2012 and those for tenancies granted after the date when changes under the Localism Act 2011 came into force.
For secure tenancies granted before April 2012 there is a limit of one succession. Spouses and civil partners qualify to succeed automatically, while other family members, including cohabitees, also qualify but only if they have lived with the tenant for at least 12 months immediately before his or her death.
Since April 2012, only spouses, civil partners and those living together as spouse or civil partner have a statutory right to succeed. However, local authorities can provide any additional succession rights that they think appropriate, including to people who have already succeeded, and to non-family members such as live-in carers.
We do not think that there is a justification for retaining the inconsistency of approach between pre-2012 and post-2012 local authority tenancies. We therefore propose that the succession rights for secure tenancies granted before April 2012 be aligned with those granted after that date. The amendments will deliver a consistent approach across all secure tenancies and ensure that common-law partners are put on an equal footing with married couples and civil partners.
Other family members who may have had an expectation of succeeding to a secure tenancy granted before April 2012, having lived with the tenant for at least 12 months, will lose their statutory right to succeed. We do not think that it is right that those who may not need social housing, because, for example, they can rent or buy privately, should have the automatic right to succeed to a social home when nearly 1.4 million households are on council waiting lists.
Mr Jones
As I said a few minutes ago, we clearly need to consider any changes that we might want to make. As I intimated, we would consider that, but we need to make any changes in the light of the reclassification. That is why we are saying that we want to consider the position extremely carefully. We expect to work closely with the housing association sector and the social housing regulator, and other stakeholders, to finalise any deregulatory package. We will consider—and we are considering—changes. That will happen in the context of the work I have mentioned.
I was explaining that family members other than common-law partners, married couples and civil partners will lose any statutory right they may have had to succeed to a secure tenancy granted before April 2012. Instead, local authorities will have the discretion to grant them succession rights, which must be written into the tenancy agreement. Where local authorities grant additional succession rights, we expect they will apply the same rules to tenancies granted before and after April 2012. However, we will provide guidelines to assist local authorities to exercise their discretion.
Peter Dowd (Bootle) (Lab)
As you know, Mr Gray, I listen avidly to what the Prime Minister says on these matters. In August 2010, in a speech in Birmingham, he said of this proposal that
“not everyone will support this and there will be quite a big argument”.
Well, he is right on that one: there will be a big argument. More importantly, however, he also said that the proposal would help with social mobility. It would be helpful if the Minister, in the absence of the Prime Minister, could explain why it will help with social mobility in any way whatever.
Mr Jones
The measure will help with social mobility—all the policies in the Bill are aimed at helping with social mobility. We want people who are able to purchase their own property—to exercise the right to buy—to do so and to exercise what we see as a right to social mobility. Within this policy, in many cases, the circumstances of tenants will be reviewed; in certain cases, it may prompt people who may otherwise not have thought about purchasing their own home to do so where they feel they are able to. That is an important thing for everybody to have the opportunity to do if they are able to.
Mr Thomas
Does the Minister envisage any exemptions for households where there are young children? One thinks, for example, of the need to offer young children stability of schooling, allowing them to go through primary school or to complete their passage through GCSEs. Might there be flexibility on secure tenancies in that situation?
Mr Jones
When a housing authority is doing a review of the circumstances of tenants who are in that position—where their bedrooms are fully occupied, and where they have children at schools—we would not expect it to assess their circumstances in the context that they have changed significantly enough to mean that those people would not be able to take a further tenancy from that authority. It is important to stress to the hon. Gentleman that this is all about trying to free up social housing for the people who really need it; this is not about taking away social housing from people whose circumstances have not changed significantly.
To come back to the point I was making about succession, even where family members do not benefit from additional succession rights, the landlord will still be able to issue them with a new tenancy in the same or a different property if they have had sufficient priority under the council’s allocation scheme. That will ensure that landlords take account of particularly hard cases. That feeds into the point made by the hon. Member for Harrow West.
The proposals ensure that spouses, civil partners and those who live together as such continue to have an automatic right to succeed to a lifetime tenancy. That seems only fair, particularly as, in many cases, they will be joint tenants. However, it is difficult to justify why other people should succeed to a lifetime tenancy, particularly when most new tenants will receive a five-year fixed-term tenancy. The proposals ensure, therefore, that anyone other than a spouse or partner will no longer be able to inherit a lifetime tenancy. Instead, if they qualify to succeed, they will be given a five-year fixed-term tenancy. At the end of the fixed-term period, the landlord will be required to carry out a review of their circumstances, as they would need to do for any new fixed-term tenant. If the tenant is still in need of social housing, the landlord will be able to grant a further fixed-term tenancy of between two and five years. We think that, taken together, the amendments strike the right balance between protection for the tenants and their families, and flexibility for landlords.
Mr Jones
I thank the hon. Gentleman for his question. There are people who have certain needs, and he mentioned somebody who is disabled and in a property that has been specially adapted to deal with that disability. He needs to realise that the amendments are not couched in terms of automatically asking somebody in those circumstances who comes to the end of a fixed-term tenancy to move on. They are about reviewing circumstances. If, after that review, it is found that the disability of the person in question has not changed and that they still need that type of property with the housing adaptations that have been made, the local authority should not do anything other than renew the tenancy, as long as the person who is occupying the property has fulfilled the obligations under their tenancy agreement.
Let me come on to one or two of the questions that were asked during the debate. A question was asked about the impact assessment. We will publish a revised Bill impact assessment, and this will certainly be included in that.
Mr Jones
I assure the hon. Gentleman that it will be published before the Bill goes to the Lords.
On the right to buy, the answer is yes, the tenant will still be able to exercise their right to buy. They must have had three years in social housing to be eligible. That is the same for flexible tenancies. Part of the purpose of the review at the end of the tenancy is to consider whether a person can exercise the right to buy if they are eligible to do so.
Teresa Pearce
Will the Minister explain something? If somebody has less than a three-year tenancy, they will not have the right to buy. If they have a two-year tenancy, then a break and then another two-year tenancy, they will not have the right to buy. Is it possible that some local authorities will not grant longer tenancies as a way of not extending the right to buy to some tenants? Has the Minister looked at that to see whether it is a possible loophole?
Mr Jones
I am trying to think carefully about the hon. Lady’s logic. I think that the circumstances she mentioned would apply to people who have a lifetime tenancy. If a person does two years and, by their own volition, whether they are on a lifetime tenancy or a fixed tenancy, moves into private rented accommodation and then comes back to the local authority for rehousing, they would not have built up the three years that makes them eligible to take on the right to buy.
This issue has come up several times. The hon. Lady is saying that the local authority moves them out of the property after two years, but at the end of the two-year fixed tenancy, the situation is reviewed and the people’s circumstances are taken into account. I cannot see that this policy will stop people being able to take up right to buy.
The provisions also align the succession rights of introductory and demoted tenants with those of secure tenants. Spouses, civil partners and those living together as a married couple will have a statutory right to succeed and the landlord will be able to grant additional succession rights in the tenancy agreement. None of the changes will apply where the tenant died before the Bill comes into force. I therefore hope that hon. Members will take the measures in the spirit in which they are intended and accept them.
Dr Blackman-Woods
I will be very measured in my comments on the two new clauses, but I want to say to the Minister and put on the record that I am extremely angry about what is contained in the new clauses. I am angry in terms of process and in terms of content. I do not think it is helpful to the deliberations of this Committee to have had these extremely controversial and wide-ranging new clauses added on the last day of the Committee. I am also angry because, as far as I can see, there has been—
Mr Jones
I am looking at the new clauses before us today and the ones that the Committee has not dealt with previously. I can see only a small number of new clauses tabled by the Government, but a significantly greater number of new clauses submitted at this stage to the Committee. I ask the hon. Lady: is not what is good for the goose good for the gander?
Dr Blackman-Woods
I thought the Minister was going to make a serious intervention about the content of the new clauses. The point I was making is that the Government new clauses, which are wide ranging and controversial and have an impact on lots of people’s lives, should not have been brought to this Committee on the last day of its deliberations without any consultation, without an impact assessment and without any background information. It really is extraordinary. It is extremely bad practice and not good policy making.
It is the content of the clauses that concerns and outrages me. As my right hon. Friend the Member for Wentworth and Dearne (John Healey) said this morning:
“People will be astonished that Ministers are legislating to deny families a stable home. This will cause worry and upheaval for tenants, and break up communities.”
Because the new clauses have not been in the public domain for long, people are only now trying to catch up with what the impact might mean for people. However, some housing lawyers have contacted us to say:
“Presently, local authorities generally grant periodic secure tenancies. Such tenancies have no automatic end date, rather, they end only when the court makes an order for possession or when a tenant gives up the tenancy. Moreover, if you are the spouse or civil partner of a local authority tenant then, on the death of that tenant, you can succeed to the tenancy on the same terms.”
Dr Blackman-Woods
We dealt with that earlier. I ask the hon. Gentleman and his colleagues to turn their attention to how we can deliver more social rented housing.
Dr Blackman-Woods
I will give way to the Minister once I have dealt with the intervention by the hon. Member for Thirsk and Malton. The way to deal with the huge demand for social rented housing is to build more of it. The figures I gave much earlier showed that last year the lowest number of homes for social rent in decades was built—I think it was 10,000 units.
Mr Jones
We have heard the heartening story of the hon. Member for Erith and Thamesmead. If she had chosen to, with a lifetime tenancy, she could by definition still be living in that house today while earning £74,000 a year as a Member of Parliament. Does the hon. Member for City of Durham think that it is right for someone to hold on to a lifetime tenancy in those circumstances, when people in housing need have nowhere near that income?
Dr Blackman-Woods
The Minister is sidestepping the point—for a change. We need to build more homes that are genuinely affordable—social homes, to rent. The Government are just making life more difficult for council tenants, trying to get them to move on somehow or other, rather than addressing the fundamental underlying problem, which is the lack of genuinely affordable housing.
Matthew Pennycook
My hon. Friend makes a good point. If I was a housing association tenant, or if I ran a housing association, I would be worried by the implications of the new clause and new schedules for tenants and for the sector as a whole.
Turning to some of the specifics, I have a number of concerns about the consequences, intended or otherwise, of the proposals. The most important is that the new clauses are yet another example of the centralising nature of the Bill. Perhaps that is the weakest part of the Government’s argument. The Minister argued that the measures are intended to promote the more efficient use of council housing, and the hon. Member for Thirsk and Malton said that they are designed to make better use of stock, but the Localism Act 2011 already allows local authorities to grant fixed-term tenancies.
Currently, it is left to local councils to decide whether to grant traditional secure tenancies or fixed-term tenancies. The Minister touched on the fact that there will be freedom and opportunity for local authorities. If that is the aim, why the need for legislation? They have that as things stand. More telling was his staggering comment that the measures are needed because local authorities are not taking advantage of the freedoms available to them. What kind of localism is it that says to a local authority, “Here is a power that you can use if you decide, as a democratically elected local authority, that the housing needs in your area demand it, but if you don’t use it, we are going to take it away, make you look at it again and force you to use it”? That is not localism. As the Conservative party has championed localism, I thought that the Government might have thought about this measure a little more carefully.
My hon. Friend the Member for City of Durham has already said that the provisions for recovery of possession at the end of the fixed term and against a successor are not workable. Where a local authority grants a fixed-term tenancy, possession proceedings operate by way of forfeiture, yet the Bill excludes forfeiture from the remedies available against fixed-term tenancies. That is unsurprising, because the provisions have been introduced so hastily that the drafting is flawed and will need to be reviewed at a later date.
Perhaps the most important point is the one made powerfully by my hon. Friend the Member for Dulwich and West Norwood. The new clauses and new schedules will have implications for the building and maintaining of stable and secure communities. I return to a point that we have touched on several times previously, including in our discussion of the pay to stay clauses. When we look at social and public housing as a zero sum game, through the lens of dependency and economic subsidy, as Government Members clearly do, we are into a world where we are undermining mixed communities. I thought that the Government—the coalition Government certainly stated this—believed in sustainable, inclusive, mixed communities. How can we have mixed communities if anyone who does well, who saves and gets a better job, is encouraged to move on?
As my hon. Friend the Member for Erith and Thamesmead, who has actually experienced living in social housing, has said, if they have the opportunity and the security and stability on which to do it, most people will take the opportunity to buy their own home and move out at some point in the future. Coercing people or applying pressure on them to do so is not the way to encourage them to move on. That is what the provisions will do.
The new clauses do not, as the Minister said, strike the right balance; they will be deeply damaging to communities throughout England, including those I represent in Plumstead, Charlton, Woolwich and Greenwich. I encourage the Minister to visit some of the estates and talk to the people there, who will say exactly as my hon. Friend the Member for Dulwich and West Norwood did: the people who hold these communities together—the glue, if you like—are those tenants who have perhaps done a little better than others but have stayed and are trusted and looked to as community figures.
The measures will increase transience and churn and undermine mixed communities. They are conclusive proof that the central thrust of the Bill is an attack on public housing and the families who rely on it. It is bad policy and, more important, it is bad policy making. The Government should go away and look again and at least, at a minimum, if they really believe in this, come back to us after a consultation when we can look at a proper impact assessment. They should not be introducing these new clauses in such a shabby way.
Mr Jones
I have heard the comments of Opposition Members, including the hon. Member for City of Durham. The hon. Lady seems to be most surprised that the Government are introducing these measures, but I am surprised that she is surprised. In August 2010 the Prime Minister first mentioned that the Government of the day were thinking of such provisions—the hon. Member for Bootle even highlighted that in his earlier intervention—and that was followed by the Localism Act 2011, which took the proposals further, and by the Chancellor’s announcement in this year’s summer Budget. The Labour party should not be surprised.
Teresa Pearce
I hear what the Minister is saying, but given that the measure has been in the pipeline since 2010, why was it not in the Bill?
Mr Jones
I am not going to give way at the moment. I want to read from a newspaper article quoting a Minister:
“the minister did say the current system had to be re-thought as it concentrated dependency and disadvantage in particular estates, frustrating people’s attempts to either get out of social housing or to get into it.”
I completely agree with that statement, but it was said in 2008 by the right hon. Member for Derby South (Margaret Beckett), when she was a Minister in the Department in which I am privileged to serve. She said:
“What we have at the moment is not effective or sustainable and it seems to me that people deserve better.”
The article states that she
“indicated that she wanted to encourage social tenants or would-be social tenants to look beyond social housing to the private sector”.
It quotes her saying:
“If people could find greater stability and security in the private rented sector, or could take advantage of low cost home ownership, then maybe fewer would think that social housing was their only option.”
It is telling that that was the thinking in 2008 of the Labour Government and the Department for Communities and Local Government, in which the shadow Housing and Planning Minister, the right hon. Member for Wentworth and Dearne (John Healey), served as a Minister.
The thinking of the Labour Government at the time was similar to our thinking now and seemed to be in the centre ground. If the Labour party had won in 2010—if the electorate had not seen fit to throw out that discredited shambles of a Labour Government—and the country had had the misfortune of having another Labour Government, there is every possibility that they would have taken a similar approach to the one we are taking now.
Dr Blackman-Woods
The Minister must really be struggling to defend this policy if the best he can come up with is a Minister many, many years ago making what we all thought were personal comments. They were never accepted as Labour party policy or proposed in legislation. That was a speech in which she made personal comments. [Laughter.] I find it pretty shocking that Government Members are laughing, given that these clauses seek to take important rights from people. Labour did not take that approach either in government or in opposition, and the Minister should not suggest that we did.
Mr Jones
My hon. Friend the Member for Burton wants to intervene on the hon. Member for City of Durham, and I understand why he wishes to do so. The then Housing Minister made those comments at a housing conference at the Adam Smith Institute in her capacity as a Minister of the Government of the time. I find it difficult to square that with the fact that the hon. Lady just said that they were personal comments. They were not personal comments; they were the comments of the Labour Government at the time. That is the direction that the Labour Government would have taken if they had been re-elected in 2010. The hon. Lady said that I am struggling to defend the policy—in a moment, I will give her some more detail about why I am confident in defending it—but I think she is struggling to put up an argument against it.
Stephen Hammond
I just want to put on the record that the only reason why I and several colleagues laughed was the shadow Minister’s shocking response and the fact that she dared to disown comments that were clearly made at an official conference by an official representative of the Government of the time. It is an extraordinarily inadequate response.
Mr Jones
I thank my hon. Friend for that intervention. It is an indication either of how far to the left the Labour party has gone or that, as usual, Labour Members have selective amnesia about the views their party held when they were in government. Time is pressing, so I shall move on.
The hon. Lady mentioned the protection for tenants who do not have their tenancy renewed. The Protection from Eviction Act 1977 means that if a person is being evicted, a court hearing will always be required. Human rights issues can be considered at that hearing. In my initial remarks, I also said that before any court hearing there would be an internal review so that the local authority in question could ensure that it had complied with its own housing policy on evicting a tenant.
A comment was made about the policy being burdensome. The legislation is all about making better use of social housing, and it will certainly save on temporary accommodation costs and the need to manage waiting lists. Our assessment of the policy’s impact will be revised, but we need to consider the family who have been in high-rent temporary accommodation for years. The Government have already shown a commitment to such people by allowing those in temporary accommodation to move into the private rented sector, which means that people who have to use such accommodation now do so for, on average, seven months less than was the case in 2010. That shows that the Conservative party is interested in getting the most vulnerable people housed, not in a policy built on ideology, as the Labour party seems to be.